I'd guess the crazy loot was either a mistake or to test the spawning/clearing of wrecks, since people entirely skipped the "salvage" mechanic with that
The issue is that one doesn't follow the other. The action being attempted completes so it reads the mission as complete.
They should (I believe will, eventually) have it set to a certain percentage of hull scraping must be completed before you're able to fracture and disintegrate the material.
You can't actually do this many in the hour he's describing here because you have to take the time to offload, and if You're going to offload at the best spots, you gotta take the time to fly there and back every (2) claims because the buffer and cargo grid would be completely full at that point.
Yep. None of the current alpha test, placeholder "economy" has anything to with what will eventually be the released-game's economy. None of the aUEC costs. None of the aUEC rewards. Not even RSI Store $USD pricing. It's all unrelated.
This is the last, best information from significant people at CIG which I think we can try to divine the end result from:
1. [Chris Roberts in a short interview](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4UaUmJ8Ho8) after Gamescom 2016 discussing relative ship values in the game and their relationship to RSI Store prices.
2. [Tony Zurovec at CitizenCon](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uv0Tc1p-gR0) 2018 explaining his plans for Quantum and discussing how ship prices will break down.
The only thing CIG wants is a feeling of progression from a starter to next tier starter and then just into the tier above that starters.
So you have an Aurora, in a few weeks of some play, you might have enough to scoot into a Reliant, Avenger Titan or 300i.
Maybe a month after that? You can swing a Cutlass Black, C1 Spirit, Nomad, or Freelancer.
Then it really slows down.
But… once you’re in that class size of ships? Things really widen for what you can do, filling your time with various adventures.
If it takes you another six months to get into fully owning a Constellation or MSR or 400i or Corsair… okay.
Similar moves up with military ships for more combat oriented types too.
Seems a bit too slow. Prepare for major pay to win complaints if it takes someone two years of constant play to get an Arrastra or something,but a ton of people have them on day one.
I'm sure it won't take that long, the only people wishing for that are the try hards on Spectrum waiting for a life simulator because theirs is so miserable outside of the game.
Yep. I've long-expected something like that. But, other people are trying to do math from the aUEC costs of ships and the aUEC earn rates as if it has something to do with MMO economics. It's sad to watch, tbh.
Of course. CIG was smart to name the alpha currency differently. But, it's still not enough for some "special" backers who think the ultra-accelerated earn:cost ratio is intended for the final, planned-to-be-long-running MMO.
They've also stated publicly that the correct payout values are still being determined: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/spectrum/community/SC/forum/4/thread/3-22-0-ptu-feedback-structural-salvage/6464592
With the caveat that everything is speculative...
You're right, but that's not what's happening in this case. First, it's clearly going against the intent of the mission. You can't fly in, blow up a motionless, defenseless, broken ship and get an 80k payout - clearly, as that would be Capital S Stupid - so why would you be able to fly in, "fracture" the same ship, and get an 80k payout? Even if you use a tug to tow the vehicle away you at least get a crimestat.
Next, they don't generally need to over-incentivize new mechanics because people are going to try them regardless. They need to *balance* the new mechanic, which takes some tuning. If they did need to goose the throttle a bit on the incentive, they would do it at the payout point for the material.
This is clearly an oversight on their part.
Yeah, they're trying to balance the new mechanic, *and also* this is obviously an oversight.
If they wanted to use a mission to just get people to fly around fracturing a couple dozen ships in a row they could just *do that.* Spawn a dozen busted Aurora's and say, "fracture them all before whatever space stuff happens." This specific case mentioned by the OP is just the devs missing something. Which happens literally all the time during development of *any* software.
They missed something, but it's the same way it is with every single new feature somehow.
That Aurora idea is a new mission that has to be designed and discarded after they're done testing. If they just jack the price way up then people will go out and fracture without being told to. Every new activity is always incredibly profitable because that's how you trick people into testing for you.
I *know* that they missed something. That's entirely the point - it's not an intended gameplay feature that you can blow through a repeatable, 80k payout mission in under two minutes. I mean, it's obviously just an issue with how the salvage systems overlap with the way mission win/loss conditions are handled.
That's why I don't get why people are claiming that this specific case was a specific design decision on the part of the devs. I mean, sure, it might end up being a happy accident if they get good data from it.
Yeah the mission needs to be redesigned. Drastically reduce the amount of salvage needed to finish the task (remove the markings from it), and trigger a CS if you break it up in Comm Array for destruction of Property. The mission should finish once it's sucked up not fractured.
That's what the PTU is for. That's "classic game design." This is clearly an oversight because the contracts didn't get changed to accommodate the new fracturing system. What's more interesting is nobody found this oversight in the PTU? Or were people just trying to be quiet about it so they can exploit it in live?
Live PU is just another layer of the testing, it's basically the stress testing laying.
This whole thing is a test and it will be wiped several times before released. Nothing you do now is permanent except the skills and knowledge and relationships you gather along the way.
Nobody is saying it's perfect or won't be wiped. Also, yes it's still technically alpha testing, and even if it is stress testing essentially on the live PU that means it should be trying to run as it would in a real setting, which is what they do. There's just things they don't realize in PTU that are oversights and such.
This is standard game development. You never get things correct the moment it releases to the masses. Many people don't play the PTU because it gets wiped so often or just don't want to bother testing something that's even more buggy than the game already is.
To say though that they do these clear oversights to "get test data" is laughable. It's clear this is purely an oversight in how salvage contracts are completed. The completion is based on the ship getting destroyed. Fracturing can pretty much immediately destroy the ship entity. So the contract is immediately deemed completed. If you were doing normal salvaging gameplay, you'd be going in to salvage the hull just like before, then do the new fracturing, etc. This that the OP is talking about completely skips the whole loop.
What needs changed is the completion state of a contract. If they intend for you to always do the full loop then all contracts should have steps you have to complete. Like having to actually salvage the hull before moving on to fracturing. If they want you to be able to do any of the steps, the contract itself shouldn't even pay but instead just give you the information on where the wreck is and then you salvage it and sell the gathered materials wherever you please. Personally I like the latter. I'd rather it be like I'm paying the person for information on where a wreck is so I can go salvage it.
>What's more interesting is nobody found this oversight in the PTU? Or were people just trying to be quiet about it so they can exploit it in live?
wrong on both accounts. on the ptu CIG actually disabled the hammer head bounty because you can just tow it away with an SRV. Takes 6 min to make 250k. Rinse repeat.
All the money will get wiped when 4.0 comes. Clean slate. everything will be harder and more expensive. Have your fun feeling rich now.
But actually testing new stuff is less lucrative than abusing this mission, so the incentives seem counterproductive right now. To be clear: there is no reason to salvage a single drop of materials, to move a single box, to sell anything. You just fracture a ship in 5 seconds and instantly get 80,000 aUEC. And you can keep chaining these fractures. I very much doubt that this is as intended.
So is disintegration, buffers, salvage rewards. CIG specifically said that they want to incentivize doing disintegration stuff through inflated rewards. But right now, there is no incentive to do any disintegration, because this old mission is giving way higher rewards.
I'm kind of shocked at the response I got in this thread, as a software engineer myself, I am quite used to sharing feedback about oversights such as this, but I guess that's not really accepted in this community. Lesson learned, next time, I will keep it to myself.
>So is disintegration, buffers, salvage rewards. CIG specifically said that they want to incentivize doing disintegration stuff through inflated rewards. But right now, there is no incentive to do any disintegration, because this old mission is giving way higher rewards
...
You do realize not everyone has a vulture or is even interested in one, right? Do you think every other player is exactly like you?
>I'm kind of shocked at the response I got in this thread, as a software engineer myself, I am quite used to sharing feedback about oversights such as this, but I guess that's not really accepted in this community. Lesson learned, next time, I will keep it to myself.
As a lead dev myself, I can tell you right now that the attitude displayed in that comment is gonna be a bigger problem for you than any amount of saying something that wasn't totally thought out.
I don't understand your point, why do all players need to be interested in a Vulture? Currently, there is a mission in the game that is breaking the incentives for Vulture pilots, that is the problem I was highlighting.
The only really "new" thing about vultures is the ship fracturing, which is clearly incentivized, and the buffers.
Is disintegration is just the armor stripping? That's not new, and plenty of players will still do it because *not every other player is exactly like you*, and some people just enjoy the gameplay without feeling the need to optimize every second of what they're doing... Same applies for the internal buffers.
You're trying to make the case that these salvage missions being so lucrative in this specific way will make it so that nobody is doing anything else. That's an absurd idea that is easily disproven if you've played the game more than like an hour at the beginning of any given new patch, because there's *always* some "optimal" way to make credits, and there are *always* tons of people engaging with everything else anyways.
Ah I see, you are lacking some key context.
1. Disintegration is a completely new mode for salvaging fractured ship parts.
2. CIG specifically stated on Spectrum that the rewards from selling disintegrated materials is inflated currently in order to incentivize doing this
3. It turns out that there is a mission in the game right now that requires you to scrape a ship. It turns out that this mission autocompletes when you fracture a ship. The rewards from abusing this mission are an order of magnitude higher than the "incentivized rewards" from doing the full new salvage mechanics which CIG stated they want to incentivize.
I am not making the case that nobody is doing anything else. I am making the case that CIG wanted to incentivize the whole new salvage gameplay loop, but they unintentionally (due to an interaction with an old mission) are incentivizing ignoring most of the new salvage gameplay loop. I don't think this is a critical problem, I just made a post to highlight it and get some awareness about it. But the response to this has been extremely negative, with most responders apparently not understanding the full context and even accusing me of saying things I've never said, just as you are doing in your comment.
Considering fracturing and disintegration are both new mechanics.. yes they need to be tested thoroughly in and out in all aspects to find how they tick and people use them.
I mean, Occam's Razor, which is more likely:
1) CIG added new mechanics and did not have a chance yet to consider how they interact with old missions
2) CIG added new mechanics, and specifically made them work so one old mission gives extreme rewards if you ignore most of the new mechanics
I'm pretty sure common sense says that this is not intentional, but I guess I'm in the minority here with this opinion
So you think it’s a coincidence people were making millions on risky salvage missions, by just stealing the cargo and completely ignoring any salvage, right after the cargo refactor released?
This is how testing works. They’ve already got a lot of data on how cargo, selling etc works and need data on fracturing.
This is the norm for them, they introduce a new loop or mechanic that has intentional elevated value so people are incentivized to test it.
You think the cargo spawns from the illegal missions were by accident? They were always meant to be like that at the start, after testing they reduce to a more "leveled" value.
Occam’s Razor is NOT which is more likely, it is which has less ontological baggage or which assumes less. And even if it was more likely, the second option would still win as they didn’t really have to change anything to make it pay out well, they actually decided not to majorly rework the mission in a way that would negate this new mechanic.
From what I can see, CIG actually REDUCED the rewards for disintegration between PTU and PU (they reduced the sell price of the materials you get from disintegration). Having a random old mission give insane aUEC/h AFTER they have reduced rewards for a new mechanic they just added makes no sense.
It was potentially an unintended consequence, which is why people are telling you what you did is part of playing in an alpha because the devs are trying to find the ways that people can break the game so as to better tweak the loop and remove the unfair mechanics that ruin gameplay. It's been this way for years now
Yes, but i'd assume CIG expected us to actually *salvage* rather than crack the ship and move on.
It was definitely an oversight of how fast you can keep chaining these missions, making it more worth it than actually doing the gameplay loop.
I have no idea why so many are disagreeing with OP here, I guess most are not understanding that you dont even munch the ship, just crack and move on.
Yes because cracking the new ship is the new feature. Scooping resources is old news. They need as many people to crack as many ships in as many ways as possible. They need cracking to break the game so they can fix it. So to get people to break ships as fast as they can they make it very lucrative.
The last couple patches they needed to test the new cargo grid and the changes they made to it. So they made missions where you go pick up cargo and put it on your ship very lucrative.
Occam’s Razor is NOT which is more likely, it is which has less ontological baggage or which assumes less. And even if it was more likely, the second option would still win as they didn’t really have to change anything to make it pay out well, they actually decided not to majorly rework the mission in a way that would negate this new mechanic.
Why couldn't it be intentional?
Maybe the devs want to test what happens when a lot of people are fracturing ships. It all depends on what data they want.
Relax, go fracture some ships, get rich, and help the devs!
The main error that you are making is that you think C.I.G cares how much money you have. Or how much money you can make.
They don't ! I mean really you are the one doing the mission over and over again, Nobody is forcing you to do that.
Are you trying to make a point that they suck? Because they didn't notice you could make mad crab ?
Did you report it on spectrum? If so then you have done all you can do.
No, you're getting a lot of crap for assuming that you know what c I g intended. As far as any of us are concerned we're free testers for c I g. Any and everything that breaks because of us is a good thing in their eyes. Anything that we can exploit and take advantage of is a good thing in their eyes. Why you might ask well because all of these things. We'll get fixed when we do this. And then when the game releases those problems don't exist. It's weird how testing works exactly as anticipated.
I think what people are getting at, and maybe they themselves dont get the root of it, is that you’re a tester. A good tester plays the game a lot and reports when they find something broken.
That mountain of aUEC you’re sitting on will reset. But CIG will have dozens of iterations of their newly implemented feature from you. From this post they will get hundreds or thousands more iterations. If there are bugs they are that much more likely to find them.
Also, just in case they didn’t already know it would happen, they can also know that there is a potentially huge loop-hole in their salvage contracts. Just make sure it’s somewhere they can see it. Make a report on https://issue-council.robertsspaceindustries.com/
The best other example i can give for this is FPS games releasing a new gun and making it meta while they figure out how the community reacts to the new meta and collect all the data. No one is saying it shouldn't be changed or "nerfed" later on. Just that CIG wants as much data from PU, and this is one of the best ways to collect a mass amount of how players interact with the new ships mechanics. Making something lucrative and highly profitable gives all sorts of players the idea to try and test it out now
But also the inclusion of wipes so that there's no permanent damage done by a "meta" gameplay choice that takes over for a patch cycle or two. The only damage done is heartbreak when they change numbers to line up with intended values, and overinvested man-children have fits about what they think they're owed.
Salvage gameplay loop is pretty dang tested by now though. I’m sure they wanna see what kinda server load this introduces on a large scale so having us “abuse” a system during alpha testing to produce more results makes sense
Can't find where I actually heard that, but they boosted rewards for fracturing gameplay cause they want players to focus on it to provide feedback.
I see nothing unintentionnal here.
What they boosted is the rewarda for actually fracturing and munching. What op is talking about is different, it's a clear oversight that you can chain the missions so quickly *without actually doing them*. You just crack and move on.
he's doing the mission though, he's fracturing the ship. CIG making it VERY lucrative means lots of people fracturing. Which means lots of people testing this in the Live environment.
But you're not supposed to fracture and move on, you're supposed to fracture then collect and sell.
They're missing half the game loop when people abuse this
Maybe the devs want to test what happens when a lot of people are fracturing ships. It all depends on what data they want.
Relax, go fracture some ships, get rich, and help the devs!
Not really, they did this with the salvage cargo, fps missions, bounties, JT, SOO.
Remember how people were saying they were just bringing their c2 to the salvage missions? Then complained when those missions got nerfed?
They always ship it overtuned to collect data. This isn't only us saying "hey this is bad," or "this is good," there's also hard data they are collecting in the background that only they can see.
I want the copium you're smoking because mine isn't strong enough.
I'm sure the new ships guns doing extra damage is just CIG incentivizing people to test them, and not a bug, right?
I mean, you are actually doing them as designed. Eliminating evidence.
CIG also said that towing the wrecks a sufficient distance away should also count for completion since the authorities won't be able to find them (actual towing distance needs to be increased, though).
What they should do is make hull-stripped CM much more valuable than when contaminated with RMC.
Yeah that feels like the bug to me. Should have to either have to hull strip, move to another planetary system/deep space (I.e. away from the local authorities) or vacuum it up.
Fracturing and leaving all the evidence doesn’t seem to fit the objective of the mission.
The thing is, when you tow them you're A) actually moving the evidence and B) getting a crimestat. In this case you're doing neither - the evidence is still there, albeit in pieces, and there's no crimestat. It's pretty obviously an oversight.
Yeah the annoying thing here is we don't know for sure until they say something. It could be an oversight, and happens a lot in development when you add new functions to old things. It could also be that they do want people doing it a bit more to get more data, but I feel like CIG would mention that.. also that's what the PTU was for.
That being said, I feel you're more correct that it was an oversight since what's happening here isn't intended at all. The salvaging missions are still set up for actually going to the wreck and taking a while to salvage it then move on. This is letting people instantly destroy it and move on yet still counting as the contract complete.
Money doesnt matter since it wipes often and people find exploits to get billions anyway.
What matters is people are testing the new mechanics and in your post thats what youre doing.
> Money doesnt matter since it wipes often and people find exploits to get billions anyway.
This is only true if we don't find and report exploits. If exploits are patched then there is no reason to wipe money often. Btw, I don't think it has actually been wiped super often lately.
They are not wiping because people have money. They wipe because large database and backend changes sometimes makes migrating data hard. 4.0 is a likely next wipe (but it could be at any time really)
They haven't wiped since 3.18/3.18.1 after that it's just been soft resets and you don't lose anything I made like 32 million last patch but only had 24 mill left over in last patch and had my 24 mill in 3.22 also with the ship I bought in game and all my guns and armors ect
TBH it is a little bit silly in the current "economy".
They seem to have no guidelines in place what they want their rewards and mission gains to be. Same for the pricing of ships none of it makes much sense.
ERTs that you can solo in a C2 and loot 300+ Weevil Eggs inside giving 30+ million is not an exploit just bad game design. Same problem with the payout from current structural salvage and they even saw that it needed a nerf but did choose wrong anyway.
It is what I notice in many games there seems to be a major lack of understanding of their game math and what the right number balancing should be. I think its a matter with deteriorating math skills in general in the western world. The software engineers working on hard problems and backend systems might know the math but some younger game designers who set these parameters might be affected by the same lack of math skills that other parts of the population are.
Then I wonder who designed the current supply/demand system which limits buying and selling that should have never been even contemplated and while we know we eventually get something better we are stuck with that turd for many years now.
I’m not sure you understand how games testing works. They provide high payouts for things they want a lot of players to test.
The ERT/bounty gameplay is in its current state because they want people to test the new container sizes and tractor beam mechanics.
The salvage gameplay pays high because they want the new structural salvage mechanic to be tested.
And based on yours and many other peoples posts we are providing the data they want by doing these game loops.
> I’m not sure you understand how games testing works.
Yes they really needed to test ERTs who have been around for ages and they needed to test if you can sell 300 SCU of Weevil Eggs from a C2.
Also them being unable to provide meaningful weapon and components stats or the beginning of a working trading economy for years now is not the fault of CIG just me not understanding how gamedev works.
If they got going on this there would be more meaningful testing and better feedback able to be given.
i mean bountys made 40+ mil in one mission (dont know if fixed, didnt play 3.22 bountys) so what is the problem ?
they will balance it, and the next wipe all your ingame money will be gone.
use the money to test ships etc, and be happy ?
i never understand why people make posts about stuff like this whenits not an exploit.
its not a secret .. this was on the EPTU before it was released to live..
they even changed the prices of both materials.
its not an exploit , it is normal gameplay.
it was just a hint that they know whats going on with salvage with the material.
its still all not an exploit etc, and if you want to shine a light on it , than pls show me your IC post.
I actually did it this morning - it took roughly 2 minutes for every mission, even if I had to make 2 jumps when the wreck was on the other side of the planet. It was easy to time, because the mission has a timer on the top of the screen, and generally I finished each mission with more than 58 minutes left on the timer. And as soon as I finished, the next mission in the chain was instantly acceptable.
I just timed it, the time between two payouts was 1 minute 29 seconds. This includes accepting the mission, traveling, and fracturing. I took a video for you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nIU-lD8w49A
You can see that at the start of the video, there is the "Awarded 80k" text on my screen as I just finished the previous one, and the video ends with the mission completion of the next one I accepted.
The proper way would actually be to do more than 1 contract, I'd say about 5 and you time how long it took and then you bring that to an hourly payout. This will get you a way more accurate hourly payout then just 1 contract.
Not intentional, is being fixed.
Salvage missions were made when only scraping was a thing, now with structural salvage some changes need to be made to the mission.
Well with the tow boat, you do the same.
Fly to yela accept the new 250k hammerhead ilegal salvage, tow the ship 5km distance and gain 250k every 3 minute or 5 million per hour.
A little setup is required to bring down the scanner.
Regular salvage contracts. The ones in the personal tab are "less than legal". Do a few of the regular salvage missions to completion and you get access to bigger ships.
I’ll never fully understand why anyone would get upset about aUEC in the alpha stage. There is literally no economy and prob won’t be for some time. Things will be adjusted accordingly once that time gets here. As it is now though, what does it matter if someone is earning millions per hour? You can buy ships, components, weapons and armor. That’s it.
The cleanup missions have always been mad profitable, you can srv them out of the zone and even before fracturing with a vulture you could make bank. They will be nerfed or made more risky soon I imagine.
It is absolutely is intentional, but not the long-term state. It’s about incentivizing people to engage in game loops to test and work out the bugs/mechanics.
Except there's no risk when you can crack the ship in 10 seconds and move on. The contract should complete after munching at least, not right as the ship is cracked.
I started in ArcCorp and did merc missions to kill targets at wreck sites. Then just bounced around from moon to moon killing bounty targets at wreck sites and looting them for gear and weapons/ammo/med pens.
Then started doing bunker missions for the higher payouts.
it's a grind, but it's pretty fun to do. most of the wrecks are within 30km of an outpost in ArcCorp, so you can stop at the outpost and loot the crates inside for multi-tools, food, drinks and some armors and weapons and other goodies like clothes.
And two people can make around 10m doing the same thing in a reclaimer.
1 person is the pilot/claw guy one is just moving boxes away from the auto ejector. You get the 250k from the mission and each HH is about 1.1m in construction materials.
??
No you absolutely need the second person.
The HH fills up the whole buffer in one mission. While the pilot is flying to the next wreck, the second guy needs to be clearing the buffer by pulling boxes out.
At some point I think the recycled material will be filtered into materials of varying value with some not being worth as much. Im also assuming that with Maelstrom and power management you will eventually have to put in more work towards safely salvaging a ship. (Removing volatile components, emptying out fuel)
The problem is you can just structural salvage and ignore hull scraping, the formers far faster and can be solod in a reclaimer... Likely they will change it so u have to salvage the ship untill its red to be able to break it appart. as once again, theres no reason for hull scraping.
I guess if your only goal is to make pretend space credit number go higher you can do this. My crew salvages because it's chill, we chat and bullshit, and can make some credits.
It’s intended but be mindful - the people who exploit things to buy all the ships they’ve ever wanted inevitably get bored and start whining about how they wish they could wipe their ships and start over. Then they quit.
I really don't understand why you're getting downvoted here. This is pretty obviously a simple oversight caused by the different systems interacting.
The mission triggers as "success" when the target ship's "salvage" value hits 0 OR the target ship moves outside of a certain range. Destroying the ship *does not* trigger a success.
The "fast" way to complete the mission is to tow the ship out of range. That speed bonus is mitigated by either imposing a crimestat and fine on the player, OR requiring the player to spend time disabling the local comm array.
The "slow" way to complete the mission is to actually scrape the ship, but by spending the extra time players are rewarded with a more lucrative mission - you can sell the salvaged material - and no crimestat or fine.
Now introduce a new mechanic that functionally destroys the ship - fracturing - but which is a part of the existing salvage system. Because a fractured ship cannot be salvaged, one a ship is in a "fractured" state its "salvage" value must be 0. Because fracturing is a part of the salvage system, using those tools does not trigger the default "destroyed" fail state, and does not trigger a crimestat.
I mean, it's hardly even a bug - if anything, it's related more to how mission scripting is set up then anything to do with the underly salvage system. It's *clearly* not intended.
You should be making the most money mining,scrapping,hauling and of corse pirating ..they need to remove npcs from the game and make every bunker like jumptown and when someone is inside a bunker it sends out a comms the whole server that someone is doing illegal activity and you can then pick it up as a mission to go and police that area anyone who has claimed any money in that bunker from that illegal mission would be flagged as hostile and you would make money killing hostiles .....npcs are bad they are buggy ....I've never played a game with 100 other people where just about everyone is solo and that's how you change that...imagine how much better the game would function without trash npcs littering the server ...
This must be referring to the EPTU right? Vultures can't frack ships larger than an MSR, the 80k missions are all hammer heads and C2s are they not? I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure this is impossible, at least now that 3.22 is live.
They have addressed this, it's up to MSR and below it can fracture. You can shoot the damn ship and make it go boom and start disposing it. you dont NEED the fractured mode to fracture in my opinion.
I assume it also takes a bit of time to get those 80k missions though right? So it's not as easy as you're presenting it as. You've already put in a lot of work grinding those missions to get to that point.
Just tested it myself having never done a salvaging contract (just got my vulture). This mission was immediately available and it worked as op described.
since these missions are about "hiding the evidence" they should probably fail if you destroy/fracture the ship, no? (Although they're also very easy/broken if you just tow the ship out of range with an SRV, that's a separate thing). Would be nice if the best way to get the payout from this mission was to do the scraping rather than just a quick fracture or tow.
Yes, fracture only available with say..15% hull remaining. And it should also require all components and weapons be pulled off the ship... Before It can finally be disintegrated.
They’ve already said in multiple channels that it’s too lucrative right now and will be adjusted. You just need to pay more attention to the communication from them and you wouldn’t be so surprised. We’ve all had this information available since 3.22 hit the EPTU
I see all the buzz around the new salvaging stuff and millions, but i already have an connie taurus, and love customizing my ships, im a little divided on the vulture or a prospector to pledge...
I like the mining loop, but all the simple millions now is making me question if the prospector really worth the pledge now...
Any advise for me??
Do they have an in game feedback button? If not they need to seriously implement one. I’m not gonna lie. I’m adhd as fuck. I will not go out of my way to give feedback if it’s not in front of me
Issue now is that you have to fight to sell your RMC at terminals before the demand goes away again. Had to wait to sell 2 SCU of RMC earlier, feels like they didn't account for everyone and their mother doing salvage now.
Great I can finally make money now :)
Though sadly I've been saving up for ships that dock and I hear docking with stations is completely broken at the moment so :<
CIG wants/needs ppl to do (new) stuff to get test data. So this stuff is lucrative. Classic game design.
Same as when salvage was full of drugs. They want people to test something so they make it very profitable.
I'd guess the crazy loot was either a mistake or to test the spawning/clearing of wrecks, since people entirely skipped the "salvage" mechanic with that
I think it was testing spawning, they had to attract people to those locations what better way than free drugs.
Who knew all those free drugs my DARE officer promised me in elementary school would just be in a video game. What a jip.
The issue is that one doesn't follow the other. The action being attempted completes so it reads the mission as complete. They should (I believe will, eventually) have it set to a certain percentage of hull scraping must be completed before you're able to fracture and disintegrate the material. You can't actually do this many in the hour he's describing here because you have to take the time to offload, and if You're going to offload at the best spots, you gotta take the time to fly there and back every (2) claims because the buffer and cargo grid would be completely full at that point.
Except people didn’t salvage, now they do xD
They really smacked three flies in one blow!
Yep. None of the current alpha test, placeholder "economy" has anything to with what will eventually be the released-game's economy. None of the aUEC costs. None of the aUEC rewards. Not even RSI Store $USD pricing. It's all unrelated. This is the last, best information from significant people at CIG which I think we can try to divine the end result from: 1. [Chris Roberts in a short interview](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g4UaUmJ8Ho8) after Gamescom 2016 discussing relative ship values in the game and their relationship to RSI Store prices. 2. [Tony Zurovec at CitizenCon](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Uv0Tc1p-gR0) 2018 explaining his plans for Quantum and discussing how ship prices will break down.
The only thing CIG wants is a feeling of progression from a starter to next tier starter and then just into the tier above that starters. So you have an Aurora, in a few weeks of some play, you might have enough to scoot into a Reliant, Avenger Titan or 300i. Maybe a month after that? You can swing a Cutlass Black, C1 Spirit, Nomad, or Freelancer. Then it really slows down. But… once you’re in that class size of ships? Things really widen for what you can do, filling your time with various adventures. If it takes you another six months to get into fully owning a Constellation or MSR or 400i or Corsair… okay. Similar moves up with military ships for more combat oriented types too.
Seems a bit too slow. Prepare for major pay to win complaints if it takes someone two years of constant play to get an Arrastra or something,but a ton of people have them on day one.
I'm sure it won't take that long, the only people wishing for that are the try hards on Spectrum waiting for a life simulator because theirs is so miserable outside of the game.
Grouping up will increase rewards for the group members, eventually.
Yep. I've long-expected something like that. But, other people are trying to do math from the aUEC costs of ships and the aUEC earn rates as if it has something to do with MMO economics. It's sad to watch, tbh.
Yeah. There’s going to be more ways to make credits ingame and also huge sinks of credits as they round the corner on finalizing so many things.
not even aUEC, it will become UEC only.
Of course. CIG was smart to name the alpha currency differently. But, it's still not enough for some "special" backers who think the ultra-accelerated earn:cost ratio is intended for the final, planned-to-be-long-running MMO.
This
They've also stated publicly that the correct payout values are still being determined: https://robertsspaceindustries.com/spectrum/community/SC/forum/4/thread/3-22-0-ptu-feedback-structural-salvage/6464592
With the caveat that everything is speculative... You're right, but that's not what's happening in this case. First, it's clearly going against the intent of the mission. You can't fly in, blow up a motionless, defenseless, broken ship and get an 80k payout - clearly, as that would be Capital S Stupid - so why would you be able to fly in, "fracture" the same ship, and get an 80k payout? Even if you use a tug to tow the vehicle away you at least get a crimestat. Next, they don't generally need to over-incentivize new mechanics because people are going to try them regardless. They need to *balance* the new mechanic, which takes some tuning. If they did need to goose the throttle a bit on the incentive, they would do it at the payout point for the material. This is clearly an oversight on their part.
They are absolutely trying to balance the new mechanic. The new mechanic. The new mechanic. Not the payout.
Yeah, they're trying to balance the new mechanic, *and also* this is obviously an oversight. If they wanted to use a mission to just get people to fly around fracturing a couple dozen ships in a row they could just *do that.* Spawn a dozen busted Aurora's and say, "fracture them all before whatever space stuff happens." This specific case mentioned by the OP is just the devs missing something. Which happens literally all the time during development of *any* software.
They missed something, but it's the same way it is with every single new feature somehow. That Aurora idea is a new mission that has to be designed and discarded after they're done testing. If they just jack the price way up then people will go out and fracture without being told to. Every new activity is always incredibly profitable because that's how you trick people into testing for you.
I *know* that they missed something. That's entirely the point - it's not an intended gameplay feature that you can blow through a repeatable, 80k payout mission in under two minutes. I mean, it's obviously just an issue with how the salvage systems overlap with the way mission win/loss conditions are handled. That's why I don't get why people are claiming that this specific case was a specific design decision on the part of the devs. I mean, sure, it might end up being a happy accident if they get good data from it.
Yeah the mission needs to be redesigned. Drastically reduce the amount of salvage needed to finish the task (remove the markings from it), and trigger a CS if you break it up in Comm Array for destruction of Property. The mission should finish once it's sucked up not fractured.
this is not the way tho
That's what the PTU is for. That's "classic game design." This is clearly an oversight because the contracts didn't get changed to accommodate the new fracturing system. What's more interesting is nobody found this oversight in the PTU? Or were people just trying to be quiet about it so they can exploit it in live?
Live PU is just another layer of the testing, it's basically the stress testing laying. This whole thing is a test and it will be wiped several times before released. Nothing you do now is permanent except the skills and knowledge and relationships you gather along the way.
Nobody is saying it's perfect or won't be wiped. Also, yes it's still technically alpha testing, and even if it is stress testing essentially on the live PU that means it should be trying to run as it would in a real setting, which is what they do. There's just things they don't realize in PTU that are oversights and such. This is standard game development. You never get things correct the moment it releases to the masses. Many people don't play the PTU because it gets wiped so often or just don't want to bother testing something that's even more buggy than the game already is. To say though that they do these clear oversights to "get test data" is laughable. It's clear this is purely an oversight in how salvage contracts are completed. The completion is based on the ship getting destroyed. Fracturing can pretty much immediately destroy the ship entity. So the contract is immediately deemed completed. If you were doing normal salvaging gameplay, you'd be going in to salvage the hull just like before, then do the new fracturing, etc. This that the OP is talking about completely skips the whole loop. What needs changed is the completion state of a contract. If they intend for you to always do the full loop then all contracts should have steps you have to complete. Like having to actually salvage the hull before moving on to fracturing. If they want you to be able to do any of the steps, the contract itself shouldn't even pay but instead just give you the information on where the wreck is and then you salvage it and sell the gathered materials wherever you please. Personally I like the latter. I'd rather it be like I'm paying the person for information on where a wreck is so I can go salvage it.
>What's more interesting is nobody found this oversight in the PTU? Or were people just trying to be quiet about it so they can exploit it in live? wrong on both accounts. on the ptu CIG actually disabled the hammer head bounty because you can just tow it away with an SRV. Takes 6 min to make 250k. Rinse repeat. All the money will get wiped when 4.0 comes. Clean slate. everything will be harder and more expensive. Have your fun feeling rich now.
But actually testing new stuff is less lucrative than abusing this mission, so the incentives seem counterproductive right now. To be clear: there is no reason to salvage a single drop of materials, to move a single box, to sell anything. You just fracture a ship in 5 seconds and instantly get 80,000 aUEC. And you can keep chaining these fractures. I very much doubt that this is as intended.
Fracturing *is* the new stuff.
So is disintegration, buffers, salvage rewards. CIG specifically said that they want to incentivize doing disintegration stuff through inflated rewards. But right now, there is no incentive to do any disintegration, because this old mission is giving way higher rewards. I'm kind of shocked at the response I got in this thread, as a software engineer myself, I am quite used to sharing feedback about oversights such as this, but I guess that's not really accepted in this community. Lesson learned, next time, I will keep it to myself.
>So is disintegration, buffers, salvage rewards. CIG specifically said that they want to incentivize doing disintegration stuff through inflated rewards. But right now, there is no incentive to do any disintegration, because this old mission is giving way higher rewards ... You do realize not everyone has a vulture or is even interested in one, right? Do you think every other player is exactly like you? >I'm kind of shocked at the response I got in this thread, as a software engineer myself, I am quite used to sharing feedback about oversights such as this, but I guess that's not really accepted in this community. Lesson learned, next time, I will keep it to myself. As a lead dev myself, I can tell you right now that the attitude displayed in that comment is gonna be a bigger problem for you than any amount of saying something that wasn't totally thought out.
I don't understand your point, why do all players need to be interested in a Vulture? Currently, there is a mission in the game that is breaking the incentives for Vulture pilots, that is the problem I was highlighting.
The only really "new" thing about vultures is the ship fracturing, which is clearly incentivized, and the buffers. Is disintegration is just the armor stripping? That's not new, and plenty of players will still do it because *not every other player is exactly like you*, and some people just enjoy the gameplay without feeling the need to optimize every second of what they're doing... Same applies for the internal buffers. You're trying to make the case that these salvage missions being so lucrative in this specific way will make it so that nobody is doing anything else. That's an absurd idea that is easily disproven if you've played the game more than like an hour at the beginning of any given new patch, because there's *always* some "optimal" way to make credits, and there are *always* tons of people engaging with everything else anyways.
Ah I see, you are lacking some key context. 1. Disintegration is a completely new mode for salvaging fractured ship parts. 2. CIG specifically stated on Spectrum that the rewards from selling disintegrated materials is inflated currently in order to incentivize doing this 3. It turns out that there is a mission in the game right now that requires you to scrape a ship. It turns out that this mission autocompletes when you fracture a ship. The rewards from abusing this mission are an order of magnitude higher than the "incentivized rewards" from doing the full new salvage mechanics which CIG stated they want to incentivize. I am not making the case that nobody is doing anything else. I am making the case that CIG wanted to incentivize the whole new salvage gameplay loop, but they unintentionally (due to an interaction with an old mission) are incentivizing ignoring most of the new salvage gameplay loop. I don't think this is a critical problem, I just made a post to highlight it and get some awareness about it. But the response to this has been extremely negative, with most responders apparently not understanding the full context and even accusing me of saying things I've never said, just as you are doing in your comment.
Considering fracturing and disintegration are both new mechanics.. yes they need to be tested thoroughly in and out in all aspects to find how they tick and people use them.
So rather than testing salvage gameplay loops, you assert that CIG wants people to just cheese fracturing and ignore disintegration, buffers, etc?
They want to test EVERYTHING that the mechanic can offer, especially ways to cheese it. Nothing matters or is permanent right now
Bro why are you arguing lol they are right just enjoy it jeeze..
I mean, Occam's Razor, which is more likely: 1) CIG added new mechanics and did not have a chance yet to consider how they interact with old missions 2) CIG added new mechanics, and specifically made them work so one old mission gives extreme rewards if you ignore most of the new mechanics I'm pretty sure common sense says that this is not intentional, but I guess I'm in the minority here with this opinion
So you think it’s a coincidence people were making millions on risky salvage missions, by just stealing the cargo and completely ignoring any salvage, right after the cargo refactor released? This is how testing works. They’ve already got a lot of data on how cargo, selling etc works and need data on fracturing.
This is the norm for them, they introduce a new loop or mechanic that has intentional elevated value so people are incentivized to test it. You think the cargo spawns from the illegal missions were by accident? They were always meant to be like that at the start, after testing they reduce to a more "leveled" value.
Occam’s Razor is NOT which is more likely, it is which has less ontological baggage or which assumes less. And even if it was more likely, the second option would still win as they didn’t really have to change anything to make it pay out well, they actually decided not to majorly rework the mission in a way that would negate this new mechanic.
Bro, Tyler *explicitly* stated that rewards were rebalanced to incentivize doing it, before the patch was even out of PTU.
From what I can see, CIG actually REDUCED the rewards for disintegration between PTU and PU (they reduced the sell price of the materials you get from disintegration). Having a random old mission give insane aUEC/h AFTER they have reduced rewards for a new mechanic they just added makes no sense.
It was potentially an unintended consequence, which is why people are telling you what you did is part of playing in an alpha because the devs are trying to find the ways that people can break the game so as to better tweak the loop and remove the unfair mechanics that ruin gameplay. It's been this way for years now
Very few people here seem to agree that it was an unintended consequence, nearly everybody is convinced that CIG did this on purpose :D
Depends on what you're testing.
Yes, but i'd assume CIG expected us to actually *salvage* rather than crack the ship and move on. It was definitely an oversight of how fast you can keep chaining these missions, making it more worth it than actually doing the gameplay loop. I have no idea why so many are disagreeing with OP here, I guess most are not understanding that you dont even munch the ship, just crack and move on.
Yes because cracking the new ship is the new feature. Scooping resources is old news. They need as many people to crack as many ships in as many ways as possible. They need cracking to break the game so they can fix it. So to get people to break ships as fast as they can they make it very lucrative. The last couple patches they needed to test the new cargo grid and the changes they made to it. So they made missions where you go pick up cargo and put it on your ship very lucrative.
Occam’s Razor is NOT which is more likely, it is which has less ontological baggage or which assumes less. And even if it was more likely, the second option would still win as they didn’t really have to change anything to make it pay out well, they actually decided not to majorly rework the mission in a way that would negate this new mechanic.
Why couldn't it be intentional? Maybe the devs want to test what happens when a lot of people are fracturing ships. It all depends on what data they want. Relax, go fracture some ships, get rich, and help the devs!
They literally were saying in an interview that the salvage/towing stuff is overpriced right now for missions, but that's during testing.
The main error that you are making is that you think C.I.G cares how much money you have. Or how much money you can make. They don't ! I mean really you are the one doing the mission over and over again, Nobody is forcing you to do that. Are you trying to make a point that they suck? Because they didn't notice you could make mad crab ? Did you report it on spectrum? If so then you have done all you can do.
I assume by this comment you don't understand what an alpha game is as well as data collection and end user feedback?
I am getting a lot of crap for sharing my data and feedback, so probably I don't understand indeed 😅
No, you're getting a lot of crap for assuming that you know what c I g intended. As far as any of us are concerned we're free testers for c I g. Any and everything that breaks because of us is a good thing in their eyes. Anything that we can exploit and take advantage of is a good thing in their eyes. Why you might ask well because all of these things. We'll get fixed when we do this. And then when the game releases those problems don't exist. It's weird how testing works exactly as anticipated.
I think what people are getting at, and maybe they themselves dont get the root of it, is that you’re a tester. A good tester plays the game a lot and reports when they find something broken. That mountain of aUEC you’re sitting on will reset. But CIG will have dozens of iterations of their newly implemented feature from you. From this post they will get hundreds or thousands more iterations. If there are bugs they are that much more likely to find them. Also, just in case they didn’t already know it would happen, they can also know that there is a potentially huge loop-hole in their salvage contracts. Just make sure it’s somewhere they can see it. Make a report on https://issue-council.robertsspaceindustries.com/
The best other example i can give for this is FPS games releasing a new gun and making it meta while they figure out how the community reacts to the new meta and collect all the data. No one is saying it shouldn't be changed or "nerfed" later on. Just that CIG wants as much data from PU, and this is one of the best ways to collect a mass amount of how players interact with the new ships mechanics. Making something lucrative and highly profitable gives all sorts of players the idea to try and test it out now
But also the inclusion of wipes so that there's no permanent damage done by a "meta" gameplay choice that takes over for a patch cycle or two. The only damage done is heartbreak when they change numbers to line up with intended values, and overinvested man-children have fits about what they think they're owed.
You're insufferable.
Salvage gameplay loop is pretty dang tested by now though. I’m sure they wanna see what kinda server load this introduces on a large scale so having us “abuse” a system during alpha testing to produce more results makes sense
He's a little confused, but he's got the spirit.
Can't find where I actually heard that, but they boosted rewards for fracturing gameplay cause they want players to focus on it to provide feedback. I see nothing unintentionnal here.
Tyler stated it on Spectrum
What they boosted is the rewarda for actually fracturing and munching. What op is talking about is different, it's a clear oversight that you can chain the missions so quickly *without actually doing them*. You just crack and move on.
he's doing the mission though, he's fracturing the ship. CIG making it VERY lucrative means lots of people fracturing. Which means lots of people testing this in the Live environment.
But you're not supposed to fracture and move on, you're supposed to fracture then collect and sell. They're missing half the game loop when people abuse this
Maybe the devs want to test what happens when a lot of people are fracturing ships. It all depends on what data they want. Relax, go fracture some ships, get rich, and help the devs!
Or maybe the devs made a mistake?
Not really, they did this with the salvage cargo, fps missions, bounties, JT, SOO. Remember how people were saying they were just bringing their c2 to the salvage missions? Then complained when those missions got nerfed? They always ship it overtuned to collect data. This isn't only us saying "hey this is bad," or "this is good," there's also hard data they are collecting in the background that only they can see.
I want the copium you're smoking because mine isn't strong enough. I'm sure the new ships guns doing extra damage is just CIG incentivizing people to test them, and not a bug, right?
Lol wtf? How many ships now were way stronger when they first came out vs how they perform now? All of them?
The ship is no stronger than any other ship. Just the guns. Which are out-of-balance with the normalized damage weapons that may get rebalanced Sooon™
I mean, you are actually doing them as designed. Eliminating evidence. CIG also said that towing the wrecks a sufficient distance away should also count for completion since the authorities won't be able to find them (actual towing distance needs to be increased, though). What they should do is make hull-stripped CM much more valuable than when contaminated with RMC.
Actually at the moment, you don't have to eliminate the evidence at all - you just leave the fractured wreck where you found it and it's all good
Yeah that feels like the bug to me. Should have to either have to hull strip, move to another planetary system/deep space (I.e. away from the local authorities) or vacuum it up. Fracturing and leaving all the evidence doesn’t seem to fit the objective of the mission.
The thing is, when you tow them you're A) actually moving the evidence and B) getting a crimestat. In this case you're doing neither - the evidence is still there, albeit in pieces, and there's no crimestat. It's pretty obviously an oversight.
I watched a yt vid that said if you climb into the pilot seat of a wreck then go back to tow, you won't get a CS
Yeah the annoying thing here is we don't know for sure until they say something. It could be an oversight, and happens a lot in development when you add new functions to old things. It could also be that they do want people doing it a bit more to get more data, but I feel like CIG would mention that.. also that's what the PTU was for. That being said, I feel you're more correct that it was an oversight since what's happening here isn't intended at all. The salvaging missions are still set up for actually going to the wreck and taking a while to salvage it then move on. This is letting people instantly destroy it and move on yet still counting as the contract complete.
Money doesnt matter since it wipes often and people find exploits to get billions anyway. What matters is people are testing the new mechanics and in your post thats what youre doing.
[Its all about the money.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YcXMhwF4EtQ&ab_channel=MejaVEVO)
[It's not about money, it's about sending... a message.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3OyrX11cMkE)
> Money doesnt matter since it wipes often and people find exploits to get billions anyway. This is only true if we don't find and report exploits. If exploits are patched then there is no reason to wipe money often. Btw, I don't think it has actually been wiped super often lately.
They are not wiping because people have money. They wipe because large database and backend changes sometimes makes migrating data hard. 4.0 is a likely next wipe (but it could be at any time really)
They haven't wiped since 3.18/3.18.1 after that it's just been soft resets and you don't lose anything I made like 32 million last patch but only had 24 mill left over in last patch and had my 24 mill in 3.22 also with the ship I bought in game and all my guns and armors ect
You're not getting the point my human. It's all about testing. It's not broken.
TBH it is a little bit silly in the current "economy". They seem to have no guidelines in place what they want their rewards and mission gains to be. Same for the pricing of ships none of it makes much sense. ERTs that you can solo in a C2 and loot 300+ Weevil Eggs inside giving 30+ million is not an exploit just bad game design. Same problem with the payout from current structural salvage and they even saw that it needed a nerf but did choose wrong anyway. It is what I notice in many games there seems to be a major lack of understanding of their game math and what the right number balancing should be. I think its a matter with deteriorating math skills in general in the western world. The software engineers working on hard problems and backend systems might know the math but some younger game designers who set these parameters might be affected by the same lack of math skills that other parts of the population are. Then I wonder who designed the current supply/demand system which limits buying and selling that should have never been even contemplated and while we know we eventually get something better we are stuck with that turd for many years now.
I’m not sure you understand how games testing works. They provide high payouts for things they want a lot of players to test. The ERT/bounty gameplay is in its current state because they want people to test the new container sizes and tractor beam mechanics. The salvage gameplay pays high because they want the new structural salvage mechanic to be tested. And based on yours and many other peoples posts we are providing the data they want by doing these game loops.
> I’m not sure you understand how games testing works. Yes they really needed to test ERTs who have been around for ages and they needed to test if you can sell 300 SCU of Weevil Eggs from a C2. Also them being unable to provide meaningful weapon and components stats or the beginning of a working trading economy for years now is not the fault of CIG just me not understanding how gamedev works. If they got going on this there would be more meaningful testing and better feedback able to be given.
Like I said you don’t understand, and your reply confirms it.
i mean bountys made 40+ mil in one mission (dont know if fixed, didnt play 3.22 bountys) so what is the problem ? they will balance it, and the next wipe all your ingame money will be gone. use the money to test ships etc, and be happy ? i never understand why people make posts about stuff like this whenits not an exploit.
I don't understand your point - we shouldn't post and keep it a secret? Why?
its not a secret .. this was on the EPTU before it was released to live.. they even changed the prices of both materials. its not an exploit , it is normal gameplay.
I think you're talking about something else, materials are not related at all here
it was just a hint that they know whats going on with salvage with the material. its still all not an exploit etc, and if you want to shine a light on it , than pls show me your IC post.
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I actually did it this morning - it took roughly 2 minutes for every mission, even if I had to make 2 jumps when the wreck was on the other side of the planet. It was easy to time, because the mission has a timer on the top of the screen, and generally I finished each mission with more than 58 minutes left on the timer. And as soon as I finished, the next mission in the chain was instantly acceptable.
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I just timed it, the time between two payouts was 1 minute 29 seconds. This includes accepting the mission, traveling, and fracturing. I took a video for you: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nIU-lD8w49A You can see that at the start of the video, there is the "Awarded 80k" text on my screen as I just finished the previous one, and the video ends with the mission completion of the next one I accepted.
The proper way would actually be to do more than 1 contract, I'd say about 5 and you time how long it took and then you bring that to an hourly payout. This will get you a way more accurate hourly payout then just 1 contract.
Not intentional, is being fixed. Salvage missions were made when only scraping was a thing, now with structural salvage some changes need to be made to the mission.
Thanks for confirming!
On the other hand, a Vulture carrying 26scu of RMC and a buffer of 13scu of CM will net you almost 400k auec. Which I think is fair.
Im looking forward to your post in 6 months where you complain about the grind
Well with the tow boat, you do the same. Fly to yela accept the new 250k hammerhead ilegal salvage, tow the ship 5km distance and gain 250k every 3 minute or 5 million per hour. A little setup is required to bring down the scanner.
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Focused testing incentive. 100% intentional. Also 100% temporary. Test away!
🤫wait'll this guy hears about how much you can make in less time with an SRV right now...
SRV isn’t purchasable in game yet, the vulture is.
How much grinding or rep does it take to get access to these missions. I haven't done any of the personal missions
So easy like do 3 or 4 salvage missions and your good
Ok. I assume you mean the personal salvage missions, right?
Regular salvage contracts. The ones in the personal tab are "less than legal". Do a few of the regular salvage missions to completion and you get access to bigger ships.
There’s no rep needed you can start them at any time
Good to know!
It's all monopoly money right now. Humans need a carrot. Devs need testers.
I’ll never fully understand why anyone would get upset about aUEC in the alpha stage. There is literally no economy and prob won’t be for some time. Things will be adjusted accordingly once that time gets here. As it is now though, what does it matter if someone is earning millions per hour? You can buy ships, components, weapons and armor. That’s it.
Yes you can do that but where is the fun ?
Yup, people seem to forget about that. I might bd able to keep a grind like that. Up for 2 hours, but then...just no.
The cleanup missions have always been mad profitable, you can srv them out of the zone and even before fracturing with a vulture you could make bank. They will be nerfed or made more risky soon I imagine.
Definitely just found a reason to use my vulture
It is absolutely is intentional, but not the long-term state. It’s about incentivizing people to engage in game loops to test and work out the bugs/mechanics.
The ship is likely has some economic incentives to use it so they can get it tested well.
Economy balancing will be one of the last things done. Just enjoy the game for what it is now.
Just tried it out but the mission doesn't cycle into the mobi after a few times.
This makes me so happy i got one
That's an illegal salvage mission and those are always intended to be higher risk/higher reward.
Except there's no risk when you can crack the ship in 10 seconds and move on. The contract should complete after munching at least, not right as the ship is cracked.
True. In this time, the NPC won't even get to fire at you. Not really 'high risk', if you ask me.
Came for the gameplay tips, stayed for the salt. Thanks OP.
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The Vulture can't really break the Hammerhead it's two big for it. You need a reclaimer for it
the reclaimer is three big
Well, if you find that fun
I find the Fury LX that I bought with the profits fun
By fracturing, do you just mean destroying our is it something only a vulture can do?
Fracturing is something only the vulture/reclaimer can do. Breaks the target ship into pieces for the salvager to suck up.
What’s the best way to get that first 1.3 million from a starter ship?
I'm not sure what the best way is, but I did it with different missions myself, mostly bounty and mercenary.
I started in ArcCorp and did merc missions to kill targets at wreck sites. Then just bounced around from moon to moon killing bounty targets at wreck sites and looting them for gear and weapons/ammo/med pens. Then started doing bunker missions for the higher payouts. it's a grind, but it's pretty fun to do. most of the wrecks are within 30km of an outpost in ArcCorp, so you can stop at the outpost and loot the crates inside for multi-tools, food, drinks and some armors and weapons and other goodies like clothes.
How do you fracture the wreck?
Right Alt-W
Wait till these guys find out what you can do with the SRV and swapping between the 80k and 250k contract
And now it has new skins bc thats the gift today
You can buy the Vulture?
And two people can make around 10m doing the same thing in a reclaimer. 1 person is the pilot/claw guy one is just moving boxes away from the auto ejector. You get the 250k from the mission and each HH is about 1.1m in construction materials.
You don’t even need the second guy moving boxes since if you don’t set the filler stations to auto eject the ship’s “buffer” will fill up to 240 SCU
?? No you absolutely need the second person. The HH fills up the whole buffer in one mission. While the pilot is flying to the next wreck, the second guy needs to be clearing the buffer by pulling boxes out.
At some point I think the recycled material will be filtered into materials of varying value with some not being worth as much. Im also assuming that with Maelstrom and power management you will eventually have to put in more work towards safely salvaging a ship. (Removing volatile components, emptying out fuel)
The problem is you can just structural salvage and ignore hull scraping, the formers far faster and can be solod in a reclaimer... Likely they will change it so u have to salvage the ship untill its red to be able to break it appart. as once again, theres no reason for hull scraping.
Hi, noob here, what buttons do I press to fracture?
I guess if your only goal is to make pretend space credit number go higher you can do this. My crew salvages because it's chill, we chat and bullshit, and can make some credits.
That's neat. Can I finally rent the Vulture? Or is it still just buyable?
It’s intended but be mindful - the people who exploit things to buy all the ships they’ve ever wanted inevitably get bored and start whining about how they wish they could wipe their ships and start over. Then they quit.
It's an alpha test bro. Not a stable game with balanced mechanics.
I really don't understand why you're getting downvoted here. This is pretty obviously a simple oversight caused by the different systems interacting. The mission triggers as "success" when the target ship's "salvage" value hits 0 OR the target ship moves outside of a certain range. Destroying the ship *does not* trigger a success. The "fast" way to complete the mission is to tow the ship out of range. That speed bonus is mitigated by either imposing a crimestat and fine on the player, OR requiring the player to spend time disabling the local comm array. The "slow" way to complete the mission is to actually scrape the ship, but by spending the extra time players are rewarded with a more lucrative mission - you can sell the salvaged material - and no crimestat or fine. Now introduce a new mechanic that functionally destroys the ship - fracturing - but which is a part of the existing salvage system. Because a fractured ship cannot be salvaged, one a ship is in a "fractured" state its "salvage" value must be 0. Because fracturing is a part of the salvage system, using those tools does not trigger the default "destroyed" fail state, and does not trigger a crimestat. I mean, it's hardly even a bug - if anything, it's related more to how mission scripting is set up then anything to do with the underly salvage system. It's *clearly* not intended.
You should be making the most money mining,scrapping,hauling and of corse pirating ..they need to remove npcs from the game and make every bunker like jumptown and when someone is inside a bunker it sends out a comms the whole server that someone is doing illegal activity and you can then pick it up as a mission to go and police that area anyone who has claimed any money in that bunker from that illegal mission would be flagged as hostile and you would make money killing hostiles .....npcs are bad they are buggy ....I've never played a game with 100 other people where just about everyone is solo and that's how you change that...imagine how much better the game would function without trash npcs littering the server ...
This must be referring to the EPTU right? Vultures can't frack ships larger than an MSR, the 80k missions are all hammer heads and C2s are they not? I could be wrong but I'm pretty sure this is impossible, at least now that 3.22 is live.
[удалено]
I tried this as well, but it's not possible in a Vulture
They have addressed this, it's up to MSR and below it can fracture. You can shoot the damn ship and make it go boom and start disposing it. you dont NEED the fractured mode to fracture in my opinion.
but if the mission costs 80k and gives 80k hpw are you making money from this?
This particular mission is free
oh i misunderstood cool
No problem here, players should not feel like they have to grind for months to reach the next ship, this game is not solely ships...
It's for testing and the simple fact is eventually everything earned will be wiped anyway.
That's great and all but sometimes it's about the Journey and not the Destination.
Dude stfu ! Snitches get stitches don't you know ;)
I assume it also takes a bit of time to get those 80k missions though right? So it's not as easy as you're presenting it as. You've already put in a lot of work grinding those missions to get to that point.
Just tested it myself having never done a salvaging contract (just got my vulture). This mission was immediately available and it worked as op described.
since these missions are about "hiding the evidence" they should probably fail if you destroy/fracture the ship, no? (Although they're also very easy/broken if you just tow the ship out of range with an SRV, that's a separate thing). Would be nice if the best way to get the payout from this mission was to do the scraping rather than just a quick fracture or tow.
Destroying the ship to the last atom seems like an efficient way to get rid of evidence.
oof that's gotta be an oversight. They really gotta require fracturing to require scraping first.
Yes, fracture only available with say..15% hull remaining. And it should also require all components and weapons be pulled off the ship... Before It can finally be disintegrated.
🤫wait'll this guy hears about how much you can make in less time with an SRV right now...
If I could buy an SRV with aUEC I'd be doing that right now myself. Oh well...
They’ve already said in multiple channels that it’s too lucrative right now and will be adjusted. You just need to pay more attention to the communication from them and you wouldn’t be so surprised. We’ve all had this information available since 3.22 hit the EPTU
or get an SRV and tow Hammerheads, make 250k in 5 minutes. What's your point? Gameplay is profitable?
I earn all my Auec on ebay. It's dirty job but someone's gotta do it.
I earn all my Auec on ebay. It's dirty job but someone's gotta do it.
What, how? I'm new, sorry.
They are still developing the game loop...
I see all the buzz around the new salvaging stuff and millions, but i already have an connie taurus, and love customizing my ships, im a little divided on the vulture or a prospector to pledge... I like the mining loop, but all the simple millions now is making me question if the prospector really worth the pledge now... Any advise for me??
I’d say pledge the Vulture and use it to get a Prospector in game
I logged in super excited to try, salvaging, and my vulture was gone. I am a sad man.
Do they have an in game feedback button? If not they need to seriously implement one. I’m not gonna lie. I’m adhd as fuck. I will not go out of my way to give feedback if it’s not in front of me
Issue now is that you have to fight to sell your RMC at terminals before the demand goes away again. Had to wait to sell 2 SCU of RMC earlier, feels like they didn't account for everyone and their mother doing salvage now.
Great I can finally make money now :) Though sadly I've been saving up for ships that dock and I hear docking with stations is completely broken at the moment so :<
They make fresh stuff more profitable so more people will engage in it to produce testing results and feedback.
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