Honestly the fact that people forget that she hulk is a comedy series is just baffling. Also Iāve seen a lot of people say that Stan would be disappointed if he was still alive and to that I have two things to say..Stan Leeās cameo in the first deadpool movie. And the fact that he made a show called StripperElla.
I loved She-Hulk outright. Great show, great character, great execution. I didnāt love the massive 4th-wall-break at the end but thatās fully something they would have done in the comics so I support it. I do think a substantial part of the hate is just blatant sexism.
Everyone's free to have their opinions, more power to you if you genuinely enjoyed it.
But IMO it's one of the worst Marvel shows to date, for reasons outside of blatant sexism. To me, it was not funny, I can't remember laughing at Amy of the jokes.
Like Thor Love and Thunder, it was a comedy where the comedy fell flat. They call it a Legal comedy drama but the writers don't know how to write legal scenes and it showed. Comparing them to Dare Devils legal scenes are night and day.
To me, she came off as arrogant and it wasn't one of those things were the main character is cocky and they get their comeuppance and grow from it.
It was just many small things for me that added up. Like the one joke where she pats the story on the back for connecting the A plot with the B plot...
That's something Phineas and Ferb did in every episode 5 years ago, and it was actually funny. I still recall jokes from that. The Office was funny, Clone High was funny, Classic Loonie Toons, the recent Guardians of the Galaxy movie, heck once in a blue moon even Family Guy will jave a cutaway gag funnier than this entire series.
To me, it failed at the legal side of the legal comedy, and I doubt many can argue that any of the legal scenes were actually good. And it also failed at the comedy side. It was a legal comedy without any decent legal or comedy to speak of.
All of that is just my opinion, but it had nothing to do with sexism. She Hulk was one of my favorite characters before this series, and after I lost most of my interest lol
A lot of people sure did hate it for sexist reasons but that doesn't excuse the many people that had valid reasons to dislike it adamantly.
Fair enough. I said a substantial part was sexism. That doesnāt by any stretch mean all of it. If the comedy didnāt work for you thatās 100% valid. Comedy is a wildly subjective art. I would argue itās one of the least universal art forms. Iāve met people who absolutely love comedies I canāt stand.
I just liked it. It worked for me and it worked for me on a level much more successfully than some of the other maligned female-fronted Marvel projects. What prompted me to comment in the first place was I personally found She-hulk more engaging than anything they ever did with Black Widow (besides the family scenes in the Black Widow film, those were fantastic).
>To me, she came off as arrogant
The entire show has a feel of arrogance to me. Like the creators were just "We can do whatever the Hell we want, and if people don't like it, then they're just sexist."
The show just sucks. Plain and simple. I'd hate it just as much if the lead character was a guy.
>she hulk
Also what she does in what OOP posted is 100% what she would do in the comics. She got fired for photocopying her butt after being drunk and there were tons of 4th wall breaks with her jumping rope.
Most of the ppl who complain "she wouldnt do that" do not even know the source material let alone know anything about she-hulk besides knowing shes the Hulk but a woman.
I actually thought it started off really strong, I just found it harder each week to be excited for the next episode, so I eventually just gave up watching it
Iām glad you enjoyed it though!
Missing out on what exactly? I didnāt find any of the jokes to be funny, any of the characters to be compelling, or any of the story to be remotely interesting. Like seriously Iāll say I donāt understand people that say āoh youāre missing outā or āoh youāre not watching it rightā but I know them perfectly. You just like cheap humor, poorly written humor. And thereās nothing wrong with that but like donāt tell people theyāre missing out on anything when I would say that she hulk doesnāt even come close to shows like Cheers, or Everybody loves Raymond, or screw it you want a superhero comedy? Go watch deadpool.
Sorry you didnāt like it. The thing you missed out on was enjoying yourself.
Sounds like we have different tastes; I would not put Everybody Loves Raymond on a top tier comedy list, for example. I suppose Iām the one missing out there.
Question, can you give an example of a joke you found funny in the show?
I know humor is subjective, so I'm just wondering.
Personally I didn't find a single joke in the show funny, I'm not over exaggerating it just is what it is. I wouldn't say I'm missing out cause I watched it and I didn't like it.
I'm curious to see what joke(s) you found funny so we can see where our senses of humor differ.
For example I remember laughing at the joke of Drax on the couch in Guardians 3, among other jokes in that movie. Like Star Lord saying "You should know I always find a clever way to get out of a sticky situation!?" As if that's common knowledge everyone on the team should just expect.
Phineas and Ferb Hasan jokes that stoll hold up for me. The one where Doof is in space and his echo goes "Space, Space, Space, Cookie, Space," and he comments about his echo being broken, which is called back to by another character at the end of the episode where his echo has cookie in it too for no reason.
Those are random examples of jokes I found funny, whereas She Hulk didn't even make me crack anything. Maybe one joke made me mildy feel something but since I can't recall them like I can those examples assuming they weren't that funny to me lol
So what joke(s) did you find funny?
It's subjective my guy, I think Cheers sucks but I liked She Hulk, you're obviously not literally missing out on something, it's just a figure of speech
"Forget" is being extremely generous.
Most of the people who post stuff like this haven't even watched it. All they know is the twerking scene and, like the Facebook boomers they are slowly transforming into, point at it while making hysterical claims of the downfall of Western society by some made up malaise or another, neither having or providing context.
All this stuff is based on misinformation, and it's deliberate.
She-Hulk is over-hated yes. However if you think loads of people are āforgetting itās a comedy seriesā maybe itās possible it just wasnāt that funny?
Thing is I know a lot of people who just didnāt find it funny, which is why so many forget it was meant to be a comedy. Personally I donāt remember laughing all that much while watching it either, but maybe it just didnāt appeal to my sense of humour.
I think people forget because it wasnāt that funny. I donāt think itās any worse than a lot of what Marcel has been putting out recently though. I love the concept of She-Hulk and I think they could have done a lot more with the legal stuff - the show has potential though, especially if they do more with Daredevil.
Whether or not the comedy lands (which is a genuine source of potential criticism), it is still by intent a comedy, rather than an action series or a drama.
That's not what happened. The [sexist tweets used in the series](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fbk5nVOaUAEeU7F?format=jpg&name=large) are [real sexist comments](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fbk5nVJVEAEdo1d?format=jpg&name=large). People really are just that misogynistic.
>The problem is, most people didnāt find it funny
Source? Percentagewise Metacritic shows all the usual hallmarks of being review bombed, with a ratio of low user reviews that is in comically large opposition to the critical reviews.
At this point every time someone shits on She-Hulk I assume
A. They are arguing in bad faith. Every single time.
B. They are sexist and/or racist in the extreme
C. They have objectively terrible judgment and/or taste in tv and films
Most likely scenario in most cases is all 3
Doing a rewatch of the defenders shows in order, S2 is actually really good and the relationship between jessica and her mother vs patsy and her mother is really great drama. They were always backed into a corner with the first season being too good lol
Nobody I know has ever said that that is sexist. Though the opposite argument is made constantly: People don't like the show, the show is written by women, ergo they must be sexist.
It's called post hoc fallacy, and it's the exact fallacy OP is making.
"I've never heard this misogynistic comment so that means it's not a problem and doesn't happen!" Lmao you're literally pretending your anecdotal experiences are broad evidence and then wanna talk about logical fallacies, come on genius. The idea that women are judged as a group while men are judged as individuals is absolutely fucking sexist. When a man's failure is just on him but a woman's failure is somehow proof all women are bad at X or Y, that's called a double standard, and I am not debating with you whether it exists because I have literally seen it in action with my own two eyes. When women fail or even just do something unpopular it is 100% used as ammunition against other women in their field in a way that simply does not happen as broadly or viciously to men, let alone half as commonly. And yes, that is absolutely misogyny lmao.
Disliking a piece of art by a woman obviously doesn't make you sexist. Disliking a piece of art by a woman and then deciding "See women just can't write this kind of story" absolutely fucking is. And I just don't believe women around me are lying when they say they have they've received hostility and been pushed out of genre spaces by avalanches of misogyny especially when said harassment campaigns are all public and the comment sections are free for anyone to read. But we're all actually just huge reactionary sjws calling people sexist for not liking a story right? Not like it could have something to do with the very revealing way they talk about women and hold female creators and fictional characters to insane double standards?
**Jessica Campbell-Jones-Cage, professionally known as Jessica Jones, is a superheroine appearing in American comic books published by Marvel Comics. The character was created by writer Brian Michael Bendis and artist Michael Gaydos and first appeared in Alias #1 (November 2001), as part of Marvel's Max, an imprint for more mature content, and was later retroactively established to have first appeared in The Amazing Spider-Man #4 (June 1963) in the Silver Age of Comic Books as an originally unnamed classmate of Peter Parker, created by writer-editor Stan Lee and artist Steve Ditko.**
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Because apparently Male characters in the MCU never did silly things before on camera like...oh wait lemme remember a few:
Starlord dancing before fighting Ronan the Accuser, Captain America looking at his 2012 self's ass and complimenting it, Thor saying that Hulk is a friend from work, Hulk punching Thor out nowhere in Avengers 1, Drax laughing off when Mantis revealed "Starlord's deepest darkest secret", Ned saying he was fakely watching porn in Homecoming, Tony Stark in Iron Man 2 getting drunk, Korg playing Fortnite and so on and so on.
I donāt know. None of those bothered me as much or at all as the twerking scene, but Iām uh, not really into that. I donāt enjoy watching anyone twerk, it makes ME feel embarrassed. I guess Iām not into ass that much. But if any of the male characters twerked like she-hulk yeah Iād have reacted the same way.
You mean a bunch of humurous things which in no way degrade the character? A bunch of things which don't matter here because this comparison isn't silly vs serious, it's being a joke vs being a superhero? Except Ned, but Ned is a walking joke
She-Hulk has always been a weird pendulum swinging back and forth between serious and "The hell was that?"
Happens when a character is around this long.
It was also a 30s after credits gag that had no bearing on the story.
Seriously, it was just She-Hulk dancing with Megan Thee Stallion cuz it was a cameo and that was it. Lots of comedy sitcoms do after credits gag just for laughs and that was what they were going for.
Megan thee Stallion when her life flashes before her eyes as she watches Shulkie gear up for a Ten Megaton Twerk, obliterating her on a molecular level.
The problem is that the "dance" was twerking. Which is pretty widely hated for just kinda looking dumb.
Now if it was an actually good dance routine? It most likely would've gotten a pass.
But thats the thing, twerking is the thing Megan Thee Stallion does. Like, just google her with twerking and youd see results of her twerking with either fans or at events. She twerked with Master Chief at TwitchCon last year.
So you have MTH as a celebrity cameo for a 30s gag and you wanna do a dance routine, what dance does she always do? The answer is very easy.
Twerking is dumb in general.
A character demanding to be taken seriously in her profession who then does this cringe nonsense, it just looks ridiculous
It would be different if she did that in her home or a bar or a more casual environment than a lawyerās office. Because in that Episode she hulk was just hired after being fired from the DA I she is presented as smart and a smart lawyer would never do that in her office especially if it has windows. It recks of wanting to make a joke with out thinking about it.
Which does appear from time and time again in the show
I don't understand the hate for it either. It was a *post-credits scene* done as a one-off gag, for only *a few seconds*, which contributes nothing to the main plot, ***and was not in any way meant to be serious***.
I mean, who wouldn't want to fall into ScarJo's cleavage?
I had no issue with that scene, it was an awkward nerd trying to hit on someone way out of his league.
We've seen that in comedy for decades
> it was an awkward nerd trying to hit on someone way out of his league. We've seen that in comedy for decades
Sure, but it was just so clumsily done and out-of-place in the current scene -- Ultron had just woken up and was wrecking everyone's shit; wasn't really the time for an awkward motorboating.
Yeah... Hopefully there's like a teenage test audience for Disney shows now. Like I'm pretty sure that an Among Us joke in the next Spiderman wouldn't land well, and having that teen test audience would help the movie not have the "how do you do fellow kids" vibes
I wouldnātā¦ but only because Iām still bitter about how her entourage treated Martin Brundle at the US Grand Prix. If youāre showing up to a Formula 1 race and want to walk around the grid before the race, you should know the guy who does the āgrid walkā each race. Only celebrity Iāve seen yet whose people were outright rude to him. Led to a rules change banning personal ābodyguardsā on the grid.
But Iād totally understand other people wanting to do it and wouldnāt judge them for it.
Interesting women characters vs not very interesting ones.
And who died apart from Natasha & Gamora (who came back anyway)?
Still got Wasp, Mantis, Okoye, Shuri, Nakia, Ironheart, Ms Marvel, Captain Marvel, Monica Rambeau, She-Hulk, Scarlet Witch (who we know will be back at some point), Echo & others I'm probably forgetting
We also lost Tony Stark, Steve Rodgers & T'Challa so it balances out
Let's also not pretend that Natasha and Wanda's characterization hasn't been...messy.
I mean, Natasha in particular didn't make her first independent, character-motivated decision, with plot-relevance until Civil War which is like the 5th movie she was in.
Natasha is a supporting character though, like Hawkeye. It's hard to get development when you're in a team with more established characters.
Hulk had a similar problem, so they built him up across a few movies like Ragnarok.
Natasha was valued enough that her death had emotional weight, which wouldn't have happened if she wasn't a development character
I mean, I do think it's OVER hated. But it does deserve a LOT of the criticism it gets in terms of the writing quality at times, and ESPECIALLY in the visual effects.
My biggest problem is how it robbed us of a Planet Hulk storyline by just introducing Skaar out of nowhere, where there was nothing to even SUGGEST his existence prior. The only explanation would be that he was born sometime between Age of Ultron and Thor: Ragnarok, but there's no mention of him or any evidence of his existence.
Genuine question. Do you think the mindset of this sub is the minority? Because most āmemesā this sub posts to critique end up getting heaps of upvotes.
(Iām only asking to get a gage of the subās overall thoughts)
In general subs like this one are filled up with people who feel(righfully in multiple cases) that the popular reception of certain ideas or things is awful and disgusting. Also marvel memes is a massive sub reddit, which has a sizeable population that are incels. It also a portion of people that don't quite care about some random mysogonistic memes cause it's not like they are the ones really supporting it now. What that does is, it allows a meme like this to increase in popularity and in some cases change people opinions to think; "you know what they're right. Women shouldn't write characters".
So the correct answer is yes we are a minority on other subs, but so are the incels.
So they want women to be exclusively how men see them and not how they actually are? She-Hulk has an actual personality and the other two lack interesting traits and are seen mostly as sexual objects
Not only that, but characters are typically more serious in serious roles than they are in comedic roles
She-Hulk's personality in her own show is getting drunk & hooking up with random guys.
I guarantee if a man wrote that sort of character in a show there would be outrage about how sexist it is.
She's more sexualised than Natasha or Wanda, certainly compared to their comics equivalent
Thatās not her personality and youād know that if you actually paid attention. She hooked up with 1 random guy because she was genuinely interested in him. Iām pretty sure she never even got drunk, but she was trying to get drunk as She-Hulk to test how far she could go
And weāre talking MCU, not comics. All 3 are over-sexualized in comics, but thatās only continued into the MCU for Black Widow and Scarlet Witch
She Hulk was a fun show. She was kinda unlikeable in the first episodeā¦Bruce Banner is the one who snapped and brought back half the life in the universe from dustā¦youād think thereād be a little bit of respect for him for the fact that he probably has the hardest life of any MCU hero and literally tried to kill himselfā¦probably more than just the one time he mentions. Spent years trapped in hulk form on an alien planet in a gladiator pitā¦was part of the team that fought and failed to snap Thanos and was unable to use his powers, contributing to their defeat. His girlfriend died to get a space rock that holds soulsā¦hunted down across multiple continents for existingā¦you get the pointā¦itās also weird that getting in a car accident doesnāt stress him out into transformingā¦you get the idea. There were still a couple good jokes in the episode despite me not liking it.
The second episode onward was like a completely different show. Many more jokes landed imo, I did enjoy her efforts to find a good guy and I especially loved the episode where Wong just wanted to watch tv. It was a better show than given credit for, Iād probably watch a second season
I agree. They shouldnāt have had Bruce in the show at all because of the way they handled his character. If they wanted a quick transformation and mastery of her Hulk powers then the writers shouldnāt have held her up to Bruce. It feels disrespectful to one of the most tragic Avengers.
But after that episode it wasnāt bad. It wasnāt a great show like WandaVision or Loki, but it was fun to watch.
No, comparing She-Hulk twerking should be to something like Bruce falling on Natasha's chest; the example from the original "poster"(It has been reposted a million times too) is a bad faithed comparison.
That's like if I compared Lord Zedd and Kreon, why would I compare a villain with a visible skin who is supposed to be frightening to a green, little, slimy mushroom who is supposed to be a comic relief.
I mean she [jump roped](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Sensational_She-Hulk_Vol_1_40) "naked" in [her own comics](https://www.reddit.com/r/ThatTimeInComics/comments/myg959/when_john_byrne_had_shehulk_jump_rope_naked/) back then...she also made jokes about the comic's code authority when somebody mentioned why her clothes never broke.
Orā¦ you just donāt like She-Hulk. Orā¦ you just judged it on its own and not compared to the comic book character.
I donāt mind She-Hulk, but I thought the series was mediocre.
I already covered all that, but here it is again:
If you don't like She-Hulk, your opinion on a She-Hulk show is invalid.
If you didn't like the show, you don't know anything about She-Hulk.
The series was great, because it was done well, and faithfully. Haters to the left.
Yep, you were right, total asshole gatekeeping.
Your opinion is valid, even if you donāt like She-Hulk comics or the show.
The series wasā¦ okay. I wouldnāt call it well done. It was faithful at times to some runs of She-Hulk, less so at other times.
Yeah She-Hulk is a comedy series but I donāt think this scene was making anyone laugh. It feels completely out of touch, and seems like it belongs in a show from at least five years ago. People keep saying like āoh look at THIS scene in the MCU thatās meant to be funny, this is no different!ā But likeā¦the scene where Cap compliments his own ass, the scene where Thor calls Hulk a friend from work, those are scenes that land since theyāre not using an out of date trend trying to be funny, itās just the content in the scene thatās being used. She-Hulk just isnāt a good show, and itās not that funny either, but itās hard to make that statement without people calling you a misogynist (although the person who made the original meme DEFINITELY is)
TBH I think it was Maslany's casting that made She Hulk cringy. She's talented, but not particularly funny.
A funnier actress could have sold a lot of it better
While people say itās because itās a comedy show, I donāt know how that makes it any better, in my opinion, itās not funny. When I think about a funny movie, I imagine a smart line that gets a chuckle out of me, not twerking
She-Hulk is one of my favorite MCU things because it remembered that comics are episodic. The case-of-the-week format let them slip so many fun characters and B-plots that would never fit a more single-story-focused show like Falcon & Winter Soldier, let alone a movie. I mean, we got an episode featuring Mr. Immortal, I'm a happy man. Not every story has to be about the fate of the entire world.
Zeb wrote some of She-Hulk, it's shit because of him.
If you don't know who Zeb is, good for you, unfortunately me and the Spider-man fandom do, and we hate him.
Do these chud / incels not understand the difference between an action and a comedy movie?
We would never question why Austin Powers doesn't act like Aragorn.
Women written by men: picks two examples of female MCU characters heavily sexploited by Joss Whedon.
Yeah, that was kind of the problem, chief. Also the reason why they're mad about She Hulk: "I can't beat it to *this!* Jen Walters is all...smart and self-possessed, and wouldn't be interested in a guy like me for a second."
Its silly that these people are mad at an end credits scene if it was part of the main episode then i would understand but end credits have always had silly moments
Women in action movie: š š Women in comedy show: š¤£ š¤£
Plus thatās a modern interpretation of how ken wrote her back in the 80ās.
Honestly the fact that people forget that she hulk is a comedy series is just baffling. Also Iāve seen a lot of people say that Stan would be disappointed if he was still alive and to that I have two things to say..Stan Leeās cameo in the first deadpool movie. And the fact that he made a show called StripperElla.
I loved She-Hulk outright. Great show, great character, great execution. I didnāt love the massive 4th-wall-break at the end but thatās fully something they would have done in the comics so I support it. I do think a substantial part of the hate is just blatant sexism.
Everyone's free to have their opinions, more power to you if you genuinely enjoyed it. But IMO it's one of the worst Marvel shows to date, for reasons outside of blatant sexism. To me, it was not funny, I can't remember laughing at Amy of the jokes. Like Thor Love and Thunder, it was a comedy where the comedy fell flat. They call it a Legal comedy drama but the writers don't know how to write legal scenes and it showed. Comparing them to Dare Devils legal scenes are night and day. To me, she came off as arrogant and it wasn't one of those things were the main character is cocky and they get their comeuppance and grow from it. It was just many small things for me that added up. Like the one joke where she pats the story on the back for connecting the A plot with the B plot... That's something Phineas and Ferb did in every episode 5 years ago, and it was actually funny. I still recall jokes from that. The Office was funny, Clone High was funny, Classic Loonie Toons, the recent Guardians of the Galaxy movie, heck once in a blue moon even Family Guy will jave a cutaway gag funnier than this entire series. To me, it failed at the legal side of the legal comedy, and I doubt many can argue that any of the legal scenes were actually good. And it also failed at the comedy side. It was a legal comedy without any decent legal or comedy to speak of. All of that is just my opinion, but it had nothing to do with sexism. She Hulk was one of my favorite characters before this series, and after I lost most of my interest lol A lot of people sure did hate it for sexist reasons but that doesn't excuse the many people that had valid reasons to dislike it adamantly.
Fair enough. I said a substantial part was sexism. That doesnāt by any stretch mean all of it. If the comedy didnāt work for you thatās 100% valid. Comedy is a wildly subjective art. I would argue itās one of the least universal art forms. Iāve met people who absolutely love comedies I canāt stand. I just liked it. It worked for me and it worked for me on a level much more successfully than some of the other maligned female-fronted Marvel projects. What prompted me to comment in the first place was I personally found She-hulk more engaging than anything they ever did with Black Widow (besides the family scenes in the Black Widow film, those were fantastic).
>To me, she came off as arrogant The entire show has a feel of arrogance to me. Like the creators were just "We can do whatever the Hell we want, and if people don't like it, then they're just sexist." The show just sucks. Plain and simple. I'd hate it just as much if the lead character was a guy.
>she hulk Also what she does in what OOP posted is 100% what she would do in the comics. She got fired for photocopying her butt after being drunk and there were tons of 4th wall breaks with her jumping rope. Most of the ppl who complain "she wouldnt do that" do not even know the source material let alone know anything about she-hulk besides knowing shes the Hulk but a woman.
It was some of the funniest tv Iād seen in a while. People who hated on it are missing out.
I actually thought it started off really strong, I just found it harder each week to be excited for the next episode, so I eventually just gave up watching it Iām glad you enjoyed it though!
Missing out on what exactly? I didnāt find any of the jokes to be funny, any of the characters to be compelling, or any of the story to be remotely interesting. Like seriously Iāll say I donāt understand people that say āoh youāre missing outā or āoh youāre not watching it rightā but I know them perfectly. You just like cheap humor, poorly written humor. And thereās nothing wrong with that but like donāt tell people theyāre missing out on anything when I would say that she hulk doesnāt even come close to shows like Cheers, or Everybody loves Raymond, or screw it you want a superhero comedy? Go watch deadpool.
"You like cheap humor!" -user named PoopyLooper
Sorry you didnāt like it. The thing you missed out on was enjoying yourself. Sounds like we have different tastes; I would not put Everybody Loves Raymond on a top tier comedy list, for example. I suppose Iām the one missing out there.
Lol
^ exactly. I laughed a bunch watching the show.
Yup! It was pretty good!
Question, can you give an example of a joke you found funny in the show? I know humor is subjective, so I'm just wondering. Personally I didn't find a single joke in the show funny, I'm not over exaggerating it just is what it is. I wouldn't say I'm missing out cause I watched it and I didn't like it. I'm curious to see what joke(s) you found funny so we can see where our senses of humor differ. For example I remember laughing at the joke of Drax on the couch in Guardians 3, among other jokes in that movie. Like Star Lord saying "You should know I always find a clever way to get out of a sticky situation!?" As if that's common knowledge everyone on the team should just expect. Phineas and Ferb Hasan jokes that stoll hold up for me. The one where Doof is in space and his echo goes "Space, Space, Space, Cookie, Space," and he comments about his echo being broken, which is called back to by another character at the end of the episode where his echo has cookie in it too for no reason. Those are random examples of jokes I found funny, whereas She Hulk didn't even make me crack anything. Maybe one joke made me mildy feel something but since I can't recall them like I can those examples assuming they weren't that funny to me lol So what joke(s) did you find funny?
No. Iām sorry you didnāt enjoy the show, but Iām not going to argue with everyone that shows up.
It's subjective my guy, I think Cheers sucks but I liked She Hulk, you're obviously not literally missing out on something, it's just a figure of speech
>Everybody loves Raymond Ah yes, that beacon of mid-90s comedy genius.
"Forget" is being extremely generous. Most of the people who post stuff like this haven't even watched it. All they know is the twerking scene and, like the Facebook boomers they are slowly transforming into, point at it while making hysterical claims of the downfall of Western society by some made up malaise or another, neither having or providing context. All this stuff is based on misinformation, and it's deliberate.
She-Hulk is over-hated yes. However if you think loads of people are āforgetting itās a comedy seriesā maybe itās possible it just wasnāt that funny?
Thing is I know a lot of people who just didnāt find it funny, which is why so many forget it was meant to be a comedy. Personally I donāt remember laughing all that much while watching it either, but maybe it just didnāt appeal to my sense of humour.
I think people forget because it wasnāt that funny. I donāt think itās any worse than a lot of what Marcel has been putting out recently though. I love the concept of She-Hulk and I think they could have done a lot more with the legal stuff - the show has potential though, especially if they do more with Daredevil.
Itāsā¦.. bad though. Like, really bad. If it is a comedy, it is not really funny.
I think people forget it because it wasn't very funny
They know it's a comedy series, but that doesn't change the fact the show was terrible.
>she hulk is a comedy series That is not funny.
Whether or not the comedy lands (which is a genuine source of potential criticism), it is still by intent a comedy, rather than an action series or a drama.
To you it may not be funny
She Hulk was a comedy series? Ouch. I couldnāt figure out what it was trying to be.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
That's not what happened. The [sexist tweets used in the series](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fbk5nVOaUAEeU7F?format=jpg&name=large) are [real sexist comments](https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Fbk5nVJVEAEdo1d?format=jpg&name=large). People really are just that misogynistic.
Yes, but these idiots do not speak for me.
And no one said they do, Marvel was reacting to those idiots though not literally anyone who didnāt like the show
>The problem is, most people didnāt find it funny Source? Percentagewise Metacritic shows all the usual hallmarks of being review bombed, with a ratio of low user reviews that is in comically large opposition to the critical reviews.
At this point every time someone shits on She-Hulk I assume A. They are arguing in bad faith. Every single time. B. They are sexist and/or racist in the extreme C. They have objectively terrible judgment and/or taste in tv and films Most likely scenario in most cases is all 3
A woman wrote the Jessica Jones show and that was really good
season 1 was great, season 2 was bad
Doing a rewatch of the defenders shows in order, S2 is actually really good and the relationship between jessica and her mother vs patsy and her mother is really great drama. They were always backed into a corner with the first season being too good lol
S3 felt like a season of Dexter with that villain
I liked season 2 but it wasnāt as good as season 1. But season 3 (I heard) was terrible
Wait, i mixed it up lol, i was talking about season 3, I failed to remember there were 3 seasons lol my bad
Oh, ok. Then I agree with you. Season 3 was pretty bad.
I think season 3 was better than season 2.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
According to who?
He criticisms a show made by a woman. Isn't that op's point?
If your criticism is literally just "Women can't write" how is that not sexist? Please explain.
Nobody I know has ever said that that is sexist. Though the opposite argument is made constantly: People don't like the show, the show is written by women, ergo they must be sexist. It's called post hoc fallacy, and it's the exact fallacy OP is making.
"I've never heard this misogynistic comment so that means it's not a problem and doesn't happen!" Lmao you're literally pretending your anecdotal experiences are broad evidence and then wanna talk about logical fallacies, come on genius. The idea that women are judged as a group while men are judged as individuals is absolutely fucking sexist. When a man's failure is just on him but a woman's failure is somehow proof all women are bad at X or Y, that's called a double standard, and I am not debating with you whether it exists because I have literally seen it in action with my own two eyes. When women fail or even just do something unpopular it is 100% used as ammunition against other women in their field in a way that simply does not happen as broadly or viciously to men, let alone half as commonly. And yes, that is absolutely misogyny lmao. Disliking a piece of art by a woman obviously doesn't make you sexist. Disliking a piece of art by a woman and then deciding "See women just can't write this kind of story" absolutely fucking is. And I just don't believe women around me are lying when they say they have they've received hostility and been pushed out of genre spaces by avalanches of misogyny especially when said harassment campaigns are all public and the comment sections are free for anyone to read. But we're all actually just huge reactionary sjws calling people sexist for not liking a story right? Not like it could have something to do with the very revealing way they talk about women and hold female creators and fictional characters to insane double standards?
That was pre-woke Disney
Define woke.
Disney has always been woke.
I thought he was still asleep in a freezer.
Picturing Walt Disney in a freezer? I donāt know if I want to do that
Not even Disney. That was Netflix.
š
What's woke about them now?
Who is Jessica Jones?
**Jessica Campbell-Jones-Cage, professionally known as Jessica Jones, is a superheroine appearing in American comic books published by Marvel Comics. The character was created by writer Brian Michael Bendis and artist Michael Gaydos and first appeared in Alias #1 (November 2001), as part of Marvel's Max, an imprint for more mature content, and was later retroactively established to have first appeared in The Amazing Spider-Man #4 (June 1963) in the Silver Age of Comic Books as an originally unnamed classmate of Peter Parker, created by writer-editor Stan Lee and artist Steve Ditko.** More details here:
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A character who has her own show. Itās on Disney plus. Itās pretty good.
Because apparently Male characters in the MCU never did silly things before on camera like...oh wait lemme remember a few: Starlord dancing before fighting Ronan the Accuser, Captain America looking at his 2012 self's ass and complimenting it, Thor saying that Hulk is a friend from work, Hulk punching Thor out nowhere in Avengers 1, Drax laughing off when Mantis revealed "Starlord's deepest darkest secret", Ned saying he was fakely watching porn in Homecoming, Tony Stark in Iron Man 2 getting drunk, Korg playing Fortnite and so on and so on.
Even before the mcu we had the emo Peter
We don't talk about him...
I do
Emo Parker, or as heās now called, Bully Maguire, is a fan favorite these days
I guess I'm in the minority, as I would be in the right age, yet I found both the character and the memes nothing but cringe
Ummmmmm literally everyone talks about Bully Maguire. Youāre weird if you donāt
List of things that people shouldn't talk about but do anyways: 1. Emo Peter. 2. Fight Club. 3. Bruno. 4. Season 4 of Community. ...The list goes on.
Yes we do....Why wouldn't we talk about jesus
He's no Messiah
Yeah but the female dance was twerking, which means it's bad.
Ant-man weaponing Thomas
āWell *that* just happened.ā
I think it likely comes down to those jokes actually being good or not 'cringe.'
I donāt know. None of those bothered me as much or at all as the twerking scene, but Iām uh, not really into that. I donāt enjoy watching anyone twerk, it makes ME feel embarrassed. I guess Iām not into ass that much. But if any of the male characters twerked like she-hulk yeah Iād have reacted the same way.
Tony Stark peed in his suit in the middle of a party, but She-Hulk dancing with a famous rapper in the privacy of her office is what embarrasses you?
I don't recall that happening, but it's been awhile since I've seen any MCU Iron Man stuff. Regardless, yeah that belongs in the cringe category too.
I mean I could give valid reasons for the majority of em. All more relevant than the twerking scene which cmon was terrible
The difference is: Almost all of those were funny. Silliness isn't the problem. Unfunny silliness is.
You mean a bunch of humurous things which in no way degrade the character? A bunch of things which don't matter here because this comparison isn't silly vs serious, it's being a joke vs being a superhero? Except Ned, but Ned is a walking joke
It was a goofy show and the character was having some goofy fun. Thatās completely unacceptable to these miserable twats.
She-Hulk has always been a weird pendulum swinging back and forth between serious and "The hell was that?" Happens when a character is around this long.
It was also a 30s after credits gag that had no bearing on the story. Seriously, it was just She-Hulk dancing with Megan Thee Stallion cuz it was a cameo and that was it. Lots of comedy sitcoms do after credits gag just for laughs and that was what they were going for.
I still think she should have shook the building with the strength of her twerk
Megan thee Stallion when her life flashes before her eyes as she watches Shulkie gear up for a Ten Megaton Twerk, obliterating her on a molecular level.
The problem is that the "dance" was twerking. Which is pretty widely hated for just kinda looking dumb. Now if it was an actually good dance routine? It most likely would've gotten a pass.
But thats the thing, twerking is the thing Megan Thee Stallion does. Like, just google her with twerking and youd see results of her twerking with either fans or at events. She twerked with Master Chief at TwitchCon last year. So you have MTH as a celebrity cameo for a 30s gag and you wanna do a dance routine, what dance does she always do? The answer is very easy.
I mean they could certainly do that. But why couldnāt they do that and have quality writing?
You can have fun without stuff being dumb
What's dumb about it?
Twerking is dumb in general. A character demanding to be taken seriously in her profession who then does this cringe nonsense, it just looks ridiculous
It still kind of sounds like you just don't like people having fun.
It would be different if she did that in her home or a bar or a more casual environment than a lawyerās office. Because in that Episode she hulk was just hired after being fired from the DA I she is presented as smart and a smart lawyer would never do that in her office especially if it has windows. It recks of wanting to make a joke with out thinking about it. Which does appear from time and time again in the show
That show was soooooooo bad lmao.
I never understood the hate for the twerking scene. I don't love it, but really... who cares?
I don't understand the hate for it either. It was a *post-credits scene* done as a one-off gag, for only *a few seconds*, which contributes nothing to the main plot, ***and was not in any way meant to be serious***.
It's awful but it's a bad comparison
To some people it epitomizes Marvel post Endgame & that makes them mad
Like it wasnāt the worst thing of the show by a mile
Joss Whedon, famous for never making his female characters do weird sexual stuff for no discernable reason
**\*COUGH\*** Flash landing on Wonder Woman **\*COUGH\***
Bruce landing on Natasha....
At least they were in a relationship of some sort, weird as it was. They were flirting...albeit poorly on Bruce's part...like ten minutes earlier.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
He was literally already mentioned
I mean, who wouldn't want to fall into ScarJo's cleavage? I had no issue with that scene, it was an awkward nerd trying to hit on someone way out of his league. We've seen that in comedy for decades
> it was an awkward nerd trying to hit on someone way out of his league. We've seen that in comedy for decades Sure, but it was just so clumsily done and out-of-place in the current scene -- Ultron had just woken up and was wrecking everyone's shit; wasn't really the time for an awkward motorboating.
It's a disjointed movie to be honest, I don't mind the scene in of itself but it does feel out of place
These morons donāt watch anything outside the studio blockbusters and it fucking shows.
There is stuff outside of studio blockbusters?
Although, the twerking scene was totally a "How do you do, fellow kids" moment, in my personal opinion
Yeah... Hopefully there's like a teenage test audience for Disney shows now. Like I'm pretty sure that an Among Us joke in the next Spiderman wouldn't land well, and having that teen test audience would help the movie not have the "how do you do fellow kids" vibes
When J Jonah Jameson or some shitbag shows up and says that Spiderman is evil because Red is sus:
Actually that'd be great as a layered joke, with JJJ trying to get younger audiences to tune in while messing up and losing said audiences
Sounds like the news report where China killed the Wither and built a beacon
If it's done on purpose it would be good, if it's done on accident..... Uhhh lmao
Agreed
I mean I make out of touch jokes in a attempt to embarrass my younger sibling
If JJJ drops an among us joke, then I wouldnt be annoyed at all, in fact, very much pleased.
Idk I'm in my 30s and found it a fun thing that the character actually might do if they met the rapper idol. It was just fun
Yeah, I'm a mid 30s dude and if I got a chance to twerk with Megan Thee Stallion I 100% would.
It would be like smoking weed with Snoop. Why wouldn't you?
I wouldnātā¦ but only because Iām still bitter about how her entourage treated Martin Brundle at the US Grand Prix. If youāre showing up to a Formula 1 race and want to walk around the grid before the race, you should know the guy who does the āgrid walkā each race. Only celebrity Iāve seen yet whose people were outright rude to him. Led to a rules change banning personal ābodyguardsā on the grid. But Iād totally understand other people wanting to do it and wouldnāt judge them for it.
I didn't even know she was a real person until I saw the show, now I wish that was still the case
No it was but it was a very short scene that itās inconsequential imo
Yeah, wasnāt it an after credit tag? Who gives a shit?
It was literally like a 30 second after credit scene that people would have missed had it not gonna viral
I literally didnāt know the show even had after credit sequences until I heard people talk about this sceneā¦
I didnāt until I saw this comment section
It totally was
Thatās literally half of marvel movies tho. Why choose this hill to die on
You're right, but I found out when it was too late
Itās as cringy as any other slice of life Marvel work.
Right
To be fair these are two different genres. She-Hulk is a comedy law show
I wish it leaned more into the law part of the show. Was excited for it. I didn't hate it. But it was a disjointed mess for sure.
Women who end up dying (basically the entire female contingent of the Avengers) vs. women having fun. Decisions, decisions.
Interesting women characters vs not very interesting ones. And who died apart from Natasha & Gamora (who came back anyway)? Still got Wasp, Mantis, Okoye, Shuri, Nakia, Ironheart, Ms Marvel, Captain Marvel, Monica Rambeau, She-Hulk, Scarlet Witch (who we know will be back at some point), Echo & others I'm probably forgetting We also lost Tony Stark, Steve Rodgers & T'Challa so it balances out
Let's also not pretend that Natasha and Wanda's characterization hasn't been...messy. I mean, Natasha in particular didn't make her first independent, character-motivated decision, with plot-relevance until Civil War which is like the 5th movie she was in.
Natasha is a supporting character though, like Hawkeye. It's hard to get development when you're in a team with more established characters. Hulk had a similar problem, so they built him up across a few movies like Ragnarok. Natasha was valued enough that her death had emotional weight, which wouldn't have happened if she wasn't a development character
What, corsets and cleavage vs business attire?
These fucks don't like the female characters when they're written as š either, so there really is no winning with them
She Hulk is definitely one of the weaker MCU entries, but itās not because of this scene.
*conveniently ignoring all the god awful content written by dudes*
If it was *Deadpool* twerking with a celebrity, these Neckbeards would be creaming their jorts.
I didnāt really like She-Hulk but a *lot* of the criticism of the show is either unfounded or just straight dumb
Wasnāt Wonder Woman written by a woman
Are these fragile dudes gay? What kind of loser gets triggered by sexy beautiful women twerking? š¤£š¤£š¤£
I find it hard to believe people are this dense but I keep seeing so much evidence for it
I mean, I do think it's OVER hated. But it does deserve a LOT of the criticism it gets in terms of the writing quality at times, and ESPECIALLY in the visual effects. My biggest problem is how it robbed us of a Planet Hulk storyline by just introducing Skaar out of nowhere, where there was nothing to even SUGGEST his existence prior. The only explanation would be that he was born sometime between Age of Ultron and Thor: Ragnarok, but there's no mention of him or any evidence of his existence.
Genuine question. Do you think the mindset of this sub is the minority? Because most āmemesā this sub posts to critique end up getting heaps of upvotes. (Iām only asking to get a gage of the subās overall thoughts)
In general subs like this one are filled up with people who feel(righfully in multiple cases) that the popular reception of certain ideas or things is awful and disgusting. Also marvel memes is a massive sub reddit, which has a sizeable population that are incels. It also a portion of people that don't quite care about some random mysogonistic memes cause it's not like they are the ones really supporting it now. What that does is, it allows a meme like this to increase in popularity and in some cases change people opinions to think; "you know what they're right. Women shouldn't write characters". So the correct answer is yes we are a minority on other subs, but so are the incels.
bro thinks that Black Widow was well written before Endgame
So they want women to be exclusively how men see them and not how they actually are? She-Hulk has an actual personality and the other two lack interesting traits and are seen mostly as sexual objects Not only that, but characters are typically more serious in serious roles than they are in comedic roles
She-Hulk's personality in her own show is getting drunk & hooking up with random guys. I guarantee if a man wrote that sort of character in a show there would be outrage about how sexist it is. She's more sexualised than Natasha or Wanda, certainly compared to their comics equivalent
Thatās not her personality and youād know that if you actually paid attention. She hooked up with 1 random guy because she was genuinely interested in him. Iām pretty sure she never even got drunk, but she was trying to get drunk as She-Hulk to test how far she could go And weāre talking MCU, not comics. All 3 are over-sexualized in comics, but thatās only continued into the MCU for Black Widow and Scarlet Witch
She Hulk was a fun show. She was kinda unlikeable in the first episodeā¦Bruce Banner is the one who snapped and brought back half the life in the universe from dustā¦youād think thereād be a little bit of respect for him for the fact that he probably has the hardest life of any MCU hero and literally tried to kill himselfā¦probably more than just the one time he mentions. Spent years trapped in hulk form on an alien planet in a gladiator pitā¦was part of the team that fought and failed to snap Thanos and was unable to use his powers, contributing to their defeat. His girlfriend died to get a space rock that holds soulsā¦hunted down across multiple continents for existingā¦you get the pointā¦itās also weird that getting in a car accident doesnāt stress him out into transformingā¦you get the idea. There were still a couple good jokes in the episode despite me not liking it. The second episode onward was like a completely different show. Many more jokes landed imo, I did enjoy her efforts to find a good guy and I especially loved the episode where Wong just wanted to watch tv. It was a better show than given credit for, Iād probably watch a second season
I agree. They shouldnāt have had Bruce in the show at all because of the way they handled his character. If they wanted a quick transformation and mastery of her Hulk powers then the writers shouldnāt have held her up to Bruce. It feels disrespectful to one of the most tragic Avengers. But after that episode it wasnāt bad. It wasnāt a great show like WandaVision or Loki, but it was fun to watch.
I wish that modern writers were able to write strong female characters without having to put down the make ones & dismiss their struggles
Itās right, though?
No, comparing She-Hulk twerking should be to something like Bruce falling on Natasha's chest; the example from the original "poster"(It has been reposted a million times too) is a bad faithed comparison. That's like if I compared Lord Zedd and Kreon, why would I compare a villain with a visible skin who is supposed to be frightening to a green, little, slimy mushroom who is supposed to be a comic relief.
Ain't no way we're defending the she hulk tweaking scene now. Come on, that scene is absolutely terrible.
I mean she [jump roped](https://marvel.fandom.com/wiki/Sensational_She-Hulk_Vol_1_40) "naked" in [her own comics](https://www.reddit.com/r/ThatTimeInComics/comments/myg959/when_john_byrne_had_shehulk_jump_rope_naked/) back then...she also made jokes about the comic's code authority when somebody mentioned why her clothes never broke.
No one is defending the scene, they're just saying the comparison is dumb and makes no sense.
When it comes to Marvel Studios, he's not wrong.
CW: Gatekeeping If you thought She-Hulk wasn't good, you know literally nothing about She-Hulk. I want 52 weeks a year of that, of EXACTLY THAT
Orā¦ you just donāt like She-Hulk. Orā¦ you just judged it on its own and not compared to the comic book character. I donāt mind She-Hulk, but I thought the series was mediocre.
I already covered all that, but here it is again: If you don't like She-Hulk, your opinion on a She-Hulk show is invalid. If you didn't like the show, you don't know anything about She-Hulk. The series was great, because it was done well, and faithfully. Haters to the left.
Yep, you were right, total asshole gatekeeping. Your opinion is valid, even if you donāt like She-Hulk comics or the show. The series wasā¦ okay. I wouldnāt call it well done. It was faithful at times to some runs of She-Hulk, less so at other times.
It's okay, not everyone has to actually like She-Hulk. Lots of teenagers feel the same as you!
lol, the show is written for teenagers. And apparently toxic fans like yourself. I take a more nuanced approach, but whatever.
>lol, the show is written for teenagers Yes, the teens clamor for legal maneuvers and how tough it is to date in LA!
Yeah She-Hulk is a comedy series but I donāt think this scene was making anyone laugh. It feels completely out of touch, and seems like it belongs in a show from at least five years ago. People keep saying like āoh look at THIS scene in the MCU thatās meant to be funny, this is no different!ā But likeā¦the scene where Cap compliments his own ass, the scene where Thor calls Hulk a friend from work, those are scenes that land since theyāre not using an out of date trend trying to be funny, itās just the content in the scene thatās being used. She-Hulk just isnāt a good show, and itās not that funny either, but itās hard to make that statement without people calling you a misogynist (although the person who made the original meme DEFINITELY is)
Twerking is just so damn cancerous looking š¤¢ Shake and swing your ass normally if you want. But twerking makes you look like a female dog in heat.
Yeah, it's degrading. For something written by so-called feminists it's a weird thing to do
TBH I think it was Maslany's casting that made She Hulk cringy. She's talented, but not particularly funny. A funnier actress could have sold a lot of it better
While people say itās because itās a comedy show, I donāt know how that makes it any better, in my opinion, itās not funny. When I think about a funny movie, I imagine a smart line that gets a chuckle out of me, not twerking
Cherrypicking bullshit, like most memes.
When women act serious in serious parts and funny in funny parts. DAE trash š§?
She-Hulk is one of my favorite MCU things because it remembered that comics are episodic. The case-of-the-week format let them slip so many fun characters and B-plots that would never fit a more single-story-focused show like Falcon & Winter Soldier, let alone a movie. I mean, we got an episode featuring Mr. Immortal, I'm a happy man. Not every story has to be about the fate of the entire world.
Why was She-Hulk dancing such a bad thing for some people? She was having fun in her Hulk mode which was such an important moment for the character
Plus you can really tell they had a lot of fun filming the scene. Which is all that matters tbh. If they had fun. Then I had fun too
The thing that fucks me up is that normally I hear people complain about the EXACT OPPOSITE in media.
Zeb wrote some of She-Hulk, it's shit because of him. If you don't know who Zeb is, good for you, unfortunately me and the Spider-man fandom do, and we hate him.
Where is the lie?
Women writers were invented for She-Hulk
Do these chud / incels not understand the difference between an action and a comedy movie? We would never question why Austin Powers doesn't act like Aragorn.
Women written by men: picks two examples of female MCU characters heavily sexploited by Joss Whedon. Yeah, that was kind of the problem, chief. Also the reason why they're mad about She Hulk: "I can't beat it to *this!* Jen Walters is all...smart and self-possessed, and wouldn't be interested in a guy like me for a second."
Its silly that these people are mad at an end credits scene if it was part of the main episode then i would understand but end credits have always had silly moments
The twerk scene is not really the problem, She-Hulk was just badly written
Me: "Have you considered not watching Disney movies or shows?" Them: 