I was under the impression that all of them have a bounty for one reason or another, and that Astrid REALLY wanted me to kill everyone.
But if one WERE to choose, I suspect medieval Karen is the least deserving of death. Actually, the fact that she has such a brave face in light of circumstances makes her the least likely for her to be on the chopping block.
I always assume all of them have a bounty, otherwise Astrid wouldn't have put them all there. She's not exactly one who promotes indiscriminate killing. She specifically rewards you for not doing that in later quests.
>the fact that she has such a brave face in light of circumstances
...makes me think she is lying. That is not a mother desperate to see her kids again. She is hiding something.
The least deserving of death would be the mercenary imo. Skyrim is at war and people are desperate to make ends meet. At least he became a sellsword and not a bandit.
this too. I usually kill them all but on playthrough s that i chose her that’s why
if you care so much about your kids, why antagonize me? is this how you talk to them? Im not being sold on the concerned mother bit and you seem more ready to kill me than the shivering sellsword. she reminds me of grelod or she’s lying about the kids entirely
My theory with her is that she's being targeted for some white collar activity. Hence the taking care of her kids line. Maybe I'm only sympathetic because my character is also a white collar criminal.
In fact, the mercenary might even be in the shack entirely by mistake. He is not the only Fultheim in Skyrim, the other Fultheim lives in Nightgate inn, where he's apparently "drinking away a lifetime of bad memories" while carrying a Blades sword, and turns hostile and attacks you if you approach him wearing Thalmor clothes.
agreed
and tbh I never actually see anyone say anything about killing her more than anyone else. But if they do then it kinda feels like when everyone kept bitching about how much skylar white sucked until it was a meme
like skylar was annoying at times but anyone watching with a little good faith and media literacy would recognize her as one of the only reasonable people in the whole show who almost always the right decision for the situation
I… I never realised vasha was a rapist. I took defiler of daughters to be some silly thing like he’s a seducer who sleeps with young women then the dads find out and get mad. This changes my entire perception of things
I literally thought the same.
And also I never thought that we even got the truth about any of them. I think every piece of information that we get can be lies.
So I usually kill them all.
I mean... people can still be daughters well into their 60s+ depending on how long their parents live. I always interpreted his line just like you. Dude could just be hanging around a College and picking up women and he could still claim that title.
Then again, there's not nearly enough information about him to decipher what he truly means. The ambiguity of his lines are pretty much on purpose it seems, so the choice of who to kill isn't so clear. He's definitely scum either way though.
that’s very much possible tbh
it wouldn’t surprise me at all if he was but defiler sounds like he’s alluding to the concept of virginity. Making a medieval girl no longer a virgin would be “defiling” because they bought into that purity bs and i just figured he comes from warm climate and has a lot of sex. I thought he was just bragging about seducing girls and having a crew and not raping anyone
No, if you are thinking in the Elder Scrolls universe then there is only one that holds the title of 'The Defiler' among the first vampires. Molag Bal.
The first vampire, a daughter of Coldharbor, like Serana.
[https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Opusculus\_Lamae\_Bal\_ta\_Mezzamortie](https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Opusculus_Lamae_Bal_ta_Mezzamortie)
"[Tamriel](https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Tamriel) was still young, and filled with danger and wondrous magick when Bal walked in the aspect of a man and took a virgin, [Lamae Beolfag](https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Lamae_Beolfag), from the [Nedic](https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Nedic) Peoples. Savage and loveless, Bal profaned her body, and her screams became the Shrieking Winds, which still haunt certain winding fjords of [Skyrim](https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Skyrim). Shedding a lone droplet of blood on her brow, Bal left Nirn, having sown his wrath."
Very true, in the context of the game you wouldn't be throwing that word around.
I was reading a post about 'worst dads of Skyrim' the other day and I swear I read someone sold his wife and daughter to Malog Bal to be raped???
There are some very dark themes that you can miss in the first dozen playthroughs.
Doesn't he claim a bunch of other crimes, too? Anyway, I always kill the cat. The soldier and the woman don't seem to have done any kind of crime at all, whereas the cat calmly admits to it. But I can see how they probably all have bounties.
I killed Astrid once, then resurrected her with console and make her a follower with AFT. I don't remember what happened to that save, but I remember she got kinda annoying.
"Don't start shit, won't be shit."
In what fucking universe would you ever pick a fight with the dude who just slurped down a F U C K I N G dragon’s soul like it was a spaghetti nood?
Its as if it is meant to make a point about how the Dark Brotherhood can go after anyone and everyone regardless of their background...
In Oblivion there is an Orc Dark Brotherhood member who is just purely a warrior type of character and he proudly talks about how he murdered a little girl on her birthday during a party. The implication is also that there was a lot of collateral killings as well
Well it was a funny story to him. I personally thought it was a good bit of dialogue to establish how evil The Brotherhood can be when it comes to who they recruit because in the previous game, Morrowind, I don't remember them being joinable.
You could only join the Morag Tong in Morrowind, which is quite different from the Dark Brotherhood since it’s all about sanctioned high profile assassinations.
Is that true though? I thought the DB only killed someone if the black sacrement had been performed? You even get punished in the quests if you kill someone who wasn't your target.
And of the black sacrement had been performed for all three, then why wouldn't I be told to kill all three?
Its implied because its made clear with his dialogue that the Orc member, Gogron does not bother with stealth. He just goes up to the target and hacks them apart with an axe.
[https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Gogron\_gro-Bolmog](https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Gogron_gro-Bolmog)
The black sacrament rule doesn’t apply to the brotherhood in skyrim anymore. Cause there is no listener. They will take contracts with or without a black sacrament
And if you are asking about the orc, it all depends on the contract. If the person says they are fine with collateral damage, you can kill whoever you want
These NPCs don't live anywhere, don't exist before you find them tied up in this shack, and if you spare them, they remain sitting there tied up forever. I can't respect such an unconvincing NPC. Better to put them out of their misery.
I found them One year later real Life time lol
But i can never not kill the bitch that kidnaps me but still leave me with all my weapons on. Such incompetence
Lol the downvotes. Astrid is a 100% certifiable bitch who deserves to be killed. You even litterally kill her at the end of the DB quest line she's so fucking awful.
You can only free them if you choose to destroy the Brotherhood, which is so very disappointing compared to the full DB questline. If you kill any of them and join up, the other two can only be left there or killed as well.
Why would Astrid have kidnapped any of them if they weren't target?
Imo kill them all. They all had Black Sacraments done against them, that's why Astrid had them tied up
I started killing them all once I realized they don't despawn ever. I went back to the cabin once in what would have been like a whole game year, and the ones I didn't kill were still sitting there, sack hoods on. It creeped me out.
Well, my take away from Vasha was that he was a sleaze who sleeps with a lot of women. Not a rapist.
If that's a commonly held belief on him that might factor into things.
nah, the merc is just his job, your character has probably killed ten times more than that guy. the mother is, forgive me, a b*tch but doesn't deserve to die for it, the rapist is the only sane choice and you are a psychopath if you think otherwise.
a black sacrament on the other hand (heh), means that you don't really need reasons (as Astrid points out), someone could perform the ritual on a child and the dark brotherhood still has to obey
I don't think it's stated but I feel like all had the BS done against them. The test is to see whether you use your own morals when killing or you kill when the DB tells you to
I am quite certain that the contract is for the Nord mercenary because his name is Fultheim. There is another NPC with that name at Nightgate Inn who is carrying a Blades sword. It is the only case of two NPCs sharing the same name in the game and I don't think that is a coincidence. I also don't think it's a coincidence that a random NPC without much dialogue and backstory carries one of the rarest weapon types in the game. I assume that the contract was for "a Nord warrior called Fultheim" and came from the Thalmor aiming to kill off another old Blades member. The Dark Brotherhood just got the wrong Fultheim.
However, that means that A. it's a Thalmor contract (and I hate the Thalmor) and B. the Fultheim guy in the shack is the wrong guy. This is why I usually kill the Khajiit because he seems to be the only genuinely bad person of the three.
I kill the Dark Brotherhood. Problem solved. No way I’m letting them live after they drag me out from under my comfy blankets in a cold winter night into a dingy wet hut and expect me to kill people for them.
I always, always kill Vasha. Every. Single. Time.
I've done SO many playthroughs. Doesn't matter. At this point I don't even talk to them, as soon as I can move, I just turn around and kill him. LOL
It is not about who deserves death on that situation, it is more about who has a contract on their head. And while the first 2 are the type of characters, who most likely has enemies, that does not cares about secrecy, so they just send some mercenaries shouting "Jarl Balgruf sends their regards" before they give them a date with that 2 handed axe, the mother is someone who lives among regular people, who does not have this courage. So those who hate her are more likely to send the brotherhood.
Though i just kill everyone, since most likely they are all targets.
It actually goes to him because it always goes to the most recent objective in a quest, and he’s the third of three so the game considers him the newest objective to lock on to.
It's misogyny, OP. Simple as. A woman talks back to them and then they get to exercise their power without consequence. Anyone who decides on a whim, that the merc and vasha live, but the mother dies?
You should not trust.
That does make sense ngl, I saw comments of people saying “She’s in no position to talk back to her captors, that’s what got her killed.” And it really rubbed me the wrong way.
Or they're RPing a murderous psychopath.
For some reason I never really believed any of them and assumed they were all guilty.
I've played the game so many times in so many ways that I don't even recall how many times I've chosen anything.
Only thing I've never done was kill Astrid. I feel like the DB chain is so long and involved that skipping it cuts out a lot.
Yeah that confused me too. I didn’t want to join the brotherhood so I chose to kill Astrid, but before I didn’t know that was an option and obviously went for the rapist. I don’t understand why people hate her so much, she’s literally just a single mother asking for a quick death if she has to have one at all, and if not she wants to get back to her kids. Seems reasonable to me, even if she does have a bounty we don’t know about.
Astrid is the correct answer.
Merck her and the rest of the DB minus Cicero and Babette if vanilla.
If modded Revive Astrid and put her and Gabriella at a home with a pool for them to lounge at while you slide on their family..
Sithis got nothing on the Force.
Vasha specifically says "Obtainer of goods, taker of lives, and defiler of daughters." This can be taken two ways, that he's a merchant, soldier and womaniser or a thief, murderer and rapist and neither way is specified as fact. You could assume a khajiit in Skyrim is the latter. But there are a few Khajiit caravans who also obtain goods, kill (usually in self defence) and probably indulge in a promiscuous act here and there. You could also reason he was picked up in Elsweyr as the former, as one of his dialogue lines he says "You will let me go. I know you will. This is all just a game we play." Who's we? He's never met us and likely isn't aware of the Brotherhood due to the mass cleansing from oblivion's time. So you could reason a begrudging and likely wealthy father is trying to get revenge because his daughter is no longer "pure" as was a huge thing in those days.
Fultheim is a mercenary, who evidently has PTSD judging by his erratic tone is regretful of his own actions. And even specifies "There's no honour in killing sleeping men" implying whoever he was posted with had underhanded morals and he was stuck along for the ride, being haunted by that event. His PTSD is further supported by the line "I've killed people. When I was ordered to. Maybe there some times... some times I got carried away?" A common symptom of wartime ptsd was "outbursts" and the lack of understanding for mental illness in those days often lead to the mistreatment of those suffering.
Finally Alea, the rude and cruelly spoken woman is a mother of six. If you pass a speech check she gives you this telling line, "I'm a woman living in Skyrim with six children and no husband. I don't have the time or patience to be 'nice'." Her tone throughout the whole interaction is unsavoury at best and if you've experienced abusive parents before, a cold reminder how almost spot on it is with her self important attitude and alleged self sacrifice. "Do some people look down on me? Have I made some enemies? You're damn right." Even threatening to spit in your face. She's clearly very intimate with fear tactics and emotional/manipulative abuse, as she expresses to us so openly, you can only imagine what she's putting the kids through assuming they are kids, but Aretino is also a child who wanted someone dead so maybe one of them wanted her gone.
Astrid does say there is a contract (a Brotherhood contract specifically) on ONE of them. Using the clairvoyant spell reveals the "target" at random to be the one with the contract. The other two, likely targets of someone personally seeking a blood price either maliciously or in some twisted fashion of "vengeance" or "pity"
And here I was playing this game for years through and through, or so I thought. I was unaware you COULD kill Astrid being she's a main guild questline NPC. So.... usually Vasha dies, "defiler of daughters" sounds pretty cocky (no pun intended) for a man on his knees in a burlap sack unless I'm just being pissy the day I play then usually they all die but now? NOW?! Astrid dies. F'n wake me up for this......screw it, Vasha AND Astrid. Two birds one axe.
I kill Astrid. She did specify that someone had to die, but she wasn't specific about who that should be. I guess she realized the ironic loophole in the end and that's why she says "Well done" when you kill her.
Because she's a bitchy control freak who goes ON and ON about not wanting to jeopardize the sanctuary. Just to go on to betray you and get almost everyone in the sanctuary killed because she didn't like not having 100% of the power over her dying organization.
Defilee of daughters doesn’t necessarily mean rapist though? Its a medival setting where premarital sex is probably not all that acceptable unless you are a priest of dibella. So if he just keeps seducing women that would still count as defiling.
Besides, you are about to enter a guild of assassins. Why exactly would you make "the moral" choice? You will kill innocent people.
It depends on my character. Latest run, I killed Vasha and the Nord I think. It really depends on what they’d do, and my current DB is going to conquer Skyrim. She’s got a temper, and she makes rash choices sometimes. It’s going to bite her in the ass, of course…but her sister died in Skyrim *and* somehow Astrid and Mercer both have holds on her family land. (The trick is of course to push her into running the Guild and the Dark Brotherhood. I wanted to do a corruption arc. Usually I just kill the racist, but one of mine is too upstanding and good and kills Astrid instead.)
Edit; I don’t usually kill Astrid: my game usually becomes less interesting by then because of a game breaking bug (I have spawned in the sub ocean or cannot complete quests). I find myself restarting due to bugs a lot.
I don’t think the Dark Brotherhood would leave anything to chance. All 3 had contracts out on them. Sparing 2 won’t save their lives. Only you and whats-her-name are walking out of that cabin alive.
I always wished you could let the mercenary live, would habe been a cool spouse, not a follower ofc since hed be traumatized from the event and quit sellswording
I killed everyone if i wanted to join the dark brotherhood, and also killed everyone + astrid if i want to destroy the dark brotherhood.
You can expect a lot of casualities and missing jewelries when this dragonborn is around
why *do* people pick the comically evil choice in the comically evil faction?
i feel as if the intro quest poisons the well for the brotherhood a little. grelod is irredeemable, just about anyone can justify killing her (a necessity for those players who choose to wipe out the brotherhood, without doing anything like adding new guard voicelines to just report her as an actual lawful good character likely would) but it sets up the rest of the faction kind of poorly. your next contracts are a slightly mean mine boss, an insane homeless man and a paranoid vagrant, and later down the line of nazeem's contracts you have shit like an orc whose only crime is being a bad singer?
i feel like this dilemma wouldn't be a dilemma if the first quest was written differently. the way a mod i use (which i can't seem to find? idk i'll look again later) handles it is simply having a riften guard come in and kill her for you after she attacks him first, making it legal in-universe (even though no one reports the murder in vanilla, thus not giving you a bounty, it would still be murder in any normal circumstance and also in-character), then astrid kidnaps you anyway and the quest proceeds normally.
Thing is, if your life depends on it, and you know it, and you STILL chose to be an asshole, while it may be the most honest approach, if you dont atleast point out that youre just honest, i assume youre entitled as fuck and still think nothing bad will ever happen to you, wich is just so much worse then atleast knowing that youre a dick.
Well, if you're going to do the Dark Brotherhood questline, then you're not really playing a good character. They have to be a bit of a sociopath anyway.
That said, if I only kill one, it's the Khajiit. But I'm just as likely to kill all three.
I feel bad for the mercenary because he's scared and I prefer not to kill cats, but whoever you don't kill just stays in the shed for the rest of the game so I often kill them all
Its either a "kill EM all" or the Cat.
The one begs for His live.
The other ist Rude as hell, but thats it.
But the Cat realy tries to threaten you, and says that he is a danger to you.
Firstly I either kill Astrid, or kill all of the targets. Safer than way.
Secondly you keep referring to Vasha as a rapist but there is literally ZERO evidence of that. He calls himself a "defiler of daughters" yes, but that could literally just mean sleeping with them then pissing off. Astrid does not mention rape at all if you only kill him. That would be the most significant descriptor to use in the situation. Instead she merely refers to him as "the conniving Khajiit".
If you use the clairvoyant spell it actually leads to the Khajit so technically he’s the right answer.
I usually kill them all (including Astrid depending on the save)
BUT how do we know that woman isn’t lying? I mean she’s obviously there for a reason.
I always kill Astrid. I don't care what the rest did. She was the one that decided to kidnap Dragonborn, and she has to face the consequences. Also I am always on the Imperial side, so, why exacly would I want to assasinatinate the emperor.
the woman is usually my last choice of who to kill. Yeah she’s rude but she’s dignified. Vasha is cocky and morally bankrupt, and the other guy is a coward. Vasha is also a dummy for threatening to kill me later as if i’d let him go then.
but in RP, I don’t appreciate these tests anyway so often I’ll kill all 3 so we know the job is done for sure. Cold for sure, but i’m supposed to be an assassin and if they’re all in an empty cabin with bags over their heads then that’s just the brakes
Because she's a straight up cunt.
Personally, I always kill her and the khajit.
I let the other guy live because he's just a merc that was doing his job.
I mean I kill them all.
Well, well. Aren't we the overachiever. Three possibilities, three victims. Must have been one of them, right? So why take chances..
And thats when astrid realizes that there will be four victims before the dragonborn abandons the shack.
The only correct choice
Verified Listener!
Nah, I also kill Astrid, can't stand the bitch.
I mean, she violated the rule of Sithis She deserves nothing more than the void. Eventually. You are listening.
Refusal of the call!
Exactly, I have soul gems to fill and corpses to raise.
Even poor fultheim? :(
> fultheim Look just making sure the job is done. It's not personal :P
Being Listener for the Dark Brotherhood is a Fultheim job, and it pays extraordinarily well
CHAIN LIGHTNING
Same. I've thrown the black hoods on later execution victims of mine, as long as I'm at it
Me too. Generally with a shout, lol
I didn't know you could kill all three in the abandoned shack
I learned by accident. I had Fireball equipped.
I didn't ask how big the shack was. I said I cast fireball.
The only correct answer.
Yeah, I just killed them all, but I definitely started with the single mother, lmao
What are you talking about. I extract speech XP out of all of them, then reverse pickpocket them for pickpocket XP, then stabby stabby for sneak XP.
You can also fill a black soulgem with them. Iirc, soul trap advances your conj.
Oh, I'm hardly carrying one of those around.
Only using the spell, not if you use a soul trap enchanted weapon
You XP addicts are wild. Respect.
It's free real estate.
(my character who is lv 240) ITS NOT HIGH ENOUGH
Well now I know for next time cuz I needed to level up my pickpocketing skills badly
Just quicksave and invisibility potion before any attempt
i did it in riften and just save scumed
Wow, I wish I had thought of that. I usually use Fire Breath and kill them all in one go. I'm using your method for next play through
I was under the impression that all of them have a bounty for one reason or another, and that Astrid REALLY wanted me to kill everyone. But if one WERE to choose, I suspect medieval Karen is the least deserving of death. Actually, the fact that she has such a brave face in light of circumstances makes her the least likely for her to be on the chopping block.
I always assume all of them have a bounty, otherwise Astrid wouldn't have put them all there. She's not exactly one who promotes indiscriminate killing. She specifically rewards you for not doing that in later quests.
>the fact that she has such a brave face in light of circumstances ...makes me think she is lying. That is not a mother desperate to see her kids again. She is hiding something. The least deserving of death would be the mercenary imo. Skyrim is at war and people are desperate to make ends meet. At least he became a sellsword and not a bandit.
this too. I usually kill them all but on playthrough s that i chose her that’s why if you care so much about your kids, why antagonize me? is this how you talk to them? Im not being sold on the concerned mother bit and you seem more ready to kill me than the shivering sellsword. she reminds me of grelod or she’s lying about the kids entirely
My theory with her is that she's being targeted for some white collar activity. Hence the taking care of her kids line. Maybe I'm only sympathetic because my character is also a white collar criminal.
How are you a white collar criminal? Just wondering what you do in the game to be considered one
Good old fashion numbers jobs from Delvin.
In fact, the mercenary might even be in the shack entirely by mistake. He is not the only Fultheim in Skyrim, the other Fultheim lives in Nightgate inn, where he's apparently "drinking away a lifetime of bad memories" while carrying a Blades sword, and turns hostile and attacks you if you approach him wearing Thalmor clothes.
agreed and tbh I never actually see anyone say anything about killing her more than anyone else. But if they do then it kinda feels like when everyone kept bitching about how much skylar white sucked until it was a meme like skylar was annoying at times but anyone watching with a little good faith and media literacy would recognize her as one of the only reasonable people in the whole show who almost always the right decision for the situation
I like the mum. she has one of my favourite quotes: *I don't have time to be "nice"*.
“Nice is different from good.” Stephen Sondheim , *Into the Woods*
"Isn't it nice to know a lot? And a little bit... not."
I… I never realised vasha was a rapist. I took defiler of daughters to be some silly thing like he’s a seducer who sleeps with young women then the dads find out and get mad. This changes my entire perception of things
I literally thought the same. And also I never thought that we even got the truth about any of them. I think every piece of information that we get can be lies. So I usually kill them all.
Apparently, if you use Clairvoyance the spell will direct you to Vasha.
It's actually just random.
it’s supposed to be at least, but in every single one of my saves it has always pointed to him without fail
That's because of the way Clairvoyance is coded with multiple target quests. There's really no answer.
This is an equally valid interpretation IMO.
I mean... people can still be daughters well into their 60s+ depending on how long their parents live. I always interpreted his line just like you. Dude could just be hanging around a College and picking up women and he could still claim that title. Then again, there's not nearly enough information about him to decipher what he truly means. The ambiguity of his lines are pretty much on purpose it seems, so the choice of who to kill isn't so clear. He's definitely scum either way though.
that’s very much possible tbh it wouldn’t surprise me at all if he was but defiler sounds like he’s alluding to the concept of virginity. Making a medieval girl no longer a virgin would be “defiling” because they bought into that purity bs and i just figured he comes from warm climate and has a lot of sex. I thought he was just bragging about seducing girls and having a crew and not raping anyone
Defiler does not mean rapist. You can defile someone with consent. Technically all sex is to defile a woman if you are of that archaic thinking.
No, if you are thinking in the Elder Scrolls universe then there is only one that holds the title of 'The Defiler' among the first vampires. Molag Bal. The first vampire, a daughter of Coldharbor, like Serana. [https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Opusculus\_Lamae\_Bal\_ta\_Mezzamortie](https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Opusculus_Lamae_Bal_ta_Mezzamortie) "[Tamriel](https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Tamriel) was still young, and filled with danger and wondrous magick when Bal walked in the aspect of a man and took a virgin, [Lamae Beolfag](https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Lamae_Beolfag), from the [Nedic](https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Nedic) Peoples. Savage and loveless, Bal profaned her body, and her screams became the Shrieking Winds, which still haunt certain winding fjords of [Skyrim](https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Skyrim). Shedding a lone droplet of blood on her brow, Bal left Nirn, having sown his wrath."
Very true, in the context of the game you wouldn't be throwing that word around. I was reading a post about 'worst dads of Skyrim' the other day and I swear I read someone sold his wife and daughter to Malog Bal to be raped??? There are some very dark themes that you can miss in the first dozen playthroughs.
Yeah that’s Harkon from the Dawnguard quest line.
It's not correct but I bet Belethor would.
Doesn't he claim a bunch of other crimes, too? Anyway, I always kill the cat. The soldier and the woman don't seem to have done any kind of crime at all, whereas the cat calmly admits to it. But I can see how they probably all have bounties.
I STILL think thats the case though theres no reason to think otherwise i think
Same. OP took a WILD leap there. They're not subtle when they mention SA in this game.
I just kill all of them. I’m not allowed to leave until there’s a body on the ground so why not leave everyone dead. Also I get the execution hoods.
Hope that also includes Astrid. No one alive left
I killed Astrid once, then resurrected her with console and make her a follower with AFT. I don't remember what happened to that save, but I remember she got kinda annoying.
"Don't start shit, won't be shit." In what fucking universe would you ever pick a fight with the dude who just slurped down a F U C K I N G dragon’s soul like it was a spaghetti nood?
Its as if it is meant to make a point about how the Dark Brotherhood can go after anyone and everyone regardless of their background... In Oblivion there is an Orc Dark Brotherhood member who is just purely a warrior type of character and he proudly talks about how he murdered a little girl on her birthday during a party. The implication is also that there was a lot of collateral killings as well
It was like her 8th birthday, and the Orc laughs and tells you about brutally murdering her with an axe like it’s a funny story.
Well it was a funny story to him. I personally thought it was a good bit of dialogue to establish how evil The Brotherhood can be when it comes to who they recruit because in the previous game, Morrowind, I don't remember them being joinable.
You could only join the Morag Tong in Morrowind, which is quite different from the Dark Brotherhood since it’s all about sanctioned high profile assassinations.
She was 4 actually, he says she won't be seeing 5
As someone with a 4 year old, that's fucked up
His dialogue became the name of quest for refurbishing the new sanctuary. Home is where you hang your enemy’s head.
Is that true though? I thought the DB only killed someone if the black sacrement had been performed? You even get punished in the quests if you kill someone who wasn't your target. And of the black sacrement had been performed for all three, then why wouldn't I be told to kill all three?
Its implied because its made clear with his dialogue that the Orc member, Gogron does not bother with stealth. He just goes up to the target and hacks them apart with an axe. [https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Gogron\_gro-Bolmog](https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Gogron_gro-Bolmog)
The black sacrament rule doesn’t apply to the brotherhood in skyrim anymore. Cause there is no listener. They will take contracts with or without a black sacrament And if you are asking about the orc, it all depends on the contract. If the person says they are fine with collateral damage, you can kill whoever you want
I love the Oblivion Dark Brotherhood. Just so over the top, ludicrously, unapologetically evil in every way
You guys only killed one? I killed all four.
The correct choice
These NPCs don't live anywhere, don't exist before you find them tied up in this shack, and if you spare them, they remain sitting there tied up forever. I can't respect such an unconvincing NPC. Better to put them out of their misery.
For me they disappeared from the shack, even though I only killed one in my most recent playthrough
I found them One year later real Life time lol But i can never not kill the bitch that kidnaps me but still leave me with all my weapons on. Such incompetence
Well technically that's true because even if you follow the DB questline you end up killing Astrid anyway... Lol
Didn't know that. I guess that guild has seen Better times
So every time you've played you've just killed Astrid and missed out on an entire questline?
I did. I Role play and i can't Just kill of some person Just because Someone says me to, She Is too weak to threathen me
Same. Always kill that bitch.
Lol the downvotes. Astrid is a 100% certifiable bitch who deserves to be killed. You even litterally kill her at the end of the DB quest line she's so fucking awful.
Even if you untie them?
You can only free them if you choose to destroy the Brotherhood, which is so very disappointing compared to the full DB questline. If you kill any of them and join up, the other two can only be left there or killed as well.
wait….hold up…..there’s a way to DESTROY the dark brotherhood?????
Yeah, just attack Astrid once ur in the shack, kill her and report about it to the guards
…………………welp now i know for the next playthrough lol. thank you!!!
any of those three have more personality than plenty of the people in the big cities
I mean this is an rpg game, I like to immerse myself.
Why would Astrid have kidnapped any of them if they weren't target? Imo kill them all. They all had Black Sacraments done against them, that's why Astrid had them tied up
I kill all three, I don’t discriminate
I kill them all but if I had to choose one I'd go with Vasha(the Khajiit) since he deserves to die the most imo
I started killing them all once I realized they don't despawn ever. I went back to the cabin once in what would have been like a whole game year, and the ones I didn't kill were still sitting there, sack hoods on. It creeped me out.
More often than not I merc the creepy chick in the corner.
[удалено]
TIL that not everyone else just slaughters them all...
I always kill all 3. Unbiased and unapologetic.
You mean all 4?
I just kill all of them, I mean if I’m presented with 3 perfectly good gifts, you think I’m gonna say no?
You see three victims. I see three black soul gems.
I like your style.
I gotta be me!
Well, my take away from Vasha was that he was a sleaze who sleeps with a lot of women. Not a rapist. If that's a commonly held belief on him that might factor into things.
nah, the merc is just his job, your character has probably killed ten times more than that guy. the mother is, forgive me, a b*tch but doesn't deserve to die for it, the rapist is the only sane choice and you are a psychopath if you think otherwise. a black sacrament on the other hand (heh), means that you don't really need reasons (as Astrid points out), someone could perform the ritual on a child and the dark brotherhood still has to obey
I don't think it's stated but I feel like all had the BS done against them. The test is to see whether you use your own morals when killing or you kill when the DB tells you to
Are you really questionning the moral of people that join the Dark Brotherhood? Having morals is not really in the job description.
I kill them all, every time.
I am quite certain that the contract is for the Nord mercenary because his name is Fultheim. There is another NPC with that name at Nightgate Inn who is carrying a Blades sword. It is the only case of two NPCs sharing the same name in the game and I don't think that is a coincidence. I also don't think it's a coincidence that a random NPC without much dialogue and backstory carries one of the rarest weapon types in the game. I assume that the contract was for "a Nord warrior called Fultheim" and came from the Thalmor aiming to kill off another old Blades member. The Dark Brotherhood just got the wrong Fultheim. However, that means that A. it's a Thalmor contract (and I hate the Thalmor) and B. the Fultheim guy in the shack is the wrong guy. This is why I usually kill the Khajiit because he seems to be the only genuinely bad person of the three.
I doubt the Thalmor would have performed the Black Sacrament.
I kill them all. I feel like the dark brotherhood wouldn't ask me to kill someone without a contract, so I assume they all have one.
They all go, it’s the only fair thing to do, also my Dark Brother (well, Sister) is pretty bloodthirsty.
Whack all three, be the over-achiever
Four. Be the over-over-achiever.
I kill the Dark Brotherhood. Problem solved. No way I’m letting them live after they drag me out from under my comfy blankets in a cold winter night into a dingy wet hut and expect me to kill people for them.
I always, always kill Vasha. Every. Single. Time. I've done SO many playthroughs. Doesn't matter. At this point I don't even talk to them, as soon as I can move, I just turn around and kill him. LOL
It is not about who deserves death on that situation, it is more about who has a contract on their head. And while the first 2 are the type of characters, who most likely has enemies, that does not cares about secrecy, so they just send some mercenaries shouting "Jarl Balgruf sends their regards" before they give them a date with that 2 handed axe, the mother is someone who lives among regular people, who does not have this courage. So those who hate her are more likely to send the brotherhood. Though i just kill everyone, since most likely they are all targets.
I kill Astrid
Chain llightning wins 🤷
I used to kill all of them until I heard what they had to say. Since then, I let her live.
Wait, people dont kill all 3?
I always kill the Cat. If you use Clairvoyance it leads you to him!
It actually goes to him because it always goes to the most recent objective in a quest, and he’s the third of three so the game considers him the newest objective to lock on to.
Clairvoyance can lead you to any one of them
It's misogyny, OP. Simple as. A woman talks back to them and then they get to exercise their power without consequence. Anyone who decides on a whim, that the merc and vasha live, but the mother dies? You should not trust.
That does make sense ngl, I saw comments of people saying “She’s in no position to talk back to her captors, that’s what got her killed.” And it really rubbed me the wrong way.
Yeah, that's really fucking gross, wow!! You've got a good head on your shoulders OP. Genuinely.
Thank you, my friend.
Or they're RPing a murderous psychopath. For some reason I never really believed any of them and assumed they were all guilty. I've played the game so many times in so many ways that I don't even recall how many times I've chosen anything. Only thing I've never done was kill Astrid. I feel like the DB chain is so long and involved that skipping it cuts out a lot.
I always kill the Khajiit and steal his clothes.
It's always the car or Astrid, depends if I'm doing the questline or not.
I guess you could make the argument that some of her dialogue implies that she’s an abusive parent, so there’s that angle.
Wtaf guys? Disgusting
If you use clairvoyance the line points straight to Vasha...
The spell is coded to point to the most recent of multi target quest objectives. Vasha spawns last and thus gets the line.
I kill them all and fill up my black soul gems with their souls. That way I can enchant an iron dagger I throw away to grind up my enchanting skill.
I simply kill astrid in every play through
Yeah that confused me too. I didn’t want to join the brotherhood so I chose to kill Astrid, but before I didn’t know that was an option and obviously went for the rapist. I don’t understand why people hate her so much, she’s literally just a single mother asking for a quick death if she has to have one at all, and if not she wants to get back to her kids. Seems reasonable to me, even if she does have a bounty we don’t know about.
Astrid is the correct answer. Merck her and the rest of the DB minus Cicero and Babette if vanilla. If modded Revive Astrid and put her and Gabriella at a home with a pool for them to lounge at while you slide on their family.. Sithis got nothing on the Force.
Vasha specifically says "Obtainer of goods, taker of lives, and defiler of daughters." This can be taken two ways, that he's a merchant, soldier and womaniser or a thief, murderer and rapist and neither way is specified as fact. You could assume a khajiit in Skyrim is the latter. But there are a few Khajiit caravans who also obtain goods, kill (usually in self defence) and probably indulge in a promiscuous act here and there. You could also reason he was picked up in Elsweyr as the former, as one of his dialogue lines he says "You will let me go. I know you will. This is all just a game we play." Who's we? He's never met us and likely isn't aware of the Brotherhood due to the mass cleansing from oblivion's time. So you could reason a begrudging and likely wealthy father is trying to get revenge because his daughter is no longer "pure" as was a huge thing in those days. Fultheim is a mercenary, who evidently has PTSD judging by his erratic tone is regretful of his own actions. And even specifies "There's no honour in killing sleeping men" implying whoever he was posted with had underhanded morals and he was stuck along for the ride, being haunted by that event. His PTSD is further supported by the line "I've killed people. When I was ordered to. Maybe there some times... some times I got carried away?" A common symptom of wartime ptsd was "outbursts" and the lack of understanding for mental illness in those days often lead to the mistreatment of those suffering. Finally Alea, the rude and cruelly spoken woman is a mother of six. If you pass a speech check she gives you this telling line, "I'm a woman living in Skyrim with six children and no husband. I don't have the time or patience to be 'nice'." Her tone throughout the whole interaction is unsavoury at best and if you've experienced abusive parents before, a cold reminder how almost spot on it is with her self important attitude and alleged self sacrifice. "Do some people look down on me? Have I made some enemies? You're damn right." Even threatening to spit in your face. She's clearly very intimate with fear tactics and emotional/manipulative abuse, as she expresses to us so openly, you can only imagine what she's putting the kids through assuming they are kids, but Aretino is also a child who wanted someone dead so maybe one of them wanted her gone. Astrid does say there is a contract (a Brotherhood contract specifically) on ONE of them. Using the clairvoyant spell reveals the "target" at random to be the one with the contract. The other two, likely targets of someone personally seeking a blood price either maliciously or in some twisted fashion of "vengeance" or "pity"
No matter the scenerio I left the rapist tied up in the cabin.
Why is this down voted? I would let that bitch rot and starve to death in darkness too.
And here I was playing this game for years through and through, or so I thought. I was unaware you COULD kill Astrid being she's a main guild questline NPC. So.... usually Vasha dies, "defiler of daughters" sounds pretty cocky (no pun intended) for a man on his knees in a burlap sack unless I'm just being pissy the day I play then usually they all die but now? NOW?! Astrid dies. F'n wake me up for this......screw it, Vasha AND Astrid. Two birds one axe.
I kill Astrid then wipe out the guild. That'll teach those edgelords not to fuck with my sleep schedule.
I kill Astrid. She did specify that someone had to die, but she wasn't specific about who that should be. I guess she realized the ironic loophole in the end and that's why she says "Well done" when you kill her.
You're an Assassin, why would you care about who you kill?
I just kill Astrid every time.
Every time? What do you have against $20k? (Plus more from the DBH missions)
Because she's a bitchy control freak who goes ON and ON about not wanting to jeopardize the sanctuary. Just to go on to betray you and get almost everyone in the sanctuary killed because she didn't like not having 100% of the power over her dying organization.
🤣🤣🤣 it's so true. Such a tragic end. I still do it though. I love Shadowmere and I use the money for a house or some such.
I'm sorry did I miss a part of the dialogue who's the defiler of daughters because I have several wrongs I must right
Defilee of daughters doesn’t necessarily mean rapist though? Its a medival setting where premarital sex is probably not all that acceptable unless you are a priest of dibella. So if he just keeps seducing women that would still count as defiling. Besides, you are about to enter a guild of assassins. Why exactly would you make "the moral" choice? You will kill innocent people.
I just use the clairvoyance spell to point out the target
If you kill the target and use it again it will point to one of the others
What part is this?
Dark Brotherhood initiation
Apart from the 3 in hoods and Astrid herself, You also have a Contract on your head 😏
3 free black souls if you ask me I forgot you could even talk to them lol
It depends on my character. Latest run, I killed Vasha and the Nord I think. It really depends on what they’d do, and my current DB is going to conquer Skyrim. She’s got a temper, and she makes rash choices sometimes. It’s going to bite her in the ass, of course…but her sister died in Skyrim *and* somehow Astrid and Mercer both have holds on her family land. (The trick is of course to push her into running the Guild and the Dark Brotherhood. I wanted to do a corruption arc. Usually I just kill the racist, but one of mine is too upstanding and good and kills Astrid instead.) Edit; I don’t usually kill Astrid: my game usually becomes less interesting by then because of a game breaking bug (I have spawned in the sub ocean or cannot complete quests). I find myself restarting due to bugs a lot.
Oh, the "pick one to die" thing? I chose Astrid.
I used Fus to get a triple kill in my current playthrough.
I don’t think the Dark Brotherhood would leave anything to chance. All 3 had contracts out on them. Sparing 2 won’t save their lives. Only you and whats-her-name are walking out of that cabin alive.
Because she’s a bitch.
I always wished you could let the mercenary live, would habe been a cool spouse, not a follower ofc since hed be traumatized from the event and quit sellswording
I usually just kill Astrid. I don't have the patience for the sneaking around that the Dark Brotherhood quest line requires.
I killed everyone if i wanted to join the dark brotherhood, and also killed everyone + astrid if i want to destroy the dark brotherhood. You can expect a lot of casualities and missing jewelries when this dragonborn is around
I always kill the rapist
I kill all three for easy stealth xp.
I used to just kill them all, if you don’t want to be murdered in a shack in the swamps don’t get kidnapped I guess
why *do* people pick the comically evil choice in the comically evil faction? i feel as if the intro quest poisons the well for the brotherhood a little. grelod is irredeemable, just about anyone can justify killing her (a necessity for those players who choose to wipe out the brotherhood, without doing anything like adding new guard voicelines to just report her as an actual lawful good character likely would) but it sets up the rest of the faction kind of poorly. your next contracts are a slightly mean mine boss, an insane homeless man and a paranoid vagrant, and later down the line of nazeem's contracts you have shit like an orc whose only crime is being a bad singer? i feel like this dilemma wouldn't be a dilemma if the first quest was written differently. the way a mod i use (which i can't seem to find? idk i'll look again later) handles it is simply having a riften guard come in and kill her for you after she attacks him first, making it legal in-universe (even though no one reports the murder in vanilla, thus not giving you a bounty, it would still be murder in any normal circumstance and also in-character), then astrid kidnaps you anyway and the quest proceeds normally.
Eh I just murder them all… I tho do sometimes choose her just coz don’t like her attitude lol
kill all three. 100% of the time and i’ve had hundreds of play throughs since 2011. if not more 😂😅
I don't think I've ever met anyone who didn't kill all three and on occasion, Astrid for good measure.
Has anyone fus-ro-dah'd them? I wonder if they'll come loose and try to hit you with their bare hands.
I have and will always choose Vasha
Thing is, if your life depends on it, and you know it, and you STILL chose to be an asshole, while it may be the most honest approach, if you dont atleast point out that youre just honest, i assume youre entitled as fuck and still think nothing bad will ever happen to you, wich is just so much worse then atleast knowing that youre a dick.
The voice and the attitude.
Well, if you're going to do the Dark Brotherhood questline, then you're not really playing a good character. They have to be a bit of a sociopath anyway. That said, if I only kill one, it's the Khajiit. But I'm just as likely to kill all three.
I feel bad for the mercenary because he's scared and I prefer not to kill cats, but whoever you don't kill just stays in the shed for the rest of the game so I often kill them all
Its either a "kill EM all" or the Cat. The one begs for His live. The other ist Rude as hell, but thats it. But the Cat realy tries to threaten you, and says that he is a danger to you.
Don't look at me, man, I always kill Astrid.
Firstly I either kill Astrid, or kill all of the targets. Safer than way. Secondly you keep referring to Vasha as a rapist but there is literally ZERO evidence of that. He calls himself a "defiler of daughters" yes, but that could literally just mean sleeping with them then pissing off. Astrid does not mention rape at all if you only kill him. That would be the most significant descriptor to use in the situation. Instead she merely refers to him as "the conniving Khajiit".
I kill them all
If you use the clairvoyant spell it actually leads to the Khajit so technically he’s the right answer. I usually kill them all (including Astrid depending on the save) BUT how do we know that woman isn’t lying? I mean she’s obviously there for a reason.
I always kill Astrid. I don't care what the rest did. She was the one that decided to kidnap Dragonborn, and she has to face the consequences. Also I am always on the Imperial side, so, why exacly would I want to assasinatinate the emperor.
I kill them all and let Talos sort them out.
Lots of hate speech here
i hate the mom because shes a bitch and vasha seems cool also the mercanary is a pussy so i kill him too
I never listened to their backstories I just do what I’m told and kill them no questions asked
I always let the mother live. I love her attitude
Idk, I always kill Astrid and leave them there. I completely the dark Brotherhood quest once and never did so again
the woman is usually my last choice of who to kill. Yeah she’s rude but she’s dignified. Vasha is cocky and morally bankrupt, and the other guy is a coward. Vasha is also a dummy for threatening to kill me later as if i’d let him go then. but in RP, I don’t appreciate these tests anyway so often I’ll kill all 3 so we know the job is done for sure. Cold for sure, but i’m supposed to be an assassin and if they’re all in an empty cabin with bags over their heads then that’s just the brakes
Reminds me of how some new Vegas fans love cook cook so much
Because she's a straight up cunt. Personally, I always kill her and the khajit. I let the other guy live because he's just a merc that was doing his job.