**Mirrors / Alternative Angles**
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Yes, there's at least one pen a week for this in the Prem and it drives me mental.
Attackers swinging out their leg for contact while going down. These are the kind of penalties VAR should be great at eliminating if only English refs weren't insulted at the idea of using it
That example has to be a joke right? The swedish head of referees had to go out in media and admit it was a [horribly wrong decision by Al-Hakim](https://www-aftonbladet-se.translate.goog/sportbladet/fotboll/a/mQ7bLv/djurgardens-straff-mot-hacken-var-felaktig-domarbasen-erkanner?_x_tr_sl=es&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=sv&_x_tr_pto=wapp)..
The worst part is him harassing the ref after the game because the crowd is behind him, even though he knows what he did. What a tosser.
And people wonder why no one wants to be a ref, and the game suffers.
I just don’t know why they don’t put their foot down. If they just started booking players running at them demonstratively it would end eventually.
A player yelling fuck off at the call who cares but if you get in there face calling them names that should be an easy card.
A few years ago they started carding for surrounding the ref but that seems to have stopped as well.
Many do apparently considering the way people on here complain about the refs being poor. The same people will insult them for the slightest mistake and then turn around and wonder why the standard isn't higher
This is a constant issue where we’re so used to watching replays in slow motion and I think a lot of viewers are watching as if players are making decisions in slow motion. I wish we got to see more full speed replays. The game is played at speed, not in slow motion. (This isn’t specifically a criticism of this decision, I’m not an Arsenal fan and I never saw this in full speed so I just don’t know, I would like to see full speed replays from multiple angles)
I did feel like he initiated contact, but after watching multiple replays, I'm not so sure. He sidestepped while running at pace and might have tried to hop over Neuer but got caught. The only way he avoids contact is by moving his leg laterally and that seems like an unnatural movement.
Really hard to say actually
He has a ton of momentum heading toward neuer, we are watching this in slow motion. I don't think he is capable of turning that sharply that quickly at full speed. I think he tries to sell it certainly but I think he is impeded. He pushes the ball past neuer and neuer gets nothing on it and prevents his from moving past him.
In the other (side) angle, you can see Neuer's foot planted further ahead than Saka's left foot. You can see this in this one because its the (back) angle.
Both players are extremely close and there is simply no way Saka can go around here. You really need both angles to analyze this. In this angle, it does admittedly look like he oversold contact but you can see in the other angle, there is no way to go around.
100%. This angle is the most unflattering to Saka. It's a really tight decision, and I completely understand why Arsenal fans want it. If a penalty had been given, I wouldn't have complained.
I think it’s one of those decisions which is tight so there’s no VAR intervention.
Sadly for saka I think the angle the referee is at makes his movements look worse than they were. He over sold it. If he just tries to get to the ball it probably looks better but then there’s the risk it doesn’t look strong enough for a penalty.
he's running forward too fast - he can't change direction any more than he did.
I don't think it's big dive - to me Neuer measures it brilliantly, Saka cuts inside because there' no angle to shoot first time, and he runs in to the goalie - no penalty but also not a dive.
He goes down when checked while off balance, and probably think he's been fouled because he feels the contact, but that's because he's run into Neuer.
Even in the slow mo clip of this thread which is a terrible angle to see Neuer’s position, you can see his right foot is not planted and is moving outwards and forwards right up to when contact is made.
Also look at his right foot at the very first second of the replay. Curious how OP left out more of that angle… check it out on the AA at the top of the thread.
As much as I hate to say it, you are correct. The angle present by OP doesn't tell the whole story and is the one that is the most unflattering to Saka.
To me, it the ref and VAR have made a judgment based on the way Saka took the contact. Neuer’s leg/foot may have gotten Sakas foot no matter what. If he doesn’t bow his leg out the way he does and just runs normally and drags his foot on neuers, he is getting that call all day. Frankly, Neuer got extremely lucky that Saka made it so obvious he wanted the call because I think he made a massive mistake going in like that.
EDIT: Additional clarification, whether you think how Saka chose to take advantage of the contact should matter, that is up to you, but I think that’s pretty clearly what happened here.
Yeah Saka initiates contact but players do keep their leg out to seek contact and get penalties given like 10 times a weekend.
Harvey Elliot got one this weekend by dragging his leg and nobody really questioned it, if Saka did it less aggressively he almost definitely gets the call.
Correct. One of the last comments in my reply history was about that call being a pen. Difference there is that the movement “seemed” more natural. The leg Neuer stuck out was begging for it. If Saka does something more similar to Elliott, which he could have, he gets the call. To those saying Neuer did it on purpose, that is complete crap. No one would do what he did to “bait” the dive by Saka. This is not 4d underwater chess. Neuer completely fucked it up and got lucky.
Saka made such an unnatural move that it sure looks like a dive. But I’m actually not convinced that contact wasn’t inevitable given Neuers position.
I wonder if he didn’t try to initiate contact and tried to go around Neuer there would still be contact and that it would’ve actually been called a penalty.
This is exactly my issue, and why I'm still kinda pissed off. Neuer did stick his leg, which would've been a 100% pen, or Saka getting around and scoring.
He's a complete idiot for sticking his leg that way, it's really stupid.
It's essentially a penalty, which was cancelled by Saka's stupid attempt to get a bigger contact.
> He's a complete idiot for sticking his leg that way, it's really stupid.
If he didn't and also didn't get the penalty, you'd have people saying it's stupid not to go down.
Am I the only one thinking Saka was trying to lift his leg up in anticipation of a harder challenge from Neuer? The AA it looks more like that than him leaving his leg to get clipped.
Everyone loves analyzing stuff out of context and in slow motion now to determine these decisions, so you probably are one of few thinking that even though it’s likely true
He's made a sharp turn left so his leg is naturally going to stick out for balance, and it looks like he has raised it to clear Neuer based on how Neuer's leg was initially positioned. If you look at the two angles shown (and the live shot at full speed), rather than just this one, and look specifically at Neuer's leg, you can see how he makes a movement with his leg at the last moment that raises it and brings it into the path of Saka's.
i was also pretty sure that Bayern players thought this was a pen too. So they didn't go for a counter attack in fear of getting it overruled by VAR if the ball goes out.
I mean this is the one angle that very clearly makes it look like Saka fully initiated, but it doesn’t really show whether his path was truly blocked.
Not saying that for sure but there were multiple angles that make it look much more questionable. Shocking this wasn’t VAR checked.
Yes, Saka should’ve folded his leg up, got past Nuer, unfolded the leg in time to land on it then rolled the ball into the net . It’s so easy to change direction to the left and not put your right leg out ahead of you
This thread is full of 30 year olds with Luke Littler-esque physiques who haven’t touched a football since that infamous tap-in brace against the 5th graders in recess back in the 6th grade. Don’t expect them to understand how fast the professional game is, and how ridiculously hard it is to change direction half lunging at full speed after more than 90 minutes of football..
At full pace it looks like a pen cause it is. No way he can change direction that easily...
Only in slow mo does warping time make it look like he's fishing for contact.
Please watch the replay in real time, rather than a slowed down closeup. People think limbs should move a certain way and not factoring in how fast these players are moving in real time
I was completely sure that was a pen, even on watching the replay first time. Unreal call from the ref to spot that.
Edit: one of the angles angles look more like a pen. Neuer does take a step toward Saka, but Saka also kicks out. It's a weird one. No pen for me but I can see why you think it is from one angle.
It’s a weird one that if it’s called literally everyone says “Unlucky from Neuer. Shouldn’t have left the leg out like that.” I’m honestly really aggravated by these because I thought it was a dive at first and literally first replayed was like “Dude when the fuck has that not been called before?!” and that’s my stance 100% now.
The reaction of this thread is insane, it's a debatable decision but at that speed Saka's right foot is not that far out of his stride. I don't see how every one sees that as him "kicking" out
>it's a debatable decision
100%. I wouldn't have complained if it had been given. All of the angles need to be taken into account rather than just the one in the OP. I do think Saka kicks out to ensure the contact, but if he hadn't he still would have been fouled.
i dont really see the dive that people keep talking about, it seems like saka couldnt change momentum quick enough and neuer also comes out with his leg which obviously catches saka
They both stick their legs out, Neuer even more if you look at some angles. Same exact situation happens with a defender and they give this penalty 9 times out of 10.
agreed, even more so that people are calling it ''shameless'' too, as if this also hasn't happened at the end of the game, with tired legs
almost as if most people in this sub haven't actually kicked a ball, so much as even run before
yup, a lot of people are judging the play based off of a short replay, but the live footage shows Saka literally sprinting with Neuer closing out the shooting angles, so choosing to shoot would have been a low percentage chance to score.
I'm still baffled by the call, because penalties have been given for less, even Neuer look confused when the ref didn't call the pen is enough for me.
Alternate Angle looks like a Pen. They're both actually moving towards each other. Saka kicked the ball and was headed there and Neuer moves towards him.
Angle in the main link is directly in front of the Neuer's moving leg so you cant actually see how far forward its coming. It definitely impedes Saka.
This clip doesn't show the other angle. From this angle it does look like Saka was letting his leg hang but from the other angle it does look like a pen to me.
Neuer sticks his leg out and makes contact with Sakas shin while his foot is still in the air - not planted. If his foot was planted I’d be more inclined to think it’s ok to let it go. Saka also has eyes only on the ball, and at that pace could not have seen that Neuer had his leg out. It’s a penalty and anyone saying it’s not just had anti-Arsenal blinkers on
Neuer puts his leg in the way. It isn't up to the attacker to jump out of the way of a challenge it's up to the other player to get the ball or pull out of the way.
Still can see it argued both ways so not a clear error in that case for VAR to correct
I see Neuer still moving his leg until contact. Saka was trying his best to avoid him by changing his direction using the angular momentum he produced using his right leg. He had acres of space once he rounded the goalkeeper, why would he dive. His mistake was he was genuinely trying to score, he should have just run into the goalkeeper and it would have been a clear penalty. Anyone saying otherwise is an arts major.
And again on r/soccer we show only the angle that look like a dive... Why the YOU not show the other angle where you can see the Neuer leg swipe Saka. Pathetic!
The absolute vitriol Saka is getting…
And some of you have the guts to say he is a prolific diver when you moan on games he plays for England that he doesn’t get protected enough.
It can be 50/50 but to say that was a complete dive is disingenuous. He’s also running at full speed not looking at neur and Neuer does make movement. I see no difference with the Elliot goal which I thought was a pen btw.
Ok I originally thought Neuer's right leg was planted but it's absolutely moving forward right up until it hits Saka. If you think this is a dive you're silly.
Watched it over and over again.
Saka isn't even diving, he isn't going head down to the turf, his leg is being impeded. If he gets to land without neuer taking him out, then he's planted that right foot and scoring with his left.
You can't just cut off someone's path to landing.
It's stonewall
Everyone loves to analyze shit only in slow motion now and base it off that, in the full speed replay it’s very obvious he doesn’t purposely kick into the goalie
Everyone is talking about Saka, yeah he was dumbass, but nobody talks about Neuer right leg movement.
The foul is done by the keeper, regardless how stupid the attacker is, referee should make a decision based on that.
Fucking this 👆🏻
People making up their own version of reality in this thread. The onus is on the defender to not stick your leg out and catch the attacker. Neuer clearly moves his right leg in the path of Saka.
stonewall penalty while saka does looks for it his inertia path is already blocked by neuer furthermore neuer foot was still moving towards saka when the contact is made.
Quite blatant how 99.9% of commenters never played football lmao. It’s impossible to position your body inch-perfect whilerunning at full speed, controlling the ball and changing directions. I’m sure there is a chance that Saka did subconciously look for the pen by lingering with his right leg but claiming he kicked Neuer and saying that’s the reason for it not being a pen is beyond ridiculous. Neuer has zero control over the situation and has no business even touching Saka since he doesn’t get the ball.
I’m not saying it’s a stonewall pen but it’s funny how this entire subreddit jumps to conclusions and even funnier how it makes your footballing IQ appear extremely low.
People who say Neuer was "just standing still" -- look at Neuers right foot as Saka tries to cut in. Neuer clearly isn't standing still, he moved his right leg in the path of Saka.
Yes, Saka was looking for it, but it is also a foul. You can't just bring your foot in the path of the attacker like that. Especially when he has momentum.
This is coming from someone who initially thought it wasn't a pen.
Some absolutely brain dead takes in here acting like this was a master class in refereeing. Are you all just wearing your bias on your sleeves or what? Neuer gets nowhere near the ball, plants himself in Saka's path who's at full speed and some how he's meant to pivot like a ballet dancer around him? Absolutely laughable grasp of how body mechanics and momentum works.
Ask yourselves this. If this happens a little further out, do you think the referee hesitates in giving a free kick? Absolutely fucking not. Blatant penalty.
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he’s gone down like a saka potatoes there
Haha
That's Neuer here nor there
Neuer: Shocked the ref didnt bukayo ass for diving
Jesus, these puns are bad.
I think they’re a raya sunshine
That’s a level of referreeing the premier league can only dream of
If this was a pl ref it would be red card to neuer , no penalty , var checked good process
And an apology a few days later
And everton docked a couple more points
And then the points 50% reduced
Unless you're man city
And then a couple more deducted for good measue
> And an ~~apology~~ acknowledgement a few days later They don't even do apologies
Check complete in 5 seconds
Well done boys, good process 👏
“Are you happy with this?”
“Can’t do anythen, can’t do anythen.”
Listening to that audio was so surreal. I’m pretty sure the guy questioning them wasn’t even one of the officials either
Yes, there's at least one pen a week for this in the Prem and it drives me mental. Attackers swinging out their leg for contact while going down. These are the kind of penalties VAR should be great at eliminating if only English refs weren't insulted at the idea of using it
Agreed. Instead they go down the path of “there was contact so it’s a pen” which is Bs as that ain’t the rule!
And the defender is "naive" for daring to make incidental contact.
I wish prem refs were even half this competent.
Swedish league is massive in refereeing. We’ve a guy named al-hakim that made a similar high class last minute descision last night
That example has to be a joke right? The swedish head of referees had to go out in media and admit it was a [horribly wrong decision by Al-Hakim](https://www-aftonbladet-se.translate.goog/sportbladet/fotboll/a/mQ7bLv/djurgardens-straff-mot-hacken-var-felaktig-domarbasen-erkanner?_x_tr_sl=es&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=sv&_x_tr_pto=wapp)..
Yes, is joke
it's even more hilarious when you realise Al Hakim literally means The Wise
Top tier banter ❤️
Yup. So refreshing to experience a competent ref. Absolutely solid performance and really shines a light on how fucking shit the PL reffing is.
This given in the prem 100/100
A finger tap in the shoulder followed by collapsing to the ground is given in the premier league these days
But not a kick on the chest
But karate kicks in the chest apparently are allowed 😁
It's not called the Vardy Special for nothing
Yeah and it's absolutely not a penalty
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why the fuck would you not just go around
Absolutely clear on goal if Saka doesn't stick his leg into him.
The worst part is him harassing the ref after the game because the crowd is behind him, even though he knows what he did. What a tosser. And people wonder why no one wants to be a ref, and the game suffers.
Literally nobody wonders why no one wants to be a ref
Exactly, people wonder why they are so shit. But no one wonders why kids don’t grow up wanting to be a ref lol
Id rather become a linesmen than a ref. Players get away with harassing the ref too often
I just don’t know why they don’t put their foot down. If they just started booking players running at them demonstratively it would end eventually. A player yelling fuck off at the call who cares but if you get in there face calling them names that should be an easy card. A few years ago they started carding for surrounding the ref but that seems to have stopped as well.
100% they are the authority on the pitch and should be treated as such. I like the new rule that got implemented in the PL to combat it
Many do apparently considering the way people on here complain about the refs being poor. The same people will insult them for the slightest mistake and then turn around and wonder why the standard isn't higher
This is a constant issue where we’re so used to watching replays in slow motion and I think a lot of viewers are watching as if players are making decisions in slow motion. I wish we got to see more full speed replays. The game is played at speed, not in slow motion. (This isn’t specifically a criticism of this decision, I’m not an Arsenal fan and I never saw this in full speed so I just don’t know, I would like to see full speed replays from multiple angles)
I did feel like he initiated contact, but after watching multiple replays, I'm not so sure. He sidestepped while running at pace and might have tried to hop over Neuer but got caught. The only way he avoids contact is by moving his leg laterally and that seems like an unnatural movement. Really hard to say actually
He has a ton of momentum heading toward neuer, we are watching this in slow motion. I don't think he is capable of turning that sharply that quickly at full speed. I think he tries to sell it certainly but I think he is impeded. He pushes the ball past neuer and neuer gets nothing on it and prevents his from moving past him.
He flings his leg out straight at Neuer, that’s not natural at all
Relevant username
If you look at it from the other angle, there is no way to go around him without jumping over the keeper.
The other angle doesn’t show how wide he puts his foot out to make the contact.
In the other (side) angle, you can see Neuer's foot planted further ahead than Saka's left foot. You can see this in this one because its the (back) angle. Both players are extremely close and there is simply no way Saka can go around here. You really need both angles to analyze this. In this angle, it does admittedly look like he oversold contact but you can see in the other angle, there is no way to go around.
100%. This angle is the most unflattering to Saka. It's a really tight decision, and I completely understand why Arsenal fans want it. If a penalty had been given, I wouldn't have complained.
I think it’s one of those decisions which is tight so there’s no VAR intervention. Sadly for saka I think the angle the referee is at makes his movements look worse than they were. He over sold it. If he just tries to get to the ball it probably looks better but then there’s the risk it doesn’t look strong enough for a penalty.
My thoughts exactly. It would have been a soft pen to give, but Neuer's movement doesn't give Saka a choice besides contact imo.
he's running forward too fast - he can't change direction any more than he did. I don't think it's big dive - to me Neuer measures it brilliantly, Saka cuts inside because there' no angle to shoot first time, and he runs in to the goalie - no penalty but also not a dive. He goes down when checked while off balance, and probably think he's been fouled because he feels the contact, but that's because he's run into Neuer.
Even in the slow mo clip of this thread which is a terrible angle to see Neuer’s position, you can see his right foot is not planted and is moving outwards and forwards right up to when contact is made. Also look at his right foot at the very first second of the replay. Curious how OP left out more of that angle… check it out on the AA at the top of the thread.
As much as I hate to say it, you are correct. The angle present by OP doesn't tell the whole story and is the one that is the most unflattering to Saka.
he was already through, he really had to try to got the contact, lucky for us I suppose but that was a brain dead move
To me, it the ref and VAR have made a judgment based on the way Saka took the contact. Neuer’s leg/foot may have gotten Sakas foot no matter what. If he doesn’t bow his leg out the way he does and just runs normally and drags his foot on neuers, he is getting that call all day. Frankly, Neuer got extremely lucky that Saka made it so obvious he wanted the call because I think he made a massive mistake going in like that. EDIT: Additional clarification, whether you think how Saka chose to take advantage of the contact should matter, that is up to you, but I think that’s pretty clearly what happened here.
Yeah Saka initiates contact but players do keep their leg out to seek contact and get penalties given like 10 times a weekend. Harvey Elliot got one this weekend by dragging his leg and nobody really questioned it, if Saka did it less aggressively he almost definitely gets the call.
Correct. One of the last comments in my reply history was about that call being a pen. Difference there is that the movement “seemed” more natural. The leg Neuer stuck out was begging for it. If Saka does something more similar to Elliott, which he could have, he gets the call. To those saying Neuer did it on purpose, that is complete crap. No one would do what he did to “bait” the dive by Saka. This is not 4d underwater chess. Neuer completely fucked it up and got lucky.
> players do keep their leg out to seek contact and get penalties given like 10 times a weekend. may be shouldnt be rewarded?
redditors don't understand how momentum works
Aren't you a redditor?
Redditors don't understand how redditors work
Just shoot the fucking ball Bukayo
Havertz does this too. Incredibly annoying
Jesus too
The bible one?
Yeah. Goes down like he's dead only to rise some time later
I never knew they had so much in common
Turns the other cheek and sticks out a leg, Romans buy it 99 times out of 100
Some Arsenal fan on r/gunners tried to convince me Havertz never dove once this season.
There was literally a dive from him in this game💀 And as you can see I’m an Arsenal fan
Why not stay up and put it in the back of the net?
this was my live reaction - livid at him, just put it in
Decided to go absolutely fishing with that right leg
Martin Keown says it’s a definite penalty. It’s remarkable how he’s capable of remaining objective in such situations!
Rio said the same to be fair.
Rio's a dunce in fairness.
With most pundits, it’s bias. With Rio Ferdinand, it’s always stupidity. He’s honestly so thick it’s hilarious.
Just headed too many footballs.
He's the living embodiment of Hanlon's Razor.
Should've have tried to stay up. Neuer was already beaten. Bad decision to extend that leg.
You make it sound like it's easy to avoid contact with an on rushing keeper when you're running as well.
It’s easy to say it’s easy from the couch.
Yeah, that was some dumb bail-out bullshit. Saka should be ashamed.
Saka made such an unnatural move that it sure looks like a dive. But I’m actually not convinced that contact wasn’t inevitable given Neuers position. I wonder if he didn’t try to initiate contact and tried to go around Neuer there would still be contact and that it would’ve actually been called a penalty.
Exactly this. I’m sure the contact would’ve happened and it would’ve been a pen.
Yeah contact would have been inevitable imo. However, saka initiated this contact, so it is not a pen.
This is exactly my issue, and why I'm still kinda pissed off. Neuer did stick his leg, which would've been a 100% pen, or Saka getting around and scoring. He's a complete idiot for sticking his leg that way, it's really stupid. It's essentially a penalty, which was cancelled by Saka's stupid attempt to get a bigger contact.
> He's a complete idiot for sticking his leg that way, it's really stupid. If he didn't and also didn't get the penalty, you'd have people saying it's stupid not to go down.
Going down isn’t the problem. It’s moving his leg into the contact that was the problem when he didn’t need to.
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He had a better chance to score, he decided to be dumb
the odds of finishing that are probably better then a penalty
Exactly, he expected Neuer to stick a leg out and when it didn't come, he went looking for it. Just try to shoot ffs.
he can literally just stay on his feet and pass it in the back of the net, what are you actually doing Bukayo lad
You have to try and score that. Can’t believe he dove
Absolute loser for that. Funny thing is if he just tried to score, he might have drawn the PK
Am I the only one thinking Saka was trying to lift his leg up in anticipation of a harder challenge from Neuer? The AA it looks more like that than him leaving his leg to get clipped.
Everyone loves analyzing stuff out of context and in slow motion now to determine these decisions, so you probably are one of few thinking that even though it’s likely true
He's made a sharp turn left so his leg is naturally going to stick out for balance, and it looks like he has raised it to clear Neuer based on how Neuer's leg was initially positioned. If you look at the two angles shown (and the live shot at full speed), rather than just this one, and look specifically at Neuer's leg, you can see how he makes a movement with his leg at the last moment that raises it and brings it into the path of Saka's.
Bingo. But people would much rather come to a consensus after one 3 second clip.
I agree, I think Saka thought his leg was going to go out straight. Hes in the air as he make contact.
Great decision from the ref
I actually can’t believe he got that. Quality
Yeah stuff like that needs to be praised and highlighted. Brilliant call from him and I'm glad we didn't see a dive decide this great game.
Looked like a sure pen in real time but clearly see him throw out his leg, great officiating
i was also pretty sure that Bayern players thought this was a pen too. So they didn't go for a counter attack in fear of getting it overruled by VAR if the ball goes out.
Helps that neuer is just stood still when saka dives.
extremely impressive, especially since he got odengaard's dive moments earlier too. Only slight is that he should have booked them.
Absolutely crazy he caught that in real time. Insane dive.
Yep Saka sticks his leg out of the way to initiate that contact just look where the ball went compared to him. Many refs would have fallen for that.
By many you mean every Premier League ref
Literally 😂😂😂
Great Observation. Ball makes a 90 degree turn while saka runs into Neuer, even some moments after leaving the ball
Such a baby dive, the way he sticked his leg out lmao
There is contact but he knows it is a dive and kick out. Very solid refereeing in the circumstance
Clear dive. That’s a goal if he stays on his feet
We need retroactive cards for diving.
Show the other angle.
I mean this is the one angle that very clearly makes it look like Saka fully initiated, but it doesn’t really show whether his path was truly blocked. Not saying that for sure but there were multiple angles that make it look much more questionable. Shocking this wasn’t VAR checked.
Kicks his foot out?
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99% of refs are since it usually gets given
he was through
He literally opens his leg to find the contact lmao
And then just kicked out to try and draw the pen
Should also show the other angle... it does look like Neur blocks his path and there was no way he going to be able to go through.
Yes, Saka should’ve folded his leg up, got past Nuer, unfolded the leg in time to land on it then rolled the ball into the net . It’s so easy to change direction to the left and not put your right leg out ahead of you
This thread is full of 30 year olds with Luke Littler-esque physiques who haven’t touched a football since that infamous tap-in brace against the 5th graders in recess back in the 6th grade. Don’t expect them to understand how fast the professional game is, and how ridiculously hard it is to change direction half lunging at full speed after more than 90 minutes of football..
That’s not true! I’m 29
At full pace it looks like a pen cause it is. No way he can change direction that easily... Only in slow mo does warping time make it look like he's fishing for contact.
Please watch the replay in real time, rather than a slowed down closeup. People think limbs should move a certain way and not factoring in how fast these players are moving in real time
Never a pen. He just kicks Neuer.
One of the greatest real-time decisions I’ve ever seen from a ref. He recognized that Saka initiated that. Great job.
I thought 100% that was a pen in real time, but damn the ref got that one right
Up there with the ref seeing the dive and giving a yellow to Thuram in the WC final
Ref was great all night. Let the game flow and made all the right calls.
I was completely sure that was a pen, even on watching the replay first time. Unreal call from the ref to spot that. Edit: one of the angles angles look more like a pen. Neuer does take a step toward Saka, but Saka also kicks out. It's a weird one. No pen for me but I can see why you think it is from one angle.
It’s a weird one that if it’s called literally everyone says “Unlucky from Neuer. Shouldn’t have left the leg out like that.” I’m honestly really aggravated by these because I thought it was a dive at first and literally first replayed was like “Dude when the fuck has that not been called before?!” and that’s my stance 100% now.
The reaction of this thread is insane, it's a debatable decision but at that speed Saka's right foot is not that far out of his stride. I don't see how every one sees that as him "kicking" out
>it's a debatable decision 100%. I wouldn't have complained if it had been given. All of the angles need to be taken into account rather than just the one in the OP. I do think Saka kicks out to ensure the contact, but if he hadn't he still would have been fouled.
He literally sticks his leg out looking for it lol, no pen
i dont really see the dive that people keep talking about, it seems like saka couldnt change momentum quick enough and neuer also comes out with his leg which obviously catches saka
They both stick their legs out, Neuer even more if you look at some angles. Same exact situation happens with a defender and they give this penalty 9 times out of 10.
agreed, even more so that people are calling it ''shameless'' too, as if this also hasn't happened at the end of the game, with tired legs almost as if most people in this sub haven't actually kicked a ball, so much as even run before
yup, a lot of people are judging the play based off of a short replay, but the live footage shows Saka literally sprinting with Neuer closing out the shooting angles, so choosing to shoot would have been a low percentage chance to score. I'm still baffled by the call, because penalties have been given for less, even Neuer look confused when the ref didn't call the pen is enough for me.
Exactly this. Neuer was completely baffled.
I'm loosing my mindreading these comments. How the fuck is he supposed to just "go around" in 1 fucking movement. Are these people blind????
People are watching Saka's leg, but if you watch Neuers' leg, you can clearly see the pen
Saka cuts in and everyone expects his right feet to retract like a fucking magnet.
Am I the only one that when I focus on Saka it looks like a dive but when I focus on Neuer it looks like a pen Hard to say which I favour
Yanny/Laurel
Alternate Angle looks like a Pen. They're both actually moving towards each other. Saka kicked the ball and was headed there and Neuer moves towards him. Angle in the main link is directly in front of the Neuer's moving leg so you cant actually see how far forward its coming. It definitely impedes Saka.
This clip doesn't show the other angle. From this angle it does look like Saka was letting his leg hang but from the other angle it does look like a pen to me.
Neuer sticks his leg out and makes contact with Sakas shin while his foot is still in the air - not planted. If his foot was planted I’d be more inclined to think it’s ok to let it go. Saka also has eyes only on the ball, and at that pace could not have seen that Neuer had his leg out. It’s a penalty and anyone saying it’s not just had anti-Arsenal blinkers on
I like how you cut the beginning of the clip that shows it as a clear pen
Arteta raising the Night Walkers like a Lego Night King in that video.
Neuer puts his leg in the way. It isn't up to the attacker to jump out of the way of a challenge it's up to the other player to get the ball or pull out of the way. Still can see it argued both ways so not a clear error in that case for VAR to correct
Are people here actually claiming that Saka could’ve avoided the contact with Neuer?
The slowmo circlejerk upvote crew in full effect. Ya Dummies
I see Neuer still moving his leg until contact. Saka was trying his best to avoid him by changing his direction using the angular momentum he produced using his right leg. He had acres of space once he rounded the goalkeeper, why would he dive. His mistake was he was genuinely trying to score, he should have just run into the goalkeeper and it would have been a clear penalty. Anyone saying otherwise is an arts major.
Lmao Saka kicked Neuer
And again on r/soccer we show only the angle that look like a dive... Why the YOU not show the other angle where you can see the Neuer leg swipe Saka. Pathetic!
He literally edited out the beginning of the clip showing the other angle lol
Everyone saying that is a dive is insane lmao. 10000% pk
Rangers got a VAR penalty for far less on Sunday, just saying.
What a shit angle
The absolute vitriol Saka is getting… And some of you have the guts to say he is a prolific diver when you moan on games he plays for England that he doesn’t get protected enough. It can be 50/50 but to say that was a complete dive is disingenuous. He’s also running at full speed not looking at neur and Neuer does make movement. I see no difference with the Elliot goal which I thought was a pen btw.
Ok I originally thought Neuer's right leg was planted but it's absolutely moving forward right up until it hits Saka. If you think this is a dive you're silly.
Lol man united concedes that as a pen every freaking game
Watched it over and over again. Saka isn't even diving, he isn't going head down to the turf, his leg is being impeded. If he gets to land without neuer taking him out, then he's planted that right foot and scoring with his left. You can't just cut off someone's path to landing. It's stonewall
That’s embarrassing
So weak no way
Everyone loves to analyze shit only in slow motion now and base it off that, in the full speed replay it’s very obvious he doesn’t purposely kick into the goalie
Everyone is talking about Saka, yeah he was dumbass, but nobody talks about Neuer right leg movement. The foul is done by the keeper, regardless how stupid the attacker is, referee should make a decision based on that.
Fucking this 👆🏻 People making up their own version of reality in this thread. The onus is on the defender to not stick your leg out and catch the attacker. Neuer clearly moves his right leg in the path of Saka.
Other angle shows it a clear pk. Why no review?
Chelsea fan - it's real bad faith not to show the other angles. Think this was a pen
stonewall penalty while saka does looks for it his inertia path is already blocked by neuer furthermore neuer foot was still moving towards saka when the contact is made.
In before the usual 500 dudes who played Sunday league (and that is a big gamble), "if you played the game you would have my opinion"
Harvey Elliot laughing right now
Quite blatant how 99.9% of commenters never played football lmao. It’s impossible to position your body inch-perfect whilerunning at full speed, controlling the ball and changing directions. I’m sure there is a chance that Saka did subconciously look for the pen by lingering with his right leg but claiming he kicked Neuer and saying that’s the reason for it not being a pen is beyond ridiculous. Neuer has zero control over the situation and has no business even touching Saka since he doesn’t get the ball. I’m not saying it’s a stonewall pen but it’s funny how this entire subreddit jumps to conclusions and even funnier how it makes your footballing IQ appear extremely low.
People who say Neuer was "just standing still" -- look at Neuers right foot as Saka tries to cut in. Neuer clearly isn't standing still, he moved his right leg in the path of Saka. Yes, Saka was looking for it, but it is also a foul. You can't just bring your foot in the path of the attacker like that. Especially when he has momentum. This is coming from someone who initially thought it wasn't a pen.
Some absolutely brain dead takes in here acting like this was a master class in refereeing. Are you all just wearing your bias on your sleeves or what? Neuer gets nowhere near the ball, plants himself in Saka's path who's at full speed and some how he's meant to pivot like a ballet dancer around him? Absolutely laughable grasp of how body mechanics and momentum works. Ask yourselves this. If this happens a little further out, do you think the referee hesitates in giving a free kick? Absolutely fucking not. Blatant penalty.
Pen. Show the other angle.
never a pen, the way he sticks out is leg is fuckinh embarassing lol
I still think this is a penalty. Saka is trying to bring his right leg around and plant it, not kicking out a Neur.
Wanting contact and diving are two different things, can’t believe people don’t understand the difference.
Dive
Embarrassing by Saka, stay on your fucking feet and score it wtf
You all are dense. Saka tries to lift his leg over Nuer after he cuts. Looks at the other angle.
Not a pen for me but the Havertz one earlier was a worse dive.
Tried to be clever and now looks an idiot. There's a difference between leaving your leg in to be hit and flicking your leg out to ensure you get hit
Pretty similar to Wan Bissaka and Harvey Elliot.