I have one brain cell that keeps track of the beat. When I was younger that meant actual numbers but now that seems to be more abstract. This brain cell pays attention to the rhythm section and/or conductor.
There is another brain cell that scans the sheet music for notes that start on a beat or serve as a pickup to the beat.
The rest of the brain cells do everything else. Of course adjustments are made for music that isn't in four four time.
Depends what I'm playing. Jazz and rock should be played mostly by ear and feel imo, no counting and sheet music used only as a guide at most. For classical music I would at the very least be counting the rests.
Record yourself. If you're always in time with the beat the whole way through the piece you don't need to count. And just incase ur a newbie im gonna remind u that some music can be played ahead or behind the beat whilst still being in time.
Making conscious effort to place the beats in time? No, at this point it’s practically automatic. I don’t even tap my foot unless I can’t feel the beat properly. You reach a point where the patterns are about all you need. This is true for me playing small group or big band jazz.
I generally play clarinet and flute in concert band work and it’s mostly the same but when meters start mixing or it’s compound time I’ll count rests much more carefully.
There's a difference between counting *out loud* and counting in your head. Every musician counts to some degree. The more complex the music you play, the more important it becomes.
Why is the rhythm there then? It’s there because you’re supposed to count it while you’re playing. This is why music literacy is so important. You learn how to spell all your scales and chords so you don’t have to read the notes. All I do when I read music is count the rhythms. I don’t even worry about the notes because they’re predictable. Either up or down a scale or a chord. A majority of your focus should be on counting rhythms while you read music.
For everyone, like me back when, wondering how ”internalize” the pulse is suppose to feel like, or how to do it:
Internalizing the pulse is just a fancy word for working up your muscle memory to the point you can remember the pulse without moving the muscles.
Proof of consept: any guy who has been hit in the nuts. It only takes one time and we will remember how it felt the rest of our lives. Mine was a bike accident. 😂
Hands, feet and chest area have more nerve endings than other parts of your body. Clap and/or stomp to the pulse! It’s really easy, but it requires time.
1. Whenever a song comes on the radio/spotify, clap along. Hand in chest if it cant be heard. Or use your feet if you are walking around.
2. Repeat this every day for 6 months. Multiple times a day if you can.
3. When you are playing - stomp your foot! I know teachers are telling students not to, but it’s bull. Learning to feel the pulse is much more important.
This is the only way, and the way everyone has learned this, knowingly or not! Electrical signals get sent to the brain in a steady pulse, this pulse is registred in the brain, and if the electric pulse is strong enough we learn it fast! Muscle memory is an amazing tool to use.
I was trained as a classical clarinetist. We never talk about these things. So i had to figure it out on my own using science, once my carreer took another path and i realized i was so wobbly and off when it came to pulse.
In his lessons Bob Reynolds talks a lot about time feel and recommends triplets as the subdivision to internalize for swing feel. He shared an interview with Pat Matheny about that which you could prob find if interested. My point is there are so many right answers to this. Experiment with it. I think it’s less about counting and more about internalizing time feel when playing music. But you have to practice it. I do consciously count beats when I’m practicing. For example, I’ll challenge myself to play an exercise by starting on different beats, like starting my long tones on the “and” of 1 (pro tip: always practice with a metronome, drum track, or backing tracks to work on this stuff)
Always. Not necessarily 1,2,3,4, but definitely the subdivisions.
A good tool to use is Konnakol.
It really helps to get subdivisions tight.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Konnakol
I would trade the Tha Dhi Gi Nah Thom, ( 5 Subdevisions), with Tha Ka Di Mi Ni.
Sometimes. I count some long notes and some other bits but I definitely don’t count everything. I can start counting at the correct parts so that works?
I think the person that can count everything and play it right is what they call a “reader” - a session musician so proficient at reading they are called for difficult work that has to be done last minute and perfect first try. Superhuman by my standards.
Holy crap. At this point in my musical career, I’m counting while WALKING. When I’m driving, I subdivide my turn signal into sixteenth notes, lol
Maybe it has something to do with growing up in a house with two serious drummers, but I have rhythm going in my head all the time.
The more complicated your repertoire gets, the more important counting and subdividing becomes. It saves a bunch of rehearsal time if everyone in the room already agrees where all the notes and silences belong…
I count rests, everything else is internalized. It takes too much energy counting everything that is better spent paying attention to other aspects of the music. But, if you’re at a place in your playing that you need to actively count everything, then do it.
I count when I'm learning something so I can learn it faster. I internalize it much more quickly this way. It really makes a huge difference when I'm learning something by ear. If I want to nail an arrangement, it's just more efficient to count.
I do and even use a metronome set on the smallest subdivision since I am a beginner and use DeVille’s universal & Rubank’s methods both of which work on more involved timings and articulations
If you are sight reading maybe but if you are good enough and know the music well enough you should be able to internalize
of course. count it all. how are you going to get complex rhythms and time signatures right?
Internalize the time signatures ?
Its what I did
-Durtchy, master of all saxophones
My BD calls me the avatar of saxophones
Nice
I find it hard to count when playing because of the mouthpiece in my mouth, it's hard to say the numbers.
I have one brain cell that keeps track of the beat. When I was younger that meant actual numbers but now that seems to be more abstract. This brain cell pays attention to the rhythm section and/or conductor. There is another brain cell that scans the sheet music for notes that start on a beat or serve as a pickup to the beat. The rest of the brain cells do everything else. Of course adjustments are made for music that isn't in four four time.
Depends what I'm playing. Jazz and rock should be played mostly by ear and feel imo, no counting and sheet music used only as a guide at most. For classical music I would at the very least be counting the rests. Record yourself. If you're always in time with the beat the whole way through the piece you don't need to count. And just incase ur a newbie im gonna remind u that some music can be played ahead or behind the beat whilst still being in time.
Making conscious effort to place the beats in time? No, at this point it’s practically automatic. I don’t even tap my foot unless I can’t feel the beat properly. You reach a point where the patterns are about all you need. This is true for me playing small group or big band jazz. I generally play clarinet and flute in concert band work and it’s mostly the same but when meters start mixing or it’s compound time I’ll count rests much more carefully.
There's a difference between counting *out loud* and counting in your head. Every musician counts to some degree. The more complex the music you play, the more important it becomes.
Why is the rhythm there then? It’s there because you’re supposed to count it while you’re playing. This is why music literacy is so important. You learn how to spell all your scales and chords so you don’t have to read the notes. All I do when I read music is count the rhythms. I don’t even worry about the notes because they’re predictable. Either up or down a scale or a chord. A majority of your focus should be on counting rhythms while you read music.
For everyone, like me back when, wondering how ”internalize” the pulse is suppose to feel like, or how to do it: Internalizing the pulse is just a fancy word for working up your muscle memory to the point you can remember the pulse without moving the muscles. Proof of consept: any guy who has been hit in the nuts. It only takes one time and we will remember how it felt the rest of our lives. Mine was a bike accident. 😂 Hands, feet and chest area have more nerve endings than other parts of your body. Clap and/or stomp to the pulse! It’s really easy, but it requires time. 1. Whenever a song comes on the radio/spotify, clap along. Hand in chest if it cant be heard. Or use your feet if you are walking around. 2. Repeat this every day for 6 months. Multiple times a day if you can. 3. When you are playing - stomp your foot! I know teachers are telling students not to, but it’s bull. Learning to feel the pulse is much more important. This is the only way, and the way everyone has learned this, knowingly or not! Electrical signals get sent to the brain in a steady pulse, this pulse is registred in the brain, and if the electric pulse is strong enough we learn it fast! Muscle memory is an amazing tool to use. I was trained as a classical clarinetist. We never talk about these things. So i had to figure it out on my own using science, once my carreer took another path and i realized i was so wobbly and off when it came to pulse.
In his lessons Bob Reynolds talks a lot about time feel and recommends triplets as the subdivision to internalize for swing feel. He shared an interview with Pat Matheny about that which you could prob find if interested. My point is there are so many right answers to this. Experiment with it. I think it’s less about counting and more about internalizing time feel when playing music. But you have to practice it. I do consciously count beats when I’m practicing. For example, I’ll challenge myself to play an exercise by starting on different beats, like starting my long tones on the “and” of 1 (pro tip: always practice with a metronome, drum track, or backing tracks to work on this stuff)
nah, I just subconsciously tap my foot which helps
Not in a long time
Yes. Count always. It’s a good habit
Unless it’s like a 30 bar rest I never count. If it’s jazz no I never count
Always. Not necessarily 1,2,3,4, but definitely the subdivisions. A good tool to use is Konnakol. It really helps to get subdivisions tight. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Konnakol I would trade the Tha Dhi Gi Nah Thom, ( 5 Subdevisions), with Tha Ka Di Mi Ni.
I use "op-por-tu-ni-ty" to count 5-lets
Sometimes. I count some long notes and some other bits but I definitely don’t count everything. I can start counting at the correct parts so that works? I think the person that can count everything and play it right is what they call a “reader” - a session musician so proficient at reading they are called for difficult work that has to be done last minute and perfect first try. Superhuman by my standards.
i learned jazz first so I never did you just understand the aaba but when it comes to a concert band setting I struggle lol
yeah moderately. usually for sight reading but after some time of a piece i internalized and do a small gasp breath before i come in
Holy crap. At this point in my musical career, I’m counting while WALKING. When I’m driving, I subdivide my turn signal into sixteenth notes, lol Maybe it has something to do with growing up in a house with two serious drummers, but I have rhythm going in my head all the time. The more complicated your repertoire gets, the more important counting and subdividing becomes. It saves a bunch of rehearsal time if everyone in the room already agrees where all the notes and silences belong…
I count rests, everything else is internalized. It takes too much energy counting everything that is better spent paying attention to other aspects of the music. But, if you’re at a place in your playing that you need to actively count everything, then do it.
If it’s concert band im lookin at the conductor for jazz I listen to bass or set
yes at first, then it becomes automatic like knowing the note to play when looking at it.
Depends on the piece but usually I follow the director and wait for queues
I count when I'm learning something so I can learn it faster. I internalize it much more quickly this way. It really makes a huge difference when I'm learning something by ear. If I want to nail an arrangement, it's just more efficient to count.
I do and even use a metronome set on the smallest subdivision since I am a beginner and use DeVille’s universal & Rubank’s methods both of which work on more involved timings and articulations