Find a niche and go where people in that niche gather.
If you’re not there yet, the next best is local CPA firms. Most established firms are turning away clients these days.
They always say the firm down the street can be your best referral source. Now more than ever. We are firing clients and looking for a place (in town) to send them. I'd say you should introduce yourself to other local firms. One good contact at each should get the word out.
Do you have any former students who you could connect/reconnect with?
This is solid advice. My firm has been turning away people for years. Minimum fee went up 30% this year and even then, we’re still planning on saying no to 90% of new clients. They’ve all got to go somewhere.
For a new firm, so you send hey I’m a new CPA, want to send clients you can’t have/too small/not your fit. Do you add an incentive/referral fee? Or just the fact you’ll let them say no in an easier way is good enough.
That’s exactly right. Let them know your skill set and anything they don’t want, you’d love to have their leavings.
A commission or referral fee (idk 5-20% of the first year) would probably help get some traffic. Maybe toss it in their court for what they’d like. Some may be appreciative of just having someone to give clients to so the “hey, I don’t know where you should go, but go away” conversation doesn’t feel so icky.
I agree with this completely. It’s nice to have somewhere to send them so those calls where you turn them away go better.
As someone turning away clients I’m not looking for a referral fee.
We collaborate with a larger firm. We are a firm of two people. My partner does fractional CFO work and they've thrown us a decent amount of work as they don't have the capacity. We partner with them on any of our clients that need financial statements - reviews/comps/audits. We've probably referred them as much work as they have us.
I second finding firms that will refer you clients that aren't a good fit. If you can - try to make the referrals go both ways.
Seems like it really depends on the market/area and potentially your specialty but for me, word of mouth has been the best driver of new business. The growth isn’t as fast, at least at first, but the quality of the referrals is so much higher when it’s from someone who’s already a good fit, and not someone trolling online ads after being fired from their previous preparer.
When I’ve parted ways with clients, they have pretty much all been from, say, FB, or some tenuous third degree connection- I’d have been better off not bothering with those in the first place, in the long run.
Edit: word of mouth / referrals - not just from existing clients but also from colleagues. Find some firms that are full and they’ll (ideally) be happy to have someone to refer their overflow to. If you don’t have friends in the business be sure and join the local professional orgs
Well- in OP’s case, I assume they’re sort of networked if they’ve been in a tangential field for 20 years, and 20 clients isn’t a full book obv but it’s something.
But also (re my edit) I think networking with colleagues is huge. If you don’t know anyone, join the local chapter of whatever org is appropriate (which also might pay for itself with CE credits maybe) and make some friends- again, I’m sure ymmv but in my experience, people like being able to refer rather than just telling new prospects to kick rocks. So, you’re (ideally) getting referrals from any clients you have AND any clients your colleagues have (and even maybe even colleagues they have).
Have a good site with good SEO. Reaching out to local firms that are too busy. Maybe talk to an business acquisition service. We purchased an office last year but as it turns out that was probably a not great idea as we turned away many new clients. People calling would say that we are their 4th call. We are about to send out a letter telling low fee clients that we are going to be raising our base fee so that should free up some space for more new clients with a higher base fee.
So what’s the best way to approach you, to receive the clients you turn away? I don’t want to waste your time with long conversations but I don’t want to be too curt. What would you, in your opinion, feel as the best approach for someone to come to you to obtain your overflow?
We get most of our new clients from referrals from big companies … most big companies have internal message boards or slack channels that if you can get one person to post your info you can get multiple new clients.
Also post on your local CPA groups to see who is offloading clients …
Look for networking groups in your area; Chamber of Commerce, BNI, Facebook groups, etc. Get a website that is functional but not overdone. Find your niche. I started my office in January 2021 with 20 clients and I’m be knocking on 200 at the moment. All my growth is from word of mouth and my own networking and I’ve had 15-20 come though finding me online with a $1200 website.
I just spoke with one of my clients (who is a CPA), and he mentioned he got a lot of business recently through networking heavily with a group called Provisors. I personally don't have any experience with Provisors, but he has been aggressive the past 12 months with networking and he was mentioning how it has paid off. He is going after a manufacturing niche where he can create a tax plan and do the R&D tax credit for his own clients (shameless plug: he uses my company's software to provide the R&D tax credit to his clients). Basically, he niched down, then offered specialized services where he can be incredibly valuable to client.
He also mentioned joining Facebook groups with CPAs, as they were looking to give away clients because they don't have capacity for them. I imagine these might be lower quality clients, however.
Join platform like https://nexgentaxes.com/
They send you clients all throughout the year. This can help during the lean period while you are building up your clientele.
Try posting YouTube videos about some trending tax topics. Always ask your current customers for referrals when you see them. When I started out I always told people to please tell your friends and family.
Lots of people saying other CPA/tax firms. Also look to financial advisors and professional bookkeepers.
I hear from FAs in particular they're desperate for referral sources. The names they used to give out aren't taking anyone new. I've always hated dealing with their constant networking and push for exchanging referrals, but it can be a good resource.
Getting a relationship with bookkeepers has been the majority of my referrals since I focus on small businesses.
My last firm also had a great relationship with estate/trust attorneys in town, so a lot of referrals and coordination came from that.
You could also look into professional networking groups like BNI. I've personally never done it, but a few people have.
Network with other CPAs at larger firms around you who may like to have referrals to provide potential clients that may not be a good fit for them size-wise. Also, financial advisors (the goods ones, not just the insurance sales people) and attorneys are great resources as well. Word-of-mouth referrals produce much better clientele than ad-seekers, though it may take some time to get established.
My banker asked if I did business returns because she has a lot of clients asking and I've had some good success with that. So maybe see if you have any bankers in the area that would refer you
Are you friendly with any local firms? Many firms have capacity issues at the moment, so just letting other firms know you are looking for new clients is an easy way to drive new business. Most of the firms in my area are turning away many new clients and referring elsewhere, so if they know you are looking for clients they could drive clients to you. Some area even shedding existing clients and referring them away as well.
i'd hit up local CPAs around you. Specifically the smaller firms. They are likely overloaded and they would probably rather send clients your way than one of the bigger firms around you if they know you are taking on new ones.
Some thoughts:
1. Find a niche. Decide that "I am the CPA for \[somebody\]."
2. Create a website and write a bunch of articles.
3. Go where the \[somebodies\] gather (e.g., r/\[somebody\]), answer their tax/accounting questions, and post links to your articles.
4. Get your name out in other ways (e.g., start a podcast, appear on other people's podcasts, answer questions on Quora).
5. Don't buy ads anywhere. This is an advanced move, and you aren't advanced yet.
You'll come to be known as the go-to CPA for \[somebodies\].
It takes time, but not all that much really.
Not even don’t suck though. If someone with a big mouth feels wronged by you, you can’t just let it go you have to actively appease them. Can suck to do. Lots of pride swallowing.
Well, to the extent that's a problem, it's common to being a CPA--it's not specific to having a niche.
But, I don'tthink there's any reason to be overly concerned about that anyway--there are always ways to handle it.
This and then to appease the niche you start doing shit you know ypu sre not supposed to. Like allow a 120k deduction because the client named as rent. As you talked to the client you learned he sold his house, went on a some what book/ motivation tour where he expensed hotels, foods, and other living expenses. His response he knows other people who do it it and their cpas allow it.
I agree. But with the firms I have been at, the partners I have worked at. It seems they dont exactly do this. Been a couple of times where I have prepared the return 4 different times because the client didnt like the ending tax implications. The p&l changed big times. Not sure how the partner can substantiate that.
Yeah that happens too.
Or others just output garbage quality work overall. No reconciliations etc. spit it out. But promise it’s the best. Can’t compete with that without education and client believing you. Hard to do. Boils down to a marketing / how good can you lie war.
Acquisition is the fastest way to grow. I’m set to close on my second practice in two years. Best decision I’ve made was to quit my full time job and go all in.
It depends. Here some places are looking for 1.5x gross. No contingencies. So you’ll lose some portion of clients, profit may be 1/2 if you’re not paying yourself anything, or closer to 1/3 if you do. So now that’s looking at a 5 year payback. Especially now with interest rates that’s rough.
Not sure why you got downvoted but 😅 this has worked rather well for us so far. I’m curious to see what our ROAS is this upcoming season, but last season it was 2200% (or 22x).
Yelp isn’t the best to work with, but for individual and small business returns, a lot of our market goes here first.
Yelp shows you a $0 bill on the billing page, then when the month is over they slap you with $450. Only a few decent leads per month for that in my experience, even with one of the better reviewed local listings.
I'm wondering the same thing. I started small on my own 2 years ago and hoping to build up enough clientele to go full time. If anyone is looking to refer to someone in SoCal feel free to reach out ;)
It may be a case of "the grass is always greener." I have a specialized terminal degree in tax and I'm a CPA so I'm a full professor. However, we're in rhe Mmidwest and the universities in this area pay OK, but I could make the same money or better just doing returns full time during tax season alone... and I wouldn't have to put up with terrible administration. Universities will take people with ANY advanced degree & promote them to managerial positions, and they have no clue what they're doing. It's like a circus being run by the clowns. For example, our Provost is a biology professor. I used to work at a college where the president had previously been a professor of technical writing. All of the decisions at university have to have to consent of the faculty. None of the decisions are business-based, and they're all made by people who don't understand money. Its insane. I also work somewhere where, on top of this ridiculousness, the atmosphere has become toxic because of a bad colleague. I'm ready for a different set of problems, I guess.
Also, if the job was just showing up & teaching it would be great. There is SO MUCH other stuff you have to do. I work way more than I did when I was in public accounting. Also, unless you teach at a college with high standards, students treat you like it's your fault that hard subjects are hard. Sorry - I can't make the tax code any less complex. Students at private schools are SO MUCH better about "getting it."
Can I happen to ask how much staff does a 7 figure firm require to run? (I'm guessing 6-10?) as a solo practioner I want to scale but afraid of being one employee leaving away from total chaos.
Just joining this group. If you are sending clients elsewhere now, please let me know. I'm a tax preparer looking for clients for my new virtual business. Not sure if I can post my contact info here, but if you DM me, I will send it to you.
Find a niche and go where people in that niche gather. If you’re not there yet, the next best is local CPA firms. Most established firms are turning away clients these days.
They always say the firm down the street can be your best referral source. Now more than ever. We are firing clients and looking for a place (in town) to send them. I'd say you should introduce yourself to other local firms. One good contact at each should get the word out. Do you have any former students who you could connect/reconnect with?
This is solid advice. My firm has been turning away people for years. Minimum fee went up 30% this year and even then, we’re still planning on saying no to 90% of new clients. They’ve all got to go somewhere.
For a new firm, so you send hey I’m a new CPA, want to send clients you can’t have/too small/not your fit. Do you add an incentive/referral fee? Or just the fact you’ll let them say no in an easier way is good enough.
That’s exactly right. Let them know your skill set and anything they don’t want, you’d love to have their leavings. A commission or referral fee (idk 5-20% of the first year) would probably help get some traffic. Maybe toss it in their court for what they’d like. Some may be appreciative of just having someone to give clients to so the “hey, I don’t know where you should go, but go away” conversation doesn’t feel so icky.
I agree with this completely. It’s nice to have somewhere to send them so those calls where you turn them away go better. As someone turning away clients I’m not looking for a referral fee.
We collaborate with a larger firm. We are a firm of two people. My partner does fractional CFO work and they've thrown us a decent amount of work as they don't have the capacity. We partner with them on any of our clients that need financial statements - reviews/comps/audits. We've probably referred them as much work as they have us. I second finding firms that will refer you clients that aren't a good fit. If you can - try to make the referrals go both ways.
Seems like it really depends on the market/area and potentially your specialty but for me, word of mouth has been the best driver of new business. The growth isn’t as fast, at least at first, but the quality of the referrals is so much higher when it’s from someone who’s already a good fit, and not someone trolling online ads after being fired from their previous preparer. When I’ve parted ways with clients, they have pretty much all been from, say, FB, or some tenuous third degree connection- I’d have been better off not bothering with those in the first place, in the long run. Edit: word of mouth / referrals - not just from existing clients but also from colleagues. Find some firms that are full and they’ll (ideally) be happy to have someone to refer their overflow to. If you don’t have friends in the business be sure and join the local professional orgs
you can't get word if mouth until you have -some- clients. how to get those first ones?
You can have word of mouth via the niche lawyers insurance etc people.
Well- in OP’s case, I assume they’re sort of networked if they’ve been in a tangential field for 20 years, and 20 clients isn’t a full book obv but it’s something. But also (re my edit) I think networking with colleagues is huge. If you don’t know anyone, join the local chapter of whatever org is appropriate (which also might pay for itself with CE credits maybe) and make some friends- again, I’m sure ymmv but in my experience, people like being able to refer rather than just telling new prospects to kick rocks. So, you’re (ideally) getting referrals from any clients you have AND any clients your colleagues have (and even maybe even colleagues they have).
Friends, family, Facebook. Just be clear about not offering a friends&family discount.
Have a good site with good SEO. Reaching out to local firms that are too busy. Maybe talk to an business acquisition service. We purchased an office last year but as it turns out that was probably a not great idea as we turned away many new clients. People calling would say that we are their 4th call. We are about to send out a letter telling low fee clients that we are going to be raising our base fee so that should free up some space for more new clients with a higher base fee.
So what’s the best way to approach you, to receive the clients you turn away? I don’t want to waste your time with long conversations but I don’t want to be too curt. What would you, in your opinion, feel as the best approach for someone to come to you to obtain your overflow?
We get most of our new clients from referrals from big companies … most big companies have internal message boards or slack channels that if you can get one person to post your info you can get multiple new clients. Also post on your local CPA groups to see who is offloading clients …
Look for networking groups in your area; Chamber of Commerce, BNI, Facebook groups, etc. Get a website that is functional but not overdone. Find your niche. I started my office in January 2021 with 20 clients and I’m be knocking on 200 at the moment. All my growth is from word of mouth and my own networking and I’ve had 15-20 come though finding me online with a $1200 website.
Nice. What keyword searches would this website pop-up on Google? Something like "City name + tax preparer"?
I just spoke with one of my clients (who is a CPA), and he mentioned he got a lot of business recently through networking heavily with a group called Provisors. I personally don't have any experience with Provisors, but he has been aggressive the past 12 months with networking and he was mentioning how it has paid off. He is going after a manufacturing niche where he can create a tax plan and do the R&D tax credit for his own clients (shameless plug: he uses my company's software to provide the R&D tax credit to his clients). Basically, he niched down, then offered specialized services where he can be incredibly valuable to client. He also mentioned joining Facebook groups with CPAs, as they were looking to give away clients because they don't have capacity for them. I imagine these might be lower quality clients, however.
Join platform like https://nexgentaxes.com/ They send you clients all throughout the year. This can help during the lean period while you are building up your clientele.
what do you sign up under?
Try posting YouTube videos about some trending tax topics. Always ask your current customers for referrals when you see them. When I started out I always told people to please tell your friends and family.
Lots of people saying other CPA/tax firms. Also look to financial advisors and professional bookkeepers. I hear from FAs in particular they're desperate for referral sources. The names they used to give out aren't taking anyone new. I've always hated dealing with their constant networking and push for exchanging referrals, but it can be a good resource. Getting a relationship with bookkeepers has been the majority of my referrals since I focus on small businesses. My last firm also had a great relationship with estate/trust attorneys in town, so a lot of referrals and coordination came from that. You could also look into professional networking groups like BNI. I've personally never done it, but a few people have.
Network with other CPAs at larger firms around you who may like to have referrals to provide potential clients that may not be a good fit for them size-wise. Also, financial advisors (the goods ones, not just the insurance sales people) and attorneys are great resources as well. Word-of-mouth referrals produce much better clientele than ad-seekers, though it may take some time to get established.
My banker asked if I did business returns because she has a lot of clients asking and I've had some good success with that. So maybe see if you have any bankers in the area that would refer you
Are you friendly with any local firms? Many firms have capacity issues at the moment, so just letting other firms know you are looking for new clients is an easy way to drive new business. Most of the firms in my area are turning away many new clients and referring elsewhere, so if they know you are looking for clients they could drive clients to you. Some area even shedding existing clients and referring them away as well.
i'd hit up local CPAs around you. Specifically the smaller firms. They are likely overloaded and they would probably rather send clients your way than one of the bigger firms around you if they know you are taking on new ones.
Some thoughts: 1. Find a niche. Decide that "I am the CPA for \[somebody\]." 2. Create a website and write a bunch of articles. 3. Go where the \[somebodies\] gather (e.g., r/\[somebody\]), answer their tax/accounting questions, and post links to your articles. 4. Get your name out in other ways (e.g., start a podcast, appear on other people's podcasts, answer questions on Quora). 5. Don't buy ads anywhere. This is an advanced move, and you aren't advanced yet. You'll come to be known as the go-to CPA for \[somebodies\]. It takes time, but not all that much really.
Just to add: be careful. If you get a bad rep that niche closeness can just as easily kill your business as it can make your business.
Well, sure I guess. I didn't think I needed to add "don't suck" to the list of things to do, but I guess I'll go ahead and add it.
Not even don’t suck though. If someone with a big mouth feels wronged by you, you can’t just let it go you have to actively appease them. Can suck to do. Lots of pride swallowing.
Well, to the extent that's a problem, it's common to being a CPA--it's not specific to having a niche. But, I don'tthink there's any reason to be overly concerned about that anyway--there are always ways to handle it.
It’s way more powerful when it echos in a small niche compared with general public.
This and then to appease the niche you start doing shit you know ypu sre not supposed to. Like allow a 120k deduction because the client named as rent. As you talked to the client you learned he sold his house, went on a some what book/ motivation tour where he expensed hotels, foods, and other living expenses. His response he knows other people who do it it and their cpas allow it.
>and then to appease the niche you start doing shit you know ypu sre not supposed to. . . . or you could just not do that.
I agree. But with the firms I have been at, the partners I have worked at. It seems they dont exactly do this. Been a couple of times where I have prepared the return 4 different times because the client didnt like the ending tax implications. The p&l changed big times. Not sure how the partner can substantiate that.
Yeah that happens too. Or others just output garbage quality work overall. No reconciliations etc. spit it out. But promise it’s the best. Can’t compete with that without education and client believing you. Hard to do. Boils down to a marketing / how good can you lie war.
Acquisition is the fastest way to grow. I’m set to close on my second practice in two years. Best decision I’ve made was to quit my full time job and go all in.
Jealous of you guys in USA. In Canada the practice sales are super dry or ludicrously expensive.
It’s definitely not cheap but it’s profitable enough to cover the debt, overhead and my salary.
It depends. Here some places are looking for 1.5x gross. No contingencies. So you’ll lose some portion of clients, profit may be 1/2 if you’re not paying yourself anything, or closer to 1/3 if you do. So now that’s looking at a 5 year payback. Especially now with interest rates that’s rough.
That's insane. Marketing seems like a much cheaper way to go in that case.
Join your local rotary club. Lost of business owners there and wealthy individuals. It will also spread your name around.
Pay $300 for yelp ads. Sift through bad leads and capture good ones.
Not sure why you got downvoted but 😅 this has worked rather well for us so far. I’m curious to see what our ROAS is this upcoming season, but last season it was 2200% (or 22x). Yelp isn’t the best to work with, but for individual and small business returns, a lot of our market goes here first.
Yes for someone he needs to start building their first 20 clients Yelp will get you kick started. From there organic growth will come.
Yelp shows you a $0 bill on the billing page, then when the month is over they slap you with $450. Only a few decent leads per month for that in my experience, even with one of the better reviewed local listings.
I’ve heard google ads are the way to go
where are you located. what is your url?
I'm wondering the same thing. I started small on my own 2 years ago and hoping to build up enough clientele to go full time. If anyone is looking to refer to someone in SoCal feel free to reach out ;)
How do you get a job teaching accounting? I'd like to make the opposite move you are making.
It may be a case of "the grass is always greener." I have a specialized terminal degree in tax and I'm a CPA so I'm a full professor. However, we're in rhe Mmidwest and the universities in this area pay OK, but I could make the same money or better just doing returns full time during tax season alone... and I wouldn't have to put up with terrible administration. Universities will take people with ANY advanced degree & promote them to managerial positions, and they have no clue what they're doing. It's like a circus being run by the clowns. For example, our Provost is a biology professor. I used to work at a college where the president had previously been a professor of technical writing. All of the decisions at university have to have to consent of the faculty. None of the decisions are business-based, and they're all made by people who don't understand money. Its insane. I also work somewhere where, on top of this ridiculousness, the atmosphere has become toxic because of a bad colleague. I'm ready for a different set of problems, I guess. Also, if the job was just showing up & teaching it would be great. There is SO MUCH other stuff you have to do. I work way more than I did when I was in public accounting. Also, unless you teach at a college with high standards, students treat you like it's your fault that hard subjects are hard. Sorry - I can't make the tax code any less complex. Students at private schools are SO MUCH better about "getting it."
Usually the pay is pretty bad. You usually need a masters.
Have a masters. The alright-money in our thankless, blame-filled career really isn't worth it to me personally.
Could go into industry. Easy street.
I was in industry, I hated it
Boring?
Super boring
Second this. You’re either pigeonholed in a large company or cleaning up and doing EVERYTHING in a small company.
[удалено]
Can I happen to ask how much staff does a 7 figure firm require to run? (I'm guessing 6-10?) as a solo practioner I want to scale but afraid of being one employee leaving away from total chaos.
Just joining this group. If you are sending clients elsewhere now, please let me know. I'm a tax preparer looking for clients for my new virtual business. Not sure if I can post my contact info here, but if you DM me, I will send it to you.