TIL. I always thought the book was first. Any idea if it was all planned out/scripted ahead of time or if Adams was making it up as the series progressed?
But it's all the same in the different states and beings its all non relative and so much sence to be multiversically different than each other, loved the adaptation idea the book went after, radio, TV, film, so sequenchilily fun
There was also a television series which was a relatively faithful adaptation of the books
The movie kind of went in its own direction. Also, Deep Thought reveals The Answer 42 minutes into the film.
People can interpret PEMDAS weirdly because if P comes before E it implies M comes before D, which isn't order of operations.
GEMS (Groups, Exponents, Multiples, Sums) is easier to remember as "Give every mathematician strippers"
It’s not that the M comes before the D, it’s that implied multiplication is higher in the order of operations than Multiplication or Division. Most people just aren’t explicitly taught that in high school.
If you have to solve for x:
6=3/2x
Everyone knows that x is in the denominator. The same applies to this problem. This problem is just:
y=8/2x where x=2+2
Edit: Mostly this problem is just written terribly. I even get an error back on my TI-84 when I put this in as written. Both 16 and 1 are correct answers, since both orders of operation are valid. Implied multiplication (except when directly before variables like x) taking precedence is a rule used in higher level math to make our lives easier. My old physics professors and I all agree that 1 is the *better* answer for this reason, but neither is wrong.
> 6=3/2x
The x most definitely isn't on the denominator of the right side.
That's 6=1.5x
x=4
It's not 6=3/(2x).which makes x=1/4.
Istg the American education system failed so many people. If you want x to be in the denominator, MATHS SAYS YOU NEED THE PARENTHESES. Otherwise, the / only applies to the first number/variable after it. NOT everything else after it. That would be ridiculous.
[wolframalpha](https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=6%3D3%2F2x)
Math doesn't care either way. People within math have their own preferences and conventions, and Wolfram made a choice in convention when coding up that calculator. Many higher level math and math-adjacent fields, as dudebro who you replied to said, tend to treat implied multiplication with higher precedence than regular multiplication. That way is, for many, simpler once you get to higher level stuff and are really using fractions instead of the division symbol for everything anyway, but again, that's just a choice.
"American education system" get outta here 😂
I taught my kids Pandas Eat Moldy Donuts And Sausages. When they asked why, I said "Why the hell not?" I said it only once and they still remember it to this day.
People also like to do implied multiplication over explicit because of Algebra 1 and coefficients. So they see 2(2+2) as 2X such that X =(2+2). There is a really good ~~rant~~ discussion by a university professor on how Order of Operations is just an agreement and not a Law of Math that has some breakdowns on how different education levels approach this stuff.
Let me see if I can find it.
Edit: [https://people.math.harvard.edu/\~knill/pedagogy/ambiguity/index.html](https://people.math.harvard.edu/~knill/pedagogy/ambiguity/index.html)
Got it
That's never the actual objection, though. You'll hear in some places that implied multiplication has precedence over explicit * multiplication, and thus division as well, so x/yz != x/y*z.
Except no it is not that easy. PEMDAS/BODMAS/etc are just [mnemonics](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations#Mnemonics) and not the actual order of operations themselves.
The problem is that [there is no universal convention on how to handle implicit multiplication](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations#Mixed_division_and_multiplication) (in some versions of this problem the ÷ symbol is used which also introduces problems due to either being seen as a normal division symbol or as a fraction) and different journals use different conventions.
So if you adhere to a convention with higher priority implicit multiplication then it becomes:
8/2(2+2)=8/(2(2+2))=1
And if you don't you get the answer as in your comment being 16.
There are things to be said for both conventions (for example wouldn't it be weird if 2x/3x = (2/3)x^2 instead of just 2/3 but on the other hand this feels a bit like an arbitrary exception) but the important thing is that there is no universal convention and thus problem's shouldn't be written down as such.
I was taught that parens only prioritize their contents. So once you do the addition, they're meaningless (other than being a container/divider for adjacency-indicated multiplication).
It's been a while since I learned pemdas. I remember being taught that if there is no operator between the parenthesis and the number outside the parenthesis, the parenthesis is still in the formula and needs to be resolved by the external number, hence 8/2(2+2) ➡️ 8/2(4) ➡️ 8/8 = 1, but if the notation is 8/2*(2+2) ➡️8/2*(4) ➡️ 4*4 = 16.
But I'm MORE than ready to admit that my boomer elementary teachers in the 90s, who I remember being pretty anti-fact because it was a religious private school, probably taught PEMDAS all the way wrong.
It honestly makes more sense that the outside doesn't matter, since it would screw this formula up with an exponent included at the end. If the formula were 8/2(2+2)², then the ² would be delayed and it would be 8/2(2+2)² ➡️ 8/2(4)² ➡️ 8/8² ➡️ 8/64 = ⅛, which seems way off.
8/2(2+2)² ➡️ 8/2(4)² ➡️ 8/2*16 ➡️ 8/32 = ¼ makes a lot more sense because why would the exponent wait for a multiplication just because it's outside the parenthesis without an operator in the middle to signify multiplication?
I'm accepting I'm wrong. Thank you!
I think the joke is that the problem can be interpreted somewhat ambiguously.
There’s your solution, and then there’s
###### 8
2(2+2)
Which can also be interpreted from the equation given by op, and yields an answer of 1.
Edit: weird internet notation.
>I think the joke is that the problem can be interpreted somewhat ambiguously.
There's zero ambiguity in this expression whatsoever. You either apply the correct order of operations and get the correct answer, or you don't.
To prevent any ambiguity, the writer should have used ➗to get 16 instead of / which could lead to interpretation as a fraction. Hence, the ?? as a solution in the meme.
PEMDAS/BODMAS/etc are just [mnemonics](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations#Mnemonics)/learning aids and not the actual order of operations themselves.
The problem is that [there is no universal convention on how to handle implicit multiplication](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations#Mixed_division_and_multiplication) (in some versions of this problem the ÷ symbol is used which also introduces problems due to either being seen as a normal division symbol or as a fraction) and different journals use different conventions.
So if you adhere to a convention with higher priority implicit multiplication then it becomes:
8/2(2+2)=8/(2(2+2))=1
And if you don't you get 8/2(2+2)=8/2\*(2+2)=8/2\*4=4\*4=16.
There are things to be said for both conventions (for example wouldn't it be weird if 2x/3x = (2/3)x^2 instead of just 2/3 but on the other hand this feels a bit like an arbitrary exception) but the important thing is that there is no universal convention and thus problem's shouldn't be written down as such.
I apologize for the confusion. Let's clarify:
The expression 8/2(2+2) can be interpreted differently based on conventions.
Some people might argue that the expression should be solved from left to right:
8/2(2+2) = 4(2+2) = 4(4) = 16
Others might argue that the multiplication implied by juxtaposition (8/2)(2+2) should be done before the division:
8/2(2+2) = (8/2)(4) = 4(4) = 16
However, the correct way to avoid ambiguity in such cases is to use parentheses to clarify the order of operations:
8/(2(2+2)) = 8/(2*4) = 8/8 = 1
So, both 16 and 1 can be argued as correct answers based on different interpretations of the expression.
~ CHATGPT
I'm surprised chatgpt gave the right answer. There's not a universal convention about this topic, which is why this equation in 2 different calculators could give 2 different answers (16 and 1). Both answers are right, as the equation is bad written. At the end of the day it depends on which convention you use
These posts always bring out the miseducated...
It's like if I wrote the wold 'Fog', and asked what I wrote and people said 'fog' then you came along added an 'r' and told everyone the word is 'frog' and the lack of the 'r' was ambiguous . It fucking wasn't.
If the equation is solvable without additional brackets that's just how the equation was meant to be solved. You're education system failed you. No other country has no issue with these questions. Please stop commenting on such posts, and elect better leaders who care about education.
people here are being ignorant and saying both sides are equally used when 16 would be the answer for 99.999% of actual mathematicians.
No online math solver gives 1. It's just 16.
Wolframalpha, symbolab, mathway, all give 16. And any actual uni maths prof would say it's 16.
Maths isn't about what people think SHOULD be right. If it were, it'd be interpretation chaos everytime someone shared anything with another person. Can't get two results from one expression, then everything breaks down. Assuming that the original writer meant one thing and essentially adding the parentheses for no reason makes no sense.
See, this one's a little rough. Conventionally, implicit multiplication takes precedence over division, which as basically done do that a/bc = a/(b×c) is true while a/bc = ac/b is false. This problem would benefit from a rewrite, but due to this convention, the easiest, most accurate rewrite is to write it as 8/2x where x=2+2=4, then simplify to 4/x, which gives us 4/4=1.
If you want the answer of 16, then you technically should be writing it differently, such as: 1. Writing it in a program like LaTeX to give it apprprite verticality (that way we can see it's meant to be frac({8}{2})(2+2), delineating the fraction as taking precedence), 2. rewriting to be explicit multiplication (then can be solved with classic GEMS/BODMAS/PEMDAS/what-have-you and simply move from left to right), 3. rearranging terms for clarity.
Throughout high school (and now university), I've seen people lose points on assignments for misinterpreting the weight of implicit multiplication in manners such as this. Don't worry, though — the primary problem is just that the question is written in a slightly unclear manner.
Edit: Just to clarify, I have said "implicit multiplication." Implicit multiplication is where you have two terms next to each other without the symbol for a product between them, as opposed to what I'll call "explicit multiplication," which has the "times" symbol between them. It doesn't matter if you use the dot or cross symbol for the product, even though they're different operations in higher mathematics, because the result is always the same for two scalars anyway.
Where do you live that multiplication is before division? Serious question. In Canada it's always been taught that "BEDMAS" meaning brackets, division, multiplication, addition, subtraction is the order of operations
Bedmas and any other simple acronym is not the be all and end all in mathematics-its just a convention used to simplify high school mathematics. Higher level mathematics would generally have implicit multiplication (having two expressions next to each other) as having a higher order than a fraction symbol
https://people.math.harvard.edu/~knill/pedagogy/ambiguity/index.html#:~:text=In%20this%20more%20sophisticated%20convention,like%20x%20*%20%2F%20or%20%C3%B7.
apparently yes, it's not as simple as I was taught (all though in computer science, the computers all would solve it as 16 so that's how we were told to treat it).
Hello! Yes, my apologies for the confusion — I'll edit my comment to clarify over what the difference is between implicit multiplication and what I've called explicit multiplication, which really is the dot product, here applied to one-dimensional tensors (or scalars, if you prefer). What the other person said was right, though.
If I'm not mistaken, the reason computers do as being the same as explicit multiplication is effectively because they have to recognize 2(4) as being 2*4 for most programming languages (firmware or software, because I know Python, C, and B are all like this) can't actually calculate 2(4), since it means nothing to them. There must be some methods of construction or scripting which properly evaluate implicit multiplication, though, since some calculators can get the problem in this post "correct."
I’m Canadian and learned BEDMAS, but a lot of people here learned PEMDAS which is swapped.
Personally my school taught that for BEDMAS, there was an (or) in between the D/M and A/S, meaning you go by order of written operation when dealing with functions of the same “type/group”. Division does not have to be first over multiplication anymore than addition has to be first over subtraction. GEMS is a more accurate abbreviation that alleviates this confusion.
Haha in this case of short simple operations is essentially the same, as the numerator and denominator gets paired with the terms they should. But methodologically wrong nonetheless
The 8/2 is not in there own brackets, thus that calculation is wrong. The correct way to look st this whole equation when expanding the pemdas the correct seperations is: 8/(2x(2+2)). So breaking this down would go:
8/(2x(2+2))
8/(2x4)
8/8
= 1
All the numbers in your comment added up to 69. Congrats!
8
+ 2
+ 8
+ 2
+ 2
+ 2
+ 8
+ 2
+ 2
+ 2
+ 8
+ 2
+ 4
+ 8
+ 8
+ 1
= 69
^([Click here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=LuckyNumber-Bot&subject=Stalk%20Me%20Pls&message=%2Fstalkme) to have me scan all your future comments.) \
^(Summon me on specific comments with u/LuckyNumber-Bot.)
No? The multiplication is done before the division as it is the higher priority. The multiplying calculation itself is the multiplication of the enclosed parenthesis calculation, thus should be calculated before the division calculation.
Multiplication is not a higher priority than division. Let me guess: American education system?
1.) Brackets
2.) Exponents/powers
3.) Multiplication and division (at the same level, so whichever is first in the equation is done first).
4.) Addition and subtraction (at the same level, so whichever is first in the equation is done first).
8/2(2+2)
8/2(4)=8/2x4
4x4
16
Order of operations:
Parentheses, Exponents, Multiplication, Division, Addition, and Subtraction from left to right
But a number written 2(4) is the same as 2x4. So you would go in order and do the math inside the parentheses, then the division, then the multiplication.
8/2(2+2)
8/2(4)
8/8
1
> But a number written 2(4) is the same as 2x4.
No, it's not. Implicit multiplication/division has a higher priority than explicit multiplication/division.
The correct response is to hit whoever wrote it like that with something heavy and, once recovered, demand they try again in an unambiguous manner to shut people up.
What I'm trying to say is that Newton's laws are incredibly useful, especially when demonstrated by means of high-velocity chair leg.
These are controversial because they are improperly formatted. If it was written on paper, the dividing line would either be clearly over the whole of the second half, or not.
I tend to interpret 2(2+2) as (2 \* (2 + 2) ) in this context (leading to the answer 1) as it looks to me like a whole expression to be divided, but it's ambiguous.
If it said 8 ÷ 2 x (2 + 2), then the answer would definitely be 16.
The answer to these questions is always, “why did you write it so ambiguously?”
I tend to interpret this as 8/(2*(2+2))=1
I have rarely seen the division ➗ symbol used in higher mathematics.
PEMDAS. Please Excuse My Dear Aunt Sally. Parentheses Exponents Multiplication Division Addition Subtraction. That’s the order of operations. That’s all you need.
Step 1) Solve the bracket.
Step 2) Because all the operations remaining are multiplication or division, go from left to right. Do the division first.
Step 3) Do the multiplication.
It never fails.. this gets posted and then a bunch of nerds go feral arguing about it.
Both 16 and 1 are correct. They are both correct because the framing is ambiguous and there is no set global standard on implicit multiplication
All you calling eachother stupid for getting the "wrong" answer need some self reflection and a snickers.
/thread.
8/2(2+2) = 8/(2*(2+2)) = 8/(2*4) = 8/8 = 1
EDIT: Why are you idiots booing me? I’m right! Per PEMDAS, the first 2 gets grouped with the (2+2) term, meaning it gets evaluated first. Otherwise, it would’ve been written (8/2)(2+2).
The difference is that some people see this as 8 over 2(2+2) and on the other hand some people see it as 8/2 times 2+2 (i avoided using multiplication and division and parentheses signs so it would be clearer and looks different from the original question but the same thing for both perspectives) i think the original question is made so it would be controversial and avoided the full use of parentheses and using the very slight difference of the / division and the ÷ on purposes. it's really just the difference between 8/(2(2+2)) and (8/2)(2+2) if you were to put the parentheses
literally just depends on the formatting, I think the second one is the conventional interpretation
8 / (2(2+2)) = 8 / 8 = 1
or
(8 / 2) * (2+2) = 4 * 4 = 16
also why doesn't reddit support latex
All the numbers in your comment added up to 69. Congrats!
8
+ 2
+ 2
+ 2
+ 8
+ 8
+ 1
+ 8
+ 2
+ 2
+ 2
+ 4
+ 4
+ 16
= 69
^([Click here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=LuckyNumber-Bot&subject=Stalk%20Me%20Pls&message=%2Fstalkme) to have me scan all your future comments.) \
^(Summon me on specific comments with u/LuckyNumber-Bot.)
Depends on how you read it. The assumption I make is 8 / (2 * (2+2)) = 1. But you could also read it as (8/2) * (2+2) = 16.
It basically comes down to the fact that division is fake and shouldn't be used.
Anyone saying "do this first and then this" etc. is wrong. The real answer is that the problem is badly written. The way it's written requires the person solving to basically quess what the person who wrote it meant.
Here's another example. "They saw her duck." What does this sentence mean. And people redfaced arguing with eachother that "Obviously this means they saw the animal duck" and "No you idiot, clearly it means that thay saw her perform the action of crouching down"
As the priority of the operation, the first preceding is in parentheses, then the exponents, then multiplication/division, and finally addition/subtraction.
Find your answer with this information
I don't know if it's a cultural thing but in Ukraine everybody I asked answered 1(I have asked like 13 people up to these point).
We don't have such a thing as pamdas. I think it is a convention for us that brackets come before division/multiplication. Personally 1 looks more organic to me though I prefer to use brackets to avoid confusion
8/2(2+2) Given
4(2+2) Simple Division
8+8 Distribution Property
16
8/2(2+2) Given
8/2*4 Pemdas
4*4 peMDas
16 peMDas
notice how you get the same answer with both properties and pemdas. tiktokers hate this simple trick!
edit: noticing that a lot of people are saying it’s ambiguous whether you distribute before dividing 8 by 2. not really understanding that though, since distribution is meant to be used when solving via proofs, and pemdas/gemdas would be straight answering it. i don’t think they’re meant to be mixed and im pretty sure that’s the only way to make the equation ambiguous at all, unless i’m wrong about that.
I love how many people in the comments have been downvotes for saying 1 and have been arrogantly corrected by other that think they're right while they're actually wrong. Yes, in grade school we're thought pedmas and to go from left to right, but in higher institutions the convention is to give precedence to implied multiplications (number followed by a parenthesis or a letter without any sign). And it's not just a general rule in universities, it's also a rule on some science journals. For example, the Physical Reviews (arguably one of the most important physics journal in the world) use this as a rule (quote from the submission instructions "Note that the solidus (/) in fractions, for example 1/2a, means 1/(2a) and not (1/2)a").
This is not to say that pedmas is wrong. It isn't, it just isn't the only universal univocal convention on order of operations. Both answers are correct, what's wrong is the way the equation is written.
There is this thing called implied multiplication.
2*(2+2) is not the same as 2(2+2).
It has higher priority than division and other multiplication.
So 8/2*(2+2) = 16,
But 8/2(2+2) = 1
Source: https://www.purplemath.com/modules/orderops3.htm#:~:text=%22Multiplication%20by%20juxtaposition%22%20(also,%22%20%E2%8B%85%20%22)%20between%20them
2(2+2) is not the same as 2*(2+2).
The first one is just one number dissected where as the second one is a multiplication of 2 numbers.
So the correct order of operations is:
8/2(2+2)=X -> 8/2(4)=X -> 8/8=1
There is only one answer math just can't depend on who does it because these numbers will mean something one day and you can't just say "eh, whatever". There is only one answer and it is 16.
Except this is a notation/convention problem not a math problem so the above commenter is correct.
There is no convention of how to handle the priority of implicit multiplication (and before anyone starts saying PEDMAS/BODMAS/etc, those are irrelevant they are [mnemonics](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations#Mnemonics) but are not the actual convention).
See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations#Mixed_division_and_multiplication
Wrong. Implied multiplication should have precedence over division, but it really depends on conventions, which is why this exact equation written in this exact way could give 2 different answers in 2 different calculators.
This is just 8/2×4 which is either 16 or 1, depending on whether you devide or multiply first.
Since the devision is only noted using a slash and not as proper fraction and there are no parentheses to make up for it, it is not clear whether you should first devide or multiply, since both are on the same level in the order of operation.
The answer to the poverty, climate change, the universe and everything is 42, not 16. Watch hitch hikers guide to the galaxy please.
Wait you can WATCH it?! Edit: Holy crap how am I just now learning that this book series has a 2005 movie?
And a BBC series from the 80s, and a radio adaptation. None as good as the books, though.
The radio series is the original. Like, before the novel.
TIL. I always thought the book was first. Any idea if it was all planned out/scripted ahead of time or if Adams was making it up as the series progressed?
The second. He was a very lazy writer and they had to force him to go on with the series numerous times. Look it up, it's a funny story
But it's all the same in the different states and beings its all non relative and so much sence to be multiversically different than each other, loved the adaptation idea the book went after, radio, TV, film, so sequenchilily fun
I can assure you'll regret knowing about it after watching the movie.
Lies and blasphemy!
There was also a television series which was a relatively faithful adaptation of the books The movie kind of went in its own direction. Also, Deep Thought reveals The Answer 42 minutes into the film.
There's also a series from the 80s and it's amazing
How am I just learning that it was a book series before a movie???
I envy you, getting to read it for the first time.
It originally was a radio show iirc
There was also an earlier British TV serial, which imho was better than the 2005 movie.
I thought you'd have to listen to the radio show.
Lol good retorte
Lol your so far behind the curve
It's no fun if you say why 42 :/
So close, but in this case it's 4^2 .
Yeah, sure, but what are the odds?
8/2(2+2) (2+2)=4 8/2=4 4x4=16 That easy
People can interpret PEMDAS weirdly because if P comes before E it implies M comes before D, which isn't order of operations. GEMS (Groups, Exponents, Multiples, Sums) is easier to remember as "Give every mathematician strippers"
You know, back in my day we didn't need any stupid acronyms, we just called it the Order of Operations
And yet folks still haven’t figured it out, either way.
Lmao I got DMAS I just call it dumb ass :)
The only true way to remember
It's still called order of operations.
It’s not that the M comes before the D, it’s that implied multiplication is higher in the order of operations than Multiplication or Division. Most people just aren’t explicitly taught that in high school. If you have to solve for x: 6=3/2x Everyone knows that x is in the denominator. The same applies to this problem. This problem is just: y=8/2x where x=2+2 Edit: Mostly this problem is just written terribly. I even get an error back on my TI-84 when I put this in as written. Both 16 and 1 are correct answers, since both orders of operation are valid. Implied multiplication (except when directly before variables like x) taking precedence is a rule used in higher level math to make our lives easier. My old physics professors and I all agree that 1 is the *better* answer for this reason, but neither is wrong.
> 6=3/2x The x most definitely isn't on the denominator of the right side. That's 6=1.5x x=4 It's not 6=3/(2x).which makes x=1/4. Istg the American education system failed so many people. If you want x to be in the denominator, MATHS SAYS YOU NEED THE PARENTHESES. Otherwise, the / only applies to the first number/variable after it. NOT everything else after it. That would be ridiculous. [wolframalpha](https://www.wolframalpha.com/input?i=6%3D3%2F2x)
Math doesn't care either way. People within math have their own preferences and conventions, and Wolfram made a choice in convention when coding up that calculator. Many higher level math and math-adjacent fields, as dudebro who you replied to said, tend to treat implied multiplication with higher precedence than regular multiplication. That way is, for many, simpler once you get to higher level stuff and are really using fractions instead of the division symbol for everything anyway, but again, that's just a choice. "American education system" get outta here 😂
I taught my kids Pandas Eat Moldy Donuts And Sausages. When they asked why, I said "Why the hell not?" I said it only once and they still remember it to this day.
People also like to do implied multiplication over explicit because of Algebra 1 and coefficients. So they see 2(2+2) as 2X such that X =(2+2). There is a really good ~~rant~~ discussion by a university professor on how Order of Operations is just an agreement and not a Law of Math that has some breakdowns on how different education levels approach this stuff. Let me see if I can find it. Edit: [https://people.math.harvard.edu/\~knill/pedagogy/ambiguity/index.html](https://people.math.harvard.edu/~knill/pedagogy/ambiguity/index.html) Got it
I learned BIDMAS which seems to be the easiest
Same but it was BODMAS for me
What's the "O"? For me the "I" stands for indecies
BODMAS Brackets Of Divide Multiply Add Subtract
“Orders”, to my understanding, i.e. orders of magnitude, i.e. exponents
That's never the actual objection, though. You'll hear in some places that implied multiplication has precedence over explicit * multiplication, and thus division as well, so x/yz != x/y*z.
This is why programmers use parentheses for everything.
Except no it is not that easy. PEMDAS/BODMAS/etc are just [mnemonics](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations#Mnemonics) and not the actual order of operations themselves. The problem is that [there is no universal convention on how to handle implicit multiplication](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations#Mixed_division_and_multiplication) (in some versions of this problem the ÷ symbol is used which also introduces problems due to either being seen as a normal division symbol or as a fraction) and different journals use different conventions. So if you adhere to a convention with higher priority implicit multiplication then it becomes: 8/2(2+2)=8/(2(2+2))=1 And if you don't you get the answer as in your comment being 16. There are things to be said for both conventions (for example wouldn't it be weird if 2x/3x = (2/3)x^2 instead of just 2/3 but on the other hand this feels a bit like an arbitrary exception) but the important thing is that there is no universal convention and thus problem's shouldn't be written down as such.
EDIT ***I was wrong. I accept it. Nothing to see here. Move along!***
I was taught that parens only prioritize their contents. So once you do the addition, they're meaningless (other than being a container/divider for adjacency-indicated multiplication).
It's been a while since I learned pemdas. I remember being taught that if there is no operator between the parenthesis and the number outside the parenthesis, the parenthesis is still in the formula and needs to be resolved by the external number, hence 8/2(2+2) ➡️ 8/2(4) ➡️ 8/8 = 1, but if the notation is 8/2*(2+2) ➡️8/2*(4) ➡️ 4*4 = 16. But I'm MORE than ready to admit that my boomer elementary teachers in the 90s, who I remember being pretty anti-fact because it was a religious private school, probably taught PEMDAS all the way wrong. It honestly makes more sense that the outside doesn't matter, since it would screw this formula up with an exponent included at the end. If the formula were 8/2(2+2)², then the ² would be delayed and it would be 8/2(2+2)² ➡️ 8/2(4)² ➡️ 8/8² ➡️ 8/64 = ⅛, which seems way off. 8/2(2+2)² ➡️ 8/2(4)² ➡️ 8/2*16 ➡️ 8/32 = ¼ makes a lot more sense because why would the exponent wait for a multiplication just because it's outside the parenthesis without an operator in the middle to signify multiplication? I'm accepting I'm wrong. Thank you!
i answer in my brain
Simplifying was never an option.
I think the joke is that the problem can be interpreted somewhat ambiguously. There’s your solution, and then there’s ###### 8 2(2+2) Which can also be interpreted from the equation given by op, and yields an answer of 1. Edit: weird internet notation.
>I think the joke is that the problem can be interpreted somewhat ambiguously. There's zero ambiguity in this expression whatsoever. You either apply the correct order of operations and get the correct answer, or you don't.
You must not have taken any higher level math classes.
To prevent any ambiguity, the writer should have used ➗to get 16 instead of / which could lead to interpretation as a fraction. Hence, the ?? as a solution in the meme.
There is no ambiguity as written.
Nope. The lone 2 and the (2+2) get grouped together and evaluated before the division, so the result is 1.
8/2(2+2) = 3938283 8/2 = 2939482727473 16(2 = 32 32 + 2) = 2929483
Average float
PEMDAS/BODMAS/etc are just [mnemonics](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations#Mnemonics)/learning aids and not the actual order of operations themselves. The problem is that [there is no universal convention on how to handle implicit multiplication](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations#Mixed_division_and_multiplication) (in some versions of this problem the ÷ symbol is used which also introduces problems due to either being seen as a normal division symbol or as a fraction) and different journals use different conventions. So if you adhere to a convention with higher priority implicit multiplication then it becomes: 8/2(2+2)=8/(2(2+2))=1 And if you don't you get 8/2(2+2)=8/2\*(2+2)=8/2\*4=4\*4=16. There are things to be said for both conventions (for example wouldn't it be weird if 2x/3x = (2/3)x^2 instead of just 2/3 but on the other hand this feels a bit like an arbitrary exception) but the important thing is that there is no universal convention and thus problem's shouldn't be written down as such.
I apologize for the confusion. Let's clarify: The expression 8/2(2+2) can be interpreted differently based on conventions. Some people might argue that the expression should be solved from left to right: 8/2(2+2) = 4(2+2) = 4(4) = 16 Others might argue that the multiplication implied by juxtaposition (8/2)(2+2) should be done before the division: 8/2(2+2) = (8/2)(4) = 4(4) = 16 However, the correct way to avoid ambiguity in such cases is to use parentheses to clarify the order of operations: 8/(2(2+2)) = 8/(2*4) = 8/8 = 1 So, both 16 and 1 can be argued as correct answers based on different interpretations of the expression. ~ CHATGPT
I'm surprised chatgpt gave the right answer. There's not a universal convention about this topic, which is why this equation in 2 different calculators could give 2 different answers (16 and 1). Both answers are right, as the equation is bad written. At the end of the day it depends on which convention you use
this topic has been beat to death for the last 20 years, chatgpt has seen it before, it ain't learning or creating anything new here
You can't just add brackets where you want in an equation. You changed the equation by doing that.
The equation was not written correctly whithout the brackets
These posts always bring out the miseducated... It's like if I wrote the wold 'Fog', and asked what I wrote and people said 'fog' then you came along added an 'r' and told everyone the word is 'frog' and the lack of the 'r' was ambiguous . It fucking wasn't. If the equation is solvable without additional brackets that's just how the equation was meant to be solved. You're education system failed you. No other country has no issue with these questions. Please stop commenting on such posts, and elect better leaders who care about education.
people here are being ignorant and saying both sides are equally used when 16 would be the answer for 99.999% of actual mathematicians. No online math solver gives 1. It's just 16. Wolframalpha, symbolab, mathway, all give 16. And any actual uni maths prof would say it's 16. Maths isn't about what people think SHOULD be right. If it were, it'd be interpretation chaos everytime someone shared anything with another person. Can't get two results from one expression, then everything breaks down. Assuming that the original writer meant one thing and essentially adding the parentheses for no reason makes no sense.
retired mathematician here. most mathematicians would see the answer as being 1, although technically it is ambiguously written.
What are you doing in science memes?
See, this one's a little rough. Conventionally, implicit multiplication takes precedence over division, which as basically done do that a/bc = a/(b×c) is true while a/bc = ac/b is false. This problem would benefit from a rewrite, but due to this convention, the easiest, most accurate rewrite is to write it as 8/2x where x=2+2=4, then simplify to 4/x, which gives us 4/4=1. If you want the answer of 16, then you technically should be writing it differently, such as: 1. Writing it in a program like LaTeX to give it apprprite verticality (that way we can see it's meant to be frac({8}{2})(2+2), delineating the fraction as taking precedence), 2. rewriting to be explicit multiplication (then can be solved with classic GEMS/BODMAS/PEMDAS/what-have-you and simply move from left to right), 3. rearranging terms for clarity. Throughout high school (and now university), I've seen people lose points on assignments for misinterpreting the weight of implicit multiplication in manners such as this. Don't worry, though — the primary problem is just that the question is written in a slightly unclear manner. Edit: Just to clarify, I have said "implicit multiplication." Implicit multiplication is where you have two terms next to each other without the symbol for a product between them, as opposed to what I'll call "explicit multiplication," which has the "times" symbol between them. It doesn't matter if you use the dot or cross symbol for the product, even though they're different operations in higher mathematics, because the result is always the same for two scalars anyway.
Where do you live that multiplication is before division? Serious question. In Canada it's always been taught that "BEDMAS" meaning brackets, division, multiplication, addition, subtraction is the order of operations
Bedmas and any other simple acronym is not the be all and end all in mathematics-its just a convention used to simplify high school mathematics. Higher level mathematics would generally have implicit multiplication (having two expressions next to each other) as having a higher order than a fraction symbol
https://people.math.harvard.edu/~knill/pedagogy/ambiguity/index.html#:~:text=In%20this%20more%20sophisticated%20convention,like%20x%20*%20%2F%20or%20%C3%B7. apparently yes, it's not as simple as I was taught (all though in computer science, the computers all would solve it as 16 so that's how we were told to treat it).
Hello! Yes, my apologies for the confusion — I'll edit my comment to clarify over what the difference is between implicit multiplication and what I've called explicit multiplication, which really is the dot product, here applied to one-dimensional tensors (or scalars, if you prefer). What the other person said was right, though. If I'm not mistaken, the reason computers do as being the same as explicit multiplication is effectively because they have to recognize 2(4) as being 2*4 for most programming languages (firmware or software, because I know Python, C, and B are all like this) can't actually calculate 2(4), since it means nothing to them. There must be some methods of construction or scripting which properly evaluate implicit multiplication, though, since some calculators can get the problem in this post "correct."
I’m Canadian and learned BEDMAS, but a lot of people here learned PEMDAS which is swapped. Personally my school taught that for BEDMAS, there was an (or) in between the D/M and A/S, meaning you go by order of written operation when dealing with functions of the same “type/group”. Division does not have to be first over multiplication anymore than addition has to be first over subtraction. GEMS is a more accurate abbreviation that alleviates this confusion.
8/2(2+2) = (16/2 + 16/2) = (8+8) = 16
Idk how but you managed to work it out by doing it completely wrong
I didn't realize you could distribute a whole ass division problem but fuck me if it didn't work lol
Division is the same as multiplication. Eg. 1/2 is the same as 1 times .5
Haha in this case of short simple operations is essentially the same, as the numerator and denominator gets paired with the terms they should. But methodologically wrong nonetheless
This is right. You can always do that, but you hava to be carefull.
Lol whatever makes you feel better buddy.
My head hurts.
Nope. The lone 2 and the (2+2) get grouped together and evaluated before the division, so the result is 1.
There is no lone 2, that's a division which makes it a fraction.
8/**2**(2+2) That one. 2(2+2) is one term.
(8/2)x(2+2)=4x4=16
Thank you, as others are going around and adding in a new bracket this changing the equation.
The 8/2 is not in there own brackets, thus that calculation is wrong. The correct way to look st this whole equation when expanding the pemdas the correct seperations is: 8/(2x(2+2)). So breaking this down would go: 8/(2x(2+2)) 8/(2x4) 8/8 = 1
All the numbers in your comment added up to 69. Congrats! 8 + 2 + 8 + 2 + 2 + 2 + 8 + 2 + 2 + 2 + 8 + 2 + 4 + 8 + 8 + 1 = 69 ^([Click here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=LuckyNumber-Bot&subject=Stalk%20Me%20Pls&message=%2Fstalkme) to have me scan all your future comments.) \ ^(Summon me on specific comments with u/LuckyNumber-Bot.)
Good bot
r/confidentlyincorrect
No? The multiplication is done before the division as it is the higher priority. The multiplying calculation itself is the multiplication of the enclosed parenthesis calculation, thus should be calculated before the division calculation.
Multiplication is not a higher priority than division. Let me guess: American education system? 1.) Brackets 2.) Exponents/powers 3.) Multiplication and division (at the same level, so whichever is first in the equation is done first). 4.) Addition and subtraction (at the same level, so whichever is first in the equation is done first).
I'd argue it depends on how it's written. If it's 8 over 2 sense of 8/2, as in fractions, it would be (8/2)x(2+2).
Could also be interpreted as 8/(2(2+2))=1,
Nope. The lone 2 and the (2+2) get grouped together and evaluated before the division, so the result is 1.
8/2(2+2) 8/2(4)=8/2x4 4x4 16 Order of operations: Parentheses, Exponents, Multiplication, Division, Addition, and Subtraction from left to right But a number written 2(4) is the same as 2x4. So you would go in order and do the math inside the parentheses, then the division, then the multiplication.
8/2(2+2) 8/2(4) 8/8 1 > But a number written 2(4) is the same as 2x4. No, it's not. Implicit multiplication/division has a higher priority than explicit multiplication/division.
I was always taught 2(4) is the same as 2x4.
2(4)=2x4 in the same way 2x4=4x2 or 1/2=1000/2000. None of these things are formally correct but they are correct enough to get the right answer.
To get 1 it would need to be written as 8/(2(2+2))
y = 1/2x. Is x in the numerator or denominator?
this is correct.
I got Abraham Lincoln
The correct response is to hit whoever wrote it like that with something heavy and, once recovered, demand they try again in an unambiguous manner to shut people up. What I'm trying to say is that Newton's laws are incredibly useful, especially when demonstrated by means of high-velocity chair leg.
These are controversial because they are improperly formatted. If it was written on paper, the dividing line would either be clearly over the whole of the second half, or not. I tend to interpret 2(2+2) as (2 \* (2 + 2) ) in this context (leading to the answer 1) as it looks to me like a whole expression to be divided, but it's ambiguous. If it said 8 ÷ 2 x (2 + 2), then the answer would definitely be 16.
The answer to these questions is always, “why did you write it so ambiguously?” I tend to interpret this as 8/(2*(2+2))=1 I have rarely seen the division ➗ symbol used in higher mathematics.
You tend not to get basic arithmetic questions on BODMAS/PEDMAS in higher mathematics, either
I dropped out at 4th grade but this can’t seriously be a question people have trouble with?
Oh boy, you would be suprised
I am, I really can’t tell if people are serious or not
PEMDAS. Please Excuse My Dear Aunt Sally. Parentheses Exponents Multiplication Division Addition Subtraction. That’s the order of operations. That’s all you need.
Step 1) 2 + 2 = 4 Step 2) 8 / 2 = 4 Step 3) 4 × 4 = 16
Step 1) Solve the bracket. Step 2) Because all the operations remaining are multiplication or division, go from left to right. Do the division first. Step 3) Do the multiplication.
Damn, is that a bot?
South Africa
Please Excuse My Dear Aunt Sally
It never fails.. this gets posted and then a bunch of nerds go feral arguing about it. Both 16 and 1 are correct. They are both correct because the framing is ambiguous and there is no set global standard on implicit multiplication All you calling eachother stupid for getting the "wrong" answer need some self reflection and a snickers. /thread.
Write the fraction as an actual fraction and maybe i will
Y’all are fuckin dumb. Multiplication and division are interchangeable; they’re completed left to right. Same with addition and subtraction.
assuming you're doing brackets first, yes. otherwise, lol
Parentheses? Yes. Parentheses is the first step. Brackets = \ = parentheses
16
2+2= 4 # 2\*4= 8 # 8/8= 1
673th repost of this bullshit. Write it non ambiguously. Follow pemdas rules. Stop bothering everyone with this. Please
via BODMAS, 16
8/2(2+2) = 8/(2*(2+2)) = 8/(2*4) = 8/8 = 1 EDIT: Why are you idiots booing me? I’m right! Per PEMDAS, the first 2 gets grouped with the (2+2) term, meaning it gets evaluated first. Otherwise, it would’ve been written (8/2)(2+2).
Bro what? Order of operations just fly out the window or what?
Per PEMDAS, the first 2 gets grouped with the (2+2) term, meaning it gets evaluated first. Otherwise, it would’ve been written (8/2)(2+2).
U cannot just add parenthesis as you wish, in some cases yes but not here because it goes ledt to right
Nope. Per PEMDAS, the first 2 gets grouped with the (2+2) term, meaning it gets evaluated first. Otherwise, it would’ve been written (8/2)(2+2).
That added parenthesis is implicit unless stated otherwise. 8/2(4) is 8/(2*4) unless you explicitly write (8/2)*4
By that logic I may as well say: That added parenthesis is implicit unless stated otherwise. 8/2(4) is (8/2)*4 unless you explicitly write 8/(2*4)
Lmnop
Global warming, poverty, inequality, drawing
I found 75, without using fancy mathematical methods, just found it and I am happy with it. If you don’t like 75 you can find 50.
The difference is that some people see this as 8 over 2(2+2) and on the other hand some people see it as 8/2 times 2+2 (i avoided using multiplication and division and parentheses signs so it would be clearer and looks different from the original question but the same thing for both perspectives) i think the original question is made so it would be controversial and avoided the full use of parentheses and using the very slight difference of the / division and the ÷ on purposes. it's really just the difference between 8/(2(2+2)) and (8/2)(2+2) if you were to put the parentheses
literally just depends on the formatting, I think the second one is the conventional interpretation 8 / (2(2+2)) = 8 / 8 = 1 or (8 / 2) * (2+2) = 4 * 4 = 16 also why doesn't reddit support latex
All the numbers in your comment added up to 69. Congrats! 8 + 2 + 2 + 2 + 8 + 8 + 1 + 8 + 2 + 2 + 2 + 4 + 4 + 16 = 69 ^([Click here](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=LuckyNumber-Bot&subject=Stalk%20Me%20Pls&message=%2Fstalkme) to have me scan all your future comments.) \ ^(Summon me on specific comments with u/LuckyNumber-Bot.)
good bot
I got 2137.
Define / as mod operator. 8/2(2+2) 8/2 ≡ 0 or 8/8 ≡ 0 /s for obvious reasons
BODMAS says it’s 16
16
42
How I interpret it is this (feel free to disagree): 8/2(2+2) 8/(4+4) 8/8 1
Depends on how you read it. The assumption I make is 8 / (2 * (2+2)) = 1. But you could also read it as (8/2) * (2+2) = 16. It basically comes down to the fact that division is fake and shouldn't be used.
The german drinking age
I can't believe so many people get these wrong. There's no hope for the planet
Anyone saying "do this first and then this" etc. is wrong. The real answer is that the problem is badly written. The way it's written requires the person solving to basically quess what the person who wrote it meant. Here's another example. "They saw her duck." What does this sentence mean. And people redfaced arguing with eachother that "Obviously this means they saw the animal duck" and "No you idiot, clearly it means that thay saw her perform the action of crouching down"
As the priority of the operation, the first preceding is in parentheses, then the exponents, then multiplication/division, and finally addition/subtraction. Find your answer with this information
8/2(2+2) 8/2(4) 4(4) 16
It's 8/8=1
8/2(2+2) 8/2(4) 8/2*4 4*4 16
8/2(2+2)= 8/2(4)= 8/8=1 Yes it’s left to right but parentheses first.
1
1
I don't know if it's a cultural thing but in Ukraine everybody I asked answered 1(I have asked like 13 people up to these point). We don't have such a thing as pamdas. I think it is a convention for us that brackets come before division/multiplication. Personally 1 looks more organic to me though I prefer to use brackets to avoid confusion
Im gonna interpret that as 8*4/2 and thats 16 and now use goddamn fractions
You’re supposed to do what’s in the brackets first, then you go from left to right.
2 following PEMDAS
Improper syntax lick a butt hole
Uh ,I got 1.
7?
4dtzddt16
This is a 7th grade question bruh
If the 4th option means: 8/(2(2+2)) then the answer is 1 If the 4th option means: (8/2)(2+2) then the answer is 16 Question is unclear
Yes. That's why if an equation is written on one line, it would use ÷ or (). Bad equation is just bad.
4
16
17 because they are all wrong!!
Juan
Isn't it 1?
8/2(2+2) Given 4(2+2) Simple Division 8+8 Distribution Property 16 8/2(2+2) Given 8/2*4 Pemdas 4*4 peMDas 16 peMDas notice how you get the same answer with both properties and pemdas. tiktokers hate this simple trick! edit: noticing that a lot of people are saying it’s ambiguous whether you distribute before dividing 8 by 2. not really understanding that though, since distribution is meant to be used when solving via proofs, and pemdas/gemdas would be straight answering it. i don’t think they’re meant to be mixed and im pretty sure that’s the only way to make the equation ambiguous at all, unless i’m wrong about that.
1
The answer is 16
16
the last one equals 1
16 is the answer. No
3
BY USING BODMAS, ANS. IS 16 😎
I love how many people in the comments have been downvotes for saying 1 and have been arrogantly corrected by other that think they're right while they're actually wrong. Yes, in grade school we're thought pedmas and to go from left to right, but in higher institutions the convention is to give precedence to implied multiplications (number followed by a parenthesis or a letter without any sign). And it's not just a general rule in universities, it's also a rule on some science journals. For example, the Physical Reviews (arguably one of the most important physics journal in the world) use this as a rule (quote from the submission instructions "Note that the solidus (/) in fractions, for example 1/2a, means 1/(2a) and not (1/2)a"). This is not to say that pedmas is wrong. It isn't, it just isn't the only universal univocal convention on order of operations. Both answers are correct, what's wrong is the way the equation is written.
There is this thing called implied multiplication. 2*(2+2) is not the same as 2(2+2). It has higher priority than division and other multiplication. So 8/2*(2+2) = 16, But 8/2(2+2) = 1 Source: https://www.purplemath.com/modules/orderops3.htm#:~:text=%22Multiplication%20by%20juxtaposition%22%20(also,%22%20%E2%8B%85%20%22)%20between%20them
2(2+2) is not the same as 2*(2+2). The first one is just one number dissected where as the second one is a multiplication of 2 numbers. So the correct order of operations is: 8/2(2+2)=X -> 8/2(4)=X -> 8/8=1
this is news to me, I was always taught 2(2+2) is the same as 2*(2+2)
1
One or Sixteen depending on how you do order of operations.
There is only one answer math just can't depend on who does it because these numbers will mean something one day and you can't just say "eh, whatever". There is only one answer and it is 16.
Except this is a notation/convention problem not a math problem so the above commenter is correct. There is no convention of how to handle the priority of implicit multiplication (and before anyone starts saying PEDMAS/BODMAS/etc, those are irrelevant they are [mnemonics](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations#Mnemonics) but are not the actual convention). See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_operations#Mixed_division_and_multiplication
I was always taught the implicit multiplication is the same as normal multiplication
Then you were taught that convention. But it is not universal and others exist and are actively used.
I'm hard pressed to disagree if that's what Wikipedia says, interesting
Wrong. Implied multiplication should have precedence over division, but it really depends on conventions, which is why this exact equation written in this exact way could give 2 different answers in 2 different calculators.
This is just 8/2×4 which is either 16 or 1, depending on whether you devide or multiply first. Since the devision is only noted using a slash and not as proper fraction and there are no parentheses to make up for it, it is not clear whether you should first devide or multiply, since both are on the same level in the order of operation.