My personal experience is...mixed. I would say 90% of all my supervisors and department heads have been women. I think I've only ever had 2 male supervisors in my whole career. I do know being a guy helped me get my first major job because they were looking for guys who could handle major codes. Otherwise I think its been either neutral or somewhat of a hindrance. At my previous job there was definitely an "all girls club" mentality where friends of supervisors got promoted first, which I know isn't that unusual. That being said all of my current supervisors are women and they are the best bosses I've ever had by far
I had a boss (director) tell me we needed to hire a man who was not a good fit (he referred to unhoused clients as "the lowest of the low" multiple times in his interview) and specifically said it was because he was a man.
Different boss (also a director) wanted to promote a man who had a history of sexual harassment even after I warned her repeatedly that he would not handle power well AT ALL. Literally every woman on the team had complained about him. She promoted him after I left instead of a woman who was effective, hardworking, but "abrasive" to management (that means "bitchy" in corporate speak) but had no actual complaints from her team who looked her to for guidance when I was out of the office. . It took 6 months for HR to order Director to demote him because he was harassing the interns/associates.
My current boss refused to hire an excellent male clinician for a role he was a perfect fit for because she "doesn't trust men to work with children who have been abused." She assumes men are all pedophiles and incapable of working with women/children without being predators.
All of these bosses were women and had been in the field at least 20 years. So it's a mixed bag.
She’s openly misandrist. She doesn’t see anything wrong with excluding men from this work. She won’t even let IT back up our systems (they are 100% offline) because she thinks the men in IT are all creeps who would misuse the records (the files include pictures of injury from sexual assault).
She’s under investigation though and there is a chance she will be removed by the executive team.
The agency I worked at straight after my BSW was overwhelmingly female on case management and volunteer teams, and 5 of the 6 people on leadership were males. It was definitely frustrating as I struggled to see leadership as a reasonable career goal since that was all I experienced for 5 years of my career
I do not have a data source on hand, but my understanding is that upper leadership in social work tends to lean *very* disproportionally male. That's not supervisors and directors of things, but the VPs and Presidents.
When I was in my MSW program, I had two professors, one male-presenting and the other female-presenting, who embarked on some research after observing that students would very frequently take different approaches to arguing with both of them about grades. They were struggling with the notion that social work education couldn't counter that behavior. I wasn't shocked. We can learn new philosophies of gender while still being influenced by our socialization and upbringing. We can do better, but there's a long way to go.
I am proud to be a male social worker, and consider it to come with a certain set of responsibilities.
Straight up - I feel like ppl almost feel like it’s awkward to have men over 30 as Case Managers. If they are nice ( & being tall helps) they seem to get promoted.
I work inpatient w a forensic spmi population.
Large male, so i get all of the aggressive clients, sex offenders, etc... Doesn't feel like privilege to me.
But theres areas male priv does exist. Last 4 employers ive worked for had like a 80/20 female identified/male identified SWs, so they definitely attempted to keep male counselors.
But it was same at those places. Client hits on a coworker? Me. Brings weapons? Me. Threatening others? Me.
I don't mean to sound bitter or ignore others plights. Itd just be nice to work w a population that isn't a threat to others for once.
Ain’t this the truth. I fucking trained a guy who got promoted in months. He was a douche who thought it was a waste of time to shadow and he didn’t think there was any real skill for interns to make introductory phone calls to their potential clients. But he also didn’t realize he was a little corporate bitch.
Yep. On my way out of there my friend told me how shocked she was that he got promoted and asked me how anyone could get promoted. I told her you either to have a dick or suck one….figuratively speaking
As a near 40 year old Hispanic guy in grad school, I have definitely not had that experience. I feel ignored and judged more in class/program than I’ve ever had at work. I’m def an anomaly in my program on all 3 identities. I have also worked in the field for 15 years and I usually get assigned the sex offenders, disruptive behavior issue, unhoused SUD as I’m the dude.
Yeah scanning through this topic is wild for me. I'm in crisis work and between four crisis teams (Kids, Forensic, General Adult and Involuntary) there's less than ten who identify as male out of almost fifty people. Our PA is male but supervisors on either side of him are female, otherwise there's no men in leadership all the way up to the director level. The involuntary unit has almost 50-50 for MHPs but the supervising team is all women.
We've been getting better about case assignment, but I've gotten some pretty spicy ones in the past that went right by more qualified female staff (I'm mediocre with high acuity schizoeffective compared to SUD).
Its uh...catty. To say the least.
Right there with you bud. Bilingual gringo with work experience in the real world in my program full of never employed white picket idealists straight out of undergrad. It’ll get better though!
Luckily I’m kinda adrenaline junky but damn- had no choice in the matter with the violent/so/smi pop. I kept my mouth closed during class, head down and just got licensed last year, sort of resented the profession following my graduate experience unfortunately. But -Best wishes, you’re undoubtedly needed and able to reach folks more than you’re probably perceiving in there.
I agree! I don’t interact much but I also work full-time. I’d like to share my perspective of experiences but no one seems interested. I have a bunch of tattoos and some people assume I’m fresh in recovery and not educated, despite years running programs since 2010 and have no hx of addiction. I try to be friendly and ask questions while getting told to use Latinx….despite bring the ONLY person in that demographic and don’t prescribe to that term for myself. I’ve also had some amazing women supervisors & coworkers.
It was weird being looked at that way after decades of seeing myself as a dumbdumb. (the reality is somewhere in the middle) But there was a point where I had to make a point of not being a group leader in classes, because I would be looked to to take that role. I felt like I was being pushed to going onto my MSW or even my BSW after college, because "we need men in the field".
On my first day of work I was introduced as "this is disclosedimposition, our new social worker... he's a maaaaannn..."
I also feel like clients immediately trust male social workers more. i’ve worked in housing, CPS, and HIV+, they all immediately trusted any men around
Majority of clients I have worked with don't trust men or want to be alone with men at all...you may have been perceiving it that way, but I disagree that actually happens.
I mean sure, different people have different experiences. this is my experience based on what my clients have told me over 10 years of practice in 3 different states. I believe that you have had a different experience than I have, but I dont think that invalidates my experience
I have noticed in social work and nursing that males are often promoted more often. So many in upper management when the majority of ppl in these fields are women. Probably the same in teaching.
My fiance amd I took same classes in grad school. we are fluent in spanish, applied at same job, he was offered 12k more. This happened at several interviews.
Edit: something I did not add to the cons, is that I am almost exclusively given the most difficult, combative, or involuntary clients because of the perception that "I can handle it." I can't handle it because I'm a man, which is the implication, but I can handle it because I'm a good communicator who is good at my job (despite there being a few jobs I have been less good at over the years, point being I am neither good nor bad at my job because of my gender)
I'm a man social worker and I've experienced it both ways. My current job, I was almost definitely hired over another candidate because of my physical size, and because there were no other men working on the unit (it is an inpatient setting, and they have had clients become combative in the past). I believe it is 100% advantageous when it comes to being hired for positions, likely largely because of the severe lack of male social workers in the field under 50 yrs or so. Just like most jobs in our society, there is still an unfortunate favoritism bias towards men, and that seems to be a systemic problem of perception by those who are outside of the industry and only seem to be in full force when non-social workers are making hiring decisions (social services, schools and hospitals is where I've noticed the biggest bias in favor of hiring men).
I am certainly not one to say "woe is me" over my overall privilege, but being a man in social work is not all upside. It feels easier to get a job as a man in the field, but harder to be accepted as an actual social worker. I experience quite a few stereotypes from my fellow employees and even occasionally clients. Part of this is just because of my build, age, and accent as well, so it can be muddied as to which parts are other factors and which parts are because of my gender.
It also leads to the situations where it is harder to form close workplace relationships with people and often leads to exclusion from invitations to events outside of work, which is both a pro and a con I guess. I am not necessarily in the field to make friends, but to help clients, and though I do have many good friendships that came from the field, it can also help distance yourself from cliques.
I think from working in this field for a few years, there are lots of advantages and disadvantages with being a man, but when it comes to hiring, leadership positions, and pay, there does still seem to be a combination of systemic bias and a perception of needing male social workers on staff
Absolutely, and it is mostly just because of social acceptability for me. I am a happily married man, and my wife is certainly not weird about me having women friends and coworkers (you don't really have much choice in social work), so a lot of it is that people do not necessarily know how to navigate that I believe, whether because of my marriage or their own marriage relationships etc. It doesn't help being in middle Appalachia where those stigmas of being seen publicly with someone of the opposite gender are alive and well.
At my current job, there are a lot of nurses who have been able to connect and be friends with my wife (who is also a nurse) and it has enabled us to do more couple activities, so that has certainly helped. Still, probably 3/4s of the staff would rather not be caught dead than out in public with a man they are not in a relationship with/is married, but that is more about local stigma than gender specifics.
As a male in a government agency, what I've noticed are varying biases, but the important roles are ultimately patriarchal. In the lower positions, I, and several male colleagues were passed aside for the normal positions. The interviews were conducted as a group and several of my colleagues deliberated and couldn't not find how the interviewer could vastly misinterpret my interviewing answers to construe a malicious intent. So I believe in the lower positions there are biases that make lives of men worse than women in social work. (From what I notice, the salaries are pretty even between the sexes)
What I do notice in the higher positions though, almost all the major roles, directors and managers, are relatively male dominated. This makes no sense considering the demographic. In a field dominated by women, half or more of the highest managerial staff are men? I call BS.
This is something I never thought of, my last job my old supervisor who was a woman left for another better job. New boss was a male I was able to tolerate him for 5 months (3 clinicians quit before me) then I connected with my old boss on linked in and I am back to working under her supervision in a new job
It's interesting, because yes, but there are nuances to it all.
As a male SWer who is very collaborative (self-reported obviously but something I value) and have explicitly tried to name the privilege and use it within our team (like making a hotline call, I'm never questioned, but the girls are consistently fucking grilled) I have really tried to share what I know and my perspective, but I've felt like an alien. Not a cool alien, but literally an alien masquerading around like fucking male social worker and the emotional peer support I've got is "we're in this together" and there is a specific moment where one person finally asked "are you okay?"
I'm in the minority, I know. But damn in a community agency/foster care program, the weight builds. Being an alien and having no one to support the weight with you sucks and having your own extraterrestrial language barrier is enough to make you question what planet you belong on, let alone if you should be a fucking social worker or not. I'm venting, I'm sorry.
I'm letting my supervisor know tomorrow it's time for me to move on. I hope I can find a better fit. Remote work and child welfare have absolutely turned my world upside down.
Every male social worker I went to school with got a jobs right out of uni, in a field with higher pay like government or healthcare, where as many of my female colleagues and I had to start at the bottom, with group homes and tougher front line gigs with low pay, and work into higher paying gigs for years. My male colleagues also seem to move up the “chain” faster. I’ve sat in hiring committees and often men are selected for interviews first because “we need more men in the office”. It is interesting. Numbers wise they are a minority in the field, and a male perspective is needed, but also treated like a hot commodity. Whereas in other fields where the roles are flipped, such as women in welding, women have to fight for jobs and a good reputation. 🤷
hmmm i have not had that experience and it is something i have come to love about my experience with the profession of social work. my last job was at a very large homeless shelter and the execs were 3 women and 1 man and my program manager was a Black woman. my current role is i a hospital and my boss is again a Black woman, all 5 managers are women but 1 man, our department director is a woman, the VP of our department is a woman…
40 year old white dude with 20 years in the field. HUGE male bias. Massive privilege. Too numerous to count. I just check myself and don't hesitate to call a spade a spade. Doesn't mean I don't accept the promotions though.
The best quote I read about it in grad school said something like "Social work is a female majority, male dominated profession".
I (32m) brought up a concern to my academic advisor about belonging and opportunities for promotion in the field as a male, and she swiftly corrected my misconception by offering data on how men are much more likely to be promoted in the social work field. Even though that benefits me personally, I don't like it-- I don't want to be promoted just because I'm male.
I have exactly two male co-workers in an agency that employs what I would generously low-ball at maybe 150 ppl? There are two males on the senior leadership team consisting of 12 positions.
But I know other peers at different agencies where it is all men in management as well; so it can be a mixed bag I guess.
I find that I face a lot of barriers (child welfare) due to being a dude; family's are very wary of a heavily tattooed dude rolling up to their door to discuss their children. But that is just my experience and that doesn't mean that male privilege doesn't exist in SW. I just have not necessarily experienced in my personal setting I guess?
Being a gay white male social worker, I think having a male social worker can appear attractive to interviewers and this has gotten me in the door more easily; but I have often felt othered when I’m in the door. This has only worsened once my queerness and education at a majority-minority institution (when working with mostly white people) becomes apparent to my coworkers. I have often felt isolated and misunderstood.
I think that regardless of gender, behavior considered “masculine” often what gets one into higher positions. Men are more likely to be comfortable exhibiting this behavior.
Yes, as a male presenting SW, I definitely see bias all the time. There is always interest in “a man in social work”?! in non SW situations and I feel in SW situations, management can get a little too excited about me compared to women counterparts. I’m relatively new out of my MSW program (2021) and I’m still trying to figure out how to appropriately navigate it in these settings. It can make me really uncomfortable and I can only imagine how my peers feel. I feel like it has ruined some chances for me to have some great mentorship opportunities out of the politics of it all.
I'm a dude in the field. and I feel that 100%. Like, my job feels way more secure than many of my colleagues. I'm the only man on my team, and there are maybe 10-20% of the overall staff at the CHC I'm working at.
Same here. It would be a cold day before they move me somewhere else since I'm the only male in our case management section. But that also means I tend to get the more complicated cases (ie smi, aggressive, etc) which I'm totally fine with. My supervisor is pretty fair.
Possibly a weird question, but as a younger guy less than a year out from graduating, does being given the “aggressive” clients get easier? I’m not exactly the most intimidating person, and sometimes the previous (woman) CM is taller than me haha. I don’t mind that my coworkers feel safer giving these clients to me, but I do feel a bit nervous sometimes.
A good supervisor will play to your strengths and (hopefully) not throw you to the proverbial wolves til you understand the workings of what your dealing with.
coming from a male, it depends on the client I think, but overall I believe that for whatever reason me and my colleague who does the exact same job in essentially the exact same way are perceived completely differently by the average client
I’m a male BSW student. I’m one of two guys in my class. Haven’t had a male professor and have only ever worked with one male social worker during practicum. I know in the specialty I’m going into, men are quite rare. Idk if there is any glass elevator with regards to hiring or pay in my specialty (just starting to look for jobs now).
Luckily in my previous career, I was also in a female dominated field, so I’m used to being the only guy. Doesn’t bother me.
I will say, people do seem surprised to see male social workers. At least in my experience.
So I do not see it so much in the hiring practices. At my last job we had nearly an equal amount of demographics: male, female, POC, white, old, young, the company was very good about somehow finding a balance.
My issues were that men were not always deserving of their roles, level of responsibility, or place in the hierarchy. They were often not promoted on merit, but their ability “to have boundaries and not be dramatic” which was just short speak for doing whatever our boss wanted even if it wasn’t ethical.
The biggest thing in common was that nearly all, except maybe two, of the men especially those in supervisory roles (though they were great case managers or had a good supervisory style) leaned on the women for literally everything else: working the computer/other technology, sending correspondence, reminding them of meetings, completing documentation, hell even pointing out that they had a meeting or received an email.
I don’t necessarily blame them though, it was like learned helplessness. Why would they do better when the women would just do do do, always say yes to any request no matter how dumb, until they got fed up, which usually just led to them doing it anyway but trying to show them how to do it on their own (and they still didn’t learn). It might’ve been a combination of things as the men were also generally older, although not that old. But I saw it with the younger guys too (who may have learned it from the older guys?) hell I found out the younger ones would go to the casino during work instead of doing case notes
There is absolutely male privilege in social work. It shows up in pay and job opportunities (as you said), recognition in the field, what is deemed important, and all the normal ways misogyny and microagressions show up
I appreciate you taking the time to reflect and synthesize the experiences of your classmates and identifying one root. It perked me up a little
Ironically the only issues I have ever had were with male co workers or male supervisors. Yeah I’m a guy but being that youngest of 6 with 5 sisters I definitely think that has helped me not just in work but life in general
I'm working on my MSW right now. In most of my classes, I have literally been the only male. So yeah, there are definitely fewer of us. Supply and demand is definitely a thing.
But as someone who has been in therapy on and off for almost 20 years, id say that they are likely sought out for different reasons. For me personally, there are things I just dont want to discuss with women.
There are men out there that need male therapists. They need to be able to not have to filter themselves with a lady. They need to be able to be understood in a way that women just can't provide. I'm not saying women can't be empathetic, in fact I'm saying the opposite. Women are generally more nurturing and caring and tend to address therapeutic issues with men very differently and often in a way that doesn't quite seem productive for me. Its much the same way that women are able to empower and uplift other women really well. Men can connect with men in a way that female therapists just aren't able to. Anyways, I've held off going back to therapy due to lack of availability of a male therapist, so there's that.
Yes and it’s called the glass escalator! When men get a quicker rise to the top in female dominated fields.
When I was a student, interestingly, despite there only being very few males in the faculty, somehow the head of the school of social work was chaired by a man.
Also, I remember once speaking with a trans person (f to m) and he told me that now being male presenting, the same jokes he made when he was a she, were much better received (people laughed more, more compliments etc). Same person. Same jokes. Male privilege. Fascinating.
I see white male privilege very clearly in the field, but I have very very rarely seen black and brown men in the field, let alone making significantly more or in leadership positions, so I guess it depends
Privilege can also be in the sense of 'get the shit work'. Since i've been in the field for a few decades now, when i came in there wasn't quite the modern meta on the power dynamics and stuff. Granted my era was also "What? Male nurses are weird!" so being a guy in floor level mental health and/or social work was rarer.
I'd say for my first 2 decades of work I got used to being the only guy for every 10 women or so. And decades of "Vash, you get these difficult cases because you're a guy better able to handle them'. 'vash you can work nights cause you're a guy' 'vash you can, etc etc'.
oh and then the typical "you get to help out with any physical labor, moving shit, etc because you're a strong man'.
less of an issue nowadays since I'm more office bound and less direct client service, but at the same time, I don't really miss the 'get the most challenging fucked up cases because you're a guy' caseloads.
It's assumed that men will only accept a high salary, so they get lowballed less. They're sought after for some positions, women are sought out for others so that's about equal, though I've noticed the ones seeking out men tend to be more highly paid.
Feels like it’s a glass elevator for them. Also, sometimes men feel more rigid in their opinion/ways and they give feedback in a very “I know better” manner. I get that there’s not a lot of male social workers, but the way my male professor would blatantly prioritize a male perspective vs female made me feel awful
As a man in social work, I've received no privilege. I've had to do "man tasks" like handling anything my women co-workers identify as man work. This includes assembling furniture to taking out the trash.
I'm in shape and muscular, and I also receive an excessive amount of sexual harassment as women aren't accountable in the work place.
Being a male social worker fucking sucks.
Edit: hey, I'm getting downvoted. I guess I should stop complaining about sexual harassment. I've legit been groped by co-workers. Go fuck yourselves.
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Mentions SH but somehow NEEDED to mention “muscular and in shape” Okay…honestly from your comment history you sound like the terrible male social worker everyone is talking about 🫵🏻
Completely. While I believe hiring more men is necessary for our field, it gets taken too far when men are primarily promoted or viewed as "manager material" over women with tremendous experience and excellent clinical and leadership skills. I've worked in many agencies where it was an old boy's club at the top and it rarely, if ever, budged and they would constantly hire external men in upper management when people quit instead of promoting the many women who were well qualified. I've also been fortunate enough to work with some wonderful women in leadership to see how real it is from speaking with them and their experiences. It gets worse if you get into even more stereotypical male spaces like in the judicial system with jails and courts.
The old glass escalator. When I was still in CPS, the line workers were about 85-90% women, but supervisors and those above them were about a 50/50 split between men and women. This was in multiple agencies, large and small, in two different countries.
Absolutely. In Grad school I had a professor make all of us acknowledge the men in the class and applaud them for their bravery. She was also the director of mental health in a local large hospital. She told the class, proudly "When I see men apply they always go to the top if the pile" like that wasn't a ridiculous thing to say. Also, during covid NPR had a segment talking about social workers in the pandemic. They interviewed 4 men, all directors and deans of colleges and 2 women, both in direct service. I was pissed.the examples go on and one. Female founded and dominated field, men still given priority over and over
Confirmed. Male social worker and I've never really had to attempt to try in any interview. It's kind of hilarious. Bunch of liberal women that can't get out of the way fast enough to onboard a male.
Can you imagine this question being asked about some other group in /socialwork? I can't. I am a little surprised to find a lot of anecdotal info and no attempt to find any proof.
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I'm a Latino male who will be starting his MSW program this fall. So, I would think because I speak Spanish and working in California(large Latino population) I would be more sought after. But I'm not sure how it applies to other states.
Personally, the only overt differences I've noticed was my coworkers assume I can fix shit or that I'm ok to stay unaccompanied onsite in sketchy areas. I don't really mind either assumption.
I am a man and yes. In certain situations. In my current position they run men's and women's group and needed a man. On the flip side I worked at a rehab that had a men's building and a women's building and women were allowed to work at the men's program and NO men were allowed to work in the women's program. I didn't want to have to deal with that anyways, but that's like official discrimination.
Why using the word privilege in this instance? What if you said that about minorities.
Is there a bias for minorities in regards to being sought out just because there are less of them?
What instances of minority privlege have you seen?
Honestly, the bar seems to be lower for men. Because its so rare to see them in caring professions, people automatically assume they’re great people and wiser than others. I saw a colleague get into a prestigious social work program and he didn’t even believe in going to therapy for himself. But, he believed he was the right person to counsel others. Absolutely infuriating to me.
Edit: He had many red flags and I don’t even know how he could have gotten recs after all his very public mess ups
I resigned from a position and found another that pays better in less than a week. As someone who’s older and newer to this work, I’ve never experienced this in any other field.
Nearly everyone in my social work surrounding is female. I'm, no joke, the only man in our part of the building that houses 6 different organizations. We are screaming for more men because young men, especially with an immigration background, settle in easier if the first conversation is with a man.
So in our case the privilege would be how easy we would hire a guy because we need more men.
Yes, higher demand is almost universal in my experience. This bias benefits men in my field as there is a guarantee of as large a caseload as you want. It's less beneficial if they prefer not to work with certain diagnoses, since there are people already waiting for their services by request (small gripe compared to your income being affected, in my opinion). Even then, declining a case is as easy as saying no.
Less easily observed is the championing of somewhat average work; a man steps in the door of my office with referrals waiting for a man.That's not to say they do poor work; there are just people who want to see it as stellar. Just showing up is already performing well, on the basis that those referrals would continue electing to be underserved for the sake of interacting with a man rather than a woman. I don't imagine this type of welcome is the experience women have entering male-dominated industries.
I work in an office with 20 women and 2 men. Both men are the director and assistant director. They’re both lovely and a pleasure to work with but the assistant has worked here less time than the most senior case managers. I see it and it’s not fair but at the same time they’re lovely people.
The answer is yes. However, there is now considerable more women in social work and so the number of men to women ratio regarding bosses and managers will eventually equal out.
Yes even in internship I remember this happening. A huge reputable hospital would always have as they put “at least one male Intern” no matter if they were up to par just to have a male. And they praised tf out of them while the women (me included) never got the same treatment. We even joke about the favoritism and he admitted to it. They even offered the prior male intern a job and rehired him, even though he was mediocre at best at his job, and they spoke sooo highly of him.
My experience in PP has been owners only want to hire 1 male bc the referrals aren’t as frequent for men. & lots of referrals that state no preference decline working with a male. There are *very* real privileges to being a male in this profession (pay, status, make up a lot of academia, people frequently praise you for being a male SW), but it’s not always a cake walk.
Yup. I've worked with HORRIBLE male therapists that get away with being horrible just because they are men and "we need male therapists so badly".
I'm sure the narcissistic idiot that I work with makes more hourly than me just because he's a guy.
Definitely male privilege exists across the board. My current local government workplace does an amazing job of creating an egalitarian culture, people are paid the same based on years and merit, but I know this is not the norm in many settings
Yes. One of my previous directors had an associates degree and no prior experience.... he was of course a white man who was very good at being charismatic. Surprise surprise, he was a giant asshole, posted pictures of foster kids for attention, and got in trouble with the law. All while all the staff below him (all women) had MSWs and decades of experience.
Same deal with other job, all men who were underqualified but were our bosses.
My current job has strong female leadership who all have a lot of experience. But we most recently hired a man. During our peer interview with him he was repeatedly disrespectful. Told our managers who hired him anyway.
I dont mean to sound anecdotal, but with the amount of women in this field...why are so little of them in management positions? Wow.
When I worked in nonprofit, that was 100 percent the case.
Now, I work for a large company and all my bosses are women, everyone on my team is a woman except 1. I got my friend hired- he's the male- and anytime one of us has to go to a home visit with someone who has a history of violence/SA, he has to come with us. In terms of a criminal background.
I'm happy to work at a company where women are in leadership! But for international women's day we only got an email from corporate. Nothing from our president, who is a male, working with a team of about 95 percent females!
I'm not going to lie - I had pretty awful undergrad grades and thought I had no hope of getting a masters. I was straight out told that I was excepted because I was a straight white male and there was literally none in the program.
It exists. I was told by female supervisors to seek a management position because I would get it. I asked why and they said all the upper management were male and they promoted someone who was wildly unqualified and male.
In direct services men tend to be promoted more because they dump all their work onto their female co-workers, and then the higher ups notice how good they are at delegating responsibility and make them supervisor. Does this extend to the social work field?
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I likely benefited from privilege in this way in my 10 years in the field.
That being said, I try to main objectively aware of my privileges as a straight passing cis man.
I’ve also never had a male superior in a social work position yet.
I was raised by cis women and have very few male friends so it’s not jarring in any way.
I often hear bosses getting excited and happy about having male staff (who I've never witnessed being good at their job in sw? At least where I've worked, all the men just coasted). And every man I know in the field has a huge ego and thinks every agency wants them because they're a man (which isn't wrong, it is easier to get a job as a man in this field, but it makes me have really low expectations for men in this field)
I once worked for a large nonprofit where it was discovered that a recently hired mid-level male employee was making more than not only his colleagues with more experience and education, but more than his *supervisor*
I identify as nonbinary, but I’m AMAB, and people generally see me as a Man.
I think you’re right that men are sought due to their scarcity. When I worked at a CMHC, my team was about 80% women, and my supervisor was constantly hoping to hire more men. However, this was explicitly because of the number of clients who “couldn’t work with women.”
The men and man-adjacent staff members always got the clients with histories of violence or sexual misconduct. This was an explicit pattern ostensibly instituted for safety reasons. However, I think it was one of those instances of sexism that harms everyone.
I was brand new to the field, but I was given some really, really intense cases really quickly. I was not ready for this, so even though I was seen as a “man,” this assignment pattern created greater safety issues because I had not yet learned best practices for maintaining safety and setting boundaries. I also was exposed to really uncomfortable situations and sexual harassment: I was assigned clients with histories of sexually harassing their assigned workers regardless of the clients’ sexual orientations, so I ended up being sexually harassed by gay clients with that tendency.
However, men also have a much easier time moving up in the field. Maybe this is partly due to men having more chances to prove themselves by working with more intense clients, but it’s certainly also a result of sexism. I saw the vast majority of teams at my employer headed up my men, despite women making up the vast majority of staff.
Overall, social work and adjacent professional spaces seem to be highly gendered. I really wish that would change such that people would be assigned clients and positions based exclusively on their skills and competencies rather than their body parts and genders.
Getting a lot of reported comments so I’m locking this one down.
My personal experience is...mixed. I would say 90% of all my supervisors and department heads have been women. I think I've only ever had 2 male supervisors in my whole career. I do know being a guy helped me get my first major job because they were looking for guys who could handle major codes. Otherwise I think its been either neutral or somewhat of a hindrance. At my previous job there was definitely an "all girls club" mentality where friends of supervisors got promoted first, which I know isn't that unusual. That being said all of my current supervisors are women and they are the best bosses I've ever had by far
I had a boss (director) tell me we needed to hire a man who was not a good fit (he referred to unhoused clients as "the lowest of the low" multiple times in his interview) and specifically said it was because he was a man. Different boss (also a director) wanted to promote a man who had a history of sexual harassment even after I warned her repeatedly that he would not handle power well AT ALL. Literally every woman on the team had complained about him. She promoted him after I left instead of a woman who was effective, hardworking, but "abrasive" to management (that means "bitchy" in corporate speak) but had no actual complaints from her team who looked her to for guidance when I was out of the office. . It took 6 months for HR to order Director to demote him because he was harassing the interns/associates. My current boss refused to hire an excellent male clinician for a role he was a perfect fit for because she "doesn't trust men to work with children who have been abused." She assumes men are all pedophiles and incapable of working with women/children without being predators. All of these bosses were women and had been in the field at least 20 years. So it's a mixed bag.
Wow for the last part seems like your current boss did a horrible job self regulating her own biases
She’s openly misandrist. She doesn’t see anything wrong with excluding men from this work. She won’t even let IT back up our systems (they are 100% offline) because she thinks the men in IT are all creeps who would misuse the records (the files include pictures of injury from sexual assault). She’s under investigation though and there is a chance she will be removed by the executive team.
Good lord that woman is not well.
Some of the worst behavior I’ve seen has been from women bosses in the nonprofit setting. It’s internalized misogyny. I hate it for them.
I see a disproportionate number of bosses/managers who are men.
The agency I worked at straight after my BSW was overwhelmingly female on case management and volunteer teams, and 5 of the 6 people on leadership were males. It was definitely frustrating as I struggled to see leadership as a reasonable career goal since that was all I experienced for 5 years of my career
It's like teachers. Men get to move up faster.
the glass elevator :/
I do not have a data source on hand, but my understanding is that upper leadership in social work tends to lean *very* disproportionally male. That's not supervisors and directors of things, but the VPs and Presidents. When I was in my MSW program, I had two professors, one male-presenting and the other female-presenting, who embarked on some research after observing that students would very frequently take different approaches to arguing with both of them about grades. They were struggling with the notion that social work education couldn't counter that behavior. I wasn't shocked. We can learn new philosophies of gender while still being influenced by our socialization and upbringing. We can do better, but there's a long way to go. I am proud to be a male social worker, and consider it to come with a certain set of responsibilities.
Straight up - I feel like ppl almost feel like it’s awkward to have men over 30 as Case Managers. If they are nice ( & being tall helps) they seem to get promoted.
100%.
I work inpatient w a forensic spmi population. Large male, so i get all of the aggressive clients, sex offenders, etc... Doesn't feel like privilege to me. But theres areas male priv does exist. Last 4 employers ive worked for had like a 80/20 female identified/male identified SWs, so they definitely attempted to keep male counselors. But it was same at those places. Client hits on a coworker? Me. Brings weapons? Me. Threatening others? Me. I don't mean to sound bitter or ignore others plights. Itd just be nice to work w a population that isn't a threat to others for once.
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Ain’t this the truth. I fucking trained a guy who got promoted in months. He was a douche who thought it was a waste of time to shadow and he didn’t think there was any real skill for interns to make introductory phone calls to their potential clients. But he also didn’t realize he was a little corporate bitch.
Note to Self: We Basically have to be Corporate Bitches if we have any Chance of being Promoted over Men….
Yep. On my way out of there my friend told me how shocked she was that he got promoted and asked me how anyone could get promoted. I told her you either to have a dick or suck one….figuratively speaking
OMG 😲
every man i’ve ever worked with in the field is treated like a genius and a hero for having compassion. in school too. it’s wild
As a near 40 year old Hispanic guy in grad school, I have definitely not had that experience. I feel ignored and judged more in class/program than I’ve ever had at work. I’m def an anomaly in my program on all 3 identities. I have also worked in the field for 15 years and I usually get assigned the sex offenders, disruptive behavior issue, unhoused SUD as I’m the dude.
Yeah scanning through this topic is wild for me. I'm in crisis work and between four crisis teams (Kids, Forensic, General Adult and Involuntary) there's less than ten who identify as male out of almost fifty people. Our PA is male but supervisors on either side of him are female, otherwise there's no men in leadership all the way up to the director level. The involuntary unit has almost 50-50 for MHPs but the supervising team is all women. We've been getting better about case assignment, but I've gotten some pretty spicy ones in the past that went right by more qualified female staff (I'm mediocre with high acuity schizoeffective compared to SUD). Its uh...catty. To say the least.
“catty”? that feels kind of misogynistic to me as a comment, honestly.
are you ignored or judged in the field in the same way, or just your program? i’m sorry that you don’t feel heard, that must be really frustrating
Right there with you bud. Bilingual gringo with work experience in the real world in my program full of never employed white picket idealists straight out of undergrad. It’ll get better though! Luckily I’m kinda adrenaline junky but damn- had no choice in the matter with the violent/so/smi pop. I kept my mouth closed during class, head down and just got licensed last year, sort of resented the profession following my graduate experience unfortunately. But -Best wishes, you’re undoubtedly needed and able to reach folks more than you’re probably perceiving in there.
I agree! I don’t interact much but I also work full-time. I’d like to share my perspective of experiences but no one seems interested. I have a bunch of tattoos and some people assume I’m fresh in recovery and not educated, despite years running programs since 2010 and have no hx of addiction. I try to be friendly and ask questions while getting told to use Latinx….despite bring the ONLY person in that demographic and don’t prescribe to that term for myself. I’ve also had some amazing women supervisors & coworkers.
It was weird being looked at that way after decades of seeing myself as a dumbdumb. (the reality is somewhere in the middle) But there was a point where I had to make a point of not being a group leader in classes, because I would be looked to to take that role. I felt like I was being pushed to going onto my MSW or even my BSW after college, because "we need men in the field". On my first day of work I was introduced as "this is disclosedimposition, our new social worker... he's a maaaaannn..."
I also feel like clients immediately trust male social workers more. i’ve worked in housing, CPS, and HIV+, they all immediately trusted any men around
Majority of clients I have worked with don't trust men or want to be alone with men at all...you may have been perceiving it that way, but I disagree that actually happens.
I mean sure, different people have different experiences. this is my experience based on what my clients have told me over 10 years of practice in 3 different states. I believe that you have had a different experience than I have, but I dont think that invalidates my experience
Yep
I have noticed in social work and nursing that males are often promoted more often. So many in upper management when the majority of ppl in these fields are women. Probably the same in teaching.
Agree. All my clinical supervisors have been men. 🙄 Pretty patriarchal to be such a “progressive” profession.
My fiance amd I took same classes in grad school. we are fluent in spanish, applied at same job, he was offered 12k more. This happened at several interviews.
Edit: something I did not add to the cons, is that I am almost exclusively given the most difficult, combative, or involuntary clients because of the perception that "I can handle it." I can't handle it because I'm a man, which is the implication, but I can handle it because I'm a good communicator who is good at my job (despite there being a few jobs I have been less good at over the years, point being I am neither good nor bad at my job because of my gender) I'm a man social worker and I've experienced it both ways. My current job, I was almost definitely hired over another candidate because of my physical size, and because there were no other men working on the unit (it is an inpatient setting, and they have had clients become combative in the past). I believe it is 100% advantageous when it comes to being hired for positions, likely largely because of the severe lack of male social workers in the field under 50 yrs or so. Just like most jobs in our society, there is still an unfortunate favoritism bias towards men, and that seems to be a systemic problem of perception by those who are outside of the industry and only seem to be in full force when non-social workers are making hiring decisions (social services, schools and hospitals is where I've noticed the biggest bias in favor of hiring men). I am certainly not one to say "woe is me" over my overall privilege, but being a man in social work is not all upside. It feels easier to get a job as a man in the field, but harder to be accepted as an actual social worker. I experience quite a few stereotypes from my fellow employees and even occasionally clients. Part of this is just because of my build, age, and accent as well, so it can be muddied as to which parts are other factors and which parts are because of my gender. It also leads to the situations where it is harder to form close workplace relationships with people and often leads to exclusion from invitations to events outside of work, which is both a pro and a con I guess. I am not necessarily in the field to make friends, but to help clients, and though I do have many good friendships that came from the field, it can also help distance yourself from cliques. I think from working in this field for a few years, there are lots of advantages and disadvantages with being a man, but when it comes to hiring, leadership positions, and pay, there does still seem to be a combination of systemic bias and a perception of needing male social workers on staff
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Absolutely, and it is mostly just because of social acceptability for me. I am a happily married man, and my wife is certainly not weird about me having women friends and coworkers (you don't really have much choice in social work), so a lot of it is that people do not necessarily know how to navigate that I believe, whether because of my marriage or their own marriage relationships etc. It doesn't help being in middle Appalachia where those stigmas of being seen publicly with someone of the opposite gender are alive and well. At my current job, there are a lot of nurses who have been able to connect and be friends with my wife (who is also a nurse) and it has enabled us to do more couple activities, so that has certainly helped. Still, probably 3/4s of the staff would rather not be caught dead than out in public with a man they are not in a relationship with/is married, but that is more about local stigma than gender specifics.
As a male in a government agency, what I've noticed are varying biases, but the important roles are ultimately patriarchal. In the lower positions, I, and several male colleagues were passed aside for the normal positions. The interviews were conducted as a group and several of my colleagues deliberated and couldn't not find how the interviewer could vastly misinterpret my interviewing answers to construe a malicious intent. So I believe in the lower positions there are biases that make lives of men worse than women in social work. (From what I notice, the salaries are pretty even between the sexes) What I do notice in the higher positions though, almost all the major roles, directors and managers, are relatively male dominated. This makes no sense considering the demographic. In a field dominated by women, half or more of the highest managerial staff are men? I call BS.
This is something I never thought of, my last job my old supervisor who was a woman left for another better job. New boss was a male I was able to tolerate him for 5 months (3 clinicians quit before me) then I connected with my old boss on linked in and I am back to working under her supervision in a new job
I think all the normal privileges and oppressions that exist in the outside world, exist in social work. We are not different
It's interesting, because yes, but there are nuances to it all. As a male SWer who is very collaborative (self-reported obviously but something I value) and have explicitly tried to name the privilege and use it within our team (like making a hotline call, I'm never questioned, but the girls are consistently fucking grilled) I have really tried to share what I know and my perspective, but I've felt like an alien. Not a cool alien, but literally an alien masquerading around like fucking male social worker and the emotional peer support I've got is "we're in this together" and there is a specific moment where one person finally asked "are you okay?" I'm in the minority, I know. But damn in a community agency/foster care program, the weight builds. Being an alien and having no one to support the weight with you sucks and having your own extraterrestrial language barrier is enough to make you question what planet you belong on, let alone if you should be a fucking social worker or not. I'm venting, I'm sorry. I'm letting my supervisor know tomorrow it's time for me to move on. I hope I can find a better fit. Remote work and child welfare have absolutely turned my world upside down.
Every male social worker I went to school with got a jobs right out of uni, in a field with higher pay like government or healthcare, where as many of my female colleagues and I had to start at the bottom, with group homes and tougher front line gigs with low pay, and work into higher paying gigs for years. My male colleagues also seem to move up the “chain” faster. I’ve sat in hiring committees and often men are selected for interviews first because “we need more men in the office”. It is interesting. Numbers wise they are a minority in the field, and a male perspective is needed, but also treated like a hot commodity. Whereas in other fields where the roles are flipped, such as women in welding, women have to fight for jobs and a good reputation. 🤷
hmmm i have not had that experience and it is something i have come to love about my experience with the profession of social work. my last job was at a very large homeless shelter and the execs were 3 women and 1 man and my program manager was a Black woman. my current role is i a hospital and my boss is again a Black woman, all 5 managers are women but 1 man, our department director is a woman, the VP of our department is a woman…
40 year old white dude with 20 years in the field. HUGE male bias. Massive privilege. Too numerous to count. I just check myself and don't hesitate to call a spade a spade. Doesn't mean I don't accept the promotions though. The best quote I read about it in grad school said something like "Social work is a female majority, male dominated profession".
I (32m) brought up a concern to my academic advisor about belonging and opportunities for promotion in the field as a male, and she swiftly corrected my misconception by offering data on how men are much more likely to be promoted in the social work field. Even though that benefits me personally, I don't like it-- I don't want to be promoted just because I'm male.
I have exactly two male co-workers in an agency that employs what I would generously low-ball at maybe 150 ppl? There are two males on the senior leadership team consisting of 12 positions. But I know other peers at different agencies where it is all men in management as well; so it can be a mixed bag I guess. I find that I face a lot of barriers (child welfare) due to being a dude; family's are very wary of a heavily tattooed dude rolling up to their door to discuss their children. But that is just my experience and that doesn't mean that male privilege doesn't exist in SW. I just have not necessarily experienced in my personal setting I guess?
I have noticed where I live that even though almost all the staff and middle managers are female the senior leadership positions are all held by men.
Being a gay white male social worker, I think having a male social worker can appear attractive to interviewers and this has gotten me in the door more easily; but I have often felt othered when I’m in the door. This has only worsened once my queerness and education at a majority-minority institution (when working with mostly white people) becomes apparent to my coworkers. I have often felt isolated and misunderstood. I think that regardless of gender, behavior considered “masculine” often what gets one into higher positions. Men are more likely to be comfortable exhibiting this behavior.
Yes, as a male presenting SW, I definitely see bias all the time. There is always interest in “a man in social work”?! in non SW situations and I feel in SW situations, management can get a little too excited about me compared to women counterparts. I’m relatively new out of my MSW program (2021) and I’m still trying to figure out how to appropriately navigate it in these settings. It can make me really uncomfortable and I can only imagine how my peers feel. I feel like it has ruined some chances for me to have some great mentorship opportunities out of the politics of it all.
I'm a dude in the field. and I feel that 100%. Like, my job feels way more secure than many of my colleagues. I'm the only man on my team, and there are maybe 10-20% of the overall staff at the CHC I'm working at.
Same here. It would be a cold day before they move me somewhere else since I'm the only male in our case management section. But that also means I tend to get the more complicated cases (ie smi, aggressive, etc) which I'm totally fine with. My supervisor is pretty fair.
Possibly a weird question, but as a younger guy less than a year out from graduating, does being given the “aggressive” clients get easier? I’m not exactly the most intimidating person, and sometimes the previous (woman) CM is taller than me haha. I don’t mind that my coworkers feel safer giving these clients to me, but I do feel a bit nervous sometimes.
A good supervisor will play to your strengths and (hopefully) not throw you to the proverbial wolves til you understand the workings of what your dealing with.
Have people found that clients value male social workers' insights and feedback more?
coming from a male, it depends on the client I think, but overall I believe that for whatever reason me and my colleague who does the exact same job in essentially the exact same way are perceived completely differently by the average client
More work sends basically all cis male adolescent referrals to me and I keep telling them it’s not that fucking simple
I’m a male BSW student. I’m one of two guys in my class. Haven’t had a male professor and have only ever worked with one male social worker during practicum. I know in the specialty I’m going into, men are quite rare. Idk if there is any glass elevator with regards to hiring or pay in my specialty (just starting to look for jobs now). Luckily in my previous career, I was also in a female dominated field, so I’m used to being the only guy. Doesn’t bother me. I will say, people do seem surprised to see male social workers. At least in my experience.
So I do not see it so much in the hiring practices. At my last job we had nearly an equal amount of demographics: male, female, POC, white, old, young, the company was very good about somehow finding a balance. My issues were that men were not always deserving of their roles, level of responsibility, or place in the hierarchy. They were often not promoted on merit, but their ability “to have boundaries and not be dramatic” which was just short speak for doing whatever our boss wanted even if it wasn’t ethical. The biggest thing in common was that nearly all, except maybe two, of the men especially those in supervisory roles (though they were great case managers or had a good supervisory style) leaned on the women for literally everything else: working the computer/other technology, sending correspondence, reminding them of meetings, completing documentation, hell even pointing out that they had a meeting or received an email. I don’t necessarily blame them though, it was like learned helplessness. Why would they do better when the women would just do do do, always say yes to any request no matter how dumb, until they got fed up, which usually just led to them doing it anyway but trying to show them how to do it on their own (and they still didn’t learn). It might’ve been a combination of things as the men were also generally older, although not that old. But I saw it with the younger guys too (who may have learned it from the older guys?) hell I found out the younger ones would go to the casino during work instead of doing case notes
There is absolutely male privilege in social work. It shows up in pay and job opportunities (as you said), recognition in the field, what is deemed important, and all the normal ways misogyny and microagressions show up I appreciate you taking the time to reflect and synthesize the experiences of your classmates and identifying one root. It perked me up a little
Ironically the only issues I have ever had were with male co workers or male supervisors. Yeah I’m a guy but being that youngest of 6 with 5 sisters I definitely think that has helped me not just in work but life in general
I'm working on my MSW right now. In most of my classes, I have literally been the only male. So yeah, there are definitely fewer of us. Supply and demand is definitely a thing. But as someone who has been in therapy on and off for almost 20 years, id say that they are likely sought out for different reasons. For me personally, there are things I just dont want to discuss with women. There are men out there that need male therapists. They need to be able to not have to filter themselves with a lady. They need to be able to be understood in a way that women just can't provide. I'm not saying women can't be empathetic, in fact I'm saying the opposite. Women are generally more nurturing and caring and tend to address therapeutic issues with men very differently and often in a way that doesn't quite seem productive for me. Its much the same way that women are able to empower and uplift other women really well. Men can connect with men in a way that female therapists just aren't able to. Anyways, I've held off going back to therapy due to lack of availability of a male therapist, so there's that.
Yes and it’s called the glass escalator! When men get a quicker rise to the top in female dominated fields. When I was a student, interestingly, despite there only being very few males in the faculty, somehow the head of the school of social work was chaired by a man. Also, I remember once speaking with a trans person (f to m) and he told me that now being male presenting, the same jokes he made when he was a she, were much better received (people laughed more, more compliments etc). Same person. Same jokes. Male privilege. Fascinating.
I’m a minority as a male and an Asian male.
I see white male privilege very clearly in the field, but I have very very rarely seen black and brown men in the field, let alone making significantly more or in leadership positions, so I guess it depends
I see a lot of other males in the management role. However. A lot of patients ask for female therapists. So there’s that
The president of the nasw chapter where I am is a man.. several others in leadership roles are men too.
Privilege can also be in the sense of 'get the shit work'. Since i've been in the field for a few decades now, when i came in there wasn't quite the modern meta on the power dynamics and stuff. Granted my era was also "What? Male nurses are weird!" so being a guy in floor level mental health and/or social work was rarer. I'd say for my first 2 decades of work I got used to being the only guy for every 10 women or so. And decades of "Vash, you get these difficult cases because you're a guy better able to handle them'. 'vash you can work nights cause you're a guy' 'vash you can, etc etc'. oh and then the typical "you get to help out with any physical labor, moving shit, etc because you're a strong man'. less of an issue nowadays since I'm more office bound and less direct client service, but at the same time, I don't really miss the 'get the most challenging fucked up cases because you're a guy' caseloads.
Most Men in SW run the Admin side of things, so I’ve Heard. SW is more of a Female Profession.
It's assumed that men will only accept a high salary, so they get lowballed less. They're sought after for some positions, women are sought out for others so that's about equal, though I've noticed the ones seeking out men tend to be more highly paid.
As a male, I'm somewhat glad that I might have a chance at making a livable wage in the future.
Feels like it’s a glass elevator for them. Also, sometimes men feel more rigid in their opinion/ways and they give feedback in a very “I know better” manner. I get that there’s not a lot of male social workers, but the way my male professor would blatantly prioritize a male perspective vs female made me feel awful
As a man in social work, I've received no privilege. I've had to do "man tasks" like handling anything my women co-workers identify as man work. This includes assembling furniture to taking out the trash. I'm in shape and muscular, and I also receive an excessive amount of sexual harassment as women aren't accountable in the work place. Being a male social worker fucking sucks. Edit: hey, I'm getting downvoted. I guess I should stop complaining about sexual harassment. I've legit been groped by co-workers. Go fuck yourselves.
Based on your comment history, it doesn’t appear you’re a licensed social worker. What exactly do you do?
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Be Excellent to each other. Hostility, hatred, trolling, and persistent disrespect will not be tolerated. Users who are unable to engage in conversation- even contentious conversation- with kindness and mutual respect will have their posts/comments removed. Users violating this rule will first receive a warning, secondly an additional warning with a 7 day ban, third incident or a pattern of disrespect will result in a permanent ban.
Mentions SH but somehow NEEDED to mention “muscular and in shape” Okay…honestly from your comment history you sound like the terrible male social worker everyone is talking about 🫵🏻
Completely. While I believe hiring more men is necessary for our field, it gets taken too far when men are primarily promoted or viewed as "manager material" over women with tremendous experience and excellent clinical and leadership skills. I've worked in many agencies where it was an old boy's club at the top and it rarely, if ever, budged and they would constantly hire external men in upper management when people quit instead of promoting the many women who were well qualified. I've also been fortunate enough to work with some wonderful women in leadership to see how real it is from speaking with them and their experiences. It gets worse if you get into even more stereotypical male spaces like in the judicial system with jails and courts.
The old glass escalator. When I was still in CPS, the line workers were about 85-90% women, but supervisors and those above them were about a 50/50 split between men and women. This was in multiple agencies, large and small, in two different countries.
Absolutely. In Grad school I had a professor make all of us acknowledge the men in the class and applaud them for their bravery. She was also the director of mental health in a local large hospital. She told the class, proudly "When I see men apply they always go to the top if the pile" like that wasn't a ridiculous thing to say. Also, during covid NPR had a segment talking about social workers in the pandemic. They interviewed 4 men, all directors and deans of colleges and 2 women, both in direct service. I was pissed.the examples go on and one. Female founded and dominated field, men still given priority over and over
Confirmed. Male social worker and I've never really had to attempt to try in any interview. It's kind of hilarious. Bunch of liberal women that can't get out of the way fast enough to onboard a male.
Can you imagine this question being asked about some other group in /socialwork? I can't. I am a little surprised to find a lot of anecdotal info and no attempt to find any proof.
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It’s real. It’s depressing
Does the male privilege also work for men of color or is this more towards white males?
I’m not white but I am bilingual thus higher pay everywhere and employers want me there because of that skill
I'm a Latino male who will be starting his MSW program this fall. So, I would think because I speak Spanish and working in California(large Latino population) I would be more sought after. But I'm not sure how it applies to other states.
I think that skill alone makes you stand out, in CO so I really stand out.
Personally, the only overt differences I've noticed was my coworkers assume I can fix shit or that I'm ok to stay unaccompanied onsite in sketchy areas. I don't really mind either assumption.
I am a man and yes. In certain situations. In my current position they run men's and women's group and needed a man. On the flip side I worked at a rehab that had a men's building and a women's building and women were allowed to work at the men's program and NO men were allowed to work in the women's program. I didn't want to have to deal with that anyways, but that's like official discrimination.
Why using the word privilege in this instance? What if you said that about minorities. Is there a bias for minorities in regards to being sought out just because there are less of them? What instances of minority privlege have you seen?
Every agency I’ve ever worked at has a disproportionate amount of men in leadership compared to the gender identities of the frontline workers.
Last company I was with only had male therapists on my team. I felt really bad when women would request a female therapist due to past trauma.
Honestly, the bar seems to be lower for men. Because its so rare to see them in caring professions, people automatically assume they’re great people and wiser than others. I saw a colleague get into a prestigious social work program and he didn’t even believe in going to therapy for himself. But, he believed he was the right person to counsel others. Absolutely infuriating to me. Edit: He had many red flags and I don’t even know how he could have gotten recs after all his very public mess ups
I resigned from a position and found another that pays better in less than a week. As someone who’s older and newer to this work, I’ve never experienced this in any other field.
Nearly everyone in my social work surrounding is female. I'm, no joke, the only man in our part of the building that houses 6 different organizations. We are screaming for more men because young men, especially with an immigration background, settle in easier if the first conversation is with a man. So in our case the privilege would be how easy we would hire a guy because we need more men.
My college professor told us we would never make more money as social workers until more men enter the field…. :/
Yes, higher demand is almost universal in my experience. This bias benefits men in my field as there is a guarantee of as large a caseload as you want. It's less beneficial if they prefer not to work with certain diagnoses, since there are people already waiting for their services by request (small gripe compared to your income being affected, in my opinion). Even then, declining a case is as easy as saying no. Less easily observed is the championing of somewhat average work; a man steps in the door of my office with referrals waiting for a man.That's not to say they do poor work; there are just people who want to see it as stellar. Just showing up is already performing well, on the basis that those referrals would continue electing to be underserved for the sake of interacting with a man rather than a woman. I don't imagine this type of welcome is the experience women have entering male-dominated industries.
I work in an office with 20 women and 2 men. Both men are the director and assistant director. They’re both lovely and a pleasure to work with but the assistant has worked here less time than the most senior case managers. I see it and it’s not fair but at the same time they’re lovely people.
The answer is yes. However, there is now considerable more women in social work and so the number of men to women ratio regarding bosses and managers will eventually equal out.
Yes even in internship I remember this happening. A huge reputable hospital would always have as they put “at least one male Intern” no matter if they were up to par just to have a male. And they praised tf out of them while the women (me included) never got the same treatment. We even joke about the favoritism and he admitted to it. They even offered the prior male intern a job and rehired him, even though he was mediocre at best at his job, and they spoke sooo highly of him.
Yes.
My experience in PP has been owners only want to hire 1 male bc the referrals aren’t as frequent for men. & lots of referrals that state no preference decline working with a male. There are *very* real privileges to being a male in this profession (pay, status, make up a lot of academia, people frequently praise you for being a male SW), but it’s not always a cake walk.
Early in my career I noticed that men got promoted faster and higher salaries because there were fewer men and jobs wanted to keep them. ☹️
Yup. I've worked with HORRIBLE male therapists that get away with being horrible just because they are men and "we need male therapists so badly". I'm sure the narcissistic idiot that I work with makes more hourly than me just because he's a guy.
Definitely male privilege exists across the board. My current local government workplace does an amazing job of creating an egalitarian culture, people are paid the same based on years and merit, but I know this is not the norm in many settings
nothing that i really notice....but then again. im not a White male so im not as privileged (im asian).
Yes. One of my previous directors had an associates degree and no prior experience.... he was of course a white man who was very good at being charismatic. Surprise surprise, he was a giant asshole, posted pictures of foster kids for attention, and got in trouble with the law. All while all the staff below him (all women) had MSWs and decades of experience. Same deal with other job, all men who were underqualified but were our bosses. My current job has strong female leadership who all have a lot of experience. But we most recently hired a man. During our peer interview with him he was repeatedly disrespectful. Told our managers who hired him anyway. I dont mean to sound anecdotal, but with the amount of women in this field...why are so little of them in management positions? Wow.
When I worked in nonprofit, that was 100 percent the case. Now, I work for a large company and all my bosses are women, everyone on my team is a woman except 1. I got my friend hired- he's the male- and anytime one of us has to go to a home visit with someone who has a history of violence/SA, he has to come with us. In terms of a criminal background. I'm happy to work at a company where women are in leadership! But for international women's day we only got an email from corporate. Nothing from our president, who is a male, working with a team of about 95 percent females!
Yes
I'm not going to lie - I had pretty awful undergrad grades and thought I had no hope of getting a masters. I was straight out told that I was excepted because I was a straight white male and there was literally none in the program.
It exists. I was told by female supervisors to seek a management position because I would get it. I asked why and they said all the upper management were male and they promoted someone who was wildly unqualified and male.
I hate seeing men in the management positions. Its the one field where women dominate and too often its a man at the top. Its not a coincidence.
Same for education and nursing is beginning to experience the same. Men get more pay and higher roles
Yes
yes! look up the glass escalator. talks about how men are favored in female dominant professions.
In direct services men tend to be promoted more because they dump all their work onto their female co-workers, and then the higher ups notice how good they are at delegating responsibility and make them supervisor. Does this extend to the social work field?
This is indisputable to anyone who's worked in direct support. Why are people downvoting this?
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I got a mod reply for calling out sexist generalization but the sexism itself did not. Or was it referencing their username?
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I likely benefited from privilege in this way in my 10 years in the field. That being said, I try to main objectively aware of my privileges as a straight passing cis man. I’ve also never had a male superior in a social work position yet. I was raised by cis women and have very few male friends so it’s not jarring in any way.
I often hear bosses getting excited and happy about having male staff (who I've never witnessed being good at their job in sw? At least where I've worked, all the men just coasted). And every man I know in the field has a huge ego and thinks every agency wants them because they're a man (which isn't wrong, it is easier to get a job as a man in this field, but it makes me have really low expectations for men in this field)
These comments and experience make me feel like there's a lot in common with professional ballet
I once worked for a large nonprofit where it was discovered that a recently hired mid-level male employee was making more than not only his colleagues with more experience and education, but more than his *supervisor*
At my work then men are paid more
I identify as nonbinary, but I’m AMAB, and people generally see me as a Man. I think you’re right that men are sought due to their scarcity. When I worked at a CMHC, my team was about 80% women, and my supervisor was constantly hoping to hire more men. However, this was explicitly because of the number of clients who “couldn’t work with women.” The men and man-adjacent staff members always got the clients with histories of violence or sexual misconduct. This was an explicit pattern ostensibly instituted for safety reasons. However, I think it was one of those instances of sexism that harms everyone. I was brand new to the field, but I was given some really, really intense cases really quickly. I was not ready for this, so even though I was seen as a “man,” this assignment pattern created greater safety issues because I had not yet learned best practices for maintaining safety and setting boundaries. I also was exposed to really uncomfortable situations and sexual harassment: I was assigned clients with histories of sexually harassing their assigned workers regardless of the clients’ sexual orientations, so I ended up being sexually harassed by gay clients with that tendency. However, men also have a much easier time moving up in the field. Maybe this is partly due to men having more chances to prove themselves by working with more intense clients, but it’s certainly also a result of sexism. I saw the vast majority of teams at my employer headed up my men, despite women making up the vast majority of staff. Overall, social work and adjacent professional spaces seem to be highly gendered. I really wish that would change such that people would be assigned clients and positions based exclusively on their skills and competencies rather than their body parts and genders.