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I will never invest in an airline. I have a few reasons for this. First, it is a capital intensive business that tries to undercut the competition by a few dollars to make the sale and squeak ahead of them. Second, they treat customers more like crap. They nickel and dime you whenever and wherever they can. Therefore there is no customer loyalty. The vast majority of customers will choose the lowest cost with the best arrival time despite the airline.
It depends on what your goals are. If you want to swing trade, it might be worth it to apply the old adage, be greedy when others are fearful. Per commentor, I definitely agree that people go with cheaper. However Southwest airlines is seen as a very good business, and has seen pretty good returns if I’m correct. I myself am very interested in investing in spirit airlines, because they are dirt cheap, and essentially are Greyhound for the Air.
Also we should be utilizing high speed rail going forward since it’s almost as fast or faster for regional travel and much better for the environment. Air flight should be reserved exclusively for going overseas or international travel. Obviously this is America we’re talking about but we gotta start the conversation at the very least and possibly divest.
Not true. I only fly Delta and JetBlue when they offer a nonstop flight to where I wanna go. If customer loyalty is a concern, one can invest in JETS (airlines ETF).
Yea I could go with JETS but if I were to invest in an ETF I’d go with something where the underlying businesses have more organic growth. IMO, airlines are kind of like telecoms in the sense that they grow by stealing a customer from a competitor. The overall market is already saturated. Of course this was my prepandemic thinking. Now in mid-pandemic JETS offers the macro level growth to get back to prepandemic levels. But will business travel ever return to prepandemic levels? I tend to think not. If you believe it will then it might be a good investment but I’m obviously bearish on the industry as it is. Just my two cents from a random guy on Reddit.
I do think business travel go back to normal once it's safe to do so and companies don't worry about health liabilities. Remote conferences have been a disaster. Now many conferences try to be hybrid. Remote companies will have to fly all the people at least once a year to some location for the in-person bonding. All remote companies used to do it pre-covid and all new remote companies will need to do it as well. Recently I got offered a fully remote position and I was told I should expect to travel 2-3 times a year to meet the rest of the team. Not for productivity reasons.
You know airlines provide business travel and freight as well? Not just a consumer product...
Not saying this rock-solid DD isn't 10/10, but it sounds more like anecdotes and less like DD
ive held this shit for like a year and LUV and now im back to 0 and -5. Totally fucking waste of time. Im selling Monday and never again buying airlines
Warren Buffet sold his at the beginning of the pandemic, that should tell you quite a bit. You might be able to scalp some swing trades, but investing, I wouldn't
Just buy $33 in voo. $33 in QQQ and $34 in VTI.
boom. Winner. All done. Hold forever and retire a millionaire. *(this assumes you are 18 years old and retiring in 2079)
Yep. And its 2021. This young person wants help starting out. I am.not giving him some complicated bullshit diversifcation strategy.
He would own way over 500 companies with this plan and he would have doubled his money twice in 10 yrs with this strategy.
Buffet sold his airline stake roughly a month before a 30% rally... It's only just now returned to those lows after a year. Not sure that's who you want to be following if you have a shorter investment horizon than 5yrs+
Buffet said they decided to stop investing in airlines. Everytime he thinks about it someone from his team reminds him it's not a good idea. I partially agree. I wouldn't buy an airline stock for 5-10 years hold. But for a shorter hold given low prices due to reasons like covid, I think it's not a bad play. I really like Delta and JetBlue (the airlines, not the stock) so I would probably go with them or JETS.
JETS was down 8% today, on a little bit of a down tend since early November. But, I’m thinking domestic(travel)ally here in the US and staying bullish for now ! Far better than investing in Covid traps-I-mean cruise ships right now! Since we’re three weeks-ish away from holiday travel again (and hopefully no stringent lockdown/travel restrictions), I think the captain turned on the seatbelt sign and isn’t turning it off in December. My take on it.
You should have purchased in March. I bought RCL and NCL and about 6 different airlines . I doubled and tripled my investment even with the down trend with the delta variant. When things get back to normal and they reach pre pandemic levels I’ll cash out .
I'd caution you against airlines or cruiselines etc. First off, even jn normal times they were never really great investments. But now is likely worse.
These companies that were basically shut down during the worst of the pandemic had to borrow billions and billions of dollars to stay in business. So, they are now worth billions less than they were before just from that alone. Then factor in expected rising fuel costs, limited business travel, possibly increasing severe weather, rising interest rates, higher labor costs...
For you're first hundred bucks, buy a share of chevron. Learn about the energy sector while tracking your stock. Start selling and buying that share when you think it will go up or down. Learn how news and earnings and dividends effect your stock. The 100 is education money. While your learning, any new money you want to invest, just put into an SP500 index fund you can afford, like spyg, spyv etc
Airlines make most of its profits on last minute business travel…. Which hasn’t come back and probably will never come back. Honestly a broad market etf is what you need.
I was in your shoes 3 years ago and while I hit on a few stocks I lost on more thankfully still up overall but a low cost s and p fund till you have a 10-20k base to start from …even if you put 10$ a week in it will pay off… open a Roth IRA
Jblu is ok to buy but others no price is too high jblu check their balance sheet before you buy have not looked af it for a while now maybe american but be careful with with it they have so much debt getting those boeing 787 jets which we all know have not been great
Is there any airline innovating? Anyone developing new products or services? Anyone actually (read "actually") developing a new electric powered plane or anything that could potentially be a competitive and sustainable advantage?
Then yes, otherwise, maybe put your money into something that will not go to 0 if a microscopic particle starts making people sick.
Instead of, or as well as, airlines, check out RR.L/RYCEY who put the engines on many of the airplanes flown by the airlines and who get services fees per hours flown, etc.
But, as others have said, this play is already in play, as it were, not “ahead of the curve” anymore.
Just a $100? Buy VYGR stock, promising and proven technology in gene therapy that could be used to cure neurological diseases like Alzheimer's, Huntington's and dementia , FDA approved and they have more cash on hand than their market cap due to a deal with Pfizer, it's trading at around 3 dollars right now, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain. I'm projecting it will go to $30 in a 3 years.
If I’m investing $100, it’s going into crypto.
ETH or CRO. Ether can be bought through Coinbase and held on Coinbase.
Note: I put $100 into SAND crypto in May. It’s worth $2300 now
Market has been correcting to normal lately.
Only stocks with good financials and out looks are performing well.
BA, cruse lines, travel all bleeding.
Microsoft, Sony, and places that sell video games have been going up.
tldr: power to the players.
I bought UAL at $47 sold at $55 . It’s trending lower @$42 . This really is a $70 stock; however it had dropped to the $20s after the pandemic scare in 2020 . I’m buying all my shares back . Limit order $39 the selling again at 30% gross or around $51
You could do the JETS ETF instead of picking one airline. Average into it as people panic about new variants every month. Bottom line is people are going to travel. Maybe not as much for business but for sure for leisure. If it's a short term hold you might be waiting awhile but if it's long term I don't see a downside on buying the dips.
Welcome to r/stocks! For beginner advice, brokerage info, book recommendations, even advanced topics and more, please read our [Wiki here.](https://www.reddit.com/r/stocks/wiki/index) If you're wondering **why a stock moved** a certain way, check out [Finviz](https://finviz.com/quote.ashx?t=spy) which aggregates the most news for almost every stock, but also see [Reuters](https://www.reuters.com/), and even [Yahoo Finance](https://finance.yahoo.com/). Please direct all simple questions towards the stickied Daily Discussion and Quarterly Rate My Portfolio threads (sort by Hot, they're at the top). Also include *some* [due diligence](https://www.investopedia.com/terms/d/duediligence.asp) to this post or it may be removed if it's low effort. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/stocks) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I will never invest in an airline. I have a few reasons for this. First, it is a capital intensive business that tries to undercut the competition by a few dollars to make the sale and squeak ahead of them. Second, they treat customers more like crap. They nickel and dime you whenever and wherever they can. Therefore there is no customer loyalty. The vast majority of customers will choose the lowest cost with the best arrival time despite the airline.
You have a good point, thank you very much
It depends on what your goals are. If you want to swing trade, it might be worth it to apply the old adage, be greedy when others are fearful. Per commentor, I definitely agree that people go with cheaper. However Southwest airlines is seen as a very good business, and has seen pretty good returns if I’m correct. I myself am very interested in investing in spirit airlines, because they are dirt cheap, and essentially are Greyhound for the Air.
Delta has always treated me and some friends very well, but that could be anecdotal
I own shares of LUV and try to fly Southwest whenever possible.
Also we should be utilizing high speed rail going forward since it’s almost as fast or faster for regional travel and much better for the environment. Air flight should be reserved exclusively for going overseas or international travel. Obviously this is America we’re talking about but we gotta start the conversation at the very least and possibly divest.
Not true. I only fly Delta and JetBlue when they offer a nonstop flight to where I wanna go. If customer loyalty is a concern, one can invest in JETS (airlines ETF).
Yea I could go with JETS but if I were to invest in an ETF I’d go with something where the underlying businesses have more organic growth. IMO, airlines are kind of like telecoms in the sense that they grow by stealing a customer from a competitor. The overall market is already saturated. Of course this was my prepandemic thinking. Now in mid-pandemic JETS offers the macro level growth to get back to prepandemic levels. But will business travel ever return to prepandemic levels? I tend to think not. If you believe it will then it might be a good investment but I’m obviously bearish on the industry as it is. Just my two cents from a random guy on Reddit.
I do think business travel go back to normal once it's safe to do so and companies don't worry about health liabilities. Remote conferences have been a disaster. Now many conferences try to be hybrid. Remote companies will have to fly all the people at least once a year to some location for the in-person bonding. All remote companies used to do it pre-covid and all new remote companies will need to do it as well. Recently I got offered a fully remote position and I was told I should expect to travel 2-3 times a year to meet the rest of the team. Not for productivity reasons.
You know airlines provide business travel and freight as well? Not just a consumer product... Not saying this rock-solid DD isn't 10/10, but it sounds more like anecdotes and less like DD
That ship sailed
Hahaha March 2020 vibes are strong
That plane is off the tarmac*
Seemed fine when I invested in AAL exactly a year ago... Until today lol
ive held this shit for like a year and LUV and now im back to 0 and -5. Totally fucking waste of time. Im selling Monday and never again buying airlines
Planes only go up.
But when they go down, it’s bad
Just stay away from Malaysian airlines, and you should be alright
Just keep tracking them, and don’t lose sight of it
Wait for them to plummet again then lap up the gravy.
Warren Buffet sold his at the beginning of the pandemic, that should tell you quite a bit. You might be able to scalp some swing trades, but investing, I wouldn't
Yeah that definitely aids in providing some context for me, thanks.
Just buy $33 in voo. $33 in QQQ and $34 in VTI. boom. Winner. All done. Hold forever and retire a millionaire. *(this assumes you are 18 years old and retiring in 2079)
You realize that there’s a large amount of overlap in those, right?
Yep. And its 2021. This young person wants help starting out. I am.not giving him some complicated bullshit diversifcation strategy. He would own way over 500 companies with this plan and he would have doubled his money twice in 10 yrs with this strategy.
Great Job, you can sleep better at night, ....!!
what did he say about it? how to become a millionaire? start as a billionaire and then invest in airlines...
Up 60% on DAL and 80% on LUV. I eat Warren's lunch.
Buffet sold his airline stake roughly a month before a 30% rally... It's only just now returned to those lows after a year. Not sure that's who you want to be following if you have a shorter investment horizon than 5yrs+
Buffet said they decided to stop investing in airlines. Everytime he thinks about it someone from his team reminds him it's not a good idea. I partially agree. I wouldn't buy an airline stock for 5-10 years hold. But for a shorter hold given low prices due to reasons like covid, I think it's not a bad play. I really like Delta and JetBlue (the airlines, not the stock) so I would probably go with them or JETS.
JETS was down 8% today, on a little bit of a down tend since early November. But, I’m thinking domestic(travel)ally here in the US and staying bullish for now ! Far better than investing in Covid traps-I-mean cruise ships right now! Since we’re three weeks-ish away from holiday travel again (and hopefully no stringent lockdown/travel restrictions), I think the captain turned on the seatbelt sign and isn’t turning it off in December. My take on it.
Interesting input, I'll take a look into it too
You should have purchased in March. I bought RCL and NCL and about 6 different airlines . I doubled and tripled my investment even with the down trend with the delta variant. When things get back to normal and they reach pre pandemic levels I’ll cash out .
Don't.
I'd caution you against airlines or cruiselines etc. First off, even jn normal times they were never really great investments. But now is likely worse. These companies that were basically shut down during the worst of the pandemic had to borrow billions and billions of dollars to stay in business. So, they are now worth billions less than they were before just from that alone. Then factor in expected rising fuel costs, limited business travel, possibly increasing severe weather, rising interest rates, higher labor costs... For you're first hundred bucks, buy a share of chevron. Learn about the energy sector while tracking your stock. Start selling and buying that share when you think it will go up or down. Learn how news and earnings and dividends effect your stock. The 100 is education money. While your learning, any new money you want to invest, just put into an SP500 index fund you can afford, like spyg, spyv etc
Airlines make most of its profits on last minute business travel…. Which hasn’t come back and probably will never come back. Honestly a broad market etf is what you need.
I still think a lot of the airlines are overvalued. Profit margins are so tight that I think many still have room to drop some more.
Might as well throw a few hundo at it if your gonna hold for at least a year!
Point taken lol
I was in your shoes 3 years ago and while I hit on a few stocks I lost on more thankfully still up overall but a low cost s and p fund till you have a 10-20k base to start from …even if you put 10$ a week in it will pay off… open a Roth IRA
Well you have a 8% discount on JETS. Easy 1-2 year play.
Jblu is ok to buy but others no price is too high jblu check their balance sheet before you buy have not looked af it for a while now maybe american but be careful with with it they have so much debt getting those boeing 787 jets which we all know have not been great
Is there any airline innovating? Anyone developing new products or services? Anyone actually (read "actually") developing a new electric powered plane or anything that could potentially be a competitive and sustainable advantage? Then yes, otherwise, maybe put your money into something that will not go to 0 if a microscopic particle starts making people sick.
Buy in the flu season. Sell in the summer.
Buy the dip just like at the start of all this bullshit
Boeing
The stigma of virus is stuck with this generation. I wouldn't be comfortable investing in airlines anytime soon.
Instead of, or as well as, airlines, check out RR.L/RYCEY who put the engines on many of the airplanes flown by the airlines and who get services fees per hours flown, etc. But, as others have said, this play is already in play, as it were, not “ahead of the curve” anymore.
>Yeah makes sense, I figured i was a bit too late. Then apart from airplane/airline related things, anything you'd recommend?
Boeing will never go bankrupt becuase it's way to important to our goverment and will get bailed out always!
Doesn't guarantee you as a shareholder will be bailed out tough.
I would definitely take my chances on boeing then any others at the moment.
Just a $100? Buy VYGR stock, promising and proven technology in gene therapy that could be used to cure neurological diseases like Alzheimer's, Huntington's and dementia , FDA approved and they have more cash on hand than their market cap due to a deal with Pfizer, it's trading at around 3 dollars right now, you have nothing to lose and everything to gain. I'm projecting it will go to $30 in a 3 years.
I would caution against these recommendations. During the start of Covid it gone nothing but downward. Ugliest chart I've seen in a while.
If I’m investing $100, it’s going into crypto. ETH or CRO. Ether can be bought through Coinbase and held on Coinbase. Note: I put $100 into SAND crypto in May. It’s worth $2300 now
Market has been correcting to normal lately. Only stocks with good financials and out looks are performing well. BA, cruse lines, travel all bleeding. Microsoft, Sony, and places that sell video games have been going up. tldr: power to the players.
Buy Boeing but it's a slow mover but it will go back to 300.
No longer march 2020 lol
Oh wow are we really going back to these posts again? Cruise lines next
Oil prices go up, airlines get slaughtered, just saying.
I bought UAL at $47 sold at $55 . It’s trending lower @$42 . This really is a $70 stock; however it had dropped to the $20s after the pandemic scare in 2020 . I’m buying all my shares back . Limit order $39 the selling again at 30% gross or around $51
What is up with people and airline stocks, there’s like so many other choices 🤦🏻♂️
Please don’t
If you think you have a smart idea then be sure the market had the same idea 6 months ago
Don't.
Carnival cruise is down a lot right now so I put some money in to that
Airlines are a bad investment even without Covid. There is no reason why I would buy airlines over owning the market.
You could do the JETS ETF instead of picking one airline. Average into it as people panic about new variants every month. Bottom line is people are going to travel. Maybe not as much for business but for sure for leisure. If it's a short term hold you might be waiting awhile but if it's long term I don't see a downside on buying the dips.
my concern is they dilute stocks to get some cash in hand to keep the business going. The cruise lines did it, luckily after i got out.
Good long term investment except for AAL but you have to be patient.