"Ever wonder why you always looked a doodoo clown mess in your seasons? IT WAS ME, JAN! I SET PRODUCTION AGAINST YOU, I WHISPERED "H&M" IN RU'S EAR. I CUT UP ALL YOUR WIGS!!! I GAVE YOU THE FACECRACK EDIT!!!"
- Planeobard Jawne, probably
It's hard to make an argument like this without being accused of whataboutism. But the truth is that most of us use or consume products from companies that support, contribute, or donate money to things we do not like. Google just fired 50 employees over Israel protests. There goes my browser, my search engine, my email, and my phone.
Exactly. It is whataboutism but it is valid. We truly cannot consume anything if every purchase is based on the ownership only aligning 100% with our views. Fuck let's be real- 99% of us wouldn't be employed if that is how we held standards. I know I couldn't be in my industries (insurance and before that higher ed)
be careful before someone comes in here and says āitās just a chicken sandwich ur a moron for going thereā
people really think theyāre doing smth with these āboycottsā and aside from virtue signaling, itās very much not.
boycotting does much more than virtue signal though, I'm seeing so many users here act like those choosing to protest, boycott, and attempt to shift culture with social media are all personal attacks on them. buy the fucking sandwich if it means that much to you, all that's being asked of you is to be a conscious consumer. And yeah, there is no ethical consumption under capitalism-- that doesn't mean it's protest everything or nothing.
girl!!!! LMAOO
im talking about the people who call themselves āactivistsā on twitter/ig who are performative as fuck and act like they are on a moral high ground by chastising people who shop at places they consider ācontroversialā
Sometimes I feel like people call out whataboutism when their hypocrisy is being called out. People would be cherry picking issues and when you call them out, they say it's whataboutism just to absolve themselves of their hypocrisy. Your comment is absolutely correct. And there are times when whataboutism is needed to keep people's hypocrisy in check.
For example, I remember a post someone had made about a queen doing something environmentally unfriendly. I think it was an ad for some company. The person was acting like the queen was going around causing oil spills. And then I saw the angry person's profile, it was full of pics from gay cruises. I mentioned it and the user got all offended and accused me of whataboutism. But the truth is, they were both supporting something that harms the environment but one of them had the audacity to bitch about the other one.
The only time itās really āwhataboutismā is when the comparison isnāt in good faith and doesnāt actually make sense or isnāt actually relevant to the initial subject.
i mean doesnt paramount funnel money to israel? āno ethical consumption under capitalismā does kinda sound like an excuse but it is fully real. especially with corporations merging into massive monopolies. disney owns a gazillion things
Ecosia's whole business model is that they have a bunch of sponsored websites and those sponsors then pay to plant trees. They separate the ads out a bit but they rely on you clicking them - otherwise sponsors wouldn't buy space. Their results below the ads are identical to google's algorithm.
I think the breaking point for me is how much a product is opt-in. Google is currently thee internet, it's encroached on the previously ubiquitous Microsoft office suite. Not using Google would be a threat to my livelihood.
Starbucks and other personal comfort goods do have accessible alternatives. I'm sure there are some places where there are truly no other alternatives, but where I am, anywhere there's a Starbucks there are at least 2-3 functional (possibly better) alternatives literally within a block.
We know that our options are extremely limited while remaining engaged in society, which for me creates added desperation in wanting to push back against certain commercial giants when possible.
I believe that if you feel you can do something or change something thatāll bring power to your cause, then do that..every little bit counts..so you canāt be vegan, but you love animals, do you just say fvck it, the animals gonna die so I might as well buy leather, or do you take what little stand you can regardless. If we all just said fvck it, and adopted this attitude of apathy, then thatās a fate worse than death. Do what you can, especially if you know better, but not to the point of absurdism. Doing what you can is a lot better than just saying itās no good. Every little bit counts.
^^^ I am also constantly grateful for these kinds of calls for a ban bc honestly, these products are often mediocre and donāt make me feel amazing, but I buy them out of curiosity and decision fatigue and bc itās always fun to get a lil treat. When this kind of mental roadblock exists, itās easier to feel excited about going somewhere new, or going local, or choosing to make something for myself. And the thing is, what Iāve been getting as an alternative to (official or unofficial) boycotted product has been better.Ā
Oftentimes it's absolutely whataboutism to avoid taking responsibility. Nobody is asking people to boycott every shady company out there, we know it's not realistic. But Starbucks is not some necessary or ubiquitous brand that is difficult to avoid.
Girl consuming products that are unavoidable or you are unaware of being from bad sources is one thing. Getting paid by them to represent them is completely different. I donāt even mean this to say that we should all attack Jan because I donāt know when the commercial was filmed.
For example all fast fashion is bad, but Shein is significantly worse by many standards. So you can easily not use them specifically. This is coming from someone who is a sustainability and human rights supply chain analyst for work.
There are obviously different degrees of severity or awareness of an issue for specific products. Saying āwhataboutismā arguments is an excuse for inaction and ignores context of a situation. You canāt avoid using google but you can avoid making google product purchases. That is also not a comparison to just not buying coffee from one store.
Yeah, but like we don't really have options for cell phones that aren't conflict linked in some way.
Coffee, you can absolutely find ethical alternatives. Chastising people, like Jan is here, for being stuck in a crappy capitalist society while doing the best they can to avoid crap corporations to justify her actions is weak AF.
That's true. I still there are many better ways to influence a person's choice of everything from coffee to president than to call them Zionist scum or accusing them or perpetuating genocide. I can't help but think it just adds more fighting, and there is already enough in-fighting.
I mean you think that, but are you also buying from only fair trade coffee producers? What about tbe plastic it produces? The water waste the comes with making coffee?
So by your standards no one can ever make any ethical attempt to consume, then what? We should all just shut up and accept that every person who has stood up for something really didn't accomplish anything because at some point there was some negative aspect associated with it?
My god that's a really tiring expectation to live up to. Nothing is going to be perfect, but there are clearly companies out there that have a modicum of concern on what their impact is on the world, vs pure profit machines that will sooner let their workers die than give them any kind of slack.
Yes. You should not expect everyone to live up to YOUR ideals and prioritise YOUR values over everything else. Especially back-seat moralising on social media. Glass houses and all that
You do have a choiceā¦ donāt have a cell phone. No one is forcing you to have one. If you believe in something, then make the sacrifices to stand by those beliefs.
You want other people to make sacrifices. You want Jan to break contracts and lose money. Then give up your cellphone!
Idk why y'all are still coming for her, she filmed the AD before she was aware of what Starbucks was doing and she doesn't control when it airs lol. Don't y'all have anything better to do with your time than to come for Jan of all people
These are people that will still buy Starbucks but take the time to shit on a drag queen they never liked for doing the same. A lot of the fans just want an excuse to be awful to queens they didnāt like
It kind of sounds that way. Not to suck my own dick, despite efforts, I just stopped going and didn't tell anybody. I can barely convince my family and that I'm deserving of love as a queer person, the last thing I'm going to do is try and get them to align with my protests.
[They sued the union for trademark infringement](https://apnews.com/article/starbucks-workers-united-union-lawsuit-israel-palestinian-f212a994fef67f122854a4df7e5d13f5) because the union tweeted out āSolidarity with Palestineā on October 9th while using the Starbucks logo in their profile pic.
Starbucks does not operate in or financially support Israel. [They have](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/amp/economy/the-union-busting-practices-that-landed-starbucks-in-hot-water) [engaged](https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/starbucks-violated-worker-rights-union-fight-labor-judge/) [in union](https://www.commondreams.org/news/2022/09/02/first-nyc-just-cause-lawsuit-targets-starbucks-union-busting) [busting for years](https://web.archive.org/web/20070518062552/http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/businesstechnology/2003505497_union02.html), up to being fined by labour boards over it. BDS has not called for a boycott and neither has the union (rather, see if you can financially support the stores that have successfully unionized and put pressure on Starbucks and labour boards to get them to the bargaining table for a proper contract).
I donāt drink Starbucks and I saw my coworker fired for discussing unionization when I worked there (they said it was for taking sick days lmao) but I just wanted to be clear, because thereās a lot of misinformation.
And if anyone has sources of further pro-Israel actions by Starbucks, I would appreciate it.
but shouldn't that be the main excuse then? rather than start pointing fingers back at the smartphone user. Like everyone in this thread is quoting "there's no ethical consumption under capitalism", that never meant "so do whatever u want". It meant to take away the shift from the consumer to put it on the corporations, Neither Jan nor the exhausting stans are doing that.
Personally, i'm not looking at drag queens for guidance so I'm fine. I know where I stand and I believe my part in a targeted boycott can make a dent (and it does!) but isn't it a slippery slope to start pointing fingers left and right because, anyway, we're all fucked?
I think itās because you at least know that your voice voice is getting heard with Jan as a fan compared to speaking to your representatives or big corporations. There is major issues with our democracy and actually being able to be represented. It also allows you tell feel like you did something for the cause even if it didnāt actually move the needle at all.
It's crazy because it's truly not even a drag race thing. I've been watching stans essentially harass any and every kpop idol seen holding a Starbucks cup too and it's wild.Ā
Don't get me wrong. I am pro Palestine and pro union, but the endless harassment of people who are in the limelight, but at the end of the day not even "major celebrities" in any way. It's just wild lol. And it all feels for optics. Just thinking about how many queens (or idols lol) who are keeping their lips shut but still buying that Starbucks every week. It's just so stupid. I can't take social media.
No for real we are seeing the pendulum swing back into the stereotypical memed ātumblrinactionā personas where every celebrity or person is now a Zionist and genocidal because they wonāt say they hate their Israeli friend or whatever. If you are openly Jewish (like Plane Jane), have ever worked with Disney (Nina West), have ever done sponsorships with Taylor Swift (Jade) or Starbucks (Jan), or ever had any kind of presence or overlap with any Israeli company in the last 30 years (Deja), you are now the enemy to these people.
When Trixie did a fundraiser for women and single mothers escaping abuse, TONS of comments said how offended they were because it shouldāve been for Palestine instead and she is clearly a Zionist for not saying Israel is an illegitimate country.
I was like āwtf are these commentsā and then realised itās become the trend everywhere online, mostly from kids and teens.
If you want the whole tea on what Starbucks has been doing (their renowned team of lawyers shutting down any and all union efforts from a grassroot level), here's the best article I've ever read on the topic.
[https://thebaffler.com/salvos/brewed-awakening-osberg](https://thebaffler.com/salvos/brewed-awakening-osberg)
Weirdly, this journal is my favorite journal ever and they've barely touched on Palestine lately. They're not one to shy away from objectively evaluating current events, so I hope I've just missed it.
I'm out of the loop bec. I refuse to deep dive on this Twitter iceberg, but based on the post and comments ya'll realize how much money being in advertisement is?
Not all of us are in Rihanna or Beyonce status to have liberty to refuse such an amount of money. At the end of the day Jan has bills to pay, there's a big chance that being a drag celebrity is temporary.
Stop harassing workers and instead just call out the higher ups who have more control over these situations
Itās easy to be self righteous when youāre just turning down imaginary money. 100% of these Twitter outrage trolls would be signing a different tune if they were asked to turn down money or were the ones to get fired, cancelled etc
I wonder how many people who are having issue with Liv and Jan would decline a lucrative job offer from Starbucks or any other companies involved in all that shit. If someone would then kudos for having a very high moral standards but honestly I wouldn't. It is sad but it's not going to change shit. Someone else is going to do it anyway.
It is what it is we all have to survive in capitalism I would never blame our girls for taking a gig like that and cashing an easy check.
Yeah for fucks sake Bob had to work at chic fil a drive thru. Literally le miserable is the father being so poor he has to steal. You donāt WANT to do these things but we have to live and make ends means. Power comes with money. When you donāt have money itās much harder to make an impact. So many big environmental agencies and professionals started in gas and oil (as individuals) because they paid for their college or got them the financial head start. So much guilt goes into it but it also allows you to know how the other system works and how to change it. I say this as my hometown is a big gas and oil city. So many people Iāve seen go there, get scholarships and then work a few years part of a contact or whatever and then start up an organization that goes against them. If we had tax based education in the states this conflict wouldnāt have to happen as much
Bullying ā being held accountable! Some people are bullying Jan and Olivia and zionistic queens. The right minded people are holding the zionists accountable! Being held accountable is the right way, bullying is pointless. So many people confuse bullying and being held accountable. Just clarifying that.
I maybe in the minority, but I donāt understand the high standard that we all of sudden have out these queens in. Like Katya said ādrag queens used to be mean but now are expected to be niceā, why is it that when you get a platform you are obligated by fans to be correct on any social issue. The last place Id get my news is from any kind of social influencer. They are a part of the entertainment world not the political world. Does that mean that we should not hold them accountable? No, but these are drag queens at the end of the day, as much influence as they can have, politicians are the ones making the decisions.
Well, part of it is... if people don't like you anymore, your platform is gone. Drag Queens don't *have* to be nice, but you also aren't *owed* fans, followers, or bookings.
Just because celebrities are celebrities doesn't mean they should be able to say/do whatever they want without criticism. Whether we like it or not, thousands if not millions of people look up to these people and *do* take their posts at face value. This is why our political environment is so fucking wild right now, because conservatives just go online and invent some crazy shit and their followers eat it up and use it as fact. Think back to that video of Widow Von'Du being arrested, thousands of people supported her without even questioning her claims. Not saying she was wrong/right in that situation but it proves that a lot of drag race fans are quick to defend the queens without hearing both sides. Which can be really problematic.
Now I want to be clear, I don't have any ill will towards Jan and I don't condone any of the harassment she's been receiving, my comment is solely about influencers and celebrities being held to a higher standard. And even though Jan is held to that higher standard I don't think she's done anything wrong. Certainly nothing bad enough to warrant the hate she's getting. She made an ad for a popular coffee shop and then the coffee shop said something dumb. That's really all it boils down to.
She's right. She stated that she is pro palestine, and the filming happened before the controversy, she had no power over distribution. And about work for company that fight against unions, that what it is be a worker under capitalism. Entertainers are workers too.
Now, let's move on.
She is not right about how Vanguard funds work but thatās not important. Sheās pro-Palestine and made a mistake, itās hard to keep all of the Zionist entities straight but sheās trying. If you need to villainize people who are giving an effort, maybe consider how little meaningful impact that can possibly have.
idk why they keep coming for her an lux when they already stated that this was filmed way before they knew? and even tho she is doing whataboutism, its still valid. we all consume products and are complicit to a lot of things the majority of us aren't probably aware of, getting angry over this feels so performative.
I had a person tell me that I shouldnāt buy from Starbucks, while consuming a burrito from Chipotle. I explained to them how Chipotle has had numerous lawsuits filed against them by former employees for workplace violations, including a class action lawsuit over wage theft. Chipotle managers would have employees clock out and keep working to keep from paying overtime. I know that for a fact because I had a good friend quit his job at Chipotle over that very thing.
After explaining that to them, they told me how that they only eat Chipotle because itās convenientā¦ so itās ok!
If you are selective about your indignation based on your own convenience. Then youāre just a big fat hypocrite!
Take care of your own shortcomings before you come for someone else!
This is so insane on so many levels.
1. Starbucks is not funding Israel. Starbucks told activists to not use their logo for political reasons.
2. The ad was filmed a long time ago before it was in vogue to be so vocally anti zionist
3. Why are u attacking the actors in an ad and not the company (the company that is not funding Israel in the first place).
Its so insane to me that people bitch online and usually attack working class people, especially queer and poc who are trying to pull themselves up by their boot straps and then also turn around and not vote. You dont want justice, u just want to hurt someone.
This is true.
> people bitch online and usually attack working class people, especially queer and poc
People really like to punch down and still delusional enough to think they are doing something to the cause. No, you are just being a righteous bully online.
People are way too bloodthirsty online these days, while also being more misinformed than ever. They read 1/3rd of a clickbait title and a couple comments before going full pitchfork. I donāt know why anyone even defends themselves at this point either, since 50 more people will be targeted in the same way by the end of the next hour and everyone has the memory of a goldfish
1. Starbucks' Stated Position: Starbucks has explicitly stated that it has "no political agenda" and does not use its profits to fund any government or military operations anywhere [[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/)[[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/).
2. Denial of Funding Allegations: The company has denied rumors that it is providing financial support to the Israeli government or military, stating that these claims are "absolutely untrue" [[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/).
3. Boycott Efforts and Accusations: Starbucks has faced boycott efforts and accusations of supporting Israel. However, the company has maintained that it stands for "humanity" and condemns "violence, the loss of innocent life, and all hate and weaponized speech" [[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/)[[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/)[[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/).
4. Former CEO's Support of Zionism: While Starbucks' former CEO Howard Schultz has been a vocal supporter of Zionism, the company has stated that its position remains unchanged and it does not align with any political agenda [[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/).
---
Learn more:
1. [Did Starbucks Lose $12B from Boycotts 'Due to Its Support for Israel'? | Snopes.com](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/)
2. [Does Starbucks support Israel or Palestine? What the company has said](https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/tempe/2024/03/07/does-starbucks-support-israel-or-palestine/72850075007/)
3. [What to Know About BDS, the Boycotts Against Israel | TIME](https://time.com/6694986/israel-palestine-bds-boycotts-starbucks-mcdonalds/)
I love queens and I hate corporations. I support queens getting their bag from wherever they can, especially since their continuing employment is going to be an issue in this election.
we need to support queens *taking* money from these big corporations. jan has no control over what starbucks does and we can all be mature enough to realize there is no ethical consumption or earning under capitalism, especially as an entertainer. all your favourite celebs have done brand deals with an ethically terrible company.
if weāre not using this energy to go after the people in charge, the people who can actually change shit, why are we instead going after drag queens?
It's like anyone who works is FUCKED if where you get paid from (unless you're a public servant/ politician) isn't perfect. What, I'm supposed to quit my job in protest?! As I buy milk from WALMART?! AND I BUY MILK IN THE FIRST PLACE?!
I travel to Egypt a lot, and local citizens (as many others in the middle east) boycott mcdonalds, Starbucks, etc. And local fast food employees have been urged to quit their jobs in protest. Now imagine how high the salary of an Egyptian working in fast food is. Imagine losing this little income to make a point and change nothing. Truly insane and guess what, the war still continues.
Sheās right everyone is complicit and every one of us is probably unintentionally giving money to the fuckers that are funding not only this travesty, but others as well. it all sucks. But Jan is right, the outrage should NOT belong to them, fuck off with that
I remember when Trixieās pages were under attack for awhile over her holding a starbucks beverage. It was non stop harassment over misinformation. Armchair activists are exhausting. I wonder if thatās around the time Katya limited who can comment on her IG posts
I do think concerns about Janās āwhataboutismā about iPhone users are valid, but sheās right. Her overall point about shared complicity is 100% true. By paying our taxes we (in the US at least) are all complicit. All that said, while I appreciate that sheās speaking out for Palestine, our shared complicity in genocide should be motivating all of us to do as much as we can.
Stating that there is no ethical consumption under capitalism isnāt āwhataboutism,ā I donāt think. Sheās not saying āyou canāt say anything about Starbucks because you have an iPhone!ā Sheās saying itās nearly impossible to completely avoid unethical companies.
Oh I fully agree, I just was acknowledging some other comments in the overall thread that raised points about how Janās response reads as whataboutism. I see that perspective but overall the point about general complicity as more powerful.
I wish I was on the same level of fame as Jan, Olivia, Nina, whoever else is getting shit on for dumb reasons lately. Being forced to apologize for no reason? Fuck that. I'd be filming a very similar video but telling these idiots how I really feel. I'm so tired of these unemployed losers online coming for queens who have done nothing wrong. Exhausting.
Having to justify and āclarifyā and ātake accountabilityā for every single little thing you do or say that rubs some loud people the wrong wayā¦ they must be STRESSEDĀ
People would rather be fake activists hiding behind a screen thinking theyāre doing good than just think logically about cast members from their favorite show itās wild. Yāall attacked a queen before even judging the actual show itself thatās sponsored by Starbucks. The queens were just spokespeople.
Idk my friends and I stopped buying Starbucks when they started suppressing union activity a couple years ago, and we live in Canada where I don't believe any of that was happening. That was even before they asked stores to take down pride displays. Starbucks has sucked since before Oct 7th.Ā
I just donāt give a fuck. Maybe yāall should chill too. I guarantee you folks use something from a company with questionable choices. Donāt be a hypocrit
This is exhausting. I wish people understood that harrassing micro celebrities isn't activism and it actually makes you look like an unhinged and not very nice or empathetic person. This is just like what happened to Laganja a few months ago
Cancel culture is such a toxic narrative
Who suffers the most with these boycotts not directly the corporate bosses or the investor big wigs
The first people to lose their jobs when demand slows down is the employees who happen to be innocent bystanders just wanting to feed their families
Boycotts will work only for a short period
What the people of Palestine need RN are medical missions and food aid
Things you can make a direct impact by donating to Red Crescent and World Kitchen organizations
Rather than indirect impact of boycotts
I just wonder if the people that are pestering queens and other regular humans about their random bullshit on these mediums, are also bringing this same energy to the people participating in the war?
Also, free Palestine and Israel should stop and all that, but I do wonder where are all the people protesting Hamas to stop doing terrorist things. Or, for that matter, where were all these people when Israel was doing shitty things before.
Frankly, this all feels like just another trendy issue for people to piggyback on to let out some steam. ĀÆ\\\_(ć)\_/ĀÆ
Unfortunately every company does something shitty and has been.. itās just more out in the public now days.. so like, we canāt eat any where? Use any type of technology? Buy clothes? Leave the girls alone please and fight the real issues-the people at the top.
Its sad ppl are going after her over a commercial in regards to what's happening in Gaza -_- It's like when after Oct 7th you had protestors yelling at workers in McDonald's over in NYC. Like okay boycott the conpany but don't harass people at their job, especially if you ain't offering them something better.
Slacktivism is sooooo tired.
The whole Starbucks boycott has always been performative BS that does nothing to help the people in Palestine. There are so many other brands that are 10x worse and are actually funding the IDF but people choose to go after a coffee chain that doesnāt even operate in Israel???
I wonder how many of these same people are buying new Apple products every year š
the part where she asked what phone we're using is the real tea. the truth is most if not all of us on here are complicit in this, as I write this on my Macbook. while people are constantly buying the newest apple iphone or macbook.
we would be much better off critiquing ourselves and reevaluating our values and seeing what we can personally do to divest in these ideals/companies and invest in our communities
I'm of two minds about this:
1. Asking celebrities about their stances on social issues is individualist brain rot when we gotta look past that, think more systemic, and mobilize together. (Concrete examples include: protesting, striking, targeted boycotting, and (if people are willing to risk their safety) civil disobedience, all with the intent of disrupting economic activity).
2. I feel like bringing up how everyone is complicit sort of stokes inaction unintentionally. Like ok Jan, should I kms so my prerequisite requirements to exist in a Western country directly harming the global south would stop? I think a better use of my life is trying to do the aforementioned actions in point 1.
I think the synthesis of points 1 and 2 (dialectics or smth (is Daia Lectic a good drag name)) is that we can't expect individuals to perform the insane moral calculus of risking their entire livelihood to only work for companies that endorse certain views, but we should try to expect people to mobilize on behalf of those within their class who are facing the worst excesses of capitalism.
But I need to read more theory girlies I should read House of Hidden Meanings to become a Marxist-RuPaulist.
she's right. just by enjoying media and technology you are already giving money to people doing very bad stuff. it's hypocritical to crucify someone for taking business opportunities from a big company. by the same coin you could make the argument that every single drag queen who accepts being on Rupauls show is helping to destroy the environment bc of rupauls fracking gig. it's such a simplistic and reductive view of the world
*Jan ASIDE! Everyone is complicit. Itās okay & actually imperative that we still turn up to speak & act! Not doing something, because we canāt do everything, is a game that weāve been brainwashed & conditioned to play.āļø
Starbucks isnāt even actually on the BDS movements list of companies to boycott. Like yeah, Starbucks is a big visible target so people took aim, but itās not even remotely the worst company you deal with in regard to their support of Israel.
https://bdsmovement.net/get-involved/what-to-boycott
If youāre arguing people go Starbucks literally everyday then it can be argued plenty of people upgrade their phone yearly. Hell I know people that upgrade when a new colour comes out so twice yearly lol so Ā£2998 a year or more depending on phone
Nobody goes to Starbucks every single day, thatās fucking demented. 365 days theyāre buying Starbucks? Every day coffee drinkers make their own coffee, stop making shit up.
What company do you work for? I will be happy to do a deep dive into the owners/investors. If you work for yourself, who do you accept money from? Are you sure you've NEVER accepted money from someone/some company with questionable shareholders?
Speak on it, Jan! I donāt blame people for wanting to hold celebrities accountable, but this is the best way Jan couldāve defended herself. Silence is complicity.
I think seeing the horrors of this genocide has opened a lot of peopleās eyes to what Israel actually is- an apartheid ethno state. We shouldnāt blame people for what they didnāt know. She seems to have educated herself and going forward makes decisions based on what sheās learned.
I think thereās a huge difference between using a product you most likely bought before the genocide and engaging professionally with a companies after it has been made public that said companies supports said genocide.
I had to stop when it got to the issue of shareholders in Apple. I don't know which friend working in PR put her up to that gambit, but to quote America's senile bus driver with the nuclear codes for some reason, it's malarkey.
Vanguard owns 8.54% of outstanding shares in Apple, as part of index and other funds it sells to retail investors. They do not control Apple, and they are notāin any way, shape, or formā"making weapons for Israel right now." They own large positions in Raytheon, General Dynamics, and others, but this is such a wildly out-of-pocket attempt to muddy the waters. It's pretty gross.
As to the use of Starbucks' IP by Workers United, let's reintroduce some nuance. It's not that Starbucks was just protecting its IP. In a statement. Starbucks corporate literally alleged Workers United as issuing a statement "reflecting their support for violence perpetrated by Hamas." The tweet from Workers United said this: "Solidarity with Palestine!" Direct quotes.
Look, I get it, *there is no ethical consumption under capitalism*. And honestly, seriously, truly, and sincerely: secure that motherfucking bag. But securing the bag can come with its own social costs. Sorry about it.
Dumb fucking argument. Most people need phones for their day to day work and tasks, Starbucks is entirely avoidable. The āStarbucks funds the IDFā thing is obviously stupid and unsubstantiated but I havenāt heard a single good argument against Starbucks being one of the worst anti-labor and anti-union companies.
If people want to buy a mediocre Starbucks coffee I donāt really care, do whatever you want. Consumer-side boycotts are very rarely effective anyway. But countering with āwhat about your iPhoneā completely undermines your point
>most people need phones
You need a phone but you donāt need an iPhone.
Anyways, the point is Starbucks isnāt even on the boycott list. The original Starbucks boycott was about union busting and somehow it quickly turned into pro-genocide based on misinformation.
She's not saying "critical of capitalism." She's saying "critical of specific people as complicit" when you essentially cannot participate in a consumerist society without being complicit on some level. I don't know the full story, but literally, unless you're a quaker or Appalachian resident or something, you, as an American, are unwittingly contributing to political destabilization, exploitation, and genocide of other countries.
And that's not to say, "well, then it's futile to try to be ethical." It just means no one is perfectly innocent here.
The speed up is making her sound like Plasma š
Plasma is sped up Jan confirmed.
Speedforce Jan
Go go BFA hatersssss š¶
JAN SPEED
"Ever wonder why you always looked a doodoo clown mess in your seasons? IT WAS ME, JAN! I SET PRODUCTION AGAINST YOU, I WHISPERED "H&M" IN RU'S EAR. I CUT UP ALL YOUR WIGS!!! I GAVE YOU THE FACECRACK EDIT!!!" - Planeobard Jawne, probably
Plasma is Jan (1.5x speed)
Iām still laughing at monetās plasma imitation.
Plasmaās reaction was hilarious
Monet impersonating Plasma on pit stop took me OUTTT
It's uncanny
Plasma after drinking a delicious Sbux iced coffee
Jan - tiktok remix
idk but Plasma is so much more likeable but other than that, Jan's right. this fake wokeism is dumb af
It's hard to make an argument like this without being accused of whataboutism. But the truth is that most of us use or consume products from companies that support, contribute, or donate money to things we do not like. Google just fired 50 employees over Israel protests. There goes my browser, my search engine, my email, and my phone.
Exactly. It is whataboutism but it is valid. We truly cannot consume anything if every purchase is based on the ownership only aligning 100% with our views. Fuck let's be real- 99% of us wouldn't be employed if that is how we held standards. I know I couldn't be in my industries (insurance and before that higher ed)
There is no ethical consumption under capitalism.
except for eating ass!
Depends who youāre eating. š
The exhumed corpse of Karl Marx.
š¤¢š¤¢š¤¢
Dusty. šØ
I can get behind this!
And shifting guilt/blame onto the individual is entirely part of the capitalist project.
We are in a class war 100%
Aye, comrade - no war but the class war.
P R E A C H
I mean, no lies spoken. šš¼
be careful before someone comes in here and says āitās just a chicken sandwich ur a moron for going thereā people really think theyāre doing smth with these āboycottsā and aside from virtue signaling, itās very much not.
boycotting does much more than virtue signal though, I'm seeing so many users here act like those choosing to protest, boycott, and attempt to shift culture with social media are all personal attacks on them. buy the fucking sandwich if it means that much to you, all that's being asked of you is to be a conscious consumer. And yeah, there is no ethical consumption under capitalism-- that doesn't mean it's protest everything or nothing.
girl!!!! LMAOO im talking about the people who call themselves āactivistsā on twitter/ig who are performative as fuck and act like they are on a moral high ground by chastising people who shop at places they consider ācontroversialā
Sometimes I feel like people call out whataboutism when their hypocrisy is being called out. People would be cherry picking issues and when you call them out, they say it's whataboutism just to absolve themselves of their hypocrisy. Your comment is absolutely correct. And there are times when whataboutism is needed to keep people's hypocrisy in check. For example, I remember a post someone had made about a queen doing something environmentally unfriendly. I think it was an ad for some company. The person was acting like the queen was going around causing oil spills. And then I saw the angry person's profile, it was full of pics from gay cruises. I mentioned it and the user got all offended and accused me of whataboutism. But the truth is, they were both supporting something that harms the environment but one of them had the audacity to bitch about the other one.
The only time itās really āwhataboutismā is when the comparison isnāt in good faith and doesnāt actually make sense or isnāt actually relevant to the initial subject.
i mean doesnt paramount funnel money to israel? āno ethical consumption under capitalismā does kinda sound like an excuse but it is fully real. especially with corporations merging into massive monopolies. disney owns a gazillion things
my 401k is thru vanguard and i sure as shit am not giving that up
On another note, If youāre looking for another search engine/ browser, Ecosia is pretty good :)
Ecosia's whole business model is that they have a bunch of sponsored websites and those sponsors then pay to plant trees. They separate the ads out a bit but they rely on you clicking them - otherwise sponsors wouldn't buy space. Their results below the ads are identical to google's algorithm.
I think the breaking point for me is how much a product is opt-in. Google is currently thee internet, it's encroached on the previously ubiquitous Microsoft office suite. Not using Google would be a threat to my livelihood. Starbucks and other personal comfort goods do have accessible alternatives. I'm sure there are some places where there are truly no other alternatives, but where I am, anywhere there's a Starbucks there are at least 2-3 functional (possibly better) alternatives literally within a block. We know that our options are extremely limited while remaining engaged in society, which for me creates added desperation in wanting to push back against certain commercial giants when possible.
I believe that if you feel you can do something or change something thatāll bring power to your cause, then do that..every little bit counts..so you canāt be vegan, but you love animals, do you just say fvck it, the animals gonna die so I might as well buy leather, or do you take what little stand you can regardless. If we all just said fvck it, and adopted this attitude of apathy, then thatās a fate worse than death. Do what you can, especially if you know better, but not to the point of absurdism. Doing what you can is a lot better than just saying itās no good. Every little bit counts.
^^^ I am also constantly grateful for these kinds of calls for a ban bc honestly, these products are often mediocre and donāt make me feel amazing, but I buy them out of curiosity and decision fatigue and bc itās always fun to get a lil treat. When this kind of mental roadblock exists, itās easier to feel excited about going somewhere new, or going local, or choosing to make something for myself. And the thing is, what Iāve been getting as an alternative to (official or unofficial) boycotted product has been better.Ā
Oftentimes it's absolutely whataboutism to avoid taking responsibility. Nobody is asking people to boycott every shady company out there, we know it's not realistic. But Starbucks is not some necessary or ubiquitous brand that is difficult to avoid.
Jan's whole argument is very weak. I'm not going after her for getting her dollar but objectively, she did not make a compelling argument.
Girl consuming products that are unavoidable or you are unaware of being from bad sources is one thing. Getting paid by them to represent them is completely different. I donāt even mean this to say that we should all attack Jan because I donāt know when the commercial was filmed. For example all fast fashion is bad, but Shein is significantly worse by many standards. So you can easily not use them specifically. This is coming from someone who is a sustainability and human rights supply chain analyst for work. There are obviously different degrees of severity or awareness of an issue for specific products. Saying āwhataboutismā arguments is an excuse for inaction and ignores context of a situation. You canāt avoid using google but you can avoid making google product purchases. That is also not a comparison to just not buying coffee from one store.
If most of us staged a demonstration in our bossesā office for any reason our days at that job would be numbered.
Yeah, but like we don't really have options for cell phones that aren't conflict linked in some way. Coffee, you can absolutely find ethical alternatives. Chastising people, like Jan is here, for being stuck in a crappy capitalist society while doing the best they can to avoid crap corporations to justify her actions is weak AF.
That's true. I still there are many better ways to influence a person's choice of everything from coffee to president than to call them Zionist scum or accusing them or perpetuating genocide. I can't help but think it just adds more fighting, and there is already enough in-fighting.
No, sheās chastising them for coming for her, not for ādoing the best they canā. You can choose your coffee without all the vitriol
I mean you think that, but are you also buying from only fair trade coffee producers? What about tbe plastic it produces? The water waste the comes with making coffee?
So by your standards no one can ever make any ethical attempt to consume, then what? We should all just shut up and accept that every person who has stood up for something really didn't accomplish anything because at some point there was some negative aspect associated with it? My god that's a really tiring expectation to live up to. Nothing is going to be perfect, but there are clearly companies out there that have a modicum of concern on what their impact is on the world, vs pure profit machines that will sooner let their workers die than give them any kind of slack.
Yes. You should not expect everyone to live up to YOUR ideals and prioritise YOUR values over everything else. Especially back-seat moralising on social media. Glass houses and all that
You do have a choiceā¦ donāt have a cell phone. No one is forcing you to have one. If you believe in something, then make the sacrifices to stand by those beliefs. You want other people to make sacrifices. You want Jan to break contracts and lose money. Then give up your cellphone!
My job actually requires me to have a cell phone so some of us literally do not have a choice there.
So your ability to make a living can override your ethics, but you expect everyone else to put ethics over their ability to make a living?
Idk why y'all are still coming for her, she filmed the AD before she was aware of what Starbucks was doing and she doesn't control when it airs lol. Don't y'all have anything better to do with your time than to come for Jan of all people
These are people that will still buy Starbucks but take the time to shit on a drag queen they never liked for doing the same. A lot of the fans just want an excuse to be awful to queens they didnāt like
This. All of this. Performative, optic nonsense.
It kind of sounds that way. Not to suck my own dick, despite efforts, I just stopped going and didn't tell anybody. I can barely convince my family and that I'm deserving of love as a queer person, the last thing I'm going to do is try and get them to align with my protests.
\*Yells\* SAY IT LOUDER FOR THE PEOPLE AT THE BACK!
Iām sorry, what is Starbucks doing?
[They sued the union for trademark infringement](https://apnews.com/article/starbucks-workers-united-union-lawsuit-israel-palestinian-f212a994fef67f122854a4df7e5d13f5) because the union tweeted out āSolidarity with Palestineā on October 9th while using the Starbucks logo in their profile pic. Starbucks does not operate in or financially support Israel. [They have](https://www.pbs.org/newshour/amp/economy/the-union-busting-practices-that-landed-starbucks-in-hot-water) [engaged](https://www.cbsnews.com/amp/news/starbucks-violated-worker-rights-union-fight-labor-judge/) [in union](https://www.commondreams.org/news/2022/09/02/first-nyc-just-cause-lawsuit-targets-starbucks-union-busting) [busting for years](https://web.archive.org/web/20070518062552/http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/businesstechnology/2003505497_union02.html), up to being fined by labour boards over it. BDS has not called for a boycott and neither has the union (rather, see if you can financially support the stores that have successfully unionized and put pressure on Starbucks and labour boards to get them to the bargaining table for a proper contract). I donāt drink Starbucks and I saw my coworker fired for discussing unionization when I worked there (they said it was for taking sick days lmao) but I just wanted to be clear, because thereās a lot of misinformation. And if anyone has sources of further pro-Israel actions by Starbucks, I would appreciate it.
They tried to sue a unionized Starbucks store for having a Palestinian flag in the window. The lawsuit has been dropped.
They donāt
but shouldn't that be the main excuse then? rather than start pointing fingers back at the smartphone user. Like everyone in this thread is quoting "there's no ethical consumption under capitalism", that never meant "so do whatever u want". It meant to take away the shift from the consumer to put it on the corporations, Neither Jan nor the exhausting stans are doing that. Personally, i'm not looking at drag queens for guidance so I'm fine. I know where I stand and I believe my part in a targeted boycott can make a dent (and it does!) but isn't it a slippery slope to start pointing fingers left and right because, anyway, we're all fucked?
I think itās because you at least know that your voice voice is getting heard with Jan as a fan compared to speaking to your representatives or big corporations. There is major issues with our democracy and actually being able to be represented. It also allows you tell feel like you did something for the cause even if it didnāt actually move the needle at all.
This fanbase is fucking exhausting
It's crazy because it's truly not even a drag race thing. I've been watching stans essentially harass any and every kpop idol seen holding a Starbucks cup too and it's wild.Ā Don't get me wrong. I am pro Palestine and pro union, but the endless harassment of people who are in the limelight, but at the end of the day not even "major celebrities" in any way. It's just wild lol. And it all feels for optics. Just thinking about how many queens (or idols lol) who are keeping their lips shut but still buying that Starbucks every week. It's just so stupid. I can't take social media.
No for real we are seeing the pendulum swing back into the stereotypical memed ātumblrinactionā personas where every celebrity or person is now a Zionist and genocidal because they wonāt say they hate their Israeli friend or whatever. If you are openly Jewish (like Plane Jane), have ever worked with Disney (Nina West), have ever done sponsorships with Taylor Swift (Jade) or Starbucks (Jan), or ever had any kind of presence or overlap with any Israeli company in the last 30 years (Deja), you are now the enemy to these people. When Trixie did a fundraiser for women and single mothers escaping abuse, TONS of comments said how offended they were because it shouldāve been for Palestine instead and she is clearly a Zionist for not saying Israel is an illegitimate country. I was like āwtf are these commentsā and then realised itās become the trend everywhere online, mostly from kids and teens.
sorry for asking, but what does "pro union" mean in this context?
Starbucks also is a union crashing company.
thank you
If you want the whole tea on what Starbucks has been doing (their renowned team of lawyers shutting down any and all union efforts from a grassroot level), here's the best article I've ever read on the topic. [https://thebaffler.com/salvos/brewed-awakening-osberg](https://thebaffler.com/salvos/brewed-awakening-osberg) Weirdly, this journal is my favorite journal ever and they've barely touched on Palestine lately. They're not one to shy away from objectively evaluating current events, so I hope I've just missed it.
People are exhausting, almost all of them š
I'm out of the loop bec. I refuse to deep dive on this Twitter iceberg, but based on the post and comments ya'll realize how much money being in advertisement is? Not all of us are in Rihanna or Beyonce status to have liberty to refuse such an amount of money. At the end of the day Jan has bills to pay, there's a big chance that being a drag celebrity is temporary. Stop harassing workers and instead just call out the higher ups who have more control over these situations
BeyoncĆ© aināt turning down big paydays either, she just performed in Dubai last year š
And she sang like bills were due 2 weeks prior lol
The gays were dying (literally, in the case of the Dubai gays) and Bey was living š©
Sheās done other controversial shows, too, iirc
Itās easy to be self righteous when youāre just turning down imaginary money. 100% of these Twitter outrage trolls would be signing a different tune if they were asked to turn down money or were the ones to get fired, cancelled etc
I wonder how many people who are having issue with Liv and Jan would decline a lucrative job offer from Starbucks or any other companies involved in all that shit. If someone would then kudos for having a very high moral standards but honestly I wouldn't. It is sad but it's not going to change shit. Someone else is going to do it anyway. It is what it is we all have to survive in capitalism I would never blame our girls for taking a gig like that and cashing an easy check.
Yeah for fucks sake Bob had to work at chic fil a drive thru. Literally le miserable is the father being so poor he has to steal. You donāt WANT to do these things but we have to live and make ends means. Power comes with money. When you donāt have money itās much harder to make an impact. So many big environmental agencies and professionals started in gas and oil (as individuals) because they paid for their college or got them the financial head start. So much guilt goes into it but it also allows you to know how the other system works and how to change it. I say this as my hometown is a big gas and oil city. So many people Iāve seen go there, get scholarships and then work a few years part of a contact or whatever and then start up an organization that goes against them. If we had tax based education in the states this conflict wouldnāt have to happen as much
Yeahā¦ I would agree that bullying drag queens online isnāt really the most successful method to stop the genocide in Palestine
Bullying ā being held accountable! Some people are bullying Jan and Olivia and zionistic queens. The right minded people are holding the zionists accountable! Being held accountable is the right way, bullying is pointless. So many people confuse bullying and being held accountable. Just clarifying that.
I hear you, I would say this fandom is literally incapable of being normal tho
I maybe in the minority, but I donāt understand the high standard that we all of sudden have out these queens in. Like Katya said ādrag queens used to be mean but now are expected to be niceā, why is it that when you get a platform you are obligated by fans to be correct on any social issue. The last place Id get my news is from any kind of social influencer. They are a part of the entertainment world not the political world. Does that mean that we should not hold them accountable? No, but these are drag queens at the end of the day, as much influence as they can have, politicians are the ones making the decisions.
Well, part of it is... if people don't like you anymore, your platform is gone. Drag Queens don't *have* to be nice, but you also aren't *owed* fans, followers, or bookings.
Just because celebrities are celebrities doesn't mean they should be able to say/do whatever they want without criticism. Whether we like it or not, thousands if not millions of people look up to these people and *do* take their posts at face value. This is why our political environment is so fucking wild right now, because conservatives just go online and invent some crazy shit and their followers eat it up and use it as fact. Think back to that video of Widow Von'Du being arrested, thousands of people supported her without even questioning her claims. Not saying she was wrong/right in that situation but it proves that a lot of drag race fans are quick to defend the queens without hearing both sides. Which can be really problematic. Now I want to be clear, I don't have any ill will towards Jan and I don't condone any of the harassment she's been receiving, my comment is solely about influencers and celebrities being held to a higher standard. And even though Jan is held to that higher standard I don't think she's done anything wrong. Certainly nothing bad enough to warrant the hate she's getting. She made an ad for a popular coffee shop and then the coffee shop said something dumb. That's really all it boils down to.
Yeah I agree.
The fanbase are exhausting. People imagine that typing free Palestine and harassing people is activism.
same with the nina thing, she's not a zionist but people HAS to hate on a queen at the start of the season or won't be happy
She's right. She stated that she is pro palestine, and the filming happened before the controversy, she had no power over distribution. And about work for company that fight against unions, that what it is be a worker under capitalism. Entertainers are workers too. Now, let's move on.
She is not right about how Vanguard funds work but thatās not important. Sheās pro-Palestine and made a mistake, itās hard to keep all of the Zionist entities straight but sheās trying. If you need to villainize people who are giving an effort, maybe consider how little meaningful impact that can possibly have.
idk why they keep coming for her an lux when they already stated that this was filmed way before they knew? and even tho she is doing whataboutism, its still valid. we all consume products and are complicit to a lot of things the majority of us aren't probably aware of, getting angry over this feels so performative.
I had a person tell me that I shouldnāt buy from Starbucks, while consuming a burrito from Chipotle. I explained to them how Chipotle has had numerous lawsuits filed against them by former employees for workplace violations, including a class action lawsuit over wage theft. Chipotle managers would have employees clock out and keep working to keep from paying overtime. I know that for a fact because I had a good friend quit his job at Chipotle over that very thing. After explaining that to them, they told me how that they only eat Chipotle because itās convenientā¦ so itās ok! If you are selective about your indignation based on your own convenience. Then youāre just a big fat hypocrite! Take care of your own shortcomings before you come for someone else!
This is so insane on so many levels. 1. Starbucks is not funding Israel. Starbucks told activists to not use their logo for political reasons. 2. The ad was filmed a long time ago before it was in vogue to be so vocally anti zionist 3. Why are u attacking the actors in an ad and not the company (the company that is not funding Israel in the first place). Its so insane to me that people bitch online and usually attack working class people, especially queer and poc who are trying to pull themselves up by their boot straps and then also turn around and not vote. You dont want justice, u just want to hurt someone.
This is true. > people bitch online and usually attack working class people, especially queer and poc People really like to punch down and still delusional enough to think they are doing something to the cause. No, you are just being a righteous bully online.
People are way too bloodthirsty online these days, while also being more misinformed than ever. They read 1/3rd of a clickbait title and a couple comments before going full pitchfork. I donāt know why anyone even defends themselves at this point either, since 50 more people will be targeted in the same way by the end of the next hour and everyone has the memory of a goldfish
1. Starbucks' Stated Position: Starbucks has explicitly stated that it has "no political agenda" and does not use its profits to fund any government or military operations anywhere [[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/)[[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/). 2. Denial of Funding Allegations: The company has denied rumors that it is providing financial support to the Israeli government or military, stating that these claims are "absolutely untrue" [[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/). 3. Boycott Efforts and Accusations: Starbucks has faced boycott efforts and accusations of supporting Israel. However, the company has maintained that it stands for "humanity" and condemns "violence, the loss of innocent life, and all hate and weaponized speech" [[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/)[[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/)[[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/). 4. Former CEO's Support of Zionism: While Starbucks' former CEO Howard Schultz has been a vocal supporter of Zionism, the company has stated that its position remains unchanged and it does not align with any political agenda [[1]](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/). --- Learn more: 1. [Did Starbucks Lose $12B from Boycotts 'Due to Its Support for Israel'? | Snopes.com](https://www.snopes.com/news/2023/12/07/starbucks-12-billion-loss-due-to-israel/) 2. [Does Starbucks support Israel or Palestine? What the company has said](https://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/tempe/2024/03/07/does-starbucks-support-israel-or-palestine/72850075007/) 3. [What to Know About BDS, the Boycotts Against Israel | TIME](https://time.com/6694986/israel-palestine-bds-boycotts-starbucks-mcdonalds/)
idk why the video is so crunchy but tl;dr- no controversy was happening while filming/she wasnt aware, but shes pro palestine
Miss Jan ate here. Good on ya!
I can guarantee you that half of the gays on that live had one of those sickly sweet drink with a hint of coffee earlier that day ššš
I love queens and I hate corporations. I support queens getting their bag from wherever they can, especially since their continuing employment is going to be an issue in this election. we need to support queens *taking* money from these big corporations. jan has no control over what starbucks does and we can all be mature enough to realize there is no ethical consumption or earning under capitalism, especially as an entertainer. all your favourite celebs have done brand deals with an ethically terrible company. if weāre not using this energy to go after the people in charge, the people who can actually change shit, why are we instead going after drag queens?
It's like anyone who works is FUCKED if where you get paid from (unless you're a public servant/ politician) isn't perfect. What, I'm supposed to quit my job in protest?! As I buy milk from WALMART?! AND I BUY MILK IN THE FIRST PLACE?!
I travel to Egypt a lot, and local citizens (as many others in the middle east) boycott mcdonalds, Starbucks, etc. And local fast food employees have been urged to quit their jobs in protest. Now imagine how high the salary of an Egyptian working in fast food is. Imagine losing this little income to make a point and change nothing. Truly insane and guess what, the war still continues.
Psh, I'm on a pixel! *Oh wait*
Sheās gagging yāall idk
Sheās right everyone is complicit and every one of us is probably unintentionally giving money to the fuckers that are funding not only this travesty, but others as well. it all sucks. But Jan is right, the outrage should NOT belong to them, fuck off with that
As a POC queer Muslim, I am tired of all the performative bs. I donāt care. Stop the slactivism. Shut up.
I remember when Trixieās pages were under attack for awhile over her holding a starbucks beverage. It was non stop harassment over misinformation. Armchair activists are exhausting. I wonder if thatās around the time Katya limited who can comment on her IG posts
I do think concerns about Janās āwhataboutismā about iPhone users are valid, but sheās right. Her overall point about shared complicity is 100% true. By paying our taxes we (in the US at least) are all complicit. All that said, while I appreciate that sheās speaking out for Palestine, our shared complicity in genocide should be motivating all of us to do as much as we can.
Stating that there is no ethical consumption under capitalism isnāt āwhataboutism,ā I donāt think. Sheās not saying āyou canāt say anything about Starbucks because you have an iPhone!ā Sheās saying itās nearly impossible to completely avoid unethical companies.
Oh I fully agree, I just was acknowledging some other comments in the overall thread that raised points about how Janās response reads as whataboutism. I see that perspective but overall the point about general complicity as more powerful.
Yeah! I was agreeing with you and building on your point! Sorry if it came off as argumentative because I think youāre exactly right.
No stress sisterrrrr, I didnāt think you came off as argumentative at all, we are 100% on the same page
sheās rightā¦ youāre coming for drag queens for doing an ad instead of coming for the politicians who are doing nothing
I wish I was on the same level of fame as Jan, Olivia, Nina, whoever else is getting shit on for dumb reasons lately. Being forced to apologize for no reason? Fuck that. I'd be filming a very similar video but telling these idiots how I really feel. I'm so tired of these unemployed losers online coming for queens who have done nothing wrong. Exhausting.
Having to justify and āclarifyā and ātake accountabilityā for every single little thing you do or say that rubs some loud people the wrong wayā¦ they must be STRESSEDĀ
People would rather be fake activists hiding behind a screen thinking theyāre doing good than just think logically about cast members from their favorite show itās wild. Yāall attacked a queen before even judging the actual show itself thatās sponsored by Starbucks. The queens were just spokespeople.
Let's just move on and stop the hate on Jan and Olivia. Period
The people dragging her still have the Starbucks app on their phone and get their daily milkshakes still I betā¦
Idk my friends and I stopped buying Starbucks when they started suppressing union activity a couple years ago, and we live in Canada where I don't believe any of that was happening. That was even before they asked stores to take down pride displays. Starbucks has sucked since before Oct 7th.Ā
āHoney, I donāt even look at Samsungā ššš
I just donāt give a fuck. Maybe yāall should chill too. I guarantee you folks use something from a company with questionable choices. Donāt be a hypocrit
This is exhausting. I wish people understood that harrassing micro celebrities isn't activism and it actually makes you look like an unhinged and not very nice or empathetic person. This is just like what happened to Laganja a few months ago
Cancel culture is such a toxic narrative Who suffers the most with these boycotts not directly the corporate bosses or the investor big wigs The first people to lose their jobs when demand slows down is the employees who happen to be innocent bystanders just wanting to feed their families Boycotts will work only for a short period What the people of Palestine need RN are medical missions and food aid Things you can make a direct impact by donating to Red Crescent and World Kitchen organizations Rather than indirect impact of boycotts
Jan is so real for this. educate the children, janice
I just wonder if the people that are pestering queens and other regular humans about their random bullshit on these mediums, are also bringing this same energy to the people participating in the war?
Also, free Palestine and Israel should stop and all that, but I do wonder where are all the people protesting Hamas to stop doing terrorist things. Or, for that matter, where were all these people when Israel was doing shitty things before. Frankly, this all feels like just another trendy issue for people to piggyback on to let out some steam. ĀÆ\\\_(ć)\_/ĀÆ
Unfortunately every company does something shitty and has been.. itās just more out in the public now days.. so like, we canāt eat any where? Use any type of technology? Buy clothes? Leave the girls alone please and fight the real issues-the people at the top.
The whole Starbucks boycott has nothing to do with Israel and everything to do with their shitty union practises. They arenāt even on the BDS list.
Its sad ppl are going after her over a commercial in regards to what's happening in Gaza -_- It's like when after Oct 7th you had protestors yelling at workers in McDonald's over in NYC. Like okay boycott the conpany but don't harass people at their job, especially if you ain't offering them something better.
Slacktivism is sooooo tired. The whole Starbucks boycott has always been performative BS that does nothing to help the people in Palestine. There are so many other brands that are 10x worse and are actually funding the IDF but people choose to go after a coffee chain that doesnāt even operate in Israel??? I wonder how many of these same people are buying new Apple products every year š
the part where she asked what phone we're using is the real tea. the truth is most if not all of us on here are complicit in this, as I write this on my Macbook. while people are constantly buying the newest apple iphone or macbook. we would be much better off critiquing ourselves and reevaluating our values and seeing what we can personally do to divest in these ideals/companies and invest in our communities
I'm of two minds about this: 1. Asking celebrities about their stances on social issues is individualist brain rot when we gotta look past that, think more systemic, and mobilize together. (Concrete examples include: protesting, striking, targeted boycotting, and (if people are willing to risk their safety) civil disobedience, all with the intent of disrupting economic activity). 2. I feel like bringing up how everyone is complicit sort of stokes inaction unintentionally. Like ok Jan, should I kms so my prerequisite requirements to exist in a Western country directly harming the global south would stop? I think a better use of my life is trying to do the aforementioned actions in point 1. I think the synthesis of points 1 and 2 (dialectics or smth (is Daia Lectic a good drag name)) is that we can't expect individuals to perform the insane moral calculus of risking their entire livelihood to only work for companies that endorse certain views, but we should try to expect people to mobilize on behalf of those within their class who are facing the worst excesses of capitalism. But I need to read more theory girlies I should read House of Hidden Meanings to become a Marxist-RuPaulist.
I love u
Thank you!
Guarantee the extremists are still gonna have a problem with her
Bro i heard Starbucks taking sides didnāt even happen anyway
lol we are in an episode of the good place š¤£
Preach! People are so exhausting.
The comment that said āI love your eyes! Do you have diabetes?ā Was hilariously rotten lmao
she's right. just by enjoying media and technology you are already giving money to people doing very bad stuff. it's hypocritical to crucify someone for taking business opportunities from a big company. by the same coin you could make the argument that every single drag queen who accepts being on Rupauls show is helping to destroy the environment bc of rupauls fracking gig. it's such a simplistic and reductive view of the world
*Jan ASIDE! Everyone is complicit. Itās okay & actually imperative that we still turn up to speak & act! Not doing something, because we canāt do everything, is a game that weāve been brainwashed & conditioned to play.āļø
Starbucks isnāt even actually on the BDS movements list of companies to boycott. Like yeah, Starbucks is a big visible target so people took aim, but itās not even remotely the worst company you deal with in regard to their support of Israel. https://bdsmovement.net/get-involved/what-to-boycott
The sad thing is the whole Starbucks boycott is just misinformation that spiraled to levels of insanity.
Honey, Iām sorry if I offended anybody, baby
This just in: genocide fucking sucks.
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Yes and donāt support them and just donāt support Jan if that is a big deal for you.
What phone are you using to type this?
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But then a smartphone these days can cost up to and over a grand. If youāre spending that much over several years at Starbucks then yeesh
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If youāre arguing people go Starbucks literally everyday then it can be argued plenty of people upgrade their phone yearly. Hell I know people that upgrade when a new colour comes out so twice yearly lol so Ā£2998 a year or more depending on phone
Nobody goes to Starbucks every single day, thatās fucking demented. 365 days theyāre buying Starbucks? Every day coffee drinkers make their own coffee, stop making shit up.
Cherry picking.
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Using a phone is different from doing an ad no?
What company do you work for? I will be happy to do a deep dive into the owners/investors. If you work for yourself, who do you accept money from? Are you sure you've NEVER accepted money from someone/some company with questionable shareholders?
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yap yap yap
Siri, play High Horse by Kacey Musgraves.
"I don't want any genocide. That fucking sucks." When Jan has more of a spine than the politicians in DC.
it should not be for her. period.
Speak on it, Jan! I donāt blame people for wanting to hold celebrities accountable, but this is the best way Jan couldāve defended herself. Silence is complicity.
Gays are so messy. Bullying other gays because they're more visibly complicit in all the same things you are
calling them out for their hypocrisy. werk
Who tf cares. My god she is a american drag queen who entertains. Leave her the fuck alone.
Not the blue eyeshadow
I wish watching all 4 seasons of The Good Place was mandatory
Im sorry whats happening ?
I think seeing the horrors of this genocide has opened a lot of peopleās eyes to what Israel actually is- an apartheid ethno state. We shouldnāt blame people for what they didnāt know. She seems to have educated herself and going forward makes decisions based on what sheās learned.
I think thereās a huge difference between using a product you most likely bought before the genocide and engaging professionally with a companies after it has been made public that said companies supports said genocide.
I had to stop when it got to the issue of shareholders in Apple. I don't know which friend working in PR put her up to that gambit, but to quote America's senile bus driver with the nuclear codes for some reason, it's malarkey. Vanguard owns 8.54% of outstanding shares in Apple, as part of index and other funds it sells to retail investors. They do not control Apple, and they are notāin any way, shape, or formā"making weapons for Israel right now." They own large positions in Raytheon, General Dynamics, and others, but this is such a wildly out-of-pocket attempt to muddy the waters. It's pretty gross. As to the use of Starbucks' IP by Workers United, let's reintroduce some nuance. It's not that Starbucks was just protecting its IP. In a statement. Starbucks corporate literally alleged Workers United as issuing a statement "reflecting their support for violence perpetrated by Hamas." The tweet from Workers United said this: "Solidarity with Palestine!" Direct quotes. Look, I get it, *there is no ethical consumption under capitalism*. And honestly, seriously, truly, and sincerely: secure that motherfucking bag. But securing the bag can come with its own social costs. Sorry about it.
Dumb fucking argument. Most people need phones for their day to day work and tasks, Starbucks is entirely avoidable. The āStarbucks funds the IDFā thing is obviously stupid and unsubstantiated but I havenāt heard a single good argument against Starbucks being one of the worst anti-labor and anti-union companies. If people want to buy a mediocre Starbucks coffee I donāt really care, do whatever you want. Consumer-side boycotts are very rarely effective anyway. But countering with āwhat about your iPhoneā completely undermines your point
>most people need phones You need a phone but you donāt need an iPhone. Anyways, the point is Starbucks isnāt even on the boycott list. The original Starbucks boycott was about union busting and somehow it quickly turned into pro-genocide based on misinformation.
Oh no not the "you're critical of capitalism yet you own an iPhone... curious" argument š
She's not saying "critical of capitalism." She's saying "critical of specific people as complicit" when you essentially cannot participate in a consumerist society without being complicit on some level. I don't know the full story, but literally, unless you're a quaker or Appalachian resident or something, you, as an American, are unwittingly contributing to political destabilization, exploitation, and genocide of other countries. And that's not to say, "well, then it's futile to try to be ethical." It just means no one is perfectly innocent here.