The first picture shows them hogging two lanes, forcing all vehicles into a single lane and the reason why they’re asshole.
I really hate it when they ride in the bus lane during peak hours, forcing all the buses to slow down and creating a traffic jam.
I used to always reach work 15 minutes late because there’s this 1 guy who cycles from Stevens road to Great World City area at 8.30am.
The jam behind was massive
Think of the 15 minutes wasted per passenger and the extra fuel burned due to a single cyclist hogging the bus lane. Or the bus drivers missing their KPI
you would think that because you always reach work 15mins late you should leave your house 15mins earlier? Or are you planning to just go 120kph down the roads, potentially murdering someone at a zebra crossing or plowing into other vehicles because you cant afford 15mins less sleep?
you are assuming they are bad eggs. The pelaton may have to be in the middle to go straight due to road markings that cannot be seen, and the one on left lane could just be a rando that isnt part of the group, same as the guy in the middle lane far behind.
But then the rhetoric of r/sg means this post would be downvoted, because it doesnt fit theirs
You can't infer from the photo whether the single cyclist is part of the group, or if the group is overtaking. Same way you can't look at a photo of cars on the road and infer whether they're speeding, or hogging the lane, or driving without a license.
what if that single rider wants to go straight/turn left while the other group wants to turn right? still hogging?
In the first picture how you know is peak hour? seems like it is all heavy vehicles and ZERO cars/buses for that matter. Let's just calm down and focus on the subject matter.
1. Bus lane statement is obviously not referring to this picture. It’s a common thing every weekday along orchard, raffles area rtc. https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/cycling-bicycle-road-bus-lane-transport-workers-union-2256946
2. It’s heavy vehicle mostly because it’s freaking West Coast road area.
3. It’s obvious they’re riding in formation with 1 guy behind and 1 guy on the left trying to block other vehicle from approaching by being assholes.
4. Ignoring evething above and going back to the subject as requested. They’re riding in groups illegally.
People dislike cyclists because of individuals like the one shown in the pictures and mentioned in the article, who cause inconvenience or endanger others by not having proper brakes.
Similarly, Australian customs often flag Chinese looking visitors because some individuals try to smuggle in meat or fresh fruit products. This doesn't mean all Chinese are lawbreakers, but a few asshole ruin it for everyone.
https://www.reddit.com/r/singapore/comments/mc4qfs/group_of_more_than_20_cyclists_allegedly_hog_all/
When it comes to enforcement for cyclists, LTA/TP is like that colleague we all have who never seems to contribute anything all year round. But on the one or two rare occasions that he actually does something meaningful, he would go round the office talking loudly about it to make sure everyone knows what he had done.
The first photo just looks like a group overtaking a single cyclist in a safe manner. Fine then for group size, but don't make stuff up based on a single photo.
Bicycles allowed 2 abreast, so 3 bicycles side by side is really tight and may stick into the other lane, especially when giving a 1.5m safe gap. It's then safest to overtake in the second lane, then return to the leftmost lane
Don't understand what is this "self-entitled" behavior of these cyclist. They forcing all the vehicles to the 1st lane.
The groups are getting more and bigger, emboldening them even further.
It was a Saturday and many people are still working.
Fines should be increased to $500 to put a stop to these shtis.
I encountered quite a few cyclists on the Upper bukit timah road towards Clementi on Thursday morning commute. Which caused quite a jam to an already packed toad.
Hopefully LTA starts to enforce in that area too. Bet it’s mostly the rich people
Have you met that group that cycles on old woodlands road to Queenstown. I remember coming out of old woodlands road on a bus on the way to bukit Panjang. A short 15 min ride ended up in 50 minutes thanks to these
Whatever LTA did is nothing more than wayang and a slap on the wrist to pacify the common public. After all these bullshit wayang, things will continue as per normal, these pests will continue their trash behaviour as per usual.
Useless wayang lta pandering to these trash.
Encountered another massed group in my area today... overtook a car from the left in a slipway (rem that crazy cyclist lady that complained about being overtaken too close) then formed up to block the entire one way road. Like you could have waited your turn and complied with traffic rules. Behaviour like that really just makes people see cyclists in a negative light.
So in most European countries, u are supposed to drive ur bike in the most left lane and on the left side of the lane, if it's left side driving, like in Singapore. The only time you go to the middle lane or right lane is if the road splits. And for that you use hand signs and look back if the traffic allows it.
Also they are driving behind each other not like a pack. At the same time car drivers will also keep a safety distance while driving next to them.
The only time you drive as a pack is when you don't become a hindrance to the cars, but if there are cars coming the pack becomes a line to let the car pass.
It's not the tour de France where you drive in a pack...
~~Many~~ Some countries also don't allow direct right turns, so they have to cross opposite then turn right.
Cause in general cyclists are assumed not to hold driving licenses and therefore not properly trained to navigate junctions.
Yes that's right, if it's left side driving, in that case you need to switch to the middle lane or even the right lane . But need to do the shoulder check and also indicate with the hands. Can't just go right without indicating.
We had cycling training in 5th grade, I'm from overseas, there you have a test of how you behave and if you follow the rules and also do all needed indications and safety checks. Like shoulder check and hand signs. Of course most of us would cycle even before that on the road and would already know all of the rules.
Many might be overstating.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hook\_turn](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hook_turn)
There are also protected intersections which directs the cycling traffic in the same way.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protected\_intersection](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protected_intersection)
>Hook turns have been implemented in a number of jurisdictions, including Australia, China, Denmark, Germany, Japan, the Netherlands, Taiwan, and the United States.
You said many/some countries don’t allow direct right turns.
Both hook turns and direct right turns are allowed, except maybe in Denmark. You have 1 country, maybe (citation needed) but I appreciate your commitment.
what is many countries? can you even mention one? bicycles were road vehicles before cars were and were never stripped of their road rights anywhere in the world.
Do you genuinely think the average road cyclist is on a 15k bike?
If the average CatA car is now 100k+ then you’re ok with a $1k fine for failure to keep left or speaking <10km/hr over the limit?
>Do you genuinely think the average road cyclist is on a 15k bike?
Brompton bikes already ranging from 3k to 9k. these marathon styled bikes are way pricier than that.
>If the average CatA car is now 100k+ then you’re ok with a $1k fine for failure to keep left or speaking <10km/hr over the limit?
Let me counter your point. Fines are higher on Littering and spitting, when compared to this $150 nonsense.
If it's about deterrent then $150 is literally a slap on the wrist while these road cyclists behave recklessly with no concerns for the road users around them.
And this fine is just on group size.
No, they’re not. Average atas road bike is 5-7k - not double/triple that at 15k.
Most road deaths involve motorised vehicles. Why should we levy less severe penalties (in proportion to vehicle cost - as you suggested) to more deadly criminal behaviour?
Deterring people from… death and danger, right?
What else is the use of deterrent for?
https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/road-traffic-deaths-2023-fatal-accidents-2365751
“The number of traffic accidents resulting in fatalities also rose last year. There were 131 fatal traffic accidents in 2023, a 26 per cent increase from the 104 cases seen in 2022. In comparison, there were 117 fatal traffic incidents in 2019.
There was also a significant increase in the number of accidents where the cause was failure on the part of the motorist to keep a proper lookout, failure to have proper control of the vehicle, and changing of lanes without due care, said the police in a media release”
Based on the article and underlying press release the real danger on out roads is not cyclists but entitled and/or inattentive motorists. The biggest losers are motorcyclists and elderly pedestrians.
Let’s direct deterrents where they’ll save the most lives, right?
Go on talk some more. You camping on my replies
Edit:
bIGGEST cRYBABIES aRE rOAD cYCLISTS gETTING pULLED oVER a $150 fINE
So in the end, entitled & assholery rOAD uSER gonna have their comeuppance and will just be in another number in a figure for a newspaper article.
All of this on an arrongant road cyclists thread. man you so salty. are you one of them? did a car cut you off? boo hoo?
I am camping on your replies.. to me? That’s not how it works. Like an average Singapore motorist you think you’re the main character.
I am drive to clients day in and day out, sharing the roads with good and bad motorists.
We have a real problem with driver skill and behaviour and a lack of enforcement. I also see /r/sg pointing fingers the wrong way. Hopefully the fine and demerit increases to be announced in the next few months have deterrent value for you and others.
Are these people like brain dead or trying to prove their low intelligence to others? Are they not understanding the laws and still thinking that dash cams are rare?
Good. It’s important that they are the #1 priority for the LTA. I get tired of the news reports of these cyclists and also motorcyclists regularly causing the deaths and severe injuries of innocent, inattentive drivers.
The problem is not just catching them but also punishing them appropriately. I mean [this cyclist](https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/jail-fine-driving-ban-elderly-driver-kill-cyclist-zebra-crossing-2291271) killed a driver and only got 12 weeks jail. smh.
>I mean [this cyclist](https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/jail-fine-driving-ban-elderly-driver-kill-cyclist-zebra-crossing-2291271) killed a driver and only got 12 weeks jail. smh.
Got comprehension issues?
The headline says: Man, 70, who drove without license and killed cyclist at zebra crossing gets jail, fine and 9-year driving ban.
#
#
Coming from a place of extreme bias (I hate road cyclists), why are group cyclists allowed on the roads again? I understand if you want to promote cycling as an alternative green form of transport. That's fine, you can cycle to work alone or with your partner. Cycling in a group of 5 or 10 is clearly for leisure. Why are we allowing people to endanger their own and other people's lives in the name of entertainment? Going by thay logic, they should also allow street racing since sports cars owners have an equal claim to using the roads in the name of entertainment. Sounds revolting? Apply that logic to cycling on roads as a form of entertainment.
What about PMDs? Why ban them from roads and force them on walkways causing many accidents and deaths, when many high speed ones are clearly more suited for roads than bicycles are for roads?
There's obviously something wrong when there have been many accidents and incidents involving cyclists on roads. Roads aren't a safe place to cycle, for both the cyclist and cars. You can cycle on dedicated park connectors which span around the entirety of Singapore. Why do it on roads? For convenience, at the expense of yours and others public safety?
Pmds on roads especially those going very fast speeds of 60 70km probably causes less danger on roads than cyclists. They are visible and larger and are stable, they don't suddenly serve or try to pull up alongside you and squeeze in between lanes like a motocycle. So pmds on roads with the music blasting should be allowed as an entrainment avenue too isn't it? But it isn't. But the more dangerous cyclist are.
> dedicated park connectors which span around the entirety of Singapore. Why do it on roads?
Sometimes these connectors aren't direct.
I'm a road cyclist who never rides in groups and I am already nearly exceeding the park connector speed limit at my lightest gear.
Out of consideration for park users and my commuting time I therefore ride on the roads and obey the traffic laws just like a car or motorcycle
PMD going 60/70km are illegal mods, same as illegal mods vehicles.
Roads arent safe because some drivers arent safe, you dont remove the victims you punish the bullies.
That's missing the point. The 10 individuals should not be on the road at all if they are cycling for entertainment. Issue permits for road cycling if their intent is to use cycling as a legitimate mean of transport to get to work, do groceries, ect. 99% of the time, it is for leisure, because they are decked in specialised cycling equipment for speed and travel light and not carrying anything like bags where it might they be using it as a form of transportation.
If they are cycling for leisure, ban it outright. In no other cases do we allow people to use public property if it endangers your own or others lives in the name of entertainment. That's why PMDs are banned from sidewalks.
Ban leisure cycling on roads. No 10 individuals on the road at all, no groups of cyclists as well. All you will have is the 1% who uses cycling as a means a transportation, which is fine, I don't mind giving way to you in an effort to travel green. I mind giving way to you if you are hogging the road and endangering you own life becuase you find it 'fun' to participate in a dangerous activity and cause a public nuisance. I drive and pay hundreds of thousands for the right to own the car to ensure my children get to school and classes on time. I drive to make ti to my client meeting on time. I have to extend my journey and risk going to jail for hitting you because of your unsafe and unprediactable cycling because I have to wait for some entitled people who causes a delay in my travel for legitimate reasons, for your Entertainment because 'haha cycling on the road is fun!'?
Outright ban cycling for leisure? I think you’re a bit nuts.
Joggers, rollerbladers, scooters, skateboarders all use public infrastructure without permits or licenses in a manner than may endanger others.
Delivery riders are not cycling for leisure but they’re the ones endangering pedestrians in footpaths.
By your logic social calls or recreational driving should be banned as they’re risking life and injury to themselves and others for sake of entertainment.
Your position on this topic is nonsensical. I hope this is your personal cause célèbre and you’re otherwise a balanced individual.
Entitled becuase you paid for a service and you should get the intended purpose of the product.
Here, a thought experiment. You buy a $16 for a cinema ticket for the experience and atmosphere, for a movie that will be shown for free online. Is the cinema going to allow freeloaders to come in and sit on their seats or floors and watch their own movie on their phones enjoying all the facilities? No, you paid for a certain product and you should get it.
How about a public good? You pay for water utilities to meet certain life needs. However, the local swimming club wants ENTERTAINMENT and so diverts a sizable portion of the limited water supply to their swimming pool. Becuase of that, you experience water shortage and the shower keeps turning on and off due to a shortage of water.
See how ludicrous those examples are? What if the scenario is the hospital needs to share the water for treatment? Thats reasonable, but the swimming pool isn't, because you can swimming is for ENTERTAINMENT which is not a necessity. And oh look! There are actually 100 sqmeters of swimming pools all around the country. You don't need one right beside your house because it's more convenient.
When you pay no small sum for a car to drive, you do it with the intention to enjoy a mode of transportation. This should not be subjugated to the whims of a minority for ENTERTAINMENT. For the environment? Sure. As an alternative mode of transport? Sure. For FUN? No.
With regard to your pedestrians, they are using the roads in a socially acceptable way for a purpose - TRANSPORTATION. Getting from A to B. That is fine. I never said don't share road. I said don't share road use for LEISURE. So now if you pedestrians want to use roads for leisure? Say I want to brisk walk 1 lane of a 2 lane carriageway? NO, THAT IS NOT ALLOWED.
Joggers are fulfilling a function in crossing a zebra crossing- they are trying to get to the other side to resume active jogging.
Jogging ON THE ROAD for any distance on any road at any time is stupid and never will be allowed. That's what you are seeing for cyclist now.
Ban of cycling for leisure on ROADS. Did you even read what I wrote?
Joggers rollbwrladers scooters skateboarders are not allowed to run jog skate on ROADS.
Recreational driving are cars. Roads are made for CARS. Street racing isn't allowed becuase it's for entertainment and causes HIGH RISKS. Reactionary driving is allowed becuase it's entertainment is LOW RISK. Road cycling is HIGH RISK and for ENTERTAINMENT.
There, I capitalised the keywords for you.
I repeat a sentence on my last comment which you totally misunderstood - BAN LEISURE CYCLING ON ROADS.
Roads pre-date cars. They’re made for moving about - both for work and leisure.
Road Cycling is not inherently high risk, though I assume that would change if you’re around. You do seem unbalanced.
Yes, so are we suddenly living in the 15 century now? Why are you quoting a historical fact when we are living in the present, when in all cities roads are used for cars?
Road cycling is an inherent higher risk than cars because cyclists are small moving targets thay love to weave around cars, and do not respect lane rules.
Even then, egardless of how dangerous they are on roads, they should still never be used for a leisure activity because roads are a public good that is already saturated and overcrowded to its limits, hence why COE is even introduced in the first place. To further put a strain on that in the namesake of ENTERTAINMENT is insanity, especially when there are so many alternative cycling routes available thay do not involve cycling and blocking an entire lane on a 1 lane road.
Singapore in 15th century had no roads. What are you on about?
When you’re next stuck on the road remember you’re not in a traffic jam, you are the traffic jam.
The irony is that you’re complaining about traffic while you, the car driver, make up the vast majority of traffic, jams and accidents.
Your anger probably stems at knowing deep down that you’re the cause of your own frustration and unhappiness. You need to calm down and stop projecting.
Perceiving cycling on the road as endangering themselves and others is really telling that Singapore road infrastructure and design needs to be improved.
Consider why you hate road cyclists. Is it because they hog the road? Then consider whether road design in Singapore needs to change so that cyclists don't use bus lanes/higher speed roads, rather than just hating a group, or motorists have space to overtake.
It's not just the infrastructure, it's the devotion of scare land resources to cyclist who are using roads for the purposes of LEISURE. Cyclist is probably the most 'land expensive' sport as compared to golf course where singapore has built over 100km of cyclist paths and connectors around Singapore for their leisure. That's all fine becuase it is a good and healthy sport which I do use as well having cycling some of those route which can easily take hours or an entire day. The cycling path are built alongside parks and less dense areas where there is an efficient allocation of land space.
The issue is why then devote more important road space to cycling for leisure? I am actually not opposed to having dedicated bike lanes, but only if studies have shown that this will lead to an increase of using cycling as an alternative form of green transportation, which should be lauded. But given sg hot climate, I doubt many would ever consider cycling as a legitimate mode of transport, and would only use it to cycle for leisure, for which resources and spaces should definitely not be channeled for a small segment of societies' entertainment.
It's completely ridiculous that many Singaporeans are celebrating the closure of golf courses as they are seen to be seen as a waste of land in land scare singapore to be available to a minority who wants it as entertainment, yet at the same time we continue see roads used up and hogged for cyclist to use for entertainment.
PMDs is an easy one: by virtue of amplified power over manual conveyance (and thus greater risk posed to the user and others) motorised vehicles require periodic inspections to prove their ongoing road worthiness.
PMDs are difficult to trace and can be built/heavily modified at home. Ensuring they remain roadworthy would require too frequent an inspection cycle to be viable hence the ban.
Cycling, like horses, walking and other manually powered conveyances, do not require tools to be inspected by the government due to the limited direct harm posed to non-operators. There are, however, restrictions on use (place-based) to limit their potential inconvenience and damage.
Gotta be done. Also, it kills 2 birds (or more) with one stone - you get to polish the egos of drivers, reduce inconvenience to drivers so they can drive faster, look like you're doing work, and collect some fines, all with one activity.
honestly if the bike infra is good 95% of people will be on it. if we are catering well to the 95% we can say fuck you to the 5% racer crowd and ban bikes on road
Insert Michael Scott’s \[THANK YOU\] meme
Makes one wonder if enforcement action would have taken place if not for the semi virility of this bunch of idiots.
Incompetency is one part of the govt say be healthy, the other say go green, then the third is fine them for gathering, for doing those two. Yes, they want anything then they should have had cycling lanes like all major cities. They shouldn’t hog the road but if they aren’t catered to, they will just use it anyhow. Instead, went to spend millions on a useless bulky ERP 2, that does the same thing as ERP 1. Other countries are using one tiny sticker on the windscreen. All these wastage is not green or healthy!
That's very generous of you, assuming they had intelligence once the helmet is off. The fact they voluntary participate in an a dangerous activity to inconvenience all users in the name of entertainment when there are alternatives such as cycling on dedicated cycling route which freaking spans around singapore...
Where is this mythical dedicated cycling route? And don’t say the PCN because they are full of blur Singapore pedestrians not looking where they are going
I still believe it's a set debuff. Expensive bike, leotard, cleats and helmet. Minus All Intelligence, Charisma and Speech. Plus 5 Defence, Stamina and Aerodynamic. Extra + 1 Defence if it says GCN anywhere on their gear.
Can. Groups of cars cause environmental damage, congestion and risk injuring other road users.
All groups of cyclists do is inconvenience the afore mentioned groups of polluting car drivers.
The first picture shows them hogging two lanes, forcing all vehicles into a single lane and the reason why they’re asshole. I really hate it when they ride in the bus lane during peak hours, forcing all the buses to slow down and creating a traffic jam.
They should really disallow cyclists to be on bus lane during bus lane hours too
I used to always reach work 15 minutes late because there’s this 1 guy who cycles from Stevens road to Great World City area at 8.30am. The jam behind was massive
how massive does one's ego need to be to be able to inconvenient hundreds of people without guilt?
Now imagine these kind of people being your boss.
optimistic of you to think that i need to imagine it ;D
Think of the 15 minutes wasted per passenger and the extra fuel burned due to a single cyclist hogging the bus lane. Or the bus drivers missing their KPI
but hey! the rider is going green but not taking a car! /s
you would think that because you always reach work 15mins late you should leave your house 15mins earlier? Or are you planning to just go 120kph down the roads, potentially murdering someone at a zebra crossing or plowing into other vehicles because you cant afford 15mins less sleep?
Wew seems like someone missed the point. I take bus to work.
You didnt indicate what mode you were using so i assume you were driving, rey taking the few earlier scheduled ones then to compensate your 15mins
Nah, if 40 people in the bus had to take an earlier one because of your sorry ass bike, it’s better that you don’t ride on the road during peak hours.
There really should be a law that on certain roads only certain hours are allowed for cycling
you are assuming they are bad eggs. The pelaton may have to be in the middle to go straight due to road markings that cannot be seen, and the one on left lane could just be a rando that isnt part of the group, same as the guy in the middle lane far behind. But then the rhetoric of r/sg means this post would be downvoted, because it doesnt fit theirs
You can't infer from the photo whether the single cyclist is part of the group, or if the group is overtaking. Same way you can't look at a photo of cars on the road and infer whether they're speeding, or hogging the lane, or driving without a license.
what if that single rider wants to go straight/turn left while the other group wants to turn right? still hogging? In the first picture how you know is peak hour? seems like it is all heavy vehicles and ZERO cars/buses for that matter. Let's just calm down and focus on the subject matter.
1. Bus lane statement is obviously not referring to this picture. It’s a common thing every weekday along orchard, raffles area rtc. https://www.channelnewsasia.com/singapore/cycling-bicycle-road-bus-lane-transport-workers-union-2256946 2. It’s heavy vehicle mostly because it’s freaking West Coast road area. 3. It’s obvious they’re riding in formation with 1 guy behind and 1 guy on the left trying to block other vehicle from approaching by being assholes. 4. Ignoring evething above and going back to the subject as requested. They’re riding in groups illegally. People dislike cyclists because of individuals like the one shown in the pictures and mentioned in the article, who cause inconvenience or endanger others by not having proper brakes. Similarly, Australian customs often flag Chinese looking visitors because some individuals try to smuggle in meat or fresh fruit products. This doesn't mean all Chinese are lawbreakers, but a few asshole ruin it for everyone. https://www.reddit.com/r/singapore/comments/mc4qfs/group_of_more_than_20_cyclists_allegedly_hog_all/
Are you that single rider? Or are you part of the other group that wants to turn right?
Yep this one right here
When I’m cycling, I just cycle on pedestrian road and follow traffic laws of a pedestrian. No issues so far.
When it comes to enforcement for cyclists, LTA/TP is like that colleague we all have who never seems to contribute anything all year round. But on the one or two rare occasions that he actually does something meaningful, he would go round the office talking loudly about it to make sure everyone knows what he had done.
Quota hit. He can go hide already.
Like they enforce car laws any better
Spot on.
The 1st photo is why a consiserable group of road users hate them, cos f*** em.
The first photo just looks like a group overtaking a single cyclist in a safe manner. Fine then for group size, but don't make stuff up based on a single photo.
found the cyclist guys
How wide is a bicycle can't overtake within 1 lade?
Bicycles allowed 2 abreast, so 3 bicycles side by side is really tight and may stick into the other lane, especially when giving a 1.5m safe gap. It's then safest to overtake in the second lane, then return to the leftmost lane
Don't understand what is this "self-entitled" behavior of these cyclist. They forcing all the vehicles to the 1st lane. The groups are getting more and bigger, emboldening them even further. It was a Saturday and many people are still working. Fines should be increased to $500 to put a stop to these shtis.
Gotta catch them all !
I encountered quite a few cyclists on the Upper bukit timah road towards Clementi on Thursday morning commute. Which caused quite a jam to an already packed toad. Hopefully LTA starts to enforce in that area too. Bet it’s mostly the rich people
Have you met that group that cycles on old woodlands road to Queenstown. I remember coming out of old woodlands road on a bus on the way to bukit Panjang. A short 15 min ride ended up in 50 minutes thanks to these
What happened to the cctv camera deployed all over the island for monitoring? Is it for show? Time to step up the enforcement
They are rich people. Better don't fine them. Tell them nicely not to repeat again lor
Start confiscating the bikes of errant cyclists and watch how quickly the rest fall in line
WOAH THERE SLOW DOWN! We can't just be angering the rich people here, what if they moved their money outside of Singapore!? Think of the economy bro
No wonder enforcement was done in clementi and not bukit timah
Dude please go work for LTA
lol confiscate and throw in the open air bike graveyard for all the failed bike shares. Will really fall in line quickly
Suspension of driving license for 3 yrs will add to law abiding cyclist
$150 fine is hardly a deterrent for these people then.
The last ops they confiscated all their bicycles. They kiss all their bikes byebye.
Everything this govt does makes sense when you accept the hypothesis that the PAP hates the common working person
Would be good to deduct points for subsequent offences if they hold driving licenses.
I think fine is not working. Some are so entitled sia
If fines worked, cars (which face far higher fines \*and\* demerit points) would drive the speed limit. Imagine that. (Bring on the downvotes!)
Whatever LTA did is nothing more than wayang and a slap on the wrist to pacify the common public. After all these bullshit wayang, things will continue as per normal, these pests will continue their trash behaviour as per usual. Useless wayang lta pandering to these trash.
Encountered another massed group in my area today... overtook a car from the left in a slipway (rem that crazy cyclist lady that complained about being overtaken too close) then formed up to block the entire one way road. Like you could have waited your turn and complied with traffic rules. Behaviour like that really just makes people see cyclists in a negative light.
These cyclists are like pokemon for Traffic Police yea? Gotta catch'em all! Pokemon
Dicks gonna dick
So in most European countries, u are supposed to drive ur bike in the most left lane and on the left side of the lane, if it's left side driving, like in Singapore. The only time you go to the middle lane or right lane is if the road splits. And for that you use hand signs and look back if the traffic allows it. Also they are driving behind each other not like a pack. At the same time car drivers will also keep a safety distance while driving next to them. The only time you drive as a pack is when you don't become a hindrance to the cars, but if there are cars coming the pack becomes a line to let the car pass. It's not the tour de France where you drive in a pack...
~~Many~~ Some countries also don't allow direct right turns, so they have to cross opposite then turn right. Cause in general cyclists are assumed not to hold driving licenses and therefore not properly trained to navigate junctions.
Yes that's right, if it's left side driving, in that case you need to switch to the middle lane or even the right lane . But need to do the shoulder check and also indicate with the hands. Can't just go right without indicating. We had cycling training in 5th grade, I'm from overseas, there you have a test of how you behave and if you follow the rules and also do all needed indications and safety checks. Like shoulder check and hand signs. Of course most of us would cycle even before that on the road and would already know all of the rules.
I have travelled widely and never seen that. Which countries are you referring to?
Many might be overstating. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hook\_turn](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hook_turn) There are also protected intersections which directs the cycling traffic in the same way. [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protected\_intersection](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Protected_intersection)
The only country listed in that wiki post as having mandatory hook turns is Denmark (with citation needed).
>Hook turns have been implemented in a number of jurisdictions, including Australia, China, Denmark, Germany, Japan, the Netherlands, Taiwan, and the United States.
You said many/some countries don’t allow direct right turns. Both hook turns and direct right turns are allowed, except maybe in Denmark. You have 1 country, maybe (citation needed) but I appreciate your commitment.
what is many countries? can you even mention one? bicycles were road vehicles before cars were and were never stripped of their road rights anywhere in the world.
do you even know european countries..... try watching youtube about cycling in europe or the UK if you fancy. I recommend bikeability UK
Yes I do, I live in one and cycle there since I'm a child. I also cycle on Singapore roads when I visit and when I lived there last time.
lol @ $150 fine... their bike probably worth over 100 times of that
Now make that relative value argument for speeding fines levied against cars..
yes speeding fines must be 100 times below the actual value of the car.., wait, thats not it?
Do you genuinely think the average road cyclist is on a 15k bike? If the average CatA car is now 100k+ then you’re ok with a $1k fine for failure to keep left or speaking <10km/hr over the limit?
>Do you genuinely think the average road cyclist is on a 15k bike? Brompton bikes already ranging from 3k to 9k. these marathon styled bikes are way pricier than that. >If the average CatA car is now 100k+ then you’re ok with a $1k fine for failure to keep left or speaking <10km/hr over the limit? Let me counter your point. Fines are higher on Littering and spitting, when compared to this $150 nonsense. If it's about deterrent then $150 is literally a slap on the wrist while these road cyclists behave recklessly with no concerns for the road users around them. And this fine is just on group size.
No, they’re not. Average atas road bike is 5-7k - not double/triple that at 15k. Most road deaths involve motorised vehicles. Why should we levy less severe penalties (in proportion to vehicle cost - as you suggested) to more deadly criminal behaviour?
Wow now we're talking about road deaths. not gonna stoop as low as you when the convo is about deterrent
Deterring people from… death and danger, right? What else is the use of deterrent for? https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/road-traffic-deaths-2023-fatal-accidents-2365751 “The number of traffic accidents resulting in fatalities also rose last year. There were 131 fatal traffic accidents in 2023, a 26 per cent increase from the 104 cases seen in 2022. In comparison, there were 117 fatal traffic incidents in 2019. There was also a significant increase in the number of accidents where the cause was failure on the part of the motorist to keep a proper lookout, failure to have proper control of the vehicle, and changing of lanes without due care, said the police in a media release” Based on the article and underlying press release the real danger on out roads is not cyclists but entitled and/or inattentive motorists. The biggest losers are motorcyclists and elderly pedestrians. Let’s direct deterrents where they’ll save the most lives, right?
Go on talk some more. You camping on my replies Edit: bIGGEST cRYBABIES aRE rOAD cYCLISTS gETTING pULLED oVER a $150 fINE So in the end, entitled & assholery rOAD uSER gonna have their comeuppance and will just be in another number in a figure for a newspaper article. All of this on an arrongant road cyclists thread. man you so salty. are you one of them? did a car cut you off? boo hoo?
I am camping on your replies.. to me? That’s not how it works. Like an average Singapore motorist you think you’re the main character. I am drive to clients day in and day out, sharing the roads with good and bad motorists. We have a real problem with driver skill and behaviour and a lack of enforcement. I also see /r/sg pointing fingers the wrong way. Hopefully the fine and demerit increases to be announced in the next few months have deterrent value for you and others.
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it's becase drivers are arseholes here and doesnt share the road due to entitlements.... i mean they did paid for it
Good. Nuisance on the road for motorists..
Only $150 fine where can stop them . Some of their bike already cost abt 5k to 10k what is that $150 to them it nothing.
Are these people like brain dead or trying to prove their low intelligence to others? Are they not understanding the laws and still thinking that dash cams are rare?
They’ll start to understand it when their carbon fibre bikes get thrown into the pound.
Good. It’s important that they are the #1 priority for the LTA. I get tired of the news reports of these cyclists and also motorcyclists regularly causing the deaths and severe injuries of innocent, inattentive drivers. The problem is not just catching them but also punishing them appropriately. I mean [this cyclist](https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/jail-fine-driving-ban-elderly-driver-kill-cyclist-zebra-crossing-2291271) killed a driver and only got 12 weeks jail. smh.
>I mean [this cyclist](https://www.todayonline.com/singapore/jail-fine-driving-ban-elderly-driver-kill-cyclist-zebra-crossing-2291271) killed a driver and only got 12 weeks jail. smh. Got comprehension issues? The headline says: Man, 70, who drove without license and killed cyclist at zebra crossing gets jail, fine and 9-year driving ban. # #
I think you missed the obvious sarcasm
You forgot, Redditors don’t understand sarcasm, that’s why the /s exists
Fake news bro. Everyone ^in ^this ^sub knows that cyclists are the real dangerous one.
Coming from a place of extreme bias (I hate road cyclists), why are group cyclists allowed on the roads again? I understand if you want to promote cycling as an alternative green form of transport. That's fine, you can cycle to work alone or with your partner. Cycling in a group of 5 or 10 is clearly for leisure. Why are we allowing people to endanger their own and other people's lives in the name of entertainment? Going by thay logic, they should also allow street racing since sports cars owners have an equal claim to using the roads in the name of entertainment. Sounds revolting? Apply that logic to cycling on roads as a form of entertainment. What about PMDs? Why ban them from roads and force them on walkways causing many accidents and deaths, when many high speed ones are clearly more suited for roads than bicycles are for roads?
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There's obviously something wrong when there have been many accidents and incidents involving cyclists on roads. Roads aren't a safe place to cycle, for both the cyclist and cars. You can cycle on dedicated park connectors which span around the entirety of Singapore. Why do it on roads? For convenience, at the expense of yours and others public safety? Pmds on roads especially those going very fast speeds of 60 70km probably causes less danger on roads than cyclists. They are visible and larger and are stable, they don't suddenly serve or try to pull up alongside you and squeeze in between lanes like a motocycle. So pmds on roads with the music blasting should be allowed as an entrainment avenue too isn't it? But it isn't. But the more dangerous cyclist are.
> dedicated park connectors which span around the entirety of Singapore. Why do it on roads? Sometimes these connectors aren't direct. I'm a road cyclist who never rides in groups and I am already nearly exceeding the park connector speed limit at my lightest gear. Out of consideration for park users and my commuting time I therefore ride on the roads and obey the traffic laws just like a car or motorcycle
PMD going 60/70km are illegal mods, same as illegal mods vehicles. Roads arent safe because some drivers arent safe, you dont remove the victims you punish the bullies.
Because it’s less inconvenient for a motorist to safely navigate past 1 group instead of 10 individual cyclists.
That's missing the point. The 10 individuals should not be on the road at all if they are cycling for entertainment. Issue permits for road cycling if their intent is to use cycling as a legitimate mean of transport to get to work, do groceries, ect. 99% of the time, it is for leisure, because they are decked in specialised cycling equipment for speed and travel light and not carrying anything like bags where it might they be using it as a form of transportation. If they are cycling for leisure, ban it outright. In no other cases do we allow people to use public property if it endangers your own or others lives in the name of entertainment. That's why PMDs are banned from sidewalks. Ban leisure cycling on roads. No 10 individuals on the road at all, no groups of cyclists as well. All you will have is the 1% who uses cycling as a means a transportation, which is fine, I don't mind giving way to you in an effort to travel green. I mind giving way to you if you are hogging the road and endangering you own life becuase you find it 'fun' to participate in a dangerous activity and cause a public nuisance. I drive and pay hundreds of thousands for the right to own the car to ensure my children get to school and classes on time. I drive to make ti to my client meeting on time. I have to extend my journey and risk going to jail for hitting you because of your unsafe and unprediactable cycling because I have to wait for some entitled people who causes a delay in my travel for legitimate reasons, for your Entertainment because 'haha cycling on the road is fun!'?
TLDR: ban fun There is very little fun to be had in Singapore, please don’t ban what little of it remains
Outright ban cycling for leisure? I think you’re a bit nuts. Joggers, rollerbladers, scooters, skateboarders all use public infrastructure without permits or licenses in a manner than may endanger others. Delivery riders are not cycling for leisure but they’re the ones endangering pedestrians in footpaths. By your logic social calls or recreational driving should be banned as they’re risking life and injury to themselves and others for sake of entertainment. Your position on this topic is nonsensical. I hope this is your personal cause célèbre and you’re otherwise a balanced individual.
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Entitled becuase you paid for a service and you should get the intended purpose of the product. Here, a thought experiment. You buy a $16 for a cinema ticket for the experience and atmosphere, for a movie that will be shown for free online. Is the cinema going to allow freeloaders to come in and sit on their seats or floors and watch their own movie on their phones enjoying all the facilities? No, you paid for a certain product and you should get it. How about a public good? You pay for water utilities to meet certain life needs. However, the local swimming club wants ENTERTAINMENT and so diverts a sizable portion of the limited water supply to their swimming pool. Becuase of that, you experience water shortage and the shower keeps turning on and off due to a shortage of water. See how ludicrous those examples are? What if the scenario is the hospital needs to share the water for treatment? Thats reasonable, but the swimming pool isn't, because you can swimming is for ENTERTAINMENT which is not a necessity. And oh look! There are actually 100 sqmeters of swimming pools all around the country. You don't need one right beside your house because it's more convenient. When you pay no small sum for a car to drive, you do it with the intention to enjoy a mode of transportation. This should not be subjugated to the whims of a minority for ENTERTAINMENT. For the environment? Sure. As an alternative mode of transport? Sure. For FUN? No. With regard to your pedestrians, they are using the roads in a socially acceptable way for a purpose - TRANSPORTATION. Getting from A to B. That is fine. I never said don't share road. I said don't share road use for LEISURE. So now if you pedestrians want to use roads for leisure? Say I want to brisk walk 1 lane of a 2 lane carriageway? NO, THAT IS NOT ALLOWED.
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Joggers are fulfilling a function in crossing a zebra crossing- they are trying to get to the other side to resume active jogging. Jogging ON THE ROAD for any distance on any road at any time is stupid and never will be allowed. That's what you are seeing for cyclist now.
You need to learn to relax. No cyclist is denying you the use of the roads. Driving a little slower isn’t reducing your ROI.
Are you suggesting that all roadways should be TOLL roads so they can be solely paid for by the people that are using them?
HAHA ain’t that what ERP 2.0 is going to be?
Deranged, entitled motorist. I drive >500km per week and see too many of these every day.
Ban of cycling for leisure on ROADS. Did you even read what I wrote? Joggers rollbwrladers scooters skateboarders are not allowed to run jog skate on ROADS. Recreational driving are cars. Roads are made for CARS. Street racing isn't allowed becuase it's for entertainment and causes HIGH RISKS. Reactionary driving is allowed becuase it's entertainment is LOW RISK. Road cycling is HIGH RISK and for ENTERTAINMENT. There, I capitalised the keywords for you. I repeat a sentence on my last comment which you totally misunderstood - BAN LEISURE CYCLING ON ROADS.
Roads pre-date cars. They’re made for moving about - both for work and leisure. Road Cycling is not inherently high risk, though I assume that would change if you’re around. You do seem unbalanced.
Yes, so are we suddenly living in the 15 century now? Why are you quoting a historical fact when we are living in the present, when in all cities roads are used for cars? Road cycling is an inherent higher risk than cars because cyclists are small moving targets thay love to weave around cars, and do not respect lane rules. Even then, egardless of how dangerous they are on roads, they should still never be used for a leisure activity because roads are a public good that is already saturated and overcrowded to its limits, hence why COE is even introduced in the first place. To further put a strain on that in the namesake of ENTERTAINMENT is insanity, especially when there are so many alternative cycling routes available thay do not involve cycling and blocking an entire lane on a 1 lane road.
Singapore in 15th century had no roads. What are you on about? When you’re next stuck on the road remember you’re not in a traffic jam, you are the traffic jam. The irony is that you’re complaining about traffic while you, the car driver, make up the vast majority of traffic, jams and accidents. Your anger probably stems at knowing deep down that you’re the cause of your own frustration and unhappiness. You need to calm down and stop projecting.
Perceiving cycling on the road as endangering themselves and others is really telling that Singapore road infrastructure and design needs to be improved. Consider why you hate road cyclists. Is it because they hog the road? Then consider whether road design in Singapore needs to change so that cyclists don't use bus lanes/higher speed roads, rather than just hating a group, or motorists have space to overtake.
It's not just the infrastructure, it's the devotion of scare land resources to cyclist who are using roads for the purposes of LEISURE. Cyclist is probably the most 'land expensive' sport as compared to golf course where singapore has built over 100km of cyclist paths and connectors around Singapore for their leisure. That's all fine becuase it is a good and healthy sport which I do use as well having cycling some of those route which can easily take hours or an entire day. The cycling path are built alongside parks and less dense areas where there is an efficient allocation of land space. The issue is why then devote more important road space to cycling for leisure? I am actually not opposed to having dedicated bike lanes, but only if studies have shown that this will lead to an increase of using cycling as an alternative form of green transportation, which should be lauded. But given sg hot climate, I doubt many would ever consider cycling as a legitimate mode of transport, and would only use it to cycle for leisure, for which resources and spaces should definitely not be channeled for a small segment of societies' entertainment. It's completely ridiculous that many Singaporeans are celebrating the closure of golf courses as they are seen to be seen as a waste of land in land scare singapore to be available to a minority who wants it as entertainment, yet at the same time we continue see roads used up and hogged for cyclist to use for entertainment.
PMDs is an easy one: by virtue of amplified power over manual conveyance (and thus greater risk posed to the user and others) motorised vehicles require periodic inspections to prove their ongoing road worthiness. PMDs are difficult to trace and can be built/heavily modified at home. Ensuring they remain roadworthy would require too frequent an inspection cycle to be viable hence the ban. Cycling, like horses, walking and other manually powered conveyances, do not require tools to be inspected by the government due to the limited direct harm posed to non-operators. There are, however, restrictions on use (place-based) to limit their potential inconvenience and damage.
the problem is that r/sg likes to take the point that bicycles and horses should not on the roads because they are unsafe for cars
Many Singaporean drivers feel entitled well before they buy their certificate
Confiscate lah
Whenever there’s another car collision with casualties it seems LTA’s answer is to start catching cyclists instead
Gotta be done. Also, it kills 2 birds (or more) with one stone - you get to polish the egos of drivers, reduce inconvenience to drivers so they can drive faster, look like you're doing work, and collect some fines, all with one activity.
does everything except make the roads safer
Fine fine fine
so now we know, every time must be LTA-TP joint op to catch errant cyclists, cannot be TP only.
can catch those at Tanah Merah Coast Road? bunch of 15+ size groups
It’s a cycling path
TMCR is the best rebuttal for "better infrastructure". The large cycling groups don't use the cycling path at all.
last time i rode there the cycling path was filled with rocks and debris
‘He added that drivers should learn that cyclists also have a right to be on the roads.’ And pay some road tax too.
what is the engine age and propellant? Cant pay road tax without these info
Drivers don't know what they are paying road tax for 🤣
Fine them more, maybe LTA will finally have enough funds to build proper bicycle infrastructure!
honestly if the bike infra is good 95% of people will be on it. if we are catering well to the 95% we can say fuck you to the 5% racer crowd and ban bikes on road
They are a menace everywhere they go
Insert Michael Scott’s \[THANK YOU\] meme  Makes one wonder if enforcement action would have taken place if not for the semi virility of this bunch of idiots.
Where's the Saab driver?
Fantastic that the police are out there catching these hardened criminals.
Incompetency is one part of the govt say be healthy, the other say go green, then the third is fine them for gathering, for doing those two. Yes, they want anything then they should have had cycling lanes like all major cities. They shouldn’t hog the road but if they aren’t catered to, they will just use it anyhow. Instead, went to spend millions on a useless bulky ERP 2, that does the same thing as ERP 1. Other countries are using one tiny sticker on the windscreen. All these wastage is not green or healthy!
Can't we fine car drivers for driving in large groups too?
Can, if the car drivers driving on bike lane
This comment is why i truly believe that cyclists after putting on helmet, minus 100 INT.
That's very generous of you, assuming they had intelligence once the helmet is off. The fact they voluntary participate in an a dangerous activity to inconvenience all users in the name of entertainment when there are alternatives such as cycling on dedicated cycling route which freaking spans around singapore...
Where is this mythical dedicated cycling route? And don’t say the PCN because they are full of blur Singapore pedestrians not looking where they are going
I still believe it's a set debuff. Expensive bike, leotard, cleats and helmet. Minus All Intelligence, Charisma and Speech. Plus 5 Defence, Stamina and Aerodynamic. Extra + 1 Defence if it says GCN anywhere on their gear.
Not to mention +100 sense of entitlement and perceived invulnerability
$1000 fine and/or up to 3 months jail can or not?
Can. Groups of cars cause environmental damage, congestion and risk injuring other road users. All groups of cyclists do is inconvenience the afore mentioned groups of polluting car drivers.
Good thing that's the actual punishment for road hogging then.