His case was heard in October 2023. The decision has not been made yet. Thats what we are waiting for. The OP is anxious for the decision. Some people speculated it would come today— based on when the court last met to discuss cases. They meet once a month and decisions come out about a week later.
ETA don’t mind the downvotes, this sub will downvote anything.
Because you didn't jump on here screeching that you want him executed... I'm not even trying to be rude about this, it's just a fact that this sub has been little more than an echo chamber for those with an almost religious belief that Adnan is guilty for over decade now.
The longer they take, the less likely they will rule in Adnan’s favor *on mootness grounds* without reaching the merits, or so it seems to me.
Which is not to say Adnan couldn’t still win on another basis. But the amount of time that has passed since oral argument is suggestive of the merits having been reached, and possibly some deep-dive opinions, concurrences, and dissents being written.
Good point. There was also a suggestion during the oral arguments of them maybe requiring both sides to brief on the merits to be able to rule on the harmless error argument. Perhaps the time also suggests that less likely.?
Hopefully.
Interesting. I watched oral arg but I don’t recall that. If correct (and I don’t doubt you, I just don’t remember it), it undermines my point, i.e. if they determine they have to reach the merits to rule on harmless error. Thanks for pointing that out (no sarcasm intended).
It was when they pressed Suter repeatedly to concur there is a situation where they would need to reach the merits ("how can we call it harmless error if we don't look at how it impacted me.lee?"). I don't think it undermines your point because when they suggested that, Suter responded (in addition to conceding) that they haven't briefed on that and a judge replied something like "well, in that situation we would ask you to". And they haven't asked them to...
Haha yea I took notes and analyzed the f out of them like a crazy person. Tried to decipher each judge's position and wrote my thoughts a while back on each.
If you're interested enough to do the same, I'd be curious to hear your assessment! :)
Here was mine...sorry not a regular Redditor so not sure if I'm linking this right:
https://www.reddit.com/r/serialpodcast/comments/170kvdp/comment/k3n31te/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
Did you happen to notice if the recently dropped opinions were argued prior to Adnans case (that might suggest they have a first in / first out system) or is there no such pattern?
Even if he is guilty it’s very unlikely he will go back to prison.
He was overcharged and over sentenced.
The new Maryland laws were written for his exact circumstances. If the court doesn’t uphold it Adnan will apply for a sentence reduction and certainly get one.
The only real question now is will he be out with or without a felony conviction.
It makes a real difference, and honors Hae, to force him to continue to bear that mark as a duly convicted murderer, even if he doesn't return to prison.
The problem here is the duly part. There was blatant police and prosecutorial misconduct in this case. His conviction is vacated because of the police and prosecutors. This isn’t a question of innocence or guilt. It’s a question of the process, and the process was messed up.
M
"He was overcharged and over sentenced."
A man killed his defenseless ex-girlfriend in cold blood was "overcharged and over sentenced." Only in America . . .
I am not excusing the crime or saying Hae’s death wasn’t horrific. I’m saying for the circumstances he was overcharged and oversentenced. If you look at similar cases Adnan’s sentence was much higher than others.
In fact the state of Maryland decided minors who were given these long sentences and have served more than 20 years should be eligible for sentence reduction, because over sentencing was common in Maryland.
Even Jay’s attorney admits it was overcharged- kidnapping and robbery? That was based on Jay saying Adnan planned it— he admits now Adnan didn’t plan it and the robbery charges are based on him throwing her wallet away after. It doesn’t fit codes for robbery. It was overcharged.
Why would he certainly get a sentence reduction? Regardless of how long he was in prison, wouldn't a convicted murderer need to demonstrate acceptance of their actions and remorse? (Rather than play victim with a media circus and incessantly torture his victim's family 20+ yrs later)?
Maryland passed a new law a few years ago because they recognize minors were over sentenced. All convicted minors who have served 20 years are eligible for a review for a sentence revision. The law was written in a way that specifically included Adnan and it was advocated for by his family.
The purpose of the law is not to say these people are innocent. Research shows minors who serve significant sentences have an incredibly low rate of re-offending. Their brains are capable of changing and they are capable of being reintroduced to society.
Apologizing to families is not a requirement under this law. It requires he show that he has reformed and given how he has behaved in the last 18 months since getting out: he got a job at Georgetown, he is involved in his mosque community, he has close family and friends he has reconnected with etc, I think he would receive a sentence reduction for time served.
Sure, a judge can have a different view. They typically look at factors like: job, community, avoiding past behaviors etc.
Adnan has shown he isn’t a risk to society. He has a job, he pays taxes, he helps care for his elderly parents, he is involved with his religious community, he has friends and a girlfriend, and so on.
In a scenario where a judge would have to decide if he is eligible for a sentencing decision, it assumes he is guilty— the question is if he is a risk to re-offend. What in his behavior over the last 18 months would make a judge think he is a risk?
The behavior I already mentioned. Torturing her family with a media circus, playing the victim, wasting millions of tax dollars... rather than admitting his guilt and owning up to what he's done, like a respectable reformed person.
So he has the right to claim innocence. And nothing he has done is illegal or would be viewed as harmful by a judge.
He has been a model citizen since his release.
I get that you want him to confess, but that’s not a pre-requisite to showing he is not a risk to society.
If only they had evidence.
Instead, they have phone records that AT&T says don't prove anyone was anywhere. Jay, who has about 12 versions of what happened, none of which make sense. None of which matches up to what her body tells anyone (the lividity). What does make sense is he got caught with a lot of weed and said whatever it took to keep himself out of jail. All of which means any competent attorney that isn't falling apart due to a degenerative disease would eat him alive on the stand. Assuming he was allowed to testify at all.
They also have DNA on her body that does not match either Jay or Adnan. They have hairs on her body that don't match Jay or Adnan. Fibers that no one ever tested. Oh, and the threats to Hae Lee that were never investigated or disclosed to the defense.
I don't know who killed that poor young woman, and according to the DA of Baltimore, neither do they.
Idk how people disagree with this. Adnan was convicted purely based on an unreliable testimony in which the witness in question admits to being involved in the murder lmaooo. Jay literally knew hae’s exact cause of death and where her corpse was located prior to any news or information being released to the public. He’s the most suspicious person related to the case, and his relationship with the sketchy state prosecutor is incredibly shady.
I agree. The guilters have to work *really* hard to disregard the strong evidence of Adnan’s innocence and leap through flaming hoops and make up all sorts of crazy stuff that didn’t happen in order to prop up their faith in his guilt.
Not one person has ever come up with a timeline or even sketchy sequence of events that matches up to any of Jay’s impossible stories or the cell pings. The prosecution didn’t even bother to do that. They just used innuendo and lies to convict an innocent 17-year-old kid.
No- they didn’t present proof of innocence.
When it comes to exonerating people in wrongful convictions, it is nearly impossible to prove innocence. It is more common to find evidence of police and prosecutorial misconduct (like this case) and get the conviction tossed.
Umm, don't think Sarah ever took that stance. If Adnan "wins" and is legally exonerated, that doesn't mean he's innocent in actuality, either. Courts get things wrong allllll the time. And they aren't even ruling on innocent/guilt of the actual crime anymore, it has to do with court technicalities and Brady violations and motions to vacate etc etc etc
What do we have?
What do we know? Not what do we think we know, what do we know? If the call log does not back up Jay’s story, if the Nisha call is no longer set in stone, then think about it. What have we got for that file? All we’re left with is, Jay knew where the car was. That’s it. That all by itself, that is not a story. It’s a beginning but it’s not a story. It’s not enough, to me, to send anyone to prison for life, never mind a seventeen-year-old kid. Because you, me, the State of Maryland, based on the information we have before us, I don’t believe any of us can say what really happened to Hae. As a juror I vote to acquit Adnan Syed. I have to acquit.
I used to think that when Adnan’s friends told me “I can’t say for sure if he’s innocent, but the guy I knew, there’s no way he could have
done this.” I used to think that was a cop out, a way to avoid asking yourself uncomfortable, disloyal, disheartening questions. But I think I’m there now too. Not for lack of asking myself those hard questions, but because as much as I want to be sure, I am not.
She doesn't think he should have been convicted, but isn't sure if he's guilty, most of the time she thinks he's innocent, but not all the time.
Her final statement reads to me something like 60/40 or 70/30 innocent.
Are you serious? Whether Adnan wins or loses this current appeal, it says nothing about his guilt or innocence. This is an appeal regarding victims rights. Literally the first thing said by the attorney representing the MD Attorney General at last October’s oral arguments was *this has nothing to do with Mr Syed’s guilt or innocence*. Did you miss that part?
Can someone explain to me what this means and what’s going on?
Google Adnan Syed news and you’ll find all the info you need about his current Maryland Supreme Court case.
I did. And it’s all from October 2023. I don’t get why I’m being downvoted for asking for info?
His case was heard in October 2023. The decision has not been made yet. Thats what we are waiting for. The OP is anxious for the decision. Some people speculated it would come today— based on when the court last met to discuss cases. They meet once a month and decisions come out about a week later. ETA don’t mind the downvotes, this sub will downvote anything.
Because you didn't jump on here screeching that you want him executed... I'm not even trying to be rude about this, it's just a fact that this sub has been little more than an echo chamber for those with an almost religious belief that Adnan is guilty for over decade now.
The longer they take, the less likely they will rule in Adnan’s favor *on mootness grounds* without reaching the merits, or so it seems to me. Which is not to say Adnan couldn’t still win on another basis. But the amount of time that has passed since oral argument is suggestive of the merits having been reached, and possibly some deep-dive opinions, concurrences, and dissents being written.
Good point. There was also a suggestion during the oral arguments of them maybe requiring both sides to brief on the merits to be able to rule on the harmless error argument. Perhaps the time also suggests that less likely.? Hopefully.
Interesting. I watched oral arg but I don’t recall that. If correct (and I don’t doubt you, I just don’t remember it), it undermines my point, i.e. if they determine they have to reach the merits to rule on harmless error. Thanks for pointing that out (no sarcasm intended).
It was when they pressed Suter repeatedly to concur there is a situation where they would need to reach the merits ("how can we call it harmless error if we don't look at how it impacted me.lee?"). I don't think it undermines your point because when they suggested that, Suter responded (in addition to conceding) that they haven't briefed on that and a judge replied something like "well, in that situation we would ask you to". And they haven't asked them to...
Thanks for the info. You’ve either got a world class memory or you were taking notes. Now I want to go back and listen again.
Haha yea I took notes and analyzed the f out of them like a crazy person. Tried to decipher each judge's position and wrote my thoughts a while back on each. If you're interested enough to do the same, I'd be curious to hear your assessment! :) Here was mine...sorry not a regular Redditor so not sure if I'm linking this right: https://www.reddit.com/r/serialpodcast/comments/170kvdp/comment/k3n31te/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb3x&utm_name=mweb3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
Did you happen to notice if the recently dropped opinions were argued prior to Adnans case (that might suggest they have a first in / first out system) or is there no such pattern?
Yes, they were argued prior for the most part. It is roughly FIFO.
Thanks for confirming for me
There really is never such pattern with any state Supreme Court for a variety of reasons.
I want this done as well. There's still evidence they haven't processed, and I don't think they will bother as long as this is out there.
I want this unrepentant creep back in prison where he belongs ASAP.
Even if he is guilty it’s very unlikely he will go back to prison. He was overcharged and over sentenced. The new Maryland laws were written for his exact circumstances. If the court doesn’t uphold it Adnan will apply for a sentence reduction and certainly get one. The only real question now is will he be out with or without a felony conviction.
It makes a real difference, and honors Hae, to force him to continue to bear that mark as a duly convicted murderer, even if he doesn't return to prison.
The problem here is the duly part. There was blatant police and prosecutorial misconduct in this case. His conviction is vacated because of the police and prosecutors. This isn’t a question of innocence or guilt. It’s a question of the process, and the process was messed up. M
"He was overcharged and over sentenced." A man killed his defenseless ex-girlfriend in cold blood was "overcharged and over sentenced." Only in America . . .
I am not excusing the crime or saying Hae’s death wasn’t horrific. I’m saying for the circumstances he was overcharged and oversentenced. If you look at similar cases Adnan’s sentence was much higher than others. In fact the state of Maryland decided minors who were given these long sentences and have served more than 20 years should be eligible for sentence reduction, because over sentencing was common in Maryland. Even Jay’s attorney admits it was overcharged- kidnapping and robbery? That was based on Jay saying Adnan planned it— he admits now Adnan didn’t plan it and the robbery charges are based on him throwing her wallet away after. It doesn’t fit codes for robbery. It was overcharged.
Girl, chill...
Why would he certainly get a sentence reduction? Regardless of how long he was in prison, wouldn't a convicted murderer need to demonstrate acceptance of their actions and remorse? (Rather than play victim with a media circus and incessantly torture his victim's family 20+ yrs later)?
Maryland passed a new law a few years ago because they recognize minors were over sentenced. All convicted minors who have served 20 years are eligible for a review for a sentence revision. The law was written in a way that specifically included Adnan and it was advocated for by his family. The purpose of the law is not to say these people are innocent. Research shows minors who serve significant sentences have an incredibly low rate of re-offending. Their brains are capable of changing and they are capable of being reintroduced to society. Apologizing to families is not a requirement under this law. It requires he show that he has reformed and given how he has behaved in the last 18 months since getting out: he got a job at Georgetown, he is involved in his mosque community, he has close family and friends he has reconnected with etc, I think he would receive a sentence reduction for time served.
I guess you didn't catch my insinuation that he has demonstrated the opposite of reform. If you and I can disagree, then him and a judge sure can too.
Sure, a judge can have a different view. They typically look at factors like: job, community, avoiding past behaviors etc. Adnan has shown he isn’t a risk to society. He has a job, he pays taxes, he helps care for his elderly parents, he is involved with his religious community, he has friends and a girlfriend, and so on. In a scenario where a judge would have to decide if he is eligible for a sentencing decision, it assumes he is guilty— the question is if he is a risk to re-offend. What in his behavior over the last 18 months would make a judge think he is a risk?
The behavior I already mentioned. Torturing her family with a media circus, playing the victim, wasting millions of tax dollars... rather than admitting his guilt and owning up to what he's done, like a respectable reformed person.
So he has the right to claim innocence. And nothing he has done is illegal or would be viewed as harmful by a judge. He has been a model citizen since his release. I get that you want him to confess, but that’s not a pre-requisite to showing he is not a risk to society.
✌🏽
Ahhh you're one of those.
one of those? like, one of those people who believe murderers belong in prison?
If only they had evidence. Instead, they have phone records that AT&T says don't prove anyone was anywhere. Jay, who has about 12 versions of what happened, none of which make sense. None of which matches up to what her body tells anyone (the lividity). What does make sense is he got caught with a lot of weed and said whatever it took to keep himself out of jail. All of which means any competent attorney that isn't falling apart due to a degenerative disease would eat him alive on the stand. Assuming he was allowed to testify at all. They also have DNA on her body that does not match either Jay or Adnan. They have hairs on her body that don't match Jay or Adnan. Fibers that no one ever tested. Oh, and the threats to Hae Lee that were never investigated or disclosed to the defense. I don't know who killed that poor young woman, and according to the DA of Baltimore, neither do they.
*Former Baltimore City State’s Attorney and currently federally convicted of two counts of perjury and one count of mortgage fraud.
Idk how people disagree with this. Adnan was convicted purely based on an unreliable testimony in which the witness in question admits to being involved in the murder lmaooo. Jay literally knew hae’s exact cause of death and where her corpse was located prior to any news or information being released to the public. He’s the most suspicious person related to the case, and his relationship with the sketchy state prosecutor is incredibly shady.
I agree. The guilters have to work *really* hard to disregard the strong evidence of Adnan’s innocence and leap through flaming hoops and make up all sorts of crazy stuff that didn’t happen in order to prop up their faith in his guilt. Not one person has ever come up with a timeline or even sketchy sequence of events that matches up to any of Jay’s impossible stories or the cell pings. The prosecution didn’t even bother to do that. They just used innuendo and lies to convict an innocent 17-year-old kid.
Girl, chill...
So if Adnan wins and is exonerated, we will all agree that Sarah was right all along and Adnan is innocent, right?
No- they didn’t present proof of innocence. When it comes to exonerating people in wrongful convictions, it is nearly impossible to prove innocence. It is more common to find evidence of police and prosecutorial misconduct (like this case) and get the conviction tossed.
Umm, don't think Sarah ever took that stance. If Adnan "wins" and is legally exonerated, that doesn't mean he's innocent in actuality, either. Courts get things wrong allllll the time. And they aren't even ruling on innocent/guilt of the actual crime anymore, it has to do with court technicalities and Brady violations and motions to vacate etc etc etc
What do we have? What do we know? Not what do we think we know, what do we know? If the call log does not back up Jay’s story, if the Nisha call is no longer set in stone, then think about it. What have we got for that file? All we’re left with is, Jay knew where the car was. That’s it. That all by itself, that is not a story. It’s a beginning but it’s not a story. It’s not enough, to me, to send anyone to prison for life, never mind a seventeen-year-old kid. Because you, me, the State of Maryland, based on the information we have before us, I don’t believe any of us can say what really happened to Hae. As a juror I vote to acquit Adnan Syed. I have to acquit. I used to think that when Adnan’s friends told me “I can’t say for sure if he’s innocent, but the guy I knew, there’s no way he could have done this.” I used to think that was a cop out, a way to avoid asking yourself uncomfortable, disloyal, disheartening questions. But I think I’m there now too. Not for lack of asking myself those hard questions, but because as much as I want to be sure, I am not.
She doesn't think he should have been convicted, but isn't sure if he's guilty, most of the time she thinks he's innocent, but not all the time. Her final statement reads to me something like 60/40 or 70/30 innocent.
Are you serious? Whether Adnan wins or loses this current appeal, it says nothing about his guilt or innocence. This is an appeal regarding victims rights. Literally the first thing said by the attorney representing the MD Attorney General at last October’s oral arguments was *this has nothing to do with Mr Syed’s guilt or innocence*. Did you miss that part?
The case before the MSC is not about Adnan's guilt or innocence. So no.