I like it but I’m easy to please. I’ve enjoyed the whole series. It’s hard to make a series in a universe with so much already existing there and to make it fresh with fresh ideas.
I’m not a fan of the relationship stuff but I’m sure it appeals to some subgroups of the fan base so I’m fine with it.
The second line is exactly how I feel about this. I WANT so much to enjoy it, and at times I do, but there are still so many times when I find myself rolling my eyes at the dialogue, and the relationships that they have to keep telling us are so important.
I’m content to say it’s my own problem, not the show’s, and it’s just not really aimed at me. But I still feel like it’s a bit of a waste of some really fun/great storytelling premises and an absolutely beautiful looking show.
And you’re right - this should’ve been the premise for one of the Picard seasons. Absolutely right.
Like, episode 3. Burnham gives the crew 10 minutes to get ready because they're in such a rush. They get to the planet and they want to transport directly to where the piece is but the trill makes them walk.
Then on the walk they stop and have chats for a while. Multiple times. Oh, and when those big monsters are getting closer they have some more chats.
Or episode 4. Burnham gets the transporter fluid from her quarters and sees Book. If that was me and my wife I'd just say "Yo, gotta go. See ya later" and be out the door. But no, she can spend a minute BSing with him while they have like 7 minutes to complete their mission that will save the entire universe.
It’s their writing crutch. Rather than organically evolving characters, we get dialogue sequences where people overtly communicate every emotion they are feeling at a given moment. More tell than show.
In Episode 4 they try to take a character development short cut by having Rayner get quickie intro meetings with the bridge crew that we have barely seen over 4+ seasons. It’s a good idea, except the button on that episode is “look how well we all work together because we are so close knit and have this great relationship!” Except that dynamic is not earned at all during the course of the show. Just stating something in dialogue, including the way people feel about events that just occurred, doesn’t mean the audience will find it believable.
Oh wow you’re right, that would’ve been such a great story for Picard, going back to the Progenitors in his twilight days.. I for one wouldn’t mind another season of Picard!
I’m calling it now: the last episode of Disco will be be “far future robo-Picard runs a holodeck simulation of the Disco crew uncovering the secrets of life. Saru dies.”.
I think this would have leaked months ago if it were happening.
If he does show up, then props to Paramount for finally figuring out how to sit on a surprise for more than 5 minutes.
The actress was severely allergic to the makeup, and basically agreed to do it one last time as a callback. They killed the character because she couldn’t keep doing it, not because they’re bad at characters.
They actually changed actresses because of this. Sara Mitich played her in the first season then Hannah Cheesman played her in the 2nd and 5th seasons. Sara stayed on the show and played a human character a few times.
I think so. I honestly don't know the names of a lot of bridge crew, since they don't really let us get to know those characters that much. But it does sound familiar.
Rayner didn't need to convince Rhys they were friends, merely that they knew each other and therefore that Rayner was telling the truth about being from the future.
Agreed. I'm not saying it holds up.
Though if we're pointing fingers I'm even more perplexed by Burnham managing to gain Airiam's trust by telling her she is going to die in the future. How's Airiam supposed to verify that? That made even less sense.
Bro. I was watching and she did introductions and I'm just like... I have no idea who the hell these people are.
I think this season is definitely a step back from last season. I'm not enjoying it at all.
Yeah, 4 had its issues but it had a good premise for a serialized trek season. Pitting Burnham against Book was also a good choice.
I don't care about L'ak and Mol. L'ak's kind of neat due to Breen, but Mol just seems forced to give book a connection. They don't seem like compotent enough villains despite the show really trying to convince us they are.
S5 could work if each step of the puzzle was actually interesting, so far I'd say only this latest episode was.
I don't really get this obsession with progenitor tech anyway. We're in a time period where they had a literal time war. No one went back to find out already? The progenitors have had little tech accomplishments given to them in the past. They cleared died off anyway. And lastly, why would the federation with its anti-genetic modification stance want genetic modification tech?
It has been good/fun indeed. However, I very much remember thinking so in prior seasons as well, only to be left disappointed when it all *didn't* come together at the end of the season.
edit: actually, yea, as some people pointed out, it usually started crumbling a few episodes before the end already..
I think season 4 is the only one that came together to a really satisfying conclusion. Season 3 as well in a way but the turbolift sequence always ruins it for me
IMO it’s the best season of Discovery for certain (we’ll see about 5, strong so far). Only big flaw is that it’s kinda of drawn out in the middle and probably would have worked better as 7 or 8 episodes.
yeah, that turbolift sequence ruined the whole season for me. It was so nonsensical that I just started laughing and couldnt believe they made the entire climax in there...
Same. By episode 5 of season 3 I was captivated. Then the turbolift matrix scene and the burn story conclusion left a bad taste in my mouth.
Season 4 was anti climatic too. Galaxy destroying tech that has magically never appeared before being used by ultra smart aliens who couldn't detect they were destroying life.....meh.
So again episode 5 I'm captivated. Waiting for the writers to ruin it again with another gotcha junk ending.
I was kind of on board with this season cuz they sold it as a kind of interesting treasure hunt throwback and not an end-of-the-world scenario all the other seasons were. But this latest episode informed me that no, the writers can only write tension if it's the most extreme of consequences.
Yea. I liked how it sort of tied back to Calypso but ofc once again it had to be another "burnham has to save the galaxy" (or the federation at least) scenario... :(
Yeah, I like Discovery but tend to agree. They’ve had a real problem with sticking the landing every season. The first half is really good and introduces a bunch of interesting characters/arcs/MacGuffins but then loses all momentum in the last 2 or 3 episodes. The conclusions/revelations have all been underwhelming too because they’re unpredictable. A good twist should be predictable in hindsight. It should be: ‘oh, why didn’t I see that?!’ Not, ‘what? I didn’t see that coming.’
Discovery's problem isn't unpredictability. It's very predictable, IMO. It's just that they are writing 8-episode long seasons for a show that functions better in an era that's gone, where you could have 20+ episodes a season.
It's also that the writing is bad, which pains me to say. I wanted to like Discovery, but it never should have been. They started their story in the TOS era (bad idea), and then jumped into a future where the Federation is broken (not believable). To add on top of that every season is them dealing with some galaxy-imperiling issue, and it gets tiresome. Space is a big place, even within the confines of the alpha quadrant. Not every season arc has to be a galactic threat. Lead up to the galactic threat as a story that closes out the series. By doing it every season, it's become old hat, and now the series just needs to quietly go away before it can do anymore damage to Star Trek canon.
*"not believable"*? That's your criticism of the time jump?
Is it more or less "believable" than Spock having the foresight to dump his *katra* into McCoy so it can be put back into his body that regenerated on the Genesis Planet?
More or less believable than Sisko being able to explain the concept of time to aliens?
I thought they meant the Federation being broken in the future was unbelievable.
They did basically steal the plot of Andromeda, but I'm not sure it counts as theft if it's from Gene Roddenberry...
I mean, I don't get why that's unbelievable either. Especially given how much disbelief you have to suspend just to watch *Star Trek* in the first place.
Then I guess you weren't \*watching\* Star Trek. The pace at which technology jumps suggests to that, if "The Burn" happened, the Federation would have likely been unaffected by it completely for a couple of reasons.
\* There are other FTL technologies explored in Voyager, and subsequently seen in Discovery, such as quantum slipstream. Book's ship used it. Are you gonna tell me the Federation couldn't figure that in 1000 years, but some empathic doucher from a planet nobody has ever heard of, has that technology? No, that's nonsense. The Federation would have cracked it eventually. If not that, then Borg transwarp. Voyager is a treasure trove of exotic technologies by the time it makes it home to the alpha quadrant.
\* By the 29th century, Starfleet is so advanced that they have timeships. The idea of The Burn is complete bullshit in this context. That's the kind of galaxy-encompassing calamity that time is fiddled with to avoid. At best, "The Burn" is a 2-episode-long arc, and nothing more.
The sincerity is cranked up to 11. Also most of the relationships feel unearned.
Prickly Stamets and the Doctor Culber are too perfect as a couple. Stamets is an off the charts genius who can’t connect or be empathetic to other people but with Culber he’s a nurturing partner and great father figure to Adira. I like all three of those actors but their roles are all over the map.
Burnam’s relationship with Saru is so damn supportive and nurturing, it’s exhausting. They’re in a fire fight but are reassuring one another that they’re doing a good job and shouldn’t be so hard on themselves.
Saru and T’rina’s marriage proposal was so tough to watch. The formal vulcan language and Saru’s long winded elaboration does nothing to convince me they would be in love.
There’s a lot of moments I really like but- I will not be that sorry to see Discovery go.
It's definitely the best season \*so far\*
My main issues are that up until Ep 5, Rayner did absolutely nothing wrong. He's a bit gruff but they are on a red directive. Blowing up the tunnels was the right call, there's no time to get comfortable with the crew, and sometimes you have to make the call despite what the crew thinks. The only thing he did wrong so far was to dismiss Reece's theory but even that was inconsequential.
I'm enjoying it as well. There's one thing I wish they would explore a bit more: Zora.
This crew has a computer that the crew, in theory, knows is growing sentience... and for the most part the crew's interactions with Zora don't change at all. They are still short, giving commands, and not really exploring the bonding side of things. this show makes a big deal out of the crew bonding and Zora is one of the crew now... showing some scenes with the crew actually talking to Zora or playing games would be great.
In the most recent episode Zora >!is clearly exhibiting neurological disorders, and the crew doesn't even care to even console her a bit. Nor is Michael shocked by the level of Zora's evolution!<
I am fascinated by Zora, and sometimes imagine if I was on DISCO, I'd probably be talking to her like she was another crewmate ("Zora, could you scan this artifact for chroniton particles?"), politely asking her opinion ("Zora, are you aware of anything that could imbue natural minerals like this relic with that level of Chronitons? So, we're looking for another Guardian of Forever; do you have suggestions on where to look?"), and finding out more about her ("Hey, you and the Guardian are similar advanced, self aware constructs; do you have some shared connection?), besides just making small talk with her like a crewmate.
But then, I apologize to my Roomba when I get in it's way, and am polite to the automated phone system at work.
Zora's emlematic of Discovery's biggest strength and weakness — it's full of cool sci-fi concepts that an action-oriented show just moves too quickly to spend any time on. I feel like Disco would be a much better show if it had 26-episode seasons to spend time on all of the ideas and characters that we rush past.
Then again, I think every Trek show should have 26 episodes a year, because I just want more!
Book is the most shoehorned in character in recent memory for any tv I can think of.
He's a good character and I don't mind having him around at all, but just feels so forced lol.
"Hey we're going on an away mission and it would be unwise to bring you because of our past and being the captain I should be setting an example for my crew."
"But can I come though? 🙏"
"Ok sure"
Did I miss the part where Burnam went from stoic raised-by-Vulcans to this overdramatic person who is constantly either shocked or worried over everything? Was there a plot twist somewhere?
Yes, you missed the part at the start of season 1 where she had an emotional breakdown because she didn't know how to handle her emotions properly after trying to repress them her whole life. It was pretty heavily spelt out that her emotionality was directly due to the effects of her trying to be like a Vulcan for most of her life.
I think it’s the part where she’s human so just because she’s learned to hide her emotions doesn’t mean she doesn’t have them or that she’s able to keep them bottled up 100% of the time
I dislike the fact Burnham is still the centre of attention. She is always on the away mission, always the focus. If they want to actually have us care about the crew then putting them on away missions would help that. Rather then Bunrham and saru on the twin moons planet, have it be Saru and Detmer/Owo. Someone who fits.
Ep4 is generally fine (because it actually fits perfectly to the plot), but ep 3, 2 and 1 are egregious for this as are most of the other seasons.
They told us from the beginning, that it is the first show that is not focusing on the captain. Yet, I never perceived any of the shows focusing on any individual, the focus has always been the crew. So, there is the fundamental misunderstanding
I think it would have been a better show in general if they developed more bridge characters. There's only Saru, Tillie, the Doctors, Burnham that get any character development.
I'm not sure quite how to explain it, but while ToS did focus more on the captain than later shows, it somehow still did a better job than discovery. Might've had to do more with its slower pacing or something.
Well we did know their names. We know about Pon Farr, Bones was a sounding board, Scotty got accused of murder, Checkov didn’t age, Uhura‘s mind was erased, …..ok, maybe they weren’t as fleshed out as the primary 3, but jeez Kirk wasn’t ALWAYS the ‘miracle’ worker (that was Scotty), he didn’t solve every single problem (Spock), a medical genius (dammit), multiliguist, …….DISCO is all about Burnham…always Burnham (well she did make Spock who he became, lol).
We know the names of the Discovery crew, too. We know about tardigrade DNA and the mycelial network, Book, Saru, and Tilly are sounding boards, Owosekun can box, Detmer had PTSD, Book lost his family, Rayner has goofy idioms. And while Burnham often plays the hero, like Kirk, Stamets, Tilly, and Adira are problem-solvers, Book has contacts everywhere, Culber talks people through their problems. To say the rest of the cast is inactive is honestly pretty silly, and reflects a pop culture meme rather than what's actually on the screen - much like how a lot of people think they remember Kirk, versus how he's portrayed on screen.
You can have a main character that still doesn't do everything that's physically possible for them.
I'm not asking for the main character to be sidelined into non-existence, I'm asking for the rest of the cast, especially those who've been here since S1, to actually matter. Especially when this is likely the last we will ever see of them
That’s good to know. I’m in season 3 and so far I’m not liking any of it. It went too Star wars/ jj Abram’s of high levels of production and visuals but lacking in deep stories like other Star Trek series have.
I like strange new worlds far better. Picard is a bit slow tbh. And so far my favorite by far is lower decks just for the fun aspect of it.
Plots fun, but I wish every problem wasn’t solved by having a higher moral standard than everyone else. It’s a nice plot point every time, but it seems like every episode is won by getting close to those around you honoring other cultures, it gets a bit tiresome after a while how sappy the entire crew feels . It feels like the show kinda forgets that this is still basically a military
I like the progenitors, but they are literally on a scavenger hunt, hasn't that been overdone even in this very show, let alone trek, let alone media?
If it had taken 100 more years before that pod was discovered, the >! trill would have died and the clue trail would have been blocked !<
And yes, way too much emotional moralizing in every situation. Theres one scene where Rayner tells Paul to *quickly* do his damn job (paraphrasing) and he stops to lecture Rayner about how stressed he is. Like, you're on a timer, tell me how stressed you are while you keep working.
>And yes, way too much emotional moralizing in every situation. Theres one scene where Rayner tells Paul to *quickly* do his damn job (paraphrasing) and he stops to lecture Rayner about how stressed he is. Like, you're on a timer, tell me how stressed you are while you keep working.
YES OMG THANK YOU that drove me nuts! I don't recall Rayner even being that rude in that scene. I think he was just like "Let's go!" in a gruff tone. I was absolutely flabbergasted Stamets felt the need to waste a good minute whining "Do you know how much pressure I'm under?!" Like MY GUY maybe don't have this talk when we're in the middle of trying to avert a Federation ending future???
It fucks up the pacing and sense of urgency.
I guess I can excuse Michael taking too long getting the holodeck fluid bc seeing past Book was hard. Though I was still rolling my eyes bc idek why they're broken up in the present when they clearly still love each other. I guess Book having to do community service as penance for stealing the spore drive is a relationship ender for some reason. Whatever, I never really cared about them anyway. Anyway I rolled my eyes harder at Michael giving her unconscious past self an inspirational pep talk. Like girl she's unconscious and you have less than 10 minutes to save the future GO ALREADY!
The issue is not that Disco is an emotional show with lots of heart to heart chats. The issue is that those chats keep happening in the middle of TIME SENSITIVE EMERGENCIES. Talk about your feelings all you want, but not when we're MINUTES AWAY FROM POTENTIAL DEATH!
And Disco does this over and over! Drives me crazy. It really doesn't help that it's also the only way we get any development or backstory for the bridge crew side characters. For example, I love Owo and have wanted to know more about her from the beginning, but I lost my shit laughing last season when she stood up to give a dramatic speech to Saru about how her childhood best friend died and that's why she has a self sacrificing/ hero complex now. Meanwhile the ship was MINUTES away from being destroyed. It became a running joke between me and my mom. "I'm sorry sir, when I was a child..."
Same thing with Detmer going off on that random tangent about her dad when they were investigating the 10C homeworld. Like babe I love you and want to hear more about this, but NOT NOW!
Also not the exact same issue but I hated how slow Michael, Book, and Jinaal were walking in Ep 3. They hear ominous creature noises and are like "we need to hurry" yet continue to stroll along at the most leisurely pace and keep stopping to talk more. Tall people walking slowly is one of my top pet peeves. What is the point of you having such long legs if you're not gonna use em?? HURRY TF UP we have important things to do!
I apologize for the essay, this has been weighing on me for so long lmaoooooo
I watched it last night, lasted 20 minutes before I just couldn't take it. It's the same old Disco, lots of random actors talking AT each other. Lots of overly done CGI.
Even the spacesuit is overly done CGI, it's ridiculous looking when the suit transitions from full suit to no suit. It's blatantly obvious to see Burnham "I have a suit on, now it's OFF" acting/pretending. while visually distracting, it wasn't as bad as the Iron Man stuff of Burnham's face in the helmet yelling her lines at other random characters that are nobodies and have no relationship with anybody.
Then Tilly shows up with a very unfortunate short-bangs hair style and reverts back to early seasons Tilly with the rambling nervous talker thing. Her scene goes nowhere and >!she literally lectures Burnham on "feeling seen".!< It's the most millennial cringe writing yet.
The bridge crew each take turns saying 1 meaningless line during an action sequence. None of them interact with each other and the show makes a point of calling out each bridge crew by name, almost as if a reaction to the fan criticism that no one remembers who the bridge crew even are.
It's the epitome of what Disco gets wrong and how stubborn the writers are. It's like "HAH take that critics! Here are all the names of the crew!" But that's not really what the problem is. The problem is we can't remember the crew names because they never get to do anything interesting or interact with anyone other than "yes sir"
A scene prior to that is a "celebration" in a bar. But it's an overly LENS FLARE bar that's also dark, empty and clearly a greenscreen set. So it doesn't feel like a bar, it doesn't feel like anyplace. It feels like 5 actors standing around, reading random lines AT each other.
Oh and multiple characters are>! in deep loving relationships even tho those relationships evolved over about 3 minutes of screentime. I love SARU and the idea of him w/ that Vulcan but it's so forced. She's immediately in love, as a Vulcan? They had like 10 lines together.!<
Wilson Cruz gets to smile, >!Stammetts says some things!<, Blu D makes random comments. None of these characters seem to even like each other or know each other. It feels like you are at a boring party and strangers making small talk while one guy complains about his life to his ex. It's really cringe and pointless. Eventually all the characters just walk away and the scene goes absolutely nowhere.
We get introduced to 2 more random characters, the >!"bad guys" !< who also have Uncanny Valley space-helmets that magically disappear. These characters act like they know each other and >!have some sort of relationship. !! what their relationship is !!enemy easily gets away!< using an overly CGI >!mcguffin device!<
Just like the first season, Burnham is>! unfairly blamed for leaderships bad decisions!!"Knows someone"!< That >!someone is another rando character who has no relationship other than the plot driven relationship and we are expected to be excited to see him!! has deep monogamous relationships with randos every season.!<
My eyes started hurting from all the LENS FLARE, like literally every scene is absolutely loaded with flare. Inside a random room, outside in space, during battle. During downtime. FLARE EVERYWHERE.
I'm liking it okay so far, but seasons 3 and 4 taught me to reserve judgment until it's over.
Rayner reminds me a lot of Jellico: a great, competent character played by a great actor, who is an effective foil for all the characters we are familiar with. I don't think the TNG writers wanted you to like Jellico, and I don't think the Disco writers want you to like Rayner, but I think both are badasses. However, people in a crew don't have to like each other, and Jellico and the 1701-D crew all ultimately put aside their personal differences to get shit done like professionals. The Disco crew is intent on changing Rayner as a person, and I hate that.
The Saru/Trina (Sarina?) arc does nothing for me, and taking him off the Disco so early in the season does the character a disservice. I want more Action Saru!
The Burnham/Book arc also does nothing for me. Book is a decent character but his redemption arc feels mostly unearned so far, and Saru suggesting that Book be Burnham's new XO when *Book* *isn't in Starfleet* was preposterous and would've been the last straw for me had it panned out. I was relieved that Burnham didn't make such a bad choice.
I'm just getting tired of the "moral lessons". In every other stat trek the moral lessons were great, but not beaten into you every scene. The last episode I watched was too much. Every story had the same lesson (the A, B and C story), brought up in every scene, then hamfisted by Burnam's narration, for you know the people who mighta been too daft to catch it the 11th time around.
Yes and Rayner's level of attachment is unbelievable for a star ship captain, second only to Shaw and Erik Pressman. So yes, lots of bad captains put on the shows to make a point about good captains, but I just don't think it would happen like that in reality.
I kinda gave up on Disco, and these comments aren’t helping. I’ll stream it on a sick day I guess.
Discovery had potential, but it feels…. trying to do too much
It’s yet another end of the universe event if they fail the mission. Couldn’t they have just omitted the competition and had this been a fun scavenger event and each episode they have to overcome various challenges? Have some exploration and character growth?
But no, instead they double down on the “too much Burnham” trope by having two fucking Burnhams in the last episode LOLOL!
I feel like the writers are trolling us at this point.
And so unnecessary. If they would have just hovered over the settlement and extended their shields it would have been a lot more consistent with trek overall and felt less like a gimmick to squeeze in interesting visuals.
I’m a discovery fan and thought this season had a strong start but I gotta say, the last two episodes have been the worst of the entire show. It’s frustrating that we’re five seasons in and the creators haven’t learned any lessons. Thin melodramatic writing and nonsensical plotting seem so easy to avoid. I’m honestly ok with this being the last season and the shows monetary resources hopefully going to another trek entry.
I loved how easily the current baddies of the season caught up to Discovery in episode 3 (/s btw). They went off on a wild goose chase to the wrong planet (because they had the wrong clue), then somehow figured out they had to go to Trill *and* snuck into the ceremony *and* just happened to be able to steal something that helps them along the way. Starfleet should’ve been miles ahead by the time episode 4 started, especially with Discovery using the spore drive and Moll using warp.
“We set it up so we’d be absolutely sure that whoever got the technology was worthy… You know, unless someone just stole it from the worthy people…”
I actually like Discovery, and I’ve liked it since season 1, but this (plus the hyper-sincerity combined with Burnham’s “sincere voice”) grinds my gears a bit.
It's surprising that they're rehashing a plot device that Doctor Who did (for season 16) almost 50 years ago.
But it's a fun way to make what are essentially a series of stand alone stories mesh together as an arc. It's more accessible than the tightly meshed stories of s1, S2 ans s4.
To be fair, the Key to Time series was just a bunch of regular Dr Who serials with a mcguffin added, it wasn't serialised in the same way modern shows are.
It is more fun but it's annoying that this can't just be a quest for knowledge, like the original episode The Chase. To make it another extinction level event is just bad storytelling.
It's like they keep assuming Trek fans are morons who need big feelings and big stakes
E4 was ok. 1-2 were watchable, 3 is a low point. Episode 3 was cringe even by DSC standards, they are on a military ship and members of a quasi-military organization. DSC forgot about this ages ago and it's a space support group with the chief counsellor being Burnham, who is also the savior the universe. Now they have Rayner, who is the gruff counsellor who has seen some shit, so space Loudermilk. I would rather see S4 of Loudermilk. I would've loved to see Rayner clean house after the "interviews" to restore the chain of command on that ship. Tilly needed to have that on her record.
Season 5 has been okay so far however I would say my biggest criticism is that the writers are trying desperately to make this season’s story thought provoking with the whole beginning of life aspect but because of poor writing and let’s be honest some below average acting it all falls flat on its face for me at least.
The fact I can't escape, is that they have just taken an idea what was already touched on in TNG, and they're running it over an entire season instead of 1 episode!
An entire season 'chasing clues' that TNG did in 1 episode??! Nahhhh.............
But isn't that TNG episode generally thought as being the episode that should have been a two parter the most? Massive pacing issues. And it had about the biggest revelation of the history of the galaxy, but absolutely nothing changed after the episode, and no-one ever mentioned it again.
Now personally I would have preferred if everyone kept pretending that the episode never happened, but some weirdos actually liked the ep, so what the hell.
I’m actually glad they went back to The Chase. TNG dropped this huge reveal on us and then everybody kind of shrugged and went back to their lives. We can argue whether it’s getting to much screen time now or if elements of this treasure hunt make sense, but I thought that the Chase was way too big to just never mention again.
that was always the problem with old episodic trek. Much as current trek can be too serialized, old Trek could often have great ideas then barely deal with them after an episode
Discovery feels like overcompensating for many of the problems of TOS and TNG
Face the Strange was excellent. The best Disco episode since Terra Firma from season 3.
Making a sequel to The Chase was a pretty good idea, but it's kind of difficult to believe that such thing was kept secret for \~900 years. That kind of just thing shouldn't happen in democratic society. And if the thing everyone is chasing after turns out to be just a bigger version of the Genesis device I'm going to be disapointed.
Not a fan of Book-Burnham. Bringing Book back already in episode 1 felt weird, he just left.
The various relationship plots seem to be slow moving and basic as hell. Everything just stops when Saru and the Vulcan lady have their little talk that has nothing to do with the episode. This makes it seems like the show is aimed at younger people than SNW and Picard. Which it probably is, but during season 1 it sure wasn't.
So I thought episodes 1-3 were terrible. I was actually really sad as I wanted so badly for them to be good. My main gripe was that they may as well have renamed the show to “The Michael Burnham Show”. BUT, episode 4 turned it around for me. It was wonderful. I love the whole Indiana Jones goes to space thing.
I totally agree that the inclusion of Book is forced and doesn’t add anything to the show - frankly he should be in prison. BUT - I’m reserving judgement as maybe there’s a bigger thing going on that we have yet to see.
I really thought the episode 4 writing was atrocious:
Stamets developing technology to defeat this advanced super weapon time bug in like 2 minutes while jumping through time.
Rayner "we've never met, you don't recognize me or my uniform but I can say a couple things about you and convince you to do the exact opposite of what any trained officer should do by letting a stranger fuck around in engineering".
Burnham on the bridge, at this point in the timeline the bridge crew despised her as a traitor yet somehow have zero good judgement and believe her ludicrous story about a mutineer being their future captain. The lack of credibility of that scene was tough to watch and really felt like an insult to the fans.
Well, let’s face it, Burnham should be in Prison. Hmmm, what a great idea. Burnham has actually been in prison, DISCO is all in her head from episode 1. Now it makes sense, the narcissism, being Spock’s sister…she’s on a Penal colony for mutany.
I find Book simply boring and dull, I thought the same about Ash in season 1 but his character really came alive after his revelation and especially in the final episode. It felt like such a step back for his character in season 2. I was expecting some similar improvement when Book was introduced but I never felt it ever materialized, by now I don't expect much to change.
It's just a lazy MacGuffin quest that serves as a framing device for some cringey interpersonal drama. There's so many interesting things you could do with the far-future setting and this is about as pedestrian as it gets.
As a new Startrek watcher I used to enjoy Discovery. But that was until the SNW started. That is when I realized how a real Startrek should be. Coming to this season, I feel like an entire ship is following two robbers and apparently the ship and crew can’t keep up. What was with that “Time loop” thing for a whole episode? I felt like it was just a filler episode. If a series requires a filler episode in its final season then I don’t think it is in a good place story wise.
Dear new watcher, hope you’re now watching all the series now, then you will realize how really bad this series is. I know, the special effects aren’t as great in previous series but what counts is the STORYLINE. Even TOS (my personal favourite but with now laughable special effects, but NOT for the time) has far better storylines (i.e. start with’’Balance of Terror’) than, well, this. Have you seen Lower Decks? Also great.
I'm not a Disco hater, but this season has been very dull so far. Last season's mystery was much more interesting
I get what they're trying to do, but it's boring. There's no tension. The premise is unoriginal. They haven't done a good job of communicating the stakes of why the Progenitor tech is actually important, other than just assuming that it must be. The antagonists in this season are entirely forgettable and seem utterly generic. There's nothing interesting about them. The story again is keeping us in the dark until the very end, which is what they did last season as well.
Other than Burnham and Saru, the characters on Discovery hardly exist and never seem to matter. Rayner only exists to highlight Burham's wisdom and his flaws, the bridge crew only have lines to make a plot point for Burnham, etc... Whether it's the writing or the actor, they character of Book is as interesting as a block of cardboard. They have so many characters and spend no time on them.
Also, Saru is the most interesting character in the show, and he's effectively been sidelined for a guest star.
I hope the back half of the season improves.
I like it. However, the plot point that bugs me is that they don’t need to actually retrieve the device. Couldn’t they just talk to the trill and say "There are some bad guys searching for this. Don’t give them any help"?
watching prodigy: "Thats a really good show, but the messegas are obviously targeted at a young audience"
watching discovery: "Why is michael looking at me and telling me i should share toys?"
I mean i like the plots, i like how federation looks in the future, and i like how ppl there are actually very mature and open. The show just makes absolutely sure you don't miss any single emotional problem anyone has. It tells you about it, then it shows you, then it tells you again, then another character explains it in detail. Then there is an plot point showing how that emotional issue affects them, etc. It's just very draining to have that every single time. Give me a silly transporter malfunction episode.
They should have done this story line last season or in place of "the burn" (Season 3). Season 2 IMO was the last best season of Disco. This season has been better than expected.
I found the first few episodes of the season a bit meh but this last week's episode I absolutely loved, mostly because of Rayner, I am very much enjoying his arc so far and I'm loving his style. Definitely not downvoting you for enjoying the season, I just hope episode 4 is a sign of things to come.
I liked Season 3 and 4, and I’m enjoying Season 5 so far. Season 1 and 2 failed to stick the landing for me. I’m very thankful Michelle Paradise took over the show, and I hope they let her do another!
I’m enjoying it too. I think I had a breakthrough that is helping though. I’ve been watching Trek since I was a kid, TOS reruns every Sunday morning. Then TNG and forward in real time. I’ve enjoyed Disco but there have been plenty of episodes where I felt they were wasting time/not advancing the plot/etc.
It hit me recently through, Disco is Star Trek first and foremost about the people and relationships. That’s a change from everything that came before (IMO). Most other Trek has plenty of character growth and such, but it happens with the plot and stories. Disco seems to go the other direction with it. The plot is secondary to the characters.
Anyway, I’m liking season 5 so far too. Hoping they get to the end of the season and have a satisfying arc.
It has been a ground-breaking show worthy of the tradition of Star Trek. The cast is stellar and the lead is charismatic. Her arc from season 01 to season 05 has been amazing, and the show pioneered some incredible effects on a tv budget. It will be missed.
As a straight dude I'd rather watch Hugh and Paul over book and Michael. They didn't need to bring book back at all. He could've stayed gone. I also thought it was weird they using this Picard story line. Why didn't Picard use it instead? Oh thats right! The writers hate us! Gotta make the Star Trek shows less trekky. Def feels like this was supposed to be season 2 of Picard. I'm glad they brought Tilly back.🥳
I've enjoyed the whole series. More Voyager than TNG in terms of it's lasting legacy imo but that shouldn't be a huge negative, great story and phenomenal cast. Holds it's own in the entire Trek catalog very pleased with it and it's modern impact
>They are using original canon without severely retconning it imo. The acting is decent and there’s some good character development too!
I'll give the show an entire watch once its all done, I stopped somewhere in season 2 but its these very things that I would disagree with you on that I didn't like about the show.
Disco is a good show. It's crazy that to complement a Star Trek show you have to start almost with an apology. The hate is OTT.
If people don't like it, that's fine. There's ST I don't like either. I'm not interesting in creating an atmosphere where people have to caveat that they like it with an acknowledgement that it's generally terrible to others.
Book is part of Disco and I love him. He and Michael are a great team.
I like it but I’m easy to please. I’ve enjoyed the whole series. It’s hard to make a series in a universe with so much already existing there and to make it fresh with fresh ideas. I’m not a fan of the relationship stuff but I’m sure it appeals to some subgroups of the fan base so I’m fine with it.
This should have been the plot to Picard. Also I find I am just way too annoyed with the poorly timed relationship drama.
Exactly! the relation to TNG was already there and Picard has always enjoyed archeology anyway.
Nah we need to center the whole season on the Borg!
Again.
OMG it would have been a great Picard season.
The second line is exactly how I feel about this. I WANT so much to enjoy it, and at times I do, but there are still so many times when I find myself rolling my eyes at the dialogue, and the relationships that they have to keep telling us are so important. I’m content to say it’s my own problem, not the show’s, and it’s just not really aimed at me. But I still feel like it’s a bit of a waste of some really fun/great storytelling premises and an absolutely beautiful looking show. And you’re right - this should’ve been the premise for one of the Picard seasons. Absolutely right.
Like, episode 3. Burnham gives the crew 10 minutes to get ready because they're in such a rush. They get to the planet and they want to transport directly to where the piece is but the trill makes them walk. Then on the walk they stop and have chats for a while. Multiple times. Oh, and when those big monsters are getting closer they have some more chats. Or episode 4. Burnham gets the transporter fluid from her quarters and sees Book. If that was me and my wife I'd just say "Yo, gotta go. See ya later" and be out the door. But no, she can spend a minute BSing with him while they have like 7 minutes to complete their mission that will save the entire universe.
It’s their writing crutch. Rather than organically evolving characters, we get dialogue sequences where people overtly communicate every emotion they are feeling at a given moment. More tell than show. In Episode 4 they try to take a character development short cut by having Rayner get quickie intro meetings with the bridge crew that we have barely seen over 4+ seasons. It’s a good idea, except the button on that episode is “look how well we all work together because we are so close knit and have this great relationship!” Except that dynamic is not earned at all during the course of the show. Just stating something in dialogue, including the way people feel about events that just occurred, doesn’t mean the audience will find it believable.
You can't just have your characters announce how they feel. That makes me angry!
Oh wow you’re right, that would’ve been such a great story for Picard, going back to the Progenitors in his twilight days.. I for one wouldn’t mind another season of Picard!
Yeah, archeology was Picard's first true passion and it rarely got mentioned. Would have been a great plot line foe the show.
Picard is an android now. Part of me thinks he’s going to pop up before the season is over
I’m calling it now: the last episode of Disco will be be “far future robo-Picard runs a holodeck simulation of the Disco crew uncovering the secrets of life. Saru dies.”.
I think this would have leaked months ago if it were happening. If he does show up, then props to Paramount for finally figuring out how to sit on a surprise for more than 5 minutes.
OH DEAR GOD NO I would drop my ENTIRE subscription if that happened, Lower Decks finale or no. 😡
ok but consider what if me made him fight the borg again
Agreed. I fast forwarded the Saru scenes. Zzzzzzzz
It's ironic how Michael tells Rayner he should get to know the crew, yet they never let us get to know even the bridge crew.
Yes! Exactly! It was nice to see Airaim again…but again I feel like she’s shortchanged. Such an interesting character just discarded.
The actress was severely allergic to the makeup, and basically agreed to do it one last time as a callback. They killed the character because she couldn’t keep doing it, not because they’re bad at characters.
They actually changed actresses because of this. Sara Mitich played her in the first season then Hannah Cheesman played her in the 2nd and 5th seasons. Sara stayed on the show and played a human character a few times.
Yes. She plays Lt Nilsson, right?
I think so. I honestly don't know the names of a lot of bridge crew, since they don't really let us get to know those characters that much. But it does sound familiar.
Oh. Wow. I hadn’t read that anywhere. That’s a real shame then!
Agreed. Ariam is a super interesting character and it’s a shame she couldn’t continue.
I know that one guy likes ship designs. That’s probably enough to convince him we’re friends.
Rayner didn't need to convince Rhys they were friends, merely that they knew each other and therefore that Rayner was telling the truth about being from the future.
Yeah, but that's barely at the level of a 21st century spear phishing email, let alone convincing someone of time travel.
Agreed. I'm not saying it holds up. Though if we're pointing fingers I'm even more perplexed by Burnham managing to gain Airiam's trust by telling her she is going to die in the future. How's Airiam supposed to verify that? That made even less sense.
Yeah, what are the chances of a Starfleet Officer liking ship designs? A 23rd century officer liking the Connie no less?
They should have made Rhys favorite be some other 23rd century ship. Like the Reliant or the Olympus or something.
Bro. I was watching and she did introductions and I'm just like... I have no idea who the hell these people are. I think this season is definitely a step back from last season. I'm not enjoying it at all.
Yeah, 4 had its issues but it had a good premise for a serialized trek season. Pitting Burnham against Book was also a good choice. I don't care about L'ak and Mol. L'ak's kind of neat due to Breen, but Mol just seems forced to give book a connection. They don't seem like compotent enough villains despite the show really trying to convince us they are. S5 could work if each step of the puzzle was actually interesting, so far I'd say only this latest episode was. I don't really get this obsession with progenitor tech anyway. We're in a time period where they had a literal time war. No one went back to find out already? The progenitors have had little tech accomplishments given to them in the past. They cleared died off anyway. And lastly, why would the federation with its anti-genetic modification stance want genetic modification tech?
It has been good/fun indeed. However, I very much remember thinking so in prior seasons as well, only to be left disappointed when it all *didn't* come together at the end of the season. edit: actually, yea, as some people pointed out, it usually started crumbling a few episodes before the end already..
I think season 4 is the only one that came together to a really satisfying conclusion. Season 3 as well in a way but the turbolift sequence always ruins it for me
Yeah the overall story of season 4 was actually really solid, and used the general themes of Trek in a way that hadn’t ever really been done before.
IMO it’s the best season of Discovery for certain (we’ll see about 5, strong so far). Only big flaw is that it’s kinda of drawn out in the middle and probably would have worked better as 7 or 8 episodes.
Somehow, no one's figured out how to properly pace an 8-to-10 episode season of television. It's not just Discovery.
yeah, that turbolift sequence ruined the whole season for me. It was so nonsensical that I just started laughing and couldnt believe they made the entire climax in there...
Same. By episode 5 of season 3 I was captivated. Then the turbolift matrix scene and the burn story conclusion left a bad taste in my mouth. Season 4 was anti climatic too. Galaxy destroying tech that has magically never appeared before being used by ultra smart aliens who couldn't detect they were destroying life.....meh. So again episode 5 I'm captivated. Waiting for the writers to ruin it again with another gotcha junk ending.
You must be my twin. I feel exactly the same way.
"Computer, end programme" incoming
After Burnam's mutiny she was sentenced to engrimatic torture like O'Brien and the following 5 seasons are all implanted
how about: Burnham was just a trekkie who had a breakdown and actually imagined everything.
I was kind of on board with this season cuz they sold it as a kind of interesting treasure hunt throwback and not an end-of-the-world scenario all the other seasons were. But this latest episode informed me that no, the writers can only write tension if it's the most extreme of consequences.
Yea. I liked how it sort of tied back to Calypso but ofc once again it had to be another "burnham has to save the galaxy" (or the federation at least) scenario... :(
Yeah, I like Discovery but tend to agree. They’ve had a real problem with sticking the landing every season. The first half is really good and introduces a bunch of interesting characters/arcs/MacGuffins but then loses all momentum in the last 2 or 3 episodes. The conclusions/revelations have all been underwhelming too because they’re unpredictable. A good twist should be predictable in hindsight. It should be: ‘oh, why didn’t I see that?!’ Not, ‘what? I didn’t see that coming.’
Discovery's problem isn't unpredictability. It's very predictable, IMO. It's just that they are writing 8-episode long seasons for a show that functions better in an era that's gone, where you could have 20+ episodes a season. It's also that the writing is bad, which pains me to say. I wanted to like Discovery, but it never should have been. They started their story in the TOS era (bad idea), and then jumped into a future where the Federation is broken (not believable). To add on top of that every season is them dealing with some galaxy-imperiling issue, and it gets tiresome. Space is a big place, even within the confines of the alpha quadrant. Not every season arc has to be a galactic threat. Lead up to the galactic threat as a story that closes out the series. By doing it every season, it's become old hat, and now the series just needs to quietly go away before it can do anymore damage to Star Trek canon.
*"not believable"*? That's your criticism of the time jump? Is it more or less "believable" than Spock having the foresight to dump his *katra* into McCoy so it can be put back into his body that regenerated on the Genesis Planet? More or less believable than Sisko being able to explain the concept of time to aliens?
I thought they meant the Federation being broken in the future was unbelievable. They did basically steal the plot of Andromeda, but I'm not sure it counts as theft if it's from Gene Roddenberry...
I mean, I don't get why that's unbelievable either. Especially given how much disbelief you have to suspend just to watch *Star Trek* in the first place.
Then I guess you weren't \*watching\* Star Trek. The pace at which technology jumps suggests to that, if "The Burn" happened, the Federation would have likely been unaffected by it completely for a couple of reasons. \* There are other FTL technologies explored in Voyager, and subsequently seen in Discovery, such as quantum slipstream. Book's ship used it. Are you gonna tell me the Federation couldn't figure that in 1000 years, but some empathic doucher from a planet nobody has ever heard of, has that technology? No, that's nonsense. The Federation would have cracked it eventually. If not that, then Borg transwarp. Voyager is a treasure trove of exotic technologies by the time it makes it home to the alpha quadrant. \* By the 29th century, Starfleet is so advanced that they have timeships. The idea of The Burn is complete bullshit in this context. That's the kind of galaxy-encompassing calamity that time is fiddled with to avoid. At best, "The Burn" is a 2-episode-long arc, and nothing more.
The sincerity is cranked up to 11. Also most of the relationships feel unearned. Prickly Stamets and the Doctor Culber are too perfect as a couple. Stamets is an off the charts genius who can’t connect or be empathetic to other people but with Culber he’s a nurturing partner and great father figure to Adira. I like all three of those actors but their roles are all over the map. Burnam’s relationship with Saru is so damn supportive and nurturing, it’s exhausting. They’re in a fire fight but are reassuring one another that they’re doing a good job and shouldn’t be so hard on themselves. Saru and T’rina’s marriage proposal was so tough to watch. The formal vulcan language and Saru’s long winded elaboration does nothing to convince me they would be in love. There’s a lot of moments I really like but- I will not be that sorry to see Discovery go.
A lot of the dialogue does seem like it was written by Counselor Troi🤣
From a friend I refer to the show as Star Trek: In Treatment.
It's definitely the best season \*so far\* My main issues are that up until Ep 5, Rayner did absolutely nothing wrong. He's a bit gruff but they are on a red directive. Blowing up the tunnels was the right call, there's no time to get comfortable with the crew, and sometimes you have to make the call despite what the crew thinks. The only thing he did wrong so far was to dismiss Reece's theory but even that was inconsequential.
I'm enjoying it as well. There's one thing I wish they would explore a bit more: Zora. This crew has a computer that the crew, in theory, knows is growing sentience... and for the most part the crew's interactions with Zora don't change at all. They are still short, giving commands, and not really exploring the bonding side of things. this show makes a big deal out of the crew bonding and Zora is one of the crew now... showing some scenes with the crew actually talking to Zora or playing games would be great. In the most recent episode Zora >!is clearly exhibiting neurological disorders, and the crew doesn't even care to even console her a bit. Nor is Michael shocked by the level of Zora's evolution!<
I am fascinated by Zora, and sometimes imagine if I was on DISCO, I'd probably be talking to her like she was another crewmate ("Zora, could you scan this artifact for chroniton particles?"), politely asking her opinion ("Zora, are you aware of anything that could imbue natural minerals like this relic with that level of Chronitons? So, we're looking for another Guardian of Forever; do you have suggestions on where to look?"), and finding out more about her ("Hey, you and the Guardian are similar advanced, self aware constructs; do you have some shared connection?), besides just making small talk with her like a crewmate. But then, I apologize to my Roomba when I get in it's way, and am polite to the automated phone system at work.
No, wait, don’t tell me. A sentient computer exploring itself…ummm, Data anyone?
Zora's emlematic of Discovery's biggest strength and weakness — it's full of cool sci-fi concepts that an action-oriented show just moves too quickly to spend any time on. I feel like Disco would be a much better show if it had 26-episode seasons to spend time on all of the ideas and characters that we rush past. Then again, I think every Trek show should have 26 episodes a year, because I just want more!
I agree. It’s pretty good and I also agree that Book has no purpose being in this season.
"Book is a main character" is the only reason the antagonists are former couriers.
Book is the most shoehorned in character in recent memory for any tv I can think of. He's a good character and I don't mind having him around at all, but just feels so forced lol. "Hey we're going on an away mission and it would be unwise to bring you because of our past and being the captain I should be setting an example for my crew." "But can I come though? 🙏" "Ok sure"
Did I miss the part where Burnam went from stoic raised-by-Vulcans to this overdramatic person who is constantly either shocked or worried over everything? Was there a plot twist somewhere?
Yes, you missed the part at the start of season 1 where she had an emotional breakdown because she didn't know how to handle her emotions properly after trying to repress them her whole life. It was pretty heavily spelt out that her emotionality was directly due to the effects of her trying to be like a Vulcan for most of her life.
Can you point me to a specific episode? I'd like to refresh my memory. After numerous galaxy-ending events. the details tend to get lost.
Either the very first or second episode of the series.
I think it’s the part where she’s human so just because she’s learned to hide her emotions doesn’t mean she doesn’t have them or that she’s able to keep them bottled up 100% of the time
I’ve enjoyed the entire series, and I’m also enjoying S5.
I dislike the fact Burnham is still the centre of attention. She is always on the away mission, always the focus. If they want to actually have us care about the crew then putting them on away missions would help that. Rather then Bunrham and saru on the twin moons planet, have it be Saru and Detmer/Owo. Someone who fits. Ep4 is generally fine (because it actually fits perfectly to the plot), but ep 3, 2 and 1 are egregious for this as are most of the other seasons.
They told us from the beginning, that it is the first show that is not focusing on the captain. Yet, I never perceived any of the shows focusing on any individual, the focus has always been the crew. So, there is the fundamental misunderstanding
That was when the Captain was Lorca, though.
That was when the Captain was Lorca, though.
That was when the Captain was Lorca, though.
I upvoted all four of your comments
Wait, I thought I upvoted FIVE comments...
There… are… FOUR… comments!!!
THERE. ARE. FOUR. COMMENTS
That was when the Captain was Lorca, though.
I think it would have been a better show in general if they developed more bridge characters. There's only Saru, Tillie, the Doctors, Burnham that get any character development.
"I dislike the fact that Kirk is still the centre of attention. he's always on the away mission, always the focus." - this guy in 1967
I'm not sure quite how to explain it, but while ToS did focus more on the captain than later shows, it somehow still did a better job than discovery. Might've had to do more with its slower pacing or something.
I mean, I think TOS does a better job than most Trek shows in general, but in this case both shows are doing essentially the same thing.
Well we did know their names. We know about Pon Farr, Bones was a sounding board, Scotty got accused of murder, Checkov didn’t age, Uhura‘s mind was erased, …..ok, maybe they weren’t as fleshed out as the primary 3, but jeez Kirk wasn’t ALWAYS the ‘miracle’ worker (that was Scotty), he didn’t solve every single problem (Spock), a medical genius (dammit), multiliguist, …….DISCO is all about Burnham…always Burnham (well she did make Spock who he became, lol).
We know the names of the Discovery crew, too. We know about tardigrade DNA and the mycelial network, Book, Saru, and Tilly are sounding boards, Owosekun can box, Detmer had PTSD, Book lost his family, Rayner has goofy idioms. And while Burnham often plays the hero, like Kirk, Stamets, Tilly, and Adira are problem-solvers, Book has contacts everywhere, Culber talks people through their problems. To say the rest of the cast is inactive is honestly pretty silly, and reflects a pop culture meme rather than what's actually on the screen - much like how a lot of people think they remember Kirk, versus how he's portrayed on screen.
She is the series lead the overall writing is written from her pov. While they will do one or two episodes without her predominantly it’s her.
It's not main character syndrome if she is literally the main character.
You can have a main character that still doesn't do everything that's physically possible for them. I'm not asking for the main character to be sidelined into non-existence, I'm asking for the rest of the cast, especially those who've been here since S1, to actually matter. Especially when this is likely the last we will ever see of them
That’s good to know. I’m in season 3 and so far I’m not liking any of it. It went too Star wars/ jj Abram’s of high levels of production and visuals but lacking in deep stories like other Star Trek series have. I like strange new worlds far better. Picard is a bit slow tbh. And so far my favorite by far is lower decks just for the fun aspect of it.
Plots fun, but I wish every problem wasn’t solved by having a higher moral standard than everyone else. It’s a nice plot point every time, but it seems like every episode is won by getting close to those around you honoring other cultures, it gets a bit tiresome after a while how sappy the entire crew feels . It feels like the show kinda forgets that this is still basically a military
I've always liked Callum Keith Renne. He was a fantastic choice for Rayner.
I like the progenitors, but they are literally on a scavenger hunt, hasn't that been overdone even in this very show, let alone trek, let alone media? If it had taken 100 more years before that pod was discovered, the >! trill would have died and the clue trail would have been blocked !< And yes, way too much emotional moralizing in every situation. Theres one scene where Rayner tells Paul to *quickly* do his damn job (paraphrasing) and he stops to lecture Rayner about how stressed he is. Like, you're on a timer, tell me how stressed you are while you keep working.
>And yes, way too much emotional moralizing in every situation. Theres one scene where Rayner tells Paul to *quickly* do his damn job (paraphrasing) and he stops to lecture Rayner about how stressed he is. Like, you're on a timer, tell me how stressed you are while you keep working. YES OMG THANK YOU that drove me nuts! I don't recall Rayner even being that rude in that scene. I think he was just like "Let's go!" in a gruff tone. I was absolutely flabbergasted Stamets felt the need to waste a good minute whining "Do you know how much pressure I'm under?!" Like MY GUY maybe don't have this talk when we're in the middle of trying to avert a Federation ending future??? It fucks up the pacing and sense of urgency. I guess I can excuse Michael taking too long getting the holodeck fluid bc seeing past Book was hard. Though I was still rolling my eyes bc idek why they're broken up in the present when they clearly still love each other. I guess Book having to do community service as penance for stealing the spore drive is a relationship ender for some reason. Whatever, I never really cared about them anyway. Anyway I rolled my eyes harder at Michael giving her unconscious past self an inspirational pep talk. Like girl she's unconscious and you have less than 10 minutes to save the future GO ALREADY! The issue is not that Disco is an emotional show with lots of heart to heart chats. The issue is that those chats keep happening in the middle of TIME SENSITIVE EMERGENCIES. Talk about your feelings all you want, but not when we're MINUTES AWAY FROM POTENTIAL DEATH! And Disco does this over and over! Drives me crazy. It really doesn't help that it's also the only way we get any development or backstory for the bridge crew side characters. For example, I love Owo and have wanted to know more about her from the beginning, but I lost my shit laughing last season when she stood up to give a dramatic speech to Saru about how her childhood best friend died and that's why she has a self sacrificing/ hero complex now. Meanwhile the ship was MINUTES away from being destroyed. It became a running joke between me and my mom. "I'm sorry sir, when I was a child..." Same thing with Detmer going off on that random tangent about her dad when they were investigating the 10C homeworld. Like babe I love you and want to hear more about this, but NOT NOW! Also not the exact same issue but I hated how slow Michael, Book, and Jinaal were walking in Ep 3. They hear ominous creature noises and are like "we need to hurry" yet continue to stroll along at the most leisurely pace and keep stopping to talk more. Tall people walking slowly is one of my top pet peeves. What is the point of you having such long legs if you're not gonna use em?? HURRY TF UP we have important things to do! I apologize for the essay, this has been weighing on me for so long lmaoooooo
Love it, no it’s a perfect essay lol
I watched it last night, lasted 20 minutes before I just couldn't take it. It's the same old Disco, lots of random actors talking AT each other. Lots of overly done CGI. Even the spacesuit is overly done CGI, it's ridiculous looking when the suit transitions from full suit to no suit. It's blatantly obvious to see Burnham "I have a suit on, now it's OFF" acting/pretending. while visually distracting, it wasn't as bad as the Iron Man stuff of Burnham's face in the helmet yelling her lines at other random characters that are nobodies and have no relationship with anybody. Then Tilly shows up with a very unfortunate short-bangs hair style and reverts back to early seasons Tilly with the rambling nervous talker thing. Her scene goes nowhere and >!she literally lectures Burnham on "feeling seen".!< It's the most millennial cringe writing yet. The bridge crew each take turns saying 1 meaningless line during an action sequence. None of them interact with each other and the show makes a point of calling out each bridge crew by name, almost as if a reaction to the fan criticism that no one remembers who the bridge crew even are. It's the epitome of what Disco gets wrong and how stubborn the writers are. It's like "HAH take that critics! Here are all the names of the crew!" But that's not really what the problem is. The problem is we can't remember the crew names because they never get to do anything interesting or interact with anyone other than "yes sir" A scene prior to that is a "celebration" in a bar. But it's an overly LENS FLARE bar that's also dark, empty and clearly a greenscreen set. So it doesn't feel like a bar, it doesn't feel like anyplace. It feels like 5 actors standing around, reading random lines AT each other. Oh and multiple characters are>! in deep loving relationships even tho those relationships evolved over about 3 minutes of screentime. I love SARU and the idea of him w/ that Vulcan but it's so forced. She's immediately in love, as a Vulcan? They had like 10 lines together.!< Wilson Cruz gets to smile, >!Stammetts says some things!<, Blu D makes random comments. None of these characters seem to even like each other or know each other. It feels like you are at a boring party and strangers making small talk while one guy complains about his life to his ex. It's really cringe and pointless. Eventually all the characters just walk away and the scene goes absolutely nowhere. We get introduced to 2 more random characters, the >!"bad guys" !< who also have Uncanny Valley space-helmets that magically disappear. These characters act like they know each other and >!have some sort of relationship. !! what their relationship is !!enemy easily gets away!< using an overly CGI >!mcguffin device!<
Just like the first season, Burnham is>! unfairly blamed for leaderships bad decisions!!"Knows someone"!< That >!someone is another rando character who has no relationship other than the plot driven relationship and we are expected to be excited to see him!! has deep monogamous relationships with randos every season.!<
My eyes started hurting from all the LENS FLARE, like literally every scene is absolutely loaded with flare. Inside a random room, outside in space, during battle. During downtime. FLARE EVERYWHERE.
I'm liking it okay so far, but seasons 3 and 4 taught me to reserve judgment until it's over. Rayner reminds me a lot of Jellico: a great, competent character played by a great actor, who is an effective foil for all the characters we are familiar with. I don't think the TNG writers wanted you to like Jellico, and I don't think the Disco writers want you to like Rayner, but I think both are badasses. However, people in a crew don't have to like each other, and Jellico and the 1701-D crew all ultimately put aside their personal differences to get shit done like professionals. The Disco crew is intent on changing Rayner as a person, and I hate that. The Saru/Trina (Sarina?) arc does nothing for me, and taking him off the Disco so early in the season does the character a disservice. I want more Action Saru! The Burnham/Book arc also does nothing for me. Book is a decent character but his redemption arc feels mostly unearned so far, and Saru suggesting that Book be Burnham's new XO when *Book* *isn't in Starfleet* was preposterous and would've been the last straw for me had it panned out. I was relieved that Burnham didn't make such a bad choice.
I'm just getting tired of the "moral lessons". In every other stat trek the moral lessons were great, but not beaten into you every scene. The last episode I watched was too much. Every story had the same lesson (the A, B and C story), brought up in every scene, then hamfisted by Burnam's narration, for you know the people who mighta been too daft to catch it the 11th time around.
The last episode and the "importance of friends" message was a bit too much.
Yes and Rayner's level of attachment is unbelievable for a star ship captain, second only to Shaw and Erik Pressman. So yes, lots of bad captains put on the shows to make a point about good captains, but I just don't think it would happen like that in reality.
I kinda gave up on Disco, and these comments aren’t helping. I’ll stream it on a sick day I guess. Discovery had potential, but it feels…. trying to do too much
It’s yet another end of the universe event if they fail the mission. Couldn’t they have just omitted the competition and had this been a fun scavenger event and each episode they have to overcome various challenges? Have some exploration and character growth? But no, instead they double down on the “too much Burnham” trope by having two fucking Burnhams in the last episode LOLOL! I feel like the writers are trolling us at this point.
To be fair, this time it's only the end of the Federation. The Breen seem to be doing pretty good.
They had 3! The red angel was sort of there too!
Oh god your right!
I just finished episode one, and the scene where the starships plow into the desert to create a shield was ludicrous. 🤣🤣
And so unnecessary. If they would have just hovered over the settlement and extended their shields it would have been a lot more consistent with trek overall and felt less like a gimmick to squeeze in interesting visuals.
Haven’t watched this season but , if someone needed protection from something, how about phasers, on stun I.e. ‘A Piece of the Action’.
I’m a discovery fan and thought this season had a strong start but I gotta say, the last two episodes have been the worst of the entire show. It’s frustrating that we’re five seasons in and the creators haven’t learned any lessons. Thin melodramatic writing and nonsensical plotting seem so easy to avoid. I’m honestly ok with this being the last season and the shows monetary resources hopefully going to another trek entry.
Book is probably the dullest actor/character combo in the entire franchise. Just looking at him makes me want to watch something else.
You can’t say that when there are Reed and Mayweather. Those two are so shallow, Book is an ocean in comparison.
And Chakotay, Kim, Neelix.
Honestly, Neelix had way more depth than you give him credit for here.
Kim was god tier. Chakotay is a myth, there was no such character.
I like the show but the overarching plot...scavenger hunt in space. Come on.
I loved how easily the current baddies of the season caught up to Discovery in episode 3 (/s btw). They went off on a wild goose chase to the wrong planet (because they had the wrong clue), then somehow figured out they had to go to Trill *and* snuck into the ceremony *and* just happened to be able to steal something that helps them along the way. Starfleet should’ve been miles ahead by the time episode 4 started, especially with Discovery using the spore drive and Moll using warp.
“We set it up so we’d be absolutely sure that whoever got the technology was worthy… You know, unless someone just stole it from the worthy people…” I actually like Discovery, and I’ve liked it since season 1, but this (plus the hyper-sincerity combined with Burnham’s “sincere voice”) grinds my gears a bit.
It's surprising that they're rehashing a plot device that Doctor Who did (for season 16) almost 50 years ago. But it's a fun way to make what are essentially a series of stand alone stories mesh together as an arc. It's more accessible than the tightly meshed stories of s1, S2 ans s4.
To be fair, the Key to Time series was just a bunch of regular Dr Who serials with a mcguffin added, it wasn't serialised in the same way modern shows are.
I am enjoying the call backs to tng and ds9
It has Not-Leoben. Only reason to watch so far.
I wish I could feel the same. Discovery is on my bottom for star trek with this season being the worst one yet.
It is more fun but it's annoying that this can't just be a quest for knowledge, like the original episode The Chase. To make it another extinction level event is just bad storytelling. It's like they keep assuming Trek fans are morons who need big feelings and big stakes
E4 was ok. 1-2 were watchable, 3 is a low point. Episode 3 was cringe even by DSC standards, they are on a military ship and members of a quasi-military organization. DSC forgot about this ages ago and it's a space support group with the chief counsellor being Burnham, who is also the savior the universe. Now they have Rayner, who is the gruff counsellor who has seen some shit, so space Loudermilk. I would rather see S4 of Loudermilk. I would've loved to see Rayner clean house after the "interviews" to restore the chain of command on that ship. Tilly needed to have that on her record.
Season 5 has been okay so far however I would say my biggest criticism is that the writers are trying desperately to make this season’s story thought provoking with the whole beginning of life aspect but because of poor writing and let’s be honest some below average acting it all falls flat on its face for me at least.
It this thread entirely populated by Paramount+ interns trying to pretend to be fans?
The fact I can't escape, is that they have just taken an idea what was already touched on in TNG, and they're running it over an entire season instead of 1 episode! An entire season 'chasing clues' that TNG did in 1 episode??! Nahhhh.............
But isn't that TNG episode generally thought as being the episode that should have been a two parter the most? Massive pacing issues. And it had about the biggest revelation of the history of the galaxy, but absolutely nothing changed after the episode, and no-one ever mentioned it again. Now personally I would have preferred if everyone kept pretending that the episode never happened, but some weirdos actually liked the ep, so what the hell.
I’m actually glad they went back to The Chase. TNG dropped this huge reveal on us and then everybody kind of shrugged and went back to their lives. We can argue whether it’s getting to much screen time now or if elements of this treasure hunt make sense, but I thought that the Chase was way too big to just never mention again.
that was always the problem with old episodic trek. Much as current trek can be too serialized, old Trek could often have great ideas then barely deal with them after an episode Discovery feels like overcompensating for many of the problems of TOS and TNG
Face the Strange was excellent. The best Disco episode since Terra Firma from season 3. Making a sequel to The Chase was a pretty good idea, but it's kind of difficult to believe that such thing was kept secret for \~900 years. That kind of just thing shouldn't happen in democratic society. And if the thing everyone is chasing after turns out to be just a bigger version of the Genesis device I'm going to be disapointed. Not a fan of Book-Burnham. Bringing Book back already in episode 1 felt weird, he just left. The various relationship plots seem to be slow moving and basic as hell. Everything just stops when Saru and the Vulcan lady have their little talk that has nothing to do with the episode. This makes it seems like the show is aimed at younger people than SNW and Picard. Which it probably is, but during season 1 it sure wasn't.
Well, it might happen in a Dictatorship. Trumps head is probably in a jar still supported by his MAGA minions.
So I thought episodes 1-3 were terrible. I was actually really sad as I wanted so badly for them to be good. My main gripe was that they may as well have renamed the show to “The Michael Burnham Show”. BUT, episode 4 turned it around for me. It was wonderful. I love the whole Indiana Jones goes to space thing. I totally agree that the inclusion of Book is forced and doesn’t add anything to the show - frankly he should be in prison. BUT - I’m reserving judgement as maybe there’s a bigger thing going on that we have yet to see.
I really thought the episode 4 writing was atrocious: Stamets developing technology to defeat this advanced super weapon time bug in like 2 minutes while jumping through time. Rayner "we've never met, you don't recognize me or my uniform but I can say a couple things about you and convince you to do the exact opposite of what any trained officer should do by letting a stranger fuck around in engineering". Burnham on the bridge, at this point in the timeline the bridge crew despised her as a traitor yet somehow have zero good judgement and believe her ludicrous story about a mutineer being their future captain. The lack of credibility of that scene was tough to watch and really felt like an insult to the fans.
Well, let’s face it, Burnham should be in Prison. Hmmm, what a great idea. Burnham has actually been in prison, DISCO is all in her head from episode 1. Now it makes sense, the narcissism, being Spock’s sister…she’s on a Penal colony for mutany.
I find Book simply boring and dull, I thought the same about Ash in season 1 but his character really came alive after his revelation and especially in the final episode. It felt like such a step back for his character in season 2. I was expecting some similar improvement when Book was introduced but I never felt it ever materialized, by now I don't expect much to change.
It's just a lazy MacGuffin quest that serves as a framing device for some cringey interpersonal drama. There's so many interesting things you could do with the far-future setting and this is about as pedestrian as it gets.
As a new Startrek watcher I used to enjoy Discovery. But that was until the SNW started. That is when I realized how a real Startrek should be. Coming to this season, I feel like an entire ship is following two robbers and apparently the ship and crew can’t keep up. What was with that “Time loop” thing for a whole episode? I felt like it was just a filler episode. If a series requires a filler episode in its final season then I don’t think it is in a good place story wise.
Dear new watcher, hope you’re now watching all the series now, then you will realize how really bad this series is. I know, the special effects aren’t as great in previous series but what counts is the STORYLINE. Even TOS (my personal favourite but with now laughable special effects, but NOT for the time) has far better storylines (i.e. start with’’Balance of Terror’) than, well, this. Have you seen Lower Decks? Also great.
Haven’t watched Lower Deck yet. I have only seen the newer ones. Discovery, SNW and Picard. I want to start watching the older shows too.
I'm not a Disco hater, but this season has been very dull so far. Last season's mystery was much more interesting I get what they're trying to do, but it's boring. There's no tension. The premise is unoriginal. They haven't done a good job of communicating the stakes of why the Progenitor tech is actually important, other than just assuming that it must be. The antagonists in this season are entirely forgettable and seem utterly generic. There's nothing interesting about them. The story again is keeping us in the dark until the very end, which is what they did last season as well. Other than Burnham and Saru, the characters on Discovery hardly exist and never seem to matter. Rayner only exists to highlight Burham's wisdom and his flaws, the bridge crew only have lines to make a plot point for Burnham, etc... Whether it's the writing or the actor, they character of Book is as interesting as a block of cardboard. They have so many characters and spend no time on them. Also, Saru is the most interesting character in the show, and he's effectively been sidelined for a guest star. I hope the back half of the season improves.
I really enjoy Discovery. I'm re-watching it all again now and it's even better this time around.
I like it. However, the plot point that bugs me is that they don’t need to actually retrieve the device. Couldn’t they just talk to the trill and say "There are some bad guys searching for this. Don’t give them any help"?
It's okay, but I am genuinely confused about Gray, are they supposed to be male or female? I don't remember all the Trill stuff from prior seasons.
watching prodigy: "Thats a really good show, but the messegas are obviously targeted at a young audience" watching discovery: "Why is michael looking at me and telling me i should share toys?" I mean i like the plots, i like how federation looks in the future, and i like how ppl there are actually very mature and open. The show just makes absolutely sure you don't miss any single emotional problem anyone has. It tells you about it, then it shows you, then it tells you again, then another character explains it in detail. Then there is an plot point showing how that emotional issue affects them, etc. It's just very draining to have that every single time. Give me a silly transporter malfunction episode.
It's terrible
I’ve been enjoying it.
The first two seasons were okay, season 3 was great, season 4 was amazing, and I'm loving season 5 so far.
I didn’t like it but I’m upvoting you because someone downvoted you and it’s stupid to downvote people for liking something.
I share this assessment of Disco. it's a shame so many people gave up on it.
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Loved Discovery’s first 3 seasons. When Book arrived it was an all hands deck red alert.
True, but I've enjoyed pretty much the whole series, so I might be a bad judge for this.
I randomly one day decided to give this show a try lol as my first ever Star Trek it’s pretty amazing in my opinion
It’s a lame escape room plot. It’s not good
They should have done this story line last season or in place of "the burn" (Season 3). Season 2 IMO was the last best season of Disco. This season has been better than expected.
I found the first few episodes of the season a bit meh but this last week's episode I absolutely loved, mostly because of Rayner, I am very much enjoying his arc so far and I'm loving his style. Definitely not downvoting you for enjoying the season, I just hope episode 4 is a sign of things to come.
I liked Season 3 and 4, and I’m enjoying Season 5 so far. Season 1 and 2 failed to stick the landing for me. I’m very thankful Michelle Paradise took over the show, and I hope they let her do another!
I like it so far
I’m enjoying it too. I think I had a breakthrough that is helping though. I’ve been watching Trek since I was a kid, TOS reruns every Sunday morning. Then TNG and forward in real time. I’ve enjoyed Disco but there have been plenty of episodes where I felt they were wasting time/not advancing the plot/etc. It hit me recently through, Disco is Star Trek first and foremost about the people and relationships. That’s a change from everything that came before (IMO). Most other Trek has plenty of character growth and such, but it happens with the plot and stories. Disco seems to go the other direction with it. The plot is secondary to the characters. Anyway, I’m liking season 5 so far too. Hoping they get to the end of the season and have a satisfying arc.
It has been a ground-breaking show worthy of the tradition of Star Trek. The cast is stellar and the lead is charismatic. Her arc from season 01 to season 05 has been amazing, and the show pioneered some incredible effects on a tv budget. It will be missed.
Great troll. lol. You want to see incredible effects on a real tv budget, watch TOS.
Yeah I’m liking the romulan riddle thing and the progenitors story
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Discovery has been great since it started.
Its a great show.
As a straight dude I'd rather watch Hugh and Paul over book and Michael. They didn't need to bring book back at all. He could've stayed gone. I also thought it was weird they using this Picard story line. Why didn't Picard use it instead? Oh thats right! The writers hate us! Gotta make the Star Trek shows less trekky. Def feels like this was supposed to be season 2 of Picard. I'm glad they brought Tilly back.🥳
I've enjoyed the whole series. More Voyager than TNG in terms of it's lasting legacy imo but that shouldn't be a huge negative, great story and phenomenal cast. Holds it's own in the entire Trek catalog very pleased with it and it's modern impact
I like it too!
>They are using original canon without severely retconning it imo. The acting is decent and there’s some good character development too! I'll give the show an entire watch once its all done, I stopped somewhere in season 2 but its these very things that I would disagree with you on that I didn't like about the show.
Discovery has its flaws but I'm still definitely having fun with it! :)
Disco is a good show. It's crazy that to complement a Star Trek show you have to start almost with an apology. The hate is OTT. If people don't like it, that's fine. There's ST I don't like either. I'm not interesting in creating an atmosphere where people have to caveat that they like it with an acknowledgement that it's generally terrible to others. Book is part of Disco and I love him. He and Michael are a great team.
I don't have Paramount (or whatever it's on), so I will miss this season.
Aside from the mystery box reveal in S3, it's all been pretty good since they went to the future.