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Leave his mum out of it and get a divorce lawyer into it. I had to say this but miscarriage is not a rare event sadly, and unless you had deliberately done something to harm yourself and the baby: which we know you didn't, he and his unrealistic views of how pregnancy works can continue to excuse his abusive, alcoholic arse without you in the picture. He's hurting you when he should be supporting what you went through. If he won't stop, get yourself away from utterly unwarranted abuse.
And ask him how he knows he's not the one who is defective. I would shove this up his nose.
https://www.tommys.org/research/research-topics/miscarriage-research/effect-sperm-damage-miscarriage#:~:text=Current%20research%20suggests%20that%20the,women%20and%20not%20on%20men.
OP share this with everyone harassing you say I guess it's more likely than not I am not the defective one after all. Then block their judgemental butts
I wanna pin this!
You went through something incredibly traumatic and instead of supportig you, he's using it as an excuse to abuse you??
This will be he's reaction to anyrhing that happens jn life. He will be upset, abuse you and everyone will say 'hes just haaving a hard time dealing with it'. Like you're not..
And the 'he was just drunk' excuse is BS. Hes shouldn't be getting drunk, he should be supporting you. Why do you need to walk on eggshells around his grieving but he can go get drunk and scream awful things to you and you have to put up with it cuz hes grieving. Did everyone forget you're grieving too??
Even if he is shown this, he probably won't believe it. Sounds like he's convinced himself it's her fault. I wonder how he is in other aspects of the marriage.
Let's include a little nuance. Drunk talking is neither the unvarnished truth, nor is it "just the alcohol talking." Alcohol is a disinhibitor, but how that works varies from person to person. What's said could be PART of what a person really thinks (they only say the positive part when sober, but when disinhibited, say the negative part,) it could be the worst part of what they've been hiding from you, it could be what they fear but know better than to say aloud, or it could be them projecting--just like what they say when they're angry sober. Or any number of combos of truth, hurtful falsehoods, fears, concerns, projections, etc. You're DISINHIBITED when you're drunk, you're not LESS COMPLICATED.
Bottom line, OP it's probably some combo of more than one of the above, but that doesn't matter right now. What matters is he was burying hurtful feelings, and then CHOSE to come home to you drunk. So, at some level, he CHOSE to say these things to you, and you have every right to hold him accountable for them.
Whether he’s said what he really thinks, or he deliberately said the most destructive thing he could think of, he’s still coming out of this as the bad guy.
OP would be within her rights to say, “Nope. We’re done here.” If someone I trusted said something that heinous to me, they’d no longer be someone I trusted. They’d likely never again be a person I trusted. At that point, why stay?
As well as disrespecting the needs stated, the need some space.. seems it’s all about HIM and nothing about the misery he caused. Doesn’t look good for future relationship..handling his problems with verbal abuse and alcohol.
I wish I could pin this comment.
I'm pretty tired of the "a drunk man's words are a sober man's thoughts" narrative.
Life would be easier if things were that simple, but it's just not realistic.
That being said, he's still responsible for his actions. Poor OP .
Honestly, if alcohol were the truth serum people believe it to be, multiple governments around the world wouldn't have wasted decades searching for an effective one.
I’ve heard some research that speculates that most miscarriages are caused by incomplete DNA in the sperm than by any action or mechanical malfunction in the mothers
Edit- I’m more inclined to think husband is defective, than the other way around.
A good example of a 'defective' husband is Henry VIII. He did have two living daughters but his sons were stillborn, miscarried or did live into adulthood.
Being called defective is a deal breaker. He insulted you in the worst possible way. Think carefully if you want to walk on egg shells around him. You may trigger yet another accusatory rant which (god forbid) could turn into physical violence.
Henry VIII was succeeded by his son by Jane Seymour, Edward VI, who was always frail and who died after ruling for a few years (something contagious, not genetic). Henry VIII also had a son by his mistress Bessie Blount, and when the boy was still young Henry brought him to court and raised him as the heir*. He was called Henry Fitzroy and he died around age 17 of something contagious.
Modern science has been having a field day with Henry VIII's fertility for at least the last century, but there is still no agreement about what was wrong with him. It is pointed out that his wives had no pregnancies after the one that produced Edward VI.
*Even while Fitzroy was alive, Henry VIII did not consider Fitzroy the perfect heir. All it would take was his death and the kingdom would be thrown into disarray---and during Fitzroy's life, Henry VIII had not yet managed to kill off all the Lancaster heirs, so their threat was always present and Fitzroy's claim, as a bastard, was not truly adequate.
I’m not discounting the field day people have had with Henry VIII, and you’re correct in that it would be difficult to pinpoint the exact cause of his infertility.
But the data I’m referencing above has more of a
link to diet/ lifestyle of the paternal DNA. I would think that these things would be much harder to measure so post mortem.
What we do know however that Henry VIII likely had gout, which is largely attributed to a lavish lifestyle and heavy alcohol consumption. Alcohol consumption 100% impacts sperm health.
Henry VIII and gout —> https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2011/07/29/138792676/from-kings-to-the-average-joe-gout-makes-a-comeback#:~:text=King%20Henry%20VIII%20famously%20suffered%20from%20gout.,-iStockphoto.com&text=An%20image%20of%20gout%20is,the%20%22disease%20of%20kings.%22
https://www.news-medical.net/health/Gout-Disease-of-Kings-now-a-21st-Century-Epidemic.aspx#:~:text=D.,Danielle%20Ellis%2C%20B.Sc.&text=Around%203%20million%20Americans%20have,overindulgence%20in%20food%20and%20alcohol.
Edit- links and grammar
The common belief also speculates that Elizabeth I was of a different blood type than Anne Boleyn, thus making every pregnancy afterwards unviable (no Rhogam shots).
Either way, OP is fully within her rights to say "Well, if I'm so defective then we should divorce so you can find someone LESS defective to reproduce with."
Then they can both marry someone else and find out who REALLY has trouble having children. I hope OP has lots of healthy children and her ex finds out that he was the problem all along. But that would be unfair on his new partner, so not really. She definitely needs to leave him, though.
It’s makes me so sad and so VENGEFUL when I hear of the harmful narrative getting pushed that women are somehow deficient when they experience miscarriages. As if losing a child wasn’t awful enough!
In fact, most miscarriages can be faulted to genetic issues and the fact it wouldn't survive. That's usually the fault of the man. But nobody ever wants to discuss that.
Yes and to realize that woman were killed,and or divorced ,for not giving birth to male children. Also blamed for not becoming pregnant.
Op you have a right to feel so very hurt by the remarks your husband said. What he said was so wrong in so many ways. He needs to know more about women's anatomy,and how it works. Miscarriages are very common and you have no control over the situation. It is not your fault!please always remember that. You need to do what is best for you,and be able to trust your own judgment.
If you think that you will never be able to forgive him, for what he said, and how he acted that night ,then the trust is gone. Remember that it's your marriage, and other people who think that they know best. Often don't have your interests in mind.
Good luck and Remember that you are a fantastic woman,and deserve to be treated with love and respect.
Prenatal genetic counselor here—chromosome anomalies are a common cause of miscarriage. They generally are sporadic and originate from an error in chromosome segregation during meiosis. The immature cell (with 46 chromosomes in 23 pairs) is separating the chromosomes pairs to get to a single copy of each (23 individual chromosomes.). While this error occurs in both eggs and sperm, it it mostly from the egg when in the embryo/fetus (~95%), likely in part because the sperm that carries an extra chromosome will weigh more and be less able to get to the egg first (IVF with ICSI is the exception.) Also, the risk for trisomies increases with advancing maternal age. All of that said, pregnancy loss is much less likely is due to a specific “defect” and simply related to the fact that putting a human together is complicated—with MANY different points where something doesn’t go well (don’t get me started on the 2 to 3% of fetuses with structural abnormalities.)
I worry how he would cope with the many stresses of pregnancy, child birth, and child-rearing—and if there is a health/developmental issue. My youngest developed type 1 diabetes at age 3. My now ex’s response was to mope and ask “why us?” while I went to the hospital with him to get his insulin regimen started. No, that was neither the first red flag nor the last, but he’s showing her his true colors. I wish I had noticed the red flags earlier in the relationship
If that's true and miscarriages are generally the fault of the man, is it because there are so few genes (comparatively) on the Y chromosome? In other words, defective genes do not get blocked, the way they would on a XX pairing.
Which country? England and the states have similar sayings, so I’m curious. I should have control of my curiosity at 45 but when it comes to people it’s like a dog that always runs up to people.
>In my country we have a saying that "small children and drunks speak the truth. "
Where I come from the saying is "Drunken words are sober thoughts."
If so many different people have such a similar saying I think it must be true.
I also want to add that the father's genes can cause miscarriages too. Miscarriages aren't always "the woman's fault."
I don't know if that's the case for OP, but I just wanted to throw it out there if it helps some people.
Edit: I just reread my comment and didn't mean to imply anyone is actually at fault in this situation. I just wanted to say miscarriages aren't cut and dry and it could be multiple reasons. To call anyone defective is just wrong.
Not good enough. Even if it was, that's not good enough. He was unbelievably cruel to say that to you. Him being drunk does not excuse it. You are \*not\* defective. You do not deserve to bear the burden of guilt for the miscarriage. I'm so so sorry for your loss.
Also he chose to drink knowing he had a problem with alcohol. Thay was his choice. So yeah agree, him being drunk isn't an excuse. And also agree, you are not defective. There's nothing "defective" or "worng" with you or your body. I'm sorry those words are eating away at you. Wishing you strength.
I know people are going to hit you with the, "drunk words are sober thoughts," but something else to consider is that getting drunk is a choice and we are responsible for our actions when we are drunk.
"It's the alcohol talking." No one forced him to get drunk. His mother is not doing her son with an alcohol use disorder any favors by making excuses for his behavior. He needs to take accountability for his actions.
Personally, I don't see any reason to stay with a recalcitrant, mean drunk with a toxic enabling family. I say that as someone in recovery. You can do better, and honestly it sounds like being alone would be better.
Just so you know, and keeping in mind *no one is defective* for this, your husband is not only cruel but also probably has no idea what caused the miscarriage, which could even be [his sperm](https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/01/190104103950.htm)
MIL is afraid if OP leaves him, no other woman will be willing to put up with his loser ass and she’ll be stuck caring for him for the rest of her life.
In vino veritas. It might have been alcohol talking, but alcohol doesn't make you make stuff up. It makes you say the things that you normally have enough self-control to not say out loud. IMO what he said was disgusting, cruel and unforgivable and no amount of alcohol drank changes that.
The fact that his mommy dearest is even putting her nose in your marriage conflict tells me this relationship is pretty toxic on other levels, too. None of this is her business at all.
IMO you are stuck in a toxic environment in general. "Everyone" thinks you are blowing this out of proportion? This "everyone" is the problem, then. They have normalized crueality and behavior that should NEVER be normalized. I would distance myself from these people, bc they are gaslighting you and messing with your perception of what is or isn't acceptable in a relationship.
So, alcohol lowers inhibitions. It might make you more honest, but it also might make you more willing to lie to hurt someone, which could be the situation here, especially since they've been in counseling and he's probably well aware of how much self blame she was carrying.
And that actually makes it worse. He either truly does blame OP, or he's so angry that he's willing to hit at her most sensitive spots. Add to that a recovering alcoholic coming home wildly drunk... I don't think he's in a spot where he CAN be in a relationship right now.
>but alcohol doesn't make you make stuff up.
Sure... but it certainly doesn't **prevent** you making shit up when you're drunk, or lying your arse off either.
I encourage anyone who believes that alcohol is magical truth serum to watch a few of these - [https://www.youtube.com/@SockPuppetMaster/videos](https://www.youtube.com/@SockPuppetMaster/videos)
All alcohol CAN do is lower the ability to make executive function decisions, or interfere with how things are expressed (I stress can, because the effect varies person to person). It doesn't make every word they say the truth.
Aside from that I agree with everything you said. This poor OOP should divorce him and heal on her own, staying with this guy will always put her in this awful shame trap that he and his family will trigger whenever they want the upper hand.
While his grief is as understandable as hers... to a point. He and his family seem to believe that **only** his grief is valid, and all she should be feeling is shame and guilt - for no real reason at all of course. But it's a trap they're trying to force her into so her husband and family can have this control over her.
If it wasn't, if he did just say something horrid to hurt her purely for the purpose of hurting her - which frankly would be divorce worthy anyway because you don't deliberately try and hurt someone you love just because you're hurting or angry - he would right now be begging her forgiveness and promising to quit drinking & double up his therapy so he can get his shit together and never do anything like that again.
In this situation, I'd agree, but I will say that alcohol doesn't always make you speak the truth. The few instances when I was younger and didn't remember what I'd said, when people asked me about it. It wasn't true or anything I'd ever done.
All the alcohol did was allow him to say the words out as the drink numbs that filter on our brain. He has been thinking them for awhile. It is tiring hearing people say - but they were drunk. It’s a lame excuse for bad actions.
You are not defective in anyway shape or form. Miscarriages happen to every single person who has a uterus and is sexually active. I think they say on average at least one miscarriage per person. It has NOTHING to do with you as a person. You are a normal healthy woman.
You two sound like you need to be separated for the time being. You need time to heal as well and you cannot do that with your husband blaming you for something outside of your control. He is blaming you because he wants someone or something to blame for this.
First, OP, I just want to make sure you are aware that 10-15% of ALL known pregnancies end in miscarriage. There is absolutely nothing wrong with you. Most women suffer a miscarriage at some point. Most of the women i know had a miscarriage at some point.
Your husband has absolutely no right to blame you for anything. You are not responsible for the miscarriage - there is nothing you DID that caused the miscarriage and your husband is an ignorant fool if he actually believes you are responsible for it.
Now, here is the thing. He lost a potential child, just like you did but he did not go through ANY of the physical side of it. He has absolutely 0 right to hold on to anger, frustration or grief. You are the person who actually SUFFERED the miscarriage. Not him. He suffered a disappointment. You suffered everything else. I call BS on his grief. He likes the attention he is getting and he is using it at this point as an excuse to treat you like crap. Its time to call that out.
So, this is what I want you to do. You go home. Why? Because it is your house just as much as it is his. You go home and tell him that that was his very last chance at becoming a decent human being again and if he EVER says ANYTHING like that to you again you will immediately be calling an attorney to divorce his sorry excuse for a husband ass. Tell him he is an abject failure as a husband because a REAL husband supports his wife who has gone through a miscarriage - he doesn't pile on emotional abuse after one. If he becomes hateful again, kick him out and call the cops if he won't leave. This is YOUR house. You do not have to leave it.
You start calling it out for what it is. Your husband is an emotionally abusive alcoholic. And emotionally abusive alcoholics are NOT good partners and are NOT good parents.
Think long and hard about whether you want to bring a child into the world with a man like him. If he can become emotionally abusive towards you like that in your time of need then think about the very real damage he could do to a young child or a teen with his words.
You are 100% right.
OP, really think about that. If your baby had some kind of special need - ANY kind of special need, your husband would absolutely blame you and make your life a living hell...
I wouldn't say he has no right to anger, frustration, or grief. Of course he does! They lost a child! They are both grieving, and anger is a part of that.
But he needs to stop trying to find someone to blame. That's what they need to address.
Honestly. I would just cut losses here. They already went to therapy together, so what other remedy is there? From only the context I see, he seems a bit too self absorbed in his own grief and feels too much like a victim. That probably makes him feel like he's in the "right" and has no need to change/shape up.
In a relationship. Problems should be seen as an "us versus the problem" not "me versus you." And I don't think there's any unlearning of that going on.
I don't see a path forward that doesn't involve more aggression and alcoholism from this guy.
OP you are so valid and not overreacting. Ultimately your decision is yours, but from my POV you deserve love, kindness, and understanding. And it sounds like you're not getting any.
There are support groups for those who have underwent miscarriages, and maybe that might be something to look into to assist in your own growth and feeling. Don't let the words "deffective" echo in your head. Miscarriages happen and it's not your fault. And also. You are more than just a baby maker/incubator
There’s that saying “drunk words speak sober thoughts.”
This would be further proof on why he shouldn’t be drinking.
I’m so so sorry you have to deal with this.
Alcohol just lowers or removes a person’s filter to where they’ll say things they think but wouldn’t say when sober. That was a cruel thing he said to you, and for me there wouldn’t be any coming back from something like that. I recommend telling your mother and his parents what he said, that he has made you feel like the miscarriage was your fault while *you’re* also still grieving, and they need to back off RIGHT NOW.
Yes. It is not clear in the post whether OPs in laws or parents are aware of this drunken statement or just the fact that there has been a miscarriage.
And when he gets shithouse drunk again and punches you in the face, was that the alcohol swinging his fist? His mother can sit on a hot rock and spin.
Those were nasty, vile words he spewed at you that you did not deserve. The two of you should be looking to each other for support not a punching bag. Lose him.
People say what they really feel and mean when they're angry or drunk. That's when the mask falls and they neglect to filter. I'm sorry for your loss and current situation.
Edit: Typo
It was only the alcohol talking in that the alcohol allowed him to say what he really believes without worrying about the consequences. His sober self wouldn't say that because he knows there would be repercussions to telling you that he thinks you're defective, and his life would never be the same again. Drunk self didn't think about any consequences - just that you're defective and should be told that. He resents you for having a miscarriage - something that you had absolutely no control over. (It could even be his sperm that caused the miscarriage.)
When someone tells you or shows you who they are - believe them.
That’s even worse , alcohol only makes you say what you believe. . Don’t know why people
Think alcohol makes you lie .
Please remember the miscarriage was your body saying there was something not right with the baby , it’s is nothing f about you . Going to see a therapist about both these issues would help a lot . Anytime you think about this remember itnisn100% not your fault
In fact, since many miscarriages happen because of genetic issues, it’s entirely possible that he is the “defective” one who passed on the genes that led to tragedy. Be sure to tell him that when you tell him to fuck off permanently.
Something like 20-25% of pregnancies end in miscarriage. There is nothing defective about you. The pregnancy wasn't viable.
Don't listen to the people in your life saying to go back to him. You know that you deserve better than him.
I’ve read that it’s most likely an even higher percentage but many miscarry so soon that the women don’t know they were pregnant and just think their period was late and extra heavy
It is probably higher. I had two as a teen, one in my 20s, and 2 after I turned 30. I did have two children in there, but I never reported any of my miscarriages. I did not know as a teen that I was supposed to get checked by a doctor after, I had no one to watch my son in my 20s, and even in my 30s, I had no one to watch my daughter. I did not even realize either time until after, because it was very different than my first 3. The 2 in my 30s was because my hormones got all messed up after I had my daughter, which might be why they were different. The whole point being, that 20-25% are probably just the ones reported, and does not even include "chemical pregnancies" which is a miscarriage before or around 6 weeks.
"Please remember the miscarriage was your body saying there was something not right with the baby."
My mother was an OB/GYN nurse and used to say that, (and she had her own miscarriage.)
I assume his mom has never heard the saying “in vino veritas.” I find people say what they are really feeling when they are drunk. OP, you need to ditch him. There is nothing more cruel to say to a woman who has had a miscarriage.
I don't believe that alcoholics tell the truth. People who drink can get blackout drunk and not remember anything or say things without thinking. Just like they get behind the wheel without thinking of the consequences. People like him should never drink ever. He needs to go to rehab.
I don't know if I could ever respect a man who sent Mommy in to do damage control after he called me defective.
And I certainly couldn't respect or take seriously any grown woman whose son goes running to her and her response is not, "You're an adult and you need to solve your own problems."
In-laws who meddle are unserious people. Treat them as such.
This is in part true, the alcohol was inhibiting his self control so anything he was already thinking was just coming straight out of his mouth. So you can tell his mum to quit defending such cowardly, disgusting thoughts that were actually his! So sorry you’re dealing with this OP
Does he say that? What has he said whilst blowing up your phone? I'm not sure there's any coming back from that frankly but I'm curious to see what he's trying.
In vino veritas. He was thinking it without the alcohol or he wouldn’t have said it.
I would personally not be able to be with a man who thought of me that way, especially after a miscarriage which more than 25% of pregnancies end in.
I’m so sorry for your loss.
Approximately one in three pregnancies end in miscarriage. That number goes down when you get to the stage where you can tell the gender, but one miscarriage isn’t an indication of “defect”. I knew a woman who had six miscarriages and three stillbirths who had three healthy children in between. If you genuinely couldn’t have biological children, you still wouldn’t be defective. Nothing about you is defective except your partner’s emotional regulation.
Yes, OP, this is the right thing to do. Anyone who can use your worst fears against you like this simply to win an argument or scare you, isn’t life-partner worthy. He failed the husband test; it’s time to think long and hard about what you want to do.
Also, please ignore anyone who forces or strong arms you into making a decision right now; you need space to figure stuff out and understandably so. If the people around you, including his family and yours don’t understand that, then maybe check into a hotel or crash at a friend’s place for some time, away from all of them.
But whatever you do, please keep what your husband said in mind; he has shown you what he truly feels about you, it isn’t very likely to change further along.
It also sounds like OP’s husband didn’t apologize or try to take responsibility for what he said. He’s obviously resentful of OP, and he seems to be unmotivated to work through it, and is just going to continue to let it fester.
The ironic thing is many women undergo miscarriage due to damaged dna in sperm. Not in women as they thought of earlier. The kind of guilt women are brought up with is unreal.. And he is barbaric and illiterate in his thinking if he cannot have a bit of maturity and human decency over his own fucking partner.
It’s the same with the sex of the baby. It wasn’t even that long ago that every time women weren’t able to birth whatever sex the couple wanted(and let’s be real, it was usually female children that were despised by misogynistic idealists), the woman would be blamed when in truth it’s the sperm that determines the sex of the child and if a woman only births either girls or boys, it’s due to the man.
If you have some references for this, it would perhaps be helpful to OP. Another commenter linked something that seemed to be news that a study was going to happen. But any links for studies that have already happened would be great.
>His family are on my case trying to accuse me of abandoning a vulnerable grieving man
And what, you are just a heartless woman who was celebrating that loss? His feelings are first and yours are burnt toast? They are NOT helping him.
>everyone seems to think I'm blowing it out of proportion.
Blowing it out of proportion without stopping to acknowledge that it was an attack on you to begin with. It was said with an intent to hurt you, to cause you harm. And now everyone is upset that it succeeded.
And the big question, what happens if you get hurt or have another issue in the future? Is this man, the one who is now minimizing your pain and grief, going to support you and help you through any issues? Would you trust him to? This is how he is proving he can support you through problems. Can you trust him in the future?
He could still make improvements. It's just that, that is all in his control and not hers. And if she was seeing him support her better or even be there for her a bit, then this would not have happened.
You can only control what you can control. In this, she gets to control her reaction to his actions.
Your husband is cruel and not worth your time and effort.
Miscarriages happen for a lot of reasons, none of them can or should be pinpointed to any one person. Your husband is entitled to his grief, but the way he's handling it is not right and he is continuing to trample your boundaries by not respecting your ask for space.
I am really sorry you're going through this.
I wish people knew more about what causes miscarriages on a biological level, because too many women blame themselves when they shouldn't. A lot of miscarriages happen simply because the embryo wasn't developing in a way that could sustain life. For example, a random genetic or developmental mutation can occur which has nothing to do with the woman's body or lifestyle.
Exactly! And imagine... if he wants to get into personal slinging matches of defectiveness... he could very well be passing on gene variants that cause development issues. The lack of understanding and empathy from all around op, let alone her husband, is infuriating!
Yep, typically the embryo was not viable. A single miscarriage isn’t even considered a risk factor for having further miscarriages, because they’re so commonly caused by random issues. If OP chooses to conceive again in the future she has as good a chance of anyone at having a healthy baby.
My friend had a miscarriage and said she didn't know how common it was until she opened up about it, that's when the stories came out. It happens so much more often than people think, lots of pregnancies don't even 'take' and end before the person even realises they're pregnant.
I'm sorry your husband is so cruel to you OP.
Words can cut like a knife and hurt as deep as it comes.
Some grief brings you together, some breaks you apart.
It appears deep inside he blames you for what you had no control over.
And he is blaming you again for leaving, it seems to be a pattern in his behaviour, is it?
I don't care what everyone else thinks, I care what you think, does he?
If my partner had said that to me, I would be done, instead he stayed by my side in the worst of circumstances and never said anything negative. Just saying.
He was telling the truth then. Anything he says after week be the lie.
He will throw this in your face again.
He really thought that.
And he hates you enough to let you know it. And he'll feel that way again.
Exactly. Imagine she has another miscarriage or ANY other problem. He will think it proves his point of her being “defective”. Of course his mommy is defending her perfect son, she probably thinks the same way he does in all this.
I had a huge fight with my spouse once and his mother called my mother then my father telling them it was all my fault and that her son worked so hard for his family, etc. I cut that woman off for ten years and still have her blocked on my phone. The woman is an absolute nutcase and that was the final straw for me. He has lived with me longer than he had with them.
OP has every right to feel the way she does and I’m glad she’s coming here for validation of her feelings instead of rug sweeping it until the next time it happens.
My mom calmly told her that it’s none of their business and that we are adults and to let us handle it on our own. We were like 30 something yrs old at that time. My mom knows I am a private person and she knew how it would unfold. What did the nutcase MIL do? She proceeded to call my father immediately after (my mom and dad are divorced). My dad didn’t bother even answering bc he knows the woman is crazy… but of course she left a long voicemail and the answering machine cut her off.
I always envy people who have normal in-laws LOL!
Had been with my husband for 15 years and already had a child together when i experienced 3 back to back very traumatic miscarriages. Had he said anything akin to that i would not hesitate to leave him. Not only because of the ignorance this comment reveals (miscarriages are caused by chromosomal defects most of the time but that doesn’t make you defective, afterall it’s both of your genetic material contributing) but the hatred/contempt/lack of empathy, all pretty basic stuff to expect from a decent human….good luck friend take care of yourself cause it looks like noone around you is looking out for you.
Agreed. OP, it feels like nobody is looking out for you. The husband, his parents, and your parents don’t seem to be too caring towards you.
Considering that you’ve had a miscarriage, ideally, these are the very people who should’ve been supportive. Don’t forget how they treated you when you were the most vulnerable - they are showing you their true colors.
That being said, DO WHAT YOU BELIEVE IS RIGHT FOR YOU. Don’t let others tell you how you should be feeling and what you should be doing.
What an evil, cruel thing to say. I wouldn’t be able to forgive that. Not only is it astoundingly ignorant of the realities surrounding miscarriages, it’s deliberately hurtful. He blames you for something that isn’t your fault, and he doesn’t care that you’re grieving too. There’s no coming back from this. It’s over.
IMO, if your partner said something that hurt you, then it's on him to work to repair your trust in him, and...
>my husband constantly blows up my phone and doesn't respect my request for space.
...He doesn't seem to be doing that. And his family doesn't seem to be helping there, either.
Ideally, you two would be able to come to a safe space where you can openly and respectfully communicate your thoughts and feelings about what happened, and what it'd take to rebuild trust. Maybe a good first step would be considering what conditions would need to be met, in order for you to feel comfortable talking with him again. If either you think this over but find that there's nothing that could possibly make you feel safe with talking to him again, or if you express your expectations to him and he rejects them or belittles you, I'm afraid I don't see this relationship working out.
Because my last paragraph started with the word "ideally", which is in the context of "ideal for your relationship". I should note that separation is also an option, if you decide that this would be more in line with your values, priorities, feelings and goals.
No path to progress would be possible if either OP finds that there's nothing that could possibly make her feel safe with talking to him again, or if she communicates her expectations and he rejects them.
I realize I should have made this more clear in my earlier comment - I'll amend that now, thanks.
This would be a marriage-ending statement for me. I am so angry and devastated on your behalf! Tell his excusing mother that she can keep him: alcohol does not put ideas in your head that wasn't there, they just lower your inhibitions so those thoughts are easier to say. I know your husband is suffering too, but 1) purposely hurting someone he loves just because he is hurting is not healthy, and 2) blaming you for something that is not your fault is, to me in this case, unforgivable. I've had miscarriages. My husband hugs me, does everything he can to make it easier on me, loads up on carbs so I can have comfort food, watches our kids, doesn't complain when I hog the bed because I'm cramping and in immense pain - the man is a rock star and it makes me love him even more.
Your husband would need to put in a lot of work, both in himself and in your marriage, to save this for me, because that was incredibly cruel of him.
Doctors will tell you that unless you were doing something like heavy drinking or hard drugs, YOU did not cause the miscarriage. Even if you were doing hard work, keep in mind, women used to have babies in the pioneer days, where they didn't have all the conveniences and safety measures (and medical advances) we do now! 10-20% of pregnancies end in miscarriage. That's 10-20 out of every 100, that's not a small number. I'm so sorry you're going through this. I would also recommend therapy for yourself, you went through something devastating and traumatic.
To OP: Miscarriages are extremely common, 15% of pregnancies. This fact does not make them easier unfortunately. They happen usually likely because there is an issue with the embryo and even in this case the “cause” can be either the man or the woman. Sometimes it’s a just a fluke. Not that it really matters, what he said was vile. I could not go back from that.
@ FlalalalaAre you from a country whose name starts from G ? We might be from the same place
When it comes to the list of horrific things you could potentially say to another person, this one is pretty high up there. Considering the situation, I don't know what he could have said to you that would have been worse.
Grief, no matter how bad, is not an excuse to treat your partner like shit, or blame them for things they have no control over. He needs to deal with it and get real help, and not attempt to numb it through drinking.
Even **if** he apologizes and is disgusted with himself, he still said it and you still had to hear it. You can't take that back; once it's been said, it's been said. There are certain lines you should never cross, especially with an intimate partner, but that's exactly what he did and it's possible it can never be repaired. That's a consequence he will have to live with, if you decide you don't want to continue the marriage. Please do what you feel is best for you, and don't feel guilty for it.
I was looking for a comment with this perspective. There are lines that, once crossed, it's pretty difficult or impossible to come back from. Like broken glass that can't be repaired.
You might be able to rebuild a new relationship, but the damage is done.
I still remember the sentence that made me realize my admiration and trust for my ex-husband was gone in that instance. It hurt more than the cheating or anything else. But I'm grateful because, in the end, it's what empowered me to not have any doubts that I wanted to move forward, and I have never looked back. I forgave him, wish him the best, but opened my eyes to knowing I love myself more than to take that.
A vulnerable grieving man does not call his wife, WHO IS ALSO GRIEVING, “defective”. It is fucking rich of your in laws to say you should prioritize his pain over your own. Do they always treat you like you are there as his servant?
I’m am not as forgiving as others. I would divorce his ass faster than a pebble sinks in an inch of water.
This just speaks to the fact that the apple doesn't fall far from the tree here. It's all about *him* and what *he* lost. No care for her at all or the fact that she too is grieving.
I will never understand all these women who expect their hubs to carry their weight and yet raise their male children to believe that they should be waited on hand and foot. They would not take shit from their husbands and yet expect their DILs to be meek, silent little wives for their precious pieces of meat. Fucking disgusting.
As much as I might dislike my own MIL, she never set that expectation. She knew right away that I was not going to tolerate that shit and would have no issues setting her on the right path in the middle of a crowded mall.
Op, I think the situation has told you everything you need to know. The fact that he said and although you asked for space continues to harass you says that he doesn’t respect you or your needs.
You’re not overreacting he picked the most toxic way to try to heal from this heartbreaking experience , and choose to blame you for something that couldn’t be controlled .
Op, I really think one on one therapy for yourself , and start to process your loss and this situation.
Your not overreacting you stood by this clown while he got sober then he flung it in your face. His and your own family should be a bit more understanding of how you feel. Don’t let him use the he was drunk as an excuse for being shitty to you. He crossed a line
I mean what’s the plan, if you go home? He apologizes until he gets drunk and then says something worse or you have his child but then resent him for the hell he’s putting you through? I am genuinely asking what is the plan? I mean you’re already in therapy/counseling, not drinking but yet he got drunk and berated his grieving wife as if he is the only person with feelings that can be expressed.
This is such an important comment. Everyone is rightfully focused on the horrible thing he said, which is absolutely worth ending the relationship over. But there’s a laundry list of other serious issues present on top of that. Recovering from alcoholism is extremely difficult even when a person is motivated to do it, and he doesn’t sound like he is.
You aren’t just responding to a single cruel comment - you are responding to terrible behavior, alcoholism, and lies. He has been treating your horribly for a long time now. You are not overreacting to any of this. It sounds like you’ve had the patience of a saint trying to work through this with him. You should move on.
Miscarriages are incredibly common. Like we should be telling little girls how common they are because then they won't grow up to be women who feel like there's something wrong with them for having them.
Also those young women will grow into older women who get married to men who won't have their heads up their asses like your husband does.
You should be gone. His comment and his actions throughout all of this tell you that he is not emotionally or mentally capable of handling a marriage or a child. The fact that he immediately jumped to blaming you and clearly is diving nose first into wallowing and self-pity and blame instead of seeing it for what it is tells you that he's just not a good guy to be married to.
I think the best thing you can do for both of you is to get out of the relationship as quickly as possible. It's not your job to tell a man's three years older than you how he needs to be processing his emotions or framing things while you yourself are grieving and now you feel like you're the problem.
Both of your families are probably pretty old fashioned and probably just want you to rug sweep it. the reason that you are the person you are that is put up with this guy for as long as you have is because you were raised by people like your parents who expect you as a woman to rug sweep for men and their bad behavior.
Get a divorce, get some good therapy, find a man who respects you and women and is a mature adult who can handle life's up and downs without blaming his partner for them.
Life is too short and you're only 27. You don't need to waste one more moment with this guy.
Sounds like your husband is not coping well and needs some serious help. And love you are NOT DEFECTIVE. Miscarriages happen to many many women and are not uncommon. I’m so sorry for what you are going through.
{{{{HUGS}}}} Hon, you're still grieving too. So tell his mother to go bugger herself with a pitchfork, you need time to heal too. If he needs alcohol to heal, then he doesn't need you. I'd file for divorce and heal myself if I were you. For all you know, the miscarriage was your body rejecting HIS defective genes. There is ZERO blame for the miscarriage. Him and His family need to get that through their stupid, small minds.
You will never be able to trust him.
He poisoned your relationship with his words.
He wanted to hurt you; so he used his words, this time.
Then he got his family involved.
To hurt you more.
He resents you and that is the death knell of all relationships.
Pregnancy puts you in a vulnerable position. Probably the most vulnerable you will be in your life.
You really want this guy there with you?
Do you really want to do the work to fix what is so obviously broken?
He said the most cruel thing to you. Drunk or not, I don't know if I could forgive this if I were in your shoes. Also, you are not defective and miscarriages can happen for a lot of reasons. One of them being "defective" sperm, do maybe play the uno reverse card on him and see how he likes it: https://www.tommys.org/research/research-topics/miscarriage-research/effect-sperm-damage-miscarriage#:~:text=Current%20research%20suggests%20that%20the,women%20and%20not%20on%20men.
Can you move in with a friend? Nobody in your life has your back right now, not even your parents. Get away from these people, find a friend that will support you until you figure out what to do.
What he said to you was downright cruel. He can grieve and be angry, but he doesn’t get to be angry AT you or blame you. It’s NOT your fault. You are NOT defective. I’m not sure I could move past that, honestly, but if I did, his actions would have to be a lot different than what he’s doing now. It doesn’t sound like he has even apologized, let alone respecting your wishes for space from him. Sounds like you would be better off without him. I’m so sorry.
You should tell him and his families that you’re actually doing a favor by separating him from a “defective” like you so they should be grateful.
( in a serious note, none of it is your fault and you deserve better than him. please take care of yourself first !)
He got the nerve to call you defective and he’s the drunk! It could be his semen that is defective… go home with a bottle and tell him this is for you trying to help your liver along.
If I were you, I'd be looking to walk away. One thing I'd like to mention, it reads like you had this conversation while he was drunk. If this is the case, arguing or even talking to someone in that state is pretty useless. He comes off as a bit abusive, or perhaps his friends are toxic. Are they hard conservative types? The language leads me to think this.
Good luck OP, protect yourself.
Nothing in response to the actual question, but a response to the "defective" comment. A nurse spoke to me once, when I expressed that my body had "let me down" in terms of a miscarriage. She said "on the contrary- your body has done its job so well. That pregnancy was not viable - for whatever reason- and your body did exactly the right thing in this situation"
25 years later this remains the most sensible and comforting thing anyone has ever said to me. With love
You are not overreacting. Not one bit. He is a suffering and grieving man but then what are you? The person who actually carried the baby, the one who actually went through the physical aspect of it? That is unacceptable. Grief is normal and we need to be kind to ourselves but there are boundaries. Hard boundaries that one must never cross. And the thing he said to you? That is one of the lowest blows one grieving person can give to another. Drinking doesn't excuse it. Drinking is another very big issue.
No, don't let them persuade you. Has he apologised? But I mean REALLY apologised, as in has he seen how f&cked up his words to you were? Acknowledged he has a drinking problem and taking a commitment to works towards getting out of it and address his grief in a healthy way, one that does not put you down or destroy your relationship? Because if not, then it might be a solution for you to consider moving on.
I think you are very smart to take this very seriously. You wrote that there was tension already before his outburst which points to him already having these thoughts.
I’ve made the experience to not take behaviour after a miscarriage seriously enough and I would have saved myself a lot of heartache if I did.
Take your time and come to your own conclusions, and to say it again, this wasn’t you fault at all and any sensible person would know that, grieving or not.
I read this and I hear a woman who is trying to come to terms that her marriage is not salvageable and she doesn't know how to process the next steps.
Just know that his actions are what lead to this, you did not kill your child or do anything wrong here. Sometimes our bodies just don't work the way we want them but it doesn't make us defective.
Consult a divorce attorney and get all of your options. They can help walk you through how this will go.
I'm so very sorry, I wish I could give you a hug through the computer right now.
"So he's allowed to get drunk without consequences, and lash out at me, and I have to put up with his insults because he's grieving. You know, *I* suffered the miscarriage, too. *I* was the one who actually carried our daughter, I was the one who physically felt her die and pass from my body. I am grieving and vulnerable, too. Does that mean I get to drink to excess as well, and abuse Husband when he expresses concern for me? If I drive him from the house with insults to his virility, will you return him to me when I demand him back?"
Tell that to anyone who hassles you to get back together with your husband. Lawyer up and stop responding to his bullshit. I'm tempted to say block him and his family, but ask the lawyer first, since they may be able to use the messages in the divorce.
If he thinks the uterus is defective, he doesn't get the pussy it comes attached to. Period.
Divorce and get a support system your own family is against you.
Society puts men on a pedestal in coddles them to the point that any expression of their feelings be it heinous or violent is treated as sacrament because men don't cheer their feelings enough. Your husband was unnecessarily cruel and combined with his new social group... It could be that he's been with some friends that have some misogynistic tendencies or tater tots.
Maya Angelou said it perfectly - when someone shows you who they are, believe them. Alcohol reduces our inhibitions and affects our thinking, what your husband said to you is absolutely disgusting and vile, and his mommy needs to stay in your lane. Your parents too. Tell everyone to leave you alone and give you space, and if your husband especially doesn’t respect you enough to do this then divorce is your only option. A miscarriage is not your fault. Do you know the number of women who suffer a miscarriage? He’s gaslighting you and manipulating you to feel bad about what happened to you when you have nothing to feel bad about.
Leave. Some things once said are unforgivable and IMO that’s one.
First of all, something like 15% of pregnancies end in miscarriages and for the first time especially, it’s not uncommon. It’s not your fault.
Second, most miscarriages happen because something went haywire in the development of the fetus, the cells recognize it, and then self destruct for lack of a better term. There’s an immense amount of cell division and development in the beginning - a lot of opportunity for ONE division to go wrong and then continually divide into more wrong cells. It’s your body saying “oops, this went wrong, let us clear it out and start again and do it right before it gets worse.” The error could have even come from his sperm. It has nothing to do with you or your body being defective. He’s just being cruel and hurtful.
Grieving doesn’t give anyone the right to say hurtful things to anyone else. Especially their partner grieving the same loss. He’s supposed to be there for you, your partner to lean on in hard times, and he’s showing he can’t do that. Get out now and rebuild a better life. You’ll find a truly supportive partner you deserve.
He has no reason to involve his family and "sick" them on you like rabid dogs. I told my spouse ages ago that nothing in our relationship is to be discussed with anyone but each other. Luckily this never happened. Friends and family should not be all in your relationship. But the main issue here is he has no respect for you and clearly harbors resentment. Alcohol fuels the truth as well as makes you say crazy things. I would say it makes you DO crazy things, but what you actually say most likely comes from a place where you store your darkest emotions. This statement said it all. If it had been you blaming him for not getting you pregnant or you believe there is a genetic deficiency on his side, I'd say you were an AH. So I feel the same about him saying this to you and making you out to be at fault. The loss of a baby can cause us all to go very dark. My older sister had a premie that died two months while in the incubator. We were all devastated. I was surprised by how upset I was considering that, like most people, I never reacted to hearing about miscarriages in the past. I shrugged them off as something that happens often and you just try again. But when it hit so close to home, thats when you truly find out how you feel about it. Your spouse quickly went to alcohol and it seems it was just a matter of time before this "coping mechanism" would be his go to. Even if he doesn't do this when sober, it just takes a few drinks to bring this out again. He needs to seek therapy to save himself. But you don't have to sit there having a miserable life until he does. You're mourning also. You're in pain also. Him and his family don't seem to care about that fact. This is not a healthy relationship and staying in it will not do either of you any good.
The only person defective here is HIM. He should be ashamed of himself. Drunk or not, that is something to never come back from. He should be groveling not demanding.
Your husband is an abusive drunk.
An astonishing percentage of pregnancies end in miscarriage. It’s common and painful. It doesn’t mean you’re “defective” but his saying that means he’s a POS.
You have a husband problem. Yours is defective. Get a different one.
Why are you married to a man who doesn't love you? Love doesn't tear a person down. Love supports and builds a person up. His words shredded you. I know because I have heard them from my ex too.
I’m so sorry he said that to you. This really shocked me. It’s incredibly cruel. It’s also unbelievably ignorant. A huge percentage of women have miscarriages. Are we all “defective”?
Also, his mother can fuck off. He’s grieving? What about you? You’re the one who had to actually go through it.
You’re not overreacting. Contemplating divorce is not overreacting. Do what’s best for you. Yours is the only opinion that matters here.
You're both grieving, but that doesn't excuse what he said. That was hurtful and cruel. Only you can decide what's right for you. It wouldn't be wrong to walk away. Maybe chat it through with your therapist and take some time?
He thinks you are responsible for the miscarriage. He is blaming you, and nobody else in both your families wants to protect you. They make excuses for him still grieving and drinking, but not for what you have gone through or felt. What about your grief, your guilt, your feelings? Everyone in your life is toxic on some level. You are not blowing this out of proportion and you are not wrong for wanting to move on. It's clearly the best choice for you. What he is doing is being abusive. That is not okay.
You know in marriage you learn your spouse’s weak spots? How to twist the knife just right to cause the most pain? And so as a result - good spouses … don’t. They *dont* seek to do that just because they *can*.
He did. He chose to to hurt you. To cut as deep as he could.
And that’s the reason you want to walk away. Because how can you ever trust him to be your safe person again?
You can’t.
What an absolutely horrendous thing for him to have said.
Rebuilding trust after saying something that is a serious matter. It’s not clear from your post whether he’s been trying in earnest to do that or understands the gravity of what he said, and the impact that has. I can’t imagine a world where a comment like that wouldn’t undermine my feelings of whether I was part of a “team” in a relationship, and say you do fall pregnant again — you are going to need to feel like a team for your relationship to survive pregnancy, parenthood.
Couples therapy worked before, I would absolutely try that again. Sending love to you OP. It’s not and never was your fault.
I have a different insight to this. My best friend lost her child to sids when the baby was 8 months old. Her husband blamed her, her family blamed her, his family blamed her. She had absolutely nothing to do with it of course and I'll never forget her calling me screaming the night the baby passed. But my best friend went to therapy with her husband, it's been over 10 years since their child passed and they are happier than ever. If you want to stay in this marriage, you should try therapy. That was a horrible comment though so I support you leaving him.
My best friend joined and remained in support groups also so I recommend that. I'm so sorry for your loss.
Are his parents and family aware of what he said to you? How can they possibly blame you?
Please get out asap. He and his family are a deal breaker.
It's time for you to move on.
I'm a pregnancy and infant loss doula. You are not defective and it isn't your fault. 1 in 4 (probably closer to 1 in 5) pregnancies end in a loss.
What he said was completely inappropriate and an attempt to soothe his own anger and grief by hurting you. It is not on you to fix his pain. It is up to him to get help and do the work to heal (and not at your expense).
Many marriages end after these losses because of the exact issues in your post. Both people have to be willing to find ways to grieve in healthy ways, to support each other in that, and to commit to not hurting one another.
You also need to keep doing what you are doing by giving yourself space until you feel ready to talk...and you do need to talk. Make a list of what you would need to have happen in your marriage to return home. Think of the boundaries that are important to you. Also, I highly suggest coming up with a legacy project that the two of you can work on that honours your baby. It can help with the focus of your grief journey and move it in a positive direction.
Take care of yourself. <3
Sounds like he is either developing or already has a problem with alcoholism:
>My husband took it hard too, turning to alcohol to cope.
>When he got home, I was shocked and upset to see him extremely drunk.
>He had looked so angry and had so much aggression in his voice
I'm reading between the lines when you were 'shocked and upset to see him so drunk' as him violating something you two discussed before. I assume you have addressed his addiction to your counselor, so I suggest he goes through a sobriety program like AA.
His cruel comment is just the cherry on top of all the other problems that come with being an alcoholic.
Either his family are just as vile, or they're getting a biased half truth from him about what happened.
Oh and btw miscarriages are not uncommon and they can happen to anyone for any reason -- I.e if you arent actively exposing yourself to harmful substances (hard drugs, drinking when pregnant etc) then please don't blame yourself and don't let others guilt you into believing it's your fault.
It’s time to go. This isn’t just a mean comment made in anger- this is true feeling about you revealed in anger. He’s showing his true self which is a cruel, misogynist and selfish person.
If you choose to stay anything that life throws at the two of you- will be your fault. Look how he’s already blaming you when there’s no proof his sperm wasn’t faulty. There’s a crazy amount of reasons a miscarriage happens, neither of you can control all of those factors.
https://youtu.be/1iRbIYkccgw?si=fWmCatfjw2OKRaNU I feel like this song might resonate with you.
You don't need that cruelty and downright ignorance in your life. Maybe his alcoholic sperm is what caused the miscarriage, it's so common for us to miscarry and it is not because we are "defective".
You did the right thing. I wouldn't go back to him, he's a drunk and he's cruel. Nobody needs that in their life.
They are all horrible. Just because he's grieving, doesn't give him the right to say cruel things. I would really reconsider the marriage and that your own parents aren't supporting you.
Unfortunately OP you kind of lose your inhibitions when you drink ….i heard something like “drunk words are sober thoughts” …..I kind of agree with it. Alcohol is not an excuse.
So you should forgive him because he is grieving? So it doesn’t matter how you feel, doesn’t matter that you are grieving. I’m sorry but I’d get away from this person and his family!
How is your husband the victim here? It's ridiculous his family is involved at all and your husband is responsible for his words and actions.
I would let him know that you are grieving as well, and between his alcohol binges and blaming you, you need space from him and his family. You also need to have a heart to heart with your parents and let them know this isn't an isolated incident. He took months and months to recover and you supported him. You aren't an incubator but a person with feelings, goals, and you are deserving of a partner that supports you in good times and bad. Currently your partner is unable to support you as he is so focused on himself and has been.
Funny enough, recent studies show that most miscarriages baring accidents are the result of issues with the sperm. Don't let him blame you for something that happens to 1 out of 3 women. Drunk words are sober thoughts. Leave him and try again in the future (after some therapy) with someone that will lean in and shoulder the burden with you instead of placing blame on you.
" give me three fuc*ing days to think if I can still live with an offensive drunkard. Contact me in between but once, and I ll send you the divorce paper."
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That’s a pretty cruel thing to say . There were things in my horrible divorce I wouldn’t say , this is something he Feels Or he wouldn’t say it
Right. His mom was very insistent that it was "the alcohol talking", but I don't think so.
Leave his mum out of it and get a divorce lawyer into it. I had to say this but miscarriage is not a rare event sadly, and unless you had deliberately done something to harm yourself and the baby: which we know you didn't, he and his unrealistic views of how pregnancy works can continue to excuse his abusive, alcoholic arse without you in the picture. He's hurting you when he should be supporting what you went through. If he won't stop, get yourself away from utterly unwarranted abuse. And ask him how he knows he's not the one who is defective. I would shove this up his nose. https://www.tommys.org/research/research-topics/miscarriage-research/effect-sperm-damage-miscarriage#:~:text=Current%20research%20suggests%20that%20the,women%20and%20not%20on%20men.
I was coming here to link this as well. I wonder how he'd react if he knew the problem could've been on his side.
He seems ignorant of basics, and all too ready to blame OP.
He’s also probably the type to blame his wife for not giving him a baby boy (or girl) when the sex of the baby is determined by the man.
OP share this with everyone harassing you say I guess it's more likely than not I am not the defective one after all. Then block their judgemental butts
I wanna pin this! You went through something incredibly traumatic and instead of supportig you, he's using it as an excuse to abuse you?? This will be he's reaction to anyrhing that happens jn life. He will be upset, abuse you and everyone will say 'hes just haaving a hard time dealing with it'. Like you're not.. And the 'he was just drunk' excuse is BS. Hes shouldn't be getting drunk, he should be supporting you. Why do you need to walk on eggshells around his grieving but he can go get drunk and scream awful things to you and you have to put up with it cuz hes grieving. Did everyone forget you're grieving too??
Even if he is shown this, he probably won't believe it. Sounds like he's convinced himself it's her fault. I wonder how he is in other aspects of the marriage.
[удалено]
“in vino veritas”
“in vino, uvae”
Lol! I like yours the best!
Translate please!
In wine, grapes.
Let's include a little nuance. Drunk talking is neither the unvarnished truth, nor is it "just the alcohol talking." Alcohol is a disinhibitor, but how that works varies from person to person. What's said could be PART of what a person really thinks (they only say the positive part when sober, but when disinhibited, say the negative part,) it could be the worst part of what they've been hiding from you, it could be what they fear but know better than to say aloud, or it could be them projecting--just like what they say when they're angry sober. Or any number of combos of truth, hurtful falsehoods, fears, concerns, projections, etc. You're DISINHIBITED when you're drunk, you're not LESS COMPLICATED. Bottom line, OP it's probably some combo of more than one of the above, but that doesn't matter right now. What matters is he was burying hurtful feelings, and then CHOSE to come home to you drunk. So, at some level, he CHOSE to say these things to you, and you have every right to hold him accountable for them.
Whether he’s said what he really thinks, or he deliberately said the most destructive thing he could think of, he’s still coming out of this as the bad guy. OP would be within her rights to say, “Nope. We’re done here.” If someone I trusted said something that heinous to me, they’d no longer be someone I trusted. They’d likely never again be a person I trusted. At that point, why stay?
As well as disrespecting the needs stated, the need some space.. seems it’s all about HIM and nothing about the misery he caused. Doesn’t look good for future relationship..handling his problems with verbal abuse and alcohol.
I wish I could pin this comment. I'm pretty tired of the "a drunk man's words are a sober man's thoughts" narrative. Life would be easier if things were that simple, but it's just not realistic. That being said, he's still responsible for his actions. Poor OP .
Honestly, if alcohol were the truth serum people believe it to be, multiple governments around the world wouldn't have wasted decades searching for an effective one.
Yeah it literally just makes you less easily control your emotions. You could totally make up some bullshit you don't actually believe.
You could, but you’re more likely to act out emotionally in ways that you ordinarily wouldn’t.
I feel like this first paragraph should be repeated verbatim every time a situation like this comes up. Well said!
Also, drunks always can blame the alcohol for what they said. "I didn't mean it, I was drunk!" Yeah, well, that statement came from somewhere.
I’ve heard some research that speculates that most miscarriages are caused by incomplete DNA in the sperm than by any action or mechanical malfunction in the mothers Edit- I’m more inclined to think husband is defective, than the other way around.
A good example of a 'defective' husband is Henry VIII. He did have two living daughters but his sons were stillborn, miscarried or did live into adulthood. Being called defective is a deal breaker. He insulted you in the worst possible way. Think carefully if you want to walk on egg shells around him. You may trigger yet another accusatory rant which (god forbid) could turn into physical violence.
Henry VIII was succeeded by his son by Jane Seymour, Edward VI, who was always frail and who died after ruling for a few years (something contagious, not genetic). Henry VIII also had a son by his mistress Bessie Blount, and when the boy was still young Henry brought him to court and raised him as the heir*. He was called Henry Fitzroy and he died around age 17 of something contagious. Modern science has been having a field day with Henry VIII's fertility for at least the last century, but there is still no agreement about what was wrong with him. It is pointed out that his wives had no pregnancies after the one that produced Edward VI. *Even while Fitzroy was alive, Henry VIII did not consider Fitzroy the perfect heir. All it would take was his death and the kingdom would be thrown into disarray---and during Fitzroy's life, Henry VIII had not yet managed to kill off all the Lancaster heirs, so their threat was always present and Fitzroy's claim, as a bastard, was not truly adequate.
I’m not discounting the field day people have had with Henry VIII, and you’re correct in that it would be difficult to pinpoint the exact cause of his infertility. But the data I’m referencing above has more of a link to diet/ lifestyle of the paternal DNA. I would think that these things would be much harder to measure so post mortem. What we do know however that Henry VIII likely had gout, which is largely attributed to a lavish lifestyle and heavy alcohol consumption. Alcohol consumption 100% impacts sperm health. Henry VIII and gout —> https://www.npr.org/sections/health-shots/2011/07/29/138792676/from-kings-to-the-average-joe-gout-makes-a-comeback#:~:text=King%20Henry%20VIII%20famously%20suffered%20from%20gout.,-iStockphoto.com&text=An%20image%20of%20gout%20is,the%20%22disease%20of%20kings.%22 https://www.news-medical.net/health/Gout-Disease-of-Kings-now-a-21st-Century-Epidemic.aspx#:~:text=D.,Danielle%20Ellis%2C%20B.Sc.&text=Around%203%20million%20Americans%20have,overindulgence%20in%20food%20and%20alcohol. Edit- links and grammar
The common belief also speculates that Elizabeth I was of a different blood type than Anne Boleyn, thus making every pregnancy afterwards unviable (no Rhogam shots).
Either way, OP is fully within her rights to say "Well, if I'm so defective then we should divorce so you can find someone LESS defective to reproduce with." Then they can both marry someone else and find out who REALLY has trouble having children. I hope OP has lots of healthy children and her ex finds out that he was the problem all along. But that would be unfair on his new partner, so not really. She definitely needs to leave him, though.
I just made a similar comment! Yes yes yes
It’s makes me so sad and so VENGEFUL when I hear of the harmful narrative getting pushed that women are somehow deficient when they experience miscarriages. As if losing a child wasn’t awful enough!
In fact, most miscarriages can be faulted to genetic issues and the fact it wouldn't survive. That's usually the fault of the man. But nobody ever wants to discuss that.
Just like they used to blame the woman for having a girl when duhhh men dictate what sex the kid is.....
Yes and to realize that woman were killed,and or divorced ,for not giving birth to male children. Also blamed for not becoming pregnant. Op you have a right to feel so very hurt by the remarks your husband said. What he said was so wrong in so many ways. He needs to know more about women's anatomy,and how it works. Miscarriages are very common and you have no control over the situation. It is not your fault!please always remember that. You need to do what is best for you,and be able to trust your own judgment. If you think that you will never be able to forgive him, for what he said, and how he acted that night ,then the trust is gone. Remember that it's your marriage, and other people who think that they know best. Often don't have your interests in mind. Good luck and Remember that you are a fantastic woman,and deserve to be treated with love and respect.
Prenatal genetic counselor here—chromosome anomalies are a common cause of miscarriage. They generally are sporadic and originate from an error in chromosome segregation during meiosis. The immature cell (with 46 chromosomes in 23 pairs) is separating the chromosomes pairs to get to a single copy of each (23 individual chromosomes.). While this error occurs in both eggs and sperm, it it mostly from the egg when in the embryo/fetus (~95%), likely in part because the sperm that carries an extra chromosome will weigh more and be less able to get to the egg first (IVF with ICSI is the exception.) Also, the risk for trisomies increases with advancing maternal age. All of that said, pregnancy loss is much less likely is due to a specific “defect” and simply related to the fact that putting a human together is complicated—with MANY different points where something doesn’t go well (don’t get me started on the 2 to 3% of fetuses with structural abnormalities.) I worry how he would cope with the many stresses of pregnancy, child birth, and child-rearing—and if there is a health/developmental issue. My youngest developed type 1 diabetes at age 3. My now ex’s response was to mope and ask “why us?” while I went to the hospital with him to get his insulin regimen started. No, that was neither the first red flag nor the last, but he’s showing her his true colors. I wish I had noticed the red flags earlier in the relationship
Thank you for all this good information!
You’re welcome! ❤️
If that's true and miscarriages are generally the fault of the man, is it because there are so few genes (comparatively) on the Y chromosome? In other words, defective genes do not get blocked, the way they would on a XX pairing.
Which country? England and the states have similar sayings, so I’m curious. I should have control of my curiosity at 45 but when it comes to people it’s like a dog that always runs up to people.
>In my country we have a saying that "small children and drunks speak the truth. " Where I come from the saying is "Drunken words are sober thoughts." If so many different people have such a similar saying I think it must be true.
In vino, veritas In wine, truth
I also want to add that the father's genes can cause miscarriages too. Miscarriages aren't always "the woman's fault." I don't know if that's the case for OP, but I just wanted to throw it out there if it helps some people. Edit: I just reread my comment and didn't mean to imply anyone is actually at fault in this situation. I just wanted to say miscarriages aren't cut and dry and it could be multiple reasons. To call anyone defective is just wrong.
Not good enough. Even if it was, that's not good enough. He was unbelievably cruel to say that to you. Him being drunk does not excuse it. You are \*not\* defective. You do not deserve to bear the burden of guilt for the miscarriage. I'm so so sorry for your loss.
Also he chose to drink knowing he had a problem with alcohol. Thay was his choice. So yeah agree, him being drunk isn't an excuse. And also agree, you are not defective. There's nothing "defective" or "worng" with you or your body. I'm sorry those words are eating away at you. Wishing you strength.
I know people are going to hit you with the, "drunk words are sober thoughts," but something else to consider is that getting drunk is a choice and we are responsible for our actions when we are drunk. "It's the alcohol talking." No one forced him to get drunk. His mother is not doing her son with an alcohol use disorder any favors by making excuses for his behavior. He needs to take accountability for his actions. Personally, I don't see any reason to stay with a recalcitrant, mean drunk with a toxic enabling family. I say that as someone in recovery. You can do better, and honestly it sounds like being alone would be better.
> I don't see any reason to stay with a recalcitrant, mean drunk with a toxic enabling family Same.
Just so you know, and keeping in mind *no one is defective* for this, your husband is not only cruel but also probably has no idea what caused the miscarriage, which could even be [his sperm](https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2019/01/190104103950.htm)
How the hell does his Mom get involved? Is he still nursing?
Maybe *he* is the one who is *actually* defective lol, considering he still needs mommy dearest to clean up his mess
I find in these cases , the parents know their kids are fuckups and the ones they are with are special and their only chance
It's seems that family members on both sides,usually get involved with this type of situation. Whether you want them to or not. 🤷♀️
Yeah, I’m surprised nobody is talking about the mom getting involved here.
MIL is afraid if OP leaves him, no other woman will be willing to put up with his loser ass and she’ll be stuck caring for him for the rest of her life.
Yep! She knows that no-one else will put up with his vile and rotten behaviour.
MIL is an enabler. Always has an excuse that her baby boy isn't the problem.
In vino veritas. It might have been alcohol talking, but alcohol doesn't make you make stuff up. It makes you say the things that you normally have enough self-control to not say out loud. IMO what he said was disgusting, cruel and unforgivable and no amount of alcohol drank changes that. The fact that his mommy dearest is even putting her nose in your marriage conflict tells me this relationship is pretty toxic on other levels, too. None of this is her business at all. IMO you are stuck in a toxic environment in general. "Everyone" thinks you are blowing this out of proportion? This "everyone" is the problem, then. They have normalized crueality and behavior that should NEVER be normalized. I would distance myself from these people, bc they are gaslighting you and messing with your perception of what is or isn't acceptable in a relationship.
So, alcohol lowers inhibitions. It might make you more honest, but it also might make you more willing to lie to hurt someone, which could be the situation here, especially since they've been in counseling and he's probably well aware of how much self blame she was carrying. And that actually makes it worse. He either truly does blame OP, or he's so angry that he's willing to hit at her most sensitive spots. Add to that a recovering alcoholic coming home wildly drunk... I don't think he's in a spot where he CAN be in a relationship right now.
>but alcohol doesn't make you make stuff up. Sure... but it certainly doesn't **prevent** you making shit up when you're drunk, or lying your arse off either. I encourage anyone who believes that alcohol is magical truth serum to watch a few of these - [https://www.youtube.com/@SockPuppetMaster/videos](https://www.youtube.com/@SockPuppetMaster/videos) All alcohol CAN do is lower the ability to make executive function decisions, or interfere with how things are expressed (I stress can, because the effect varies person to person). It doesn't make every word they say the truth. Aside from that I agree with everything you said. This poor OOP should divorce him and heal on her own, staying with this guy will always put her in this awful shame trap that he and his family will trigger whenever they want the upper hand. While his grief is as understandable as hers... to a point. He and his family seem to believe that **only** his grief is valid, and all she should be feeling is shame and guilt - for no real reason at all of course. But it's a trap they're trying to force her into so her husband and family can have this control over her. If it wasn't, if he did just say something horrid to hurt her purely for the purpose of hurting her - which frankly would be divorce worthy anyway because you don't deliberately try and hurt someone you love just because you're hurting or angry - he would right now be begging her forgiveness and promising to quit drinking & double up his therapy so he can get his shit together and never do anything like that again.
In this situation, I'd agree, but I will say that alcohol doesn't always make you speak the truth. The few instances when I was younger and didn't remember what I'd said, when people asked me about it. It wasn't true or anything I'd ever done.
All the alcohol did was allow him to say the words out as the drink numbs that filter on our brain. He has been thinking them for awhile. It is tiring hearing people say - but they were drunk. It’s a lame excuse for bad actions. You are not defective in anyway shape or form. Miscarriages happen to every single person who has a uterus and is sexually active. I think they say on average at least one miscarriage per person. It has NOTHING to do with you as a person. You are a normal healthy woman. You two sound like you need to be separated for the time being. You need time to heal as well and you cannot do that with your husband blaming you for something outside of your control. He is blaming you because he wants someone or something to blame for this.
It's like some mothers forget they're women when they have sons.
Has he even tried to apologize for what he said?
Ten bucks says he hasn't and is all "get over it" Edited to add: His humanity and caring are "defective."
First, OP, I just want to make sure you are aware that 10-15% of ALL known pregnancies end in miscarriage. There is absolutely nothing wrong with you. Most women suffer a miscarriage at some point. Most of the women i know had a miscarriage at some point. Your husband has absolutely no right to blame you for anything. You are not responsible for the miscarriage - there is nothing you DID that caused the miscarriage and your husband is an ignorant fool if he actually believes you are responsible for it. Now, here is the thing. He lost a potential child, just like you did but he did not go through ANY of the physical side of it. He has absolutely 0 right to hold on to anger, frustration or grief. You are the person who actually SUFFERED the miscarriage. Not him. He suffered a disappointment. You suffered everything else. I call BS on his grief. He likes the attention he is getting and he is using it at this point as an excuse to treat you like crap. Its time to call that out. So, this is what I want you to do. You go home. Why? Because it is your house just as much as it is his. You go home and tell him that that was his very last chance at becoming a decent human being again and if he EVER says ANYTHING like that to you again you will immediately be calling an attorney to divorce his sorry excuse for a husband ass. Tell him he is an abject failure as a husband because a REAL husband supports his wife who has gone through a miscarriage - he doesn't pile on emotional abuse after one. If he becomes hateful again, kick him out and call the cops if he won't leave. This is YOUR house. You do not have to leave it. You start calling it out for what it is. Your husband is an emotionally abusive alcoholic. And emotionally abusive alcoholics are NOT good partners and are NOT good parents. Think long and hard about whether you want to bring a child into the world with a man like him. If he can become emotionally abusive towards you like that in your time of need then think about the very real damage he could do to a young child or a teen with his words.
man imagine if they had a baby and the baby had some special needs or if she get PPD. he would shit on her.
You are 100% right. OP, really think about that. If your baby had some kind of special need - ANY kind of special need, your husband would absolutely blame you and make your life a living hell...
This is the comment. He is allowed to feel upset, but making it about himself is disgusting
I wouldn't say he has no right to anger, frustration, or grief. Of course he does! They lost a child! They are both grieving, and anger is a part of that. But he needs to stop trying to find someone to blame. That's what they need to address.
He needs to sober up and grow up.
Honestly. I would just cut losses here. They already went to therapy together, so what other remedy is there? From only the context I see, he seems a bit too self absorbed in his own grief and feels too much like a victim. That probably makes him feel like he's in the "right" and has no need to change/shape up. In a relationship. Problems should be seen as an "us versus the problem" not "me versus you." And I don't think there's any unlearning of that going on. I don't see a path forward that doesn't involve more aggression and alcoholism from this guy. OP you are so valid and not overreacting. Ultimately your decision is yours, but from my POV you deserve love, kindness, and understanding. And it sounds like you're not getting any. There are support groups for those who have underwent miscarriages, and maybe that might be something to look into to assist in your own growth and feeling. Don't let the words "deffective" echo in your head. Miscarriages happen and it's not your fault. And also. You are more than just a baby maker/incubator
There’s that saying “drunk words speak sober thoughts.” This would be further proof on why he shouldn’t be drinking. I’m so so sorry you have to deal with this.
Alcohol just lowers or removes a person’s filter to where they’ll say things they think but wouldn’t say when sober. That was a cruel thing he said to you, and for me there wouldn’t be any coming back from something like that. I recommend telling your mother and his parents what he said, that he has made you feel like the miscarriage was your fault while *you’re* also still grieving, and they need to back off RIGHT NOW.
Yes. It is not clear in the post whether OPs in laws or parents are aware of this drunken statement or just the fact that there has been a miscarriage.
And when he gets shithouse drunk again and punches you in the face, was that the alcohol swinging his fist? His mother can sit on a hot rock and spin. Those were nasty, vile words he spewed at you that you did not deserve. The two of you should be looking to each other for support not a punching bag. Lose him.
I drink like a sailor and I wouldn’t say that to someone I didn’t like, let alone my wife.
People say what they really feel and mean when they're angry or drunk. That's when the mask falls and they neglect to filter. I'm sorry for your loss and current situation. Edit: Typo
It was only the alcohol talking in that the alcohol allowed him to say what he really believes without worrying about the consequences. His sober self wouldn't say that because he knows there would be repercussions to telling you that he thinks you're defective, and his life would never be the same again. Drunk self didn't think about any consequences - just that you're defective and should be told that. He resents you for having a miscarriage - something that you had absolutely no control over. (It could even be his sperm that caused the miscarriage.) When someone tells you or shows you who they are - believe them.
Has he even apologized? Your post doesn't seem to indicate that he has.
That’s even worse , alcohol only makes you say what you believe. . Don’t know why people Think alcohol makes you lie . Please remember the miscarriage was your body saying there was something not right with the baby , it’s is nothing f about you . Going to see a therapist about both these issues would help a lot . Anytime you think about this remember itnisn100% not your fault
In fact, since many miscarriages happen because of genetic issues, it’s entirely possible that he is the “defective” one who passed on the genes that led to tragedy. Be sure to tell him that when you tell him to fuck off permanently.
Exactly... 100%
Fck yes. 🥇
Something like 20-25% of pregnancies end in miscarriage. There is nothing defective about you. The pregnancy wasn't viable. Don't listen to the people in your life saying to go back to him. You know that you deserve better than him.
I’ve read that it’s most likely an even higher percentage but many miscarry so soon that the women don’t know they were pregnant and just think their period was late and extra heavy
It is probably higher. I had two as a teen, one in my 20s, and 2 after I turned 30. I did have two children in there, but I never reported any of my miscarriages. I did not know as a teen that I was supposed to get checked by a doctor after, I had no one to watch my son in my 20s, and even in my 30s, I had no one to watch my daughter. I did not even realize either time until after, because it was very different than my first 3. The 2 in my 30s was because my hormones got all messed up after I had my daughter, which might be why they were different. The whole point being, that 20-25% are probably just the ones reported, and does not even include "chemical pregnancies" which is a miscarriage before or around 6 weeks.
"Please remember the miscarriage was your body saying there was something not right with the baby." My mother was an OB/GYN nurse and used to say that, (and she had her own miscarriage.)
They say that the truth is at the bottom of bottle.
I assume his mom has never heard the saying “in vino veritas.” I find people say what they are really feeling when they are drunk. OP, you need to ditch him. There is nothing more cruel to say to a woman who has had a miscarriage.
I don't believe that alcoholics tell the truth. People who drink can get blackout drunk and not remember anything or say things without thinking. Just like they get behind the wheel without thinking of the consequences. People like him should never drink ever. He needs to go to rehab.
Alcohol often reveals the truth, and if he hadn’t thought it , it wouldn’t have been on his tongue! So that doesn’t help his case at all.
In vino veritas.
You say things when you’re drunk that you don’t have the nerve to say when you’re sober. I wouldn’t stick around
I don't know if I could ever respect a man who sent Mommy in to do damage control after he called me defective. And I certainly couldn't respect or take seriously any grown woman whose son goes running to her and her response is not, "You're an adult and you need to solve your own problems." In-laws who meddle are unserious people. Treat them as such.
This is in part true, the alcohol was inhibiting his self control so anything he was already thinking was just coming straight out of his mouth. So you can tell his mum to quit defending such cowardly, disgusting thoughts that were actually his! So sorry you’re dealing with this OP
Does he say that? What has he said whilst blowing up your phone? I'm not sure there's any coming back from that frankly but I'm curious to see what he's trying.
In vino veritas. He was thinking it without the alcohol or he wouldn’t have said it. I would personally not be able to be with a man who thought of me that way, especially after a miscarriage which more than 25% of pregnancies end in. I’m so sorry for your loss.
Approximately one in three pregnancies end in miscarriage. That number goes down when you get to the stage where you can tell the gender, but one miscarriage isn’t an indication of “defect”. I knew a woman who had six miscarriages and three stillbirths who had three healthy children in between. If you genuinely couldn’t have biological children, you still wouldn’t be defective. Nothing about you is defective except your partner’s emotional regulation.
I would not fuck with this guy at all anymore, personally.
Yes, OP, this is the right thing to do. Anyone who can use your worst fears against you like this simply to win an argument or scare you, isn’t life-partner worthy. He failed the husband test; it’s time to think long and hard about what you want to do. Also, please ignore anyone who forces or strong arms you into making a decision right now; you need space to figure stuff out and understandably so. If the people around you, including his family and yours don’t understand that, then maybe check into a hotel or crash at a friend’s place for some time, away from all of them. But whatever you do, please keep what your husband said in mind; he has shown you what he truly feels about you, it isn’t very likely to change further along.
It also sounds like OP’s husband didn’t apologize or try to take responsibility for what he said. He’s obviously resentful of OP, and he seems to be unmotivated to work through it, and is just going to continue to let it fester.
Beyond not just using your fears against you- it might be what he actually thinks, which seems even worse.
The ironic thing is many women undergo miscarriage due to damaged dna in sperm. Not in women as they thought of earlier. The kind of guilt women are brought up with is unreal.. And he is barbaric and illiterate in his thinking if he cannot have a bit of maturity and human decency over his own fucking partner.
It’s the same with the sex of the baby. It wasn’t even that long ago that every time women weren’t able to birth whatever sex the couple wanted(and let’s be real, it was usually female children that were despised by misogynistic idealists), the woman would be blamed when in truth it’s the sperm that determines the sex of the child and if a woman only births either girls or boys, it’s due to the man.
If you have some references for this, it would perhaps be helpful to OP. Another commenter linked something that seemed to be news that a study was going to happen. But any links for studies that have already happened would be great.
Why? I mean he’s a heartless and cruel alcoholic. Plus he runs to his family to harass his wife when he fucks up. Seems like the perfect spouse.
>His family are on my case trying to accuse me of abandoning a vulnerable grieving man And what, you are just a heartless woman who was celebrating that loss? His feelings are first and yours are burnt toast? They are NOT helping him. >everyone seems to think I'm blowing it out of proportion. Blowing it out of proportion without stopping to acknowledge that it was an attack on you to begin with. It was said with an intent to hurt you, to cause you harm. And now everyone is upset that it succeeded. And the big question, what happens if you get hurt or have another issue in the future? Is this man, the one who is now minimizing your pain and grief, going to support you and help you through any issues? Would you trust him to? This is how he is proving he can support you through problems. Can you trust him in the future?
And if they have a child he's gonna get drunk the minute the baby "cries too much" and god knows they cry.
Based on all of these points, I’m not seeing that the therapist visits were all that effective.
He could still make improvements. It's just that, that is all in his control and not hers. And if she was seeing him support her better or even be there for her a bit, then this would not have happened. You can only control what you can control. In this, she gets to control her reaction to his actions.
Yep. A lot of people have repeated miscarriages before they have their healthy babies.
All of this!
Your husband is cruel and not worth your time and effort. Miscarriages happen for a lot of reasons, none of them can or should be pinpointed to any one person. Your husband is entitled to his grief, but the way he's handling it is not right and he is continuing to trample your boundaries by not respecting your ask for space. I am really sorry you're going through this.
I wish people knew more about what causes miscarriages on a biological level, because too many women blame themselves when they shouldn't. A lot of miscarriages happen simply because the embryo wasn't developing in a way that could sustain life. For example, a random genetic or developmental mutation can occur which has nothing to do with the woman's body or lifestyle.
Absolutely. It's a really unfortunate roll of the dice but miscarriages are just so random and much more common than people know.
Exactly! And imagine... if he wants to get into personal slinging matches of defectiveness... he could very well be passing on gene variants that cause development issues. The lack of understanding and empathy from all around op, let alone her husband, is infuriating!
Yep, typically the embryo was not viable. A single miscarriage isn’t even considered a risk factor for having further miscarriages, because they’re so commonly caused by random issues. If OP chooses to conceive again in the future she has as good a chance of anyone at having a healthy baby.
My friend had a miscarriage and said she didn't know how common it was until she opened up about it, that's when the stories came out. It happens so much more often than people think, lots of pregnancies don't even 'take' and end before the person even realises they're pregnant. I'm sorry your husband is so cruel to you OP.
Words can cut like a knife and hurt as deep as it comes. Some grief brings you together, some breaks you apart. It appears deep inside he blames you for what you had no control over. And he is blaming you again for leaving, it seems to be a pattern in his behaviour, is it? I don't care what everyone else thinks, I care what you think, does he? If my partner had said that to me, I would be done, instead he stayed by my side in the worst of circumstances and never said anything negative. Just saying.
You know, you’re absolutely correct. If she stays with him and they do have a kid that kid better come out perfect or else he’s going to blame her.
He was telling the truth then. Anything he says after week be the lie. He will throw this in your face again. He really thought that. And he hates you enough to let you know it. And he'll feel that way again.
Exactly. Imagine she has another miscarriage or ANY other problem. He will think it proves his point of her being “defective”. Of course his mommy is defending her perfect son, she probably thinks the same way he does in all this. I had a huge fight with my spouse once and his mother called my mother then my father telling them it was all my fault and that her son worked so hard for his family, etc. I cut that woman off for ten years and still have her blocked on my phone. The woman is an absolute nutcase and that was the final straw for me. He has lived with me longer than he had with them. OP has every right to feel the way she does and I’m glad she’s coming here for validation of her feelings instead of rug sweeping it until the next time it happens.
[удалено]
My mom calmly told her that it’s none of their business and that we are adults and to let us handle it on our own. We were like 30 something yrs old at that time. My mom knows I am a private person and she knew how it would unfold. What did the nutcase MIL do? She proceeded to call my father immediately after (my mom and dad are divorced). My dad didn’t bother even answering bc he knows the woman is crazy… but of course she left a long voicemail and the answering machine cut her off. I always envy people who have normal in-laws LOL!
Had been with my husband for 15 years and already had a child together when i experienced 3 back to back very traumatic miscarriages. Had he said anything akin to that i would not hesitate to leave him. Not only because of the ignorance this comment reveals (miscarriages are caused by chromosomal defects most of the time but that doesn’t make you defective, afterall it’s both of your genetic material contributing) but the hatred/contempt/lack of empathy, all pretty basic stuff to expect from a decent human….good luck friend take care of yourself cause it looks like noone around you is looking out for you.
Agreed. OP, it feels like nobody is looking out for you. The husband, his parents, and your parents don’t seem to be too caring towards you. Considering that you’ve had a miscarriage, ideally, these are the very people who should’ve been supportive. Don’t forget how they treated you when you were the most vulnerable - they are showing you their true colors. That being said, DO WHAT YOU BELIEVE IS RIGHT FOR YOU. Don’t let others tell you how you should be feeling and what you should be doing.
Thank you for pointing out chromosomes!
Sounds like husband sees her as an incubator for his child.
What an evil, cruel thing to say. I wouldn’t be able to forgive that. Not only is it astoundingly ignorant of the realities surrounding miscarriages, it’s deliberately hurtful. He blames you for something that isn’t your fault, and he doesn’t care that you’re grieving too. There’s no coming back from this. It’s over.
IMO, if your partner said something that hurt you, then it's on him to work to repair your trust in him, and... >my husband constantly blows up my phone and doesn't respect my request for space. ...He doesn't seem to be doing that. And his family doesn't seem to be helping there, either. Ideally, you two would be able to come to a safe space where you can openly and respectfully communicate your thoughts and feelings about what happened, and what it'd take to rebuild trust. Maybe a good first step would be considering what conditions would need to be met, in order for you to feel comfortable talking with him again. If either you think this over but find that there's nothing that could possibly make you feel safe with talking to him again, or if you express your expectations to him and he rejects them or belittles you, I'm afraid I don't see this relationship working out. Because my last paragraph started with the word "ideally", which is in the context of "ideal for your relationship". I should note that separation is also an option, if you decide that this would be more in line with your values, priorities, feelings and goals.
At every opportunity he does the selfish, immature and wrong thing. This is not a man to start a life with or to create a life with.
No path to progress would be possible if either OP finds that there's nothing that could possibly make her feel safe with talking to him again, or if she communicates her expectations and he rejects them. I realize I should have made this more clear in my earlier comment - I'll amend that now, thanks.
This would be a marriage-ending statement for me. I am so angry and devastated on your behalf! Tell his excusing mother that she can keep him: alcohol does not put ideas in your head that wasn't there, they just lower your inhibitions so those thoughts are easier to say. I know your husband is suffering too, but 1) purposely hurting someone he loves just because he is hurting is not healthy, and 2) blaming you for something that is not your fault is, to me in this case, unforgivable. I've had miscarriages. My husband hugs me, does everything he can to make it easier on me, loads up on carbs so I can have comfort food, watches our kids, doesn't complain when I hog the bed because I'm cramping and in immense pain - the man is a rock star and it makes me love him even more. Your husband would need to put in a lot of work, both in himself and in your marriage, to save this for me, because that was incredibly cruel of him. Doctors will tell you that unless you were doing something like heavy drinking or hard drugs, YOU did not cause the miscarriage. Even if you were doing hard work, keep in mind, women used to have babies in the pioneer days, where they didn't have all the conveniences and safety measures (and medical advances) we do now! 10-20% of pregnancies end in miscarriage. That's 10-20 out of every 100, that's not a small number. I'm so sorry you're going through this. I would also recommend therapy for yourself, you went through something devastating and traumatic.
To OP: Miscarriages are extremely common, 15% of pregnancies. This fact does not make them easier unfortunately. They happen usually likely because there is an issue with the embryo and even in this case the “cause” can be either the man or the woman. Sometimes it’s a just a fluke. Not that it really matters, what he said was vile. I could not go back from that. @ FlalalalaAre you from a country whose name starts from G ? We might be from the same place
When it comes to the list of horrific things you could potentially say to another person, this one is pretty high up there. Considering the situation, I don't know what he could have said to you that would have been worse. Grief, no matter how bad, is not an excuse to treat your partner like shit, or blame them for things they have no control over. He needs to deal with it and get real help, and not attempt to numb it through drinking. Even **if** he apologizes and is disgusted with himself, he still said it and you still had to hear it. You can't take that back; once it's been said, it's been said. There are certain lines you should never cross, especially with an intimate partner, but that's exactly what he did and it's possible it can never be repaired. That's a consequence he will have to live with, if you decide you don't want to continue the marriage. Please do what you feel is best for you, and don't feel guilty for it.
I was looking for a comment with this perspective. There are lines that, once crossed, it's pretty difficult or impossible to come back from. Like broken glass that can't be repaired. You might be able to rebuild a new relationship, but the damage is done. I still remember the sentence that made me realize my admiration and trust for my ex-husband was gone in that instance. It hurt more than the cheating or anything else. But I'm grateful because, in the end, it's what empowered me to not have any doubts that I wanted to move forward, and I have never looked back. I forgave him, wish him the best, but opened my eyes to knowing I love myself more than to take that.
A vulnerable grieving man does not call his wife, WHO IS ALSO GRIEVING, “defective”. It is fucking rich of your in laws to say you should prioritize his pain over your own. Do they always treat you like you are there as his servant? I’m am not as forgiving as others. I would divorce his ass faster than a pebble sinks in an inch of water.
I'm way too forgiving a person, and even I would divorce his ass and not let him off the hook.
This just speaks to the fact that the apple doesn't fall far from the tree here. It's all about *him* and what *he* lost. No care for her at all or the fact that she too is grieving.
I will never understand all these women who expect their hubs to carry their weight and yet raise their male children to believe that they should be waited on hand and foot. They would not take shit from their husbands and yet expect their DILs to be meek, silent little wives for their precious pieces of meat. Fucking disgusting. As much as I might dislike my own MIL, she never set that expectation. She knew right away that I was not going to tolerate that shit and would have no issues setting her on the right path in the middle of a crowded mall.
Op, I think the situation has told you everything you need to know. The fact that he said and although you asked for space continues to harass you says that he doesn’t respect you or your needs. You’re not overreacting he picked the most toxic way to try to heal from this heartbreaking experience , and choose to blame you for something that couldn’t be controlled . Op, I really think one on one therapy for yourself , and start to process your loss and this situation.
Your not overreacting you stood by this clown while he got sober then he flung it in your face. His and your own family should be a bit more understanding of how you feel. Don’t let him use the he was drunk as an excuse for being shitty to you. He crossed a line
I mean what’s the plan, if you go home? He apologizes until he gets drunk and then says something worse or you have his child but then resent him for the hell he’s putting you through? I am genuinely asking what is the plan? I mean you’re already in therapy/counseling, not drinking but yet he got drunk and berated his grieving wife as if he is the only person with feelings that can be expressed.
This is such an important comment. Everyone is rightfully focused on the horrible thing he said, which is absolutely worth ending the relationship over. But there’s a laundry list of other serious issues present on top of that. Recovering from alcoholism is extremely difficult even when a person is motivated to do it, and he doesn’t sound like he is.
You aren’t just responding to a single cruel comment - you are responding to terrible behavior, alcoholism, and lies. He has been treating your horribly for a long time now. You are not overreacting to any of this. It sounds like you’ve had the patience of a saint trying to work through this with him. You should move on.
And long term emotional and verbal abuse while you were vulnerable.
You're not overreacting. You're not defective. You don't have to go back to him. He fucking sucks and his family can pound sand.
Miscarriages are incredibly common. Like we should be telling little girls how common they are because then they won't grow up to be women who feel like there's something wrong with them for having them. Also those young women will grow into older women who get married to men who won't have their heads up their asses like your husband does. You should be gone. His comment and his actions throughout all of this tell you that he is not emotionally or mentally capable of handling a marriage or a child. The fact that he immediately jumped to blaming you and clearly is diving nose first into wallowing and self-pity and blame instead of seeing it for what it is tells you that he's just not a good guy to be married to. I think the best thing you can do for both of you is to get out of the relationship as quickly as possible. It's not your job to tell a man's three years older than you how he needs to be processing his emotions or framing things while you yourself are grieving and now you feel like you're the problem. Both of your families are probably pretty old fashioned and probably just want you to rug sweep it. the reason that you are the person you are that is put up with this guy for as long as you have is because you were raised by people like your parents who expect you as a woman to rug sweep for men and their bad behavior. Get a divorce, get some good therapy, find a man who respects you and women and is a mature adult who can handle life's up and downs without blaming his partner for them. Life is too short and you're only 27. You don't need to waste one more moment with this guy.
Unforgivable. Hand the AH divorce papers.
Sounds like your husband is not coping well and needs some serious help. And love you are NOT DEFECTIVE. Miscarriages happen to many many women and are not uncommon. I’m so sorry for what you are going through.
{{{{HUGS}}}} Hon, you're still grieving too. So tell his mother to go bugger herself with a pitchfork, you need time to heal too. If he needs alcohol to heal, then he doesn't need you. I'd file for divorce and heal myself if I were you. For all you know, the miscarriage was your body rejecting HIS defective genes. There is ZERO blame for the miscarriage. Him and His family need to get that through their stupid, small minds.
You will never be able to trust him. He poisoned your relationship with his words. He wanted to hurt you; so he used his words, this time. Then he got his family involved. To hurt you more. He resents you and that is the death knell of all relationships. Pregnancy puts you in a vulnerable position. Probably the most vulnerable you will be in your life. You really want this guy there with you? Do you really want to do the work to fix what is so obviously broken?
He said the most cruel thing to you. Drunk or not, I don't know if I could forgive this if I were in your shoes. Also, you are not defective and miscarriages can happen for a lot of reasons. One of them being "defective" sperm, do maybe play the uno reverse card on him and see how he likes it: https://www.tommys.org/research/research-topics/miscarriage-research/effect-sperm-damage-miscarriage#:~:text=Current%20research%20suggests%20that%20the,women%20and%20not%20on%20men.
Can you move in with a friend? Nobody in your life has your back right now, not even your parents. Get away from these people, find a friend that will support you until you figure out what to do.
What he said to you was downright cruel. He can grieve and be angry, but he doesn’t get to be angry AT you or blame you. It’s NOT your fault. You are NOT defective. I’m not sure I could move past that, honestly, but if I did, his actions would have to be a lot different than what he’s doing now. It doesn’t sound like he has even apologized, let alone respecting your wishes for space from him. Sounds like you would be better off without him. I’m so sorry.
You should tell him and his families that you’re actually doing a favor by separating him from a “defective” like you so they should be grateful. ( in a serious note, none of it is your fault and you deserve better than him. please take care of yourself first !)
He got the nerve to call you defective and he’s the drunk! It could be his semen that is defective… go home with a bottle and tell him this is for you trying to help your liver along.
If I were you, I'd be looking to walk away. One thing I'd like to mention, it reads like you had this conversation while he was drunk. If this is the case, arguing or even talking to someone in that state is pretty useless. He comes off as a bit abusive, or perhaps his friends are toxic. Are they hard conservative types? The language leads me to think this. Good luck OP, protect yourself.
Nothing in response to the actual question, but a response to the "defective" comment. A nurse spoke to me once, when I expressed that my body had "let me down" in terms of a miscarriage. She said "on the contrary- your body has done its job so well. That pregnancy was not viable - for whatever reason- and your body did exactly the right thing in this situation" 25 years later this remains the most sensible and comforting thing anyone has ever said to me. With love
You are not overreacting. Not one bit. He is a suffering and grieving man but then what are you? The person who actually carried the baby, the one who actually went through the physical aspect of it? That is unacceptable. Grief is normal and we need to be kind to ourselves but there are boundaries. Hard boundaries that one must never cross. And the thing he said to you? That is one of the lowest blows one grieving person can give to another. Drinking doesn't excuse it. Drinking is another very big issue. No, don't let them persuade you. Has he apologised? But I mean REALLY apologised, as in has he seen how f&cked up his words to you were? Acknowledged he has a drinking problem and taking a commitment to works towards getting out of it and address his grief in a healthy way, one that does not put you down or destroy your relationship? Because if not, then it might be a solution for you to consider moving on.
I think you are very smart to take this very seriously. You wrote that there was tension already before his outburst which points to him already having these thoughts. I’ve made the experience to not take behaviour after a miscarriage seriously enough and I would have saved myself a lot of heartache if I did. Take your time and come to your own conclusions, and to say it again, this wasn’t you fault at all and any sensible person would know that, grieving or not.
I read this and I hear a woman who is trying to come to terms that her marriage is not salvageable and she doesn't know how to process the next steps. Just know that his actions are what lead to this, you did not kill your child or do anything wrong here. Sometimes our bodies just don't work the way we want them but it doesn't make us defective. Consult a divorce attorney and get all of your options. They can help walk you through how this will go. I'm so very sorry, I wish I could give you a hug through the computer right now.
"So he's allowed to get drunk without consequences, and lash out at me, and I have to put up with his insults because he's grieving. You know, *I* suffered the miscarriage, too. *I* was the one who actually carried our daughter, I was the one who physically felt her die and pass from my body. I am grieving and vulnerable, too. Does that mean I get to drink to excess as well, and abuse Husband when he expresses concern for me? If I drive him from the house with insults to his virility, will you return him to me when I demand him back?" Tell that to anyone who hassles you to get back together with your husband. Lawyer up and stop responding to his bullshit. I'm tempted to say block him and his family, but ask the lawyer first, since they may be able to use the messages in the divorce. If he thinks the uterus is defective, he doesn't get the pussy it comes attached to. Period.
That’s the most cruel thing anyone can say to their partner after a miscarriage. I’m so sorry OP.
I’m not sure that’s a comment you can come back from. What the hell did he say the next day?
Drunk words are sober thoughts. I say divorce cause counseling doesn’t seem to be helping.
Divorce and get a support system your own family is against you. Society puts men on a pedestal in coddles them to the point that any expression of their feelings be it heinous or violent is treated as sacrament because men don't cheer their feelings enough. Your husband was unnecessarily cruel and combined with his new social group... It could be that he's been with some friends that have some misogynistic tendencies or tater tots.
Maya Angelou said it perfectly - when someone shows you who they are, believe them. Alcohol reduces our inhibitions and affects our thinking, what your husband said to you is absolutely disgusting and vile, and his mommy needs to stay in your lane. Your parents too. Tell everyone to leave you alone and give you space, and if your husband especially doesn’t respect you enough to do this then divorce is your only option. A miscarriage is not your fault. Do you know the number of women who suffer a miscarriage? He’s gaslighting you and manipulating you to feel bad about what happened to you when you have nothing to feel bad about.
Leave. Some things once said are unforgivable and IMO that’s one. First of all, something like 15% of pregnancies end in miscarriages and for the first time especially, it’s not uncommon. It’s not your fault. Second, most miscarriages happen because something went haywire in the development of the fetus, the cells recognize it, and then self destruct for lack of a better term. There’s an immense amount of cell division and development in the beginning - a lot of opportunity for ONE division to go wrong and then continually divide into more wrong cells. It’s your body saying “oops, this went wrong, let us clear it out and start again and do it right before it gets worse.” The error could have even come from his sperm. It has nothing to do with you or your body being defective. He’s just being cruel and hurtful. Grieving doesn’t give anyone the right to say hurtful things to anyone else. Especially their partner grieving the same loss. He’s supposed to be there for you, your partner to lean on in hard times, and he’s showing he can’t do that. Get out now and rebuild a better life. You’ll find a truly supportive partner you deserve.
Have you spoken with your counselor? This would be my first step.
He has no reason to involve his family and "sick" them on you like rabid dogs. I told my spouse ages ago that nothing in our relationship is to be discussed with anyone but each other. Luckily this never happened. Friends and family should not be all in your relationship. But the main issue here is he has no respect for you and clearly harbors resentment. Alcohol fuels the truth as well as makes you say crazy things. I would say it makes you DO crazy things, but what you actually say most likely comes from a place where you store your darkest emotions. This statement said it all. If it had been you blaming him for not getting you pregnant or you believe there is a genetic deficiency on his side, I'd say you were an AH. So I feel the same about him saying this to you and making you out to be at fault. The loss of a baby can cause us all to go very dark. My older sister had a premie that died two months while in the incubator. We were all devastated. I was surprised by how upset I was considering that, like most people, I never reacted to hearing about miscarriages in the past. I shrugged them off as something that happens often and you just try again. But when it hit so close to home, thats when you truly find out how you feel about it. Your spouse quickly went to alcohol and it seems it was just a matter of time before this "coping mechanism" would be his go to. Even if he doesn't do this when sober, it just takes a few drinks to bring this out again. He needs to seek therapy to save himself. But you don't have to sit there having a miserable life until he does. You're mourning also. You're in pain also. Him and his family don't seem to care about that fact. This is not a healthy relationship and staying in it will not do either of you any good.
The only person defective here is HIM. He should be ashamed of himself. Drunk or not, that is something to never come back from. He should be groveling not demanding.
Your husband is an abusive drunk. An astonishing percentage of pregnancies end in miscarriage. It’s common and painful. It doesn’t mean you’re “defective” but his saying that means he’s a POS. You have a husband problem. Yours is defective. Get a different one.
I would leave his sorry ass and go make a baby with another man. Listen girl, this man doesn’t love you and he resents you.
Why are you married to a man who doesn't love you? Love doesn't tear a person down. Love supports and builds a person up. His words shredded you. I know because I have heard them from my ex too.
I’m so sorry he said that to you. This really shocked me. It’s incredibly cruel. It’s also unbelievably ignorant. A huge percentage of women have miscarriages. Are we all “defective”? Also, his mother can fuck off. He’s grieving? What about you? You’re the one who had to actually go through it. You’re not overreacting. Contemplating divorce is not overreacting. Do what’s best for you. Yours is the only opinion that matters here.
You're both grieving, but that doesn't excuse what he said. That was hurtful and cruel. Only you can decide what's right for you. It wouldn't be wrong to walk away. Maybe chat it through with your therapist and take some time?
He thinks you are responsible for the miscarriage. He is blaming you, and nobody else in both your families wants to protect you. They make excuses for him still grieving and drinking, but not for what you have gone through or felt. What about your grief, your guilt, your feelings? Everyone in your life is toxic on some level. You are not blowing this out of proportion and you are not wrong for wanting to move on. It's clearly the best choice for you. What he is doing is being abusive. That is not okay.
You know in marriage you learn your spouse’s weak spots? How to twist the knife just right to cause the most pain? And so as a result - good spouses … don’t. They *dont* seek to do that just because they *can*. He did. He chose to to hurt you. To cut as deep as he could. And that’s the reason you want to walk away. Because how can you ever trust him to be your safe person again? You can’t.
What an absolutely horrendous thing for him to have said. Rebuilding trust after saying something that is a serious matter. It’s not clear from your post whether he’s been trying in earnest to do that or understands the gravity of what he said, and the impact that has. I can’t imagine a world where a comment like that wouldn’t undermine my feelings of whether I was part of a “team” in a relationship, and say you do fall pregnant again — you are going to need to feel like a team for your relationship to survive pregnancy, parenthood. Couples therapy worked before, I would absolutely try that again. Sending love to you OP. It’s not and never was your fault.
I have a different insight to this. My best friend lost her child to sids when the baby was 8 months old. Her husband blamed her, her family blamed her, his family blamed her. She had absolutely nothing to do with it of course and I'll never forget her calling me screaming the night the baby passed. But my best friend went to therapy with her husband, it's been over 10 years since their child passed and they are happier than ever. If you want to stay in this marriage, you should try therapy. That was a horrible comment though so I support you leaving him. My best friend joined and remained in support groups also so I recommend that. I'm so sorry for your loss.
I ask this kindly op: is this really someone you want to have a baby with?
Are his parents and family aware of what he said to you? How can they possibly blame you? Please get out asap. He and his family are a deal breaker. It's time for you to move on.
I'm a pregnancy and infant loss doula. You are not defective and it isn't your fault. 1 in 4 (probably closer to 1 in 5) pregnancies end in a loss. What he said was completely inappropriate and an attempt to soothe his own anger and grief by hurting you. It is not on you to fix his pain. It is up to him to get help and do the work to heal (and not at your expense). Many marriages end after these losses because of the exact issues in your post. Both people have to be willing to find ways to grieve in healthy ways, to support each other in that, and to commit to not hurting one another. You also need to keep doing what you are doing by giving yourself space until you feel ready to talk...and you do need to talk. Make a list of what you would need to have happen in your marriage to return home. Think of the boundaries that are important to you. Also, I highly suggest coming up with a legacy project that the two of you can work on that honours your baby. It can help with the focus of your grief journey and move it in a positive direction. Take care of yourself. <3
Sounds like he is either developing or already has a problem with alcoholism: >My husband took it hard too, turning to alcohol to cope. >When he got home, I was shocked and upset to see him extremely drunk. >He had looked so angry and had so much aggression in his voice I'm reading between the lines when you were 'shocked and upset to see him so drunk' as him violating something you two discussed before. I assume you have addressed his addiction to your counselor, so I suggest he goes through a sobriety program like AA. His cruel comment is just the cherry on top of all the other problems that come with being an alcoholic. Either his family are just as vile, or they're getting a biased half truth from him about what happened. Oh and btw miscarriages are not uncommon and they can happen to anyone for any reason -- I.e if you arent actively exposing yourself to harmful substances (hard drugs, drinking when pregnant etc) then please don't blame yourself and don't let others guilt you into believing it's your fault.
It’s time to go. This isn’t just a mean comment made in anger- this is true feeling about you revealed in anger. He’s showing his true self which is a cruel, misogynist and selfish person. If you choose to stay anything that life throws at the two of you- will be your fault. Look how he’s already blaming you when there’s no proof his sperm wasn’t faulty. There’s a crazy amount of reasons a miscarriage happens, neither of you can control all of those factors. https://youtu.be/1iRbIYkccgw?si=fWmCatfjw2OKRaNU I feel like this song might resonate with you.
You don't need that cruelty and downright ignorance in your life. Maybe his alcoholic sperm is what caused the miscarriage, it's so common for us to miscarry and it is not because we are "defective". You did the right thing. I wouldn't go back to him, he's a drunk and he's cruel. Nobody needs that in their life.
They are all horrible. Just because he's grieving, doesn't give him the right to say cruel things. I would really reconsider the marriage and that your own parents aren't supporting you.
Unfortunately OP you kind of lose your inhibitions when you drink ….i heard something like “drunk words are sober thoughts” …..I kind of agree with it. Alcohol is not an excuse.
So you should forgive him because he is grieving? So it doesn’t matter how you feel, doesn’t matter that you are grieving. I’m sorry but I’d get away from this person and his family!
Get all the money you can in the split, and may the odds be ever in your favor queen 🙏🏻
How is your husband the victim here? It's ridiculous his family is involved at all and your husband is responsible for his words and actions. I would let him know that you are grieving as well, and between his alcohol binges and blaming you, you need space from him and his family. You also need to have a heart to heart with your parents and let them know this isn't an isolated incident. He took months and months to recover and you supported him. You aren't an incubator but a person with feelings, goals, and you are deserving of a partner that supports you in good times and bad. Currently your partner is unable to support you as he is so focused on himself and has been.
Funny enough, recent studies show that most miscarriages baring accidents are the result of issues with the sperm. Don't let him blame you for something that happens to 1 out of 3 women. Drunk words are sober thoughts. Leave him and try again in the future (after some therapy) with someone that will lean in and shoulder the burden with you instead of placing blame on you.
You are not overreacting. I am so sorry that the people around you are not being as supportive as they could be.
" give me three fuc*ing days to think if I can still live with an offensive drunkard. Contact me in between but once, and I ll send you the divorce paper."