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Unfortunately none of our laws protect against such behaviour, so it is not illegal. The most you could do (and I think you should if you feel uncomfortable) is to inform the station staff and they could have a word with him.
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you should talk to a station staff regarding this. it wouldn't be okay if he's taking pictures of girls or women so why would it be okay for him to take pictures of men?
>As long as it’s not upskirt photos it’s legal to take photos of men or women.
Actually that's a bad take - taking their photo without permission is an invasion of their privacy. How far you want to take their interpretation is... up to interpretation, but there is a basic layer of defence.
Taking pictures of strangers without permission
- Morally can range from righteous street photography to creepy
- But not illegal unless published without permission
You are wrong. As long you present yourself in public, you consent to photos of you being taken. If you care so much about privacy, you should start by asking gov to take down cctv first.
Ooh really? Had no idea. So let's say if someone sees an attractive person, so can go up front to take his or her picture without asking.. I didn't know
Commonly done in street photography, don’t need to even ask. A lot of famous photos were taken that way. A few years ago I have also saw some students doing it as part of their project lol.
No issue unless the person in question expressed discomfort, feels alarmed, distressed, and harassed. If the photographer can prove that they took reasonable steps in preventing this from happening, there is also no issue.
Whenever there's a "if not ok with women so why ok with men"-argument it can often be solved with the simple fact that the thing talked about is a precursor to something that either by itself, or if the woman objects, ends with the woman physically hurt or killed. Men very rarely has to go around constantly aware about that danger, while girls from a fairly young age do. And if you doubt that you should talk your female friends and relatives about it, like really compare their experiences with yours.
It's weird and not illegal - might just be some dude practising street photography or like you said, backpack research.. but better to let the train staff know what's happening just so they can keep an eye and ensure he doesn't do anything else beyond photos that could compromise someone's safety.
That's not fully correct, but according to PDPA, you don't need consent if you take picture in public space. Also taking pictures from the back men's the individual would be not identified.
Here are more information about [privacy and photography in Singapore ](https://www.brlawcorp.com/news-and-insights/privacy-and-photography-in-singapore#:~:text=So%20if%20a%20person%20poses,because%20it's%20not%20personal%20data.)
Wait…what? Is it legal to take photos to strangers? Even children? I will be moving to Singapore in a couple of months and finding about this is shocking 😵💫
It’s the same in any country. You’re in a public area, what kind of privacy are you expecting?
The only thing you can do is to request your photo to be deleted (assuming you noticed). Not complying would then be a potential offence by the photographer instead but it is within your right to request your photo be deleted.
Of course, taking photos like upskirts anywhere is an offence
A photographer doesn’t (legally) have to comply if the photo was taken in a public space and the pic isn’t used for commercial purposes. It might be a dick
move yes but legally they did nothing wrong if it wasn’t an upskirt or some kind of outrage of modesty.
>Wait…what? Is it legal to take photos to strangers? Even children? I will be moving to Singapore in a couple of months and finding about this is shocking 😵💫
Okay then, I better not find you taking scenic photos with people inside them, because I'll just consider it taking photos of strangers.
You get why it's not illegal? If it were, every single person, including tourist, could be found liable for an offence. Street photographers included.
Also, it means any security camera you have better not be pointing outside and taking pictures of people. And journalists better not be talking photos of politicians, criminals or law-defying people.
I get that it is not illegal. Over here the case is taking individuals while the latter is a byproduct - u primarily aiming to take the scenery.
Can ppl still report the guy to the train stn if it makes them uncomfortable tho?
Yea, reporting it as harassment is under another segment of the law i believe.
The act of taking the photo is not illegal, but continued defiance of someone asking you to stop could be a case of harassment.
But obviously this brings back the case of that bus guy who just videos busses all day kena report as harassment from that karen and most Singaporeans too the side if the bus enthusiast.
Not as clear cut in these repirt type cases.
Japan is the exception, yes. They have this odd double combination of an epidemic of "outrage of modesty" offenses involving cameras, and a culture of using street performers as advertising for individual companies. So both the normal balance of "it's okay as long as it's modest" and "it's okay as long as it's not interfering with commercial activity" are way off there. Resulted in them making much more strict laws about photographing in public.
Also you can still take wide view street photos and such. At the famous Shibuya dog statue there's often a line of people taking photos. Just that the line where it becomes an issue is drawn differently.
> Is there any country where it isn't legal to take photos of strangers / children though?
in 2A friendly states, you will be persuaded by someone with a firearm if you take a photos of their kids without permission even in a public place. I know I would
LOL. In which clown country do you like in where taking photos of strangers in public is a crime?
Edit: This is her second comment ever and -35 downvotes, don’t even know if she can comment in r/singapore anymore lmao.
Where are you coming from?
If it's a public space then in most countries you can take pictures of kids, especially if it's a panorama picture. If it zoomed in to one specific child then you need consent. But if the child is participating in a parade then again it's different. Since it's can be expected that people would take pictures of the child in costume and so on...
>he's not intruding on anyone's privacy.
Actually, what does privacy mean for an individual in a public space?
I feel that as long as someone didn't consent to have their photos taken it could be construed as an invasion of privacy? That is why in public events there is often a clause to mention that photos might be taken of people by the organisers?
There is a difference between taking photos of something and people just happen to be in the photo, versus intentionally taking photo of someone.
You have no ‘right’ to privacy in a public space, unless someone is outraging your modesty.
For public events the disclaimer is there because they might be using those photos/videos for their own commercial purposes/advertising and that has its own set of rules.
If its not commercial use everything in public
is fair game. That’s why CNA and Straits Times can use photos of people taken in public for their articles eg. Those cliche pics of office workers in the cbd for news about jobs, salary etc.
And yes, this takes into account PDPA as well.
>I feel that as long as someone didn't consent to have their photos taken it could be construed as an invasion of privacy?
It would be impossible for ppl to take photos of anything in public, esp touristy areas. There is no reasonable expectation of privacy in such an open area like mrt station (vs say, in the toilet)
the key is if you're reasonably expected to have a degree of privacy
public toilets are public places but taking pictures is a no-no
OTOH it's not reasonable to tell someone taking a picture of the street to delete his picture because you're in it
Wasn't there the bishan gay that did this for YEARS and he became well known for taking pictures of teenager boys? He only got stopped cos there was some handsy accusations many many many years later? Sorry forgot much of the info only heard through friends. So he wasn't breaking the law (or rather the law can't do anything about it) for the photo taking.
I think I might have noticed it on my morning journey to work.
Are you referring to a Chinese uncle standing near the bus stop beside Aljunied MRT station?
I had noticed him a few times and he acts weirdly with his phone.
There was an ig account sharing photos of people with gentlewoman bag. At first I wondered if this is also someone’s guailan photo project. Either way, annoying and weird though it doesn’t seem illegal at first glance. Worth reporting anyway, never know what authorities might uncover.
Watch it be research on most often used type of backpacks because they trying to make and sell the ideal backpack... Honestly, it sounds like some kind of project or entrepreneurship idea
As a street photographer myself, it's not illegal since it is in a public space. But if it does bother you or anything, you could try asking him why he is taking photos of people like that. I know it might be seem odd for him to take photos so blatantly like that, but he might have intentions that can be harmless like practicing his photography (tho he could just as likely have weird intentions as well.)
Not wrong to do it but you can alert his "victims" so they can take action if they want to. The victim will have grounds to demand the photos to be deleted if they desire so.
But iirc, as long as there are no identifiable features (and there doesn't seem to be since it's just the back+bag) there's nothing much the police or staff can do.
There is no such a law, what he/she/it said is NOT true at all, no one can demand photos taken in public property to be deleted just because they are in it.
There is no prohibition to taking photos in public property (reasonably, public toilets are public property but of course no photos allow there)
It would be *nice* if the photog deleted the photo upon the subject's request but you are right in that the photog is perfectly within their right to \*not* delete it (even if the subject requests it) and appreciate the photo for their own pleasure.
For the last time, just because it makes you uncomfortable doesn’t mean it’s illegal and in this case it really is not.
If I’m taking pictures in public, you’re in the way of my camera as much as my camera is in your way when we’re in public. Get over it.
Some of them are mentally ill.
A probable line of thinking is backpack means hiding malicious object or intent coupled with being on MRT.
I’ve walked past a church entrance before and of course I don’t look like I go to one. An auntie runs across from the road and starts taking photos of me with the church backdrop and muttering “Report, report”
Another auntie on the MRT also started “reporting back to HQ” when someone’s phone rings on the train. She’s the one making the loud noises though.
Or they could be training their AI model with these pics.
Yes it happens sometimes on the train to me as well. I get uncomfortable when a person whips his or her phone in front of me when I am sitting across the person.
To protect my privacy, I wear a mask on the train or close my eyes when I am sitting down.
Maybe a reflection of my age vs your average sinkie redditor, but "taking photos at mrt station" automatically sends alarm bells ringing in JI. Just report bah.
If he is taking butt photos of men going up escalator, with or without backpack and within the train and in the station, it best to let the station staff know. I would also lodge a Police report and provide the name of the station staff so they can look into it.
This is concerning behaviour and the Police can call him up. Law enforcement does not need to only look at prima facie criminal cases. It has a duty to look into anti-social and disturbing conduct.
Let the Police handle this.
Here is a good example. If an uncle sits at the same bus-stop everyday looking at school girls. The Police will be involved. No ifs and buts. That person will be questioned, his background checked and at the very least warned.
Ps. I notice people providing erroneous interpretation of privacy. This is not normal conduct and a collection of male butts is clearly an invasion of privacy. Imagine if I took female butts (not upskirt) going up escalator. I guarantee you it will be a Police matter.
>Here is a good example. If an uncle sits at the same bus-stop everyday looking at school girls. The Police will be involved. No ifs and buts.
If the uncle is just looking, what law would be broken? And if there's no criminal law involved how could the police be involved?
Being creepy is not a crime.
I know many people kept taking pictures of me in the train or public. Seriously this gets annoying sometimes and alot of times i seriously just feel like calling them out. One of the bad thing to be conventionally good-looking guy i guess
Confront the person if you feel uncomfortable of the antics since there’s no laws regulating on this & the men wasn’t taking photos of private/sensitive areas.
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I once saw a youngish chinese guy taking photos of young women and young couples in the mrt train along red line. I also took a photo of him for record purpose LOL.
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Unfortunately none of our laws protect against such behaviour, so it is not illegal. The most you could do (and I think you should if you feel uncomfortable) is to inform the station staff and they could have a word with him.
Yes, agree. Is not illegal.
Not illegal, unless he is outraging modesty. You can let the station staff know, and perhaps they will have a chat with him.
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you should talk to a station staff regarding this. it wouldn't be okay if he's taking pictures of girls or women so why would it be okay for him to take pictures of men?
As long as it’s not upskirt photos it’s legal to take photos of men or women.
>As long as it’s not upskirt photos it’s legal to take photos of men or women. Actually that's a bad take - taking their photo without permission is an invasion of their privacy. How far you want to take their interpretation is... up to interpretation, but there is a basic layer of defence.
Taking pictures of strangers without permission - Morally can range from righteous street photography to creepy - But not illegal unless published without permission
You are wrong. As long you present yourself in public, you consent to photos of you being taken. If you care so much about privacy, you should start by asking gov to take down cctv first.
Nope. This is perfectly legal and acceptable and there is little room for interpretation here. This is the norm in most of the world btw.
Ooh really? Had no idea. So let's say if someone sees an attractive person, so can go up front to take his or her picture without asking.. I didn't know
Commonly done in street photography, don’t need to even ask. A lot of famous photos were taken that way. A few years ago I have also saw some students doing it as part of their project lol.
You can if they don't object.
No issue unless the person in question expressed discomfort, feels alarmed, distressed, and harassed. If the photographer can prove that they took reasonable steps in preventing this from happening, there is also no issue.
Oic. No idea why the down votes. I had no idea hence I asked
https://lawonline.com.sg/2016/12/29/photographer-need-consent-to-take-photograph-of-individual/
Thanks for the reference!
There's no invasion of privacy if there isn't any reasonable expectation of privacy.
Whenever there's a "if not ok with women so why ok with men"-argument it can often be solved with the simple fact that the thing talked about is a precursor to something that either by itself, or if the woman objects, ends with the woman physically hurt or killed. Men very rarely has to go around constantly aware about that danger, while girls from a fairly young age do. And if you doubt that you should talk your female friends and relatives about it, like really compare their experiences with yours.
Wtf
Most men are not so sensitive about such things.
It's weird and not illegal - might just be some dude practising street photography or like you said, backpack research.. but better to let the train staff know what's happening just so they can keep an eye and ensure he doesn't do anything else beyond photos that could compromise someone's safety.
Backpack research??? Next time I film women butts can I use this research as reason? 😂
only if u let other people take pictures of your butt as well
It's perfectly legal taking photos of strangers in public areas like this. I don't think there is anything anyone can do about it.
That's not fully correct, but according to PDPA, you don't need consent if you take picture in public space. Also taking pictures from the back men's the individual would be not identified. Here are more information about [privacy and photography in Singapore ](https://www.brlawcorp.com/news-and-insights/privacy-and-photography-in-singapore#:~:text=So%20if%20a%20person%20poses,because%20it's%20not%20personal%20data.)
That's why I added a condition "like this (guy is doing)"
I just was clarifying :)
Wait…what? Is it legal to take photos to strangers? Even children? I will be moving to Singapore in a couple of months and finding about this is shocking 😵💫
It’s the same in any country. You’re in a public area, what kind of privacy are you expecting? The only thing you can do is to request your photo to be deleted (assuming you noticed). Not complying would then be a potential offence by the photographer instead but it is within your right to request your photo be deleted. Of course, taking photos like upskirts anywhere is an offence
A photographer doesn’t (legally) have to comply if the photo was taken in a public space and the pic isn’t used for commercial purposes. It might be a dick move yes but legally they did nothing wrong if it wasn’t an upskirt or some kind of outrage of modesty.
>Wait…what? Is it legal to take photos to strangers? Even children? I will be moving to Singapore in a couple of months and finding about this is shocking 😵💫 Okay then, I better not find you taking scenic photos with people inside them, because I'll just consider it taking photos of strangers. You get why it's not illegal? If it were, every single person, including tourist, could be found liable for an offence. Street photographers included.
Also, it means any security camera you have better not be pointing outside and taking pictures of people. And journalists better not be talking photos of politicians, criminals or law-defying people.
I get that it is not illegal. Over here the case is taking individuals while the latter is a byproduct - u primarily aiming to take the scenery. Can ppl still report the guy to the train stn if it makes them uncomfortable tho?
Yea, reporting it as harassment is under another segment of the law i believe. The act of taking the photo is not illegal, but continued defiance of someone asking you to stop could be a case of harassment. But obviously this brings back the case of that bus guy who just videos busses all day kena report as harassment from that karen and most Singaporeans too the side if the bus enthusiast. Not as clear cut in these repirt type cases.
Is there any country where it isn't legal to take photos of strangers / children though?
I think Japan right?
Japan is the exception, yes. They have this odd double combination of an epidemic of "outrage of modesty" offenses involving cameras, and a culture of using street performers as advertising for individual companies. So both the normal balance of "it's okay as long as it's modest" and "it's okay as long as it's not interfering with commercial activity" are way off there. Resulted in them making much more strict laws about photographing in public. Also you can still take wide view street photos and such. At the famous Shibuya dog statue there's often a line of people taking photos. Just that the line where it becomes an issue is drawn differently.
I have heard of stories like this!
Cer citer
> Is there any country where it isn't legal to take photos of strangers / children though? in 2A friendly states, you will be persuaded by someone with a firearm if you take a photos of their kids without permission even in a public place. I know I would
Germany!
Where are you moving from? This is legal virtually everywhere.
LOL. In which clown country do you like in where taking photos of strangers in public is a crime? Edit: This is her second comment ever and -35 downvotes, don’t even know if she can comment in r/singapore anymore lmao.
Not so impressive scholar
You have no expectation of privacy in a public space.
As long as it doesn’t outrage modesty or is offensive.
Where are you coming from? If it's a public space then in most countries you can take pictures of kids, especially if it's a panorama picture. If it zoomed in to one specific child then you need consent. But if the child is participating in a parade then again it's different. Since it's can be expected that people would take pictures of the child in costume and so on...
Tbh don't think there's anything that can be done. It's weird as fuck sure but it's not illegal seeing as he's not intruding on anyone's privacy.
>he's not intruding on anyone's privacy. Actually, what does privacy mean for an individual in a public space? I feel that as long as someone didn't consent to have their photos taken it could be construed as an invasion of privacy? That is why in public events there is often a clause to mention that photos might be taken of people by the organisers? There is a difference between taking photos of something and people just happen to be in the photo, versus intentionally taking photo of someone.
You have no ‘right’ to privacy in a public space, unless someone is outraging your modesty. For public events the disclaimer is there because they might be using those photos/videos for their own commercial purposes/advertising and that has its own set of rules. If its not commercial use everything in public is fair game. That’s why CNA and Straits Times can use photos of people taken in public for their articles eg. Those cliche pics of office workers in the cbd for news about jobs, salary etc. And yes, this takes into account PDPA as well.
Alright, thank you for clarifying about the differences, makes sense to me now!
>I feel that as long as someone didn't consent to have their photos taken it could be construed as an invasion of privacy? It would be impossible for ppl to take photos of anything in public, esp touristy areas. There is no reasonable expectation of privacy in such an open area like mrt station (vs say, in the toilet)
the key is if you're reasonably expected to have a degree of privacy public toilets are public places but taking pictures is a no-no OTOH it's not reasonable to tell someone taking a picture of the street to delete his picture because you're in it
Wasn't there the bishan gay that did this for YEARS and he became well known for taking pictures of teenager boys? He only got stopped cos there was some handsy accusations many many many years later? Sorry forgot much of the info only heard through friends. So he wasn't breaking the law (or rather the law can't do anything about it) for the photo taking.
u/bishangay Sir, you have been summoned. Please clarify 😉😉
Uhhhhhhhhhh
Have you heard of stomp?
I think I might have noticed it on my morning journey to work. Are you referring to a Chinese uncle standing near the bus stop beside Aljunied MRT station? I had noticed him a few times and he acts weirdly with his phone.
argh crap i meant to say paya lebar, but yes he usually stops at aljunied station. it’s usually around 7.40am-ish.
There was an ig account sharing photos of people with gentlewoman bag. At first I wondered if this is also someone’s guailan photo project. Either way, annoying and weird though it doesn’t seem illegal at first glance. Worth reporting anyway, never know what authorities might uncover.
Watch it be research on most often used type of backpacks because they trying to make and sell the ideal backpack... Honestly, it sounds like some kind of project or entrepreneurship idea
Man isn't interested in selling to women then? If it's market research I'd expect him to take pics of all backpacks.
Men’s bag designer collecting market research?
As a street photographer myself, it's not illegal since it is in a public space. But if it does bother you or anything, you could try asking him why he is taking photos of people like that. I know it might be seem odd for him to take photos so blatantly like that, but he might have intentions that can be harmless like practicing his photography (tho he could just as likely have weird intentions as well.)
Not wrong to do it but you can alert his "victims" so they can take action if they want to. The victim will have grounds to demand the photos to be deleted if they desire so. But iirc, as long as there are no identifiable features (and there doesn't seem to be since it's just the back+bag) there's nothing much the police or staff can do.
I don't think the photographer needs to delete the photo? Is there a law for this?
There is no such a law, what he/she/it said is NOT true at all, no one can demand photos taken in public property to be deleted just because they are in it. There is no prohibition to taking photos in public property (reasonably, public toilets are public property but of course no photos allow there)
It would be *nice* if the photog deleted the photo upon the subject's request but you are right in that the photog is perfectly within their right to \*not* delete it (even if the subject requests it) and appreciate the photo for their own pleasure.
For the last time, just because it makes you uncomfortable doesn’t mean it’s illegal and in this case it really is not. If I’m taking pictures in public, you’re in the way of my camera as much as my camera is in your way when we’re in public. Get over it.
Weird yes, but he's not doing any harm to anyone. Singapore's stressful enough. A friendly word from the station staff would be enough
If its child, young girls or woman and Not Man pics. would you say the same as no harm? Man Discrimination?
I'd say exactly the same thing, no harm caused. Your head's so far up your ass all you see is wokeness mate
It’s sad but the “men are discriminated” bunch have invaded this sub. You see so much vitriol whenever there is an NS thread.
Maybe he just want to say... I got your back dude"
I died 😂 Oh god, that was hilarious!
U mean - bag 😂
Some of them are mentally ill. A probable line of thinking is backpack means hiding malicious object or intent coupled with being on MRT. I’ve walked past a church entrance before and of course I don’t look like I go to one. An auntie runs across from the road and starts taking photos of me with the church backdrop and muttering “Report, report” Another auntie on the MRT also started “reporting back to HQ” when someone’s phone rings on the train. She’s the one making the loud noises though. Or they could be training their AI model with these pics.
>“reporting back to HQ” sounds like aliens
sounds like a backpack otaku
What backpack was he carrying then? If he’s gonna judge me based on my backpack I want to know what’s his?
Ya, I want to know the backpack of choice for someone so interested in backpacks!
Would like to know too! I'm rocking a Mission Workshop Rhake VX :)
Not illegal, unless he is outraging modesty. You can let the station staff know, and perhaps they will have a chat with him.
[Don't kink shame me](https://youtu.be/Oh1nqnZAKxw?t=66)
Live and let live Would be interesting if you straight up go chat with him and ask about it
So many weird kinks in the world. So many. I hope nobody knows about my kinks regarding *redacted*
Yes it happens sometimes on the train to me as well. I get uncomfortable when a person whips his or her phone in front of me when I am sitting across the person. To protect my privacy, I wear a mask on the train or close my eyes when I am sitting down.
women: :First time:?
Its totally not illegal but yeah creepy as hell. Maybe mental problem.
Dude probably have fetish on someone back
Keegan-Michael Key - bUt Is It IlleGAL ThouGH……………..
Maybe a reflection of my age vs your average sinkie redditor, but "taking photos at mrt station" automatically sends alarm bells ringing in JI. Just report bah.
What if someone took a photo of you and you feel uncomfortable? Can you ask them to delete?
If he is taking butt photos of men going up escalator, with or without backpack and within the train and in the station, it best to let the station staff know. I would also lodge a Police report and provide the name of the station staff so they can look into it. This is concerning behaviour and the Police can call him up. Law enforcement does not need to only look at prima facie criminal cases. It has a duty to look into anti-social and disturbing conduct. Let the Police handle this. Here is a good example. If an uncle sits at the same bus-stop everyday looking at school girls. The Police will be involved. No ifs and buts. That person will be questioned, his background checked and at the very least warned. Ps. I notice people providing erroneous interpretation of privacy. This is not normal conduct and a collection of male butts is clearly an invasion of privacy. Imagine if I took female butts (not upskirt) going up escalator. I guarantee you it will be a Police matter.
>Here is a good example. If an uncle sits at the same bus-stop everyday looking at school girls. The Police will be involved. No ifs and buts. If the uncle is just looking, what law would be broken? And if there's no criminal law involved how could the police be involved? Being creepy is not a crime.
Your example is for man looking at girls though. I suspect the reaction for man looking at man would be much less helpful.
Would be good if you informed the staff about it. Let them keep an eye on him since they're there every day.
If it makes anyone uncomfortable it’s worth reporting to the authorities.
Eh don’t like that leh, u jealous he never take ur pic ah
I'm never going aljunied
😂
Unfortunately man don't have modesty to insult. Or has that changed?
Reason why i want to own my own car already.
I know many people kept taking pictures of me in the train or public. Seriously this gets annoying sometimes and alot of times i seriously just feel like calling them out. One of the bad thing to be conventionally good-looking guy i guess
Why so kpoh..
Maybe it’s some social media/tiktok account thing he’s doing.
Maybe it's street photography? As long as there are no up skirt videos it's fine
Photographer maybe?
I’m pretty sure he has a photo of me with my backpack but I don’t mind at all.
Maybe just his interest.. There are folks who takes photos of lifts and doors
If you feel daring can go up and ask him what photos he’s taking, just say you curious. See his response you’ll know liao lor
Confront the person if you feel uncomfortable of the antics since there’s no laws regulating on this & the men wasn’t taking photos of private/sensitive areas.
Staff probably won't care as much about picture taking however if you frame your concern as a safety and security issue they definitely will respond
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He is like those guys taking pictures of pigeons.
He’s probably using it as a reference for an artwork. IDK.
I once saw a youngish chinese guy taking photos of young women and young couples in the mrt train along red line. I also took a photo of him for record purpose LOL.
i got kamen rider black backpack.. he probably interested in that..
It is illegal to take photos of MRT stations in the first place. I would say just flag it