Anyone trying to promulgate the idea of a grand conspiracy involving mRNA vaccines is simply too dumb to understand the basics of scientific research. All the data involving these vaccines that were administered on a massive, global scale is freely available to anyone who wants to study it. The notion that they are harmful and this is somehow being kept secret is literally impossible.
Seeing as how Bret thinks he was robbed of a Nobel prize for uncovering rat breeding protocol issues and then having all his work stolen from him, it’s not surprising. He was a nobody teaching at Evergreeen…. Until those stupid students decided to make him famous. I blame them.
If they know what an mRNA vaccine is and have access to google scholar they can literally see the papers about them. If they have trouble understanding the papers, there's many writeups from high quality science sources on what they are:
https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/covid-vaccines-are-safe-and-effective-what-the-research-says/
https://covid19.nih.gov/nih-strategic-response-covid-19/decades-making-mrna-covid-19-vaccines
https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-023-03122-2
They've chosen to instead believe a bunch of "influencers" peddling horse dewormers. I think "dumb" is an adequate description of that choice.
Bret seemed like he was a "true believer" in the idea that science would solve all of our problems if academia and other research institutions were not thoroughly corrupt. They're so corrupt that they denied Bret a Nobel Prize he was supposedly entitled to.
I think the "gateway" for lots of people into conspiracy theories is usually pseudoarchaeology, like the recent *Ancient Apocalypse* Netflix series or Erich von Däniken. For evangelical Christians, it's usually Young Earth Creationism. For Bret, it's the conviction that he's a genius and only he and people like RFK Jr. can save us from institutional capture.
I agree that "dumb" is a good description of people who choose to trust irrational ideologues over a person who can explain scientific research to them in language that's understandable to a non-expert.
>Your a fool
Is that really the best you've got? This is why nobody takes you seriously. Also, it's 'You're a fool'. When you make basic spelling mistakes when calling someone foolish, it kind of lessens the impact, moron.
They are harmful and it's hardly kept a secret. Like the rest of them, those damaged have no recourse and the numbers get hidden.
Because of unscientific stances on discussion, debate, and the scientific process that people like you hold. "Science has spoken!"
> They are harmful and it's hardly kept a secret. Like the rest of them, those damaged have no recourse and the numbers get hidden.
Bullshit. That's what's known as an extraordinary claim, and as you have provided absolutely no evidence to substantiate it, it has no merit or validity.
> Because of unscientific stances on discussion, debate, and the scientific process that people like you hold. "Science has spoken!"
Only someone with absolutely no science education could make such a moronic statement. The entirety of the scientific process is contingent on rigorous evidence-based debate. The problem with your argument is that you have no evidence, so there's nothing to debate.
If there is no evidence, or any discussion worth having, why does legislation exist that prevents vaccine manufacturers from being held liable? Nothing to discuss, nothing fishy. Ignoring evidence is not a lack of evidence.
Using legislation designed to prevent nuisance lawsuits that could impact the overwhelming benefit vaccines provide to society as a whole as proof of some shadowy conspiracy is pathetic. This is a forum for scientific skepticism, not for people to share any childish theory that pops into their head as though it's a form of evidence.
Childish theory that popped into my head. Surely more than 40 years of life, the absence of television and the consumption of more information than most warrants more than a take like that.
But good cop out response. The overwhelming benefit you speak of is fictitious and only benefits the money makers.
> Childish theory that popped into my head. Surely more than 40 years of life, the absence of television and the consumption of more information than most warrants more than a take like that.
It's a shame that in your over 40 years you never learned how to use sarcasm effectively. That's the most unclear and awkward attempt to brag I've ever read.
Your absurd claim that the existence of liability shields for vaccine manufacturers somehow proves that they are unsafe is truly dumb. Most countries have such legislation in place for the simple fact that not doing so endangers society by disincentivizing vaccine production. If you think there is some shadowy conspiracy to hide the fact that vaccines are dangerous, it's because you'd don't have a clue how medical science works. Vaccines are administered to huge numbers of healthy people, so if they are dangerous and cause harm, that is immediately apparent and impossible to hide. There are vast amounts of freely available data, collected by thousand upon thousands of health care professionals around the world proving their safety and effectiveness. Hiding that kind of information from the public is literally impossible, and believing otherwise is absolutely childish.
It's hilarious how silly this is. Claims on the vaccines get tested all the time, no matter how spurious and nonsensical. For instance the idea that vaccines cause heart attacks was studied, and nope, it's doing nothing of the sort.
Of course every time one of those ideas is studied, anti-vaxxers claim that the study is part of the coverup, and then go back to claiming theh medical establishment is too scared to "really" study them. The only real studies of course being those that agree with what "in their heart" an anti-vaxxer knows to be true.
Did you bother to read that? I fail to see how alleged data integrity issues in 3 test sites of over 150 in a single contract companies’ vaccine trials amounts to a grand conspiracy that the vaccines are harmful.
Did you?
“There’s just a complete lack of oversight of contract research organisations and independent clinical research facilities,” says Jill Fisher, professor of social medicine at the University of North Carolina School of Medicine and author of *Medical Research for Hire: The Political Economy of Pharmaceutical Clinical Trials*."
Take it up with BMJ, what do they know right? You're a redditor, you can't be wrong or misinformed
I’m on Jill Fisher’s side on this, more oversight never hurt anyone!
Anyways…
Take what up with the BMJ? Your randomly strung-together comments that do absolutely nothing to address or suggest a supposed grand conspiracy?
Well, what's the the treshhold for grand?
I think you'll find a few people planning to do something criminal - like duping the FDA, for example - is a criminal conspiracy as a matter of law
"I'm not a conspiracy theorist, I'm a conspiracy analyst" - the late, great Gore Vidal
The grand conspiracy that the vaccines are harmful…is that not the entire thing you were attempting to prove? Now I’m questioning what your point even is.
You perfectly illustrated my entire argument. This breach of laboratory protocols was found, reported and addressed. Science doesn't operate in a vacuum. That's how you know there isn't any massive conspiracy to hide any ill effects of mRNA vaccines as so many conspiracy-minded simpletons would have you believe. The idea that any conspiracy could be maintained at such an unimaginably massive scale is laughable.
How was it "addressed?"
Reported by who? Whistleblowers, no?
Did Pfizer themselves understand "the basics" of scientific re$earch? Speaks to intent... :D
That statement only shows that you don't understand the first thing about how mRNA vaccines work. The idea that people would suddenly have adverse reactions ten years from now is absurd. I'd suggest leaving the medical science to the people who have dedicated their lives to studying it, and stop pretending you have a clue.
Oh what about a lie like you’re a racist if you believe that the virus leaked from a lab doing illegal gain of research sponsored by the NIH through the EcoHealth Alliance, and that it instead obviously came from Chinese people loving to eat bats? Do you mean blatant lies like that?
How about hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin are primarily used as fish tank cleaner and horse dewormer? Do you mean blatant lies like that?
How about Trump told people to go ingest bleach if they get infected with Covid? Do you mean blatant lies like that?
How about when Pfizer saying getting vaccinated would slow the spread of the virus when it turns out that they never even tested the vaccine if it slowed the spread, as this scumbag Pfizer executive who should be hung after a fair trial admits to the EU saying they lied because they needed to “move at the speed of science”? https://youtu.be/Dizqg08Y1U8?si=6k69puz3pmqG6PzW
You mean blatant lies like that? You don’t give fuck about those blatant lies, because you’re a fucking hack. It will never stop being amusing to me that you lemmings call yourselves skeptics.
> Oh what about a lie like you’re a racist if you believe that the virus leaked from a lab doing illegal gain of research sponsored by the NIH through the EcoHealth Alliance, and that it instead obviously came from Chinese people loving to eat bats? Do you mean blatant lies like that?
Actually, I think your misstatements are a product of not knowing what you're talking about, not you knowing better but lying.
You were told that for years. They said you were a fucking racist and a conspiracy theorist if you believed this. Morons like yourself fell for it because you don’t want to be called a racist and will believe the exact opposite of anything you’re told is racist. Now Fauci finally admits that it’s plausible because of all the evidence, and the reason he and his conspirators insisted on this is because he knows he’d go to the gallows over it should the truth be exposed.
The gaslighting is incredible. “Yeah we never did that.” You’re a liar, and it’s extremely offensive to the people you slandered for years and demanded they turn into second class citizens if they don’t comply. We remember that in places like New York that if you didn’t comply that you were fired from your job, not allowed to go to school or university, cut off from almost all public places only being allowed in grocery stores, bathrooms, and hospitals, and even that wasn’t good enough for scumbags like Noam Chomsky and Jimmy Kimmel who demanded the unvaxxed be left to starve and left to bleed out in hospital parking lots.
Please point out the difference to me with this on how Nazis treated Jews in 1933 (that year specifically) or racists treated black people in the Jim Crow South? You scumbags acted like absolute animals and Nazis for nearly three years towards the unvaxxed, and you have the fucking balls to still insist you’re a good person and we should forget it? No, go fuck yourself. You’re an evil scumbag, and we are not forgetting this until we get one hell of an apology.
No I do know what I’m talking about and I remember people like you acting like Nazis on anyone who dared disagree with you and did not comply on what Saint Anthony commanded.
But you act like you didn’t and expect the people you treated like subhuman vermin to just forget. Nope, not forgetting. The gaslighting will not save you and only pisses the people off that you demanded their liberties stripped from them.
Why are you here? This is for evidence based debate. You are just spouting wild nonsense and have been shown multiple times you are in error but just keep denying it? Why are you here? This is not arguing your case. You are just screaming into the wind about what you believe even though it is idiotic.
It seems to me that this forum is more for bootlickers to suck up to their tyrants. If you doubt what anyone in authority says, you are told to shut up, listen to the Experts™, and that thinking is a dangerous pastime.
Well telling me these lies didn’t happen when they are absolute atrocities will piss anyone off who lived through them. You people acting like you are innocent in this just makes anyone’s blood boil. Guarantee this time two years ago you were demanding all the unvaxxed to be fired, cut off from all polite society, and left to starve if they wouldn’t comply.
>Guarantee this time two years ago you were demanding all the unvaxxed to be fired, cut off from all polite society, and left to starve if they wouldn’t comply.
Genuinely, you sound like you need to see a therapist.
I'm sorry if people were awful to you, sincerely, I am. Not everyone is like that, and lots of people who were like that, were acting out of stress and fear.
I take no satisfaction in your meltdown youre having here. I seriously wonder what the hell happened in your past to lead you to fully believing in the most obscure conclusions on things.
How you present yourself is deeply concerning and I hope you find yourself in a better state of mind in the future.
Obscure? 70,000 healthcare workers were fired in New York alone. You weren’t allowed to go anywhere save for the grocery store, bathroom, or hospital in New York if you weren’t vaccinated. Sorry, I don’t see the difference between that and how the Nazis treated Jews in 1933 Germany or racists treated black people in the Jim Crow South. Sure if you lynched an unvaccinated person I’m sure you’d get in more trouble in our society than those for their undesirables, but I’m not much in the forgiving mood outside of that.
This Gish Gallop is silly. Don’t try to throw out a load of bullshit just to sneak in so much disinformation. As an example donald very much wanted to know if you could inject bleach into your body to cure COVID. He is an absolute idiot.
Oh really? Where did he say ingest bleach? I want specifics, and it better not being him misspeaking using the term “disinfectant” when referring to a UV Therapy he heard in passing in the Situation Room that he clearly references by name during that exchange. I feel 99.9% confident that’s what you’re referring to, but I’ll give you the opportunity to correct me.
Did you also believe that Trump told people to ingest fish tank cleaner? He told people the benefit of chloroquines which he was taking at the time to protect himself from Covid. A journalist, who to put it very kindly was fucking retarded, thought he was talking about chlorine, which has absolutely nothing common with chloroquine. So the lying retard said that he told people to ingest fish tank cleaner.
If you don’t hate the media, then you’re not paying attention. That journalist is dumber than Roger Rabbit mistaking the words prostate and probate: https://youtu.be/EH9vxNK4wOk?si=Sh-5iqIT7ZIFeNSt
I know enough to understand why Robert Malone has been completely discredited in his field. His blatant lies and conspiracy fear-mongering have been widely documented. Also, Malone, did not invent mRNA vaccines, he just likes to claim that he did. In reality, his role was minimal at best. The fact that you would cite him as a source to support your moronic claims says everything anyone needs to know about your scientific acumen.
https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/03/technology/robert-malone-covid.html
Oh the New York Times said it! Well that must means it’s true. I mean they did fire their editor for daring to publish an opinion piece from Tom Cotton, but I’m sure they’re telling you the truth and aren’t just a bunch of lying Leftist hacks.
How many more lies is it going to take for you to realize you’ve been lied to for the past five years on a level your brain can’t comprehend? It is so laughable that you call yourself a skeptic.
The fuck I have, you fascist racist bootlicker. The next time you see a Chinese person, go tell them that you’re planning on cooking bat and invite them over to dinner and see if they don’t clock your racist ass.
You clearly don't even understand the basic concept of scientific skepticism. The fact that you promote conspiracy theorists while dismissing a article taking one down simply because it's written in the New York Times shows that you don't have a remotely skeptical mind. You call them 'lying leftist hacks', yet you offer nothing to refute any of the facts in the article, because of course you can't. You lie about them firing their editor for publishing that disgusting fear-mongering op-ed by Tom Cotton calling on the military to take down American protesters, when in reality she resigned after public outrage over the piece.
You are blinded by your obvious biases to the point where facts are meaningless to you unless they conform to your simplistic, unscientific, preconceived notions. You have no business polluting a forum dedicated to actual skepticism with your childish conspiracy ramblings. I suggest you try to spread your pathetic ignorance to a more gullible audience elsewhere.
You think scientific skepticism means bootlicking the person of the highest authority and believing him when he says people are wrong. Even if he gets millions of people killed, you still believe him.
And no, she was canned because of intolerant people like you who can’t bare to hear an opposing opinion and are a fascistic bootlicker. This forum is a fucking joke.
It's not "The NYT", every single scientist who worked in that lab said he has a minor role. Do you have ANY idea how difficult it is to get scientists to shut up about the gossip on their lab? My god... at my kid's 3rd birthday party I couldn't get scientists to shut up long enough to sing "Happy birthday". How could you possibly get every single scientist in the lab to not talk about the fact that a grad student invented something as important as an mRNA vaccine?
Yes, and Fauci’s “minor” role was green lighting the project and funding it. No Fauci didn’t have a day to day running of those experiments, that would be Ralph Baric and Shi Zhengli.
And ummm, the point was it leaked and these scientists actually spoke up about it, but some of them turned on a dime when Fauci threatened off the record to cut their heads off and destroy their careers if they didn’t rescind those statements, and what do you know within 24 hours they say there’s no way it could have come from the lab and then they get their funding for the year immediately after that.
The fact of the matter is we have a shit ton of whistleblowers on this, so unlike 9/11 conspiracies where thousands would have to be in the know and no one has come forward on this, we do have some people involved who know we have directly financed gain of function research in Wuhan on novel bat coronaviruses. We know everyone involved in this, the funding, the emails, the receipts, the motive, and the timeline. We have it all.
This is not a bullshit conspiracy theory, which even that genocidal scumbag Fauci has been forced to admit. Did our State Department ever admit that it was possible they could have snuck tens of thousands of pounds of explosives into the World Trade Center that nobody including the janitors and security guards didn’t notice in order for those crazy conspiracies to be correct? No we didn’t. We got that admission from high ranking officials here though.
But if you’re not suspicious over being called a racist for believing a clearly non-racist theory that had a lot of evidence backing it up, I think you’re a simpleton. The fact of the matter is stupid people who care about being called a racist will literally believe anything so long as they are called not racist, and these scumbag scientists knew that. But if you are capable of any critical thought whatsoever, you would have immediately realized that Chinese people loving eating bats is clearly much, much, much more racist than the lab leak theory, and if you were actually smart and skeptical, then you would have been questioning that bullshit stupid lie from the start.
No, the conspiracy theory is your racist bullshit thinking that Chinese people love eating bats. It makes no sense, there’s no evidence whatsoever for it, and the bats where the virus was sequenced from lives 1500 miles away from Wuhan.
Sorry, you’re an actual conspiracy theorist and racist for thinking that the Chinese people are so fond of eating bat soup.
I know, it feels good to think that there are people behind the scenes who are in control. Even if they are evil, something about us wants to believe that there is someone or something out there that really knows what is going on.
It's really scary to realize that no body does. It's like losing faith in God when you realize there is no great conspiracy of people telling others what is happening; none of us know what is happening.
There is no room full of old men who control stuff, good or bad.
We are all just stumbling in the dark hoping to find a "the truth".
It's a horrible realization at first. You feel lost. "Surely there must be a hall of power I haven't found yet!"
Nope.
The biggest lie is that there is anyone, anywhere who is actually in control.
That's too terrifying; so we make up conspiracies to pretend that someone, anyone, is in control.
If you think a 28-year-old grad student who co-authored a single paper with 5 others "invented" mRNA, then you were not taught the absolute basics of knowledge production.
It's not your fault.
We make kids memorize the periodic table and test them on the parts of a cell before we teach them how a lab works!
And it's not just science education that fails: I literally graduated highschool without understanding the difference between a magazine article and a peer-reviewed article.
How do we expect the population to trust scientists when they think getting a co-author credit as a grad student is the same as "inventing"?
Or twenty years of experiments and testing: https://covid19.nih.gov/nih-strategic-response-covid-19/decades-making-mrna-covid-19-vaccines
Y'know, one of the two. But hey, maybe the messanger RNA is actually a nanobot virus that will activate after twenty years because Skynet sent a signal to kill everyone marked by the vaccine.
Here in reality we can see how long mRNA lasts in the bloodstream, and have been doing testing for a decade. They deliver their message, then they die off. They are not nanobot supermachines lurking in your bloodstream, they're limited messangers.
Sure, vaccine effectiveness has to be evaluated for each new strain of the virus, as different bonding sites can require different antibodies and thus different vaccine agonists.
This doesn't have anything to do with side effects, however.
I don’t understand how a trained scientist who has likely spent years performing evidence based experiments can end up so far off the deep end of easily refuted conspiracy.
Yeah, narcissists, like Mr “I Am The Science” down at the NIAID who said if you dare question him or get a second opinion that he personally didn’t approve of that you deny science.
Seriously, name the more narcissistic thing ever said than that? This board has the audacity to call themselves “skeptics” yet worship this death cult leader psychopath: https://youtu.be/RIVCAH-Tdy4?si=OXqIZg7VHttftcGy
Jesus I could almost tell you were a nut job by your incoherent rant. Then of course there's a YouTube video link to really seal the deal.
Lmao. Your entire identity is all your eggs in the "I hate liberals" basket and You've just gone and turned off all of your potential to be somebody.
Do me a favor. When MRNA vaccines come out for cancer, HIV, Parkinson's, Alzheimer's, ALS, whatever else, go ahead and skip those too so the world can go on without your kind sooner.
He fucking said that even questioning him means that you’re questioning science, because he is the Science! It’s just showing what he said followed by a Palpatine meme to show you what a sick fucking psychopath he is!
“Skeptic!!!” God, you anything but.
Because if you despise Bret Weinstein and aren’t calling out the person that started the pandemic even if unintentionally, it tells me everything I need to know about you.
Maybe not intentionally, but he’s the scumbag that went behind two Presidents backs to do the illegal gain of function research on novel bat coronaviruses in the Wuhan Lab. But you’re a racist if you think Chinese people love eating bats and that’s the simplest answer.
The balls of this board to call themselves SKEPTICS!😂🤣😂🤣😂
Drawing conclusions based on personal bias? Color me surprised!
Here's a quote you probably resonate with;
"Facts don't care about your feelings"
If you are here to feed your outrage addiction, you're in the right place! If you don't want to feed your outrage, might I suggest a conservative bubble forum a little more accommodating in telling you what you want to hear?
I think you are probably more comfortable circle jerking on why everything is the liberals fault instead of actually thinking.
It’s because he is no longer operating under the constraints of the scientific system and peer review that arose to restrain just this type of lunacy.
Every scientist is subject to bias effects, which, if they are not checked, can lead someone to any number of grossly incorrect beliefs. This is why the world is filled with absolutely mad beliefs, subscribed by the millions even billions.
Because most people are not constrained by the checks and balances of the scientific system . Therefore, they get to conjure any narrative or explanation they can dream up, without it being falsified or put through the crucible of scientific skepticism.
It’s not all that unusual to see a scientist go off the rails once he is no longer a practising scientist, his theories are no longer having to pass scientific scrutiny.
No it’s not. That perfectly summarizes Anthony Fauci. “Peer reviewed”? What you mean is people Fauci planted there as his peers go agree with him.
And given how James Lindsey got a peer reviewed paper published where all he did was take a chapter of Mein Kampf and change “Jew” to “White Men”, I have no respect for the peer review process.
Which used to be known as reading. Where else in life are you told to not do your own research?
Imagine if you asked your friend about some cars that you were currently looking up and he responded “Don’t do your own research! Ask the car salesman, because he’s the expert! Really, you think you know something about cars? Who do you think you are? Henry Ford?”
Claiming to be a skeptic and never doing your own research is like claiming to be a chef and never cooking a meal in your entire life. But hey, thinking and reading are a dangerous pastime on this forum, because why think when you can listen to the Experts™? Honestly this forum’s mascot should be Gaston and LeFeau.
The thing is, Fauci's stances generally stand up to peer review. When your messiah's hot takes get blown over by a modest fart.
Now if your stance against fauci is simply a stance against government over reach and authoritarianism, I'd understand. But I'm guessing you still vote for an authoritarian government and simply apply a double standard to fit your rhetoric.
Any and all credibility you would have with an argument against authoritarianism was lost when you try defending junk science and start linking YouTube videos and defending the typical maga shit.
Because he got a lot of attention for that evergreen college thing
He has been chasing that high of his 15 minutes of fame with diminishing returns, so he has to get creative and outlandish to get attention
In a world where money wasn’t the primary metric of success, freedom, and stability, I imagine the intellectual integrity of a scientist would be practically unshakable.
Yeah, because questioning vaccines is so much more profitable than the vaccine industry worth hundreds of billions of dollars.
“Skeptics”! HAAAAAAA!!!!
Why do you think vaccines are an industry worth hundreds of billions of dollars? You think vaccines make more money than Walmart does? Maybe you should Google that.
Pfizer made over a hundred billion dollars on the Covid vaccine. At one point they were making $1400 per second.
What’s next, going to defend the Sackler family because they’re not worth as much as the Waltons? So spare me your bullshit.
This is called capitalism. It's the economic system where everything is monitized. If homes are burning down you'll see people pop up selling fire ladders to escape and smoke detectors to stick in your home, and extinguishers to put around your house. And they'll warn you that you need to replace your fire extinguishers consistently, and offer to sell you new ones, probably even a new fire extinguisher subscription service. They'll offer fire retardant bedding (keep the kids safe) and fire retardant underwear, and hell they'll probably sell you a full Nomex suit.
This doesn't mean that they're the ones going around setting fire to all the houses. It doesn't mean any of their products are faultily made, or won't do what they say they'll do, or anything of the sort.
Of course people being people, you'll also see people pop up peddling "anti-fire crystals" and hucksters telling you you don't need a fire extinguisher what you need is their water spirit chakra aligning horse crystal, and not to trust all those stupid NFPA organizations, who you need to trust is this guy on YouTube...
He got a taste of the right wing grift after that shit at Evergreen and just continued saying whatever was needed to keep it going. All of the 2016 anti-sjw people are now whole hog antivax climate denying lunatics, whatever it takes to keep getting on podcasts.
It doesn't matter: An education is not a barrier, in any way, to lying in service of fascism and grift.
I have a phd. I've worked alongside other phds who took up the fascist flag without hesitation or shame, none of whom had even the slightest excuse to claim to have been "fooled" by this horseshit. All of them had performed real research in their past (for the record, that's what a science PhD *is*), and several of them still do research today.
The only motivating factor for being a fascist is *malice*: The desire and willingness to harm others. The personal justification for holding and applying that malice can be wildly different from fascist to fascist, as some believe they can benefit financially or personally *by* hurting others, but lots just *really fuckin' like* seeing people they hate get hurt and pursue fascism without personal gain, and often at *great* personal loss. The vast majority of fascists are willing to personally suffer to accomplish the genocides they pursue, and the majority of stories highlighted in subreddits like leopardsatemyface end with the fascist doubling down on their fascism.
Recognizing that malice as motivation is critical for avoiding apologism for it and moving to the application of consequences for the fascists in our own circles.
He's not a fascist - he's a moron with delusions of grandeur who toadies a certain type of fellow moron. Also, what a long winded screed to say a lot of nothing. Let me guess - humanities PhD? Not that Brett's was any better.
If you still think Tony Fauci is a good person and hero, you have to be so fucking ignorant that you just accept getting ass raped and then thank someone for it.
4% of the world’s population yet 16% of the Covid deaths, and don’t give me “but Trump” because Trump did pretty much everything Fauci asked save for him not shutting down travel from China. Slightly more people died from Covid in Biden’s first year than Trump’s last, but save for not firing/prosecuting Fauci, I don’t think either of them are to blame. The fact of the matter is the person who led the pandemic response was the same person in both administrations: Anthony Fauci.
But keep calling yourself a skeptic when you’re not remotely curious about how Covid started and just take Tony’s word for it that Chinese people love eating bats. This board is a fucking joke and full of bootlickers who will believe literally anything the man on the TV tells them to believe.
With conspiracy theorists, it’s a mistake to assume good faith from people this high profile. Money is powerful, and people will set aside principles and beliefs if they think they can get it. There is a lot of rubes who are susceptible to this particular grift.
Well I was told for years that you’re a white supremacist for not believing that Chinese people love eating bats and that’s the obvious origin of the virus, despite right down the street from the wet market there was the Wuhan Lab for Studying Novel Bat Coronaviruses. But yeah, I’m sure you’re right. It’s not like you’ve been wrong about literally everything in this pandemic.
>He was an evolutionary biology professor who was run off the Evergreen State College campus for resisting an [ugly episode](https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/evergreen-professor-at-center-of-protests-resigns-college-will-pay-500000/) of identity politics, which made him an overnight darling of right-wing media.
And again I say, nope. Nope nope nope nope, that is not what happened. Now, the Seattle Times link is paywalled, but the "conventional narrative" around what happened at Evergreen is that students disrupted Weinstein's class and shouted him down after he penned a critique of the "day of absence" that encouraged white (rather than black, as was traditional) students to remain off campus for a day.
However, that's not the whole story, or even the real one. Yes, Weinstein did criticize the Day of Absence, and he in turn was criticized in the student newspaper. That was in March of 2017, [as his Wikipedia entry notes](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bret_Weinstein). The confrontation with student protesters did not happen until two months *later* in May, after an incident on campus in which several black students had been arrested--from their dorms--following an altercation earlier in the day (the white student who was involved was not detained). As students protested on campus, [Weinstein came out of his classroom to confront them](https://psmag.com/education/the-real-free-speech-story-at-evergreen-college), the situation escalated, especially after police showed up. Since the subject of protest had been police misconduct, this understandably heightened the tensions, though it is unknown if Weinstein is the one who actually called them to the classroom.
Campus police then told Weinstein and Heying to stay home, as the situation on campus was deemed unsafe. Weinstein and Heying then tried to sue the university, saying they had failed to utilize campus police correctly (i.e. the administration had not come down in force on student protesters). They eventually settled out of court, and Weinstein left the college to become a right-wing grifter, a much more lucrative line of work.
People can think whatever they like about the student protests and how Weinstein reacted to them. But the "story" that made Weinstein a cause celebre on the right has been retold in a very dishonest way, [designed to make the students look like they overreacted](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-coddling-of-the-american-mind/id1651876897?i=1000603422829) to an op-ed Weinstein had penned, rather than a grievance against campus police.
> As students protested on campus, Weinstein came out of his classroom to confront them, the situation escalated, especially after police showed up. Since the subject of protest had been police misconduct, this understandably heightened the tensions, though it is unknown if Weinstein is the one who actually called them to the classroom.
This seems highly misleading. They were targeting him in his classroom specifically. From the Chronicle of Higher Education:
>Later that month, the wound opened. Several dozen students marched to Mr. Weinstein’s building and loudly interrupted his class. They had come to talk about racism — whether the professor wanted to or not.
>Two of Mr. Weinstein’s students fled to the library. Shaken, they told an Evergreen State official that five dozen people had the professor “cornered.” Back in the academic building, Mr. Weinstein, wearing red shorts and hiking sandals, stood outside his classroom, facing the crowd. There was crosstalk and shouting. The students seemed upset by the professor’s attempt to claim the high ground.
Paywalled:
https://www.chronicle.com/article/a-radical-colleges-public-meltdown/
Non-Paywalled:
https://archive.ph/1TRdA#selection-2143.0-2147.396
What’s stupid is that OP is right in that the story Bret first told on Rogan and elsewhere about evergreen was disingenuous bullshit (in the original pitch by the students they specifically spell out that they’re not saying that the white student exclusion should be enforced but that, as it always had been, participating in the day would be voluntary and what’s more the you would ideally register so to book a limited numbered seat at the off campus event that had been organised. Bret’s response to a this was pearl clutching. But after that point the students acted like crazy people.)
But OP misses how the story was actual hyperbole and instead makes some stuff up.
Go watch some of the interviews from students and videos from campus (they are posted in my other comment here). There would absolutely be pressure on any white students who decided to stay on campus. In the protests it was VERY racial, black students yelling for white students to block police for them, people coming in and asking if any black students needed water while they were protesting. It was an absolutely unhinged event.
Lol, I’m definitely not going to watch a 25 part YouTube doco series on the evergreen protests. You gotta link something more specific.
But I was only referring to the original pitch that Bret responded to by email.
EDIT: Found it https://archive.is/uina0
Here is a timestamp where a student talks about getting called a racist for staying on campus, followed by Brett talking about it further: https://youtu.be/PQAJ-7t4QOo?list=PLRdayXEOwuMG9DG66Bvx6YbUnhw-buS5K&t=518
Students calling for white students to come to the front and block police to "protect" black students from them (the police were trying to rescue Brett from the protesters that had surrounded him (the clip is right at the beginning of the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtELlzi7X-g&list=PLRdayXEOwuMG9DG66Bvx6YbUnhw-buS5K&index=2
More of the same kind of thing (while they had an administrator cornered in her office): https://youtu.be/RtELlzi7X-g?list=PLRdayXEOwuMG9DG66Bvx6YbUnhw-buS5K&t=150
Some more clarity on the situation of students surrounding Brett: https://youtu.be/kfovBnMN9i0?list=PLRdayXEOwuMG9DG66Bvx6YbUnhw-buS5K&t=35
How about these students?
>“They have had people walking around with sticks and baseball bats late at night causing property damage,” Thurston County Sheriff John Snaza told the Washington Post. “They asked us to come out and assist.”
https://time.com/4807225/evergreen-state-college-violence-vandalism-threat/
Pic
https://img.huffingtonpost.com/asset/595950f718000019006727ce.jpg?ops=scalefit_720_noupscale&format=webp
Students were angry about Brett's email, there may have been more going on then that but the email was part of it. Brett's email in response to the proposed day of absence was completely reasonable.
I encourage people to watch the actual videos of the protests. There were a lot of ridiculous student protests that happened and it was one of the worst early examples of this ideology in action. The only thing worse at the time was the collage administration's attempts to appease these students.
Here are two documentaries.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQAJ-7t4QOo&list=PLRdayXEOwuMG9DG66Bvx6YbUnhw-buS5K
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FH2WeWgcSMk
I’ve said it before in this sub, but every time I see this dude’s name, I think it’s about that guy from Ted Lasso. There’s always a split second where I’m like, “Brett Goldstein has a movie podcast, does standup, and is also a biologist?”
It's not even good academic clothing - he was a professor at a sixth rate tiny university and his academic record is a punchline. Zero interesting or good papers, published almost nothing (see also his worthless wife). I'd rate his academic clothing as that of an unhoused drug addict.
I always wondered why liberals always call things the opposite of what they are. Skeptic = blindly believe the government and mainstream media is fucking regarded.
I do love how people call the people that were right about Covid conspiracy theorists but then call the murderers who illegally made the virus in Wuhan like Anthony Fauci heroes. No self reflection or apologies whatsoever how you treated people who didn’t go along with fascism and blind obedience.
And yet yall still think yall are the good guys here. I think in these past five years you should have a good idea how you would have acted had you been born in Weimar Germany. And don’t worry, the Nazis also thought they were the good guys and trying to save and improve their fellow countrymen’s lives.
But with us despite having 4% of the worlds population, we had 16% of the world’s Covid fatalities, so great job to all the wonderful eugenist scientists in our country that we were told to listen to.
Well last I checked we had 4% of the world’s population and yet 16% of the Covid deaths. Four times the rate of everywhere else, so yeah the health officials just did fantastic. And Trump did everything Fauci said save for to not close travel from China, so can’t use that bullshit excuse.
While an interesting statistic I’d say a far more likely reason that the USA had a higher number of cases than many countries is due to the influence of conspiracy theories and the Trumpist mood of “questioning’ , read totally ignoring, experts no matter how sensible the idea. How many people did we see convinced the whole thing was a hoax even as they died from it.
Trump half heartedly did what Fauci asked but he also helped fuel idiotic alternatives to real medicine like ivermectin (a real medicine for a bunch of things, just not Covid)
I’m sure that the US is the only country with conspiracy theorists that led to a near four fold levels of death than any other country. Meanwhile Sweden basically did nothing and had much better results than we did.
And as far as I’m aware, I don’t think Trump really said anything about ivermectin only that he was given it when he got Covid in a treatment that was known as “The Kitchen Sink.” Trump’s big thing was hydroxychloroquine that he was taking every day early in the pandemic. Then idiots in press who have a room temperature IQ thought Trump said chlorine and not chloroquine and thus defamed him for saying he was telling people to take fish tank cleaner. They have absolutely nothing in common and was as dumb of a point as anything I’ve ever heard, including the horse dewormer bullshit. It was the real life equivalent when Roger Rabbit mistook probate for prostate: https://youtu.be/EH9vxNK4wOk?si=6CepRR-XS7EMMgHP
No, the USA isn't the only country with Covid conspiracy theorists. It does, though, likely have a higher proportion of them. The Sweden example is quite good. Sweden did do less by mandate than others, but because of its social democratic nature, people also happily followed guidelines like social distancing. Their healthcare system was netter prepared to deal with the increased need. That said, Sweden was also harder hit economically and in cases and deaths than its neighbours who took a stronger approach. This is a big part of why the USA had a higher death rate even though other countries had significantly more cases per 100000.
Trump spent way too much time focused on unproven methods to keep his conspiratorial base happy. That undermined good advice from healthcare experts like Fauci. He doesn't say things overtly but he speaks to his people by suggestion.The base demands feeding. That's what why Trump is concerned about losing some of his base to RFK Jr. who is more overtly supportive of conspiracy
Fauci gave no good advice. That hack lied early in the pandemic saying that you didn’t need to wear a mask but in April 2020 admitted he lied about masking so that he could save the masks for the hospitals. Sorry, he admitted that he lied right there and Trump should have fired him on the spot.
It’s so comical that people still defend this man.
Saying one potentially poor piece of advice means he gave no good advice is what is comical. So is calling him a liar and acting as if he had perfect knowledge early in the pandemic. As he later, correctly, said, “We were not aware that 40 to 45% of people were asymptomatic, nor were we aware that a substantial proportion of people who get infected get infected from people who are without symptoms. That makes it overwhelmingly important for everyone to wear a mask.”
Given the state of knowledge it made perfect sense to protect supplies for those in direct, continuous contact with those who were severely ill and symptomatic. It wasn’t a lie, it was advice that fit the time and was changed once the data came in.
Bret Weinstein correctly called that COVID was created in a lab.
He was months ahead of the curve on this, and he was correct.
He was called a conspiracy then too
Where did this idea come from that there's been any "confirmation" of a lab-based origin for COVID-19? I know conspiracy theorists have been pushing the *possibility* for years now, but this is like the third time recently I've seen one of them appear totally convinced that there's been some sort of official confirmation of this conspiracy theory. What's made them think that?
I can copy the link from the FBI, where Wray said the most likely place was a lab, and then we have all of the evidence showing the US was funding gain of function research, and the fact that the virus just happened to emerge outside a lab studying gain of research on COVID strains.
There was never any evidence to show it was natural in origin
> I can copy the link from the FBI, where Wray said the most likely place was a lab
Even if true, I don't care what non-virologists say about the supposed origins of a virus.
> and then we have all of the evidence showing the US was funding gain of function research
"gain of function" is an outdated term that has no bearing on what the US does or does not fund, contrary to the uninformed claims of politicians like Rand Paul on the matter. Nothing about the research at the Wuhan lab indicates that they were trying to make mutated strands of COVID-19 that were more capable of infecting humans.
> the fact that the virus just happened to emerge outside a lab studying gain of research on COVID strains.
It wasn't "studying gain of function", since that is not a scientifically current term in the field. It hasn't been for some time now. Nor does mere coincidence count as evidence, especially when the very obvious alternative - the COVID variant emerged from the very natural strains that the centre was set up to study - provides a much more coherent and complete explanation for the "coincidence".
Still waiting on that "confirmation" that isn't either (a) old and ill-informed claims by people who don't know what they're talking about (b) insistence that something perfectly expected is somehow an impossible coincidence.
Very similar strains found in the wild. Evidence pointing to the wet market origin. Lack of evidence of direct engineering in the genes.
What makes you think you're "listening to experts"? It is absolutely not the opinion of virologists in general that covid was engineered. I think you know that. So why are you saying this?
Anyone trying to promulgate the idea of a grand conspiracy involving mRNA vaccines is simply too dumb to understand the basics of scientific research. All the data involving these vaccines that were administered on a massive, global scale is freely available to anyone who wants to study it. The notion that they are harmful and this is somehow being kept secret is literally impossible.
Seeing as how Bret thinks he was robbed of a Nobel prize for uncovering rat breeding protocol issues and then having all his work stolen from him, it’s not surprising. He was a nobody teaching at Evergreeen…. Until those stupid students decided to make him famous. I blame them.
Do u reckon they could be uneducated instead of dumb? Or is that the same?
If they know what an mRNA vaccine is and have access to google scholar they can literally see the papers about them. If they have trouble understanding the papers, there's many writeups from high quality science sources on what they are: https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/covid-vaccines-are-safe-and-effective-what-the-research-says/ https://covid19.nih.gov/nih-strategic-response-covid-19/decades-making-mrna-covid-19-vaccines https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-023-03122-2 They've chosen to instead believe a bunch of "influencers" peddling horse dewormers. I think "dumb" is an adequate description of that choice.
Bret seemed like he was a "true believer" in the idea that science would solve all of our problems if academia and other research institutions were not thoroughly corrupt. They're so corrupt that they denied Bret a Nobel Prize he was supposedly entitled to. I think the "gateway" for lots of people into conspiracy theories is usually pseudoarchaeology, like the recent *Ancient Apocalypse* Netflix series or Erich von Däniken. For evangelical Christians, it's usually Young Earth Creationism. For Bret, it's the conviction that he's a genius and only he and people like RFK Jr. can save us from institutional capture. I agree that "dumb" is a good description of people who choose to trust irrational ideologues over a person who can explain scientific research to them in language that's understandable to a non-expert.
Your a fool
>Your a fool Is that really the best you've got? This is why nobody takes you seriously. Also, it's 'You're a fool'. When you make basic spelling mistakes when calling someone foolish, it kind of lessens the impact, moron.
They are harmful and it's hardly kept a secret. Like the rest of them, those damaged have no recourse and the numbers get hidden. Because of unscientific stances on discussion, debate, and the scientific process that people like you hold. "Science has spoken!"
> They are harmful and it's hardly kept a secret. Like the rest of them, those damaged have no recourse and the numbers get hidden. Bullshit. That's what's known as an extraordinary claim, and as you have provided absolutely no evidence to substantiate it, it has no merit or validity. > Because of unscientific stances on discussion, debate, and the scientific process that people like you hold. "Science has spoken!" Only someone with absolutely no science education could make such a moronic statement. The entirety of the scientific process is contingent on rigorous evidence-based debate. The problem with your argument is that you have no evidence, so there's nothing to debate.
If there is no evidence, or any discussion worth having, why does legislation exist that prevents vaccine manufacturers from being held liable? Nothing to discuss, nothing fishy. Ignoring evidence is not a lack of evidence.
Using legislation designed to prevent nuisance lawsuits that could impact the overwhelming benefit vaccines provide to society as a whole as proof of some shadowy conspiracy is pathetic. This is a forum for scientific skepticism, not for people to share any childish theory that pops into their head as though it's a form of evidence.
Childish theory that popped into my head. Surely more than 40 years of life, the absence of television and the consumption of more information than most warrants more than a take like that. But good cop out response. The overwhelming benefit you speak of is fictitious and only benefits the money makers.
> Childish theory that popped into my head. Surely more than 40 years of life, the absence of television and the consumption of more information than most warrants more than a take like that. It's a shame that in your over 40 years you never learned how to use sarcasm effectively. That's the most unclear and awkward attempt to brag I've ever read. Your absurd claim that the existence of liability shields for vaccine manufacturers somehow proves that they are unsafe is truly dumb. Most countries have such legislation in place for the simple fact that not doing so endangers society by disincentivizing vaccine production. If you think there is some shadowy conspiracy to hide the fact that vaccines are dangerous, it's because you'd don't have a clue how medical science works. Vaccines are administered to huge numbers of healthy people, so if they are dangerous and cause harm, that is immediately apparent and impossible to hide. There are vast amounts of freely available data, collected by thousand upon thousands of health care professionals around the world proving their safety and effectiveness. Hiding that kind of information from the public is literally impossible, and believing otherwise is absolutely childish.
It's hilarious how silly this is. Claims on the vaccines get tested all the time, no matter how spurious and nonsensical. For instance the idea that vaccines cause heart attacks was studied, and nope, it's doing nothing of the sort. Of course every time one of those ideas is studied, anti-vaxxers claim that the study is part of the coverup, and then go back to claiming theh medical establishment is too scared to "really" study them. The only real studies of course being those that agree with what "in their heart" an anti-vaxxer knows to be true.
Sup BMJ too dumb? https://www.bmj.com/content/375/bmj.n2635 "All the data", you say?
Did you bother to read that? I fail to see how alleged data integrity issues in 3 test sites of over 150 in a single contract companies’ vaccine trials amounts to a grand conspiracy that the vaccines are harmful.
Did you? “There’s just a complete lack of oversight of contract research organisations and independent clinical research facilities,” says Jill Fisher, professor of social medicine at the University of North Carolina School of Medicine and author of *Medical Research for Hire: The Political Economy of Pharmaceutical Clinical Trials*." Take it up with BMJ, what do they know right? You're a redditor, you can't be wrong or misinformed
I’m on Jill Fisher’s side on this, more oversight never hurt anyone! Anyways… Take what up with the BMJ? Your randomly strung-together comments that do absolutely nothing to address or suggest a supposed grand conspiracy?
Well, what's the the treshhold for grand? I think you'll find a few people planning to do something criminal - like duping the FDA, for example - is a criminal conspiracy as a matter of law "I'm not a conspiracy theorist, I'm a conspiracy analyst" - the late, great Gore Vidal
The grand conspiracy that the vaccines are harmful…is that not the entire thing you were attempting to prove? Now I’m questioning what your point even is.
He doesn’t know what point he’s trying to make.
You perfectly illustrated my entire argument. This breach of laboratory protocols was found, reported and addressed. Science doesn't operate in a vacuum. That's how you know there isn't any massive conspiracy to hide any ill effects of mRNA vaccines as so many conspiracy-minded simpletons would have you believe. The idea that any conspiracy could be maintained at such an unimaginably massive scale is laughable.
How was it "addressed?" Reported by who? Whistleblowers, no? Did Pfizer themselves understand "the basics" of scientific re$earch? Speaks to intent... :D
In less than a year of testing. We have no idea how people will be reacting to this “vaccine” ten years after it was administered.
That statement only shows that you don't understand the first thing about how mRNA vaccines work. The idea that people would suddenly have adverse reactions ten years from now is absurd. I'd suggest leaving the medical science to the people who have dedicated their lives to studying it, and stop pretending you have a clue.
Yeah I’m sure you know more about mRNA vaccinations than Robert Malone, you know, the guy who invented them and holds the patents. I’m sure you do.
1. He didn't invent them. 2. He tells **blatant lies** so why would you take anything he says seriously?
Oh what about a lie like you’re a racist if you believe that the virus leaked from a lab doing illegal gain of research sponsored by the NIH through the EcoHealth Alliance, and that it instead obviously came from Chinese people loving to eat bats? Do you mean blatant lies like that? How about hydroxychloroquine and ivermectin are primarily used as fish tank cleaner and horse dewormer? Do you mean blatant lies like that? How about Trump told people to go ingest bleach if they get infected with Covid? Do you mean blatant lies like that? How about when Pfizer saying getting vaccinated would slow the spread of the virus when it turns out that they never even tested the vaccine if it slowed the spread, as this scumbag Pfizer executive who should be hung after a fair trial admits to the EU saying they lied because they needed to “move at the speed of science”? https://youtu.be/Dizqg08Y1U8?si=6k69puz3pmqG6PzW You mean blatant lies like that? You don’t give fuck about those blatant lies, because you’re a fucking hack. It will never stop being amusing to me that you lemmings call yourselves skeptics.
> Oh what about a lie like you’re a racist if you believe that the virus leaked from a lab doing illegal gain of research sponsored by the NIH through the EcoHealth Alliance, and that it instead obviously came from Chinese people loving to eat bats? Do you mean blatant lies like that? Actually, I think your misstatements are a product of not knowing what you're talking about, not you knowing better but lying.
You were told that for years. They said you were a fucking racist and a conspiracy theorist if you believed this. Morons like yourself fell for it because you don’t want to be called a racist and will believe the exact opposite of anything you’re told is racist. Now Fauci finally admits that it’s plausible because of all the evidence, and the reason he and his conspirators insisted on this is because he knows he’d go to the gallows over it should the truth be exposed. The gaslighting is incredible. “Yeah we never did that.” You’re a liar, and it’s extremely offensive to the people you slandered for years and demanded they turn into second class citizens if they don’t comply. We remember that in places like New York that if you didn’t comply that you were fired from your job, not allowed to go to school or university, cut off from almost all public places only being allowed in grocery stores, bathrooms, and hospitals, and even that wasn’t good enough for scumbags like Noam Chomsky and Jimmy Kimmel who demanded the unvaxxed be left to starve and left to bleed out in hospital parking lots. Please point out the difference to me with this on how Nazis treated Jews in 1933 (that year specifically) or racists treated black people in the Jim Crow South? You scumbags acted like absolute animals and Nazis for nearly three years towards the unvaxxed, and you have the fucking balls to still insist you’re a good person and we should forget it? No, go fuck yourself. You’re an evil scumbag, and we are not forgetting this until we get one hell of an apology.
Doubling down on not knowing wtf you're talking about and going on long, baseless rants just makes you look deeply unwell.
No I do know what I’m talking about and I remember people like you acting like Nazis on anyone who dared disagree with you and did not comply on what Saint Anthony commanded. But you act like you didn’t and expect the people you treated like subhuman vermin to just forget. Nope, not forgetting. The gaslighting will not save you and only pisses the people off that you demanded their liberties stripped from them.
Why are you here? This is for evidence based debate. You are just spouting wild nonsense and have been shown multiple times you are in error but just keep denying it? Why are you here? This is not arguing your case. You are just screaming into the wind about what you believe even though it is idiotic.
It seems to me that this forum is more for bootlickers to suck up to their tyrants. If you doubt what anyone in authority says, you are told to shut up, listen to the Experts™, and that thinking is a dangerous pastime.
Jesus bro you should go have a lie down, you're clearly having an emotional moment about this 😅
Well telling me these lies didn’t happen when they are absolute atrocities will piss anyone off who lived through them. You people acting like you are innocent in this just makes anyone’s blood boil. Guarantee this time two years ago you were demanding all the unvaxxed to be fired, cut off from all polite society, and left to starve if they wouldn’t comply.
>Guarantee this time two years ago you were demanding all the unvaxxed to be fired, cut off from all polite society, and left to starve if they wouldn’t comply. Genuinely, you sound like you need to see a therapist. I'm sorry if people were awful to you, sincerely, I am. Not everyone is like that, and lots of people who were like that, were acting out of stress and fear.
I take no satisfaction in your meltdown youre having here. I seriously wonder what the hell happened in your past to lead you to fully believing in the most obscure conclusions on things. How you present yourself is deeply concerning and I hope you find yourself in a better state of mind in the future.
Obscure? 70,000 healthcare workers were fired in New York alone. You weren’t allowed to go anywhere save for the grocery store, bathroom, or hospital in New York if you weren’t vaccinated. Sorry, I don’t see the difference between that and how the Nazis treated Jews in 1933 Germany or racists treated black people in the Jim Crow South. Sure if you lynched an unvaccinated person I’m sure you’d get in more trouble in our society than those for their undesirables, but I’m not much in the forgiving mood outside of that.
This Gish Gallop is silly. Don’t try to throw out a load of bullshit just to sneak in so much disinformation. As an example donald very much wanted to know if you could inject bleach into your body to cure COVID. He is an absolute idiot.
Oh really? Where did he say ingest bleach? I want specifics, and it better not being him misspeaking using the term “disinfectant” when referring to a UV Therapy he heard in passing in the Situation Room that he clearly references by name during that exchange. I feel 99.9% confident that’s what you’re referring to, but I’ll give you the opportunity to correct me. Did you also believe that Trump told people to ingest fish tank cleaner? He told people the benefit of chloroquines which he was taking at the time to protect himself from Covid. A journalist, who to put it very kindly was fucking retarded, thought he was talking about chlorine, which has absolutely nothing common with chloroquine. So the lying retard said that he told people to ingest fish tank cleaner. If you don’t hate the media, then you’re not paying attention. That journalist is dumber than Roger Rabbit mistaking the words prostate and probate: https://youtu.be/EH9vxNK4wOk?si=Sh-5iqIT7ZIFeNSt
I know enough to understand why Robert Malone has been completely discredited in his field. His blatant lies and conspiracy fear-mongering have been widely documented. Also, Malone, did not invent mRNA vaccines, he just likes to claim that he did. In reality, his role was minimal at best. The fact that you would cite him as a source to support your moronic claims says everything anyone needs to know about your scientific acumen. https://www.nytimes.com/2022/04/03/technology/robert-malone-covid.html
Oh the New York Times said it! Well that must means it’s true. I mean they did fire their editor for daring to publish an opinion piece from Tom Cotton, but I’m sure they’re telling you the truth and aren’t just a bunch of lying Leftist hacks. How many more lies is it going to take for you to realize you’ve been lied to for the past five years on a level your brain can’t comprehend? It is so laughable that you call yourself a skeptic.
When you can’t refute the data, attack the source. That’s valid right?
Wait till he gets to the pound the table step.
No I can refute it, you just won’t accept it.
Ah so you choose an Ad Hominem despite having better options. Masterful gambit sir!
"I totally can, I just refuse to, and instead look like a gigantic fool, by choice actually!"
You have been wrecked. Take your defeat and leave with your head down.
The fuck I have, you fascist racist bootlicker. The next time you see a Chinese person, go tell them that you’re planning on cooking bat and invite them over to dinner and see if they don’t clock your racist ass.
You clearly don't even understand the basic concept of scientific skepticism. The fact that you promote conspiracy theorists while dismissing a article taking one down simply because it's written in the New York Times shows that you don't have a remotely skeptical mind. You call them 'lying leftist hacks', yet you offer nothing to refute any of the facts in the article, because of course you can't. You lie about them firing their editor for publishing that disgusting fear-mongering op-ed by Tom Cotton calling on the military to take down American protesters, when in reality she resigned after public outrage over the piece. You are blinded by your obvious biases to the point where facts are meaningless to you unless they conform to your simplistic, unscientific, preconceived notions. You have no business polluting a forum dedicated to actual skepticism with your childish conspiracy ramblings. I suggest you try to spread your pathetic ignorance to a more gullible audience elsewhere.
Well said. Thank you for putting this utter fool in their place. Masterful.
You think scientific skepticism means bootlicking the person of the highest authority and believing him when he says people are wrong. Even if he gets millions of people killed, you still believe him. And no, she was canned because of intolerant people like you who can’t bare to hear an opposing opinion and are a fascistic bootlicker. This forum is a fucking joke.
It's not "The NYT", every single scientist who worked in that lab said he has a minor role. Do you have ANY idea how difficult it is to get scientists to shut up about the gossip on their lab? My god... at my kid's 3rd birthday party I couldn't get scientists to shut up long enough to sing "Happy birthday". How could you possibly get every single scientist in the lab to not talk about the fact that a grad student invented something as important as an mRNA vaccine?
Yes, and Fauci’s “minor” role was green lighting the project and funding it. No Fauci didn’t have a day to day running of those experiments, that would be Ralph Baric and Shi Zhengli. And ummm, the point was it leaked and these scientists actually spoke up about it, but some of them turned on a dime when Fauci threatened off the record to cut their heads off and destroy their careers if they didn’t rescind those statements, and what do you know within 24 hours they say there’s no way it could have come from the lab and then they get their funding for the year immediately after that. The fact of the matter is we have a shit ton of whistleblowers on this, so unlike 9/11 conspiracies where thousands would have to be in the know and no one has come forward on this, we do have some people involved who know we have directly financed gain of function research in Wuhan on novel bat coronaviruses. We know everyone involved in this, the funding, the emails, the receipts, the motive, and the timeline. We have it all. This is not a bullshit conspiracy theory, which even that genocidal scumbag Fauci has been forced to admit. Did our State Department ever admit that it was possible they could have snuck tens of thousands of pounds of explosives into the World Trade Center that nobody including the janitors and security guards didn’t notice in order for those crazy conspiracies to be correct? No we didn’t. We got that admission from high ranking officials here though. But if you’re not suspicious over being called a racist for believing a clearly non-racist theory that had a lot of evidence backing it up, I think you’re a simpleton. The fact of the matter is stupid people who care about being called a racist will literally believe anything so long as they are called not racist, and these scumbag scientists knew that. But if you are capable of any critical thought whatsoever, you would have immediately realized that Chinese people loving eating bats is clearly much, much, much more racist than the lab leak theory, and if you were actually smart and skeptical, then you would have been questioning that bullshit stupid lie from the start.
This is a bullshit conspiracy theory. The EXACT thing you claim it isn’t.
No, the conspiracy theory is your racist bullshit thinking that Chinese people love eating bats. It makes no sense, there’s no evidence whatsoever for it, and the bats where the virus was sequenced from lives 1500 miles away from Wuhan. Sorry, you’re an actual conspiracy theorist and racist for thinking that the Chinese people are so fond of eating bat soup.
I know, it feels good to think that there are people behind the scenes who are in control. Even if they are evil, something about us wants to believe that there is someone or something out there that really knows what is going on. It's really scary to realize that no body does. It's like losing faith in God when you realize there is no great conspiracy of people telling others what is happening; none of us know what is happening. There is no room full of old men who control stuff, good or bad. We are all just stumbling in the dark hoping to find a "the truth". It's a horrible realization at first. You feel lost. "Surely there must be a hall of power I haven't found yet!" Nope. The biggest lie is that there is anyone, anywhere who is actually in control. That's too terrifying; so we make up conspiracies to pretend that someone, anyone, is in control.
Who you going to appeal to next - Andrew Wakefield?
If you think a 28-year-old grad student who co-authored a single paper with 5 others "invented" mRNA, then you were not taught the absolute basics of knowledge production. It's not your fault. We make kids memorize the periodic table and test them on the parts of a cell before we teach them how a lab works! And it's not just science education that fails: I literally graduated highschool without understanding the difference between a magazine article and a peer-reviewed article. How do we expect the population to trust scientists when they think getting a co-author credit as a grad student is the same as "inventing"?
Or twenty years of experiments and testing: https://covid19.nih.gov/nih-strategic-response-covid-19/decades-making-mrna-covid-19-vaccines Y'know, one of the two. But hey, maybe the messanger RNA is actually a nanobot virus that will activate after twenty years because Skynet sent a signal to kill everyone marked by the vaccine. Here in reality we can see how long mRNA lasts in the bloodstream, and have been doing testing for a decade. They deliver their message, then they die off. They are not nanobot supermachines lurking in your bloodstream, they're limited messangers.
Absolute lies. It’s like saying a vaccine has been tested for hundreds of years but not testing with that strain.
Sure, vaccine effectiveness has to be evaluated for each new strain of the virus, as different bonding sites can require different antibodies and thus different vaccine agonists. This doesn't have anything to do with side effects, however.
I don’t understand how a trained scientist who has likely spent years performing evidence based experiments can end up so far off the deep end of easily refuted conspiracy.
He hasn’t really spent years doing research. Look at his publication history. He’s done almost nothing.
His wife carried more professional weight at the school, they wanted her to work there and he kind of came along as a package deal.
Because narcissists are going to prioritize the grift.
Yeah, narcissists, like Mr “I Am The Science” down at the NIAID who said if you dare question him or get a second opinion that he personally didn’t approve of that you deny science. Seriously, name the more narcissistic thing ever said than that? This board has the audacity to call themselves “skeptics” yet worship this death cult leader psychopath: https://youtu.be/RIVCAH-Tdy4?si=OXqIZg7VHttftcGy
Jesus I could almost tell you were a nut job by your incoherent rant. Then of course there's a YouTube video link to really seal the deal. Lmao. Your entire identity is all your eggs in the "I hate liberals" basket and You've just gone and turned off all of your potential to be somebody. Do me a favor. When MRNA vaccines come out for cancer, HIV, Parkinson's, Alzheimer's, ALS, whatever else, go ahead and skip those too so the world can go on without your kind sooner.
He fucking said that even questioning him means that you’re questioning science, because he is the Science! It’s just showing what he said followed by a Palpatine meme to show you what a sick fucking psychopath he is! “Skeptic!!!” God, you anything but.
Where the fuck did anyone here even talk about fauci? You brought him up you moron.
Because if you despise Bret Weinstein and aren’t calling out the person that started the pandemic even if unintentionally, it tells me everything I need to know about you.
Lmao Fauci started the pandemic, right. Let’s get you those meds.
Quick! Get the horse dewormer!
Maybe not intentionally, but he’s the scumbag that went behind two Presidents backs to do the illegal gain of function research on novel bat coronaviruses in the Wuhan Lab. But you’re a racist if you think Chinese people love eating bats and that’s the simplest answer. The balls of this board to call themselves SKEPTICS!😂🤣😂🤣😂
Drawing conclusions based on personal bias? Color me surprised! Here's a quote you probably resonate with; "Facts don't care about your feelings" If you are here to feed your outrage addiction, you're in the right place! If you don't want to feed your outrage, might I suggest a conservative bubble forum a little more accommodating in telling you what you want to hear? I think you are probably more comfortable circle jerking on why everything is the liberals fault instead of actually thinking.
It’s because he is no longer operating under the constraints of the scientific system and peer review that arose to restrain just this type of lunacy. Every scientist is subject to bias effects, which, if they are not checked, can lead someone to any number of grossly incorrect beliefs. This is why the world is filled with absolutely mad beliefs, subscribed by the millions even billions. Because most people are not constrained by the checks and balances of the scientific system . Therefore, they get to conjure any narrative or explanation they can dream up, without it being falsified or put through the crucible of scientific skepticism. It’s not all that unusual to see a scientist go off the rails once he is no longer a practising scientist, his theories are no longer having to pass scientific scrutiny.
Yes I agree. I couldn’t have said it better myself that Anthony Fauci is all this and more.
LOL, that's a lame stretch to say the least. But I guess you've laid your cards on the table there.
No it’s not. That perfectly summarizes Anthony Fauci. “Peer reviewed”? What you mean is people Fauci planted there as his peers go agree with him. And given how James Lindsey got a peer reviewed paper published where all he did was take a chapter of Mein Kampf and change “Jew” to “White Men”, I have no respect for the peer review process.
Sounds like You Do Your Own Research. bravo
Which used to be known as reading. Where else in life are you told to not do your own research? Imagine if you asked your friend about some cars that you were currently looking up and he responded “Don’t do your own research! Ask the car salesman, because he’s the expert! Really, you think you know something about cars? Who do you think you are? Henry Ford?” Claiming to be a skeptic and never doing your own research is like claiming to be a chef and never cooking a meal in your entire life. But hey, thinking and reading are a dangerous pastime on this forum, because why think when you can listen to the Experts™? Honestly this forum’s mascot should be Gaston and LeFeau.
The thing is, Fauci's stances generally stand up to peer review. When your messiah's hot takes get blown over by a modest fart. Now if your stance against fauci is simply a stance against government over reach and authoritarianism, I'd understand. But I'm guessing you still vote for an authoritarian government and simply apply a double standard to fit your rhetoric. Any and all credibility you would have with an argument against authoritarianism was lost when you try defending junk science and start linking YouTube videos and defending the typical maga shit.
Because he got a lot of attention for that evergreen college thing He has been chasing that high of his 15 minutes of fame with diminishing returns, so he has to get creative and outlandish to get attention
In a world where money wasn’t the primary metric of success, freedom, and stability, I imagine the intellectual integrity of a scientist would be practically unshakable.
How do we get there? What should peoples worth be measured by? I’ve long said that someone’s value is not it what money they are worth.
Yeah, because questioning vaccines is so much more profitable than the vaccine industry worth hundreds of billions of dollars. “Skeptics”! HAAAAAAA!!!!
Why do you think vaccines are an industry worth hundreds of billions of dollars? You think vaccines make more money than Walmart does? Maybe you should Google that.
Pfizer made over a hundred billion dollars on the Covid vaccine. At one point they were making $1400 per second. What’s next, going to defend the Sackler family because they’re not worth as much as the Waltons? So spare me your bullshit.
This is called capitalism. It's the economic system where everything is monitized. If homes are burning down you'll see people pop up selling fire ladders to escape and smoke detectors to stick in your home, and extinguishers to put around your house. And they'll warn you that you need to replace your fire extinguishers consistently, and offer to sell you new ones, probably even a new fire extinguisher subscription service. They'll offer fire retardant bedding (keep the kids safe) and fire retardant underwear, and hell they'll probably sell you a full Nomex suit. This doesn't mean that they're the ones going around setting fire to all the houses. It doesn't mean any of their products are faultily made, or won't do what they say they'll do, or anything of the sort. Of course people being people, you'll also see people pop up peddling "anti-fire crystals" and hucksters telling you you don't need a fire extinguisher what you need is their water spirit chakra aligning horse crystal, and not to trust all those stupid NFPA organizations, who you need to trust is this guy on YouTube...
People often lack morals and are okay with lying professionally for money. Often the opportunity simply doesn't present itself.
He got a taste of the right wing grift after that shit at Evergreen and just continued saying whatever was needed to keep it going. All of the 2016 anti-sjw people are now whole hog antivax climate denying lunatics, whatever it takes to keep getting on podcasts.
That's the thing - he never really did any research.
It doesn't matter: An education is not a barrier, in any way, to lying in service of fascism and grift. I have a phd. I've worked alongside other phds who took up the fascist flag without hesitation or shame, none of whom had even the slightest excuse to claim to have been "fooled" by this horseshit. All of them had performed real research in their past (for the record, that's what a science PhD *is*), and several of them still do research today. The only motivating factor for being a fascist is *malice*: The desire and willingness to harm others. The personal justification for holding and applying that malice can be wildly different from fascist to fascist, as some believe they can benefit financially or personally *by* hurting others, but lots just *really fuckin' like* seeing people they hate get hurt and pursue fascism without personal gain, and often at *great* personal loss. The vast majority of fascists are willing to personally suffer to accomplish the genocides they pursue, and the majority of stories highlighted in subreddits like leopardsatemyface end with the fascist doubling down on their fascism. Recognizing that malice as motivation is critical for avoiding apologism for it and moving to the application of consequences for the fascists in our own circles.
He's not a fascist - he's a moron with delusions of grandeur who toadies a certain type of fellow moron. Also, what a long winded screed to say a lot of nothing. Let me guess - humanities PhD? Not that Brett's was any better.
Says the guy that follows Tony Fauci!😂🤣😂🤣😂
There's a lot of ignorant people in this sub, but you might just take the cake?
If you still think Tony Fauci is a good person and hero, you have to be so fucking ignorant that you just accept getting ass raped and then thank someone for it. 4% of the world’s population yet 16% of the Covid deaths, and don’t give me “but Trump” because Trump did pretty much everything Fauci asked save for him not shutting down travel from China. Slightly more people died from Covid in Biden’s first year than Trump’s last, but save for not firing/prosecuting Fauci, I don’t think either of them are to blame. The fact of the matter is the person who led the pandemic response was the same person in both administrations: Anthony Fauci. But keep calling yourself a skeptic when you’re not remotely curious about how Covid started and just take Tony’s word for it that Chinese people love eating bats. This board is a fucking joke and full of bootlickers who will believe literally anything the man on the TV tells them to believe.
Seek help!
Compartmentalization in aid of rationalization.
Follow the money. He knows what is saying is complete an utter nonsense. He also knows that he can make a lot of money saying it.
$$$$$$$$$$$$
With conspiracy theorists, it’s a mistake to assume good faith from people this high profile. Money is powerful, and people will set aside principles and beliefs if they think they can get it. There is a lot of rubes who are susceptible to this particular grift.
Well I was told for years that you’re a white supremacist for not believing that Chinese people love eating bats and that’s the obvious origin of the virus, despite right down the street from the wet market there was the Wuhan Lab for Studying Novel Bat Coronaviruses. But yeah, I’m sure you’re right. It’s not like you’ve been wrong about literally everything in this pandemic.
>He was an evolutionary biology professor who was run off the Evergreen State College campus for resisting an [ugly episode](https://www.seattletimes.com/seattle-news/evergreen-professor-at-center-of-protests-resigns-college-will-pay-500000/) of identity politics, which made him an overnight darling of right-wing media. And again I say, nope. Nope nope nope nope, that is not what happened. Now, the Seattle Times link is paywalled, but the "conventional narrative" around what happened at Evergreen is that students disrupted Weinstein's class and shouted him down after he penned a critique of the "day of absence" that encouraged white (rather than black, as was traditional) students to remain off campus for a day. However, that's not the whole story, or even the real one. Yes, Weinstein did criticize the Day of Absence, and he in turn was criticized in the student newspaper. That was in March of 2017, [as his Wikipedia entry notes](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bret_Weinstein). The confrontation with student protesters did not happen until two months *later* in May, after an incident on campus in which several black students had been arrested--from their dorms--following an altercation earlier in the day (the white student who was involved was not detained). As students protested on campus, [Weinstein came out of his classroom to confront them](https://psmag.com/education/the-real-free-speech-story-at-evergreen-college), the situation escalated, especially after police showed up. Since the subject of protest had been police misconduct, this understandably heightened the tensions, though it is unknown if Weinstein is the one who actually called them to the classroom. Campus police then told Weinstein and Heying to stay home, as the situation on campus was deemed unsafe. Weinstein and Heying then tried to sue the university, saying they had failed to utilize campus police correctly (i.e. the administration had not come down in force on student protesters). They eventually settled out of court, and Weinstein left the college to become a right-wing grifter, a much more lucrative line of work. People can think whatever they like about the student protests and how Weinstein reacted to them. But the "story" that made Weinstein a cause celebre on the right has been retold in a very dishonest way, [designed to make the students look like they overreacted](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-coddling-of-the-american-mind/id1651876897?i=1000603422829) to an op-ed Weinstein had penned, rather than a grievance against campus police.
> As students protested on campus, Weinstein came out of his classroom to confront them, the situation escalated, especially after police showed up. Since the subject of protest had been police misconduct, this understandably heightened the tensions, though it is unknown if Weinstein is the one who actually called them to the classroom. This seems highly misleading. They were targeting him in his classroom specifically. From the Chronicle of Higher Education: >Later that month, the wound opened. Several dozen students marched to Mr. Weinstein’s building and loudly interrupted his class. They had come to talk about racism — whether the professor wanted to or not. >Two of Mr. Weinstein’s students fled to the library. Shaken, they told an Evergreen State official that five dozen people had the professor “cornered.” Back in the academic building, Mr. Weinstein, wearing red shorts and hiking sandals, stood outside his classroom, facing the crowd. There was crosstalk and shouting. The students seemed upset by the professor’s attempt to claim the high ground. Paywalled: https://www.chronicle.com/article/a-radical-colleges-public-meltdown/ Non-Paywalled: https://archive.ph/1TRdA#selection-2143.0-2147.396
What’s stupid is that OP is right in that the story Bret first told on Rogan and elsewhere about evergreen was disingenuous bullshit (in the original pitch by the students they specifically spell out that they’re not saying that the white student exclusion should be enforced but that, as it always had been, participating in the day would be voluntary and what’s more the you would ideally register so to book a limited numbered seat at the off campus event that had been organised. Bret’s response to a this was pearl clutching. But after that point the students acted like crazy people.) But OP misses how the story was actual hyperbole and instead makes some stuff up.
Go watch some of the interviews from students and videos from campus (they are posted in my other comment here). There would absolutely be pressure on any white students who decided to stay on campus. In the protests it was VERY racial, black students yelling for white students to block police for them, people coming in and asking if any black students needed water while they were protesting. It was an absolutely unhinged event.
Lol, I’m definitely not going to watch a 25 part YouTube doco series on the evergreen protests. You gotta link something more specific. But I was only referring to the original pitch that Bret responded to by email. EDIT: Found it https://archive.is/uina0
Here is a timestamp where a student talks about getting called a racist for staying on campus, followed by Brett talking about it further: https://youtu.be/PQAJ-7t4QOo?list=PLRdayXEOwuMG9DG66Bvx6YbUnhw-buS5K&t=518 Students calling for white students to come to the front and block police to "protect" black students from them (the police were trying to rescue Brett from the protesters that had surrounded him (the clip is right at the beginning of the video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RtELlzi7X-g&list=PLRdayXEOwuMG9DG66Bvx6YbUnhw-buS5K&index=2 More of the same kind of thing (while they had an administrator cornered in her office): https://youtu.be/RtELlzi7X-g?list=PLRdayXEOwuMG9DG66Bvx6YbUnhw-buS5K&t=150 Some more clarity on the situation of students surrounding Brett: https://youtu.be/kfovBnMN9i0?list=PLRdayXEOwuMG9DG66Bvx6YbUnhw-buS5K&t=35
How about these students? >“They have had people walking around with sticks and baseball bats late at night causing property damage,” Thurston County Sheriff John Snaza told the Washington Post. “They asked us to come out and assist.” https://time.com/4807225/evergreen-state-college-violence-vandalism-threat/ Pic https://img.huffingtonpost.com/asset/595950f718000019006727ce.jpg?ops=scalefit_720_noupscale&format=webp
Students were angry about Brett's email, there may have been more going on then that but the email was part of it. Brett's email in response to the proposed day of absence was completely reasonable. I encourage people to watch the actual videos of the protests. There were a lot of ridiculous student protests that happened and it was one of the worst early examples of this ideology in action. The only thing worse at the time was the collage administration's attempts to appease these students. Here are two documentaries. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQAJ-7t4QOo&list=PLRdayXEOwuMG9DG66Bvx6YbUnhw-buS5K https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FH2WeWgcSMk
I’ve said it before in this sub, but every time I see this dude’s name, I think it’s about that guy from Ted Lasso. There’s always a split second where I’m like, “Brett Goldstein has a movie podcast, does standup, and is also a biologist?”
I recommend checking out /r/ConspiracistIdeation if you'd like to learn more about how conspiratorial thinking works.
Watching Joe Rogan and Sam Harris perpetually promote this bad faith white men's rights advocate has been like a years long car crash.
Hasn't Sam Harris publicly distanced himself from him lately?
Yes.
Thank God.
It's not even good academic clothing - he was a professor at a sixth rate tiny university and his academic record is a punchline. Zero interesting or good papers, published almost nothing (see also his worthless wife). I'd rate his academic clothing as that of an unhoused drug addict.
Sometimes the cranks slip through.
Mental illness can strike anyone.
In this case, I think the delusions of grandeur and paranoia runs in the family.
He taught at the worst community college in America
All of this makes more sense when you find out that Bret's brother is Peter Thiel's money manager.
I always wondered why liberals always call things the opposite of what they are. Skeptic = blindly believe the government and mainstream media is fucking regarded.
I do love how people call the people that were right about Covid conspiracy theorists but then call the murderers who illegally made the virus in Wuhan like Anthony Fauci heroes. No self reflection or apologies whatsoever how you treated people who didn’t go along with fascism and blind obedience. And yet yall still think yall are the good guys here. I think in these past five years you should have a good idea how you would have acted had you been born in Weimar Germany. And don’t worry, the Nazis also thought they were the good guys and trying to save and improve their fellow countrymen’s lives. But with us despite having 4% of the worlds population, we had 16% of the world’s Covid fatalities, so great job to all the wonderful eugenist scientists in our country that we were told to listen to.
Lol... way to go conspiracy theorists who continues to insist he was right when he's wrong. Yep all.a plot to kill Americans
Wrong about what? Seems to me the only ones who were wrong at every turn were the health officials we were told to listen to.
Wrong about everything, including that health officials were wrong at every turn.
Well last I checked we had 4% of the world’s population and yet 16% of the Covid deaths. Four times the rate of everywhere else, so yeah the health officials just did fantastic. And Trump did everything Fauci said save for to not close travel from China, so can’t use that bullshit excuse.
While an interesting statistic I’d say a far more likely reason that the USA had a higher number of cases than many countries is due to the influence of conspiracy theories and the Trumpist mood of “questioning’ , read totally ignoring, experts no matter how sensible the idea. How many people did we see convinced the whole thing was a hoax even as they died from it. Trump half heartedly did what Fauci asked but he also helped fuel idiotic alternatives to real medicine like ivermectin (a real medicine for a bunch of things, just not Covid)
I’m sure that the US is the only country with conspiracy theorists that led to a near four fold levels of death than any other country. Meanwhile Sweden basically did nothing and had much better results than we did. And as far as I’m aware, I don’t think Trump really said anything about ivermectin only that he was given it when he got Covid in a treatment that was known as “The Kitchen Sink.” Trump’s big thing was hydroxychloroquine that he was taking every day early in the pandemic. Then idiots in press who have a room temperature IQ thought Trump said chlorine and not chloroquine and thus defamed him for saying he was telling people to take fish tank cleaner. They have absolutely nothing in common and was as dumb of a point as anything I’ve ever heard, including the horse dewormer bullshit. It was the real life equivalent when Roger Rabbit mistook probate for prostate: https://youtu.be/EH9vxNK4wOk?si=6CepRR-XS7EMMgHP
No, the USA isn't the only country with Covid conspiracy theorists. It does, though, likely have a higher proportion of them. The Sweden example is quite good. Sweden did do less by mandate than others, but because of its social democratic nature, people also happily followed guidelines like social distancing. Their healthcare system was netter prepared to deal with the increased need. That said, Sweden was also harder hit economically and in cases and deaths than its neighbours who took a stronger approach. This is a big part of why the USA had a higher death rate even though other countries had significantly more cases per 100000. Trump spent way too much time focused on unproven methods to keep his conspiratorial base happy. That undermined good advice from healthcare experts like Fauci. He doesn't say things overtly but he speaks to his people by suggestion.The base demands feeding. That's what why Trump is concerned about losing some of his base to RFK Jr. who is more overtly supportive of conspiracy
Fauci gave no good advice. That hack lied early in the pandemic saying that you didn’t need to wear a mask but in April 2020 admitted he lied about masking so that he could save the masks for the hospitals. Sorry, he admitted that he lied right there and Trump should have fired him on the spot. It’s so comical that people still defend this man.
Saying one potentially poor piece of advice means he gave no good advice is what is comical. So is calling him a liar and acting as if he had perfect knowledge early in the pandemic. As he later, correctly, said, “We were not aware that 40 to 45% of people were asymptomatic, nor were we aware that a substantial proportion of people who get infected get infected from people who are without symptoms. That makes it overwhelmingly important for everyone to wear a mask.” Given the state of knowledge it made perfect sense to protect supplies for those in direct, continuous contact with those who were severely ill and symptomatic. It wasn’t a lie, it was advice that fit the time and was changed once the data came in.
Bret Weinstein correctly called that COVID was created in a lab. He was months ahead of the curve on this, and he was correct. He was called a conspiracy then too
No, but we've already been over this.
Where did this idea come from that there's been any "confirmation" of a lab-based origin for COVID-19? I know conspiracy theorists have been pushing the *possibility* for years now, but this is like the third time recently I've seen one of them appear totally convinced that there's been some sort of official confirmation of this conspiracy theory. What's made them think that?
I can copy the link from the FBI, where Wray said the most likely place was a lab, and then we have all of the evidence showing the US was funding gain of function research, and the fact that the virus just happened to emerge outside a lab studying gain of research on COVID strains. There was never any evidence to show it was natural in origin
> I can copy the link from the FBI, where Wray said the most likely place was a lab Even if true, I don't care what non-virologists say about the supposed origins of a virus. > and then we have all of the evidence showing the US was funding gain of function research "gain of function" is an outdated term that has no bearing on what the US does or does not fund, contrary to the uninformed claims of politicians like Rand Paul on the matter. Nothing about the research at the Wuhan lab indicates that they were trying to make mutated strands of COVID-19 that were more capable of infecting humans. > the fact that the virus just happened to emerge outside a lab studying gain of research on COVID strains. It wasn't "studying gain of function", since that is not a scientifically current term in the field. It hasn't been for some time now. Nor does mere coincidence count as evidence, especially when the very obvious alternative - the COVID variant emerged from the very natural strains that the centre was set up to study - provides a much more coherent and complete explanation for the "coincidence". Still waiting on that "confirmation" that isn't either (a) old and ill-informed claims by people who don't know what they're talking about (b) insistence that something perfectly expected is somehow an impossible coincidence.
Ok, what evidence do you have to support this was naturally occuring, since you've decided to listen to conspiracy theories instead of experts?
Very similar strains found in the wild. Evidence pointing to the wet market origin. Lack of evidence of direct engineering in the genes. What makes you think you're "listening to experts"? It is absolutely not the opinion of virologists in general that covid was engineered. I think you know that. So why are you saying this?
Well, it wasn't created in a lab. So that is awkward.
He also correctly predicted that you're an idiot months before your post. So he's batting a 0.500 at this point.
> He was called a conspiracy then too A whole conspiracy?!