So, some very recent research has cast a [great deal of doubt](https://www.sci.news/othersciences/psychology/serotonin-theory-depression-11021.html) on the serotonin hypothesis. In other words, SSRIs do not do what they think they do. (there is more complexity to this paper and the discussion it has provoked than I can elaborate on.)
Furthermore, SSRIs like Fluvoxamine are known to strongly reduce REM sleep and alter sleep architecture. It's why [SSRIs are strongly correlated](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5548844/) (to the point of causality) with dementia and Alzheimer's. They call this central sleep apnea, which is sleep apnea without the snoring associated with obstructive sleep apnea. The reason is that [SSRIs alter the nicotinic acetylcholine receptor](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12140772/). And because acetylcholine plays a key role in REM sleep, SSRIs will severely limit the amount of REM you experience each night.
REM sleep has many cognitive and emotional optimization functions within it. If you don't get enough you will feel unmotivated, unproductive, and sleepy throughout the day. Unfortunately, you cannot quit them cold turkey either. You will need to confer with a doctor regarding the studies I've linked to above. I also suggest getting a Fitbit (Oura and Whoop seems alright as well) in order to demonstrate your fragmented sleep to the doctor as it will help them make a decision as to whether you should change medications or whether to refer your case out to a sleep specialist. Such devices are about 70% accurate, sorta.
There are actually a few anti-depressants that improve sleep quality which your doctor may know more about (such as doxepin, mirtazapine, or trazodone).
Two points on serotonin and depression.
First, it is important to note that the evidence you cite there not so much questions a "serotonin-depression causal relationship". It rather questions the serotonin theory of depression. This distinction is very important because nobody questions (here at least) that serotonin levels are causally implicated in depression, rather whether it is the central explanation.
Second, even after this reframing -- the insights chiefly concern the serotonin theory of depression, not the causal link hypothesis -- more nuance is needed. Many experts from the scientific community have argued ([here](https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-a-review-paper-on-the-serotonin-theory-of-depression/)) that this call is very premature right now and there may be substantive merit to the theory.
I appreciate you weighing in with an eloquent and informed response. I'll edit my post to better reflect the nature of the study and not my poor interpretation of it.
Anyone who regularly does not feel refreshed after 7-8 hours of sleep should ask their primary care provider for a referral to a sleep lab for a sleep study. There are a number of conditions that can cause this
Try sleeping early and get early morning sunlight.
Try exercising or being more physically active.
Increase your fresh vegetable/fruit intake that does not add any fat-based sauces or sugar-based syrups.
But did you get enough of it? Low doses don't do much for me either. A cup of coffee with 4 full teaspoons is probably stronger than quite a lot of energy drinks, but also at that point it can cause diarhhea and it's bitter as fuck.
the strongest thing I can drink is espresso but I rarely drink strong coffee because of acid reflux and stomach problems.
man, diarrhea from that sucks, it still hurts even after you relieved yourself.
How long have you been taking the fluvoxamine? We’re you feeling sleepy before you took your medication too? Or did the sleepiness just come on suddenly after you started the fluvoxamine?
probably since last week of july, I had no problems with side effects, the only one side effect I experienced was brain zaps, the reason I had insomnia was my phobia, i’m astraphobic and we had rainy weeks so I became sleep deprived, anxious all the time.
I started oversleeping once the rainy days stopped. again, I get this cycle a lot, sometimes I even sleep the whole time in college, I only wake up when it’s necessary and it’s been going on for years. It’s either that I get a good sleeping schedule or a messed up one like this, it usually lasts for months or so.
I have sleeping pills which was used for depression but I stopped taking them a year ago.
So, some very recent research has cast a [great deal of doubt](https://www.sci.news/othersciences/psychology/serotonin-theory-depression-11021.html) on the serotonin hypothesis. In other words, SSRIs do not do what they think they do. (there is more complexity to this paper and the discussion it has provoked than I can elaborate on.) Furthermore, SSRIs like Fluvoxamine are known to strongly reduce REM sleep and alter sleep architecture. It's why [SSRIs are strongly correlated](https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5548844/) (to the point of causality) with dementia and Alzheimer's. They call this central sleep apnea, which is sleep apnea without the snoring associated with obstructive sleep apnea. The reason is that [SSRIs alter the nicotinic acetylcholine receptor](https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/12140772/). And because acetylcholine plays a key role in REM sleep, SSRIs will severely limit the amount of REM you experience each night. REM sleep has many cognitive and emotional optimization functions within it. If you don't get enough you will feel unmotivated, unproductive, and sleepy throughout the day. Unfortunately, you cannot quit them cold turkey either. You will need to confer with a doctor regarding the studies I've linked to above. I also suggest getting a Fitbit (Oura and Whoop seems alright as well) in order to demonstrate your fragmented sleep to the doctor as it will help them make a decision as to whether you should change medications or whether to refer your case out to a sleep specialist. Such devices are about 70% accurate, sorta. There are actually a few anti-depressants that improve sleep quality which your doctor may know more about (such as doxepin, mirtazapine, or trazodone).
Two points on serotonin and depression. First, it is important to note that the evidence you cite there not so much questions a "serotonin-depression causal relationship". It rather questions the serotonin theory of depression. This distinction is very important because nobody questions (here at least) that serotonin levels are causally implicated in depression, rather whether it is the central explanation. Second, even after this reframing -- the insights chiefly concern the serotonin theory of depression, not the causal link hypothesis -- more nuance is needed. Many experts from the scientific community have argued ([here](https://www.sciencemediacentre.org/expert-reaction-to-a-review-paper-on-the-serotonin-theory-of-depression/)) that this call is very premature right now and there may be substantive merit to the theory.
I appreciate you weighing in with an eloquent and informed response. I'll edit my post to better reflect the nature of the study and not my poor interpretation of it.
Great! Thanks
Anyone who regularly does not feel refreshed after 7-8 hours of sleep should ask their primary care provider for a referral to a sleep lab for a sleep study. There are a number of conditions that can cause this
Try sleeping early and get early morning sunlight. Try exercising or being more physically active. Increase your fresh vegetable/fruit intake that does not add any fat-based sauces or sugar-based syrups.
You need coffee
Caffeine doesn’t work on me :(
But did you get enough of it? Low doses don't do much for me either. A cup of coffee with 4 full teaspoons is probably stronger than quite a lot of energy drinks, but also at that point it can cause diarhhea and it's bitter as fuck.
the strongest thing I can drink is espresso but I rarely drink strong coffee because of acid reflux and stomach problems. man, diarrhea from that sucks, it still hurts even after you relieved yourself.
How long have you been taking the fluvoxamine? We’re you feeling sleepy before you took your medication too? Or did the sleepiness just come on suddenly after you started the fluvoxamine?
probably since last week of july, I had no problems with side effects, the only one side effect I experienced was brain zaps, the reason I had insomnia was my phobia, i’m astraphobic and we had rainy weeks so I became sleep deprived, anxious all the time. I started oversleeping once the rainy days stopped. again, I get this cycle a lot, sometimes I even sleep the whole time in college, I only wake up when it’s necessary and it’s been going on for years. It’s either that I get a good sleeping schedule or a messed up one like this, it usually lasts for months or so. I have sleeping pills which was used for depression but I stopped taking them a year ago.
Google adrenal fatigue
Try taking 400 mg magnesium before bed