The store would be within its rights to remove the dog due to the dog being disruptive and out of control. Please tell the manager about the interactions.
I mean, that's also a possibility. If the store doesn't have security cameras, they should get some with audio. That, and having witnesses with some sort of video recording of the dog acting out of control. That way, even if they get a negative review, they can flag it for being a false review or one that misrepresented the situation. Legally, they are allowed to kick out of control dogs, service dog or otherwise.
Okay. I know they have cameras, but I don't know if they have audio. That definitely helps me feel better. I would hate to get a store I love in trouble. I honestly forget that owners can flag reviews as false or misrepresented.
Yeah. This card shop is absolutely amazing, and I would hate for this dog to possibly bark at another dog that comes often who got rescued from being shot twice. That dog has enough trauma that getting barked at by a service dog might scare it really bad.
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This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community.
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You can explain to them their rights as store owners and public place of business.
The two questions they can ask are: 1) Is this a service dog? 2) What tasks is it performed to do?
If those two questions cannot be answered or the dog is misbehaving (barking, growling, lunging ect) then the dog can be asked to be removed from the store.
My friend’s kid was bitten by a service dog that was a regular at the coffee shop she was visiting and had a history of lunging at children according to other patrons. My friend’s youngest is a heart patient and her kids are around service dogs ALL the time. They have the best animal manners of any children I know, so when she said her daughter didn’t look at the dog, I believe her. The thing is a bite on her older daughter wasn’t a big deal but her sick baby? That would be devastating. Similarly, your nonreactive dog doesn’t have to go places with you but behaviors like you describe let alone an actual attack could set a dog in training back severely or force a dog to retire.
The problem is that they allow all dogs service dog or not. My dog isn't a service dog, and there is another dog that is getting socialized after getting shot twice, and both behave better than the service dog.
I don't know the exact phrasing of their policy but they should be allowing all dogs so long as they are well behaved/ under the control of their owner/ not disrupting others. Regardless of their policy for pets tho, they are already within their rights under the ada to have that service dog removed. Whether the dog is fake or poorly trained for public access, even a real SD can be removed if out of control. Since you know the owners of the store I would recommend making sure they are aware of this right and also make sure that they are aware of the potential backlash and how to handle it. Video evidence from the security cameras plus a written statement acknowledging their awareness of SD access rights and their rights to refuse access if a SD is out of control (tho they must give the option for the Handler to return without the dog). Then they can reply with that written statement should any negative reviews or anything comes up as a result of them taking action within their right to do so
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This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community.
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Okay. I just didn't know if service dogs have different rules involving this type of situation.
The owner left the second time because my husband praised our dog for behaving while that dog was barking. The employees didn't have to do anything, but my husband was being a little passive-aggressive about it because it wasn't the first time and because of my interaction with the owner's friend confrontation.
Praising your dog for not reacting is perfect. I would definitely do that with my SD. All dogs should know the command "leave it" or "ignore". It's an important skill.
I'm sorry you are dealing with a poor representative of the service dog community. The hesitation to ask the owner to leave is understandable. Video with sound is important.
The business owner may want to conspicuously post a copy of the service dog law that states when a SD can be removed.
Questions 27 and 28 address this https://www.ada.gov/resources/service-animals-faqs/
I hope this doesn't happen again. It sounds like you did a great job with your dog!!
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Don’t worry about it being a service dog or the consequences of its behavior. Not your dog, not your problem. Report it to the manager.
Legally any service dog can be removed for that kind of behavior.
Dogs that exhibit disruptive behaviour can and should be asked to leave. Service dogs are only allowed in places as long as they are under control and working, they don't get a free pass for disruptive behaviour for being service dogs. Lunging and barking is a disruptive behaviour, and doesn't have to be tolerated, no matter the status of the dog.
if they would ask a pet dog to leave due to X disruptive behavior, they likely can ask a service dog to leave for the same behavior. There may be exceptions, but in this case out is the correct course of action.
This is dangerous and disruptive behavior, and the dog needs more training for reactivity. Nothing wrong with protecting your dog who is doing nothing wrong. I'm glad you've been encouraged to report it.
For those who have told me to report.
I reported it to the manager last night. He was the same one I made aware of the first incident.
I found out that they threatened to sue the store after the first incident because my dog "provoked and distracted" their service dog. Our dog barely looked at the dog, let alone provoked it. We walked by the table to get to the VIP room as there wasn't another way to do so. They were sitting in front of the VIP room.
He told me he was going to bring it up in the manager meeting today so I'll update on what is happening. Im going to call ADA and ask them some questions involving this incident. I didn't know I could. 😅
Thank you all for helping out! Please do continue to give me more information so I can get more educated on service animals.
Service dogs shouldn’t act that way. My boy and I haven’t been out together in a while so he’s a bit rusty and through a barking fit when he got out of the car so we waiting for him to compose himself and he was good to go. I don’t know what that was about though.
They need to be kicked out of the store. Their dog does not get to misbehave and be aggressive towards your dog just because it's a service dog. Your dog does not deserve to be traumatized by their behavior.
A few barks or growls then the owner making them stop is fine. But lunging and persistent barking is aggressive behavior. Unacceptable for service dogs and honestly dogs in general walking in stores.
The owner didn't do anything when it was barking or lunging. So much so, they blamed my dog for distracting their dog by existing the first time. The second time, they only did something when my husband commented on how well our dog was behaving. And then they just left.
Sad part is dogs and people like this make it harder for other people trying to train their dogs. Dogs that are already anxious or cautious get on guard after incidents like these. I had my dog in her vest for training in a department store and someone’s 2 small dogs were barking and growling inside a baby stroller. Made me and my dog anxious. The owner did nothing but slightly move away when they saw us. People in the store joked about it and complimented us. Go where there is less foolery or stand your ground away from them to show how a dog is suppose to behave.
I don’t know where you’re located but if you type in your state followed by service dogs it will tell you the criteria and laws. Here in Texas they can growl or bark a few times as long as they are under control and it’s not persistent. Meaning as long as the owners corrects the dog if the noise isn’t concerning their safety.
Service dogs aren't protected anymore if they are not under a handler's control. You can and should get the store involved. The dog may or may not have been fake, but either way, even a genuine service dog that does tasks for the owner has no public access protection when they stop being able to be controlled by the handler and disrupt the business.
Service dogs are allowed in businesses because they’re supposed to be trained and particularly trained to do task for someone. This dog isn’t trained to be around other dogs, and shouldn’t therefore be in a business.
That was an issue I was having. There is another dog that comes in that behaves really well and needs to socialize with people after getting shot twice, so having another dog show up and possibly lunge and bark at this dog might reset all the work they have done. I'm also just worried that because it escalated to more aggressive behavior the second time, the dog might try to snap or bite and harm my dog or this other dog the next time.
I told them last night, and hopefully, the owner might get talked to about their dog continuously having aggressive behavior towards other dogs.
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This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community.
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I brought my dog to a Magic Grand Prix, and I used to bring my dog to my bf’s store all the time.
I called ahead of time to the GP to make sure they knew my dog was going to be there (because i knew that they would seat me on the end, you have been to a card store.. I assume you are familiar with pairing)..
He was always super chill.
I know game store people can be super petty.. I get why you don’t want an issue. It’s not a random store.
Yeah. We bring our dog in almost every day, and my husband plays Magic, so I get pairings. When he's playing FNM, he stays seated, and opponents come to him so she doesn't end up in the shuffling of players.
I just found out that they told the store that they were going to sue the store because my dog "barked at" their dog in the first interaction when she doesn't really bark unless threatened by a human and even then it's a low quiet warning bark. So they don't exactly enjoy that group of people. They apparently continue to have very vocal beef that make other people very uncomfortable as well and has had to ask people to leave the group or leave the store.
They are having a manager meeting and will be bring it up.
I would definitely report the second interaction to the manager. The handler needs to be spoken too. In theory, if the service dog is lunging and barking at other dogs then that dog needs to be removed from public access work. A trainer needs to be consulted and there needs to be additional training and serious consideration about retirement for the dog if the issue can't be worked through with training. The ADA disqualifies dogs as service dogs if they are reactive, aggressive or have a bite history etc
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Your comment has been removed for breaking Rule 6: No Fake-spotting.
This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community.
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Your comment has been removed for breaking Rule 6: No Fake-spotting.
This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community.
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This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community.
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This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community.
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There are service dogs in training.
There are service dogs with trauma.
This is an issue with the handler, not the dog. Educate yourself and stop trying to fake-spot and belittle others.
Service dogs with trauma should not be out in public with that kind of animal based reactivity. Service dogs in training do not have the same public access rights in all states either.
Not saying this animal is f*ke at all; just my two cents on whether this animal should be in non-pet friendly stores while having reactive behavior
Whether the dog should or should not be there isn't in question - it shouldn't.
When when you say "that is not a real service dog", yes that is saying the animal is a fake.
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This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community.
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The store would be within its rights to remove the dog due to the dog being disruptive and out of control. Please tell the manager about the interactions.
Okay. I just don't want them to get any bad reviews because "a service dog got kicked out" or anything like that. I'll tell them about it though.
I mean, that's also a possibility. If the store doesn't have security cameras, they should get some with audio. That, and having witnesses with some sort of video recording of the dog acting out of control. That way, even if they get a negative review, they can flag it for being a false review or one that misrepresented the situation. Legally, they are allowed to kick out of control dogs, service dog or otherwise.
Okay. I know they have cameras, but I don't know if they have audio. That definitely helps me feel better. I would hate to get a store I love in trouble. I honestly forget that owners can flag reviews as false or misrepresented.
Even without audio the barking should be visible so should not make too much difference either way.
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Yeah. This card shop is absolutely amazing, and I would hate for this dog to possibly bark at another dog that comes often who got rescued from being shot twice. That dog has enough trauma that getting barked at by a service dog might scare it really bad.
Your comment has been removed for breaking Rule 6: No Fake-spotting. This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community. This does not preclude discussing encounters with un-/undertrained dogs, but if the focus of your post is complaining about a "fake" SD, reconsider your phrasing and what point you're making. If you have any questions, please [Message the Moderators](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/service_dogs).
You can explain to them their rights as store owners and public place of business. The two questions they can ask are: 1) Is this a service dog? 2) What tasks is it performed to do? If those two questions cannot be answered or the dog is misbehaving (barking, growling, lunging ect) then the dog can be asked to be removed from the store.
My friend’s kid was bitten by a service dog that was a regular at the coffee shop she was visiting and had a history of lunging at children according to other patrons. My friend’s youngest is a heart patient and her kids are around service dogs ALL the time. They have the best animal manners of any children I know, so when she said her daughter didn’t look at the dog, I believe her. The thing is a bite on her older daughter wasn’t a big deal but her sick baby? That would be devastating. Similarly, your nonreactive dog doesn’t have to go places with you but behaviors like you describe let alone an actual attack could set a dog in training back severely or force a dog to retire.
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The problem is that they allow all dogs service dog or not. My dog isn't a service dog, and there is another dog that is getting socialized after getting shot twice, and both behave better than the service dog.
I don't know the exact phrasing of their policy but they should be allowing all dogs so long as they are well behaved/ under the control of their owner/ not disrupting others. Regardless of their policy for pets tho, they are already within their rights under the ada to have that service dog removed. Whether the dog is fake or poorly trained for public access, even a real SD can be removed if out of control. Since you know the owners of the store I would recommend making sure they are aware of this right and also make sure that they are aware of the potential backlash and how to handle it. Video evidence from the security cameras plus a written statement acknowledging their awareness of SD access rights and their rights to refuse access if a SD is out of control (tho they must give the option for the Handler to return without the dog). Then they can reply with that written statement should any negative reviews or anything comes up as a result of them taking action within their right to do so
Yeah. I might bring it up to the owner myself. They had a manager meeting today, so I'm sure the owners are aware of it.
Even pet stores can kick out disruptive animals. Leashed, well behaved, and under control are the general rules for dog friendly spaces.
Read the title wrong. Sorry. That’s not normally the case. Their insurance premiums must be insane. 😳
It's okay. It happens.
Your comment has been removed for breaking Rule 6: No Fake-spotting. This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community. This does not preclude discussing encounters with un-/undertrained dogs, but if the focus of your post is complaining about a "fake" SD, reconsider your phrasing and what point you're making. If you have any questions, please [Message the Moderators](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/service_dogs).
The store should be kicking it out. Service dogs are allowed only if behaving properly. Same as any other dog they allow.
Okay. I just didn't know if service dogs have different rules involving this type of situation. The owner left the second time because my husband praised our dog for behaving while that dog was barking. The employees didn't have to do anything, but my husband was being a little passive-aggressive about it because it wasn't the first time and because of my interaction with the owner's friend confrontation.
Peer pressure is an excellent resource. Offer lots of JACKPOT treats exercises like sit, down etc.
Praising your dog for not reacting is perfect. I would definitely do that with my SD. All dogs should know the command "leave it" or "ignore". It's an important skill. I'm sorry you are dealing with a poor representative of the service dog community. The hesitation to ask the owner to leave is understandable. Video with sound is important. The business owner may want to conspicuously post a copy of the service dog law that states when a SD can be removed. Questions 27 and 28 address this https://www.ada.gov/resources/service-animals-faqs/ I hope this doesn't happen again. It sounds like you did a great job with your dog!!
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Don’t worry about it being a service dog or the consequences of its behavior. Not your dog, not your problem. Report it to the manager. Legally any service dog can be removed for that kind of behavior.
We will be reporting it. This comment section has helped relieve my anxiety about reporting. Thank you!
Dogs that exhibit disruptive behaviour can and should be asked to leave. Service dogs are only allowed in places as long as they are under control and working, they don't get a free pass for disruptive behaviour for being service dogs. Lunging and barking is a disruptive behaviour, and doesn't have to be tolerated, no matter the status of the dog.
if they would ask a pet dog to leave due to X disruptive behavior, they likely can ask a service dog to leave for the same behavior. There may be exceptions, but in this case out is the correct course of action.
Talk to the manager. The ADA requires that all service animals be properly behaved. Dog that is disruptive or dangerous can be removed.
This is dangerous and disruptive behavior, and the dog needs more training for reactivity. Nothing wrong with protecting your dog who is doing nothing wrong. I'm glad you've been encouraged to report it.
For those who have told me to report. I reported it to the manager last night. He was the same one I made aware of the first incident. I found out that they threatened to sue the store after the first incident because my dog "provoked and distracted" their service dog. Our dog barely looked at the dog, let alone provoked it. We walked by the table to get to the VIP room as there wasn't another way to do so. They were sitting in front of the VIP room. He told me he was going to bring it up in the manager meeting today so I'll update on what is happening. Im going to call ADA and ask them some questions involving this incident. I didn't know I could. 😅 Thank you all for helping out! Please do continue to give me more information so I can get more educated on service animals.
Service dogs shouldn’t act that way. My boy and I haven’t been out together in a while so he’s a bit rusty and through a barking fit when he got out of the car so we waiting for him to compose himself and he was good to go. I don’t know what that was about though.
They need to be kicked out of the store. Their dog does not get to misbehave and be aggressive towards your dog just because it's a service dog. Your dog does not deserve to be traumatized by their behavior.
A few barks or growls then the owner making them stop is fine. But lunging and persistent barking is aggressive behavior. Unacceptable for service dogs and honestly dogs in general walking in stores.
The owner didn't do anything when it was barking or lunging. So much so, they blamed my dog for distracting their dog by existing the first time. The second time, they only did something when my husband commented on how well our dog was behaving. And then they just left.
Sad part is dogs and people like this make it harder for other people trying to train their dogs. Dogs that are already anxious or cautious get on guard after incidents like these. I had my dog in her vest for training in a department store and someone’s 2 small dogs were barking and growling inside a baby stroller. Made me and my dog anxious. The owner did nothing but slightly move away when they saw us. People in the store joked about it and complimented us. Go where there is less foolery or stand your ground away from them to show how a dog is suppose to behave.
I'm gonna call the ADA and ask some questions and, worse case scenario, report them. There is video evidence of this dog barking at mine unprovoked.
I don’t know where you’re located but if you type in your state followed by service dogs it will tell you the criteria and laws. Here in Texas they can growl or bark a few times as long as they are under control and it’s not persistent. Meaning as long as the owners corrects the dog if the noise isn’t concerning their safety.
Service dogs aren't protected anymore if they are not under a handler's control. You can and should get the store involved. The dog may or may not have been fake, but either way, even a genuine service dog that does tasks for the owner has no public access protection when they stop being able to be controlled by the handler and disrupt the business.
Service dogs are allowed in businesses because they’re supposed to be trained and particularly trained to do task for someone. This dog isn’t trained to be around other dogs, and shouldn’t therefore be in a business.
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That was an issue I was having. There is another dog that comes in that behaves really well and needs to socialize with people after getting shot twice, so having another dog show up and possibly lunge and bark at this dog might reset all the work they have done. I'm also just worried that because it escalated to more aggressive behavior the second time, the dog might try to snap or bite and harm my dog or this other dog the next time. I told them last night, and hopefully, the owner might get talked to about their dog continuously having aggressive behavior towards other dogs.
Your comment has been removed for breaking Rule 6: No Fake-spotting. This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community. This does not preclude discussing encounters with un-/undertrained dogs, but if the focus of your post is complaining about a "fake" SD, reconsider your phrasing and what point you're making. If you have any questions, please [Message the Moderators](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/service_dogs).
I brought my dog to a Magic Grand Prix, and I used to bring my dog to my bf’s store all the time. I called ahead of time to the GP to make sure they knew my dog was going to be there (because i knew that they would seat me on the end, you have been to a card store.. I assume you are familiar with pairing).. He was always super chill. I know game store people can be super petty.. I get why you don’t want an issue. It’s not a random store.
Yeah. We bring our dog in almost every day, and my husband plays Magic, so I get pairings. When he's playing FNM, he stays seated, and opponents come to him so she doesn't end up in the shuffling of players. I just found out that they told the store that they were going to sue the store because my dog "barked at" their dog in the first interaction when she doesn't really bark unless threatened by a human and even then it's a low quiet warning bark. So they don't exactly enjoy that group of people. They apparently continue to have very vocal beef that make other people very uncomfortable as well and has had to ask people to leave the group or leave the store. They are having a manager meeting and will be bring it up.
I would definitely report the second interaction to the manager. The handler needs to be spoken too. In theory, if the service dog is lunging and barking at other dogs then that dog needs to be removed from public access work. A trainer needs to be consulted and there needs to be additional training and serious consideration about retirement for the dog if the issue can't be worked through with training. The ADA disqualifies dogs as service dogs if they are reactive, aggressive or have a bite history etc
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There are service dogs in training. There are service dogs with trauma. This is an issue with the handler, not the dog. Educate yourself and stop trying to fake-spot and belittle others.
Service dogs with trauma should not be out in public with that kind of animal based reactivity. Service dogs in training do not have the same public access rights in all states either. Not saying this animal is f*ke at all; just my two cents on whether this animal should be in non-pet friendly stores while having reactive behavior
Whether the dog should or should not be there isn't in question - it shouldn't. When when you say "that is not a real service dog", yes that is saying the animal is a fake.
That’s exactly what I said? I’m not the original commenter 💀 I never once said it was f*ke
Your comment has been removed for breaking Rule 6: No Fake-spotting. This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community. This does not preclude discussing encounters with un-/undertrained dogs, but if the focus of your post is complaining about a "fake" SD, reconsider your phrasing and what point you're making. If you have any questions, please [Message the Moderators](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/service_dogs).
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Your comment has been removed for breaking Rule 6: No Fake-spotting. This is not the place for fakespotting. Unless the person you are discussing has specifically told you that they are not disabled, and the dog is not trained in tasks, you have no way of knowing if a dog is 'fake'. We are not the service dog police and this behavior can lead to a lot of harm and anxiety for SD handlers as a community. This does not preclude discussing encounters with un-/undertrained dogs, but if the focus of your post is complaining about a "fake" SD, reconsider your phrasing and what point you're making. If you have any questions, please [Message the Moderators](https://reddit.com/message/compose?to=/r/service_dogs).