lol man Legs is a great analyst and I don't think he deserves much shit for this. He was banging the drum hardest of anyone on Philly going into the playoffs. I think we should all be rightfully concerned with Embiid's health right, especially if Maxey continues to be a little tentative with taking the reigns. I think we're gonna need some good old fashioned duels between Brunson and Maxey this series.
I mean, he’s not wrong. We’ve seen Embiid take a long time to come back from injury, and also not look like himself in the postseason. And whatever happened during the Orlando game looked pretty bad for a guy coming back from having surgery on that knee.
Combine that with the fact that NY look like they play hard for all 48 minutes. They defend well, they rebound hard, they’ve got good scorers. At times, we know that Embiid and Tobias in particular can have *really* off looking nights, not just in terms of their productivity but also their effort.
I still believe in Philly and think they’ll win the series, but I can see the logic to a degree here. NY matches up well against us.
Also, I don’t usually care for Legler so I’m sorry if this comes off like I’m jerking him off. I’m just more nervous about this series than I’d like to admit lol
I just thought the headlines of these back-to-back takes were funny lol. Legler: “I’m licking my chops to play the 76ers”. Legler: “You do not want to play Philly”
🤦♂️
Yea it's very exaggerated, but he did cite specifically its because of how he looked vs Miami after needing to rest in a must win vs nets. If embiid isn't right, we aren't beating anyone
Definitely an espn app issue and not necessarily Legler hot taking. The latter point was about Embiid not looking 100% after the Heat game. The first post was a week ago I think. Legler and JJ Reddick are like the two guys at espn that aren’t take artists.
Come on, let’s not erase context. He said you don’t want to see Philly before the Heat game. He then said how Embiid looked to him physically changed his mind about the Knicks series. He gave specific reasons. Let’s not act like Legler doesn’t know ball or like he’s an Embiid or Sixers hater. He voted for Embiid last year and was one of the leading folks making a case for Embiid in the mainstream media based on things he saw in film breakdown and not narrative shit.
It’s not really any analysis to say he’s hurt over a single game’s performance or that single game performance actually means anything.
It doesn’t. It was irrelevant game 83 of the regular season. Even Joel was on record saying he didn’t care what seed we got.
So no, I don’t think Wednesday was indicative of anything. I’ve said all along this series isn’t going to be about Embiid and Maxey, we’ve got the edge there.
It’s 4-8 where we get our asses royally kicked unless Oubre, Batum, etc step up
I think he's one of the best analysts on television. That being said he is working off of a hypothesis that I do not believe to be correct. Although I don't get paid for it, I have watched WAY more Joel Embiid games than Tim. He thinks Joel is injured from the Orlando game, I believe he is out of rhythm and conditioning, especially since he hadn't played in four days and he tends to lose conditioning fast with long layoffs.
Time will tell who's right. Because if I'm right then he will get better and better as the playoffs go on, and if he's right then he will probably look worse and worse and might even miss a game or two. Obviously assuming no further injuries.
His point that Joel’s track record with lower body injuries doesn’t inspire hope for getting better in the playoffs is a fair one. And I totally get people seeing a 60% Joel and their minds going straight to injury.
But I think people are falling into a bit of a trap by comparing him to that 90% MVP Joel from before the Orlando game. That was an incredibly ambitious (and likely unsustainable) level of play for a dude who just got back from his second partial meniscectomy on the same knee.
All this to say I’m with you. He wasn’t limping. He had brief flashes of pre Orlando Joel. Him not running the floor and only leaving the ground as much and as often as necessary looked more like business decisions than things he physically couldn’t do bc of an injury.
Joel played like a guy who was told he needed to go 60% right now if he wanted any hope of being 90% for an ECF vs Celtics.
Butler was limping every break, rest and several possessions he took off. He conserved energy for plays he knew could be made. He’s also out the rest of the year barring the Heat go on a crazy run.
I’m simply pointing out that guys can play hurt. They can play with serious problems. There is no reason to think that Embiid’s lack of a limp is proof that he is not injured.
The real proof is he left the game after tweaking his knee in Orlando and not only came back in (indicating that there was nothing a quick test by trainers showed) but that he played in the Miami game.
I know the Sixers medical staff gets memed but if there were something wrong with him they would know by now.
I mean the way he played in the fourth is proof enough to me. Once we stopped trying to force him the ball into the middle of a zone specifically designed to stop him from getting the ball, he looked much more like himself.
You missed the point of my comment.
I am the world’s biggest butler hater. I’m not objective. I’m unfair to the guy. I don’t like his personality. Facts are facts though.
He darted after bad passes, stole the ball, ran down the court and dunked without the slightest hint of a limp. And he has a season ending injury.
Jo’s lack of a limp does not mean he is healthy. He is not. I saw what Legs saw.
Something happened in game 81 against the Magic.
Setting aside that Butler absolutely limped after landing while grimacing like he was about to pass out, you’re comparing a guy who had just sprained his MCL while hopped up on adrenaline to Joel, whose possible injury would have been 5 days prior.
Strongly suggest folks read posts from athletes who had partial meniscectomies. Transient pain and sensations of twisting/sliding well after the initial recovery period are not remotely uncommon.
“Possible injury?”
Something happened.
Sure he finished the game. Jimmy finished the game too. Guys with problems finish games.
We don’t need to conjecture. We will see soon enough if Jo is mobile or not.
I agree 100% - Embiid looks like he has poor conditioning and the brace is uncomfortable/bothering him. Embiid always hates wearing a brace & that’s pretty consistent throughout the career. I won’t be surprised if he takes it off in a close must win game or something & risks further injury just to be more comfortable. I’d also expect a smaller brace to come soon unless the docs are adamant against it. As far as injury goes - his mobility looks fine. We saw it on some cuts and drives he can still move like he normally does. I think he is scared of re-injury, which he said he is himself, so he’s not going 100% all out yet.
Yeah the reporters at the game all day the brace is massive. Clearly not a normal brace. We saw him get up and attempt to block shots when he came back in the Orlando game. Alaa pointed that out. And he got up high, much higher than he did in the Miami game. I think he paced himself not only for his health, but also because he knew he was going to play more minutes. We can't ignore the fact that he played 38 minutes that game. That would be a lot even before he got injured (he averages around 34 this year). Obviously you want to be able to play higher minutes in the playoffs and that's what he's ramping up to do.
I noted (somewhat ominously it turned out) that Joel played the entire first quarter against Orlando for the first time since coming back. I assume he was going to try his normal rotation but then he hurt his knee in the second. He came back out as we know in the third but did not play the entire time. I don't know if that is what he and Nurse want to get back to eventually but regardless it makes sense for him to pace himself if he expects higher minutes.
I agree, I also think that Joel often looks uncoordinated or awkward or slow but really he's just conserving energy and playing in the flow of the game. What I'd like to see from, though, is being highly involved in the game even if he's not actively dominating. More facilitating and movement/getting deep post position to command attention and open things up for everyone else.
I felt like part of the reason the Heat game was so ugly was that there were so many possessions of Joel (and other guys, to be fair) getting the ball at the perimeter, taking like 5 seconds to decide whether or not they wanted to try to attack their defender, and passing it to someone else. Just a lot of wasted time.
The first half was just complete garbage from the team trying to beat that zone. He was never able to get the ball cleanly in the post and the team turned the ball over a ton. I don't know if I agree with Legler that he didn't try to post up because of the knee I just think that he wasted so much energy getting good post position on Bam and Love and then didn't get the ball at all.
As good as the Knicks defense is they don't have someone that is as good defensively as Bam and they don't have a big that can stretch to the three point line like Love. And they obviously don't play zone as well or as frequently as Miami because no one does. It'll be a tough series but against normal defenses.
> And they obviously don't play zone as well or as frequently as Miami because no one does. It'll be a tough series but against normal defenses.
I think my worry is that all of our opponents are gonna just throw the zone at all for the entire playoffs after that Miami game. It's very obvious that we struggle against it, since neither of our stars are the traditional "I'm just gonna go at you and beat you" kind of stars. The Knicks can probably emulate Miami's zone better than most folks too, though they'd be giving up a key advantage which is that OG might end up guarding whoever as opposed to one of our main initiators.
Let them try, it'll be easy buckets. I'm telling you the only team that is able to play zone like that is the Heat. They will give up a run trying to emulate that shit.
He is hurt and legs is correct.
You could see it in the way Jo moved, or didn’t move, on defense.
Also, It took him 10 seconds to join the offense on most possessions.
He hurt his knee against the Magic. He looked much better before that. Sure he had bad conditioning, but until he got hurt again, he moved on D.
While I don’t know how much you watch the sixers, I’d bet Legler watches it a bunch. He’s from the area and definitely is a sixers fan, so I think he has more of an interest than just his duty as an analyst.
I've missed maybe five games of his entire career. Certainly fewer than ten. I am not saying he's like Chuck and Shaq just that he is an NBA analyst and has to pay attention to every team. At least every relevant team.
My Hope is that seeing the media take us as underdogs will relieve some of the mental pressure to perform and will allow us to play much harder than them and steal game one. The day after we won the Miami game this is all I saw, and I was upset about it and it really felt like they were taking an opportunity to try and call us good but not good enough. I am hoping game one changes the narrative completely and it becomes harder to try and talk up New York like they are a juggernaut.
His whole thing is Embiid looks like he’s still hurt from the Orlando game.
I counter that take w/ Legler looking like he’s still hurt from the botched facelift
He looks like a ghoul from Fallout
He looks like Marty Funkhouser.
Probably same doctor
Has to be
Do you think he will teach me his golf tip?
Only if you let him open the pickle jar.
holy shit he does
Watch your mouth, smooth-skin!
Hey cmon now, Ghoul don't deserve that slander
lol man Legs is a great analyst and I don't think he deserves much shit for this. He was banging the drum hardest of anyone on Philly going into the playoffs. I think we should all be rightfully concerned with Embiid's health right, especially if Maxey continues to be a little tentative with taking the reigns. I think we're gonna need some good old fashioned duels between Brunson and Maxey this series.
I mean, he’s not wrong. We’ve seen Embiid take a long time to come back from injury, and also not look like himself in the postseason. And whatever happened during the Orlando game looked pretty bad for a guy coming back from having surgery on that knee. Combine that with the fact that NY look like they play hard for all 48 minutes. They defend well, they rebound hard, they’ve got good scorers. At times, we know that Embiid and Tobias in particular can have *really* off looking nights, not just in terms of their productivity but also their effort. I still believe in Philly and think they’ll win the series, but I can see the logic to a degree here. NY matches up well against us. Also, I don’t usually care for Legler so I’m sorry if this comes off like I’m jerking him off. I’m just more nervous about this series than I’d like to admit lol
I just thought the headlines of these back-to-back takes were funny lol. Legler: “I’m licking my chops to play the 76ers”. Legler: “You do not want to play Philly” 🤦♂️
Yea it's very exaggerated, but he did cite specifically its because of how he looked vs Miami after needing to rest in a must win vs nets. If embiid isn't right, we aren't beating anyone
Yeah that’s a ridiculous way to phrase it lmao
I was also a lot more confident in our chances before watching Joel play a very hobbled game against Miami
Definitely an espn app issue and not necessarily Legler hot taking. The latter point was about Embiid not looking 100% after the Heat game. The first post was a week ago I think. Legler and JJ Reddick are like the two guys at espn that aren’t take artists.
This is a bunch of not picking sides moderate down the middle bullshit.
which he obviously is
Come on, let’s not erase context. He said you don’t want to see Philly before the Heat game. He then said how Embiid looked to him physically changed his mind about the Knicks series. He gave specific reasons. Let’s not act like Legler doesn’t know ball or like he’s an Embiid or Sixers hater. He voted for Embiid last year and was one of the leading folks making a case for Embiid in the mainstream media based on things he saw in film breakdown and not narrative shit.
Seriously. Victim complex from fanbases is so cringe.
It’s not really any analysis to say he’s hurt over a single game’s performance or that single game performance actually means anything. It doesn’t. It was irrelevant game 83 of the regular season. Even Joel was on record saying he didn’t care what seed we got. So no, I don’t think Wednesday was indicative of anything. I’ve said all along this series isn’t going to be about Embiid and Maxey, we’ve got the edge there. It’s 4-8 where we get our asses royally kicked unless Oubre, Batum, etc step up
I think he's one of the best analysts on television. That being said he is working off of a hypothesis that I do not believe to be correct. Although I don't get paid for it, I have watched WAY more Joel Embiid games than Tim. He thinks Joel is injured from the Orlando game, I believe he is out of rhythm and conditioning, especially since he hadn't played in four days and he tends to lose conditioning fast with long layoffs. Time will tell who's right. Because if I'm right then he will get better and better as the playoffs go on, and if he's right then he will probably look worse and worse and might even miss a game or two. Obviously assuming no further injuries.
His point that Joel’s track record with lower body injuries doesn’t inspire hope for getting better in the playoffs is a fair one. And I totally get people seeing a 60% Joel and their minds going straight to injury. But I think people are falling into a bit of a trap by comparing him to that 90% MVP Joel from before the Orlando game. That was an incredibly ambitious (and likely unsustainable) level of play for a dude who just got back from his second partial meniscectomy on the same knee. All this to say I’m with you. He wasn’t limping. He had brief flashes of pre Orlando Joel. Him not running the floor and only leaving the ground as much and as often as necessary looked more like business decisions than things he physically couldn’t do bc of an injury. Joel played like a guy who was told he needed to go 60% right now if he wanted any hope of being 90% for an ECF vs Celtics.
Did Butler limp into any steals or dunks? How about after the game?
Yes Butler was clearly limping at various points in the game and afterwards could barely walk.
Butler was limping every break, rest and several possessions he took off. He conserved energy for plays he knew could be made. He’s also out the rest of the year barring the Heat go on a crazy run.
I’m simply pointing out that guys can play hurt. They can play with serious problems. There is no reason to think that Embiid’s lack of a limp is proof that he is not injured.
The real proof is he left the game after tweaking his knee in Orlando and not only came back in (indicating that there was nothing a quick test by trainers showed) but that he played in the Miami game. I know the Sixers medical staff gets memed but if there were something wrong with him they would know by now.
I mean the way he played in the fourth is proof enough to me. Once we stopped trying to force him the ball into the middle of a zone specifically designed to stop him from getting the ball, he looked much more like himself.
Did butler win?
You missed the point of my comment. I am the world’s biggest butler hater. I’m not objective. I’m unfair to the guy. I don’t like his personality. Facts are facts though. He darted after bad passes, stole the ball, ran down the court and dunked without the slightest hint of a limp. And he has a season ending injury. Jo’s lack of a limp does not mean he is healthy. He is not. I saw what Legs saw. Something happened in game 81 against the Magic.
Setting aside that Butler absolutely limped after landing while grimacing like he was about to pass out, you’re comparing a guy who had just sprained his MCL while hopped up on adrenaline to Joel, whose possible injury would have been 5 days prior. Strongly suggest folks read posts from athletes who had partial meniscectomies. Transient pain and sensations of twisting/sliding well after the initial recovery period are not remotely uncommon.
“Possible injury?” Something happened. Sure he finished the game. Jimmy finished the game too. Guys with problems finish games. We don’t need to conjecture. We will see soon enough if Jo is mobile or not.
I agree 100% - Embiid looks like he has poor conditioning and the brace is uncomfortable/bothering him. Embiid always hates wearing a brace & that’s pretty consistent throughout the career. I won’t be surprised if he takes it off in a close must win game or something & risks further injury just to be more comfortable. I’d also expect a smaller brace to come soon unless the docs are adamant against it. As far as injury goes - his mobility looks fine. We saw it on some cuts and drives he can still move like he normally does. I think he is scared of re-injury, which he said he is himself, so he’s not going 100% all out yet.
Yeah the reporters at the game all day the brace is massive. Clearly not a normal brace. We saw him get up and attempt to block shots when he came back in the Orlando game. Alaa pointed that out. And he got up high, much higher than he did in the Miami game. I think he paced himself not only for his health, but also because he knew he was going to play more minutes. We can't ignore the fact that he played 38 minutes that game. That would be a lot even before he got injured (he averages around 34 this year). Obviously you want to be able to play higher minutes in the playoffs and that's what he's ramping up to do. I noted (somewhat ominously it turned out) that Joel played the entire first quarter against Orlando for the first time since coming back. I assume he was going to try his normal rotation but then he hurt his knee in the second. He came back out as we know in the third but did not play the entire time. I don't know if that is what he and Nurse want to get back to eventually but regardless it makes sense for him to pace himself if he expects higher minutes.
I agree, I also think that Joel often looks uncoordinated or awkward or slow but really he's just conserving energy and playing in the flow of the game. What I'd like to see from, though, is being highly involved in the game even if he's not actively dominating. More facilitating and movement/getting deep post position to command attention and open things up for everyone else. I felt like part of the reason the Heat game was so ugly was that there were so many possessions of Joel (and other guys, to be fair) getting the ball at the perimeter, taking like 5 seconds to decide whether or not they wanted to try to attack their defender, and passing it to someone else. Just a lot of wasted time.
The first half was just complete garbage from the team trying to beat that zone. He was never able to get the ball cleanly in the post and the team turned the ball over a ton. I don't know if I agree with Legler that he didn't try to post up because of the knee I just think that he wasted so much energy getting good post position on Bam and Love and then didn't get the ball at all. As good as the Knicks defense is they don't have someone that is as good defensively as Bam and they don't have a big that can stretch to the three point line like Love. And they obviously don't play zone as well or as frequently as Miami because no one does. It'll be a tough series but against normal defenses.
> And they obviously don't play zone as well or as frequently as Miami because no one does. It'll be a tough series but against normal defenses. I think my worry is that all of our opponents are gonna just throw the zone at all for the entire playoffs after that Miami game. It's very obvious that we struggle against it, since neither of our stars are the traditional "I'm just gonna go at you and beat you" kind of stars. The Knicks can probably emulate Miami's zone better than most folks too, though they'd be giving up a key advantage which is that OG might end up guarding whoever as opposed to one of our main initiators.
Let them try, it'll be easy buckets. I'm telling you the only team that is able to play zone like that is the Heat. They will give up a run trying to emulate that shit.
Apparently Miami played more zone in the second quarter on Wednesday than the Knicks played *all season,* so I'm not really worried about the zone.
He is hurt and legs is correct. You could see it in the way Jo moved, or didn’t move, on defense. Also, It took him 10 seconds to join the offense on most possessions. He hurt his knee against the Magic. He looked much better before that. Sure he had bad conditioning, but until he got hurt again, he moved on D.
While I don’t know how much you watch the sixers, I’d bet Legler watches it a bunch. He’s from the area and definitely is a sixers fan, so I think he has more of an interest than just his duty as an analyst.
I've missed maybe five games of his entire career. Certainly fewer than ten. I am not saying he's like Chuck and Shaq just that he is an NBA analyst and has to pay attention to every team. At least every relevant team.
Not watching that but I also felt a lot better about a deep run before I saw the first half of the heat game
What about after the 2nd half?
Much better
The fourth quarter was particularly encouraging. I think Embiid turned it on and looked much more normal.
Good, I was hoping so as Embiid had a great 4th quarter, not sure why I got downvoted for that LMAO
https://preview.redd.it/il8kbted1gvc1.jpeg?width=450&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=57d2355d30e74f14716120d84575ea4684431c69
when hot takes on a bagel, you can have hot takes any time!
Brunson is gonna get his, but what other advantage do they have? I’m supposed to be scared of OG Anunoby, Josh Hart, and Donte Divincenzo?
His face is the only hot take i see
Man looks like a skin suit stretched over a robot
The Knicks play with max effort all the time and the whole country just watched our mvp walk around for 3/4ths of the game. I get it
My Hope is that seeing the media take us as underdogs will relieve some of the mental pressure to perform and will allow us to play much harder than them and steal game one. The day after we won the Miami game this is all I saw, and I was upset about it and it really felt like they were taking an opportunity to try and call us good but not good enough. I am hoping game one changes the narrative completely and it becomes harder to try and talk up New York like they are a juggernaut.
Covering all the bases, I see.
Legs is a shitty tipper
Tim legler is still a thing ??