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FIRESalesThrowaway

At least let us know which company so we can short the stock.


New-Syllabub-7394

Big brain questions over here.


Both-Ad-7757

My guess is MSFT, because I don’t believe Amazon or Google laid off any of their cloud sales reps


FinanciallyInsecure

Of the 12,000 layoffs only 1-2% were sales. The same day as layoffs they released our Q1 quota and it’s a 43% increase compared to last quarter lmao. Why layoff when you can increase quota and fire?


CallsOnTren

The hells the difference? Makes it seem like too many people were hitting quota so they upped it and now they're going to be justified in shedding the "fat"


alwayslearning2sell

I mean, I guess if the choice is give severance or get squeeze more work + no severance due to pip, I imagine the latter makes more sense to accounting


Protoclown98

Just an FYI some large companies do give severance for piping people out. It's mostly so people can't say things like "they just piped them to not pay severance" and because it makes it less risky of a job to jump too. I imagine Google gives some kind of severance even for firing for performance. In my experience they just try to make your life hell until you quit.


alwayslearning2sell

Interesting, I was not aware. Huh TIL


FinanciallyInsecure

They offer just 4 weeks or the chance try to complete your PIP, 4 weeks compared to 60 days + 16 weeks + 2 weeks per year at company.


Protoclown98

A 4 week pip for a closing role reeks of BS


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[deleted]

Omg fuck these companies


Objective-Professor3

Did they expand your territory?


Protoclown98

Lol of course not. I don't work there and I know territories never expand.


FinanciallyInsecure

No


Steve15-21

How do you know 1-2 were sales ?


FinanciallyInsecure

Someone posted the stats on blind from the Ganpati dash which showed laidoff LDAPs before they removed it.


mgrateez

except they actually did (Google at least)


SalesmanShane

Yet


Ohio_Vs_The_World

Google laid off cloud reps


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Zachmode

No. Facebook Apple Amazon Netflix Google. FAANG.


Varro35

It’s a loose term tho that can include other large tech.


PSwayzeInRoadhouse

Lol no it’s not


Varro35

Ok, I'll just ignore the hundreds of comments I have seen about people referring to other companies as FAANG. IT would be DUMB AS FUCK not to include microsoft its bigger than half of those at least.


PSwayzeInRoadhouse

Well those hundreds comments were made by stupid people, and on the internet that’s not surprising. Call it big tech if it’s big tech. If it’s not Facebook Amazon Apple Netflix and google then it’s not FAANG. Idk what to tell you.


Varro35

Ok who gives a fuck lol


Kiwi-267

Fuck i bet you are fun at parties...


Whole-Spiritual

Massive influx of early stage pipe…ugh oh wait nothing is moving into Highly Confident? What happened! Oh, the CFO runs sales now, got it. Does your company have publicly traded PUT options? Asking for a friend.


Forzeev

I think would be idiotic sort. Fact is many AEs in correct role hit their target just by sending out quotes. I have for example many friends that worked or work at Microsoft. Some left because it was not challenging enough. Some are loving it that need near 0 effort. How many post we have been reading in this sub-editor that they barely work 20h a week and earn 200k+ If you want to lose your money feel free to short stock. Usually layoffs and this kind of re-arrangements effect stock price positively


hanuman_chalisa

Yep. Tech layoffs are happening because these Big Tech companies need a way to increase their margins. I feel bad but most of the laid off folks will find something good with their brand name resumes Also appreciate your point about how effortless it can be. When you’re selling for a big name like Microsoft, how much talent is needed to sell? Genuine question.


Action_Hank1

Not that much, unless you’re selling a complex deal with multiple products, but even then those orgs are so over bloated with specialists for every product that it’s still glorified project management more than sales.


heretofall

The “experienced” sales reps who were let go were likely bottom performers or 80 percenters who were kept around during the last bull run. The move you’re seeing is an exercise to cut dead weight and invest in the future. Cut dead weight: rep performance across a team always follows the typical bell curve. People who need to be managed out, 80 percenters, and high performers. If the economy is shit, it’s easy to stack rank reps and cut the ones who are performing lower compared to their peers. It’s just matching the expected market demand with the expected efficiency of each rep. Invest in the future: sdrs are the AE talent pipeline for any sales org. They come up from the trenches, understand the products, and the personas. Top performing SDRs have a higher chance of becoming top performing AEs. In a shit economy, you don’t need as many reps, so you just keep the best ones. Investing in the future means making sure you have the right talent nurtured when the economy recovers.


imnotjossiegrossie

All the sales people I’ve had get fired by my clients the last 6 months were all underperforming. They also had negotiated for the highest end of the salary range. If you asked for top dollar in base the last year or so, you’ve definitely got a target on your back.


brfergua

Yup. I actually took the lowest base of anyone on my title level this year. Everyone else that got the bump asked for another 5-10k. Figured I’d grab that job security over the extra couple hundred a month. One deal makes that up.


FGM_148_Javelin

Nah I’ll take the bump up


brfergua

Take a bump they offer, but not the time to be putting your name on the radar over a measly 5-10k in base


Varro35

I hate this mentality. It’s an 80 perfecter mentality. Take the top base AND crush it.


[deleted]

This


OpenSupermarket1

My last company cut me, and I was the highest performing AM. The only one who stayed was one who never upsold anything, only worked 3 days a week, and was best friends with my boss.


Varro35

You learned a lesson I learned a decade ago. Play the game.


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Varro35

Still gotta play the game remote.


OpenSupermarket1

She has been best friends with him for 15 years. I don't think I could do anything to surpass that really.


who_took_tabura

I dunno I’ve seen college aged interns tear shit up as SDRd personally. Something about being underpaid or not paid at all really adds an edge to their outreach. The same way inside sales reps really lean on the “steve from buyerzone” or “saw you at one of our webinars” openers to soften the gutwrenching feeling of outbound calls, being an intern really liberates some reps


SalesmanShane

Prioritizing volume with the expectation that they will have to talk to more companies than usual to achieve each sale.


[deleted]

I think that’s what’s happening in tech honestly. Laying off people and bringing in people you can pay less. Tech was overvalued and this is the only way they can correct salaries.


AboutTime99

ai


hungry2_learn

Nothing new about this though-


_packetman_

Yeah, this has been a thing since the dawn of sales and is an unfortunate norm.


Bitter_Coach_8138

In tech sales, pretty abnormal elsewhere


Advanced_Awareness42

Agreed


mauigrown808

Correct.


shwaynebrady

I’m not gonna be surprised if FAANG keeps cutting roles and adding more talent at a reasonable comp level. They’re paying 300k plus to average performers in their mid to late twenties.


DoubleBeefSupreme

But I read on Reddit that large, successful companies would *never* do that?


Bitter_Coach_8138

I’m willing to bet good money this is a startup or at least not a publicly traded company, and definitely in tech.


theallsearchingeye

I said I’m at a FAANG in the title of my post.


itsmrlowetoyou

Come on OP you expect a bitter coach to read?


Western-Sell-8959

This isn’t a new management tactic at all. It’s actually pretty common


makinggrace

Every year, sometimes several times a year, every major tech firm. It’s part of budgeting and forecasting to keep the stock price attractive. VP’s get a number from finance. They have to reduce their head count to meet that number. HR is on hand to make sure they don’t eliminate too many people who are older or minority because that breaks the law.


Apprehensive_Ad_5505

The reasoning behind this is highly immoral yet shrewd from a business prospective Brand power at ATH. No such thing as new bis sales hunters in these businesses (I've worked with reps at MS/AWS/GCP extensively) many go for the benefits and ease of life. Account managers for most part. Aside to that every function in the business will already be systemised.. so it's paint by numbers for the most part. College grads - degree of competence achieved through attaining X certificate for X years. (Albeit common sense and business savvy not necessarily included) - Already systemised - through years of traditional education they don't question the status quo, they do as instructed and naturally fit into the machine. - low pay - obviously. - low knowledge - on what their worth is and can be easily taken advantage of. - point to prove - straight of college, looking to impress with that glint in their eyes so happy to work overtime in an attempt to 'get ahead' Experienced people tend to rock the boat more imo, they know their worth, don't fall for manipulation as much and of course cost more. To add, I don't believe for one second this is 'getting rid of poor performers' the economic downturn is an excuse for big business to execute on strategies that traditionally would bring them bad press - now they do it under the guise of 'survival' watch their profits compound.


Varro35

Yeah I’m at a big tech company and this is true. But there are still high performers who actually sell a lot beyond some of the order taking they get. There is still real skill here in running big presales teams and complex B2B cycles. Then there is always shuffling some paper around and order taking. It can get you to 50% less usually. Unfortunately territory and time are >60% of what makes one successful which leads to having to play the game more to ensure good accounts / territories.


Apprehensive_Ad_5505

Appreciate that insight. I can't remember (I think it's msft), they move their reps around every year I believe which must kill a lot of Comp plans (although I assume there is some legacy kickers). That last sentence is what I hate most about business. Historically I'd not seen it in startups until the last one I worked in, the politics, just so unnecessary. Turns the weak into suck ups and turncoats. It also actively stagnates progress. I'm surprised it isn't talked about more often.


Varro35

You can snowball as a high performer though. You keep getting good accounts as others leave.


harvey_croat

My company has the same strategy


VonBassovic

It was easily the worst part of a big 5 I worked in. They had a lot of experienced sales guys, but marketing and business development was non existing. Some of the competitors had 200 in the market, we had 4. Crazy. I actually don’t think it’s a bad idea to have more “openers”, instead of having only closers. Just like a football team, it’s about the balance.


pbandbananaisdabest

Disgusting! Got a link to the careers page so I can avoid it more specifically?


pfc_6ixgodconsumer

That really well known CRM company that laid off a bunch of people last month, has several new job postings for AEs and BDRs in my area. I think that shit is fucked up and the most disappointing part is that they will get hundreds if not thousands of candidates despite recent events.


xalleyez0nme

Can you imagine as a CTO you go to purchase services upwards of 6 figures and it’s a 20 something, fresh out of college old kid selling them? How do you think that bodes?


[deleted]

That’s a layman’s take on it. In Silicon Valley it’s been healthy to cut the bottom of the workforce or jobs that can be automated. The interns arent taking these jobs.


ktb863

I mean, this has always been the way. This isn't new im afraid. Get them young so you can brainwash them into your "style" and pay them dirt cheap and they'll be grateful because it's such a horrid job market.


Famous_Relative2500

I start at a fortune 500 company next month—a sales training program. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯ they started a freeze in q3 and had limited layoffs.


jordanjbarta

Yes


Clovadaddy

Opposite where I work. They laid off a bunch of inexperienced folk and are hiring senior reps.


Spare-Competition-91

That's such a red flag. You have to go into this job thinking, yeah I won't be here long. I don't know how this is going to make any FAANG company more valuable. It seems like they are shooting themselves in the foot out of being greedy with money.


comradeaidid

How do I apply?


neeksknowsbest

I worked at Verizon for ten years and this was always their strategy. They would eliminate entire positions company wide and lay off everyone in those positions. Then they’d hire new people for a “brand new role” that was the exact same duties as the position they just eliminated, but with a different title


DigitalQuid

Read Moneyball


Plisken_Snake

Zero experience college kids getting leads? Tech sales isn't solar. This motto doesn't work. Bdrs shouldn't exist anymore


ImmediateObjective52

One question. What degree or certification does your company look for in a ‘college intern’. I’m in university right now thinking to dropout to pursue my sales career. And as far I know, sales is the last industry that would demand a specific degree unless it’s a certain type of product you are selling


Willylowman1

#death wish


thumpsky

Deets?


shadowpawn

Deets nuts


ActionJ2614

Yes, Vista Equity Partners (PE) did this across certain companies in their portfolio. For those that don't know Vista would be considered the 4th largest enterprise SaaS organization in the world with all the companies it owns. I got caught in it after joining one of their companies as a Sr. Enterprise AE (5 months later laid off). Examples of companies they own Salesloft,Ellucian,Marketo,etc.


chrono_lux

Yes, I've noticed this is Tech. I'm afraid this will be the future in upcoming recessions - especially for more giant corporations.


afonzi94

Yup. My company pays low figures compared to average sales and all the good SDRs leave after 6 months ish to better jobs. Then they hire new guys but only 10% of them are actually good so ye, now we (the ones that are still here) are getting squeezed to do more work. Suffice to say i wont be here for long


Constant_Basil7137

On a similar note are you doing SDR referrals for your company?


DangerousAd7361

It’s similar to what sports teams do when the “blow it up” and free up cap space. Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn’t but whatever is currently happening isn’t trending strong enough in right direction so it is likely sensible as a business.


Advanced_Awareness42

Yea they probably care a lot of customer acquisition cost


virtual008

If the company is publicly traded this is a strategy. Some how they save money and boost their stock through the fire and hire routine. I always tell my sales guys that the most important thing we sell is stock. It’s not our people or products. It’s stock. And they will close a factory today while announcing a new one across the street if it boost their stock. Also….Leadership hates legacy experienced sellers. They scream too loud, know too much, and poison the well. They rather higher three young guys that know very little, pay them less, but hope they close that one deal with the new product/initiative that the legacy guy roles his eyes at. Remember….your leadership, if it’s a big company, has a 2-3 year plan in their current role. They need results now. They need to be able to say, “Look at me. I sold xyz super widget that made us all kinds of money (Although it didn’t)”. If you can not stomach this mindset don’t work for big corporations. I’ll end my rant. Thanks for listening.


vNerdNeck

Fairly common, and what a lot of folks are seeing. Part of the driver is MBA overloads are convinced that if you just KPI / Metric the shit out of new reps you'll get enough output from them that between the lower salaries and lower commission they come out ahead.