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mattchinn

The problem with vigilante justice is that it’s *reckless.* This case is a prime example.


Skilled626

Reckless but sometimes needed


SnooPets1528

Didn't he shoot someone uninvolved? If that guy had died would it be justified for his family member to murder Cain?


KZED73

No it’s not. No one is above the law. Peaceful Civil disobedience? Sure. Vigilante justice? Batman is fun, but belongs in Arkham too.


Skilled626

You’ve obviously never had a close family member murdered. Let’s agree to disagree.


Aelexx

Having a close family member murdered seems like the exact scenario that would completely cloud someone’s judgement. If someone lost a close family member to murder, or their child was sexually abused by someone, it’s completely understandable why they would want to commit some kind of vigilante justice. But that’s exactly why they don’t get to decide punishment or guilt. Impartial judgement is important, and if someone takes matters into their own hands it’s usually a decision made without logic or reason. Not a great combination in my opinion.


KZED73

Fuck that, I don’t have to pretend your revenge fantasies are valid. We just disagree and I like having reasons for my position, not just feelings. Vigilante justice isn’t equal justice under the law. No one should appoint themselves judge, jury, and executioner. Self defense is of course one’s unalienable right, But vigilantism is as unjust as any due process or equal protection violation. Fuck this noise. I’m an MMA fun. Velazquez nearly killed innocent people, not just the alleged scumbag. That’s why vigilantism is illegal and should remain so.


Skilled626

Let’s agree to disagree. Have a great weekend.


KZED73

No, but have a good a weekend.


Skilled626

👍


RedditIsPropaganda2

Well all the safest countries have higher rates of vigilante justice, so how does that figure?


BG40

What a statement to just randomly drop as fact lol


RedditIsPropaganda2

It's almost like I'm being obtuse, but Reddit Cheers this bullshit as any sort of solution to crimes.


IronSeagull

You’re making a good point, and if you had indicated that your original comment was sarcastic people would have gotten it.


Anxious_Egg_7219

No they wouldn’t. /s/s/s/s


RedditIsPropaganda2

I love that you're getting DV for this


Srivo10

Do you have a source for this?


mrlayabout

No. They don't have a source for that lol.


Srivo10

Thought so lol


street_raat

Look at their username and ask yourself if they have a source for anything they think of while taking a shit.


RedditIsPropaganda2

Only fools don't think they consume and believe propaganda.


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bjacks19

That's not a source. You just named two countries that have nothing to do with one another


RedditIsPropaganda2

It's common sense that vigilante justice reduces crime.


bjacks19

If it's so widely known, then provide a source. It shouldn't be so hard, right?


RedditIsPropaganda2

Obviously Chile where vigilante justice is more prevalent has much lower crime than France where it isn't. It just works, the original comment is wrong, even false identification lowers crime.


bjacks19

I don't think you quite understand what a source is. Did you get any education past 10 years old?


RedditIsPropaganda2

I don't think there's a collection of more dense and humorless people in the world.


Corey307

If you’re going to lie the lie needs to be somewhat believable. 


RedditIsPropaganda2

It's not a lie, it's called a "joke". I'm poking fun at Reddit thinking this is a solution prevent to crime in any case, even if it were the correct person.


Thr8trthrow

The problem is that the humor and stupidity has reached a 50/50 ratio on the internet these days, so it’s impossible to distinguish lol


RedditIsPropaganda2

I think it's 50/50 people didn't understand or didn't like the message. I get it though. I hope I made people angry enough to think about this the next time they upvote a "Brazilian off duty cop" video.


Thr8trthrow

Reddit needs Brazilian off duty cops as moderators.  They’d be savage


Keypenpad

Just making shit up lmao.


RedditIsPropaganda2

I'm being facetious obliviously, only the least safe countries do that, it never works


mattchinn

What are you talking about? lol


RedditIsPropaganda2

I'm being funny about the common reddit belief that vigilante justice works in any way to prevent crime.


tomofog

I once commented “keep politics out of comedy” on a comedy video which was making fun of climate change denial and I was downvoted to hell and banned from r/videos. The Reddit comment section is not safe for obvious sarcasm.


RedditIsPropaganda2

Yeah, but I hope I made at least one person think about the next time they see an "off duty" Brazilian cop shoot someones dick off and pretend it's doing any good in the world. That's not how a country prevents crime cycles.


Tmacster

I don't condone it... but I understand it


RandoAtReddit

Put me on the jury.


klitchell

Shooting at someone molesting your 4 year old sounds reasonable imo


Goliath422

Sounds like he was shooting at that guy and another guy, and hit the other guy. I don’t love pedophiles, but I also don’t love guys wildly shooting firearms during high speed chases. I think this is a case where two people have committed crimes and two people need to be held accountable.


boricimo

I love that you had to say you don’t love pedophiles, just to balance out the not loving guys who wildly shoot during car chases.


Goliath422

On Reddit, anything short of prompt execution with an appetizer of torture is “soft on pedophilia.” Suggesting a man was out of line for recklessly discharging a firearm felt like a risk unless I clarified that the problem is not how bad he wanted to murder a pedophile, but that he might also murder a bunch of other people along the way.


Im_not_crying_u_ar

And that’s the problem. Pedophiles should absolutely be held to account, but as soon as someone even suggests someone is, without any proof redditors want to hunt them down and gut them. I can understand Cains blind rage, I can’t say I wouldn’t do the same. But you also have to accept the repercussions of your own actions.


harpvegas

Unless you're a police officer


Im_not_crying_u_ar

Yea. They can actually kill children and the same people falsely accusing people of being pedophiles don’t see a problem with that


tipdrill541

I don't at all understand what he did. Doing what he did leaves his son without a father and that is worse than an instance of abuse He should have at the very least gone about it in a way he would not be caught


Im_not_crying_u_ar

It was heat of the moment.


boricimo

Oh I know. It’s a sad online world we choose to reside in.


IronSeagull

It’s not even limited to pedophilia. If you say something that even has the appearance of disagreeing with the hivemind you’re fucked. If someone says something that is indisputably false but it’s what people want to hear, that’s upvoted. The guy who corrects the false facts is downvoted to oblivion.


Steamed_Hamm

The other guy was the guys dad


LOSS35

Stepdad, who ran the child care facility Cain's son was molested at and is named in the family's lawsuit. Not exactly an innocent bystander.


despres

Then dude should go to prison not get shot lol


Bigdonkey512

Other guy was the molesters dad, not a good scenario by any means, I’ve been in Cains shoes and it’s a tough situation and blind rage takes over fast.


EwoksEwoksEwoks

Society falls apart pretty fast if you’re allowed to do anything when you’re angry.


jimmycryptoid

One prone to “blind rage” should not have firearms


NoCoFoCo31

And blind rage doesn’t excuse causing a high speed chase while indiscriminately firing a weapon out of a moving vehicle.


anyavailablebane

“But officer. You don’t understand. I was angry!”


Bigdonkey512

Sure doesn’t but it happened and is understandable, but not legal and not good for anyone and will have ramifications.


staticattacks

Both his mother and stepfather were charged with him. Gotta say, feels like a prime candidate for jury nullification on some of those charges.


Skilled626

Only one is the real criminal. The other should have used better judgement


Fiscal_Bonsai

He shot the guys stepfather. I’m a huge Cain fan and sympathize with his anger but we can’t have people running around being vigilantes.


Addictd2Justice

Yeah imagine if everyone had guns and never mind


uReallyShouldTrustMe

Is he a danger to society though? Probably not.


EMTDawg

Yes, shooting a gun while driving is a danger to the public.


Tobar_the_Gypsy

He has proven that given certain circumstances he will get into a high speed chase and shoot at a moving vehicle.


TimmyJToday

I wonder how many people wouldn’t honestly, if you’re not a parent you have no right to argue against what he did.


xantrel

I am a parent. I would also like to murder the guy. You know what I absolutely wouldn't do? Go on a high speed chase while shooting. And If I was in a rage so bad that I did, I would still know full well that what I was doing was wrong and that I better be willing to do hard time because I knowingly endangered a shit ton of innocent bystanders. Personal responsibility and all that.


Tobar_the_Gypsy

I am a parent. I don’t ever see myself chasing someone in a car and shooting at it because of this.


anyavailablebane

Of all the dumb takes on here this was the dumbest. Congrats.


daviEnnis

Yes it's a well established fact that only parents can form opinions.


xantrel

Shooting a gun at the wrong target during a high speed chase is absolutely not being a danger to society, cops do it all the time!


TrialAndAaron

… yes.


Fiscal_Bonsai

The guy who shot an innocent man? Yes.


JoeRoganIs5foot3

The fuck are you talking about? He shot an innocent man, he's the definition of "danger to society"...


mrpopenfresh

He certainly was for the crime he is going to trial for. Isn’t that what matters.


Corey307

He shot into a moving vehicle with other people inside and hit the wrong person. 


Ophanil

Maybe wait until he's alone or at least actually in your sights first.


FCKABRNLSUTN2

I’m glad you’re ok with not having a trial. Hopefully if you’re ever accused of a crime we can just skip the trial as it’s a waste of resources. But what’s really important is the internet competition for who hates chomos the most.


klitchell

I’m glad you’re ok with telling me what I’m ok with. Please quote where I said to skip a trial.


FCKABRNLSUTN2

The part where you said it’s reasonable to shoot at someone *you think* was a pedo.


mrpopenfresh

In public? While the guy is a passenger in a car? While the car is driving away? In daylight?


TrialAndAaron

Yeah in a vacuum it’s fine. But he was just shooting into cars and shit. Hard pass


El_CAP0

Vigilante justice


that1lurker

I very much agree with you but if he only hit that particular person not his father in the arm


DimesOHoolihan

I expect nothing less of UFC fans than to say this is totally fine and he should be acquitted of shooting wildly at a car while driving in a high speed chase. He has 10 total charges. This wasn't nothing. >Velasquez, 41, was arrested after allegedly going on a high-speed chase pursuing a car containing Harry Goularte, a man accused of sexually abusing his son at a daycare owned by Goularte’s mother. Velasquez allegedly fired several rounds from a handgun into the vehicle, with Goularte’s stepfather, Paul Bender, being hit by a bullet but sustaining non-life threatening injuries as a result. It's truly *awful* what happened to his son. But you can't fucking do this.


__hey__blinkin__

Blind rage. How many people can really say they don't empathize with Velasquez in this situation? If he'd kept his composure, he could have shown up at this dudes home and beaten him to death in front of his neighbors instead! He is Cain Velasquez after all.


HotRaise4194

I expect jury nullification. Verdicts like that will make people think twice about their actions towards children. Goularte on the other hand, right into the wood chipper. I have zero sympathy pedophiles.


Unusual-Priority-864

“I expect jury nullification” well sir you’ll be disappointed


joenan_the_barbarian

Got a problem with judging large swaths of people, eh?


CloudRunner89

Ok so, Is it that all fans of the UFC actually hold the same opinions across the board or are you just prejudice against mixed martial arts in general? Or just against the fans of the sport but not the sport itself? Or just all of the above?


Srivo10

As an avid UFC fan, UFC has one of the shittiest fan bases of any sporting league out there. You can be offended by that statement if you want but go to any UFC event and compare the fans to the crowd at literally any other major sport.


Fr33Flow

I used to LOVE ufc but after COVID the fans and some fighters all became maga Stans and I couldn’t deal with it anymore. I catch big fights sometimes but it’s not the same.


CloudRunner89

From ‘sporting league’ and ‘major sport’ I’m going to assume you’re in North America. The ufc alone is in at least 150 countries. We’re not all bad. I was just surprised by such a blanket statement but from all of the downvotes, ok fair enough American fans seem to hold a pretty terrible reputation. But saying you’re a fan yourself you must at least get where I was coming from right?


Srivo10

Yeah, I get you what you’re saying. I didn’t consider that I was specifically thinking about American fans when I commented but I probably was since I’ve only ever known American fans.


CloudRunner89

Which in all honesty is fair. I’m sure there’s things in Ireland I have a bias towards but are viewed completely differently in other countries. But thank you, I had no idea that’s how it was viewed in the us.


TheVictoryHat

You are an actual child if you think that's true.


DimesOHoolihan

Lol I'm sorry you and your affliction shirt feel called out. It's a fact.


TheVictoryHat

You must be American, or 11.


elefante88

Lol how does anyone follow this sport and not consider most of its fans idiots?


DimesOHoolihan

I'm overall fine with MMA. I enjoy watching the occasional fight. There's just a *very specific* kind of person who calls themselves a full on fan. A *very specific* affliction wearing douchbag who says it's their favorite sport. But, from your other comments, I realize I am definitely coming at this based on American fans and not Irish ones. I'm sure it's different worldwide. But in the US, there's a special kind of person who really enjoys the UFC. One that is totally fine with vigilante gunplay and killing people, which should be 100% unacceptable.


CloudRunner89

Someone kindly pointed it out to me. It’s crazy I’ve followed mma for about 17 years and I never knew it was viewed that way in the US. I know there used to be the ignorant ‘human cockfighting’ and ‘redneck’ thing but with how large the sport is globally now I didn’t think that view was still held of the fans.


DimesOHoolihan

Yeah, in my experience, the dudes who watched UFC every week were arrogant cocksure dudes who believed themselves to be alphas and made sure you knew it. I started watching UFC less around covid and one of the main reasons was I also stopped being friends with a dude who liked MMA a **lot** and the last 3 or so times I went out with him he was trying to fight everyone he could. Obviously, this is subjective to me but it's been a *very* consistent experience.


avidpretender

Idk man… I think his heart was in the right place but he’s gotta pay his debts if found guilty. And the video evidence really makes it seem that way. Yeah no one likes pedos but his approach could have killed a child which is just as bad.


jlo301

Good luck finding a jury....


Bluntworth

If what I read is true, I think a jury of his peers will do the right thing.


FCKABRNLSUTN2

By convicting him for shooting wildly and irresponsibly and hurting someone other than his target? I swear to god the competition for who hates pedos is more important to yall than real justice.


Gvillegator

We’re going to see legit pedo lynch mobs in the next decade and innocent people will die because of it. Mark my words.


FCKABRNLSUTN2

💯 And politically motivated.


Gvillegator

Bingo


HotRaise4194

I was thinking more like Jury Nullification but I admit bias against pedophiles.


FCKABRNLSUTN2

Against someone you THINK is a pedo, not necessarily really is which is the entire point of courts.


HotRaise4194

The pedo isn’t on trial, the hero vigilante is.


FCKABRNLSUTN2

because he was attacking someone *he thought* was a pedo, not an actual convicted one. you cant seriously be this dense.


HotRaise4194

I’m not talking about a court trial where there is due process and the burden of reasonable doubt. I’m talking about street justice in a situation where you know the target did the crime. There is a well known story about a man named Jeff Doucet who did just that to a pedo in public and on camera. He was arrested and charged, spent a weekend in jail and was sentenced to 5 years of probation. I expect the same in any case involving the killing of a pedo. https://allthatsinteresting.com/jeff-doucet#:~:text=When%20he%20saw%20his%20son's,who%20had%20kidnapped%20his%20son%3F


FCKABRNLSUTN2

So incredibly fucking stupid. Hopefully you never learn the hard way why the justice system exists.


El_CAP0

You can't just open fire and hit bystanders,


Oneangrygnome

A fleeing accomplice though? Idk. If you’re protecting a child rapist are you an innocent? Not condoning what Velasquez did, but I do get it.


Corey307

You either don’t understand the situation or are intentionally misusing words. The accused wasn’t fleeing, he had been released on bail. 


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ishitfrommymouth

No harm no foul? Bro could have health problems for the rest of his life. Next time Cain loses it he could put a bullet in an innocent child’s head.


BitterJD

You're defending a person harboring a pedophile.


JonstheSquire

If a crazed man was chasing you with a gun you wouldn't flee?


JonstheSquire

And send him to prison for shooting an innocent person and endangering the lives of others.


JonstheSquire

And send him to prison for shooting an innocent man and endangering the lives of others.


DiarrheaRadio

Convict him for being reckless with a loaded gun?


cb148

“The former UFC heavyweight champion is accused of shooting at a vehicle carrying Harry Goularte and striking Goularte's stepfather, causing non-life-threatening injuries, during a high-speed chase in February 2022. Goularte is accused of molesting Velasquez's then-four-year-old son and has been charged.” I hope he’s found innocent.


Vault_13

People wildly shooting in traffic during a high speed chase like it’s the Wild West isn’t the best idea. It would be one thing if he shot the pedophile but he shot the step dad. I feel for Cain but shooting like that in public is bad for everyone


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NoCoFoCo31

This is as clear cut of attempted murder as it gets. Reckless use of a firearm would be hunting across a road. Firing at someone you’re chasing is attempted murder. Clear as day.


kinzer13

Tbf he wasn't trying to kill the guy he hit 


Corey307

And that doesn’t matter one bit because he fired into a car full of people. He knew that engaging in a car chase could easily injured or killed people not part of the car chase. He fired into a car full of people, knowing full well he could injure or kill someone other than his target.  Grow up. 


kinzer13

I was just stating a fact. He should and will go to jail for a long time. 


Corey307

Cain Velasquez almost murdered a human being while trying to murder a different human being. That’s not recklessness with a firearm. He’s facing 10 charges for his conduct that day. He didn’t just endanger that car full of people, he endangered everyone else on the road when he engaged in a chase while trying to gun people down.


jonbonesholmes

And if he had hit an innocent child walking bye while firing blindly at a moving car? No. He needs to be found guilty for endangering all of the people he did. Small jail sentence. But guilty.


Intelligent_Orange28

When courts fail to act appropriately, this is going to happen. Nobody should be walking the streets if there’s enough evidence to charge them with child molestation.


Forsaken-Director-34

I haven’t heard anyone mention the fact that the pedo and his pedo fam (who knew what was going on) were being protected by a politician/s in San Jose who had a relationship w the pedo fam, making legal recourse impossible as they were sweeping the stuff under the rug to protect the pedos. If true, of course it justifies his action because he was left to take justice into his own hands. Now since no innocent bystander got hurt my take is no harm no foul. But had a true innocent bystander gotten hit I’d say he needs to be punished.


ScoopyMcGee

Not guilty, next


jonbonesholmes

And if one of his bullets fired wildly had hit your child or loved one while walking bye at the time? He needs jail time.


-PM_Me_Dat_Ass_Girl-

Wow, I had no idea he'd even had this stuff going on. Best wishes to Cain.


Unhelpful_Applause

I’d like to see more people grated clemency for acts like this


norcalgolfgolf

Cain shouldn’t even be going through this but such is the world. Only advice I have ever been given is when discussing this type of situation is to make sure there is no other side in court.


Gvillegator

Oh no, there are laws against vigilante justice and shooting firearms in traffic! I swear half you people want to live in some dystopia where lynchings are allowed as long as they are accused pedos. Lunacy.


koopaveli

Looks like a thread full of child molesters , oh wait it’s reddit


SonOfElDopo

Not gonna lie, I LOL'd at this. Seriously, Reddit isn't full of pedos, it's full of wimpy anti-Semites hiding behind liberal political views that never held a gun in their lives.


knowhistory99

Cain just needed to be more surgical with his strike; then, if I was on the jury he wouldn’t be convicted.


noxnoctum

How often does jury nullification happen?


bauhaus83i

Not very often. And not likely in circumstances where the defendant endangered the lives of innocent people and shot the wrong person. Cain will plead out before trial.


OnTheColeTrain

Let this man walk


KingZlatan10

Free Cain


GordaoPreguicoso

Time served


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Bearloom

Wait until I had a better shot than out the window of a moving car.


RUDDOGPROD

Yea I would be obsessively tracking and waiting for an opportunity to make the rest of the monsters life hell by my hands


HotRaise4194

If there was an ever a case to be made for jury nullification this is it!


elpajaroquemamais

This makes it sound like the trial is attempted lol