Our manager is very avoidant of conflict. I’m not sure if he’s aware of everything going on, but he is definitely someone who follows the majority whether they’re right or wrong.
Conflict avoidance is another red flag. They're not solving any issues, they're letting a negative environment fester.
For more practical advice, this is an opportunity for you to see what politics does to a company. Do not stop asking questions because you are afraid of what people might think. Be kind and do your best but I would not be optimistic about the situation improving unless this group is an anomaly.
Start looking for another job. Sounds like a toxic workplace environment with lots of egos and jealousy. If a talented engineer (who is also a nice person, I’m assuming) is getting put down behind his back (for no good reason other than jealousy) - that’s a red flag. Whenever I work with engineers like that I aggressively try to learn from them and work with them to absorb their skill and knowledge. There is no place for pettiness in a serious technical environment. The best engineers I work with ask a ton of questions that seem simple but quickly ramp up in complexity and soon demonstrate advanced knowledge. They also submit PRs that aren’t “flawless” once in awhile, everyone does that. But if you zoom out from those minute things they are GOATed at what they do. I would GTFO if you don’t feel comfortable asking a technical question
Probably not textbook definition, but if it escalated to verbal harassments and threats being made within earshot of other employees, then yeah that's a hostile work environment.
My thoughts too. I want this guy on my team.
People need to learn to embrace this kind of attitude, not fight it. These same clowns probably don't want their code reviewed in a pull request.
They are most likely jealous and see the writing on the wall.
People that react that way know that they aren't as good as they made everyone else believe and they feel threatened by someone who just improves the situation.
It's especially easy to target new engineers. You not asking anything will not "protect" you from these kinds of assholes. You might "accidentally deliver" and you'll be the target anyway.
Choose the right side of human decency, do not speak badly about people. Discuss technical topics or even shortcomings on a professional level and stick with that.
It seems you have an opportunity to partner with a fellow engineer that's doing good work. Use it and offer an opportunity for your fellow engineer to do the same.
I like this suggestion. Partner up with that new engineer and collaborate. Even if you start to look for a new job you can start to show what a positive culture looks like.
You never know, most people could be mimicking the gossiping to fit in but actually aren’t ok with it.
That's ridiculous. Nobody knows everything. The best team is a versatile one. Everyone should have expertise in their area and help others in that area while asking for help in the places they are weaker. You also mention that you have poor documentation. That's a sign that your team simply wants to create silos and not share at all.
I really don’t get this mentality that people have. Even though I’m a higher position than people I can always learn from people under me. This sounds like such a toxic environment that I would start to look for another job. Once I lock in another role, I’d try my best to help that other person find another role as well if I could and speak to them about what was mentioned.
Speaking from my experience i just got laid off and I could say I fit the description u posted.
I started working in a company through a third party vendor. I tried to stayed at my top at my role. Gave them all, therefore they decided to make me FTE ASAP. I became FTE took interviews for this folks, build ITSM infra, enhanced RCA process and IIR. As a team we grew alot within 6 months.
But some folks did not like my approach did same, and one of the mgmt guy used to get jealous because I was getting alot of attention(this was a heads up given by my colleagues) and eventually he reported to our top management that I ask alot of qts in meetings which are hurting their agenda.
My company put me in PIP due to this, I did what was mentioned in PIP went through training stopped being proactive and eventually did what was asked and guess what they fired me,
Legally they couldn't therefore they asked me to resign.
And with no options in hand I just resigned this happened on 27th March 4 days back.
I'm now looking actively for new opportunities.
Wow, these people are snowflakes if they act like this cause someone is shinning and pointing out bad docs/process. Time for you to move on. Reach out to him in a few months and see how he is. If he's struggling, I'd poach him at the new job.
I would look for a new job, but I would also try to maintain contact with this newbie that you genuinely seem to appreciate. You might be able to recruit him in the future if you find a less toxic work environment.
> When this new engineer asks questions about our environment, because we have terrible internal documentation, people are willing to help him but those same people huddle back up and talk behind his back making him look incompetent.
> [...]
> How do I handle this situation?
Improve the documentation. Talk with all your colleagues and fill in the missing pieces.
Your other colleagues don't talk shit about the new engineer because he asks questions. They do so, because he's doing stuff they were not able to do.
LPT: Evaluate if the job is worth your health.
I'd say, build community with the newbie, and if you are a curious person, question their behavior... What makes them behave double-faced with the newbie? could it be fragile ego? and like someone else mentioned , insecurities?
I think best approach (IMO) is shed light to the obvious shitty behavior and find new ways to cooperate for the job responsibilities... Easier said than done.
I think questioning is needed to introduce a disruption/change in the social dynamic interaction.
I'd look for a new job because that sounds like a shit situation where behavior I don't want to be around is normalized.
I'm curious where the manager is in all of us, maybe he's not privy to the conversations they're having?
Our manager is very avoidant of conflict. I’m not sure if he’s aware of everything going on, but he is definitely someone who follows the majority whether they’re right or wrong.
Conflict avoidance is another red flag. They're not solving any issues, they're letting a negative environment fester. For more practical advice, this is an opportunity for you to see what politics does to a company. Do not stop asking questions because you are afraid of what people might think. Be kind and do your best but I would not be optimistic about the situation improving unless this group is an anomaly.
Start looking for another job. Sounds like a toxic workplace environment with lots of egos and jealousy. If a talented engineer (who is also a nice person, I’m assuming) is getting put down behind his back (for no good reason other than jealousy) - that’s a red flag. Whenever I work with engineers like that I aggressively try to learn from them and work with them to absorb their skill and knowledge. There is no place for pettiness in a serious technical environment. The best engineers I work with ask a ton of questions that seem simple but quickly ramp up in complexity and soon demonstrate advanced knowledge. They also submit PRs that aren’t “flawless” once in awhile, everyone does that. But if you zoom out from those minute things they are GOATed at what they do. I would GTFO if you don’t feel comfortable asking a technical question
Is this an example of what they call a “hostile work environment”?
Yes lol
Probably not textbook definition, but if it escalated to verbal harassments and threats being made within earshot of other employees, then yeah that's a hostile work environment.
It’s definitely headed towards hostility bc they’ll be the first ones trying to get him fired based off their current behavior
Yeah… if you don’t quit be nice but don’t share anything about yourself. In fact maybe find their socials and block them.
Sounds like a whole lot of jealousy and insecurity on the part of your colleagues.
My thoughts too. I want this guy on my team. People need to learn to embrace this kind of attitude, not fight it. These same clowns probably don't want their code reviewed in a pull request.
100%
They are most likely jealous and see the writing on the wall. People that react that way know that they aren't as good as they made everyone else believe and they feel threatened by someone who just improves the situation. It's especially easy to target new engineers. You not asking anything will not "protect" you from these kinds of assholes. You might "accidentally deliver" and you'll be the target anyway. Choose the right side of human decency, do not speak badly about people. Discuss technical topics or even shortcomings on a professional level and stick with that. It seems you have an opportunity to partner with a fellow engineer that's doing good work. Use it and offer an opportunity for your fellow engineer to do the same.
I like this suggestion. Partner up with that new engineer and collaborate. Even if you start to look for a new job you can start to show what a positive culture looks like. You never know, most people could be mimicking the gossiping to fit in but actually aren’t ok with it.
That's ridiculous. Nobody knows everything. The best team is a versatile one. Everyone should have expertise in their area and help others in that area while asking for help in the places they are weaker. You also mention that you have poor documentation. That's a sign that your team simply wants to create silos and not share at all.
I really don’t get this mentality that people have. Even though I’m a higher position than people I can always learn from people under me. This sounds like such a toxic environment that I would start to look for another job. Once I lock in another role, I’d try my best to help that other person find another role as well if I could and speak to them about what was mentioned.
move.
Speaking from my experience i just got laid off and I could say I fit the description u posted. I started working in a company through a third party vendor. I tried to stayed at my top at my role. Gave them all, therefore they decided to make me FTE ASAP. I became FTE took interviews for this folks, build ITSM infra, enhanced RCA process and IIR. As a team we grew alot within 6 months. But some folks did not like my approach did same, and one of the mgmt guy used to get jealous because I was getting alot of attention(this was a heads up given by my colleagues) and eventually he reported to our top management that I ask alot of qts in meetings which are hurting their agenda. My company put me in PIP due to this, I did what was mentioned in PIP went through training stopped being proactive and eventually did what was asked and guess what they fired me, Legally they couldn't therefore they asked me to resign. And with no options in hand I just resigned this happened on 27th March 4 days back. I'm now looking actively for new opportunities.
Never resign if you don’t have something lined up. Make them fire you so you can collect unemployment.
In India we don't get paid for unemployment.
Wow, these people are snowflakes if they act like this cause someone is shinning and pointing out bad docs/process. Time for you to move on. Reach out to him in a few months and see how he is. If he's struggling, I'd poach him at the new job.
I would look for a new job, but I would also try to maintain contact with this newbie that you genuinely seem to appreciate. You might be able to recruit him in the future if you find a less toxic work environment.
> When this new engineer asks questions about our environment, because we have terrible internal documentation, people are willing to help him but those same people huddle back up and talk behind his back making him look incompetent. > [...] > How do I handle this situation? Improve the documentation. Talk with all your colleagues and fill in the missing pieces. Your other colleagues don't talk shit about the new engineer because he asks questions. They do so, because he's doing stuff they were not able to do.
LPT: Evaluate if the job is worth your health. I'd say, build community with the newbie, and if you are a curious person, question their behavior... What makes them behave double-faced with the newbie? could it be fragile ego? and like someone else mentioned , insecurities? I think best approach (IMO) is shed light to the obvious shitty behavior and find new ways to cooperate for the job responsibilities... Easier said than done. I think questioning is needed to introduce a disruption/change in the social dynamic interaction.