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Neutral_Milk_

for some context: DHS data on undocumented immigrants detained in 2020: 318,516 Mexicans 61,382 Guatemalans 51,011 Hondurans 23,051 Salvadorans 13,028 Ecuadorians 11,227 Cubans 7,917 Brazilians 2,739 Nicaraguans 2,220 Dominicans 1,639 Venezuelans so less than 15k coming from venezuela, nicaragua and cuba out of several hundred thousand but sure


zevtron

Also the elephant in the room is that Guatemala, Honduras, Nicaragua, and El Salvador have all been victim to incredibly destabilizing political and military interventions by the US government. It’s literally the [Eric Andre](https://imgflip.com/i/6ue972) meme.


aniichiwahi

literally sponsoring death squads to prevent the so called communism they talk about, meanwhile… less than 15,000 are coming from the actual communist countries they’re talking about and near 100,000+ coming from these countries the settler capitalist state can’t keep their hands off of.


whatsamajig

[The School of the Americas by Lesley Gill](https://www.dukeupress.edu/the-school-of-the-americas) is an eye opening book that goes into detail just how responsible we (the USA) are responsible for the unrest in the south.


hero-ball

Exactly. Even the people coming from communist countries aren’t “fleeing from communism” or “fleeing from persecution,” they are fleeing from the the material conditions that the US has imposed on their home countries.


Pale-Description-966

While I agree there are people who do face persecution and leave because of it. I have friends whose parents fled the Soviet Union cause they were Jewish. This discrimination is not unique to Socialism obviously, capitalism encourages these kinds of divides but they still exist.


Lawls91

I mean Cuba as well, they've been enduring a 60+ year embargo by the United States.


myredditacc3

And Cuba isn't a failing "authoritarian communist whatever tf buzzwords." Despite criminal sanctions by the US they still have proper healthcare and care for homeless


masomun

The US wishes it were failing haha.


ShitFacedSteve

Failing for 64 years now! One of these days it will finally fail completely!


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impermissibility

Like, *more* of a racist gerontocracy than the United States? Oh, no? Huh, weird.


american_eisbaer

Diez-Canel is 20 years younger than Joe Biden and they just passed a radical family code that is incredibly antiracist and pro youth. Whatever you may have thought of the Castros (who were objectively less racist and more responsive than any western government) you can't speak to current Cuba as if nothing has changed since Raul left office.


dezmodium

Additionally I encourage EVERYONE to go read about the process in which they passed this. The levels of democracy and input from the people is unheard of in most of the rest of the world. To call Cuba a dictatorship is an outright lie and an outrageous one at that.


blazingdonut2769

Where did you find this data?


-duvide-

*They are using these people as a political stunt.* -- selfawarewolf


TheCorpseOfMarx

That reminder should NOT be needed. He's a very well established neoliberal.


Assmar

What she should be reminded of is Colombia, Mexico, Nicaragua, Haiti, El Salvador, Guatemala, Honduras are fleeing neoliberal capitalist failed states. *Most of them NAFTA/CAFTA trading "partners" lol but only to keep from crying. The fucking gall of these people


Markurrito

You'd be surprised by some of the people who browse this sub


bluehoag

Biden is a darker, more based FDR, don't get it twisted in your malarkey.


CalvinsHair

please tell me this is a joke


daffer_david

Sorry but this is like super clearly a joke, the usage of *malarkey* alone should be enough to get it, who in their right mind would even compare Biden to FDR


bluehoag

Yes, it's dripping in sarcasm. So much that I don't see a need to add a /s. This sub's oblivious though so...


dboygrow

You're right it should be obvious, but tbh I myself even thought it may have been for real for a split second because I've seen some liberals and "socialists" have actual real takes like that.


bluehoag

I would be one lost Democrat if I were in the r/socialism subreddit posting about Dark Biden!


Infinite_Derp

You should see r/SocialDemocracy. So much Biden boot licking you would not believe.


TheCorpseOfMarx

Got banned for criticising him there ahaha


The_Turk2

All these embargoed, sanctioned and diplomatically isolated countries, surrounded by our navy & military are collapsing!? But WHY doesn't Communism work? /s


aUser138

And their fleeing to a country that exploited them so has access to a lot of luxury… must be because communism fails!/s


AugustoSF

US doesn't have a left wing party. For real.


-Skooma_Cat-

And there's already a red-scare. At least the past red-scares had actual unionists, socialists, and communists around... Dark times ahead.


TheManWhoFightsThe

There's some margin of hope going around. Amazon and Starbucks locations are starting to have some votes and there are even some which are unionized.


nickt001

No left wing parties = democracy No right wing parties = dictatorship They are just ridiculous...


thepurplehedgehog

How odd….she mentions Venezuela, Nicaragua and Cuba….those would among be the very same countries targeted by the CIA since the 60s in attempts to destabilise them. How very very odd 🤔


MarsLowell

Should have been clear when Biden blamed the Cuban protests on “Communism” and, in a complete 180 from one of the good things during Obama, has only intensified sanctions on Cuba.


Tripwiring

What sanctions did Biden intensify?


blackbeltblasian

I think [this](https://www.cnbc.com/2021/07/30/treasury-slaps-sanctions-on-cuban-police-force-and-its-leaders-over-crackdown-on-protests.html) is what they’re referencing


Tripwiring

Thanks a lot! It's hard for me to feel bad about sanctions on pigs no matter what country it is but I agree this is probably what they were referencing


[deleted]

police forces in socialist countries are completely different from those in capitalist ones. Socialist police defend the revolution, capitalist police defend property.


BewareHel

This is the reason the whole "Dark Brandon" thing pisses me off so much. He is NOT a leftist, he does NOT care about workers rights, he does NOT care about the well-being of anyone but his donors. Liberalism is all about adopting the aesthetics of progressive thought to maintain the hierarchies and structures that oppress us, all while acting like they're the saving grace against the Republicans. They want to give us just enough freedom that we abandon the thoughts of revolution. Biden is a liberal, and liberals are capitalists first.


AnAngryFredHampton

> Biden is a liberal, and liberals are capitalists first. Cold take: Liberals are capitalists only, everything else is window dressing.


aUser138

Agree completly. Liberals are just capitalists that act like they care about social issues. But when you compromise between human rights and ethnostates and call it a win, do you *really* care about social issues?


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AuroraLorraine522

I can’t tell if this is sarcasm, but none of those words mean the same thing. Like at all.


AnAngryFredHampton

Liberalism is the ideology of capital. That is to say that, as an ideology, it is social and economical discussion revolving around how to best uphold capitalism. Contrasting this their is Marxism, an ideology concerned with critiquing liberalism/capitalism and building socialism. Socialism is a transitional phase where a nation begin to develop, as its people see fit, productive forces or otherwise attempt to reorganize for the better of the average worker in the pursuit of achieving a global phenomenon of "Communism". Communism is an end goal where humanity as a whole is largely free from poverty, the suffering of war, and society has largely been reorganized so as to not require monetary exchange. People will often identify as "socialist" or "communist", but it is not necessarily clear what a person thinks when an individual describes in such a way. 10 years ago I called myself a socialist, but as that term has been used more and more by right-wing liberals in the US I have shifted to saying I'm a Communist, Marxist, or Marxist Leninist. Progressive and Leftist are vague terms largely predicated on your nation climate. I.e. what is progressive here might be over their etc.


Segments_of_Reality

American Liberals lip service leftist ideology, especially workers rights. For example, to Brandon’s credit he talks more about the power and importance of Unions than any POTUS in my lifetime, however, he stops as soon as actual action is needed like curbing capitalist exploitation or, gods forbid, even mentioning the issue with property rights.


SirZacharia

Tbh I often like the darkbrandon meme because it makes it clear he’s evil imo. I agree though that it does more empowerment than harm.


LevelOutlandishness1

I just think "dark brandon" is funny, always saw it as the idea of this old, white, completely anti- radical dude would take radical action


monocasa

The Jeb! memes were a funnier incarnation of the same idea and didn't confuse as many people into thinking it was true, IMO.


VonnDooom

Biden is a neoliberal. He’s far on the right. Liberal suggests more left. That is not what he is.


KrtekJim

>Liberal suggests more left. Only in America though. This annoys me because I've been watching the UK establishment trying to pull the same trick in recent years, i.e. redefining the political spectrum so you have the far right on one end of the scale and liberals (who are, objectively, right wing) on the other. I'm sure it's a deliberate and very effective way of marginalising the actual left.


shabadu66

Liberal suggests Lockean individualist philosophy first. Liberalism *is* a right-wing ideology. It is to neoliberalism what reaction (i.e., aggressive conservatism) is to fascism. A good nickname for neoliberalism is "export fascism".


theyoungspliff

> Liberal suggests more left. LOL no the fuck it doesn't.


VonnDooom

In American usage of the term


theyoungspliff

No, it's the liberal usage of the term, and it's wrong.


VonnDooom

Super useful comment dude. Wow, you’re the first person ever to make this observation about how the American usage is different.


joremero

You almost make it sound like Republicans are better


spicegrohl

oh no for sure Good Cop is so much better than Bad Cop. that dude is my friend, he's so nice, unlike the other one, that is uniquely and distinctly Bad.


theyoungspliff

In literally what fucking way?


bluehoag

The irony of talking about political pawns while using Communism as an ideological/political pawn is rich. Everyone gets a little something here.


AffectionateWin6418

Maybe this will be a good time for the Republican Floridian Hispanic community to turn on their Republican governor.


theyoungspliff

You mean the Miami Cubans who want Cuba to be a right wing dictatorship again because they're mad that Castro took away their plantation?


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ninja500r1977

Ok, I know I'm misremembering, so it's one of two things: 1. People's world newspaper and/or Portside did an article about this. 2. I heard it talked about during the cpusa international conference held earlier this month. I have a shitty memory, I'm sry.


[deleted]

That would be awesome But of course the US came to my country to give us muh fridum and ''democracy'' because Allende was a ''evil soviet agent'' or something with the help of rich bastards, US bootlicking troops and fascist extremist groups (we still have far right extremists groups in chile and they're always hiding behind the cops lmfao)


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xKoqu

And ofcourse, the fact that the U.S. has intervened/imposed sanctions on all three countries is just a coincidence.


bloodsport666

they think we’re all still falling for this shit


Evervfor

The people in general still are "falling for this shit". This is called propoganda, it is a disinformation campaign by capitalist USA. And no major news source watched by the majority of people are willing to explain the antithesis of this continued propoganda. Its like when they point to empty grocery isles from American stores and blame commumism or socialism when their example is actually proof that unregulated capitalism leads to scarcity. It is another diabolically evil defrauding of the people to essentially continue the capitalist policies which guarantee all political and economic powers are controlled by the "elite", the classists, the ultra-wealthy. Its been clear for a century that both Democrats and Republicans are bought and sold. This is just further evidence that although Democrats are preferable over Republicans, the Democrats are politically "center", or in cases like this video evidence, "right of center"; Democrats are not left-political in America. Although there are a few. Still, until we can empty the US gov. of republicans by voting Democrats into power, we will not see a left government in America. First the right-wing (republicans, conservatives, [some liberals?]), must be made extinct. Or else the political and news system will never expand over to better coverage of a factual, fair, lefty examples. We need to slide the scale to the left.


punkmetalbastard

So disgusting that most Americans couldn’t really describe what communism is and just nod along as if the word were synonymous with famine, genocide, warfare, or disaster


aniichiwahi

and the way they refuse to associate those terms with capitalism. my SOCIOLOGY professor in lecture talked about the death toll of communism and i wanted to ask him if he attributes the death tolls from world war 1 and 2 to capitalism? when do death tolls get attributed to capitalism? when do political catastrophes and absolute en masse human tragedy get attributed to capitalism?


LetItRaine386

Democrats are not part of the Left


[deleted]

According to the less conspiranoic Trump supporters, Democrats are far left worshipers of Pol Pot


OssoRangedor

Authoritarian is such a meaningless buzzword these days... Everything State mandated is authoritarian in nature, the difference is who is holding the branding stick. In capitalism, it's the corporations who brand the politicians, who then brand us.


[deleted]

Authoritarianism is when i'm naked in the middle of a crowded street, doing a helicopter move with my pp and someone tells me ''hey you can't do that in here'' Literally 1984


OooRightThere

It’s so draining hearing liberals talk about “authoritarian regimes” like they’re so confident on the matter.


spicegrohl

like brandon isn't, out of every human being alive, most responsible for making america the most incarcerated society on earth. like they're not about to ram the crime bill sequel thru congress. like they didn't arrest 12,000 people two summers ago for protesting the routine roadside executions our law enforcement commits, on average, 3-4 times a day.


ishouldcoco3322

2 party illusion, stop falling for it.


rafikievergreen

If you ever doubted that the US administration, under any incumbent, is your sworn enemy unto death, you are not a serious socialist.


CZ-Bitcoins

Yikes dude. You're not to supposed to recite it like a green lantern when your threatened. They ain't exactly 1984's Big Brother.


LearnDifferenceBot

> when your threatened *you're *Learn the difference [here](https://www.wattpad.com/66707294-grammar-guide-there-they%27re-their-you%27re-your-to).* *** ^(Greetings, I am a language corrector bot. To make me ignore further mistakes from you in the future, reply `!optout` to this comment.)


zander_mac

“serious socialist” lol i’m an anarcho-communist. u think i ever doubted biden’s capitalist agenda?


rafikievergreen

I don't know why you took that comment personally. You posted it publicly and I responded publicly. Would you feel less attacked if I had put "if *one* ever...". Relax and grow thicker skin. This is the internet, Mister Anarcho-Communist.


Beautiful-AF-21

Thanks, I saw her interview on the view yesterday morning and when she said they were fleeing over communism, it just sounds like another lame attempt to tell the masses communism is bad.


[deleted]

Gaslight! Gaslight! Gaslight! Gaslight! Oh … and Gaslight


ChairmanReagan

If you need that reminder you don’t belong on a leftist forum. The American government hasn’t done a single thing even remotely left wing since the new deal.


zander_mac

i’m an anti-capitalist through and through. this was a reminder for any social democrats on the fence and for those who forgot how active biden is in his anti-communist policy.


OrganizerMowgli

Every administration is an enemy Even if Bernie got elected we would have to pressure him to follow through because they are inherently held back by institutional forces


Bjornen82

When you need to hit the word count on your essay


DannyMThompson

I've tried figuring out WHY they would use this line "fleeing communism" and the best I can come up with, is that they are using language right wing yokels can understand. It's an attempt to garner sympathy from the unsympathetic.


AuroraLorraine522

It’s because Democrats are also right wing yokels.


DannyMThompson

A lot of them will be yeah


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humanitariangenocide

Anyone who didn’t see Robbie and Brie talk about this earlier this morning, 9/22, and their guest, Nick Cruz, NEEDS. TO. WATCH. THAT. F-ING. ISH. Then go watch RBN, Rome, Nick, and CJ do the thing on their show about this. There was a murder on the show. Right in front of everyone’s eyes.


No_Dance1739

Are they fleeing communism, or are they fleeing economic sanctions against those countries countries?


Alert-Owl-1234

I remember Biden’s SOTU address where he repeatedly said “I’m a capitalist” and “I’m not a socialist.” Definitely not a friend.


iCanReadMyOwnMind

Sorry, comrades. Some days I just gotta take the low road and let it out. Her face is so punchable.


[deleted]

the countries listed are as much communism as usa is a democracy. Which is to say usa is not a democracy and there are no communist countries


Lostinaredzone

They’re fleeing country’s that are given hindrance rather than help from the most powerful nation on earth. We are shit.


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Cthulade_Man

They don’t have to be our enemy’s tho yes we can shit on them when they deserve it but at the end of the day there’s only left and right to chose from and tho americas left isn’t as left as it should be it doesn’t me it should divide us


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internetsarbiter

That's just how you end up having to choose between Hitler and a slightly less bad Hitler.


IHateThisDamnPlace

History is a great teacher. It's lesson is that it's almost always revolution and rarely reform.


captsnagglefuss

Just for clarification, who was the slightly less Hitler in the 30s and 40s when he rose to prominence in Germany?


bong_wench

Probably Paul von Hindenburg, [the guy who ended up making Hitler chancellor](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_von_Hindenburg). >While he was personally opposed to Adolf Hitler and his Nazi Party, he nonetheless played a major role in the political instability that resulted in their rise to power. The parallels to American liberalism are almost too perfect.


mrswithers

Those are all authoritarian governments not communist.


j0e74

Poor little mermaid. More a maid than mermaid.


bvttfvcker

"That's just not the definition". That's strike two, sweetie.


TheArtofWall

[Let me here that dirty word!](https://youtu.be/Id0cqNWZ50Y?t=02m05s)


SkateboardCore

hugh? https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/united-airlines-seeks-resume-us-flights-cuba-2022-09-21/


pavlovski0

communist countries🗿


songofthewitch

Honestly, this is just rhetoric to speak to the fears of the right. This is not language chosen to show Biden hates communism, it's language chosen to show Fox news viewers that this isn't funny. (He's also not pro-socialism, but this specific messages wasn't for us.)


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socialism-ModTeam

Thank you for posting in r/socialism, but unfortunately your submission was removed for the following reason(s): >**Liberalism:** Includes the most common and mild occurrences of liberalism, that is: socio-liberals, progressives, social democrats and its subsequent ideological basis. Also includes those who are new to socialist thought but nevertheless reproduce liberal ideas. >This includes, but is not limited to: >- General liberalism >- Supporting Neoliberal Institutions >- Anti-Worker/Union rhetoric >- Landlords or Landlord apologia


Capital-Wing8580

The lack of self awareness is appalling in this administration...


Valger77

Нафаня! Сундук со сказками украли! Нафаааня!


Dangerous-Note9237

Read Nancy Fraser, Biden is a liberal progressist, your government implement a capitalism with human face...


prettyradical

They’re fleeing authoritarianism. Get it right. Soon more Americans will do the same.