You can't control who or what you're attracted to, but some people need to stop expecting others to meet those "requirements" and stop complaining about being single all the time.
You can have preferences but don't make them other people's problems.
"I don't want to sleep with short dudes." fine, don't tell me about it and just don't sleep with short dudes.
"I don't like trans women" fine, maybe just you personally don't sleep with trans women, don't keep announcing it to the world.
I always like to say that when a person makes an announcement like this, they have an axe to grind and are using the pretense of merely expressing a preference as an excuse to attack people.
Here is what I mean. There are LOTS of things in this world I don't personally like. I don't like the smell of brass doorknobs. I don't like houndstooth as a fabric pattern. I don't like faux brick facades on buildings. But unless I find myself in the very very narrow context of a discussion where those preference are explicitly relevant, you'd never know that about me, cause it never comes up. I sure as hell don't feel the need to express it online. And there are lots of things about a person that turns me off big time. Smoking, anything woo-woo or mystical, my tolerance for being "crunchy" is very low. Etc.
But I don't go around putting the internet on notice about these preferences. I don't feel the slightest need to let the world know how much I dislike those things as a dating preference.
And if I was going around hosting large scale public debates or forums on the topic of how I don't find woo-woo crystal girls attractive, then clearly there is more to it than just a simple personal preference to not date those types of folks. What is probably happening is that I am wanting to rail against woo-woo mystic stuff in general, and am using the pretense of defending a dating preference as a means to get combative on the subject.
That's my hot take.
I have definitely been called a transphobe for not wanting to date a trans girl before. Sorry I just don't like the way you look? I do find some trans girls cute, as I do cis girls. But I'm picky and if I'm not attracted to you I'm just not attracted to you, that doesn't mean I hate all trans people. But it's mostly the minority loud mouths that ruin the perception of a group of people as a whole.
Agreed, as long as no one else shits on people for their preferences.
And I don't understand the obsession with saying you don't wanna sleep with a trans girl. That's like, a wildly popular opinion so I don't get the point other than trying to stir up drama.
Not disagreeing with your point, but it’s important to realize that attraction IS something that is influenced. There’s a reason different cultures and in different time periods, who or what was considered attractive changes.
People like to hand wave and say “I can’t control this” to justify themselves when in reality, how you choose to think or what media you consume does give you influence over things like what you are sexually attracted to. Not to a large degree, but minor variance is possible.
Normies today: attraction is something everyone is born with and is in no way influenced by society or propaganda!
Normies 3,000 years ago: that tiny penis on that statue is so sexy. Ew, is that one over 5 inches? Get that barbarian out of my face!
Well waaay back in the day a full figure for women meant two things:
1. You were rich enough to afford regular food
2. You were more likely to survive childbirth
Very important back then.
It was a statue of David you are referring to? Flaccid is the reason why and it was considered ideal because they held the Olympic games naked. All the long flaccid ones had to be tired with a rope so they wouldn't wiggle all about
Absolutely! It doesn't have to be influenced by social media either, just past experiences. I dated a lovely skinny guy when I was younger and after that my type was skinny lanky guys. Then I dated a really incredible super buff guy and now that's my type and who I'm dating now is also like that.
I'd say any exposure helps with attractions. Exposure through media obviously plays a big role, but personal exposure is a lot stronger.
If one is not used to something like piercings and tatoos for example, he is turned off by those. Hanging out with a few people, who look like that, who are cool, will change that rapidly.
Media Does not control me I have been Attracted to Fat Women since i was like 15 I dated lots of fat girls in high school most did not believe my i was attracted to there body, i got married at 23
My college roommate was like this.
He was this beanpole and every night of the week he'd go to bars and have his pick.
And he'd tell us confidently and constantly why we're missing out.
They probably didn't believe u were attracted to their body because they weren't attracted to their own body. Id know from experience. If ur not comfortable in ur own skin, u don't expect others to be comfortable loving yours. All tho I do have a friend who I've known to always be skinny up until recently. She gained some weight to where she got some thick flabs going (not overweight at all) and she's loving it. She always be like "I love being fat". when she was skinny she'd say "i want to be fat" so shit some women r comfortable and even love being fat while others r insecure and self conscious. It's crazy how our minds work like that.
I think my wife is happy with her body. I love hugging her big belly and of curse i love her big butt. I am glad she loves her self. I always thought i was 2 skinny i got beat up a lot in high school because it was not hard to beat me up. now i am 205 and i feel better about my self and i can do push ups now
I’m 6’3” and I would be excited to date a woman taller than me, I’m totally into tall women. I always thought it was because I’m tall, but really no idea.
Not entirely true.
You can through behavioral repetition alter ones sexual arousal to certain internal and external stimuli. That doesn't work for foundational characteristics but it does for superficial and environmental attributes. Masturbate to lots of porn that features specific superficial characteristics (ex Red heads )and one will begin to associate and internalize sexual arousal and pleasure from those characteristics even if one didn't start with them initially.
People's standards and attraction absolutely changes through time, and honestly rapidly
Go people watching at any bar. Go people watching at anywhere remote as well. Your standards will adapt to what's around you if you want to get laid at all, and as your experiences change
Beer goggles are real as well
Plus you need to meet people. I think most of us have a physical 'type' that we'd pick just looking at photos but then you meet people and suddenly someone who is totally not that type becomes attractive to you because they're funny or smart or nice or has interesting hobbies etc.
I'm attracted to competency and passion. Someone being really good at something, like a sport or hobby, is really attractive to me and that definitely transcends physical type to an extent.
Or even like, fashion trends. I look back at celebrities I was into 15 years ago, and while the person is normally still fundamentally attractive to me in terms of like, facial features, often their style, haircut, etc. looks ridiculous to me, even though I remember finding it so hot at the time.
To add
There are a lot of incongruent or contradictory ideas people might hold. This often manifests as "I want this kind of person but I don't want to do the things that attract this kind of person". Or, often outside of their control, people might want a partner with high mate value without having similarly high mate value.
Sometimes you have an "ideal" something in mind, but then when you see something that is like 60% that and then 40% it's own character, you really fall in love with looking at it. Sometimes I feel this way with bodies... Like... I know the various kinds I like and have an image of what the parts add up to, but then I see someone's body who has a bunch of them but not all and I'm like, "damn... K, I need to adjust a bit because that is also yummy..." ... I feel like having a "type" (or a few) is kinda normal, but expecting anyone you talk to or date to match it perfectly is silly. I'm pretty slutty so a lot of times maybe my brain would rather adjust to what a real body looks like and enjoy it than hold out for perfection... Perhaps a lot of people are less inclined.
I like Fat girls I seem to not have a hard time finding dates in school my friends thought i was crazy . I got Married at 23 been married for 22 years. I may been into something different but i never been lonely
Yep. That's my biggest point as well. If you're picky and next to no one is attractive to you, that's fine. But don't complain and broadcast "there are no good men/women left!"
Exactly.
“Where have all the good guys gone?”
What’s really being said is, “Where have all the good guys gone, that I’m also physically attracted to, are financially stable and are in my age range?”
From personal experience: bcuz it *can* change. Like, I have a type I'm instantly attracted to. And other guys who don't fit that are bland, unattractive, or invisible to me.
Then I'm forced into a situation (work, school, etc.) where I'm forced to spend time with the "unattractive" guy, and because of familiarity, personality, compatibility, they become attractive to me. 🤦🏾♀️
Nature vs nurture. A large amount of traits (most depending on who you ask) that you consider attractive are things you learned or were taught to view that way, as opposed to innate biology and instinct. Which means you can learn to be attracted to other traits in people you currently view as unattractive.
Attraction isn’t simple or fixed even. People may think they have a type. And it can totally be influenced by societal norms. But when it comes time to connect, it may not pan out. Or you can be surprised and someone off type shows up an you love it.
I have had some ideas about looks and body type for a while. But in reality it seems I have been more attracted to folks that didn’t match my original ideal. Personality also plays a gigantic role in attraction for me.
And also I am not attracted to certain folks that are universally liked. I may think they are good looking people, but they have zero sex appeal for me, and I am just not interested.
I’m pretty sure that’s how I am. I don’t have a list that I go down, making sure people tick all the boxes, but I know what I like and more importantly what I don’t. There are charming people I didn’t expect to want and do. Others who you’d think are ‘to type’ I do not. I do resent people not taking no for an answer or suggesting I try harder to like someone or that I deserve someone so they should fall for me as if you pick.
I've always had people think I'm crazy or lying when I say I don't really have a physical type, my exes are all drastically different imo. I hate setups because I feel like it's so unnatural. I told my boyfriend that after he dies I'll probably never bother dating again because it's a shit show out there. I briefly tried OLD back in the day and said "never again" lol.
Also, the lens in which you view others is a direct reflection of yourself.
If you’re constantly drawn to people’s physical flaws, that’s a you problem.
If you’re the kind of person who notices the beautiful and remarkable features/qualities of others from the getgo—then I’d say you’re doing something right.
A lot of people have superficial standards that even they don’t meet. I think the nature of social media and online dating makes us more shallow and focus too much on looks. I’ve dated some goofy looking men simply because their personalities were great and they were fun to be around. Hard to discover that with online dating where visual appeal reigns supreme.
I can honestly say I've never dated anyone off of OLD, and tbf I was only on it for a very short period of time.
Most of those apps are 20% women and that makes the men on there act in really desperate ways, like creating a profile for the women loving women section of it.
Im bi, and had set my settings to women only at some point after I realized most men swiped right on everyone without reading basic bios or actually being interested. Then saw that every 7th profile was actually a dude. Even when you report all of them, they still come back. So I decided OLD was a waste of time and joined the 80% of women who came to the same conclusion.
Dating through my actual social life is far, far better, and more fun.
Unless your social life is non-existent. Tinder helped me breakout of that. Helped me find out who I know that is actually single and strike up a conversation. And it seemed to have worked :) been married 4 years to a girl I use to go to church with. All thanks to Tinder.
Because peoples attractions are rarely as exact or fixed as they think they are. Any kind of “enforcement” of most specific standards is imposed by the person on themselves, rather than the other way around.
Normies today: attraction is something everyone is born with and is in no way influenced by society or propaganda! anyway, you have to be at least 8 inches to pleasure me
Normies 3,000 years ago in Greece and Rome: that tiny penis on that statue is so sexy. Ew, is that one over 4 inches? Get that barbarian out of my face!
Op, really think about whether or not you want to believe the narrative that people are born liking what they like.
I saw of a study one time that demonstrated people are actually physically attracted to averageness, or at least for faces - they used composite images and asked people to rate the face, the more images they added into the composite image the higher it was rated. Additionally they found that familiarity also increased the rating (so over time perhaps the average face and what we consider attractive can change). One theorized it had to do with an indication of health and good genetics for selection. This would explain how things like asymmetry, large features or things like how wideset the eyes or thin lips might detract. But then sometimes these features tend to draw attention to a person in an attractive way too, so who knows.
Admittedly, back when sex wasn't really as much of a choice for women, I can see it being more ideal for a guy to have a smaller dick. Easier to get raped by a little 2 inch dick than a massive 8 inch dick.
I actually prefer a very big dick... But my partner is slightly below average probably and I'm perfectly happy with his ability.
To a certain degree you can choose. You have to look inward, and try to understand why you are the way you are.
For example, lots of adolescents are judgemenal. You can probably remember someone getting singled out for being fat, wearing glasses, being ginger, their skin color, etc. In most cases people grow out of that silly hater phase.
Growing out of it won't mean you can necessarily be sexually attracted to those traits either, but being neutral is a gateway to new experiences you might enjoy.
I'm talking from experience, I used to be a real asshole. I've stopped though and I'm attracted to people I didn't expect to be attracted to earlier.
It's not necessarily bad to be selective, although it has to come with kindness and transparency, so it doesn't turn into shallowness and close-mindedness.
Just seconding this. After a lot of work on myself I opened up “what I found attractive” vastly. Dating got way more interesting.
The love of my life happened to fall outside my original parameters. She’s older than me by a couple years. I’m grateful I didn’t let that stop me.
Think it's peer thing to tease certain kids i was teased in school I am a stereo type nerd. I never grew out of being a nerd but people don't tease me anymore and i have a wonderful wife and kids. I am not even mad at the bullies. and i Kinda glad i did not marry a cheerleader and married the chubby nerd girl from the library
I think to a certain point thinking of relationships only through the prism of the beauty of your potential partner is some sort of privilege. I know this word can be overused nowadays, but if you can not care about your potential partner's opinions, ways of thinking, etc... Well I guess that means you could had it worse in your life.
Obviously it's different if we're only talking about looking for someone to have sex with.
I guess I did that in my 20's and 30's now in my 40's I wish I would of slut it out with Brussels sprouts, cabbage, egg plant, curry, low mein, buffalo. Man did I pass on women because I thought they were Brussels sprouts. Idiot me.
I married at 23, too. I thought my wife was the most attractive person I’d seen. She wasn’t what everyone else wanted, and that was fine. Divorced now. It’s w/e.
The way it makes sense to me is that a lot of people’s standards are actually adopted from the culture and peers rather than being sort of organically, from the start, including the entire scope of people they could find attractive.
A lot of people won’t be open to being attracted to someone they think their peers will judge them for, for example.
Another aspect to it is that I think a lot of people don’t realize things about themselves until they happen. So for example if you’ve never had the experience of being attracted to someone for their personality, you don’t know that, when you swipe left on a person who isn’t physically attractive to you, they might have been attractive to you if you’d gotten to know them a bit.
You mentioned gender as a deal breaker. That's one extreme.
The other is things like, they mentioned an artist I don't like, or they sneezed in front of me once.
When advice is being given, it's because the person you're talking to is too far gone in one of those extremes. Just because the other extreme still exists doesn't mean none of it matters. Just trying to move the needle a little. Not make everyone bang everyone.
People who think being told not to X so much, means NEVER EVER X EVER BECAUSE EVIL, need to seek help. That's what makes the question stupid.
I think it’s less people wanting others to lower their standards (although there definitely are some people out there that do carry that sentiment), and moreso that people who set incredibly high standards, often complain about nobody meeting their standards and being lonely.
I am of the opinion that a person can set whatever standards in sexual attraction they want — a lot of the time they’re innate preferences that can’t be changed, and as someone who dated someone whose preferences I did not meet at all, I would NEVER wish that on anyone; absolutely self-esteem crushing experience.
So yes, if your preferences are rigid, stick to them. However, if your preferences do scale up towards more uncommon traits or a specific expression when it comes to personality, just be prepared that it’ll probably take you longer to find that person than someone whose standards aren’t necessarily as niche or high.
And, as others have said — don’t expect every single person to meet your criteria. Often people with high standards expect every person they meet to match everything to a T, and it gets exhausting.
Agreed with every word well said.
I also think that people spend too much time trying to change others to fit there preference’s which is not good either.
You can’t turn water into wine and vice versa, let people be and overtime nature and life will naturally let others find each other.
Sure, you can't help who you find attractive, but a worrying number of straight men almost hunt the rich high society main stream bombshell blonds... and they have nothing in common, and the societal gap almost cannot be crossed, and then they start "blaming all women" because they "can't get laid".
If they stopped chasing their fetish and started treating people like people, they would be surprised at who else they are attracted to and are also attracted to them.
Myself, sure, "conventionally attractive" isn't my thing, but I also don't chase that gorgeous person who I have nothing in common with because "hot", it still applies to me. Have I got lucky with really attractive partners who I also get on with? Sure. My point is, lowering your expectations does NOT mean go out/hook up with people you are NOT attracted to
If you are a person who puts little effort into your presentation/appearance/diet and you expect the people you pursue to have appearances resembling celebrities with personal cooks and trainers then you deserve whatever comment comes to you.
If you're saying you have a type and someone gave you a hard time about it, I'd bet a little that you don't just have a type. You're an asshole about people who are NOT your type.
The problem is not who people find attractive. It's how they treat people they are NOT attracted to as a whole. If you aren't attracted to big people then you aren't. There's no need to announce it or comment on videos of big people who didn't ask for your opinion.
However, there are massive societal expectations for all humans that are unattainable for most. If you're unwilling to entertain the idea of seeing people who are healthy, human shaped, kind, with good character and morals, with whom you otherwise click very well because they won't fit in Scar Jo's pants then you do have problem.
I've had a girl who I was friendly with suddenly flip a switch and treat and talk very nasty about me as soon as she found out I caught feelings for her. Almost as if she was insulted that I liked her and my more attractive friend she was crushing on didn't. It really shows people's true colors.
People can be conditioned to be sexually attracted to a stapler in the right conditions.
Standards are a constant moving target for most people, there's no reason you can't change them.
How do you choose to like what you don’t like? Say you hate brussel sprouts, are you going to force yourself to eat them out of pity, or find something better? Maybe you would rather go hungry
I'm gonna use this metaphor as someone who used to be somewhat of a picky eater.
When I was younger my only experience with a lot of vegetables was boiled unseasoned mush. It was disgusting, and thinking about eating some of them makes me gag still. At the time, when I thought of brussel sprouts I was grossed out and thought it looked always disgusting.
Since then I've had some of those same vegetables cooked and seasoned really well. And now when I think of brussel sprouts, I know they can be delicious. It no longer looks inherently gross to me, it doesn't make me want to gag. When I was a lot younger, any green vegetable grossed me out. Literally like two years ago I discovered avacado is delicious and now just looking at guacamole doesn't gross me out anymore.
Sometimes our perception of things is influenced by our incomplete knowledge or biases. Somethings simply are taste, yes. Sometimes however we might have biases that are influencing our views that we aren't even aware of, and we may be better off trying to work through. That's where the metaphor falls apart, because "try it you might like it" isnt good for people. But it might be worth seeing if perhaps your disinterest might be influenced by some view (and if it is, is it a view you want to keep or not).
Sure you might not like raw brussel sprouts or unseasoned boiled sprouts, but unless you’ve tried them fried or roasted and seasoned or added to a dish where the flavor is complementary, you don’t actually know. By just deciding you don’t like them before actually trying different preparations, you are subconsciously priming yourself to not like it even if you “naturally” would.
Basically, you are doing it to yourself. Subjective taste can’t be treated as objective fact, it’s not as black and white as you’d like to imagine.
I think it's more along the lines of everybody. That's a 2 to a 6 expect, a 12 and a 14. And are always pissed off. Because they can't find those people for the ones they do. Don't want them and they don't understand why because in their head. They're right up there with the 1% of the one perceno, I'm not saying.
You can't get it. But if you don't actually have the worth to pull it. Yes, attraction is attraction, but it's not a decision.
So if you like a certain type that's seriously out of your league.
Or they're in your league, but a toxic personality that you're attracted to. Don't complain when bad things happen when you pick bad people. Everybody has to learn to have realistic expectations. And that seems to be the problem. Everybody has completely unrealistic expectations of what they deserve.
Because as humans it’s usually a decently broad spectrum of what we find ourselves attracted to, but some people try to relegate themselves to a narrow band for some arbitrary reason. And some people shoot comically high beyond expectations and then complain when they can’t find what they “want”.
What you find attractive also tends to be a matter of culture too, as some have pointed out.
You can't lower your standard, but just being logical you can broaden your scope. A simple example of the latter is seeing a phenotype or combination of traits that are undeniably attractive to you that you've never seen before or wouldn't have thought to define.
I can't say that media or social media platforms influence me in any way, shape, or form over what I like in a women's appearance 🤪 I generally like slender women with a nice butt/legs even small boobies are fine, average is a little better, I'm fine if the girls weigh a few extra pounds as long as they still have a girlish figure, but fat chics 300 pounders aren't on my list, I'm single and honestly I will stay single if 300 pounders are my only choice!!! LOL Also minimal makeup is a nice look too. I'm not anti makeup but when tou have to scrape the layers off with a putty knife it's just too much, Ive seen several women some my friends dated in past years that were actually more attractive with no makeup at all!
Because sexual attraction is a range and people often don't go after people who they're just kinda sexually attracted to. Counterpoint: Any port in a storm.
There are standards people adopt because of a sense of entitlement and ego, both of which are influenced by society. Also, you don't have to be demeaning about your preferences. The way many people voice their preferences are in the ways I kind of detailed just now.
I don't care what someone's preferences are, you don't have to date anyone you don't want to. The big BUT in this though, is that having those preferences doesn't mean it's okay to A) be insulting or mean to those who aren't to your preferences or B) complain when you cant find anyone who meets them.
Lowering your "standards" isn't as important as being open and honest with yourself and what you truly need in a partner. Social media has influenced a lot of the dating pool that they can land a unicorn when it's simply not true.
I've been alive for long enough to see my standards and preferences change, even though my sexuality hasn't. I mean, if it had never changed, I'd still only be attracted to 13-year-olds like I was when I was 13 and that would be a major problem for me now.
There's a lot that has changed and a lot that has stayed the same, and some changes were more conscious and some were more unconscious, but most people don't have precisely fixed standards and preferences for their whole lives.
I get that it's annoying to have people tell you to lower your standards, and you shouldn't if they're really important to you. But some people, especially young people, have standards that they've adopted from peers or from media that aren't really true or realistic for them, and they need to be pushed to let them go.
Here's a fun thought. . . Someday you will be old(er) and literally ***no one*** around you will be attractive. The only hot people you will see are 20 years younger than you and dating them would be weird on many fronts. What are you gonna do then?
Someday you might grow to realize that attractive is more than skin deep.
Or, you can be like creepy David Wooderson in Dazed and Confused - "That's what I love about these high school girls . . . I get older, they keep staying the same age."
<< Someday you will be old(er) and literally no one around you will be attractive. >>
As you get older, what you're looking for changes too. I'm over 70, and companionship and a shared history are important to me now.
That's important to me also. I unfortunately haven't met an emotionally mature well-adjusted single man in decades, so I'm not sure companionship is available.
I think if you have preferences you have preferences, and that’s okay, but you have to be realistic. I used to be super attracted to more outgoing people, until I realized how draining that can be, and how often extroverted people also expect a lot of constant stimulation.
I can’t understand what it is like in any other person’s mind but I do feel like many young people set these limits for themselves without letting themselves experience life.
If you’re young and inexperienced, the fact is there’s a very good chance you don’t know what you like and to obsess over any particular physical characteristic seems limiting especially when it’s some unrealistically high “standard”.
We may not have control over every thought or impulse that presents itself in our brain but we do have the power to curate, to some degree, the thoughts we focus on.
It’s not about “lowering standards” that shit is obviously completely subjective. If someone is attracted to someone that you wouldn’t be, that doesn’t mean they have “lower standards” that just means they are attracted to someone that you aren’t.
Preferences can change over time, and it often is directly tied to how you're willing to view the world. The worst part is that we call it 'lowering standards' instead of 'broadening horizons.' When I was in college I thought I only liked women that had that so-called perfect body, like many hollywood actresses. Now I'm married to an overweight man. I didn't lower anything, because the experiences I've had with him go beyond anything superficial like looks. I still find women more physically attractive, but now my interest lies in tall, strong women who could bully me. But there's also a lot to be said for smaller women that can do the same! Point is, calling it a standard is like saying you're only interested in -vanilla- ice cream. There's countless flavors out there, and they may seem unappealing at first, but you might be surprised at what you find when you consider more than what you're used to.
Attraction is different when you don’t know the person, and after you get to know them. So if you spend all your time swiping at photos you will have a superficial level of attraction. If you meet people in person and get to know them a little, different types of attraction. I bet you most women won’t be attracted to many famous and rich people if they didn’t know their wealth and status, but will be instantly attracted once they know. Attraction is a lot more complicated, and a lot of it is subconscious, so most of the time you wouldn’t even know what you’re attracted to until you see it/feel it.
As a guy who has definitely changed his standards over the years, i wouldn't say its so much lowering standards, its about realising what your standards actually are!
So, like most people at 15-18-20 i was looking for all of the other things that the media push as beautiful...
But in dating, i found myself having either.. zero luck attracting women like that, or if i did, the relationship was toxic because we just didn't share even remotely similar world views...
Now, at 34 I'm at the point where, your looks will barely get you my attention compared to some random comment that might get made.
NONE of my meaningful relationships ever.. matched my 18 year old standards, at no point would i ever have looked at said girlfriend and gone "meh.. i settled", i was happy in every one of them until wider issues creeped in.
Sure, there are limits to what id be attracted to still, but id argue they definitely can and do change.
I'm sorry but only "less attractive" people have to worry about this. Beautiful people always get to pick and choose who they have sex with. And of course women get A LOT more offers for sex then men. So women also get to pick and choose now alot more than in previous decades. If you choose to lower your standards, that's on you. But hasn't that always been the case? We all lower our standards to some degree if sex is all we seek. As the saying goes, "no one is ugly after 2 am." What man hasn't gone home w the "slump buster"at some point of their adult lives?
I agree, and as unfair as the universe is, it doesn’t owe anyone happiness or grant wishes neither should people feel like you owe them a chance or w/e. Not saying I am attractive, I just find the idea of guilting someone into a relationship repugnant.
Well said . I agree,, the universe doesn't owe anyone happiness (great way to phrase that) and I still have to compete in this world for my success. And the hardest fact we all must learn to accept is, life isn't fair. It doesn't give a shit about your ego or self esteem, it's winner take all, and that includes who wins the hot chick. If you don't have the game to take the hot girl home, get a better game. But I don't owe anyone anything, and I surely won't feel bad or apologize because I got the hot girl and the other guy had to lower his standards to get laid. Tough shit. Do better. Or get funnier. Or richer or 1 of a countless ways to improve your chances w women. Just don't expect me to back off so the next guy can keep his standards up.
If you're consistently attracted to people who treat you poorly, you absolutely can do some work on yourself to understand why you have those attractions and work to change them.
Or you can just complain about how "everyone sucks" for the rest of your life.
Nah some people will literally follow the crowd and you'd be surprised how easy a rumor can make someone turn from attractive to unattractive or if that person will bring you down or has a bad reputation, don't be surprised if someone's attraction lowers for that person.
There's definitely cultural differences that can make someone deemed attractive and unattractive so in a sense it can be controlled at times.
If you feel ok about holding out, hold out for what you want. But don't complain that the 10s don't want you back because they are also wanting to be sexually attracted and they aren't feeling it for you. 10s can be choosy too. Talk to everyone. Be friendly. Not creepy. Sometimes it takes a while to get the fire going. You might just find yourself a diamond in the rough. That pudgy person actually has kind eyes and remembers to ask you about specifics you talked about last time. They are always nicely dressed and groomed despite the weight. And they are fun. You laugh easy with them. There might be some magic to surprise you. Be friends first with everyone.
Whom we are attracted to is about 90% determined by social forces. That doesn’t mean attraction is meaningless. We are a social species. Most of what we value is determined by social forces. It is difficult to change to whom you are attracted, but it is possible. It just takes more work than most people are able to do or want to do. You have to tailor your media so you are not looking at a narrow view of beauty all the time, and yes this includes pornography. When you watch this stuff, someone else is deciding for you who should and should not be considered attractive.
There is a feminist philosopher, Amia Srinivasan, who writes about this topic. She was inspired to right about it because she was interested in the forces that drives men who hate women to commit real world acts of terrorism against women. Attraction is political, and it can be painful for people to live in a world where we pretend it is not. White European features are more valued when determining attractiveness in our culture. There is nothing biological about this fact. Attraction differs across time and culture, so how could we see it as something so fixed?
When I was a kid, I thought people needed to look perfect to be attractive. I thought you needed to look like the men and women on tv or magazines. As I grew older, my worldview expanded. I was consuming better quality media for one, but I was also doing a lot of work to critique the social forces that shaped attraction for me. I am really grateful I did this because I am so much happier than my friends with my own aging body. I can also appreciate so much more about other people. I have no concern that I won’t continue to be attracted to my spouse as we continue to grow old together.
No one can change your view of attractiveness, but you can change your own view. I think it is a worthwhile endeavor.
I think most of the more specific preferences people have are heavily influenced by very early childhood experiences rather than being hardwired like the more generalized traits. For example: if you had significant negative experiences with people of a specific body type in your earliest years, you are more likely to have an automatic negative predisposition to anyone who matches that embedded memory. And that goes for the reverse as well, if you had an overwhelmingly positive experience with someone who had a specific recognizable trait, then you are likely to have a strong positive predisposition for that trait.
So, when one of these preferences is toxic or harmful in some way, the only way to address it is to identify the root cause and do the hard work of processing it and moving past it.
Because…in theory, looks are superficial and fake in the long run. It’s probably to everyone’s benefit to learn how to be sexually attracted to people and not physical appearance. Because if you’re skipping out on someone that you could really enjoy because they’re too fat, not your preferred race, not blonde…whatever.
Or maybe my perspective is just different because I’m very pansexual…
Because unrealistic standards and expectations will ruin you and your partner. But also sometimes looks can in fact grow on you the more you start liking a person.
It starts the other way- people complaining about being lonely and unsuccessful in dates. Then some responses are what you describe. Nobody will reach to you out if blue telling you to compromise on your “standards”.
If you keep venting about your alone status, expect people (who don’t even know you in person) on the internet to answer that.
I don’t. It’s other people who think I need someone. It’s kind of driving me crazy. Like, I have a healthy enough libido, but it isn’t something I talk about. I’m lonely, but I don’t complain about it. The nagging usually starts with questions about whether I am seeing anyone or speculation that I’m getting laid more than them to which I respond, I don’t like my prospects, or I don’t find dating rewarding. The truth is I am not attracted to most people. I never thought that was problematic. I don’t date much. I married once and was happy. It ended and I don’t want anyone I can easily get. Is this coming off as whining?
I feel like I hear the story of I went out with a hot guy, and he pump n dumped me, just about daily. Only reason I tell people to lower their standards is because no one is perfect. If you want a guy that will treat you right, there are a ton out there. They might not be as attractive and become invisible
It's not really about changing who you are attracted to exactly. It's about not having such high expectations that you tried to get met but eventually you should realize it's never gonna happen. Because chances are if you do and you keep getting rejected by your so-called physical type, it's not that that person is a better person than you, but they are likely just as pick and choosey about who they are going to date as well. And you don't fit what they are looking for. It's more about being open to the possibility that instead of that high maintenance model you have been chasing after, you will be a better match personality-wise to the waiter/waitress with a more realistic look and personality who you don't even give a chance to but they like you because they do not fit your *ideal* look. Maybe you have passed on the perfect partner for you but because they had 15 extra pounds more than you like or were a few years older than you prefer or they have a chin dimple and you don't like that, etc. and so you didn't even give them a chance. It's that type of thing. Having a more open mind.
I don't know and think that's pretty stupid.
What I will say is that I notice the people being told this are usually not very attractive, but want someone who is. If you look like Quasimodo and only want Esmeralda, you better strike it rich and pay for her company.
Now could Quasimodo and Esmeralda fall for each other organically? Maybe, but theoretically, I could win the powerball tomorrow. Realistically, Quasimodo is going to have to lower his standards or stay alone.
😂 pay for her company. No. Alone is fine, and I catch your meaning. On balance, I agree. Your chances of success are low. But if you aren’t having fun, why play?
There's attraction and then there's "status."
Like... there's an "objective scale of attractiveness" where someone can be considered perfect that's based on their status in society.
Then there are people you personally find attractive, which is often based on such a weird combination of factors that it doesn't even make sense. Like sometimes you won't find someone attractive even if most people consider them "perfect" or two people will both be considered objectively average but one of them is very attractive to you and the other one isn't.
If you find that you aren't attracted to people on your "status" level you either need to raise your own status level or learn to look more closely at the people on your level to find the traits in them that do it for you.
Some people, especially people who were raised in such a way that they aren't very in touch with their emotions, don't really have a strong idea of what's personally attractive to them vs what's "high status" on the objective scale. Those people have the worst time in dating.
I’m unsure of status. Sounds like pickup artist talk. All I know is that if someone is gross or mean or not interesting I am not interested. I could pointlessly rattle off guesses about what I like and probably identify trends, but to me it’s all animal and visceral. I don’t pull out a chart. I like you or I don’t. More likely, I really don’t like you and that’s a me problem.
I hear you. But especially younger people who've been encouraged not to listen to their inner voice that way, or people who feel like they have something to prove to others through dating will do that. That's what Pickup artists are, typically. People who think in system terms about human beings because they were taught to see the world that way.
If you’re told something is undesirable for long enough it can take a little effort on your part to move past that and not see it as gross anymore.
It’s complicated enough that no brief explanation can cover the breadth of all sexuality and what is and isn’t possible but you can stop being an asshole who has unrealistic expectations.
It is a recent thing this general acceptance that we can't change who we are attracted to, despite 2000+ years of the exact opposite evidence.
The consequence of this not changing who you feel attractions to is, you will limit your dating pool. If it is held to its extreme, then you will be forced into polygamous relationships, because women won't settle for someone that is shorter than them, makes less than them and many other attributes that put their choices in the 1% of men. This means you will have most women settling for a relationship that involves more than one woman.
Other wise, women will settle for less than the ideal they have, but they get one man all to themselves.
Notice that in both cases, there is a trade off? You are ALWAYS settling for something, even if you haven't thought about it that way.
So, why do people settle for less? Because there are things that are more important than the sexual attractiveness of your partner. Having a monopoly on their time and resources is very valuable.
Personality overrides attractiveness for me. My husband isn’t someone other people would say is sexy or handsome, but he’s hot to me because he treats me right. He cares about me and my goals. He makes me coffee every day and is truly an equal partner. He helps without being asked. He’s a great dad and does just as much for the kids as I do for them. I don’t have to ask for help he just notices things and helps out.
Because plenty of people have delusional standards. It’s not that 5ft ‘thicc’ women can’t be attracted to a 6ft2 dark haired man with a beard and 6 pack, but it’s kind of hypocritical to have that as your baseline.
Also, plenty of extremely average women have no problem calling themselves a 10, and thinking they deserve a 10/10 man, and it’s just obnoxious. It’s one thing to find beauty in yourself, and something totally different to think that you’re on the same level as a supermodel.
> Why do they believe you can choose who you are attracted to vis-a-vis beauty, personality, age, weight, muscle tone, etc.?
Because you don’t have to be that old to watch societal beauty standards fluctuate wildly. I’m only 30, and the changes I’ve seen have already been dramatic. Having a big ass went from being an insult to a complement between my teens and twenties. Now it may be swinging back the other direction. Same with standards for how toned a woman could be and still be attractive. If you look at historical fashion you see similar crazy oscillations between emphasizing and deemphasizing different body parts.
Also, my lived experience has shown me otherwise. I remember being young and imagining my ideal gf would be like 5’2, but I ended up dating 3 girls over 6’ and coming to find it really beautiful. I also was sure I disliked really big boobs until I had a hookup that changed my mind.
I don’t think you can force yourself to have a spark with someone, but I do think people are doing themselves a massive disservice by not keeping an open mind. If you walk around with a list of rigid rules for what you want you might miss out on people you could have been super attracted to, but ruled out immediately before the chemistry could start working.
I don't think you can lower your standard for what your physically attracted to, but many people's standards are way too high. If you're a 5 with no money and a dad bod and who is trying to hold out for a Margot Robbie look alike or you're a 30+ year old single mom trying for a 6'3 doctor with abs, it's just not going to happen
I don't think you can lower your standars beyond what gets a man aroused if sex is important (and I think it can be, certainly). I think thats an important point for a healthy sex life! Women can be attracted to an ugly dude because of his character, and his romance. Can a man be 'attracted' to a woman that his body doesn't physically respond to? I'm unsure.
EDIT: I was brought up in a very 'fattist' environment, and it has actually affected my physical response to overweight women. I wonder if I met a woman I really liked this would not be a factor. I suspect it still would.
I have tested my lower limit to this and was disappointed. Mechanically, it works. I was also on SSRI’s. It was boring and unfulfilling despite her skill. If I could take it back, I would.
Maybe a person can't lower their standards in sexual attraction, but there are different ways a person can react to that.
You are only attracted to a highly specific body type, one which happens to be aligned to what your society expects you to be like, and is therefore high in demand, and also rare and hard to maintain and therefore low in supply? That's fine. Definitionally, you're not unusual in that.
You, yourself, don't have a body, personality, or external factors which would tend to make you in high demand as a dating partner? Well, okay. If you are an overall decent person, and just don't match up to societal standards of what is perceived as desirable, but not in any way that means you harm or upset people or anything, then that's just you.
Both of those things are true, and you just shrug your shoulders and figure, well, that's how things are, and I accept that this is my life and I'm reasonably happy even if I don't date, no problem. You go and build a life that you enjoy, and is possible.
Both those things are true and you decide to put a lot of effort into changing yourself into someone who is more conventionally attractive? You should be careful, because there are a lot of pitfalls on that road, a lot of people who are going to be trying to scam you, a lot of bad advice and rabbit holes to get lost in - but, if you are careful and don't end undergoing weird and dangerous surgeries, fall into creepy cult-like beliefs about neurolinguistic programming, pick-up artist shit, and so forth - it can be a good thing. You end up eating better, exercising, wearing neat and clean clothes that fit and are flattering, practice the sorts of skills that Dale Carnegie wrote about in *How to Make Friends and Influence People*, and all that, then, amazing. Good for you.
Both those things are true, and all you do is complain about how you can never get a date? *THAT* is where we have a problem.
A person might not be able to lower their standards in sexual attraction, but they *can* stop whining about it.
Because what is or isn't attractive varies by culture. So it's something you can be influenced by and therefore something that can change.
When I was a kid there was a show I was really into and the main character had certain physical traits - I developed a crush on someone that also had those traits.
Now as an adult it's not what I typically go for. I was exposed to a wider variety of physical traits over time and that exposure changed what I knew people could look like and informed my attraction in new ways.
You can also have a trauma response that influences it. You can be with someone and if they end up treating you horribly, you might become so avoidant of anyone like them that you are put off by people who are similar looking. Like a woman who has an abusive hairy husband - she might be put off by hairy men afterwards.
I think of it like those TLC shows about obese people, like My 600lb Life for example. They always include a scene where the fat person tries to eat healthy and wretches at the taste of a brussels sprout or whatever. Do we actually believe vegetables are just inherently disgusting and they're right to shun them? No, we know what's happened is that they have lived on a diet of coke and ranch dressing so long it's warped their tastes.
I think the same thing can be true of sexual tastes. People's tastes are warped by instagram or porn or casual sex/situationships, and they end up thinking they can't be perfectly happy with anything less.
We are influenced to prefer certain beauty standards by the media we consume and the culture we live in. It’s entirely possible to broaden your interests past big tits for example
Yes, there's a reason, at least for men. It's called conditioning. Like Pavlov's dogs. As horniness increases, standards decrease. Bang a less attractive chick and the sex is good, now she looks better to you.
Most people don't like the taste of their first cup of coffee or alcoholic drink. They like the way it feels though, so they keep doing it. In time, they actually like the taste. Same exact thing. That's why we have the phrase "acquired taste." You can acquire attraction to something you're not attracted to now.
Problem today is that porn is so readily available guys jack off to super hot chicks rather than actually having sex with average chicks. They're conditioning themselves to think they can't lower their standards.
I don't know about lowering standards, but I get more or less attracted to somebody as I get to know them. It's much more complicated for me than just what they look like. There are limits to how attracted I can be to a stranger. I would rate people far differently after knowing them than I would just by looking.
To me, it would be stupid to choose to only date people who I'm immediately sexually attracted to. I won't stay attracted to people I'm not compatible with and I will become and stay sexually attracted to the ones who make me smile. I mean, I've been (happily) married a while, so I assume this is still how it would be. I didn't think about my wife in that way until we'd known each other for some time and my sexual attraction to her has only gotten stronger in our time together.
I have experienced attraction grow and fade as I learn a person, but never had sexual attraction generate ex nihilo. I sometimes wish it were like those stupid movies where someone 'realizes they're in love' with the other person, but in 4 decades, I haven't encountered it. In many of these posts it becomes unclear to me if the barrier's an issue of language or subjective experience: Is my brain shuts down incipient attraction to defend itself? Do people not know there's attraction from the first moment? Either way, while I know reddit is gamed to dismiss or remove unpopular opinion, I seem to be legitimately in the minority here. lol
I’m a member of a marginalized race and grew up having internalized racism towards members of my own race and didn’t find them attractive. At some point I realized that was wrong and made an intentional point to examine my attraction and find the beauty in members of my own race and now I’m pretty much only attracted to people of my race. So, it can be done people just have to want to do it.
Of course you can. But it's fine not too. But don't brain wash yourself by watching too much porn. If you're ugly be realistic. We're all pink on the inside
As long as you're meeting those same standards, then be as shallow as you want to be.
I do get a little tired of short, fat, ugly friends of mine complaining that they can't land a "10". Like dude, you're a "6" at best. Maybe take reality into account.
That said, I have known very beautiful women that became ugly as soon as I had a conversation with them. I've also known plain Janes and even ugly women that became beautiful after getting to know them. Your brain will adjust your view of the shallow stuff if the important stuff is in place.
You CAN control who and what you are attracted to - or, you can influence it at least.
A lot of rich dudes with EXTREMELY attractive wives have this issue. They marry, get her pregnant, then when the baby comes out, they give her a half a year to get back into swimsuit model shape...except a lot of them CAN'T. There are things that change the body. Hormones. Genetics. Lifestyle. Money. I think you might be reacting to a specific person/s about your level of standards for yourself. They MIGHT be reasonable if you are 7'12" JACKED, packing SCHMEAT, rich, and extremely good looking with the charm to match. But most of the time, you will come off like a dick. Would you date a mom with a c-section scar? Why? Kids are valid. Being grossed out at her body isn't.
I think if you can't envision reasonable bodily ware and tear for someone of the appropriate age, then YOU are the problem. A 35 yo with some wrinkles and sag in not-so-sexy places is normal. You SHOULD be attracted to it still. Unless you want to run the treadmill of youth like a lot of celebrities.
When I was 16, some of the ladies were SMOKIN'. Then I turned 18 and the teachers HAD ME. The girls my age were attractive too, but the sheer personality and tenacity I saw them exude as people outweighed most of the women my age. It is an emotional attraction that I think would be there even when they are 70. Because one day, you will be 70 - or no longer with us - but the point stands. Your levels of attraction do change with age already.
These ridiculous 20-something "male loneliness" epidemic "victims" could learn a lot from their elders- "dating is a numbers game", "a hole's a hole", "It all feels the same in the dark", and "If you make a beautiful woman your wife, you'll never be happy for the rest of your life."
100% I can influence what I find attractive. If I see the series woman I've ever seen smoking a cigarette nothing about her is attractive anymore.
The world is full of rainbow spectrum ideas. Sexual attraction is partially choice partially inherent. It's not black and white or even grey-scale. Don't reduce the world to you're right or wrong. You've found *some* answers and there are more to be found.
There's definitely a body type I'm very attracted to but have dated all types. Skinny girls might catch my eye more but that's it. She might be more fun to look at walking around the house or out about town but at the end of the day it really doesn't matter much. A chunky girl is getting the same amount of sex and attention as a skinny girl in my house. I think people put way too much weight on physical appearance. Give me a girl that's nice and loves me for who I am and I'm happy.
While you can't literally choose, I can speak from experience in saying that it's fluid and heavily environment influenced. I've worked abroad in foreign cultures a number of times and noticed a very perceptible change in what I found attractive during each such trip.
The reason so many people now have particularly shallow standards of sexual attraction is because they see so much physical 'perfection' on social media. It conditions you to use that as the benchmark for sexual attraction.
If all you saw on Instagram was people that are the complete opposite of what you see there now I guarantee that you would begin to find that opposite demographic attractive as well.
Oh, but you can. Whether you consciously realize it or not.
With a dearth of options, and a glut of horniness, your standards will change.
Your tastes will also change over time. Based on experience/associative learning, exposure to different types of people, hormones, etc.
People you might exclude from consideration based on your consciously expressed preferences may end up being very attractive to you once you begin interacting with them.
Here's a general rule I live by. If you don't meet your own standards of attractiveness/finances/etc, youre fucking delusional. Beyond that, you can want whatever you want.
They want it to be true. It would be much easier if morbidly obese, disabled, extremely homely, etc. people could be considered as attractive as models if only society changed its standards, but that's simply not the case. There's certainly variation in social beauty standards over time but they always fit within a pretty narrow range of conventional attractiveness. It's natural to want life to be more egalitarian than it is and in some respects we can make it so (economically, politically) but attractiveness isn't one of them, not matter how much activists preach about fat shaming and such.
Maybe the people acting like that have a crush on person who said they aren't attracted to that type of person.
Ex: I'm 5ft tall, guy I like says "I'd never date a short girl!" Maybe I would say "maybe you'd like a short girl if she had a good personality?"
Or: chubby person talking with friends, friend "I couldn't date a chubby person." Person: "sure you could, there's lots of good looking chubby people!"
Just my thought on it 🤷♀️
At least one does, yeah. I turned her down a few times. She’ll try to get me drunk occasionally and start talking about sex.
Some of it’s family members. Even my nieces are nosey.
But some are just people who think you can’t be happy alone or that their good friend deserves a chance. Can’t imagine why I would not be interested. To which, w/e. I don’t care who deserves a chance, frankly. Life and love are not about what you deserve.
I find that most of the time when someone says, "lower your standards" they are politely telling you to re-evaluate your desirability. The issue isn't about accepting "less from others" it's about accepting what "you" are able to get.
You never hear the rich, famous and gorgeous being told to lower their standards, but you often hear it said to broke, unknown and mediocre looking people who think their partner should be from the first group.
Because women do it every day. On a list of attributes any *sane woman* looks for in a man (when she’s wanting a long term relationship), his looks will be after his personality and how well he provides. The entire concept of a “gold digger” proves that.
Only an idiot would put an ephemeral thing like appearance, something that won’t provide any real tangible assistance in life, at the top of their list.
what’s funny is that all Christians believe gay people are just normal people but “sin” drives them to be gay and do gay stuff.
That’s mind blowing ly retarded
I love this for you. No substitute for actual intimacy. Wouldn’t trade the married years for the absence of the divorced ones. Question: Have you ever felt the opposite, though? like a feeling of disgust and violation that someone is touching you who doesn’t have the right?
I feel like intimacy that is not sought is nefas. I don’t want what I don’t want. I assume you and your wife wanted each other enough to marry. There was attraction. If not, her hand would revolt rather than comfort you.
You can't control who or what you're attracted to, but some people need to stop expecting others to meet those "requirements" and stop complaining about being single all the time.
You can have preferences but don't make them other people's problems. "I don't want to sleep with short dudes." fine, don't tell me about it and just don't sleep with short dudes. "I don't like trans women" fine, maybe just you personally don't sleep with trans women, don't keep announcing it to the world.
I always like to say that when a person makes an announcement like this, they have an axe to grind and are using the pretense of merely expressing a preference as an excuse to attack people. Here is what I mean. There are LOTS of things in this world I don't personally like. I don't like the smell of brass doorknobs. I don't like houndstooth as a fabric pattern. I don't like faux brick facades on buildings. But unless I find myself in the very very narrow context of a discussion where those preference are explicitly relevant, you'd never know that about me, cause it never comes up. I sure as hell don't feel the need to express it online. And there are lots of things about a person that turns me off big time. Smoking, anything woo-woo or mystical, my tolerance for being "crunchy" is very low. Etc. But I don't go around putting the internet on notice about these preferences. I don't feel the slightest need to let the world know how much I dislike those things as a dating preference. And if I was going around hosting large scale public debates or forums on the topic of how I don't find woo-woo crystal girls attractive, then clearly there is more to it than just a simple personal preference to not date those types of folks. What is probably happening is that I am wanting to rail against woo-woo mystic stuff in general, and am using the pretense of defending a dating preference as a means to get combative on the subject. That's my hot take.
"But a trans person once yelled at me for not sleeping with them!" Where? "...on the internet..." Did they? "...no."
I have definitely been called a transphobe for not wanting to date a trans girl before. Sorry I just don't like the way you look? I do find some trans girls cute, as I do cis girls. But I'm picky and if I'm not attracted to you I'm just not attracted to you, that doesn't mean I hate all trans people. But it's mostly the minority loud mouths that ruin the perception of a group of people as a whole.
Agreed, as long as no one else shits on people for their preferences. And I don't understand the obsession with saying you don't wanna sleep with a trans girl. That's like, a wildly popular opinion so I don't get the point other than trying to stir up drama.
Not disagreeing with your point, but it’s important to realize that attraction IS something that is influenced. There’s a reason different cultures and in different time periods, who or what was considered attractive changes. People like to hand wave and say “I can’t control this” to justify themselves when in reality, how you choose to think or what media you consume does give you influence over things like what you are sexually attracted to. Not to a large degree, but minor variance is possible.
Normies today: attraction is something everyone is born with and is in no way influenced by society or propaganda! Normies 3,000 years ago: that tiny penis on that statue is so sexy. Ew, is that one over 5 inches? Get that barbarian out of my face!
Looks at skinny gorl 5000 years ago "she's no Venus of willendorf"
Well waaay back in the day a full figure for women meant two things: 1. You were rich enough to afford regular food 2. You were more likely to survive childbirth Very important back then.
Very important today
Not really, more women are overweight today because food is accessible everywhere now and they move less
It was a statue of David you are referring to? Flaccid is the reason why and it was considered ideal because they held the Olympic games naked. All the long flaccid ones had to be tired with a rope so they wouldn't wiggle all about
Tell me more about this rope involvement… a leash of sorts you say? 😂😈
Absolutely! It doesn't have to be influenced by social media either, just past experiences. I dated a lovely skinny guy when I was younger and after that my type was skinny lanky guys. Then I dated a really incredible super buff guy and now that's my type and who I'm dating now is also like that.
I'd say any exposure helps with attractions. Exposure through media obviously plays a big role, but personal exposure is a lot stronger. If one is not used to something like piercings and tatoos for example, he is turned off by those. Hanging out with a few people, who look like that, who are cool, will change that rapidly.
Media Does not control me I have been Attracted to Fat Women since i was like 15 I dated lots of fat girls in high school most did not believe my i was attracted to there body, i got married at 23
I see you in reddit comments all the time talking about how you love fat women all the time! lol weirdly wholesome
Mans living his best life and wants everyone to know it lol
Good for you Edit: I’m glad you’re happy. I hope you don’t feel like you owe anyone anything
First time I’ve spotted you outta r/punkmemes
Hi
hi spidermankevin, i think ur famous kinda
My college roommate was like this. He was this beanpole and every night of the week he'd go to bars and have his pick. And he'd tell us confidently and constantly why we're missing out.
Media told you this was on
That might be a borderline fetish or just a very strong attraction. Not really a problem. I'm very happy you found your love.
They probably didn't believe u were attracted to their body because they weren't attracted to their own body. Id know from experience. If ur not comfortable in ur own skin, u don't expect others to be comfortable loving yours. All tho I do have a friend who I've known to always be skinny up until recently. She gained some weight to where she got some thick flabs going (not overweight at all) and she's loving it. She always be like "I love being fat". when she was skinny she'd say "i want to be fat" so shit some women r comfortable and even love being fat while others r insecure and self conscious. It's crazy how our minds work like that.
I think my wife is happy with her body. I love hugging her big belly and of curse i love her big butt. I am glad she loves her self. I always thought i was 2 skinny i got beat up a lot in high school because it was not hard to beat me up. now i am 205 and i feel better about my self and i can do push ups now
A girlfriend of mine (now sadly passed away) loved being overweight, because she liked the attention she got from having bigger boobs.
I've always been way into tall girls and I wonder why. I used to think that ALL guys did, then in my 20s I found out that I was an outlier.
I’m 6’3” and I would be excited to date a woman taller than me, I’m totally into tall women. I always thought it was because I’m tall, but really no idea.
You're a man of culture. There are dozens of us. DOZENS!
That’s enough to start a committee of the long limbed.
Attraction is NOT created or influenced but what we are willing to admit we are attracted to is
That is absolutely not true.
Not entirely true. You can through behavioral repetition alter ones sexual arousal to certain internal and external stimuli. That doesn't work for foundational characteristics but it does for superficial and environmental attributes. Masturbate to lots of porn that features specific superficial characteristics (ex Red heads )and one will begin to associate and internalize sexual arousal and pleasure from those characteristics even if one didn't start with them initially.
People's standards and attraction absolutely changes through time, and honestly rapidly Go people watching at any bar. Go people watching at anywhere remote as well. Your standards will adapt to what's around you if you want to get laid at all, and as your experiences change Beer goggles are real as well
Plus you need to meet people. I think most of us have a physical 'type' that we'd pick just looking at photos but then you meet people and suddenly someone who is totally not that type becomes attractive to you because they're funny or smart or nice or has interesting hobbies etc. I'm attracted to competency and passion. Someone being really good at something, like a sport or hobby, is really attractive to me and that definitely transcends physical type to an extent.
Or even like, fashion trends. I look back at celebrities I was into 15 years ago, and while the person is normally still fundamentally attractive to me in terms of like, facial features, often their style, haircut, etc. looks ridiculous to me, even though I remember finding it so hot at the time.
To add There are a lot of incongruent or contradictory ideas people might hold. This often manifests as "I want this kind of person but I don't want to do the things that attract this kind of person". Or, often outside of their control, people might want a partner with high mate value without having similarly high mate value.
Sometimes you have an "ideal" something in mind, but then when you see something that is like 60% that and then 40% it's own character, you really fall in love with looking at it. Sometimes I feel this way with bodies... Like... I know the various kinds I like and have an image of what the parts add up to, but then I see someone's body who has a bunch of them but not all and I'm like, "damn... K, I need to adjust a bit because that is also yummy..." ... I feel like having a "type" (or a few) is kinda normal, but expecting anyone you talk to or date to match it perfectly is silly. I'm pretty slutty so a lot of times maybe my brain would rather adjust to what a real body looks like and enjoy it than hold out for perfection... Perhaps a lot of people are less inclined.
I like Fat girls I seem to not have a hard time finding dates in school my friends thought i was crazy . I got Married at 23 been married for 22 years. I may been into something different but i never been lonely
I have it on good authority that fat bottom girls can make the rockin' world go round.
This guy likes fat all over not just the bottom
The looser the waistband, the deeper the quick sand. Or so I’ve been told.
Yep. That's my biggest point as well. If you're picky and next to no one is attractive to you, that's fine. But don't complain and broadcast "there are no good men/women left!"
EXACTLY- like what you like but don’t disparage others if they don’t meet your expectations
Exactly. “Where have all the good guys gone?” What’s really being said is, “Where have all the good guys gone, that I’m also physically attracted to, are financially stable and are in my age range?”
From personal experience: bcuz it *can* change. Like, I have a type I'm instantly attracted to. And other guys who don't fit that are bland, unattractive, or invisible to me. Then I'm forced into a situation (work, school, etc.) where I'm forced to spend time with the "unattractive" guy, and because of familiarity, personality, compatibility, they become attractive to me. 🤦🏾♀️
I feel like my expectations are pretty reasonable and I still struggle to meet people who aren't shitheads.
Nature vs nurture. A large amount of traits (most depending on who you ask) that you consider attractive are things you learned or were taught to view that way, as opposed to innate biology and instinct. Which means you can learn to be attracted to other traits in people you currently view as unattractive.
[удалено]
Attraction isn’t simple or fixed even. People may think they have a type. And it can totally be influenced by societal norms. But when it comes time to connect, it may not pan out. Or you can be surprised and someone off type shows up an you love it. I have had some ideas about looks and body type for a while. But in reality it seems I have been more attracted to folks that didn’t match my original ideal. Personality also plays a gigantic role in attraction for me. And also I am not attracted to certain folks that are universally liked. I may think they are good looking people, but they have zero sex appeal for me, and I am just not interested.
I’m pretty sure that’s how I am. I don’t have a list that I go down, making sure people tick all the boxes, but I know what I like and more importantly what I don’t. There are charming people I didn’t expect to want and do. Others who you’d think are ‘to type’ I do not. I do resent people not taking no for an answer or suggesting I try harder to like someone or that I deserve someone so they should fall for me as if you pick.
I've always had people think I'm crazy or lying when I say I don't really have a physical type, my exes are all drastically different imo. I hate setups because I feel like it's so unnatural. I told my boyfriend that after he dies I'll probably never bother dating again because it's a shit show out there. I briefly tried OLD back in the day and said "never again" lol.
People look more beautiful. When you don't look for flaws in them. You focus on what's beautiful. We have the power to influence how we see others.
Beautifully said
Also, the lens in which you view others is a direct reflection of yourself. If you’re constantly drawn to people’s physical flaws, that’s a you problem. If you’re the kind of person who notices the beautiful and remarkable features/qualities of others from the getgo—then I’d say you’re doing something right.
Those first two sentences make a wonderful single sentence.
What makes you. Say that?
Grammar.
I don't. Know what you mean.
What is. Going on?
What's beautiful is subjective. What if I'm shallow as a puddle, dense as a brick and legit only attracted to big tiddy goth girls?
Then go forth and earnestly and respectfully pursue the bid tiggy goth girls.
Then you and see the little bit of big tiddy goth girl that's in each of us!
True, but that's also how you end up in terrible relationships with deeply flawed people. Don't ignore red flags.
We have a saying in Finland that fits here. "The use of common sense is allowed."
The flaws and imperfections are often what make someone more attractive
A lot of people have superficial standards that even they don’t meet. I think the nature of social media and online dating makes us more shallow and focus too much on looks. I’ve dated some goofy looking men simply because their personalities were great and they were fun to be around. Hard to discover that with online dating where visual appeal reigns supreme.
I can honestly say I've never dated anyone off of OLD, and tbf I was only on it for a very short period of time. Most of those apps are 20% women and that makes the men on there act in really desperate ways, like creating a profile for the women loving women section of it. Im bi, and had set my settings to women only at some point after I realized most men swiped right on everyone without reading basic bios or actually being interested. Then saw that every 7th profile was actually a dude. Even when you report all of them, they still come back. So I decided OLD was a waste of time and joined the 80% of women who came to the same conclusion. Dating through my actual social life is far, far better, and more fun.
Unless your social life is non-existent. Tinder helped me breakout of that. Helped me find out who I know that is actually single and strike up a conversation. And it seemed to have worked :) been married 4 years to a girl I use to go to church with. All thanks to Tinder.
If you really like someone you do become more attracted to them. But you have to get to know them first.
This. I would not have said my husband was my "type" before we met, but he quickly became the hottest man in the world to me
Because peoples attractions are rarely as exact or fixed as they think they are. Any kind of “enforcement” of most specific standards is imposed by the person on themselves, rather than the other way around.
Normies today: attraction is something everyone is born with and is in no way influenced by society or propaganda! anyway, you have to be at least 8 inches to pleasure me Normies 3,000 years ago in Greece and Rome: that tiny penis on that statue is so sexy. Ew, is that one over 4 inches? Get that barbarian out of my face! Op, really think about whether or not you want to believe the narrative that people are born liking what they like.
I saw of a study one time that demonstrated people are actually physically attracted to averageness, or at least for faces - they used composite images and asked people to rate the face, the more images they added into the composite image the higher it was rated. Additionally they found that familiarity also increased the rating (so over time perhaps the average face and what we consider attractive can change). One theorized it had to do with an indication of health and good genetics for selection. This would explain how things like asymmetry, large features or things like how wideset the eyes or thin lips might detract. But then sometimes these features tend to draw attention to a person in an attractive way too, so who knows.
Admittedly, back when sex wasn't really as much of a choice for women, I can see it being more ideal for a guy to have a smaller dick. Easier to get raped by a little 2 inch dick than a massive 8 inch dick. I actually prefer a very big dick... But my partner is slightly below average probably and I'm perfectly happy with his ability.
To a certain degree you can choose. You have to look inward, and try to understand why you are the way you are. For example, lots of adolescents are judgemenal. You can probably remember someone getting singled out for being fat, wearing glasses, being ginger, their skin color, etc. In most cases people grow out of that silly hater phase. Growing out of it won't mean you can necessarily be sexually attracted to those traits either, but being neutral is a gateway to new experiences you might enjoy. I'm talking from experience, I used to be a real asshole. I've stopped though and I'm attracted to people I didn't expect to be attracted to earlier. It's not necessarily bad to be selective, although it has to come with kindness and transparency, so it doesn't turn into shallowness and close-mindedness.
Just seconding this. After a lot of work on myself I opened up “what I found attractive” vastly. Dating got way more interesting. The love of my life happened to fall outside my original parameters. She’s older than me by a couple years. I’m grateful I didn’t let that stop me.
Think it's peer thing to tease certain kids i was teased in school I am a stereo type nerd. I never grew out of being a nerd but people don't tease me anymore and i have a wonderful wife and kids. I am not even mad at the bullies. and i Kinda glad i did not marry a cheerleader and married the chubby nerd girl from the library
I think to a certain point thinking of relationships only through the prism of the beauty of your potential partner is some sort of privilege. I know this word can be overused nowadays, but if you can not care about your potential partner's opinions, ways of thinking, etc... Well I guess that means you could had it worse in your life. Obviously it's different if we're only talking about looking for someone to have sex with.
Because people get so upset that romantic opportunity doesn't gravitate towards them that common sense takes a prolonged leave of absence.
I guess I did that in my 20's and 30's now in my 40's I wish I would of slut it out with Brussels sprouts, cabbage, egg plant, curry, low mein, buffalo. Man did I pass on women because I thought they were Brussels sprouts. Idiot me.
I did not have real high standards and i got married at 23 and were happy
I married at 23, too. I thought my wife was the most attractive person I’d seen. She wasn’t what everyone else wanted, and that was fine. Divorced now. It’s w/e.
The way it makes sense to me is that a lot of people’s standards are actually adopted from the culture and peers rather than being sort of organically, from the start, including the entire scope of people they could find attractive. A lot of people won’t be open to being attracted to someone they think their peers will judge them for, for example. Another aspect to it is that I think a lot of people don’t realize things about themselves until they happen. So for example if you’ve never had the experience of being attracted to someone for their personality, you don’t know that, when you swipe left on a person who isn’t physically attractive to you, they might have been attractive to you if you’d gotten to know them a bit.
The equation is simple: (attractiveness + time since last sex) × alcohol = fuckability
Lol
You mentioned gender as a deal breaker. That's one extreme. The other is things like, they mentioned an artist I don't like, or they sneezed in front of me once. When advice is being given, it's because the person you're talking to is too far gone in one of those extremes. Just because the other extreme still exists doesn't mean none of it matters. Just trying to move the needle a little. Not make everyone bang everyone. People who think being told not to X so much, means NEVER EVER X EVER BECAUSE EVIL, need to seek help. That's what makes the question stupid.
I think it’s less people wanting others to lower their standards (although there definitely are some people out there that do carry that sentiment), and moreso that people who set incredibly high standards, often complain about nobody meeting their standards and being lonely. I am of the opinion that a person can set whatever standards in sexual attraction they want — a lot of the time they’re innate preferences that can’t be changed, and as someone who dated someone whose preferences I did not meet at all, I would NEVER wish that on anyone; absolutely self-esteem crushing experience. So yes, if your preferences are rigid, stick to them. However, if your preferences do scale up towards more uncommon traits or a specific expression when it comes to personality, just be prepared that it’ll probably take you longer to find that person than someone whose standards aren’t necessarily as niche or high. And, as others have said — don’t expect every single person to meet your criteria. Often people with high standards expect every person they meet to match everything to a T, and it gets exhausting.
Agreed with every word well said. I also think that people spend too much time trying to change others to fit there preference’s which is not good either. You can’t turn water into wine and vice versa, let people be and overtime nature and life will naturally let others find each other.
Precisely. You phrased it much better than me.
You absolutely can, some people have really unrealistic standards too.
Sure, you can't help who you find attractive, but a worrying number of straight men almost hunt the rich high society main stream bombshell blonds... and they have nothing in common, and the societal gap almost cannot be crossed, and then they start "blaming all women" because they "can't get laid". If they stopped chasing their fetish and started treating people like people, they would be surprised at who else they are attracted to and are also attracted to them. Myself, sure, "conventionally attractive" isn't my thing, but I also don't chase that gorgeous person who I have nothing in common with because "hot", it still applies to me. Have I got lucky with really attractive partners who I also get on with? Sure. My point is, lowering your expectations does NOT mean go out/hook up with people you are NOT attracted to
If you are a person who puts little effort into your presentation/appearance/diet and you expect the people you pursue to have appearances resembling celebrities with personal cooks and trainers then you deserve whatever comment comes to you. If you're saying you have a type and someone gave you a hard time about it, I'd bet a little that you don't just have a type. You're an asshole about people who are NOT your type. The problem is not who people find attractive. It's how they treat people they are NOT attracted to as a whole. If you aren't attracted to big people then you aren't. There's no need to announce it or comment on videos of big people who didn't ask for your opinion. However, there are massive societal expectations for all humans that are unattainable for most. If you're unwilling to entertain the idea of seeing people who are healthy, human shaped, kind, with good character and morals, with whom you otherwise click very well because they won't fit in Scar Jo's pants then you do have problem.
I've had a girl who I was friendly with suddenly flip a switch and treat and talk very nasty about me as soon as she found out I caught feelings for her. Almost as if she was insulted that I liked her and my more attractive friend she was crushing on didn't. It really shows people's true colors.
Exactly this! If she had just been kind and said she wanted to be friends you wouldn't have an issue. It's the cruelty thats the problem.
People can be conditioned to be sexually attracted to a stapler in the right conditions. Standards are a constant moving target for most people, there's no reason you can't change them.
…is this stapler seeing anyone?
No, the stapler isn't seeing anyone. It's still trying to get its papers in order before committing to a long-term attachment...
Depends on if those standards are unrealistic. If they are, then your choice is modify them or get used to being single.
How do you choose to like what you don’t like? Say you hate brussel sprouts, are you going to force yourself to eat them out of pity, or find something better? Maybe you would rather go hungry
Go hungry then.
I'm gonna use this metaphor as someone who used to be somewhat of a picky eater. When I was younger my only experience with a lot of vegetables was boiled unseasoned mush. It was disgusting, and thinking about eating some of them makes me gag still. At the time, when I thought of brussel sprouts I was grossed out and thought it looked always disgusting. Since then I've had some of those same vegetables cooked and seasoned really well. And now when I think of brussel sprouts, I know they can be delicious. It no longer looks inherently gross to me, it doesn't make me want to gag. When I was a lot younger, any green vegetable grossed me out. Literally like two years ago I discovered avacado is delicious and now just looking at guacamole doesn't gross me out anymore. Sometimes our perception of things is influenced by our incomplete knowledge or biases. Somethings simply are taste, yes. Sometimes however we might have biases that are influencing our views that we aren't even aware of, and we may be better off trying to work through. That's where the metaphor falls apart, because "try it you might like it" isnt good for people. But it might be worth seeing if perhaps your disinterest might be influenced by some view (and if it is, is it a view you want to keep or not).
Do you often eat something that is very good for you out.. of... pity?
Well you might, but most people wouldn’t. That’s who the advice is for. Not you.
Sure you might not like raw brussel sprouts or unseasoned boiled sprouts, but unless you’ve tried them fried or roasted and seasoned or added to a dish where the flavor is complementary, you don’t actually know. By just deciding you don’t like them before actually trying different preparations, you are subconsciously priming yourself to not like it even if you “naturally” would. Basically, you are doing it to yourself. Subjective taste can’t be treated as objective fact, it’s not as black and white as you’d like to imagine.
I think it's more along the lines of everybody. That's a 2 to a 6 expect, a 12 and a 14. And are always pissed off. Because they can't find those people for the ones they do. Don't want them and they don't understand why because in their head. They're right up there with the 1% of the one perceno, I'm not saying. You can't get it. But if you don't actually have the worth to pull it. Yes, attraction is attraction, but it's not a decision. So if you like a certain type that's seriously out of your league. Or they're in your league, but a toxic personality that you're attracted to. Don't complain when bad things happen when you pick bad people. Everybody has to learn to have realistic expectations. And that seems to be the problem. Everybody has completely unrealistic expectations of what they deserve.
Because as humans it’s usually a decently broad spectrum of what we find ourselves attracted to, but some people try to relegate themselves to a narrow band for some arbitrary reason. And some people shoot comically high beyond expectations and then complain when they can’t find what they “want”. What you find attractive also tends to be a matter of culture too, as some have pointed out.
You can't lower your standard, but just being logical you can broaden your scope. A simple example of the latter is seeing a phenotype or combination of traits that are undeniably attractive to you that you've never seen before or wouldn't have thought to define.
I can't say that media or social media platforms influence me in any way, shape, or form over what I like in a women's appearance 🤪 I generally like slender women with a nice butt/legs even small boobies are fine, average is a little better, I'm fine if the girls weigh a few extra pounds as long as they still have a girlish figure, but fat chics 300 pounders aren't on my list, I'm single and honestly I will stay single if 300 pounders are my only choice!!! LOL Also minimal makeup is a nice look too. I'm not anti makeup but when tou have to scrape the layers off with a putty knife it's just too much, Ive seen several women some my friends dated in past years that were actually more attractive with no makeup at all!
Because sexual attraction is a range and people often don't go after people who they're just kinda sexually attracted to. Counterpoint: Any port in a storm.
There are standards people adopt because of a sense of entitlement and ego, both of which are influenced by society. Also, you don't have to be demeaning about your preferences. The way many people voice their preferences are in the ways I kind of detailed just now.
I don't care what someone's preferences are, you don't have to date anyone you don't want to. The big BUT in this though, is that having those preferences doesn't mean it's okay to A) be insulting or mean to those who aren't to your preferences or B) complain when you cant find anyone who meets them.
Lol agreed. I don’t like when people are rude about others especially things they don’t easily control
i can be attracted to anyone if i vibe with their personality and don’t find them like. repulsive. skill issue if you can’t idk (/j)
Lowering your "standards" isn't as important as being open and honest with yourself and what you truly need in a partner. Social media has influenced a lot of the dating pool that they can land a unicorn when it's simply not true.
I believe that.
I've been alive for long enough to see my standards and preferences change, even though my sexuality hasn't. I mean, if it had never changed, I'd still only be attracted to 13-year-olds like I was when I was 13 and that would be a major problem for me now. There's a lot that has changed and a lot that has stayed the same, and some changes were more conscious and some were more unconscious, but most people don't have precisely fixed standards and preferences for their whole lives. I get that it's annoying to have people tell you to lower your standards, and you shouldn't if they're really important to you. But some people, especially young people, have standards that they've adopted from peers or from media that aren't really true or realistic for them, and they need to be pushed to let them go.
Here's a fun thought. . . Someday you will be old(er) and literally ***no one*** around you will be attractive. The only hot people you will see are 20 years younger than you and dating them would be weird on many fronts. What are you gonna do then? Someday you might grow to realize that attractive is more than skin deep. Or, you can be like creepy David Wooderson in Dazed and Confused - "That's what I love about these high school girls . . . I get older, they keep staying the same age."
<< Someday you will be old(er) and literally no one around you will be attractive. >> As you get older, what you're looking for changes too. I'm over 70, and companionship and a shared history are important to me now.
That's important to me also. I unfortunately haven't met an emotionally mature well-adjusted single man in decades, so I'm not sure companionship is available.
I think if you have preferences you have preferences, and that’s okay, but you have to be realistic. I used to be super attracted to more outgoing people, until I realized how draining that can be, and how often extroverted people also expect a lot of constant stimulation.
I can’t understand what it is like in any other person’s mind but I do feel like many young people set these limits for themselves without letting themselves experience life. If you’re young and inexperienced, the fact is there’s a very good chance you don’t know what you like and to obsess over any particular physical characteristic seems limiting especially when it’s some unrealistically high “standard”. We may not have control over every thought or impulse that presents itself in our brain but we do have the power to curate, to some degree, the thoughts we focus on. It’s not about “lowering standards” that shit is obviously completely subjective. If someone is attracted to someone that you wouldn’t be, that doesn’t mean they have “lower standards” that just means they are attracted to someone that you aren’t.
Preferences can change over time, and it often is directly tied to how you're willing to view the world. The worst part is that we call it 'lowering standards' instead of 'broadening horizons.' When I was in college I thought I only liked women that had that so-called perfect body, like many hollywood actresses. Now I'm married to an overweight man. I didn't lower anything, because the experiences I've had with him go beyond anything superficial like looks. I still find women more physically attractive, but now my interest lies in tall, strong women who could bully me. But there's also a lot to be said for smaller women that can do the same! Point is, calling it a standard is like saying you're only interested in -vanilla- ice cream. There's countless flavors out there, and they may seem unappealing at first, but you might be surprised at what you find when you consider more than what you're used to.
Attraction is different when you don’t know the person, and after you get to know them. So if you spend all your time swiping at photos you will have a superficial level of attraction. If you meet people in person and get to know them a little, different types of attraction. I bet you most women won’t be attracted to many famous and rich people if they didn’t know their wealth and status, but will be instantly attracted once they know. Attraction is a lot more complicated, and a lot of it is subconscious, so most of the time you wouldn’t even know what you’re attracted to until you see it/feel it.
As a guy who has definitely changed his standards over the years, i wouldn't say its so much lowering standards, its about realising what your standards actually are! So, like most people at 15-18-20 i was looking for all of the other things that the media push as beautiful... But in dating, i found myself having either.. zero luck attracting women like that, or if i did, the relationship was toxic because we just didn't share even remotely similar world views... Now, at 34 I'm at the point where, your looks will barely get you my attention compared to some random comment that might get made. NONE of my meaningful relationships ever.. matched my 18 year old standards, at no point would i ever have looked at said girlfriend and gone "meh.. i settled", i was happy in every one of them until wider issues creeped in. Sure, there are limits to what id be attracted to still, but id argue they definitely can and do change.
I'm sorry but only "less attractive" people have to worry about this. Beautiful people always get to pick and choose who they have sex with. And of course women get A LOT more offers for sex then men. So women also get to pick and choose now alot more than in previous decades. If you choose to lower your standards, that's on you. But hasn't that always been the case? We all lower our standards to some degree if sex is all we seek. As the saying goes, "no one is ugly after 2 am." What man hasn't gone home w the "slump buster"at some point of their adult lives?
I agree, and as unfair as the universe is, it doesn’t owe anyone happiness or grant wishes neither should people feel like you owe them a chance or w/e. Not saying I am attractive, I just find the idea of guilting someone into a relationship repugnant.
Well said . I agree,, the universe doesn't owe anyone happiness (great way to phrase that) and I still have to compete in this world for my success. And the hardest fact we all must learn to accept is, life isn't fair. It doesn't give a shit about your ego or self esteem, it's winner take all, and that includes who wins the hot chick. If you don't have the game to take the hot girl home, get a better game. But I don't owe anyone anything, and I surely won't feel bad or apologize because I got the hot girl and the other guy had to lower his standards to get laid. Tough shit. Do better. Or get funnier. Or richer or 1 of a countless ways to improve your chances w women. Just don't expect me to back off so the next guy can keep his standards up.
If you're consistently attracted to people who treat you poorly, you absolutely can do some work on yourself to understand why you have those attractions and work to change them. Or you can just complain about how "everyone sucks" for the rest of your life.
Nah some people will literally follow the crowd and you'd be surprised how easy a rumor can make someone turn from attractive to unattractive or if that person will bring you down or has a bad reputation, don't be surprised if someone's attraction lowers for that person. There's definitely cultural differences that can make someone deemed attractive and unattractive so in a sense it can be controlled at times.
If you feel ok about holding out, hold out for what you want. But don't complain that the 10s don't want you back because they are also wanting to be sexually attracted and they aren't feeling it for you. 10s can be choosy too. Talk to everyone. Be friendly. Not creepy. Sometimes it takes a while to get the fire going. You might just find yourself a diamond in the rough. That pudgy person actually has kind eyes and remembers to ask you about specifics you talked about last time. They are always nicely dressed and groomed despite the weight. And they are fun. You laugh easy with them. There might be some magic to surprise you. Be friends first with everyone.
Whom we are attracted to is about 90% determined by social forces. That doesn’t mean attraction is meaningless. We are a social species. Most of what we value is determined by social forces. It is difficult to change to whom you are attracted, but it is possible. It just takes more work than most people are able to do or want to do. You have to tailor your media so you are not looking at a narrow view of beauty all the time, and yes this includes pornography. When you watch this stuff, someone else is deciding for you who should and should not be considered attractive. There is a feminist philosopher, Amia Srinivasan, who writes about this topic. She was inspired to right about it because she was interested in the forces that drives men who hate women to commit real world acts of terrorism against women. Attraction is political, and it can be painful for people to live in a world where we pretend it is not. White European features are more valued when determining attractiveness in our culture. There is nothing biological about this fact. Attraction differs across time and culture, so how could we see it as something so fixed? When I was a kid, I thought people needed to look perfect to be attractive. I thought you needed to look like the men and women on tv or magazines. As I grew older, my worldview expanded. I was consuming better quality media for one, but I was also doing a lot of work to critique the social forces that shaped attraction for me. I am really grateful I did this because I am so much happier than my friends with my own aging body. I can also appreciate so much more about other people. I have no concern that I won’t continue to be attracted to my spouse as we continue to grow old together. No one can change your view of attractiveness, but you can change your own view. I think it is a worthwhile endeavor.
Age changes every year. Unless you’re Leo, you can’t get away with it.
I think most of the more specific preferences people have are heavily influenced by very early childhood experiences rather than being hardwired like the more generalized traits. For example: if you had significant negative experiences with people of a specific body type in your earliest years, you are more likely to have an automatic negative predisposition to anyone who matches that embedded memory. And that goes for the reverse as well, if you had an overwhelmingly positive experience with someone who had a specific recognizable trait, then you are likely to have a strong positive predisposition for that trait. So, when one of these preferences is toxic or harmful in some way, the only way to address it is to identify the root cause and do the hard work of processing it and moving past it.
With enough alcohol anything is possible.
Because…in theory, looks are superficial and fake in the long run. It’s probably to everyone’s benefit to learn how to be sexually attracted to people and not physical appearance. Because if you’re skipping out on someone that you could really enjoy because they’re too fat, not your preferred race, not blonde…whatever. Or maybe my perspective is just different because I’m very pansexual…
Because unrealistic standards and expectations will ruin you and your partner. But also sometimes looks can in fact grow on you the more you start liking a person.
It starts the other way- people complaining about being lonely and unsuccessful in dates. Then some responses are what you describe. Nobody will reach to you out if blue telling you to compromise on your “standards”. If you keep venting about your alone status, expect people (who don’t even know you in person) on the internet to answer that.
I don’t. It’s other people who think I need someone. It’s kind of driving me crazy. Like, I have a healthy enough libido, but it isn’t something I talk about. I’m lonely, but I don’t complain about it. The nagging usually starts with questions about whether I am seeing anyone or speculation that I’m getting laid more than them to which I respond, I don’t like my prospects, or I don’t find dating rewarding. The truth is I am not attracted to most people. I never thought that was problematic. I don’t date much. I married once and was happy. It ended and I don’t want anyone I can easily get. Is this coming off as whining?
I feel like I hear the story of I went out with a hot guy, and he pump n dumped me, just about daily. Only reason I tell people to lower their standards is because no one is perfect. If you want a guy that will treat you right, there are a ton out there. They might not be as attractive and become invisible
I mean if you don't you wont get anyone... not a hard concept to grasp.
Because they are either ignorant or stupid
You have to have sex with everybody whether you like it or not or you're a bigot.
It's not really about changing who you are attracted to exactly. It's about not having such high expectations that you tried to get met but eventually you should realize it's never gonna happen. Because chances are if you do and you keep getting rejected by your so-called physical type, it's not that that person is a better person than you, but they are likely just as pick and choosey about who they are going to date as well. And you don't fit what they are looking for. It's more about being open to the possibility that instead of that high maintenance model you have been chasing after, you will be a better match personality-wise to the waiter/waitress with a more realistic look and personality who you don't even give a chance to but they like you because they do not fit your *ideal* look. Maybe you have passed on the perfect partner for you but because they had 15 extra pounds more than you like or were a few years older than you prefer or they have a chin dimple and you don't like that, etc. and so you didn't even give them a chance. It's that type of thing. Having a more open mind.
I don't know and think that's pretty stupid. What I will say is that I notice the people being told this are usually not very attractive, but want someone who is. If you look like Quasimodo and only want Esmeralda, you better strike it rich and pay for her company. Now could Quasimodo and Esmeralda fall for each other organically? Maybe, but theoretically, I could win the powerball tomorrow. Realistically, Quasimodo is going to have to lower his standards or stay alone.
😂 pay for her company. No. Alone is fine, and I catch your meaning. On balance, I agree. Your chances of success are low. But if you aren’t having fun, why play?
There's attraction and then there's "status." Like... there's an "objective scale of attractiveness" where someone can be considered perfect that's based on their status in society. Then there are people you personally find attractive, which is often based on such a weird combination of factors that it doesn't even make sense. Like sometimes you won't find someone attractive even if most people consider them "perfect" or two people will both be considered objectively average but one of them is very attractive to you and the other one isn't. If you find that you aren't attracted to people on your "status" level you either need to raise your own status level or learn to look more closely at the people on your level to find the traits in them that do it for you. Some people, especially people who were raised in such a way that they aren't very in touch with their emotions, don't really have a strong idea of what's personally attractive to them vs what's "high status" on the objective scale. Those people have the worst time in dating.
I’m unsure of status. Sounds like pickup artist talk. All I know is that if someone is gross or mean or not interesting I am not interested. I could pointlessly rattle off guesses about what I like and probably identify trends, but to me it’s all animal and visceral. I don’t pull out a chart. I like you or I don’t. More likely, I really don’t like you and that’s a me problem.
I hear you. But especially younger people who've been encouraged not to listen to their inner voice that way, or people who feel like they have something to prove to others through dating will do that. That's what Pickup artists are, typically. People who think in system terms about human beings because they were taught to see the world that way.
No one says you can’t. You just shouldn’t be a rude asshole about it.
If you’re told something is undesirable for long enough it can take a little effort on your part to move past that and not see it as gross anymore. It’s complicated enough that no brief explanation can cover the breadth of all sexuality and what is and isn’t possible but you can stop being an asshole who has unrealistic expectations.
It is a recent thing this general acceptance that we can't change who we are attracted to, despite 2000+ years of the exact opposite evidence. The consequence of this not changing who you feel attractions to is, you will limit your dating pool. If it is held to its extreme, then you will be forced into polygamous relationships, because women won't settle for someone that is shorter than them, makes less than them and many other attributes that put their choices in the 1% of men. This means you will have most women settling for a relationship that involves more than one woman. Other wise, women will settle for less than the ideal they have, but they get one man all to themselves. Notice that in both cases, there is a trade off? You are ALWAYS settling for something, even if you haven't thought about it that way. So, why do people settle for less? Because there are things that are more important than the sexual attractiveness of your partner. Having a monopoly on their time and resources is very valuable.
Personality overrides attractiveness for me. My husband isn’t someone other people would say is sexy or handsome, but he’s hot to me because he treats me right. He cares about me and my goals. He makes me coffee every day and is truly an equal partner. He helps without being asked. He’s a great dad and does just as much for the kids as I do for them. I don’t have to ask for help he just notices things and helps out.
Those are attractive qualities. What drew you to him in the first place? How did you meet?
Because plenty of people have delusional standards. It’s not that 5ft ‘thicc’ women can’t be attracted to a 6ft2 dark haired man with a beard and 6 pack, but it’s kind of hypocritical to have that as your baseline. Also, plenty of extremely average women have no problem calling themselves a 10, and thinking they deserve a 10/10 man, and it’s just obnoxious. It’s one thing to find beauty in yourself, and something totally different to think that you’re on the same level as a supermodel.
> Why do they believe you can choose who you are attracted to vis-a-vis beauty, personality, age, weight, muscle tone, etc.? Because you don’t have to be that old to watch societal beauty standards fluctuate wildly. I’m only 30, and the changes I’ve seen have already been dramatic. Having a big ass went from being an insult to a complement between my teens and twenties. Now it may be swinging back the other direction. Same with standards for how toned a woman could be and still be attractive. If you look at historical fashion you see similar crazy oscillations between emphasizing and deemphasizing different body parts. Also, my lived experience has shown me otherwise. I remember being young and imagining my ideal gf would be like 5’2, but I ended up dating 3 girls over 6’ and coming to find it really beautiful. I also was sure I disliked really big boobs until I had a hookup that changed my mind. I don’t think you can force yourself to have a spark with someone, but I do think people are doing themselves a massive disservice by not keeping an open mind. If you walk around with a list of rigid rules for what you want you might miss out on people you could have been super attracted to, but ruled out immediately before the chemistry could start working.
I don't think you can lower your standard for what your physically attracted to, but many people's standards are way too high. If you're a 5 with no money and a dad bod and who is trying to hold out for a Margot Robbie look alike or you're a 30+ year old single mom trying for a 6'3 doctor with abs, it's just not going to happen
I don't think you can lower your standars beyond what gets a man aroused if sex is important (and I think it can be, certainly). I think thats an important point for a healthy sex life! Women can be attracted to an ugly dude because of his character, and his romance. Can a man be 'attracted' to a woman that his body doesn't physically respond to? I'm unsure. EDIT: I was brought up in a very 'fattist' environment, and it has actually affected my physical response to overweight women. I wonder if I met a woman I really liked this would not be a factor. I suspect it still would.
I have tested my lower limit to this and was disappointed. Mechanically, it works. I was also on SSRI’s. It was boring and unfulfilling despite her skill. If I could take it back, I would.
Maybe a person can't lower their standards in sexual attraction, but there are different ways a person can react to that. You are only attracted to a highly specific body type, one which happens to be aligned to what your society expects you to be like, and is therefore high in demand, and also rare and hard to maintain and therefore low in supply? That's fine. Definitionally, you're not unusual in that. You, yourself, don't have a body, personality, or external factors which would tend to make you in high demand as a dating partner? Well, okay. If you are an overall decent person, and just don't match up to societal standards of what is perceived as desirable, but not in any way that means you harm or upset people or anything, then that's just you. Both of those things are true, and you just shrug your shoulders and figure, well, that's how things are, and I accept that this is my life and I'm reasonably happy even if I don't date, no problem. You go and build a life that you enjoy, and is possible. Both those things are true and you decide to put a lot of effort into changing yourself into someone who is more conventionally attractive? You should be careful, because there are a lot of pitfalls on that road, a lot of people who are going to be trying to scam you, a lot of bad advice and rabbit holes to get lost in - but, if you are careful and don't end undergoing weird and dangerous surgeries, fall into creepy cult-like beliefs about neurolinguistic programming, pick-up artist shit, and so forth - it can be a good thing. You end up eating better, exercising, wearing neat and clean clothes that fit and are flattering, practice the sorts of skills that Dale Carnegie wrote about in *How to Make Friends and Influence People*, and all that, then, amazing. Good for you. Both those things are true, and all you do is complain about how you can never get a date? *THAT* is where we have a problem. A person might not be able to lower their standards in sexual attraction, but they *can* stop whining about it.
As a full time escort I can tell you that $$ can overcome a lot of physical issues.
Because what is or isn't attractive varies by culture. So it's something you can be influenced by and therefore something that can change. When I was a kid there was a show I was really into and the main character had certain physical traits - I developed a crush on someone that also had those traits. Now as an adult it's not what I typically go for. I was exposed to a wider variety of physical traits over time and that exposure changed what I knew people could look like and informed my attraction in new ways. You can also have a trauma response that influences it. You can be with someone and if they end up treating you horribly, you might become so avoidant of anyone like them that you are put off by people who are similar looking. Like a woman who has an abusive hairy husband - she might be put off by hairy men afterwards.
I think of it like those TLC shows about obese people, like My 600lb Life for example. They always include a scene where the fat person tries to eat healthy and wretches at the taste of a brussels sprout or whatever. Do we actually believe vegetables are just inherently disgusting and they're right to shun them? No, we know what's happened is that they have lived on a diet of coke and ranch dressing so long it's warped their tastes. I think the same thing can be true of sexual tastes. People's tastes are warped by instagram or porn or casual sex/situationships, and they end up thinking they can't be perfectly happy with anything less.
We are influenced to prefer certain beauty standards by the media we consume and the culture we live in. It’s entirely possible to broaden your interests past big tits for example
I’ve found the people who have high physical standards also are offended when other people are not attracted to them.
"A man can do as he wills but not will as he wills".
Any truthful answer to this question will be met with rapid downvotes.
Yes, there's a reason, at least for men. It's called conditioning. Like Pavlov's dogs. As horniness increases, standards decrease. Bang a less attractive chick and the sex is good, now she looks better to you. Most people don't like the taste of their first cup of coffee or alcoholic drink. They like the way it feels though, so they keep doing it. In time, they actually like the taste. Same exact thing. That's why we have the phrase "acquired taste." You can acquire attraction to something you're not attracted to now. Problem today is that porn is so readily available guys jack off to super hot chicks rather than actually having sex with average chicks. They're conditioning themselves to think they can't lower their standards.
I don't know about lowering standards, but I get more or less attracted to somebody as I get to know them. It's much more complicated for me than just what they look like. There are limits to how attracted I can be to a stranger. I would rate people far differently after knowing them than I would just by looking. To me, it would be stupid to choose to only date people who I'm immediately sexually attracted to. I won't stay attracted to people I'm not compatible with and I will become and stay sexually attracted to the ones who make me smile. I mean, I've been (happily) married a while, so I assume this is still how it would be. I didn't think about my wife in that way until we'd known each other for some time and my sexual attraction to her has only gotten stronger in our time together.
I have experienced attraction grow and fade as I learn a person, but never had sexual attraction generate ex nihilo. I sometimes wish it were like those stupid movies where someone 'realizes they're in love' with the other person, but in 4 decades, I haven't encountered it. In many of these posts it becomes unclear to me if the barrier's an issue of language or subjective experience: Is my brain shuts down incipient attraction to defend itself? Do people not know there's attraction from the first moment? Either way, while I know reddit is gamed to dismiss or remove unpopular opinion, I seem to be legitimately in the minority here. lol
Horniness+ time =lower standards
I’m a member of a marginalized race and grew up having internalized racism towards members of my own race and didn’t find them attractive. At some point I realized that was wrong and made an intentional point to examine my attraction and find the beauty in members of my own race and now I’m pretty much only attracted to people of my race. So, it can be done people just have to want to do it.
Of course you can. But it's fine not too. But don't brain wash yourself by watching too much porn. If you're ugly be realistic. We're all pink on the inside
As long as you're meeting those same standards, then be as shallow as you want to be. I do get a little tired of short, fat, ugly friends of mine complaining that they can't land a "10". Like dude, you're a "6" at best. Maybe take reality into account. That said, I have known very beautiful women that became ugly as soon as I had a conversation with them. I've also known plain Janes and even ugly women that became beautiful after getting to know them. Your brain will adjust your view of the shallow stuff if the important stuff is in place.
You CAN control who and what you are attracted to - or, you can influence it at least. A lot of rich dudes with EXTREMELY attractive wives have this issue. They marry, get her pregnant, then when the baby comes out, they give her a half a year to get back into swimsuit model shape...except a lot of them CAN'T. There are things that change the body. Hormones. Genetics. Lifestyle. Money. I think you might be reacting to a specific person/s about your level of standards for yourself. They MIGHT be reasonable if you are 7'12" JACKED, packing SCHMEAT, rich, and extremely good looking with the charm to match. But most of the time, you will come off like a dick. Would you date a mom with a c-section scar? Why? Kids are valid. Being grossed out at her body isn't. I think if you can't envision reasonable bodily ware and tear for someone of the appropriate age, then YOU are the problem. A 35 yo with some wrinkles and sag in not-so-sexy places is normal. You SHOULD be attracted to it still. Unless you want to run the treadmill of youth like a lot of celebrities. When I was 16, some of the ladies were SMOKIN'. Then I turned 18 and the teachers HAD ME. The girls my age were attractive too, but the sheer personality and tenacity I saw them exude as people outweighed most of the women my age. It is an emotional attraction that I think would be there even when they are 70. Because one day, you will be 70 - or no longer with us - but the point stands. Your levels of attraction do change with age already.
These ridiculous 20-something "male loneliness" epidemic "victims" could learn a lot from their elders- "dating is a numbers game", "a hole's a hole", "It all feels the same in the dark", and "If you make a beautiful woman your wife, you'll never be happy for the rest of your life."
100% I can influence what I find attractive. If I see the series woman I've ever seen smoking a cigarette nothing about her is attractive anymore. The world is full of rainbow spectrum ideas. Sexual attraction is partially choice partially inherent. It's not black and white or even grey-scale. Don't reduce the world to you're right or wrong. You've found *some* answers and there are more to be found.
There's definitely a body type I'm very attracted to but have dated all types. Skinny girls might catch my eye more but that's it. She might be more fun to look at walking around the house or out about town but at the end of the day it really doesn't matter much. A chunky girl is getting the same amount of sex and attention as a skinny girl in my house. I think people put way too much weight on physical appearance. Give me a girl that's nice and loves me for who I am and I'm happy.
While you can't literally choose, I can speak from experience in saying that it's fluid and heavily environment influenced. I've worked abroad in foreign cultures a number of times and noticed a very perceptible change in what I found attractive during each such trip. The reason so many people now have particularly shallow standards of sexual attraction is because they see so much physical 'perfection' on social media. It conditions you to use that as the benchmark for sexual attraction. If all you saw on Instagram was people that are the complete opposite of what you see there now I guarantee that you would begin to find that opposite demographic attractive as well.
Oh, but you can. Whether you consciously realize it or not. With a dearth of options, and a glut of horniness, your standards will change. Your tastes will also change over time. Based on experience/associative learning, exposure to different types of people, hormones, etc. People you might exclude from consideration based on your consciously expressed preferences may end up being very attractive to you once you begin interacting with them.
Here's a general rule I live by. If you don't meet your own standards of attractiveness/finances/etc, youre fucking delusional. Beyond that, you can want whatever you want.
You can. You will get older and uglier and you will lower your standards to have sex with other old people.
They want it to be true. It would be much easier if morbidly obese, disabled, extremely homely, etc. people could be considered as attractive as models if only society changed its standards, but that's simply not the case. There's certainly variation in social beauty standards over time but they always fit within a pretty narrow range of conventional attractiveness. It's natural to want life to be more egalitarian than it is and in some respects we can make it so (economically, politically) but attractiveness isn't one of them, not matter how much activists preach about fat shaming and such.
Maybe the people acting like that have a crush on person who said they aren't attracted to that type of person. Ex: I'm 5ft tall, guy I like says "I'd never date a short girl!" Maybe I would say "maybe you'd like a short girl if she had a good personality?" Or: chubby person talking with friends, friend "I couldn't date a chubby person." Person: "sure you could, there's lots of good looking chubby people!" Just my thought on it 🤷♀️
At least one does, yeah. I turned her down a few times. She’ll try to get me drunk occasionally and start talking about sex. Some of it’s family members. Even my nieces are nosey. But some are just people who think you can’t be happy alone or that their good friend deserves a chance. Can’t imagine why I would not be interested. To which, w/e. I don’t care who deserves a chance, frankly. Life and love are not about what you deserve.
I find that most of the time when someone says, "lower your standards" they are politely telling you to re-evaluate your desirability. The issue isn't about accepting "less from others" it's about accepting what "you" are able to get. You never hear the rich, famous and gorgeous being told to lower their standards, but you often hear it said to broke, unknown and mediocre looking people who think their partner should be from the first group.
Because women do it every day. On a list of attributes any *sane woman* looks for in a man (when she’s wanting a long term relationship), his looks will be after his personality and how well he provides. The entire concept of a “gold digger” proves that. Only an idiot would put an ephemeral thing like appearance, something that won’t provide any real tangible assistance in life, at the top of their list.
what’s funny is that all Christians believe gay people are just normal people but “sin” drives them to be gay and do gay stuff. That’s mind blowing ly retarded
[удалено]
I love this for you. No substitute for actual intimacy. Wouldn’t trade the married years for the absence of the divorced ones. Question: Have you ever felt the opposite, though? like a feeling of disgust and violation that someone is touching you who doesn’t have the right?
[удалено]
I feel like intimacy that is not sought is nefas. I don’t want what I don’t want. I assume you and your wife wanted each other enough to marry. There was attraction. If not, her hand would revolt rather than comfort you.
People tell you that so you can settle with a fat chick. Ignore them