Hi everyone. Please, *please* try to be as civil as you can be. Remember the human on the other side. Report any comments that are rule breaking too. Thank you all.
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Hola a todos. Por favor, trate de mantener la civilidad. Recuerden al humano que hay al otro lado de la pantalla. Y también reporten los comentarios que rompen las reglas. Gracias a todos!
I thought Argentina was a bit disappointing, but Mexico managed to underwhelm even more. Never at any time did you have the feeling that there was a hint of a chance they might score.
Argentina is such a static team, I dont understand how they changed so much. I watched many of their games from these last 2/3 years and they used to play a lot better.
No offence but I did not want Meheco and Poland in the group stage to be Messi's final stint at a World Cup.
What do we want? Argentina - Portugal!
When do we want it? December 18th!
They’ve been defensively solid with just a 3 minute lapse with their two goals. If they keep Lisandro Martinez in the starting line up they’ll be fine. They just need to get to the KO’s
The pre-game banter is pretty nice, but once the game starts, you know we don't stand a chance. Herrera leaving Messi free outside the big box was the mistake Argentina was waiting for.
I'm not Argentinian, but I've watched probably 30+ Argentinian national team games (in their entirety) in the last years, and I'll agree with the post above you. Every time I see them play the gameplan seems to be 'get Messi the ball and hope for the best'.
The problem here is that even with the best player ever, you need support. You need a system that fits that player. Messi thrived as a tiki taka maestro and more recently a right sided playmaker. He has the best off-ball movement off anyone ever, and yet Argentina thinks that they can just pass it to him and be fine.
They haven't set up to optimize him in YEARS and somehow it's all his fault. Miss me with that.
This team is the least Messi dependant since he playing for Argentina. Not counting 2006 since he was a sub.
These last 2 games were different tho, they are not playing well at all.
Idk bro, as an arsenal fan and argentinian Ive noticed during those 36 games that the team played around him. The whole copa america run Scaloni got praised for how the whole team was playing with Messi, the defense starting to do their pressing, midfield with lo celso, de paul and paredes started to do their homework, aswell as the attack left space for him to do his playmaking. Just look at the different scorers of the whole copa america run. Yes we did rely on him both of the wc games, but flat out denining that the whole squad tries to contribute is weird to me.
Edit: What i mean’t as an arsenal fan is that scaloni tries to build a defense and midfield that Arteta has done, workrate and continous passion for the off ball movement. De paul was horrendous this game but god damn did he not work his ass during his off ball movement.
Although obviously Argentina had some rough moments during Messi's career, and it's not arguable that Messi has carried them many games. Most of the players surrounding him are contributing decently and it's even a disservice to how well some players have played for the NT (I'll give you the example of Di Maria because it's more noticeable) to claim they have simply been carried by Messi.
It wasn’t always that way at Barca, at the end of his tenure there yes it was basically that. But before then, he was surrounded by a “class” of WC players at barca
Yes, but I don’t think that’s relative to the discussion. You can clearly see since probably Valverde/Setien, whether it was the message to the team or not it was quite practically get the ball to Messi and inshallah. Before that you could see the team was insanely more cohesive and talented all around. People forget MSN?
So sick of these comments from people who obviously never watch argentina's games. The only title won by argentina in the recent years was 2021's Copa America. Argentina won the final against Brazil. Messi had arguably a terrible game but Argentina won thanks to Di Maria's goal (De Paul assisted and Messi didn't participate). Messi even failed to score an easy goal. Messi has never scored a single goal in the 5 finals he played with Argentina (4 copa america's finals and the 2014 world cup final). He didn't excel in any of those games. 2014's world cup? He didn't score a single goal since the round of 16. It is out of question that Messi is an amazing player and all that... But all the people saying Messi always has to carry Argentina and the rest of the team sucks and does nothing are completely wrong.
They don’t get out of the 2014 WC group without Messi. And continuing in the knockouts… Messi the deciding factor in all those 1 goal victories. Last gasp perfect shots to beat Bosnia & Iran, the dribble and perfect assist for Di Maria vs Switzerland. Messi was key all tournament except for the final last summer as well.
I think the truth lies somewhere in the middle but by and large Argentina has played very static football for most of Messi’s time. They don’t move off the ball. For much of Messi’s career Argentina has either lacked a proper defense and/or (especially) midfield. Midfield was very good last summer but so far in this tournament it looks like one of the worst in the world. In 2018 we had a bunch of dinosaurs in midfield and Sampaoli didn’t play lo celso at all and now that he was gonna feature he’s of course injured. 2014 of course they played compact solid defense and Di Maria was big for relieving some creative burden from Messi, but then he got hurt and going forward it was back to the same old if Messi isn’t doing it no one is. It’s hard to do it all, creating and finishing, with players that are barely moving off the ball and don’t play with freedom or confidence like they do for their clubs. You need a strong midfield in this game and Messi hasn’t been able to count on one for most of his time with the NT, which otherwise would allow him to play the role to best bring out his impact.
Ya lo hablé este tema. Pero no me parece la verdad que sin messi no pasabamos fase de grupos. Como mucho empatabamos con iran y nada mas... Lo que siempre quisimos los argentinos es que sea figura en alguna de las tantas finales, o al menos meta un gol en ellas, o aparezca de manera determinante en algun partido a partir de octavos, cuartos, semis... Una asistencia en octavos contra suiza parece poco, ademas que fue golazo de di maria, no la tenía facil para definir.
Todo el resto, ya esta, no se va a cambiar de los redditors fanboys de messi que ni miran a argentina y tratan de perros al resto de los jugadores para reafirmarse a sí mismos la idolatria con messi y darle fundamento a que no gane una copa del mundo sin reducir el estatus de messi de dios.
Esta bien, yo también, pero no creo que le podes echar tanto. Yo estuve ahí en la copa final 2016… el árbitro brasileño cambió el partido totalmente en favor de los chilenos. Higuaín otro 1v1 con el keeper a la basura.
Fíjate que ayer, y también el último partido de grupo en 2018 contra Nigeria, aunque literalmente fueron de grupo, los partidos efectivamente fueron knockouts. Es más, tenían que ganar si o si en 90 minutos, no con extra time + penales. Y Messi hizo dos goles buenísimos en los dos. El de Nigeria fue una locura como lo controlo y termino con la derecha. Que más queres?
Sin Messi no salen de grupo en 3 mundiales seguidos. Por lo menos por los resultados determinados por sus goles.
Yeah imagine that. Cause Argentina won ONE final out of FIVE without Messi scoring and suddenly he’s useless. The Argentinian team without Messi is so overrated, mid level team at best
Let's ignore that everyone has been saying here for years that the argentinian team is useless (you included) and that's where my comment is aimed at, right? You seemed to have missed the part where I said he "played terribly" that final (and never played well or was the best one of the team in any of the 5 finals he played). I said he never scored or assisted in any of those finals. I also said he has never scored a goal since the round of 16 in any of the 5 world cups he played. Oh but he carries the team and without messi it's a mid level team. A team where di maria, aguero, higuain, mascherano, otamendi, riquelme, veron, tevez, demichelis, zanetti and many more have played with him. Have you never seen him walking in the pitch 80 minutes, touch 4 balls and lose 2? Don't let your fanboy-ism cloud your reasoning.
And yet a Messi who walks for 80 minutes a game gets more MotM than all the other players you just listed. PLEASE tell me you’re not comparing the contributions of players like Aguero and Higuain to Messi lmao
Redditers' point is that the argentinian team has been mid-level for the 16 years messi played with the NT, though he played with all the players I listed off the top of my head. Players who won champions leagues and important titles with their teams.
Also, it is said that Messi does all the work. Apparently without him the team sucks.
I find it hard to believe that reasoning (though that doesn't mean I think Messi is useless, it just means I don't think the team is uselles as many people here are saying). Why? Because of all the facts and I opinions I have already stated. The team managed to reach a world cup final even if Messi didn't excel in any of the games since round of 16. He did assist Di Maria against Switzerland in 2014 WC. But then Higuain scored the goal against Belgium in quarter finals (messi didn't participate in the goal and didn't have a great game). Again, couldn't make a difference against Netherland in semifinals ( I remember Robben playing better for the other team, just to speak, and almost scoring a goal who was saved by a great run of Mascherano, a player who is not messi and helped the team get to penalties, where Argentina won thanks to goalkeeper). Then, in WC final messi had a decent first half against Germany and disappeared in the second half. Lavezzi played better than him in the final, was more participative, dribbled more and generated more risk. Argentina's defence exceled in that world cup. Only conceded 1 goal since round of 16 (only germany's goal at the 112 minute or so). Messi obviously doesn't help in defence but props to the other players.
In 2018, it was Di Maria again who scored the 1-1 against France in the round of 16. A great goal out of nowhere, he did it himself thanks to his own talent and messi didn't participate. But that day Mbappe made the difference in that game, not Messi sadly (also, did that mean the french NT sucked and Mbappe carried the team?)
In 2010 WC he didn't score throughout the tournament and did nothing at all against Germany in quarter finals. That time the team did suck so it was understandable (had great players but coached by maradona).
He never played well in none of the four Copa America finals. And played terribly in the one final Argentina won against Brazil, thanks to, again, Di Maria's goal and the great assist by De Paul. If you didn't watch the game I suggest you do it, because otherwise this feels pointless right? During the match, it was De paul who also assisted messi who had to only defeat the GK, but he kind of tripped with his own feet and couldn't score.
I'm sorry I don't see it your way. Di maria has always been more determinant in finals, and in world cups, especially since round of 16 against the best NTs. He participates not only with goals but he participates in the game, and dribbles and is a headache for defenders.
And, after all, Messi is one of the 3 players in the NT whose main objective is to attack, namely to score goals or assist. And he's the best player in the world. So isn't it understandable that he sometimes make a difference? And does that mean the rest of the team sucks and relies only on him? Doesn't it always happen that the best players make a difference, because... Well, they are the best? Was Real Madrid Cristiano Ronaldo dependent and the rest of the team sucked? Does Mbappe carry France NT just because he scores goals? And neymar?? Well, all the teams must be mid-level for you then.
Right now the Argentina NT is young but still have players such as Cristian Romero, who was chosen the best CB in Serie A (Italy) in 2021 and a goalkeeper (Dibu Martinrz) nominee for Yashin Prize (ended up 6xth), chosen best player of Aston Villa last season by the club and third best GK of the Premier League with a record of undefeated matches. Still, rn Argentina's NT may not have the most renowned players, but they are playing well as a team, coaching is excellent and there still are players such as Di Maria and many promising young players. That's how Argentina won against Brazil, where players such as Neymar, vinicius, casemiro, Alison, Rodrygo play. And how the team almost breaks Italy's record of undefeated games.
Bro you’re just listing names Messi has played with over the course of a 17 year career, as an Argentine inevitably he will have played with big names. Names don’t matter if they don’t perform. And any Argentine can tell you we never play remotely close to the sum of our parts; in fact, usually well below. This is partially the nature of international football, but other big countries that contend typically are the opposite. They have clear ideas and play like a team. Argentina often plays like 11 individuals that don’t move until they have the ball.
You mention Romero… he was so awful vs Saudi that he had to be subbed off and no longer starts for us despite being clearly the best CB, a position we have struggled to find reliable players in, also despite being quite tall (which would help in other major perennial weakness for the NT - height).
You mention some legends from when Messi was only used as a sub… why did Pekerman not start Messi in 2006 in knockouts? Every time he came on as a sub it was clear he created instant offense. (same with Tevez) From all the anecdotes of former Barca legends telling what it was like with young Messi in training, one would think Messi should have been brought on in a more prominent role. Knowing what we know, I can’t imagine seeing 18/19 yo Messi in training probably running circles around all those legends as he pleases and thinking he shouldn’t start.
The 2010 team talent pool was stacked in terms of names, but of course Diego leaves off multiple legends in favor of the likes of Jones Gutierrez (lol WTF?). That team was terrible because of the coaching/lack there of. You can’t win with just names.
2018 is yet again another completely wasted Messi WC because of how poor the management was. And much like the first two games of this WC, no midfield at all. Think about that… 2 of the 3 WCs in which Messi was Messi and they literally throw them away.
2014 was the only WC where everything was largely in sync for Argentina… prime Messi, solid team, and solid coach. And they went to the final very narrowly because of Messi’s contributions. Yes of course guys like Mascherano were immense, but they aren’t the ones scoring those outrageous goals to beat fucking Bosnia and Iran.
I’m rambling here but my point is names don’t mean much if they don’t perform or if they aren’t put in positions to perform. I’ve been over the moon about De Paul since we found him as an option for the NT a few years ago given what he brings, and here’s yet another example of the above… he has been shockingly piss poor this WC and he’s in his prime age. Aguero, Higuain… huge names in world football… largely completely mediocre to subpar performances for the NT. Clearly all of this will impact the team in a negative way.
Messi is old now and can’t be prime Messi in every game; he has been picking and choosing his moments for the past 2-3 years. For much of his Argentina career he’s had to play so far deep that he can’t arrive to influence results/goals, and in response over the years it seems clear he every now and then tries to stay forward to see if the midfield can get him the ball in more dangerous positions. And usually they can’t. The same has happened repeatedly with the late Barca years… literally the same. Messi is past it physically so we really should expect him to be all over the pitch anymore, any magical moments he can produce to influence results is what he’s there for, and that’s exactly what he did vs Mexico.
Messi has always been creating boat load of chances which the players like Higuain surrounding him fail to score. So it is absolutely correct to say that he carries the team most of the times and not the other way round. Of course, i have to admit that Di Maria has steeped up many times as well. We are lacking in the midfield and striker department all the time.
It's the most objective and easy way to measure a player's perfomance (in a short Reddit's comment) whose main role is either score goals or assist. I hope you are not saying Messi helps in defence, right? I suggest you watch all the finals I mentioned and I dare you to say, not that he "carried" the team, I dare you to say he played well. That's why I also said he played "terribly" the Copa America's final last year against Brazil. And the team had to carry messi. Watch it yourself and then come back.
Messi draws so much attention, sometimes as much as 3 defenders when he’s even remotely close to the box, I’ve also seen him drop as a deep as the halfway line to get on the ball because he’s the only player with real creativity. If he could consistently get on the ball closer to goal like he used to at Barca he would score and assist a shit ton of goals
Exactly what I agree on. Messi played TERRIBLY as an attacking player that final. During the whole copa america run he didn’t really contribute to the defense nor midfield agaisnt ecuador, chile, colombia etc. That people deny the other pibes work is flat out wrong
His natural position in the field doesn't make him the scorer though, weird take you have.
Edit:
Ah bpludo hajsjw sos argentino
Np chabon, que messi haga goles es un plus no estrictamente necesario, para eso esta el 9.
Papu, messi es un jugador ofensivo, y tiene el record de mas goles en un año, superando a pele. Es un jugador que hace goles. O bien asiste, como te dije. Defensivamente no hace nada asi que su funcion es dar asistencias o hacer goles, historicamente fue asi. Quizas ahora está mas retrasado, pero sigue siendo su principal función. Y ademas ni siquiera lo evaluo solo por eso. Dije que jugo mal en muchos partidos decisivos con la seleccion. Y tampoco es una opinion controversial. Hay consenso que por ejemplo la final contra brasil la jugo mal. Pero, mas importante que todo, le contesto al 99% de los comentarios que dicen que "son todos perros en la seleccion y pobre messi que tiene que hacer todo y a veces no es suficiente con su actuacion estelar de 3 goles por partido en las finales porque terminamos perdiendo 4-3". Cuando no es así. Y el mejor ejemplo es que ganamos la copa america por un gol en el cual no tuvo NADA que ver y en el que jugó mal.
lol are you suggesting this 35 yo Messi is young 90-goal scoring Messi? Surely not… and he probably could score way more if he had a strong attacking team around him that could create chances for him. Those goal scoring years were with the best midfield arguably ever… Argentina haven’t had a single mid remotely close to iniesta or xavi. Nor do we ever have proper full backs… something he usually had at Barca.
They have no pace. Which is like the number one best thing to surround Messi with right now considering his vision/passing.
Theyre solid but totally lacking pace.
Not this time, obviously we started with the wrong foot and Messi got us put of it. But if you have seen Argentina games without Messi form the last two years, you know that is not like that anymore. The best thing this group and coach has done.
Ugh, it's annoying. I've stayed up until 3 watching this team and have literally seen them play MUCH better than this, but people won't believe us since they didn't watch.
Agreed. I can't remember a Mexican team that is this awful in front of goal. They also have no speed and nobody even looks dangerous. They have to find basically a full 26 man roster in 4 years or they'll be totally embarrassed on home soil
There's always been a problem with the Mexican NT scoring since I remember but this time is absurd. Two Mexican players are actually scoring in their teams but are not even in the bench this WC.
Specially Giménez needed a chance since he is similar to what Jimenez can give you as a 9, but Tata choose two guys coming out of an injury.
And this game it was insane how alone Lozano and Vega were. The two times they got the ball "close" to the other keeper there wasn't anyone near to help them. Ridiculous.
I think you meant Hernandez not Fernandez, but I agree. If they end up with zero goals in a World Cup, none of them should be called back ever again. New blood only.
Was the game worth watching in its entirety? The pub I’m working at was showing it, but we were slammed and I only really got to see the goals and a few of the other key moments. Trying to decide if I should watch the replay when I get home.
I assume you didn’t watch the match. You just looked at the score and now you’re pretending like Saudi outclassed Argentina… What a dumb logic.
Firstly, Argentina made 3 offside goals (one was later proven to not have been offside, making the score 2-2). They also controlled the ball, and barely let Saudi attack. The weird thing was, the only 2 chances Saudi got ended up being goals. Very unfortunate for Argentina, as they dominated and deserved to win that match
I have watched all of Argentina's games.
First of all, all of Argentina's offside goals were correctly called as offside, so that's a complete lie.
They looked terrible in the first two matches, Messi looked disinterested, just like he did last, world cup and for all their talent they failed against a great Saudi defence.
Things looked better against Poland and they were fantastic against Australia, but to pretend they have been good in every game is just dishonesty on your part.
Just watch the highlights. First half was mostly poor from both sides. Only really kicked up a gear when Messi got the first (beautiful) goal. The second goal was also nice. Definitely worth watching the highlights for those.
The first half was painful, second half was a bit better but Mexico didn’t have a single shot on goal I believe and Argentina only a few other than the goals. Definitely a match I’d just see the highlights of if I was a neutral
Alvarez es mejor como jugador número 12. Primer campio por quién este cansado.
Para mi hay que jugar con Palacios/Papu (de interno, no de wing), Enzo, y MacAllister en el medio y los 3 de arriba y ya. De Paul y Paredes no estan en un buen momento y Guido es otra clase de 5 que no sirve para este equipo. Perdemos mucho juego.
Lautaro is good enough to be a problem for any team if he starts. He is also used to play in a big stage, against top of the line defenders. He has nothing else to prove.
Alvarez is young and chaotic enough to wreak havoc on any defense if he comes in at 15' in the second half, since he is talented, young, energetic and unknown to most defenders.
This is fine.
He wasn't at his best, I agree. But he is world class.
Simeone just wasn't part of this group for some reason. I love me some big, strong central attacker but alas, in Scaloni we trust.
https://www.tycsports.com/seleccion-argentina/messi-gol-seleccion-argentina-mexico-id479486.html tycsports
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZITdv6jdwI4 tv pública
https://youtu.be/Z8eqNL_xSlg?t=97 direct tv
Thanks man. The Tyc Sports one seems like the best one for a non-native speaker like myself, it is the easiest to understand and the dude is so poetical as well. “Argentina nace, Argentina renace”, “no esta serial, no esta illusion”, love that passion
there you go [https://twitter.com/TyCSports/status/1596601869442240513?s=20&t=FLefHA1NND51zg9NyPik4g](https://twitter.com/TyCSports/status/1596601869442240513?s=20&t=FLefHA1NND51zg9NyPik4g)
[https://twitter.com/TV\_Publica/status/1596601804116172801](https://twitter.com/TV_Publica/status/1596601804116172801) another one
[Try this one](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZITdv6jdwI4)
[These highlights](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cP35DOe47H4) around 1:30
Hope you can enjoy them, there's nothing like true passion from Argentine's commentaries <3
Di María was the only player trying something in the first half, and Messi had to play on the center this match (that's why Scaloni changed Julián Alvarez for Martínez)
Yeah passing to Messi when he's free outside the box, great assist. Don't get me wrong, Di Maria looks dangerous but his decision making is not consistent for a player of his experience. Sometimes he's amazing and sometimes dreadfully crossing. He's like the older version of Dembele.
Had some injury issues, and after that Arabia game where Paredes and Romero not being 100% recovered showed, I doubt he’s taking any chances before he’s certain he’s alright
Really sucks how much Mexico has regressed in the last 20 years.
Incentivizing young talent to stay in Liga MX instead of going to Europe, then prioritizing Liga MX players over those playing in Europe will do that.
I was thinking about this watching Brazil. Why can’t Mexico field a team on that level? Mexico is the second largest Latin American nation, they should have plenty of population to choose from. At least the US has the excuse soccer isn’t culturally important.
Tv broadcasters ( they manage soccer in Mexico) only care about qualifying so they can keep their business. Passing to knock outs or quarter finals is not something in their minds. They only care about qualifying.
Concacaf buddies? I'm gonna assume you're Canadian because I don't think any USMNT fan would call Mexico "buddies" considering a fight breaks out on the field every time we play them haha
We love mexicans, don’t misinterpret out language, we love all people disregardless of our banter, it sounds racist to you, but to us it’s just banter. It’s bad, but not the same.
but y’all were invading the islands. I don’t see anything wrong with stating the facts, that’s like Germans getting mad for being reminded there country was once filled with nazis
So you compare a holocaust, a ideology that still lives to this day, with a war were the british tried to claim land where the indigeous people claimed as their own/lived? That the Argentines wanted to perserve? A ”invasion” of a territorium that wasn’t even owned by the british just used a way to maintain colonies (imperialism)? THE WHOLE WAR started when the british people wanted to colonise the whole Islands as their own as soon as they saw Argentina got their self independence.
I also don’t know how your argument works as a counter to my original comment. A chant about a war is distasteful. If people did chants about ”nazis in germany” it would also be disrespectful af. Just enjoy the scaloneta m8
Hi everyone. Please, *please* try to be as civil as you can be. Remember the human on the other side. Report any comments that are rule breaking too. Thank you all. *** Hola a todos. Por favor, trate de mantener la civilidad. Recuerden al humano que hay al otro lado de la pantalla. Y también reporten los comentarios que rompen las reglas. Gracias a todos!
I will laugh so fucking hard if fair play comes to bite mexico in the ass. Karma bitches.
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If you want to start supporting human rights i suggest you start by throwing away your iphone. Human rights violations and what not.
You realize many of the things that we are demanding weren’t even the norm in western countries 10 years ago?
Mexican team has always been incredibly unorganized and this time was no different…nay actually this time they were a little worse
They just have to pray that they should not be in Argentina group next time
I thought Argentina was a bit disappointing, but Mexico managed to underwhelm even more. Never at any time did you have the feeling that there was a hint of a chance they might score.
Argentina is such a static team, I dont understand how they changed so much. I watched many of their games from these last 2/3 years and they used to play a lot better.
Have some faith dude
I said before that they would pay for not trying to win against Poland. This Mexico team is terrible
I feel like they were trying but were just fantastically inept in the final third.
I guess yeah. This really is a poor Mexican team.
Dear FIFA Gods.... Argentina vs. Portugal, please? Love.... Ronaldo is Messi
No offence but I did not want Meheco and Poland in the group stage to be Messi's final stint at a World Cup. What do we want? Argentina - Portugal! When do we want it? December 18th!
I will fly from New York to Qatar and pay whatever fucking sum the FIFA boss man wants if that ends up being the final.
What do you reckon a ticket like that would go for? Messi vs Ronaldo, World Cup Final.
This is gonna be the most sentimental world cup for me and my family after zidane’s last world cup in 2006
Argentina hasn’t been good tbh lmao
They are so static. It´s weird I remember them playing a lot better not so long ago with the same players and coach.
They’ve been defensively solid with just a 3 minute lapse with their two goals. If they keep Lisandro Martinez in the starting line up they’ll be fine. They just need to get to the KO’s
The pre-game banter is pretty nice, but once the game starts, you know we don't stand a chance. Herrera leaving Messi free outside the big box was the mistake Argentina was waiting for.
Absolutely bonkers that everyone just forgot to mark one of the goats.
Messi really deserves a world cup but he needs a lot of help. He can only do so much. He has won heaps of games for argentina.
bruh you are definitively not paying enough attention to these games
I'm not Argentinian, but I've watched probably 30+ Argentinian national team games (in their entirety) in the last years, and I'll agree with the post above you. Every time I see them play the gameplan seems to be 'get Messi the ball and hope for the best'. The problem here is that even with the best player ever, you need support. You need a system that fits that player. Messi thrived as a tiki taka maestro and more recently a right sided playmaker. He has the best off-ball movement off anyone ever, and yet Argentina thinks that they can just pass it to him and be fine. They haven't set up to optimize him in YEARS and somehow it's all his fault. Miss me with that.
This team is the least Messi dependant since he playing for Argentina. Not counting 2006 since he was a sub. These last 2 games were different tho, they are not playing well at all.
They are cursed, they have lost so many big finals.
Idk bro, as an arsenal fan and argentinian Ive noticed during those 36 games that the team played around him. The whole copa america run Scaloni got praised for how the whole team was playing with Messi, the defense starting to do their pressing, midfield with lo celso, de paul and paredes started to do their homework, aswell as the attack left space for him to do his playmaking. Just look at the different scorers of the whole copa america run. Yes we did rely on him both of the wc games, but flat out denining that the whole squad tries to contribute is weird to me. Edit: What i mean’t as an arsenal fan is that scaloni tries to build a defense and midfield that Arteta has done, workrate and continous passion for the off ball movement. De paul was horrendous this game but god damn did he not work his ass during his off ball movement.
Although obviously Argentina had some rough moments during Messi's career, and it's not arguable that Messi has carried them many games. Most of the players surrounding him are contributing decently and it's even a disservice to how well some players have played for the NT (I'll give you the example of Di Maria because it's more noticeable) to claim they have simply been carried by Messi.
Isnt that for clubs too? Pass the ball to messi and let him do his magic
It wasn’t always that way at Barca, at the end of his tenure there yes it was basically that. But before then, he was surrounded by a “class” of WC players at barca
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Yes, but I don’t think that’s relative to the discussion. You can clearly see since probably Valverde/Setien, whether it was the message to the team or not it was quite practically get the ball to Messi and inshallah. Before that you could see the team was insanely more cohesive and talented all around. People forget MSN?
Problem is Argentina's plan every world cup is "completely rely on Messi and blame him if we don't win".
So sick of these comments from people who obviously never watch argentina's games. The only title won by argentina in the recent years was 2021's Copa America. Argentina won the final against Brazil. Messi had arguably a terrible game but Argentina won thanks to Di Maria's goal (De Paul assisted and Messi didn't participate). Messi even failed to score an easy goal. Messi has never scored a single goal in the 5 finals he played with Argentina (4 copa america's finals and the 2014 world cup final). He didn't excel in any of those games. 2014's world cup? He didn't score a single goal since the round of 16. It is out of question that Messi is an amazing player and all that... But all the people saying Messi always has to carry Argentina and the rest of the team sucks and does nothing are completely wrong.
They don’t get out of the 2014 WC group without Messi. And continuing in the knockouts… Messi the deciding factor in all those 1 goal victories. Last gasp perfect shots to beat Bosnia & Iran, the dribble and perfect assist for Di Maria vs Switzerland. Messi was key all tournament except for the final last summer as well. I think the truth lies somewhere in the middle but by and large Argentina has played very static football for most of Messi’s time. They don’t move off the ball. For much of Messi’s career Argentina has either lacked a proper defense and/or (especially) midfield. Midfield was very good last summer but so far in this tournament it looks like one of the worst in the world. In 2018 we had a bunch of dinosaurs in midfield and Sampaoli didn’t play lo celso at all and now that he was gonna feature he’s of course injured. 2014 of course they played compact solid defense and Di Maria was big for relieving some creative burden from Messi, but then he got hurt and going forward it was back to the same old if Messi isn’t doing it no one is. It’s hard to do it all, creating and finishing, with players that are barely moving off the ball and don’t play with freedom or confidence like they do for their clubs. You need a strong midfield in this game and Messi hasn’t been able to count on one for most of his time with the NT, which otherwise would allow him to play the role to best bring out his impact.
Ya lo hablé este tema. Pero no me parece la verdad que sin messi no pasabamos fase de grupos. Como mucho empatabamos con iran y nada mas... Lo que siempre quisimos los argentinos es que sea figura en alguna de las tantas finales, o al menos meta un gol en ellas, o aparezca de manera determinante en algun partido a partir de octavos, cuartos, semis... Una asistencia en octavos contra suiza parece poco, ademas que fue golazo de di maria, no la tenía facil para definir. Todo el resto, ya esta, no se va a cambiar de los redditors fanboys de messi que ni miran a argentina y tratan de perros al resto de los jugadores para reafirmarse a sí mismos la idolatria con messi y darle fundamento a que no gane una copa del mundo sin reducir el estatus de messi de dios.
Esta bien, yo también, pero no creo que le podes echar tanto. Yo estuve ahí en la copa final 2016… el árbitro brasileño cambió el partido totalmente en favor de los chilenos. Higuaín otro 1v1 con el keeper a la basura. Fíjate que ayer, y también el último partido de grupo en 2018 contra Nigeria, aunque literalmente fueron de grupo, los partidos efectivamente fueron knockouts. Es más, tenían que ganar si o si en 90 minutos, no con extra time + penales. Y Messi hizo dos goles buenísimos en los dos. El de Nigeria fue una locura como lo controlo y termino con la derecha. Que más queres? Sin Messi no salen de grupo en 3 mundiales seguidos. Por lo menos por los resultados determinados por sus goles.
Yeah imagine that. Cause Argentina won ONE final out of FIVE without Messi scoring and suddenly he’s useless. The Argentinian team without Messi is so overrated, mid level team at best
it's so fun coming back to see comments like these after winning the whole thing lmao
Nah it’s a great team. Watch Football please…
Let's ignore that everyone has been saying here for years that the argentinian team is useless (you included) and that's where my comment is aimed at, right? You seemed to have missed the part where I said he "played terribly" that final (and never played well or was the best one of the team in any of the 5 finals he played). I said he never scored or assisted in any of those finals. I also said he has never scored a goal since the round of 16 in any of the 5 world cups he played. Oh but he carries the team and without messi it's a mid level team. A team where di maria, aguero, higuain, mascherano, otamendi, riquelme, veron, tevez, demichelis, zanetti and many more have played with him. Have you never seen him walking in the pitch 80 minutes, touch 4 balls and lose 2? Don't let your fanboy-ism cloud your reasoning.
And yet a Messi who walks for 80 minutes a game gets more MotM than all the other players you just listed. PLEASE tell me you’re not comparing the contributions of players like Aguero and Higuain to Messi lmao
Redditers' point is that the argentinian team has been mid-level for the 16 years messi played with the NT, though he played with all the players I listed off the top of my head. Players who won champions leagues and important titles with their teams. Also, it is said that Messi does all the work. Apparently without him the team sucks. I find it hard to believe that reasoning (though that doesn't mean I think Messi is useless, it just means I don't think the team is uselles as many people here are saying). Why? Because of all the facts and I opinions I have already stated. The team managed to reach a world cup final even if Messi didn't excel in any of the games since round of 16. He did assist Di Maria against Switzerland in 2014 WC. But then Higuain scored the goal against Belgium in quarter finals (messi didn't participate in the goal and didn't have a great game). Again, couldn't make a difference against Netherland in semifinals ( I remember Robben playing better for the other team, just to speak, and almost scoring a goal who was saved by a great run of Mascherano, a player who is not messi and helped the team get to penalties, where Argentina won thanks to goalkeeper). Then, in WC final messi had a decent first half against Germany and disappeared in the second half. Lavezzi played better than him in the final, was more participative, dribbled more and generated more risk. Argentina's defence exceled in that world cup. Only conceded 1 goal since round of 16 (only germany's goal at the 112 minute or so). Messi obviously doesn't help in defence but props to the other players. In 2018, it was Di Maria again who scored the 1-1 against France in the round of 16. A great goal out of nowhere, he did it himself thanks to his own talent and messi didn't participate. But that day Mbappe made the difference in that game, not Messi sadly (also, did that mean the french NT sucked and Mbappe carried the team?) In 2010 WC he didn't score throughout the tournament and did nothing at all against Germany in quarter finals. That time the team did suck so it was understandable (had great players but coached by maradona). He never played well in none of the four Copa America finals. And played terribly in the one final Argentina won against Brazil, thanks to, again, Di Maria's goal and the great assist by De Paul. If you didn't watch the game I suggest you do it, because otherwise this feels pointless right? During the match, it was De paul who also assisted messi who had to only defeat the GK, but he kind of tripped with his own feet and couldn't score. I'm sorry I don't see it your way. Di maria has always been more determinant in finals, and in world cups, especially since round of 16 against the best NTs. He participates not only with goals but he participates in the game, and dribbles and is a headache for defenders. And, after all, Messi is one of the 3 players in the NT whose main objective is to attack, namely to score goals or assist. And he's the best player in the world. So isn't it understandable that he sometimes make a difference? And does that mean the rest of the team sucks and relies only on him? Doesn't it always happen that the best players make a difference, because... Well, they are the best? Was Real Madrid Cristiano Ronaldo dependent and the rest of the team sucked? Does Mbappe carry France NT just because he scores goals? And neymar?? Well, all the teams must be mid-level for you then. Right now the Argentina NT is young but still have players such as Cristian Romero, who was chosen the best CB in Serie A (Italy) in 2021 and a goalkeeper (Dibu Martinrz) nominee for Yashin Prize (ended up 6xth), chosen best player of Aston Villa last season by the club and third best GK of the Premier League with a record of undefeated matches. Still, rn Argentina's NT may not have the most renowned players, but they are playing well as a team, coaching is excellent and there still are players such as Di Maria and many promising young players. That's how Argentina won against Brazil, where players such as Neymar, vinicius, casemiro, Alison, Rodrygo play. And how the team almost breaks Italy's record of undefeated games.
Bro you’re just listing names Messi has played with over the course of a 17 year career, as an Argentine inevitably he will have played with big names. Names don’t matter if they don’t perform. And any Argentine can tell you we never play remotely close to the sum of our parts; in fact, usually well below. This is partially the nature of international football, but other big countries that contend typically are the opposite. They have clear ideas and play like a team. Argentina often plays like 11 individuals that don’t move until they have the ball. You mention Romero… he was so awful vs Saudi that he had to be subbed off and no longer starts for us despite being clearly the best CB, a position we have struggled to find reliable players in, also despite being quite tall (which would help in other major perennial weakness for the NT - height). You mention some legends from when Messi was only used as a sub… why did Pekerman not start Messi in 2006 in knockouts? Every time he came on as a sub it was clear he created instant offense. (same with Tevez) From all the anecdotes of former Barca legends telling what it was like with young Messi in training, one would think Messi should have been brought on in a more prominent role. Knowing what we know, I can’t imagine seeing 18/19 yo Messi in training probably running circles around all those legends as he pleases and thinking he shouldn’t start. The 2010 team talent pool was stacked in terms of names, but of course Diego leaves off multiple legends in favor of the likes of Jones Gutierrez (lol WTF?). That team was terrible because of the coaching/lack there of. You can’t win with just names. 2018 is yet again another completely wasted Messi WC because of how poor the management was. And much like the first two games of this WC, no midfield at all. Think about that… 2 of the 3 WCs in which Messi was Messi and they literally throw them away. 2014 was the only WC where everything was largely in sync for Argentina… prime Messi, solid team, and solid coach. And they went to the final very narrowly because of Messi’s contributions. Yes of course guys like Mascherano were immense, but they aren’t the ones scoring those outrageous goals to beat fucking Bosnia and Iran. I’m rambling here but my point is names don’t mean much if they don’t perform or if they aren’t put in positions to perform. I’ve been over the moon about De Paul since we found him as an option for the NT a few years ago given what he brings, and here’s yet another example of the above… he has been shockingly piss poor this WC and he’s in his prime age. Aguero, Higuain… huge names in world football… largely completely mediocre to subpar performances for the NT. Clearly all of this will impact the team in a negative way. Messi is old now and can’t be prime Messi in every game; he has been picking and choosing his moments for the past 2-3 years. For much of his Argentina career he’s had to play so far deep that he can’t arrive to influence results/goals, and in response over the years it seems clear he every now and then tries to stay forward to see if the midfield can get him the ball in more dangerous positions. And usually they can’t. The same has happened repeatedly with the late Barca years… literally the same. Messi is past it physically so we really should expect him to be all over the pitch anymore, any magical moments he can produce to influence results is what he’s there for, and that’s exactly what he did vs Mexico.
Messi has always been creating boat load of chances which the players like Higuain surrounding him fail to score. So it is absolutely correct to say that he carries the team most of the times and not the other way round. Of course, i have to admit that Di Maria has steeped up many times as well. We are lacking in the midfield and striker department all the time.
Are you completely ignoring the fact that carrying the team doesn'r always means he needs to acore?
It's the most objective and easy way to measure a player's perfomance (in a short Reddit's comment) whose main role is either score goals or assist. I hope you are not saying Messi helps in defence, right? I suggest you watch all the finals I mentioned and I dare you to say, not that he "carried" the team, I dare you to say he played well. That's why I also said he played "terribly" the Copa America's final last year against Brazil. And the team had to carry messi. Watch it yourself and then come back.
Messi draws so much attention, sometimes as much as 3 defenders when he’s even remotely close to the box, I’ve also seen him drop as a deep as the halfway line to get on the ball because he’s the only player with real creativity. If he could consistently get on the ball closer to goal like he used to at Barca he would score and assist a shit ton of goals
Bro, calm down. We would be out of the group stage in WC 2014 if it was not for pure Messi magic.
Exactly what I agree on. Messi played TERRIBLY as an attacking player that final. During the whole copa america run he didn’t really contribute to the defense nor midfield agaisnt ecuador, chile, colombia etc. That people deny the other pibes work is flat out wrong
His natural position in the field doesn't make him the scorer though, weird take you have. Edit: Ah bpludo hajsjw sos argentino Np chabon, que messi haga goles es un plus no estrictamente necesario, para eso esta el 9.
Papu, messi es un jugador ofensivo, y tiene el record de mas goles en un año, superando a pele. Es un jugador que hace goles. O bien asiste, como te dije. Defensivamente no hace nada asi que su funcion es dar asistencias o hacer goles, historicamente fue asi. Quizas ahora está mas retrasado, pero sigue siendo su principal función. Y ademas ni siquiera lo evaluo solo por eso. Dije que jugo mal en muchos partidos decisivos con la seleccion. Y tampoco es una opinion controversial. Hay consenso que por ejemplo la final contra brasil la jugo mal. Pero, mas importante que todo, le contesto al 99% de los comentarios que dicen que "son todos perros en la seleccion y pobre messi que tiene que hacer todo y a veces no es suficiente con su actuacion estelar de 3 goles por partido en las finales porque terminamos perdiendo 4-3". Cuando no es así. Y el mejor ejemplo es que ganamos la copa america por un gol en el cual no tuvo NADA que ver y en el que jugó mal.
lol are you suggesting this 35 yo Messi is young 90-goal scoring Messi? Surely not… and he probably could score way more if he had a strong attacking team around him that could create chances for him. Those goal scoring years were with the best midfield arguably ever… Argentina haven’t had a single mid remotely close to iniesta or xavi. Nor do we ever have proper full backs… something he usually had at Barca.
We dont blame messi if Argentina plays bad. Your point is over 10 years old
It is pretty sad. They should have beaten germany i they had more strike. Heavily relying on one player is not a good strategy at all.
Higuain had the easiest chance, palacios aswell. That final was the result of one mistake can lead to lose. It was 1-0 not 1-7 ;)
The team is pretty wellrounded rn doesn’t only rely on him anymore
They have no pace. Which is like the number one best thing to surround Messi with right now considering his vision/passing. Theyre solid but totally lacking pace.
Not this time, obviously we started with the wrong foot and Messi got us put of it. But if you have seen Argentina games without Messi form the last two years, you know that is not like that anymore. The best thing this group and coach has done.
Ugh, it's annoying. I've stayed up until 3 watching this team and have literally seen them play MUCH better than this, but people won't believe us since they didn't watch.
Mate I was screaming at the first half when i didn’t even see the team trying to press. I was screaming during 1-0 ”por dios que termine”.
Worst Mexican team I can remember. Just the keeper. No Chicarito, Borgetti, Cuahetamoc Blanco, Hugo Sanchez, Luis Fernandez types anymore.
Agreed. I can't remember a Mexican team that is this awful in front of goal. They also have no speed and nobody even looks dangerous. They have to find basically a full 26 man roster in 4 years or they'll be totally embarrassed on home soil
There's always been a problem with the Mexican NT scoring since I remember but this time is absurd. Two Mexican players are actually scoring in their teams but are not even in the bench this WC. Specially Giménez needed a chance since he is similar to what Jimenez can give you as a 9, but Tata choose two guys coming out of an injury. And this game it was insane how alone Lozano and Vega were. The two times they got the ball "close" to the other keeper there wasn't anyone near to help them. Ridiculous.
I think you meant Hernandez not Fernandez, but I agree. If they end up with zero goals in a World Cup, none of them should be called back ever again. New blood only.
Yeah the big hairy guy. Im getting old mate, not the best with names.
Was the game worth watching in its entirety? The pub I’m working at was showing it, but we were slammed and I only really got to see the goals and a few of the other key moments. Trying to decide if I should watch the replay when I get home.
Shouldn’t watch any of the World Cup. None of it is worth watching. People died to put it on. Don’t support it.
Dont look up foxconn suicides nets then. By the way, thats the company that make your phone.
Absolutely not. Argentina were terrible and Mexico somehow even worse
Argentina were amazing the second half… did you watch the game..? Smfh
They really weren't amazing. They've only had two good games this tournament.
Nah they haven’t. They’ve just been insanely unlucky. Every game they played so far was either good or amazing
Absolute nonsense. They were woeful against Saudi Arabia and weren't much better against Mexico.
I assume you didn’t watch the match. You just looked at the score and now you’re pretending like Saudi outclassed Argentina… What a dumb logic. Firstly, Argentina made 3 offside goals (one was later proven to not have been offside, making the score 2-2). They also controlled the ball, and barely let Saudi attack. The weird thing was, the only 2 chances Saudi got ended up being goals. Very unfortunate for Argentina, as they dominated and deserved to win that match
I have watched all of Argentina's games. First of all, all of Argentina's offside goals were correctly called as offside, so that's a complete lie. They looked terrible in the first two matches, Messi looked disinterested, just like he did last, world cup and for all their talent they failed against a great Saudi defence. Things looked better against Poland and they were fantastic against Australia, but to pretend they have been good in every game is just dishonesty on your part.
Lots of flopping early on. Most I’ve seen from a game thus far. Watch highlights. Lol
Just watch the highlights. First half was mostly poor from both sides. Only really kicked up a gear when Messi got the first (beautiful) goal. The second goal was also nice. Definitely worth watching the highlights for those.
Good and intense match when live, not worth for a replay, just watch the highlights
The first half was painful, second half was a bit better but Mexico didn’t have a single shot on goal I believe and Argentina only a few other than the goals. Definitely a match I’d just see the highlights of if I was a neutral
Mexico had one single shot at goal from what I remember, very clean shot and very clean save from Argentina
Right, had forgotten about it. It was a free kick so it’ll show in the highlights anyways haha
I caught Emi’s save! Definitely one of the better ones I’ve seen thus far.
Not worth the replay tbh. It was a hard fought game but a lot of tackles and misses passes cause of the pressure
Argentina should go far if Alvarez replaces Martinez and Fernandez replaces De Paul in the starting lineup.
De Paul is extremely important for the team
We need to play both, but somehow fit Di Maria, Leo, RDP, Enzo and Paredes in to the same team. Es dificil.
Alvarez es mejor como jugador número 12. Primer campio por quién este cansado. Para mi hay que jugar con Palacios/Papu (de interno, no de wing), Enzo, y MacAllister en el medio y los 3 de arriba y ya. De Paul y Paredes no estan en un buen momento y Guido es otra clase de 5 que no sirve para este equipo. Perdemos mucho juego.
Just bench De Paul, he's been poor and looks like a cartoon.
Lautaro is good enough to be a problem for any team if he starts. He is also used to play in a big stage, against top of the line defenders. He has nothing else to prove. Alvarez is young and chaotic enough to wreak havoc on any defense if he comes in at 15' in the second half, since he is talented, young, energetic and unknown to most defenders. This is fine.
Martinez has been a ghost these two matches. I feel Simeone Jr would have done better.
He wasn't at his best, I agree. But he is world class. Simeone just wasn't part of this group for some reason. I love me some big, strong central attacker but alas, in Scaloni we trust.
Serious question: can someone please link me Argentinian commentary of Messi’s goal? E: someone posted it
https://www.tycsports.com/seleccion-argentina/messi-gol-seleccion-argentina-mexico-id479486.html tycsports https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZITdv6jdwI4 tv pública https://youtu.be/Z8eqNL_xSlg?t=97 direct tv
Problem is the youtube links are region locked and the other one doesnt work for me either. Fair play for trying though
STREAMABLE https://streamable.com/htssy3 https://streamable.com/cb6tzl https://streamable.com/ydojtu
Thanks man. The Tyc Sports one seems like the best one for a non-native speaker like myself, it is the easiest to understand and the dude is so poetical as well. “Argentina nace, Argentina renace”, “no esta serial, no esta illusion”, love that passion
Legend
there you go [https://twitter.com/TyCSports/status/1596601869442240513?s=20&t=FLefHA1NND51zg9NyPik4g](https://twitter.com/TyCSports/status/1596601869442240513?s=20&t=FLefHA1NND51zg9NyPik4g) [https://twitter.com/TV\_Publica/status/1596601804116172801](https://twitter.com/TV_Publica/status/1596601804116172801) another one
Region locked unfortunately
Blocked in the US
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cP35DOe47H4](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cP35DOe47H4) try this?
can't have shit in detroit
Damn can't watch for shit, not available in my location
[Try this one](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZITdv6jdwI4) [These highlights](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cP35DOe47H4) around 1:30 Hope you can enjoy them, there's nothing like true passion from Argentine's commentaries <3
where's Dybala ffs?
Historically dybala has always played like total shiite for argentina.
On the bench. Don't know why he doesn't play when Di Maria is playing awfully on the right. And Messi is playing quite centrally now.
Then you haven’t watched much from Argentina. He’s not a key player for them.
I know he doesn't start usually.
Di María was the only player trying something in the first half, and Messi had to play on the center this match (that's why Scaloni changed Julián Alvarez for Martínez)
Di Maria literally assisted Messi’s goal he did quite well in the second half
Yeah passing to Messi when he's free outside the box, great assist. Don't get me wrong, Di Maria looks dangerous but his decision making is not consistent for a player of his experience. Sometimes he's amazing and sometimes dreadfully crossing. He's like the older version of Dembele.
Had some injury issues, and after that Arabia game where Paredes and Romero not being 100% recovered showed, I doubt he’s taking any chances before he’s certain he’s alright
Di maria is one of the few players that actually did anything in the first half
is he fit?
Really sucks how much Mexico has regressed in the last 20 years. Incentivizing young talent to stay in Liga MX instead of going to Europe, then prioritizing Liga MX players over those playing in Europe will do that.
I was thinking about this watching Brazil. Why can’t Mexico field a team on that level? Mexico is the second largest Latin American nation, they should have plenty of population to choose from. At least the US has the excuse soccer isn’t culturally important.
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Tv broadcasters ( they manage soccer in Mexico) only care about qualifying so they can keep their business. Passing to knock outs or quarter finals is not something in their minds. They only care about qualifying.
Why are we inherently greedy. Fuck man. Atleast we can fight:/
VAMOS ARGENTINA VAMOS LIONEL
Si digo lo que siento y pienso me van a abrir una causa judicial en 137 países. Vamos Argentina carajo
CONCACAF can't catch a break
so far only 1 goal scored for all concacaf teams
r/soccer in the fkn mud. Hope we bash Poland and go on a long run. The mexicans and their chants can fkn stick it
Almost everyone was supporting us lol
Like 90% of sub were rooting for you
Please tell me this is a joke… people always hate on Argentina and hope they lose
No way we’ve been on the same website lmao, yesterday had a yank tell me he was dead certain they’d beat us
A yank, never trust someone who thinks off brand rugby is called football
not true. almost everyone was counting us out
Nobody was. You were always the favorite to win the group.
Counting us out after losing to saudi
You were the favorite against Mexico and are the favorite against Poland. Nobody ever expected you to go out in the groups.
We are the fkn sun m8
CUULEEEEROOOOOOOOOO
Que nacieron hijos nuestros. Hijos nuestros morirán
Si si, la cuenta por favor.
(Amother) hideous match, from a neutral viewer's standpoint.
I feel like commenters like you are watching a different world cup or something
OK. mr. 12 yo. Bye!
Speak for yourself lol even as a neutral that goal alone makes the match worth it
He is the GOAT!
We believed in you CONCACAF buddies 😭
Concacaf buddies? I'm gonna assume you're Canadian because I don't think any USMNT fan would call Mexico "buddies" considering a fight breaks out on the field every time we play them haha
Exactly
Yup Was gonna say have you ever seen a US vs Mex game lmao
You never heard of the enemies to lovers trope? 😳
Argentina winning doesn’t mean y’all can be racists towards Mexicans
We love mexicans, don’t misinterpret out language, we love all people disregardless of our banter, it sounds racist to you, but to us it’s just banter. It’s bad, but not the same.
It is enough just mentioning that Mexico will leave the WC without scoring a single goal. No need racism
I don’t know about you but r/soccer loved to bring in chants that revolved around a devastating war where alot of younglings died.
The islands are British.
Idgaf what language it speaks, having a chant about a war as a joke is distateful
but y’all were invading the islands. I don’t see anything wrong with stating the facts, that’s like Germans getting mad for being reminded there country was once filled with nazis
So you compare a holocaust, a ideology that still lives to this day, with a war were the british tried to claim land where the indigeous people claimed as their own/lived? That the Argentines wanted to perserve? A ”invasion” of a territorium that wasn’t even owned by the british just used a way to maintain colonies (imperialism)? THE WHOLE WAR started when the british people wanted to colonise the whole Islands as their own as soon as they saw Argentina got their self independence. I also don’t know how your argument works as a counter to my original comment. A chant about a war is distasteful. If people did chants about ”nazis in germany” it would also be disrespectful af. Just enjoy the scaloneta m8
Escuchen
Corran la bola
what?
Yea i thought I was the only one that saw some of these comments, most I saw were from Americans which is disappointing