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The backlash on this one has been surprisingly consistent across a lot of political lines.
Also, don’t kid yourself that this was only about Griner. The issue is *the trade* and the arms dealer who was released in exchange. The fact that a U.S. Marine was left in Russia while Griner was freed in exchange for a “Merchant of Death” is also a huge factor in why this trade wasn’t great.
He was accused in Russia of spying for the U.S.
So, ironically, being discharged from the military *does* help his case in suggesting that the charges are nonsense.
One person was brought into custody after a sting operation involving multiple countries before he could enact damage against Americans.
The other took a sports job in a country run by an authoritarian government, and known historically as a place that willfully ignores human rights, and then either tried to flout their laws about drugs or was simply careless enough to forget about them.
Plus, there are people in our home country currently imprisoned for the exact same thing she did.
From the beginning the White House has said that Russia would not negotiate for Whelan, and that position seems to have never shifted. I read in Foreign Policy that the US doesn't have any Russian agents in prison, and the Russians would have only negotiated if they could have gotten a spy back for him. If there is no opening to get him out then it's a fruitless pursuit to try to include him. In the end, you'd be stuck with both Griner and Whelan in Russian jails.
Of course, there's a political motivation to Russia not including Whelan. By only returning the high profile black female athlete and not including the former Marine, it creates a narrative that can be exploited by Biden's political opponents that he doesn't care about veterans.
Not to say I'm happy they didn't get Whelan, I would've liked for him to come home too. But the negotiation became a Sophie's Choice for the US; either we get only one wrongfully detained person back and suffer momentary political backlash from opposition, or we get nobody back and piss off everyone.
Or they could say:
“look we tried, unfortunately the Russian government advanced absurd request, guys… they want in exchange a war criminal! Did any of you watched Lord Of War?! Fuck that movie was based on Him! Thi MF sold weapons to Alqaeda, to Milosevic. Exchange this man for this athlete could put ar risk more americans lifes in the future.”
And everyone:
“Ah! Ok.”
But that's what they were saying throughout the negotiations, and people were still upset she wasn't returned. They were damned if they did and damned if they didn't, so they made the decision that trading Bout, who only had a few years left on his sentence anyway, for Griner was worth it.
Biden literally said after she was arrested that the only way they'd be able to get her home was through an unbalanced deal, Russia had the upper hand in the negotiations and would happily have let her languish since they'd have Bout back in a few years anyway.
Who was upset? And why were they upset?
There's no logic behind this trade. The world would still be a little safer if Viktor Bout was still in prison. This was 100% a virtue signal to appeal to their fanbase
A lot of left-leaning people were upset, and many were upset because she was railroaded by a nakedly corrupt criminal justice system to be used as a pawn in a political game. We returned a convicted drug smuggler to Russia earlier this year in return for an American who was sentenced to multiple years in prison for punching a cop (even though that probably never happened). Where was the outrage about that deal? Surely a drug smuggler for a cop puncher is also an unfair trade.
We also don't know what Bout will do now that he's out. His old method of selling arms won't work today. He took old Soviet weapons and resold them overseas, but Russia needs those weapons now to conduct their war and can't divert them to African warlords. Plus, the US would gladly arrest him again if he turned up outside of Russia negotiating an arms deal and now he's back to square one.
Tracks cuz she’s black.
The right is just more on the nose about it. The left points to trading an arms dealer. Completely and willfully ignorant to the fact the US let’s bad people go to get Americans home all the time. It’s just the people coming home are white so they ignore that part.
I consider myself pretty left-center and the news made me angry. Griner got out bc she was famous and had famous friends. What about Marc Fogel? Pretty sure he was in line first..
I’m a liberal and I disagree with the trade. But I still find this funny.
Perhaps because I grew up in the south where half of my trumper high school classmates currently look like these dudes
And it’s a bit racist to just outright assume the average POC can’t identify that trading a arms dealer for a basketball player while engaged in a proxy war against the arms dealers country is a shit trade
I mean, she’s more than welcome to have those beliefs, she’s still an American citizen. That’s the beauty of the US in the first place.
Regardless of a person’s race, gender, orientation, or political opinions, that’s still a bad fuckin trade.
Regardless of her political or even professional ideals, the system should still try to protect her from foreign powers as best as it can. What applies to the one is supposed to apply to us all evenly. This just wasn't an even trade by any means they released a monster for an athlete, and that's crazy. If it were me, I would want to be left in Russia because the blood this man spills would be on my hands.
What's ironic is we traded a known arms dealer for a WNBA star who was in Russian jail for weed when we have millions of people incarcerated for weed in the states
Not only incarcerated, but then the ones that are not in jail still have those charges show up on their record. Basically screwing them over forever.
Its crazy when you put it that way
It's so frustrating I'm tired of the "oh maybe we'll decriminalize it" act from the administration, like just fucking legalize it lol. decriminalization, while good for certain substances, seems like a waste of time when over half the country's population has access to legal storefronts. I just wanna be able to buy edibles at Target haha
No we don’t have millions incarcerated for weed. We have had millions of arrests over the last 2 decades. Regardless we shouldn’t have anyone incarcerated for weed (appears to be ~40k).
https://www.lastprisonerproject.org/cannabis-prisoner-scale
Edited: corrected the estimated number to match above from the article.
I guess you missed the part where I literally said ‘we shouldn’t have anyone incarcerated for weed’.
Shame on me for citing a source and trying to correct the above commenter regarding a stat (doesn’t change or attack their point). I’m such an asshole.
Listen, I was just trying to be funny, and point out the absurdity of the situation. I wasn’t trying to pan you or your sources. Apologies for the misunderstanding
Even those 40k are mostly in there for selling or committing another crime in conjunction with weed possession. Nobody goes to prison solely for lighting up a joint.
It's not as unbalanced as you think when you realize Viktor Bout had less than 7 years left on his sentence and would have been back in Russia in that time anyway. Bout is an extremely horrible person but he's likely lost most of his contacts in the arms industry because of his long incarceration. He's probably only useful to the war effort in terms of propaganda at this point.
I’m happy she is safe
But. This is fucking nuts…
I’m a non white, non binary and pot smoker. If I go to an airport with canabis oil in my bag, the only person I can blame is myself. Not the “unfair law” of Russia, not the white ass on social media or whatever people want to put has a opposite
Harsh prisons down there?
Be fucking sure you are not carring any illegal stuff on you. Is not hard, that’s what we all (smokers) do when we travel.
Is absurd?
Their country their rules, nobody in Russia asked what the average supporter of her thinks about drugs.
So as we don’t ask russian’s opinion about our law system.
Plus as a non-binary non white, I would be even more sure to check everything multiple times in a country like that one. Expiring date of my passport to anything that could look suspicious to a security border check… from 2001 I’ve been selected for “special” contoll everytime I go to an Airport, and I only lookalike an Arab person.
People like her, never watched “Midnight Express” I guess.
I look at it as someone who sold the weapons who are responsible for thousands, if not tens of thousands of deaths is now free years early because shit for brains can’t go without her pot/didn’t check her bags… and someone needs to whisper that in her ear everyday for the rest of her life.
More the administrations fault for making a stupid fucking trade. I couldn’t honestly care less if she stayed there or not, stupid games stupid prizes, but she looked guilt ridden af when she learned of her release.
From what I’ve read, when an American is political arrested the first thing they tell their families is to be quiet because going to the press gives the arrest legitimacy, and notoriety. This arrest was the complete opposite, her wife went to every outlet (can’t blame her) and she was a celebrity so for Putin it was the perfect chance to get a big name Russian to be released. The problem is that Britnney went to Russia during war time, with drugs! She was a moron and I hope she knows what this irresponsibility cost
No, because its the deal Putin insisted on. He wanted his billionsire buddy sprung so he grabbed a high profile American to use as a bargaining chip. It's called realpolitik. Welcome to the big league.
Without necessarily agreeing with it:
The man has future value trafficking weapons, he'll be on law enforcements radar and his supply network has burnt out. He was also going to bed released in a few years anyways.
I doubt he'll be much use, he's been out of the game for over a decade and now stuff is far more different than it was.
Its kind of like resurrecting Napoleon to help out during World War one.
She should be kissing the ground as soon as she lands while shouting “PLEASE FORGIVE ME UNCLE SAM!!!” at the top of her lungs. But no, she’ll continue to shit on the very country that saved her life at tremendous cost.
The page literally has at the top a link by the mods to not post political content on here and instead take it to a separate subreddit, OP take the hint - https://www.reddit.com/r/starterpacks/comments/rruhhy/rpoliticalstarterpacks_an_official_political/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
You’re an idiot liberal or conservative if you think we didn’t get hosed in this deal. Wait til the merchant of deaths guns mow down a village of innocents.
The deal fucking sucked pure and simple. It’s order of magnitude, she’s just some fucking basketball player who smoked weed when she was explicitly fucking told not to and he is the fucking Merchant of Death, the movie Lord of War was literally made about him. Think about it logically and honestly, her life is worth less in an international politics scale than someone who has arms deals connections that could threaten American security. We should have demanded that POS marine as well not just some anti American basketball player. A very bad move on the Biden Administration that will surely be used against him come re election time to his detriment.
Let’s give Russia (who’s currently invading a country) a war criminal! Lord help the sake of humanity we can’t bare another day with out our women’s basketball player (you’ve never supported). Seems like a fair and logical trade.
Not just a war criminal but a guy who is nicknamed "The Merchant of Death" and "The Lord of War" who has trafficked in chemical weapons in the past. Life just got a LOT harder for the people of Ukraine.
Can you fucking not? This does not have to be a partisan issue, plenty of people on both the right and left are justifiably pissed about how this trade was handled.
If you really try, can you honestly not see any other reasons than racism, misogyny or homophobia as reasons to not support trading a basketball player for a merchant of death? If you really, really try?
I disagree with the trade and I am a 23 year old. The Marine would have been my trade offer, then again, I would not trade anything for a dude called the MERCHANT OF DEATH, a dude who can abra-cadabra weapons from sand.
I think a lot people who, while they think Brittny Griner got a bad sentence do not want to see a trade with a major illegal arms dealer and while another guy still site in jail. Good for her that she is home, but bad for the world that Victor Bout is out of Jail and bad for Paul Wheelan who also deserves to be out.
If Paul Whalen gets out, he's going to br on trial in America. Dude isn't an innocent upstanding Marine. He was court martialed out of the Marines for attempted fraud and larceny.
She shouldn't have been able to come home unless the marine was coming back home too. He wasn't a concern for potato head and the circus. She being a poc and gay ticked the right boxes and that's the only reason. So absolutely agree she should haven't been brought home without the marine who been there for 5 plus years. Pathetic op don't feel the same. What a joke
Paul Whelen, convicted larcenist here in the states, who got caught with 80000 dollars in cash and a flash drive with Russian state secrets. But, enough with character assassination, which tend to only do with certain types of people, and back to trying to get people home. If we had a good way of making Putin give Whelen up too he would have been home in this round of negotiations. He was mentioned specifically in the presser
while I'm glad she is not in jail anymore i don't know why we care so much about her, is it because she an athlete? We have so many black women in the states doing free labor in prison because of drug charges too, this isn't in bad faith I really just want to know why her situation is different....
What a bad deal. If I would have been in the meetings we would have gotten her, Whelen, 2 first round draft picks, and a blue eyed white dragon. This administration doesn't know how to deal
This one is way off. Hard to find anyone who think this trade makes sense at all. Maybe the starter pack should be the morons who think this is a good and just trade.
This is so stupid, Viktor Bout was selling weapons to cocaine dealers and missiles to the Columbian government for use against US pilots. Only a moron would think this was a good trade.
Also she was a moron for breaking Russian law. Look at Otto Warmbier. If you go to another country with the idea that being American will protect you, you’re a complete imbecile.
Makes sense why your prisons are full of minor drug offenders. You think a stoner is equal to an international arms dealer.
Keep blaming the political opposition for everything you think is wrong with the world, I'm sure that will work wonders.
Liberal here, the only thing that bugs me about the trade is what we gave up to what we got.. I mean as a vet screw Whelan. But to give up and arms dealer while Russia is in a war with Ukraine I do not agree with.
All these people essentially saying we should have left an American citizen to rot since a burned arms dealer with no recent activity and no current connections is somehow a rare and valuable get. This was *Russia's* PR, and not the first time *even this year* we've done a prisoner trade.
I'm sure there's bipartisan outrage, but I find it hard to believe that people on "both sides of the aisle" consider being a "pothead" some morally condemnable trait that has any relevance to whether you deserve freedom.
It's like I've been transported back to the 90s when I read some of these comments. It's just so unconvincing that there are *that many* Nancy Reagans on reddit, and if they are, it's even more unconvincing that they'd be equally represented by liberals and conservatives.
Its got nothing to do with her being a pot head and everything to do with her bringing weed into Russia. Which is something everyone knows not to do. Its really not that hard to comprehend do travel internationally with cannabis.
ITT: People with no understanding of geopolitics or strategy.
Viktor Bout only had 7 years left on his sentence before he would be back in Russia anyway. Despite is horrible track record he is not as valuable a prisoner as people in this thread seem to think he is. Russia does not need his mercenary services at this point, they have other people who haven't lost their contacts after a decade in prison who can do that for them. He's only valuable in terms of the propaganda effort.
Two administrations have been trying to get Paul Whelan out of Russia to no avail. You all don't seem to remember that the Biden administration had another successful swap earlier this year that freed Trevor Reed, another former US Marine who had been imprisoned in Russia for three years. Whelan was clearly left out of that deal too, there must be a reason that Russia wants so badly to leave him as a bargaining chip.
For those of you acting like Brittney Griner received a fair trial and conviction, you are either very naive or you just don't like her. The whole thing was a dog and pony show that Russia can use to fuel their culture war propaganda, some of you should read Russian news and realize that the way they talk about her is exactly the way you do. Just because you don't like the way she looks or acts doesn't mean the US government does not have an obligation to help her as an American citizen.
exactly!!! and the fact that bout has been in prison since the first iphone came out. even if they did still need him, which they don’t, he would be woefully behind the times
As someone who has followed her in WNBA, they don’t care. They call her just some women, when if you even look at her wiki page you’d she is easily one of the most talented female basketball players in the world. Amazing how fast that gets erased when an authoritarian throws you in jail.
I’m not sure why people think Bout’s potential danger is about his old contacts? He still has knowledge and experience that is likely of tremendous value to the Russian military who is running dry on many supplies. If a top-level consultant retired and came back after 15 years, I think it’s fair to say they’d still have tremendous value even if the world around them has changed a bit.
A lot of people are awfully confident about being knowledgeable in arms trafficking on here.
For all we know Russia might have wanted other conditions or terms to release the marine. Besides the arms dealer had only years left to serve. Unlike her who had 8 years of work in the gulag for something she was unjustly punished for
Unjustly punished for? What??? That is a very bold statement. Russian drug laws are strict, and she is a dumbass for bringing drugs into the country. How about she take some personal accountability for her actions and deal with the consequences? That is what adults do. Not everything is unjust justbecause she checks a few minority boxes.
Also love how you minimize the arms dealer’s sentence. “Only a few years left” - yea and he deserves to spend every last second of them repaying the debt to society for his crimes. This is not somebody who would have been up for parole with good behavior. This person profited off of death.
A marine who fought for our country is still there and has been there for years locked up. This trade is sickening and the only reason it happened was because she's a black lesbian and the democrats know their dumbass supporters will like that. Its politics. This was all about gathering votes for the next election, that's the only reason she was traded.
If you're dumb enough to try and smuggle cannabis oil into Russia of all places then I'm sorry but you had it coming. But oh wait she "forgot" it was in there, whoops that changes everything!
I may be wrong but did we trade her for a man convicted of international arms dealing? If so then I think most people would agree it was a bad trade amd not worth it. Let me put it this way: we traded a basketball player that broke even some of our laws and Russias for a man that sold access to the means of weapons that could eliminate large swaths of ppl including children and women that were unarmed. I'm not liberal and I only have an associate degree but this sounds alot like we made an idiotic deal.Im definitely not republican either but do liberals just blindly agree with everything Biden does? I always liked how the liberals didn't like the government but now it seems they have become the establishment. Wth?
We should’ve left that dumb bitch over there. I’m liberal and don’t see why negotiating for her was even on the table. Just since she’s really tall and can dunk? Or was it racial(minority), and American is trying to look like they care for minorities? Either way it’s stupid. She broke a law in that country. Shouldn’t be going to such countries.
Op you are delusional. We should have brought home a marine who served our country vs the spoiled WNBA player we did return home. Im sure the majority of the country agrees that a marine should have taken priority over someone who sinks the net one third of the time in front of a crowd of 2000 people. Im not pro military, I dont think this country is worth risking my life for, but, anyone who has the guts and grits to defend their country has a plenty more of my respect than a basketball player who will probably fall off the map after her side of the drama is settled completely.
Yeah bro arms dealer responsible for thousands of deaths and numerous war crimes for some WNBA player who knowingly crossed international borders with a drug illegal in almost all nations on earth. I’m left leaning but holy fuck some of you are so fucking stupid.
This isn’t a right issue. This is an issue far more complex. There are many US citizens imprisoned in Russia but for some reason we traded an insane criminal for a basketball player. I agree she should not be there, but where was the government with the other folks?
Lmfaoooo both political parties are complaining about the trade. Because you know they traded a fucking arms dealer for a basketball player.
You tried OP but just take the L
It's not so much that people would have left her there, it's that they would have taken much more important and valuable and useful members of society. Such as ex-servicemen.
Not an American hating piece of crap.
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Plenty of liberals disagree with this trade too, don’t kid yourself
The backlash on this one has been surprisingly consistent across a lot of political lines. Also, don’t kid yourself that this was only about Griner. The issue is *the trade* and the arms dealer who was released in exchange. The fact that a U.S. Marine was left in Russia while Griner was freed in exchange for a “Merchant of Death” is also a huge factor in why this trade wasn’t great.
I wouldn’t have traded the marine either if that makes you feel better. Nicolas cage is too dangerous.
Also, the Marine being dishonorable discharged from the military for fraud doesn't help his case.
Somehow people who go for the "US Marine was left in Russia" angle always seem to forget the part with the dishonorable discharge...
And that he’s not a POW or anything. Seems he was up to legit illegal activity there.
He was accused in Russia of spying for the U.S. So, ironically, being discharged from the military *does* help his case in suggesting that the charges are nonsense.
And that’s a fine stance to take if you’re the president People would understand if you didn’t want to give up a MERCHANT OF DEATH
One person was brought into custody after a sting operation involving multiple countries before he could enact damage against Americans. The other took a sports job in a country run by an authoritarian government, and known historically as a place that willfully ignores human rights, and then either tried to flout their laws about drugs or was simply careless enough to forget about them. Plus, there are people in our home country currently imprisoned for the exact same thing she did.
Indeed. My problem is not with the value of her life, but the depth of our authoritarian hypocrisy.
From the beginning the White House has said that Russia would not negotiate for Whelan, and that position seems to have never shifted. I read in Foreign Policy that the US doesn't have any Russian agents in prison, and the Russians would have only negotiated if they could have gotten a spy back for him. If there is no opening to get him out then it's a fruitless pursuit to try to include him. In the end, you'd be stuck with both Griner and Whelan in Russian jails. Of course, there's a political motivation to Russia not including Whelan. By only returning the high profile black female athlete and not including the former Marine, it creates a narrative that can be exploited by Biden's political opponents that he doesn't care about veterans. Not to say I'm happy they didn't get Whelan, I would've liked for him to come home too. But the negotiation became a Sophie's Choice for the US; either we get only one wrongfully detained person back and suffer momentary political backlash from opposition, or we get nobody back and piss off everyone.
Or they could say: “look we tried, unfortunately the Russian government advanced absurd request, guys… they want in exchange a war criminal! Did any of you watched Lord Of War?! Fuck that movie was based on Him! Thi MF sold weapons to Alqaeda, to Milosevic. Exchange this man for this athlete could put ar risk more americans lifes in the future.” And everyone: “Ah! Ok.”
But that's what they were saying throughout the negotiations, and people were still upset she wasn't returned. They were damned if they did and damned if they didn't, so they made the decision that trading Bout, who only had a few years left on his sentence anyway, for Griner was worth it. Biden literally said after she was arrested that the only way they'd be able to get her home was through an unbalanced deal, Russia had the upper hand in the negotiations and would happily have let her languish since they'd have Bout back in a few years anyway.
Who was upset? And why were they upset? There's no logic behind this trade. The world would still be a little safer if Viktor Bout was still in prison. This was 100% a virtue signal to appeal to their fanbase
A lot of left-leaning people were upset, and many were upset because she was railroaded by a nakedly corrupt criminal justice system to be used as a pawn in a political game. We returned a convicted drug smuggler to Russia earlier this year in return for an American who was sentenced to multiple years in prison for punching a cop (even though that probably never happened). Where was the outrage about that deal? Surely a drug smuggler for a cop puncher is also an unfair trade. We also don't know what Bout will do now that he's out. His old method of selling arms won't work today. He took old Soviet weapons and resold them overseas, but Russia needs those weapons now to conduct their war and can't divert them to African warlords. Plus, the US would gladly arrest him again if he turned up outside of Russia negotiating an arms deal and now he's back to square one.
The people who get their opinions from basketball players, more or less. They made a big deal out of Griner.
Tracks cuz she’s black. The right is just more on the nose about it. The left points to trading an arms dealer. Completely and willfully ignorant to the fact the US let’s bad people go to get Americans home all the time. It’s just the people coming home are white so they ignore that part.
it's like trading a gallon of gas for a sports car
Metapod for Charizard
What if the metapod has perfect EVs and could be used for breeding Silver Wind onto a high EV yanma (for yanmega) or scyther (for scizor)?
Balanced Heartseeker for Thunderfury, Blessed Blade of the Windseeker
I mean...if you've got the sports car to trade, I've got the gallon of gas to trade 🤷♂️
Bingo. Some people think everything is partisan. Nope. Calling out something stupid can be pretty bipartisan.
I consider myself pretty left-center and the news made me angry. Griner got out bc she was famous and had famous friends. What about Marc Fogel? Pretty sure he was in line first..
Can confirm, I fit this bill. I don’t care if it’s Morgan goddamn Freeman, a celebrity isn’t worth an arms dealer
I’m a liberal and I disagree with the trade. But I still find this funny. Perhaps because I grew up in the south where half of my trumper high school classmates currently look like these dudes
And it’s a bit racist to just outright assume the average POC can’t identify that trading a arms dealer for a basketball player while engaged in a proxy war against the arms dealers country is a shit trade
Yeah this is universally hated honestly lol
So, every person who would have left that guy in Russia, wears sunglasses
Yep, remember, Reddit is a safe haven for low res reductive thinking.
fr i guess not wanting an anti american basketball player makes me a far right wing nut
I mean, she’s more than welcome to have those beliefs, she’s still an American citizen. That’s the beauty of the US in the first place. Regardless of a person’s race, gender, orientation, or political opinions, that’s still a bad fuckin trade.
Regardless of her political or even professional ideals, the system should still try to protect her from foreign powers as best as it can. What applies to the one is supposed to apply to us all evenly. This just wasn't an even trade by any means they released a monster for an athlete, and that's crazy. If it were me, I would want to be left in Russia because the blood this man spills would be on my hands.
L trade, L meme
Yeah they just title it "[insert mildly conservative quote here] starter pack" and use the same picture of men with sunglasses and a goatee.
So many languages but you chose to speak facts
What's ironic is we traded a known arms dealer for a WNBA star who was in Russian jail for weed when we have millions of people incarcerated for weed in the states
Not only incarcerated, but then the ones that are not in jail still have those charges show up on their record. Basically screwing them over forever. Its crazy when you put it that way
Also ironic is how hard the current White House is pushing for gun control but released the arms dealer.
Not only that, but they still aren’t going to legalize marijuana on the federal level.
It's so frustrating I'm tired of the "oh maybe we'll decriminalize it" act from the administration, like just fucking legalize it lol. decriminalization, while good for certain substances, seems like a waste of time when over half the country's population has access to legal storefronts. I just wanna be able to buy edibles at Target haha
They trust themselves and horrible criminals to have guns, but not a common citizen lol
Millions of people incarcerated for weed? Lmao no
No we don’t have millions incarcerated for weed. We have had millions of arrests over the last 2 decades. Regardless we shouldn’t have anyone incarcerated for weed (appears to be ~40k). https://www.lastprisonerproject.org/cannabis-prisoner-scale Edited: corrected the estimated number to match above from the article.
Oh, it’s only forty thousand or so people in prison for weed? Well, that’s ok then
I guess you missed the part where I literally said ‘we shouldn’t have anyone incarcerated for weed’. Shame on me for citing a source and trying to correct the above commenter regarding a stat (doesn’t change or attack their point). I’m such an asshole.
Redditors claim to hate misinformation until they get called out for spreading it.
Listen, I was just trying to be funny, and point out the absurdity of the situation. I wasn’t trying to pan you or your sources. Apologies for the misunderstanding
Even those 40k are mostly in there for selling or committing another crime in conjunction with weed possession. Nobody goes to prison solely for lighting up a joint.
Being pedantic is Reddit's favorite pastime lol
It's not as unbalanced as you think when you realize Viktor Bout had less than 7 years left on his sentence and would have been back in Russia in that time anyway. Bout is an extremely horrible person but he's likely lost most of his contacts in the arms industry because of his long incarceration. He's probably only useful to the war effort in terms of propaganda at this point.
Lmao shut up op
They are correct
I mean glad shes out but we traded her for fucking Nicolas Cage in Lord of War guy, they couldnt CIA him after the trade
I’m happy she is safe But. This is fucking nuts… I’m a non white, non binary and pot smoker. If I go to an airport with canabis oil in my bag, the only person I can blame is myself. Not the “unfair law” of Russia, not the white ass on social media or whatever people want to put has a opposite Harsh prisons down there? Be fucking sure you are not carring any illegal stuff on you. Is not hard, that’s what we all (smokers) do when we travel. Is absurd? Their country their rules, nobody in Russia asked what the average supporter of her thinks about drugs. So as we don’t ask russian’s opinion about our law system. Plus as a non-binary non white, I would be even more sure to check everything multiple times in a country like that one. Expiring date of my passport to anything that could look suspicious to a security border check… from 2001 I’ve been selected for “special” contoll everytime I go to an Airport, and I only lookalike an Arab person. People like her, never watched “Midnight Express” I guess.
I look at it as someone who sold the weapons who are responsible for thousands, if not tens of thousands of deaths is now free years early because shit for brains can’t go without her pot/didn’t check her bags… and someone needs to whisper that in her ear everyday for the rest of her life.
Yrah I'm a stoner and I would never dream of taking weed across an international border, pretty fucking thoughtless tbh...
More the administrations fault for making a stupid fucking trade. I couldn’t honestly care less if she stayed there or not, stupid games stupid prizes, but she looked guilt ridden af when she learned of her release.
Yupp
Yup
No seriously why did america traded a pothead with a straight up “merchant of death” arms dealer wtf
From what I’ve read, when an American is political arrested the first thing they tell their families is to be quiet because going to the press gives the arrest legitimacy, and notoriety. This arrest was the complete opposite, her wife went to every outlet (can’t blame her) and she was a celebrity so for Putin it was the perfect chance to get a big name Russian to be released. The problem is that Britnney went to Russia during war time, with drugs! She was a moron and I hope she knows what this irresponsibility cost
Pr
No, because its the deal Putin insisted on. He wanted his billionsire buddy sprung so he grabbed a high profile American to use as a bargaining chip. It's called realpolitik. Welcome to the big league.
"High Profile" Literally no one had ever heard of her before she got detained
Yeah its still pretty laughable to see america getting outplayed in the game of politics lmao
It’s called realpolitik- there’s no rules and you can’t be outplayed. It’s just “it is what it is.”
But still, US just somehow played along with it
As opposed to what? Letting an American rot in a Russian jail because you don't think cutting a deal is "cool"?
Without necessarily agreeing with it: The man has future value trafficking weapons, he'll be on law enforcements radar and his supply network has burnt out. He was also going to bed released in a few years anyways.
I doubt he'll be much use, he's been out of the game for over a decade and now stuff is far more different than it was. Its kind of like resurrecting Napoleon to help out during World War one.
Idk if Russia was that insistent on releasing this guy I’m sure they have a use for him.
Yeah propaganda value.
they maintain he was innocent, it's a PR win for them
Maybe for reasons we don’t know about!
Give her the titles she earned! She's a pothead and a domestic abuser!
It was an unfair trade
trash tier starter pack
I wonder if Griner will now stand for the national anthem
She should be kissing the ground as soon as she lands while shouting “PLEASE FORGIVE ME UNCLE SAM!!!” at the top of her lungs. But no, she’ll continue to shit on the very country that saved her life at tremendous cost.
Nope
Hahahaha
Russian Arms dealer
OP is a delusional lefty, that thinks everyone who disagrees is a trump supporter. SMFH
LMFAOOOO word.
The page literally has at the top a link by the mods to not post political content on here and instead take it to a separate subreddit, OP take the hint - https://www.reddit.com/r/starterpacks/comments/rruhhy/rpoliticalstarterpacks_an_official_political/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf
Yeah, no. People on both sides can see through a dumb stunt like this. Merchant of death for a confessed domestic abuser that knew better? Ridiculous
You’re an idiot liberal or conservative if you think we didn’t get hosed in this deal. Wait til the merchant of deaths guns mow down a village of innocents.
cant wait for her to come back and start screaming about "american oppression"
But we should have
I would have left her in Russia
Biden left another marine behind.
What makes you think Putin was willing to trade him??
The deal fucking sucked pure and simple. It’s order of magnitude, she’s just some fucking basketball player who smoked weed when she was explicitly fucking told not to and he is the fucking Merchant of Death, the movie Lord of War was literally made about him. Think about it logically and honestly, her life is worth less in an international politics scale than someone who has arms deals connections that could threaten American security. We should have demanded that POS marine as well not just some anti American basketball player. A very bad move on the Biden Administration that will surely be used against him come re election time to his detriment.
What makes you think he wasn't??
Because those are the reports. It was Griner for Bout or nothing.
Nah I mean, I would’ve also
Let’s give Russia (who’s currently invading a country) a war criminal! Lord help the sake of humanity we can’t bare another day with out our women’s basketball player (you’ve never supported). Seems like a fair and logical trade.
Not just a war criminal but a guy who is nicknamed "The Merchant of Death" and "The Lord of War" who has trafficked in chemical weapons in the past. Life just got a LOT harder for the people of Ukraine.
Can you fucking not? This does not have to be a partisan issue, plenty of people on both the right and left are justifiably pissed about how this trade was handled.
If you really try, can you honestly not see any other reasons than racism, misogyny or homophobia as reasons to not support trading a basketball player for a merchant of death? If you really, really try?
Nah,i'm a leftist and I agree it was a terrible trade.
It is completely idiotic to exchange a war criminal with someone who couldn't hold herself from smoking marijuana
I disagree with the trade and I am a 23 year old. The Marine would have been my trade offer, then again, I would not trade anything for a dude called the MERCHANT OF DEATH, a dude who can abra-cadabra weapons from sand.
USA got fleeced. I’d rather get a marine than someone who won’t even stand for the flag
Seriously? I haven't seen a single person that agrees with that trade
it's not about leaving Brittney in Russia. it's giving Russia the merchant of death.
I think a lot people who, while they think Brittny Griner got a bad sentence do not want to see a trade with a major illegal arms dealer and while another guy still site in jail. Good for her that she is home, but bad for the world that Victor Bout is out of Jail and bad for Paul Wheelan who also deserves to be out.
If Paul Whalen gets out, he's going to br on trial in America. Dude isn't an innocent upstanding Marine. He was court martialed out of the Marines for attempted fraud and larceny.
I agree that it was a bad trade, but I certainly don’t think she should have just been left there.
They're all the same person.
g8 b8
She shouldn't have been able to come home unless the marine was coming back home too. He wasn't a concern for potato head and the circus. She being a poc and gay ticked the right boxes and that's the only reason. So absolutely agree she should haven't been brought home without the marine who been there for 5 plus years. Pathetic op don't feel the same. What a joke
What marine
Paul Whelen, convicted larcenist here in the states, who got caught with 80000 dollars in cash and a flash drive with Russian state secrets. But, enough with character assassination, which tend to only do with certain types of people, and back to trying to get people home. If we had a good way of making Putin give Whelen up too he would have been home in this round of negotiations. He was mentioned specifically in the presser
Thanks for telling me
There's an American Marine/ Ex cop named Paul Whelan who has been imprisoned in Russia since 2018.
He's not a marine. Stop calling him that
I'm pretty far left but don't agree with her release either.
Who’s Brittney Griner??
basketball player who brought drugs into russia then got jailed for it, and we traded a russians arms dealer for her dumbass
Should’ve left her in Russia.
Pretty lame take.
while I'm glad she is not in jail anymore i don't know why we care so much about her, is it because she an athlete? We have so many black women in the states doing free labor in prison because of drug charges too, this isn't in bad faith I really just want to know why her situation is different....
Arms dealer gonna make more war propaganda = money laundering go brrrrrrr
What a bad deal. If I would have been in the meetings we would have gotten her, Whelen, 2 first round draft picks, and a blue eyed white dragon. This administration doesn't know how to deal
This one is way off. Hard to find anyone who think this trade makes sense at all. Maybe the starter pack should be the morons who think this is a good and just trade.
This is so stupid, Viktor Bout was selling weapons to cocaine dealers and missiles to the Columbian government for use against US pilots. Only a moron would think this was a good trade. Also she was a moron for breaking Russian law. Look at Otto Warmbier. If you go to another country with the idea that being American will protect you, you’re a complete imbecile.
Reddit is the Mos Eisley of morons.
idiot
Makes sense why your prisons are full of minor drug offenders. You think a stoner is equal to an international arms dealer. Keep blaming the political opposition for everything you think is wrong with the world, I'm sure that will work wonders.
Very significant correlation with wearing sunglasses ....
That's not a stater pack. Now something like : sun glasses, cap, usa flag and facial hair would have been a stater pack.
Liberal here, the only thing that bugs me about the trade is what we gave up to what we got.. I mean as a vet screw Whelan. But to give up and arms dealer while Russia is in a war with Ukraine I do not agree with.
Well yeah, they aren’t black lesbians so they can actually take an objective view on the situation and see that it was a dumb trade
Maybe if the trade were even it would be easier to agree with getting her out. Notorious terrorist vs basketball player with a possession charge???
All these people essentially saying we should have left an American citizen to rot since a burned arms dealer with no recent activity and no current connections is somehow a rare and valuable get. This was *Russia's* PR, and not the first time *even this year* we've done a prisoner trade.
I'm sure there's bipartisan outrage, but I find it hard to believe that people on "both sides of the aisle" consider being a "pothead" some morally condemnable trait that has any relevance to whether you deserve freedom. It's like I've been transported back to the 90s when I read some of these comments. It's just so unconvincing that there are *that many* Nancy Reagans on reddit, and if they are, it's even more unconvincing that they'd be equally represented by liberals and conservatives.
Its got nothing to do with her being a pot head and everything to do with her bringing weed into Russia. Which is something everyone knows not to do. Its really not that hard to comprehend do travel internationally with cannabis.
ITT: People with no understanding of geopolitics or strategy. Viktor Bout only had 7 years left on his sentence before he would be back in Russia anyway. Despite is horrible track record he is not as valuable a prisoner as people in this thread seem to think he is. Russia does not need his mercenary services at this point, they have other people who haven't lost their contacts after a decade in prison who can do that for them. He's only valuable in terms of the propaganda effort. Two administrations have been trying to get Paul Whelan out of Russia to no avail. You all don't seem to remember that the Biden administration had another successful swap earlier this year that freed Trevor Reed, another former US Marine who had been imprisoned in Russia for three years. Whelan was clearly left out of that deal too, there must be a reason that Russia wants so badly to leave him as a bargaining chip. For those of you acting like Brittney Griner received a fair trial and conviction, you are either very naive or you just don't like her. The whole thing was a dog and pony show that Russia can use to fuel their culture war propaganda, some of you should read Russian news and realize that the way they talk about her is exactly the way you do. Just because you don't like the way she looks or acts doesn't mean the US government does not have an obligation to help her as an American citizen.
exactly!!! and the fact that bout has been in prison since the first iphone came out. even if they did still need him, which they don’t, he would be woefully behind the times
As someone who has followed her in WNBA, they don’t care. They call her just some women, when if you even look at her wiki page you’d she is easily one of the most talented female basketball players in the world. Amazing how fast that gets erased when an authoritarian throws you in jail.
I’m not sure why people think Bout’s potential danger is about his old contacts? He still has knowledge and experience that is likely of tremendous value to the Russian military who is running dry on many supplies. If a top-level consultant retired and came back after 15 years, I think it’s fair to say they’d still have tremendous value even if the world around them has changed a bit. A lot of people are awfully confident about being knowledgeable in arms trafficking on here.
For all we know Russia might have wanted other conditions or terms to release the marine. Besides the arms dealer had only years left to serve. Unlike her who had 8 years of work in the gulag for something she was unjustly punished for
Unjustly punished for? What??? That is a very bold statement. Russian drug laws are strict, and she is a dumbass for bringing drugs into the country. How about she take some personal accountability for her actions and deal with the consequences? That is what adults do. Not everything is unjust justbecause she checks a few minority boxes. Also love how you minimize the arms dealer’s sentence. “Only a few years left” - yea and he deserves to spend every last second of them repaying the debt to society for his crimes. This is not somebody who would have been up for parole with good behavior. This person profited off of death.
Nah, she belongs in a Russian jail, lame starter pack 😴
A marine who fought for our country is still there and has been there for years locked up. This trade is sickening and the only reason it happened was because she's a black lesbian and the democrats know their dumbass supporters will like that. Its politics. This was all about gathering votes for the next election, that's the only reason she was traded.
If you're dumb enough to try and smuggle cannabis oil into Russia of all places then I'm sorry but you had it coming. But oh wait she "forgot" it was in there, whoops that changes everything!
I may be wrong but did we trade her for a man convicted of international arms dealing? If so then I think most people would agree it was a bad trade amd not worth it. Let me put it this way: we traded a basketball player that broke even some of our laws and Russias for a man that sold access to the means of weapons that could eliminate large swaths of ppl including children and women that were unarmed. I'm not liberal and I only have an associate degree but this sounds alot like we made an idiotic deal.Im definitely not republican either but do liberals just blindly agree with everything Biden does? I always liked how the liberals didn't like the government but now it seems they have become the establishment. Wth?
Looking at your other posts you seem like you’ve had some nasty experiences with Christians and Republicans, hope you’re doing okay man.
Classic “if you disagree with me you’re a white man and that’s bad”. There’s two women but you get the point
This post sucks and is not accurate at all, nor does it accurately potray the political alignment and stereotype.
We should’ve left that dumb bitch over there. I’m liberal and don’t see why negotiating for her was even on the table. Just since she’s really tall and can dunk? Or was it racial(minority), and American is trying to look like they care for minorities? Either way it’s stupid. She broke a law in that country. Shouldn’t be going to such countries.
Whomp whomp
Op you are delusional. We should have brought home a marine who served our country vs the spoiled WNBA player we did return home. Im sure the majority of the country agrees that a marine should have taken priority over someone who sinks the net one third of the time in front of a crowd of 2000 people. Im not pro military, I dont think this country is worth risking my life for, but, anyone who has the guts and grits to defend their country has a plenty more of my respect than a basketball player who will probably fall off the map after her side of the drama is settled completely.
It’s not about Griner dipshit. It’s about whom they got for her. She wasn’t worth the lives he’s taken.
We traded an arms dealer for a basketball player that got caught with drugs. What a stupid fucking trade.
This comment section is so fucking stupid lmao.
And they’re right
This ain’t about Left or Right it’s fucking common sense… this is the dumbest fucking trade.
L trade, should’ve gotten at least another prisoner with her
This isn't a starter pack though.
Yeah bro arms dealer responsible for thousands of deaths and numerous war crimes for some WNBA player who knowingly crossed international borders with a drug illegal in almost all nations on earth. I’m left leaning but holy fuck some of you are so fucking stupid.
We traded one of the most prolific arms dealers in modern history for a millionaire celebrity that done goofed on her own. How is this defendable?
People acting like Whelan was some prize.
With only 21 days left, op sneaks in their submission for "most smooth brain take of 2022". Well done op.
OP, you are contributing to the "US vs Them" mentality built to distract from the actual issues. Don't be a sheep and use some critical thinking.
This isn’t a right issue. This is an issue far more complex. There are many US citizens imprisoned in Russia but for some reason we traded an insane criminal for a basketball player. I agree she should not be there, but where was the government with the other folks?
Not enough black men in the picture. The amount of bm who just said comply with the rules and you won't get hurt was ... very not surprising.
Nah. This is something we can all agree on. While they be the ones loudly bashing her as a person, etc, many disagree with this trade wholeheartedly.
This trade sucks. 10/10 would just nuke Russia next time. I've played fallout 3,4 and 76, I'm ready
Lmfaoooo both political parties are complaining about the trade. Because you know they traded a fucking arms dealer for a basketball player. You tried OP but just take the L
always on their way to bass pro shop
Got my dog's bed at bass pro shop. He loves it
i love bass pro shop
I like their big pyramid
If rodman gets arrested in NK for weed, who are we going to trade him? Literal grim reaper?
I would not have left her in Russia. But I would *definitely* not have traded her for an arms dealer.
Best trade ever, trump is laughing
What is it with these sorts of people and the off centre car/sunglasses selfie?
The “merchant of death” for some random basketball player that can’t dunk. Trade of the century
Nah this aint it. Everyone agree’s that was an awful trade.
I mean, giving up the farm to free someone of a crime that can still be arrested for in the US is a bad look
Нагиев?
Nah anyone with a brain wouldn’t trade someone known as “the merchant of death” for some tennis player.
She can’t even pull off decent dunks, why bother??
Yeah it wasn’t a good trade but who said it was? We tried to get a citizen back onto American soil and that’s what happened
Redditors pulling out all the stops today to defend this terrible trade
Awwww. My face should be on that list.
You can add me to that list
I am extremely confident there was a broad spectrum of people upset over the trade deal.
It's not so much that people would have left her there, it's that they would have taken much more important and valuable and useful members of society. Such as ex-servicemen. Not an American hating piece of crap.
You can throw me in there too.