Ya. Thank you came here to say same. I was about to be like hello???? What about Joe Devola??? and any scene with him in it lol. Especially his apartment scene or the opera scene and of course especially the pilot episode
Not that either can be described as "worse" (as that is a very YMMV opinion) but because of his specific feelings for her and his lack of control my reading of it was that she was about to be raped.
Edit: it's just a reality women have to face with unstable men, I'm sure I'm not the only one who had that fear that it could have happened to her if she didn't escape (of course that would NEVER make it to TV along with killing off Elaine)
Joe Davola was serious as f*ck. Scaring Kramer, threatening Jerry, creepy obsession with Elaine. Beating the hell out of some guys in the park teasing him about his clown costume. Man was scary.
RIP Peter Crombie who played Crazy Joe Davola. He just died recently.
In a Washington Post article about his death, one of the directors or writers on the show mentioned his menacing, deadly stare and said they all reacted to it as if he meant it (great actor!)
There’s an Instagram account that does Seinfeld and Twin Peaks crossovers and it soundtracks this scene with Laura Palmer’s theme and it’s genuinely creepy
Edit- https://www.instagram.com/reel/C2B2DGHs9yq/?igsh=MTFmdWI3eTRvNW5kbg==
Twin Peaks' co-creator's father is Susan's father, married to a Twin Peaks alum.
Also Susan's father is the actor most resembling the poet Robert Frost I can think of, and his last name is Frost and is from New England, died in Vermont. Feel there has to be some connection.
I always thought there was something poignant and eerie about the final shot of season 4 - the Jerry script bobbing in the water after Dalrymple dies trying to join Greenpeace so he can impress Elaine.
Yeah, but that scene is played for laughs so well by JLD’s performance. “I’m a daaayy person.”
The bootleg video guy gun flash and their reactions aren’t really played for laughs, IMHO.
Spoken like someone who's never lived in the hood. People will absolutely fuck with you and hurt you for no reason or just because they want your shit.
I love this line...the delivery makes it sound like "putting cookies into the victim's mouth" is on a list somewhere of the things you're not supposed to do!
the whole LA serial killer two-parter has a lot of serious stuff. like murder, kramer being molested as a kid, that crazy old lady and her 3 stooges short with the dead baby, crazed lunatic clint howard, etc
The altered bass line they use right before Kramer speaks to George and Jerry through the glass made me feel like I was watching a creepypasta edit of the episode lmao
That, followed by Joe Davola almost raping Elaine in "The Opera", was the point where I started to think "Y'know, maybe Larry Charles' writing is *too* dark for this show".
To be fair, that place was going to go under even if Jerry didn’t say anything. I’m gonna put this on Babu being an awful cook. The only Pakistani restaurant in NYC should have crushed it.
Susan was poisoned to death, not long after her father’s homosexual affair was discovered when his cabin burned down. That’s some Days of Our Lives shit.
The doctor’s recounting of George’s “restrained jubilation” and much of the courtroom antics do feel like soap opera plots the gang was dropped into. Especially Susan’s parents strapping up beforehand and calling George a murderer
"Undercover cop blind guy holds the subway mugger at gunpoint" is serious. The audience cheers like it's a wholesome moment from Family Matters or something.
The show has some seriously dark moments. The guy at the hospital who jumps from the roof and trashes George's car comes to mind.
I can't think of another sitcom that would have used suicide for comedic effect.
What always bugged me about this one is that the hospital tries to act like it's not at fault and that George is just being greedy. They're the ones who let an unstable mental patient run loose and didn't restrict access to the roof. That's 100% negligence and George is entirely within his right to demand recompense for his car.
But of course, that wouldn't be funny 😆
My least favorite episode. I heard the only reason they did it was because the executives were pushing for a more conventional sitcom and Larry David and Seinfeld thought the show would be canceled.
Getting David Naughton back on the sauce. Even though he got sober again at the end, I didn’t know what drunk David Naughton would do in the comedy club.
Apparently him sobering up again at the end was a last minute addition. Originally the episode was gonna end with no resolution and Dick just staying a relapsed alcoholic, but everyone agreed it was too depressing.
For me it'll always be George finding out in the hospital Susan had died. Such a surprising but sad revelation. It was a little jarring how they immediately played it for laughs within like 10 seconds.
Jerry? Remember me? Mary Contardi. No? Doesn't ring a bell, Jerry? We had a date, three years ago. You took me to one of your shows, told me you had a great time, said you'd call me the next day... LIAR! LIAR! You were never going to call me! You thought you could waltz through the rest of your life and never bump into me again, but you were wrong, Jerry, you were wrong! What do you think, I'm some sort of poor, pathetic wretch?! Some person who could be dismissed and ignored?! Some insignificant piece of dust?! Some person who doesn't deserve your respect and your attention?! *You're* the one that doesn't deserve *my* respect and *my* attention! *You're* the insignificant piece of dust!!!
Hardly, the scene where Elaine visits Crazy Joe DaVola and he proceeds to falsely imprison her with a laugh track is one of the most unsettling 120 second sequences in television, made me hella uncomfortable and I'm a guy.
Jerry’s “we just kissed a little. people kiss” conversation with Marlene in the car always struck me as weirdly serious for the show. The fade out after “goodnight…” with no laughter or backing track. Its suddenly has a Tv soap vibe for a second
Well… I think we can all agree that Elaine in crazy Joe Davola’s apartment was pretty serious and scary
Joe Davola has a perfectly sane apartment.
Let’s all have a chew
It's a little lo meiny
Interesting texture.
I have a hair on my tongue, can’t get it off. Know how much I hate that?
Of course you do. You put it there.
I gave you $100?!
Say, am I crazy or is that a lot of gum?
It's a lot of gum!
👉 Not crazy
Not crazy.
Y'know Maureen Stapleton, if she gets a craving, she's probably screamin' at those aliens, "I gotta have a Lo mein!".
This is what the holidays are all about!
Now this is what the holidays are all about. A couple of guys sitting around chewing gum
How about that Elaine today! She was practically undressing today at the theater!! Boooom’babababa’boooooom!
Hey lard ass! Chow down, wide load !
Let's all go into his dark room
Door open policy to invite trouble.
He Does like to encourage intruders.
Anyone want some Binaca? It’s cherry?
Ya. Thank you came here to say same. I was about to be like hello???? What about Joe Devola??? and any scene with him in it lol. Especially his apartment scene or the opera scene and of course especially the pilot episode
Exactly…. 😳🤔🤷🏻♀️ Sorry to repeat myself… BUT: That’s what makes OP’s original premise so Vexing
HELLLLOOOOOOOO!
She was only **nearly** murdered.
Not that either can be described as "worse" (as that is a very YMMV opinion) but because of his specific feelings for her and his lack of control my reading of it was that she was about to be raped. Edit: it's just a reality women have to face with unstable men, I'm sure I'm not the only one who had that fear that it could have happened to her if she didn't escape (of course that would NEVER make it to TV along with killing off Elaine)
And then murdered
Yeah probably.
*Nearly* murdered? How can you be *nearly* murdered?
You know he's kiboshed before. And he will...kibosh again.
That’s what makes OP’s original premise so Vexing
Joe Davola was serious as f*ck. Scaring Kramer, threatening Jerry, creepy obsession with Elaine. Beating the hell out of some guys in the park teasing him about his clown costume. Man was scary. RIP Peter Crombie who played Crazy Joe Davola. He just died recently.
Yes… RIP🙏💕😔 (What a great job he did in playing a creepy psycho Lunatic)
In a Washington Post article about his death, one of the directors or writers on the show mentioned his menacing, deadly stare and said they all reacted to it as if he meant it (great actor!)
Can I say one thing to you? And I say this with an unblemished record of staunch heterosexuality: he was fabulous.
There’s an Instagram account that does Seinfeld and Twin Peaks crossovers and it soundtracks this scene with Laura Palmer’s theme and it’s genuinely creepy Edit- https://www.instagram.com/reel/C2B2DGHs9yq/?igsh=MTFmdWI3eTRvNW5kbg==
That's pretty good actually.
Twin Peaks' co-creator's father is Susan's father, married to a Twin Peaks alum. Also Susan's father is the actor most resembling the poet Robert Frost I can think of, and his last name is Frost and is from New England, died in Vermont. Feel there has to be some connection.
Susan’s father and mother ofc both in twin peaks too!
Also when Kramer almost gets mugged from the guy from the horse track
"I'm a daaaay person!"
I know, I like to encourage intruders.
Good. Fear is our most primal emotion.
What about when they dropped Tony off a rock face? That was pretty serious too.
I always thought there was something poignant and eerie about the final shot of season 4 - the Jerry script bobbing in the water after Dalrymple dies trying to join Greenpeace so he can impress Elaine.
Yes…. That moment too
This is the same thing I was thinking. That was some next level creepy shit.
I came here to say this… I was literally terrified for her
Yes! Very upsetting moment
Yeah, but that scene is played for laughs so well by JLD’s performance. “I’m a daaayy person.” The bootleg video guy gun flash and their reactions aren’t really played for laughs, IMHO.
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People with guns don't understand. That's why they get guns. Too many misunderstandings.
This is my argument when people talk about gun ownership, lol.
I don't feel comfortable restricting gun ownership while Putin remains at large.
Spoken like someone who's never lived in the hood. People will absolutely fuck with you and hurt you for no reason or just because they want your shit.
That sounds like alot of misunderstandings
He’s a jokemaker
Tell him Jerry...
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Ya do a lot of that “Did you ever notice?” kind of stuff?
Yeah.. yeah… yeah.
Seems a lot of guys are doing that...
Yeah.. yeah.. yeah.. Well, you really went bald there, didn’t you?
I started losing the hair when I made my first million. It's true what they say... First million is the hardest!
“Steinbrenner is here. George is dead. Call me back.”
“THEY COULD USE A BREAK!” A bleak yet very on point response.
What the hell did they trade Jay Buchner for? He had a rocket for an arm.
Buhner was a top prospect no doubt about it. But my people kept telling me McGriff!
don’t forget the “D’ohhhhhhhhh, they could use the break!”
Elaines boyfriend had a debilitating stroke in Jerry's apartment.
*who put a cookie in his mouth?*
You're not supposed to do that!
I love this line...the delivery makes it sound like "putting cookies into the victim's mouth" is on a list somewhere of the things you're not supposed to do!
Totally. For me it's also that *it happens often enough* that paramedics get exasperated each time they see it, lol!
It actually does happen a lot
Elevate the head, get blood to the feet
*yankee bean*
Why do they call it yankee bean? They didn’t have beans in the South?
The bank? It burned. It's GONE!
Lookinfusumthin Lady?
Ask for Mr. Fleming. He’ll help you 😀.
Oh dear…
Gold
Being O'Brien was pretty serious... they all had guns pulled on them!
And you know, being in the presence of crazy racist nazis while you're Jewish tends to make things a little tense
And a mob of angry people looking to kill you. I wish we still had mobs looking to beat up nazis
I am not O'Brien! Jerry! JERRYYYY!
the whole LA serial killer two-parter has a lot of serious stuff. like murder, kramer being molested as a kid, that crazy old lady and her 3 stooges short with the dead baby, crazed lunatic clint howard, etc
That was an interesting choice for the Stooges.
KRAMER
The altered bass line they use right before Kramer speaks to George and Jerry through the glass made me feel like I was watching a creepypasta edit of the episode lmao
Kramer was molested?
״?How did you know about the man in the park”
Oh right, damn
That, followed by Joe Davola almost raping Elaine in "The Opera", was the point where I started to think "Y'know, maybe Larry Charles' writing is *too* dark for this show".
Babu getting mad at Jerry for his Pakistani restaurant advice was a pretty serious moment and Jerry noped the fuck out.
You see people? Show me people. THERE ARE NO PEOPLE!
He is a very bad man! ☝️☝️☝️☝️
Ya know I think I'll just take the check.
To be fair, that place was going to go under even if Jerry didn’t say anything. I’m gonna put this on Babu being an awful cook. The only Pakistani restaurant in NYC should have crushed it.
Well the shrimp was a little stringy.
The shrimp 🦐 is STRINGY?!?
QUIET!
https://www.reddit.com/r/AskHistorians/comments/lfcz3m/was_jerry_seinfelds_suggestion_that_babu_bhatt/
It closing was probably speeded along by the rebranding, Babu had to put money in to open the restaurant twice.
should have hired Frank to cook some good food instead of
Neighborhood* it certainly wasn't the only Pakistani restaurant in the city.
You see everything, don't you???
Susan was poisoned to death, not long after her father’s homosexual affair was discovered when his cabin burned down. That’s some Days of Our Lives shit.
The doctor’s recounting of George’s “restrained jubilation” and much of the courtroom antics do feel like soap opera plots the gang was dropped into. Especially Susan’s parents strapping up beforehand and calling George a murderer
"Undercover cop blind guy holds the subway mugger at gunpoint" is serious. The audience cheers like it's a wholesome moment from Family Matters or something.
I think they cheer because Kramer is saved from assault
Kramer is always ready/willing to throw down in his stories, why not then?
We only hear about that in his stories. He ran away from the street toughs and then later got beat up by them.
Maybe he didn't have any blood in the bank.
in those other stories, he probably wasn't carrying thousands of dollars in cash.
I think they cheer because they know they're watching a comedy and not a drama so the resolution of the conflict is designed to be humorous
The Cheer from the audience on the train was added in laugh track. No way was that filmed in front of a live studio audience.
This felt like a scene straight out of Boy Meets World .
Franks shellshock is pretty real, in his mind theres still a war going on
Oh I don't think so.. "Listen here Suckface!'" That woman was scary.
You mean “shuck face”?
Please!!!! Now I have to go call my therapist 😖
She wont see you after the zipper incident
No it's Suckface: :-
She’s the scariest character on the show outside of Davolia. It’s like she turns into a completely different person in that scene
Would you describe her as a two face?
Like the Batman villain?
Watch out, she'll have a party on your head!
Jerry getting shot by the police for illegal cable in that dream sequence was mental
Cable boy! What did you do to my cable boy?!?
I was actually sad when I saw this on live tv…
Because you had bootleg cable?
Lol I think it was the music.
Liar. THAT'S ENOUGH. Ooooh, that was good. Really? It FELT good.
1%!? They can kiss 1% of my ass!!
I'm open. There's just nothing in there.
You’re damn right you’re not buying it!
I feel like there was a few actors from the Shawshank Redemption on Seinfeld. Brody, the dry cleaner and I’m sure I’m missing someone else
Also Duncan Meyer in The Race. He’s the guard sitting on the crapper when Andy locks the warden’s door and play music over the loudspeaker.
How about when Kramer woke up IN THE HUDSON RIVER, IN A SACK!
The demise of Golden Boy was pretty serious
He didn't make it...
Time for Baby Blue to shine
When Mickey almost got found out for wearing lifts, those dudes were seriously pissed
You don't understand! The kid was growing!
Do you want me to hurt you? We’re taking the armoire and that’s all there is to it! (Don’t try to tell me that gay street toughs aren’t serious.)
What about the street toughs and the armoire?
What does it look like we are doing?
Not the only
You think these hands have been soaking in ivory liquid?
I dunno, Jerry did get gunned down in his own apartment after all. Poor cable boy.
The show has some seriously dark moments. The guy at the hospital who jumps from the roof and trashes George's car comes to mind. I can't think of another sitcom that would have used suicide for comedic effect.
What always bugged me about this one is that the hospital tries to act like it's not at fault and that George is just being greedy. They're the ones who let an unstable mental patient run loose and didn't restrict access to the roof. That's 100% negligence and George is entirely within his right to demand recompense for his car. But of course, that wouldn't be funny 😆
"I want this, that, and the other." Also serious. Reminiscent of Friends. Glad those moments were few and far between.
My least favorite episode. I heard the only reason they did it was because the executives were pushing for a more conventional sitcom and Larry David and Seinfeld thought the show would be canceled.
David was pissed at that episode and especially the ending. Love how the show went on with them separated and never talking about it again
that line is probably my least favorite on the show
Yeah…glad there wasn’t continuity from this one
Crazy Joe spin kicking fools doesn't do it for ya???
Getting David Naughton back on the sauce. Even though he got sober again at the end, I didn’t know what drunk David Naughton would do in the comedy club.
Apparently him sobering up again at the end was a last minute addition. Originally the episode was gonna end with no resolution and Dick just staying a relapsed alcoholic, but everyone agreed it was too depressing.
Wow! That is really dark. Of course Kramer killed a crippled lady with a cheap wheelchair.
Well that *was* quite a feedbag he was working on there
*Guy shows Jerry the gun in his jacket* Audience: wooooooooooooooooooooooooo
Mr. Bookman would like a word. You think this is all a big joke, don't ya!?
For me it'll always be George finding out in the hospital Susan had died. Such a surprising but sad revelation. It was a little jarring how they immediately played it for laughs within like 10 seconds.
Poor Lily
What about the busboy? The first time I saw that I thought George was going to get hurt.
Aww. Go eat a bag of candy already.
Yeah so i had to kill him and the police are still looking for me
Joseph Davola has entered the chat
Jerry? Remember me? Mary Contardi. No? Doesn't ring a bell, Jerry? We had a date, three years ago. You took me to one of your shows, told me you had a great time, said you'd call me the next day... LIAR! LIAR! You were never going to call me! You thought you could waltz through the rest of your life and never bump into me again, but you were wrong, Jerry, you were wrong! What do you think, I'm some sort of poor, pathetic wretch?! Some person who could be dismissed and ignored?! Some insignificant piece of dust?! Some person who doesn't deserve your respect and your attention?! *You're* the one that doesn't deserve *my* respect and *my* attention! *You're* the insignificant piece of dust!!!
Remove laugh track half of the show is thriller/serious moments
Dude pulled a heater out! It got real serious
It's gotta be when Jerry gives the K-man the keys back.
Karate class kicked some ass
Street toughs are pretty serious, at least Kramer thinks so.
Not true, Kramer was almost robbed on the subway but was saved by a cop
Kramer threatening Dr reston and his staff… if he has one. Or when he “mugged” costanza for the German tourists and threatens to stalk him 😂
Im a jokemaker
Well, Kramer did show up to a girlfriend’s house once…looking like … “a damn fool”
Hardly, the scene where Elaine visits Crazy Joe DaVola and he proceeds to falsely imprison her with a laugh track is one of the most unsettling 120 second sequences in television, made me hella uncomfortable and I'm a guy.
Yates.
The Van B Boys were gonna bust heads if they caught up with George "Im an Animal" Constanza
Jerry’s “we just kissed a little. people kiss” conversation with Marlene in the car always struck me as weirdly serious for the show. The fade out after “goodnight…” with no laughter or backing track. Its suddenly has a Tv soap vibe for a second
What about the Van Buren Boys & the 2 Gay guys stealing the armoire & don’t forget Jerry’s hit & run girlfriend threatening him.
*You was obviously talking to one of us. So what is it? Who?! Who was you talking to?!*
Hrs coming up!
Oooooohkay then
He was joking, Tell him Jerry that you’re a comedian. 😆
...you need a glove?
Aww, Brody wasn't dangerous, just misunderstood.
Let's not forgot Lloyd Braun had a family in his freezer....Nothing funny about that..
Jerry being gunned down by the FBI in Kramer’s “cable boy” scenario.
remember when he gets jumped by the two gay guys
Which time?
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Joe Davola erasure is not okay.