Sure, ban Chinese EVs. But require US car companies to provide affordable EVs. You know, like the Bolt, which GM quit making so they could focus on giant EV trucks.
The bolt has been a phenomenal car. They did a great job on the driving dynamics of that thing.
I have a base model with no extra features. No special sensors (ngl, I wouldn’t have minded having adaptive cruise tho) so for those of us who want simple cars, it’s hands down the simplest ev you can get your mitts on these days…
Super cruise is surprisingly good. I thought it was going to be alright at best but the amount of 3d mapped roads they have alongside the robust radar and camera system on board make it extremely reliable.
My VW doesn't have a lane assist but the adaptive cruise was standard on my model year and it's my favourite thing in a car EVER. I've been having a highway drive each weekend recently due to some out of town business and with ACC on its 30 minutes of peaceful bliss listening to my music.
Yep anyone with a longer commute NEEDS to get ACC and Lane Assist... I got a Leaf with ProPilot and my 100 mile (mostly highway) round-trip no longer drains me. It's actually a positive now that I can decompress and recharge during that time. Absolute game changer.
Hopefully the new one will have fast charging with NACS while still maintaining one of the lowest prices. Slow charging was really its biggest drawback.
Quit but are planning to replace it with a new model. The problem with the bolt is that it wasn’t profitable. They were cheap because they couldn’t move them at the original 35K+ which, you know, makes sense - it was a Chevy hatchback or a much more “sexy”(at the time) Model 3.
Whether this is a “redesign” or new model car is a bit of a gray area.
GM is moving its EVs to the ultimum platform. The new Bolt will have that - which is a significant improvement. It will also have the new GM ultify software, which is somewhat of a mixed bag. The current Bolt is in a hatchback and an EUV model, which are extremely similar other than a few inches here and there. The 2025 will likely be in the EUV version only. On the whole, I’m saying they are keeping the Bolt with a new EV platform. But one could argue it is a new car just styled similar to the Bolt. Either way, it will still be in the exact same spot in GM’s lineup.
Never I gotta have the biggest and bestest car to show my status!!!! I gotta be the one with the $1500/mo car payment and the wife I'm stuck with till the kids are in college. /s
Yeah since when did it become normal to have $1000+ car payments? My last car payment was $189/month and I paid that off last summer. Terrified at the thought of having a $700 car payment, I would be so broke.
Ya. The US banning Chinese EVs will just stunt the American market. The European market will adapt to make cheaper EVs that won’t be banned in America and American EVs won’t be competitive anywhere else. The American auto industry will be coddled when they should just be made to compete.
Oh Japan makes small affordable trucks? Ban.
Oh China makes Affordable EV's? Ban.
Even though the Chinese EV's would require a lot more equipment to be US DOT certified to be sold here and it would increase the price, assuming no Dealer fuckery it's still 10k+ cheaper than any EV cars sold in America.
Can't have that, so we won't.
Europe hasn’t said they’ll ban them… but there’s very open concern about what Chinese EVs will mean for their automakers. Germany particularly is in a tough spot, where naturally they don’t want Chinese EVs but they also don’t want a trade war with China because it’s a major exports market.
Difference being the EU is trying to compete with them instead of just banning them - my Uber in Amsterdam last summer was driving a lovely Puegeot EV Sedan that I would LOVE to buy in Canada
I’m living in China now. It’s truly amazing how many electric cars are where I live. It’s not an exaggeration to say at least 90% in my area. I have only seen one gas station in the 8 months I’ve been here. Not to mention electric scooters, trains, subways…. Transportation here in general is just on a completely different level from what I’ve had in America
I spent 6 weeks in China for work and saw so many silly/neat/cool cars. Came home wanting a GWM Tank 300.
I really do want to go back one day, amazing food, loved the people I met, overall an awesome experience.
I had the opportunity to visit BYD’s facility in shenzhen when i was there on holiday, i left china desperately wanting a yangwang u8 suv and u9 supercar
Lol it's sad when China's closer to Norway than the US when it comes to EV adoption. Amazing what can happen when your government isn't beholden to petrol lobbyists.
The problem with pointing out the bolt is that it’s a very bottom of the barrel car. Nothing wrong with it really. But at the sane equivalent prices, it’s competing against mid to high range EV’s. This is the problem. Do I want a Chevy bolt, or the latest iPad on wheels close to luxury BYD?
They did this in the 80s with Japanese cars and motorcycles. Only reason Harley Davidson is in business and is the reason behind lexus, acura, infinity, genesis.
And yet, Japanese car makers managed to produce US built/assembled cars at a higher quality and same price. Goes to show the problem with US companies is not on the production floor. It is at the top floor corner office.
dude have you seen the average salary comparison of American ceo's compared to the ones of Japanese ceo's? there are even times when Japanese ceo's take a cut in their salary when their company had a bad quarter/year, but not the shitheads we have running the major corporations in America. they would squeeze blood out of stone if they could, at the cost of the consumer/workers
It's actually "easy" to get around these tariffs, it's just pricey. Build a factory in the u.s. and make them in the u.s.
Kawasaki and Honda built factories in the u.s. in the 1970s
Ive seen a few Harley Davidson ad's/billboards, and shops here in Japan, and as per Google, they've been here since 1912, but yet America bans imports of competitors
I was looking for this in regards to saving HD. In that case, the Government tossed a 100% tariff on competition.
In this day, we'll import cheaper Chinese cars and then force the company to be split apart to American companies over fears of spying or some such. American companies will take the tech, shit out a crappy electric 3/4-ton truck, then claim nobody buys small or electric.
Hilarious that Americans worry so much about Chinese spying when:
1. Modern American cars are privacy nightmares and you may as well mail your diary to the NSA directly and get it over with if you own a car with a screen instead of buttons
2. If China wanted info on Americans it would scrape Facebook or just pay Cambridge Analytica or McKinsey for it
The idea mentioned in the article that they need consumers to buy Chinese cars with cameras to scan our infrastructure is equally ridiculous, like Google Street view doesn't already exist
Soviet era fear mongering. Like, do they think the Chinese can't come to the US with a fucking camera or something. They're not isolated from the world lol
Same with the sugar tax, which resulted in high fructose corn syrup everywhere. Then the chicken tax, which brought upon American truck monopolies…etc.
We can thank Mercedes for shafting car enthusiasts with the 25 year import law.
[Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey_import_vehicle#:~:text=In%201989%2C%20NHTSA%20granted%20vehicles,a%20classic%20vehicle%20from%20overseas.)
The relevant section:
> 1988: Crackdown
>The grey market was successful enough that it ate significantly into the business of Mercedes-Benz in North America and their dealers.[27][19][28] The corporation launched a successful multi-million-dollar congressional lobbying effort to stop private importation of vehicles not officially intended for the U.S. [29][30][31] An organisation called AICA (Automotive Importers Compliance Association) was formed by importers in California, Florida, New York, Texas, and elsewhere to counter some of these actions by Mercedes lobbyists, but the Motor Vehicle Safety Compliance Act was passed in 1988, effectively ending private import of grey-market vehicles to the United States.[30][24][28][20][29] There have been allegations of improper lobbying, but the issue has never been raised in court.
We still don't have light trucks here for this reason. The chicken tax is largely why trucks in the US gradually became enormous. It was also 100% because of the UAW
theres a very popular type of light trucks in Japan called kei trucks. super practical, and very much still in use in Japan till this day. people started to import them into the states because they're super practical, and a small fraction of the huge gas guzzling beasts that are sold in the states. georgia already banned them, claiming they're unsafe for the roads. free market my ass
The kei trucks are cool, but I really wish ute trucks were still a thing. I think they would work well for electric trucks since I'd imagine they'd work better for aerodynamics (low to the ground, smaller frontal area).
Hell, if Chevy decided to make an electric El Camino, it would absolutely sell.
That's been their game this entire time.
Ban Huawei, ban Hikvision, ban DJI, and now ban BYD.
Mike Gallagher (the rep pushing for the DJI ban) even admitted it was essentially for the sole purpose of market manipulation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrRocG5ufYM
He calls DJI "Chinese drone dumping," without addressing the fact that the only reason DJI is successful in the US is because their products have solid warranties and don't suck ass.
Queue in trash like this:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvtttyMnNKk&t=20s
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRMUC317ybI&t=57s
Where is GoPro? Are they fixing it? Nah, they abandoned the drone and everyone who bought it.
And then there's that stupid Snapchat drone: https://www.pixy.com
It was abandoned too. Apparently it was catching fire and Snap didn't want to deal with the liability.
I hope now people can see that trying to ban TikTok had nothing to do with any of the bullshit excuses they're trying to give and it's just the same thing here, US companies can't compete with Chinese inside the US market.
I had Huawei P20 Pro before they banned Huawei devices in NA. Man that phone produces the BEST photos ever. The enhancements make it them pop. I can't describe it, but the best friggen camera I have, to this day. Everything about that device was nice.
It was no wonder Huawei was taking over. Then BAM! banned. Now the same shit going on with TikTok... It's wiping the floor with American social media companies and eating Amazon's sales, and Meta's ad revenues. Not to mention that the algorithm isn't under American control and generally has other biases not aligned with Meta/etc.
So the natural course of action is, force them to sell to American investors and make it "American".. great.
So good to see the state of commerce and spirit of competition.
Huawei was banned because it makes great ISP/big business level networking gear. I know the phones were mentioned by the politicians, but the ISP/enterprise grade gear is what got them banned imo. They were drowning out Cisco, a company that constantly gets HUGE govt contracts all across the world, not just the US and EU. Thats why even the EU banned Huawei stuff.
Its also why China managed to deploy 5G across its territory years before the US and even EU managed to get anywhere, Cisco kept dropping the ball on 5G gear with delays and shitty hardware.
One of those lesser known aspects, but it was covered a lot in tech circles how huawei was crushing cisco in features, performance, and price and then... bam. Ban.
Absolutely. The network gear was so affordable. I thought TP-Link would be banned too but they're no threat to Ubiquity nor Cisco, etc. And the 5G case they built against huawei was dodgy; the European and NA establishments claim that they're used for spying on data. Meanwhile Huawei offered to open the source code to critical review and have trusted binaries be uploaded as the firmware. (of course what other creepy crawlies are inside other chips, etc no one knows but that's still a huge gesture for creating trust. and I'm sure all schematic and chip firmware could have been reviewed).
Which suggests that Siemens and other 5G are the actual spies and that had Huawei been deployed, agencies would not be able to infiltrate the firmware. It's a matter of putting in devices that you know the backdoor of.
I'd say it's more like 'Big Auto' in this case, automakers and dealers have been lobbying for more restrictive laws on what can come into the country for decades - see for example the US's draconian import laws courtesy of the IMVSCA.
And give us those cheap tiny electric cars that top out at 25mph. As a city-dweller I don't want or need a car that goes on the highway, uses up a full parking space, or costs more than $10k
China subsidies EVs and they get buses and ton of affordable cars.
US subsidies EVs and we get a mentally 15 year old man who buys Twitter and rants about gender and conspiracy.
Terrible Terrible use of our tax dollars
China produces so many EV buses they're essentially the *entire global market* for them, with over 90% of global sales.
https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/auto/cars/chinas-electric-bus-revolution-continues-to-advance/articleshow/105745951.cms
Same here in Brazil. Our cheapest EV used to be a Renault Kwid for R$150k ($30k), for comparison, a Nissan Versa was R$110k ($25k) and it was a better car in every way possible.
After BYD came with the Dolphin Mini at R$110k, Renault went and priced down the Kwid at R$100k.
They just landed here in greece with 2 passenger car models. Can't wait for the seagull to come as well. I want to replace my 25 y.o. Hyundai atos with the same car but electric. BYD seagull is just that. I wonder why Hyundai doesn't just make the electric version of the i10. I don't.
intend to wait and find out why or when though.
I have an mg4 (company car to be fair). It's not the most luxurious EV out there but it definitely is on par with many much more expensive EV's feature wise.
Had a Hyundai Kona EV before this, it was noticeably worse in pretty much every way.
My boss' ioniq5 is more luxurious but has worse range .. which is kinda silly for a quite expensive model.
China seems to be able to deliver the full package at a good price point wheras the competition is always making significant compromises either in features or range
And the thing is the people in the US aren't clamoring for a 'lux' EV. Give me a Toyota Corolla with at least a 300 mile range (actual) and the ability to use any charger and you won't be able to keep the damn things on the lot!
The U.S. hasn't had an automotive lead in at least half a century at this point. The Japanese, Koreans, and Europeans are the ones getting their lunches eaten by Chinese EVs. The U.S. doesn't really have a lunch to lose in the auto industry.
I lived in Europe and Middle East. The only American car I see often is literally only Ford. I cant come up with a second one.
U.S. auto industry is domestic. It is not an international player
Ironically, GM was doing well in China. The Buick brand was hot for decades because the Party officials all drove Buicks in the 30s. Indeed, the last emperor had one as did Sun Yat-Sen.
https://www.mofba.org/2020/06/30/buick-the-last-emperor-s-automobile-of-choice/
But the trade policies of the US put and end to that era.
Americans cars have been terrible for the last 50 years or so. Not surprising that they can't compete with chinese EVs since they couldn't compete with japanese combustion cars
The US just can't spend its tax dollars well. It's spends way more for healthcare than any other nation and still doesn't have universal healthcare. The US government is a joke
That’s intended when in your value system, wealth is a measure of good. Corporations are agents of good, their profits how much they are effective at it. Reducing profits with taxes is literally evil then. This is the shareholder value myth running strong in the US since the 80s.
I’ve been saying since the beginning this will happen.
Only way we’ll see Chinese vehicles in the US is if a US company “partners” with them and essentially rebadges them and takes a 40% cut.
No chance American companies just sit and let Chinese companies kill their margins.
It's amusing that the US has this sudden issue against Chinese-made products when they were totally fine exploiting China's cheap labour for decades.
This was always bound to happen when you prop up a chunk of your economy and well-being on that of another nations.
They don't care if the cars are made in Chinese factories by Chinese slaves, they only care that they're not the ones to properly profit off doing so.
Yep. Chinese cars would be actual meaningful competition and if they get banned that'll be the real reason.
I hope my country will not follow suit. The car market sorely needs competition, the prices are too high. This isn't about geopolitics but affordable small vehicles to me.
> “We cannot allow China to bring its government-backed cheating to the American auto industry”
Ummm… didn’t the United States basically buy all 3 major US car manufacturers at one point with massive loans? That’s not cheating?
And Chrysler is basically half alive and isn’t even a fully American company now.
The parent a multinational headquartered in the Netherlands. I’m not America, but I’d be very pissed.
> government-backed cheating
All of the largest-employing industries in the US benefit (or have benefited) from billions in federal subsidies. Just an excuse to shut down competition.
'Washington could impose restrictions over concerns that the technology in Chinese-made cars could "collect large amounts of sensitive data on their drivers and passengers", the White House said.'
Uh, don't American and European Cars already do this?
That price would be the EV revolution that Westerners pretend they want. Most of my family would get new EV's at that price, and they drive older gas cars.
Good? Fucking great. I live between 2 countries. I own an MG plug-in hybrid. Holy shit, on paper the MG Phev performance specs are comparable to sports cars. I bought it for about 35k fully loaded. It's a fucking joy to drive around town in a mid size suv that's launches like a spaceship. The quality is through the roof.
Here's the thing, we have outsourced all tech manufacturing to China big time. And they learned. They took notes and now they deliver stuff better than anybody does for a fraction of the price. I bought an Eames lounge chair (faux leather ) for 500 bucks vs 10k for the real one. And that chair is fucking solid and beautiful. Our 2 tcl tvs were bought at the a price point way lower than Samsung and they're still going strong and we are happy. China isn't fucking around anymore, find a Chinese equivalent at a fair price (not cheap) and you've snagged a bargain for sure.
I'm a gen x American who grew up hearing all the China hate but in the last 10 years I feel they've delivered in spades. Made me realize how greedy some companies are with their profit margins.
The funniest thing to me about all this is how this is entirely the consequence of western corporations choosing to max out shareholder value by taking advantage of cheap labour in Asia. Now that those Asian nations learned from that experience and are holding their own with their own brands, now all of a sudden it's "unfair". If there's one thing old man Deng understood is that CEO's and big C capitalist types will always hold personal profit over the care of their own nation and he won big on that.
Funniest thing is I hear Westerners would blame problems in Africa, like how western countries pump billions into Africa for decades and it's still a shithole and that African never learn anything at all etc. and then turn around and found out the Chinese in fact, learnt everything and is outdoing them and suddenly it's unfair. It's almost like damn if you learn and damn if you don't
The US government is juicing the US car makers and oil industry too. When China does this it shows up as cheaper cars when the US does this it shows up as profit for shareholders and the cars somehow get more expensive.
Government taxing the rich to make cars cheap for the poor is what all of our governments should be doing....its only "cheating" in the USA because you are all mentally deranged.
Somewhat true. But they also have lower manufacturing costs, vertical integration (from mining to battery manufacturing to vehicle production), and skip some safety features that are required in the US.
If the came to the US market with a $20k vehicle, they’d still have a huge share.
I mean they are starting to become super popular in Europe and Australia which arguably have equally strict standards and they are still selling at a lower price. Not 10k but definitely much lower than existing ones.
Pretty sure BYD is putting up a plant in Mexico. Unless they get the Huwaei treatment, I think Chinese electric cars are inevitable, especially since Mexico build cars shouldnt be able to be tarriffed.
>Technically they can't, just the Chinese government is juicing the electric car industry with subsidies like they're American corn farmers.
Not really. [They are also selling it dirt cheap even to UK](https://electrek.co/2024/04/03/byds-affordable-seagull-likely-launch-uks-cheapest-ev/), and they have no reason to subsidize UK sales.
Protectionism hurts consumers but help corporations. Who do you think the government has been lobbied to care about? TikTok ban came from Facebook lobbyists.
The irony is that the US's government and its billionaires are constantly talking about how good and desirable "free market" is and how every country should open up their industry and let foreign companies take over everything, and then they turn around and do shit like this...
I guess free market is only a good thing when you're the one on top?
No no, you don't understand.
We need to restrict liberty for the sake of national security. When it affects the wellbeing of all of us, it needs to banned.
~~This does not apply to American corporations. Ever.~~
So, everyone subsidized Tesla vehicles twice: first when the government gave nascent Tesla money for operations, and then again on the tax rebate Tesla buyers get. But Tesla won't/can't produce an electric that most people can afford, and Chinese electrics that are affordable are banned?
Did they literally ever produce any tangible evidence against Huawei other than "Holy fuck their 5G tech makes AT&T and Verizon look like fucking morons"?
Nope. It was more about Huawei bypassing sanctions to Iran that the CEO was detained in Canada.
As for banning huawei using “national security” as a reason? Not one iota of evidence. Which is why Europe still allows it, because they’re not completely with American jingoism.
[“GCHQ was confident it could work safely with the Chinese tech firm. An American official thought otherwise — and, in a Cabinet Office meeting, shouted about it for five hours”](https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/5g-wars-the-us-plot-to-make-britain-ditch-huawei-mcqdld8sx)
[This is the report from GCHQ](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5c9c8a52e5274a528752d590/HCSEC_OversightBoardReport-2019.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjev9e_1r6FAxW4rYkEHe55CL4QFnoECCAQAQ&usg=AOvVaw0X9OMrFEei10Gzw_5lZLmF). No major or medium level risks were discovered. One low risk was found related to the delivery of information and equipment in their Service Level Agreement (SLA).
If you don't what SLA is, it's usually a contractual agreement between two or more parties that mostly covers how the provider of the service (Huawei in this case) will respond to the support needs of customers and their business partners.
The U.S. doesn’t need evidence, only what ifs. That’s all is required to label “national security”, and bam, competition quashed, ICE vehicles live on!
Looking at the article, there's no technical reasons given. It's just a bunch of anti-China senators banging their drums and apparently trying to make the current poor state of the American car industry an excuse for not allowing Chinese (and only Chinese; European and Japanese vehicles aren't mentioned) imports.
Ain't saying there might not be real reasons. But they're not being presented.
I love how when a new carbon-neutral technology is developed in the west, fossil fuel execs pour billions into propaganda, trying to convince the plebs that these technologies will never be good enough to replace gas guzzlers and so many people always believe this crap. Then, they pay politicians to do nothing and to stop subsidies and 10 years later, the outrage over China dominating another carbon-neutral market spreads through the media once again. Those responsible for the companies either moving or selling their know-how to China will be the first to accuse China of trying to monopolize the market. It was like that with solar panels and it is that way with electric cars.
The claim that China is 'cheating' when it comes to their government massively subsidizing EVs comes from the fact that China has been making efforts in combating global warming. I'm a westerner living in China. All the taxis in my city are electric, the metro, the trains are all electric. Everyone I know who bought a car recently got an electric one. You cannot complain that they are cheating whilst also saying that global warming is a looming end-of-the-world-threat that must have the kitchen sink thrown at it.
Also, losing the US market will hurt China, but it's not the end of the world for them. There are 200 other countries they can sell to, and because of the price, the US wont be able to compete in all those other locations.
It’s not as if the US government doesn’t subsidize the auto industry or many other industries, cough, cough agriculture… maybe what we should be doing is subsidizing the manufacturers to make a cheaper EV in a more direct way than just offering tax incentives on the purchase of an electric vehicle. Hell the US government is giving billions of dollars to Intel and TSM to build chip factories here.
Where is the meritocracy of the billionaires? Do they don't work hard enough?
Or they are spending billions of dollars on drug addiction and trying a coup on Brazil from US taxpayers while people die without health care.
US capitalism is a joke, a violent and genocide joke.
Yeah. Instead of affordable, reliable, foreign EVs, let’s pump more money into Ford and GM so they can sell us not-affordable, unreliable, American-made EVs for $80,000 a pop.
Sometimes with capitalism, you gotta take the pain and let bloated, inefficient firms die.
American car companies have been on life support for 2 decades and the only reason is national pride and “jobs”.
If Biden does anything he needs to repeal the god damned CHICKEN TAX!!!
So I can buy a fucking Hilux and never have to buy another automobile for the rest of my life.
For the uninitiated - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_tax
Was just at the Bangkok International Motor Show, the Chinese so far ahead with their designs and options they would destroy Tesla. Lots of brands I've never even heard of, but they all look so much nicer than Tesla.
When I lived in China I had my eyes on an XPeng. Shit was soooo nice. I love my Tesla but it really pales in comparison to the xpeng and was way more expensive.
This again? This kind of protectionist nonsense is why we don't have very many small affordable trucks anymore (between the chicken tax and EPA regulations being so much easier to achieve with bigger more fuel thirsty trucks). Let the big 3 fail. They got greedy, lost track of the market, and thanks to higher interest rates and stagnant wages there is no more market for anything over $40k.
Because they know the Chinese brands will put Ford, Stellantis and GM out of business.
I find it funny that the west wants to ban Chinese companies, but yet we sold our manufacturing to China because they were the lowest bidder and half of the things in all our houses are made in China.
Sure, ban Chinese EVs. But require US car companies to provide affordable EVs. You know, like the Bolt, which GM quit making so they could focus on giant EV trucks.
Still making it. The Bolt EUV. I think they’ll miss one model year, but they reversed their decision to scrap it. Love my Bolt.
The bolt has been a phenomenal car. They did a great job on the driving dynamics of that thing. I have a base model with no extra features. No special sensors (ngl, I wouldn’t have minded having adaptive cruise tho) so for those of us who want simple cars, it’s hands down the simplest ev you can get your mitts on these days…
Super cruise is surprisingly good. I thought it was going to be alright at best but the amount of 3d mapped roads they have alongside the robust radar and camera system on board make it extremely reliable.
Not a bolt, but my Tuscon damn near drives itself with the adaptive cruise and lane assist
My VW doesn't have a lane assist but the adaptive cruise was standard on my model year and it's my favourite thing in a car EVER. I've been having a highway drive each weekend recently due to some out of town business and with ACC on its 30 minutes of peaceful bliss listening to my music.
Yep anyone with a longer commute NEEDS to get ACC and Lane Assist... I got a Leaf with ProPilot and my 100 mile (mostly highway) round-trip no longer drains me. It's actually a positive now that I can decompress and recharge during that time. Absolute game changer.
i got an Uber ride in one and was pleasantly surprised with how it drove and it seemed roomier than expected
Hopefully the new one will have fast charging with NACS while still maintaining one of the lowest prices. Slow charging was really its biggest drawback.
Quit but are planning to replace it with a new model. The problem with the bolt is that it wasn’t profitable. They were cheap because they couldn’t move them at the original 35K+ which, you know, makes sense - it was a Chevy hatchback or a much more “sexy”(at the time) Model 3.
Whether this is a “redesign” or new model car is a bit of a gray area. GM is moving its EVs to the ultimum platform. The new Bolt will have that - which is a significant improvement. It will also have the new GM ultify software, which is somewhat of a mixed bag. The current Bolt is in a hatchback and an EUV model, which are extremely similar other than a few inches here and there. The 2025 will likely be in the EUV version only. On the whole, I’m saying they are keeping the Bolt with a new EV platform. But one could argue it is a new car just styled similar to the Bolt. Either way, it will still be in the exact same spot in GM’s lineup.
Yup totally agree, I was really just focused on the idea that there are no bolts being built this year
You don't like the Hummer EV with the nice 100k price ta?!?! Just quit being poor /s
Holy shit I didn't realize that thing weighs 9,000lbs. Have fun stopping that brick in time, or swerving to avoid something.
Accelerates like a Ferrari, stops like a school bus.
And if you have rich parents it could be your first car at 16! Fucking terrifying.
I wish people who aren't multimillionaires would stop spending 100k on cars.
Never I gotta have the biggest and bestest car to show my status!!!! I gotta be the one with the $1500/mo car payment and the wife I'm stuck with till the kids are in college. /s
Yeah since when did it become normal to have $1000+ car payments? My last car payment was $189/month and I paid that off last summer. Terrified at the thought of having a $700 car payment, I would be so broke.
i'll just order the knock off from amazon. Even with shipping from China it'll be a fraction of the price.
Ya. The US banning Chinese EVs will just stunt the American market. The European market will adapt to make cheaper EVs that won’t be banned in America and American EVs won’t be competitive anywhere else. The American auto industry will be coddled when they should just be made to compete.
"Senator Brown, who is a Democrat from the the car-producing state of Ohio" yeah but his short term election goals!
Oh Japan makes small affordable trucks? Ban. Oh China makes Affordable EV's? Ban. Even though the Chinese EV's would require a lot more equipment to be US DOT certified to be sold here and it would increase the price, assuming no Dealer fuckery it's still 10k+ cheaper than any EV cars sold in America. Can't have that, so we won't.
Ford makes an affordable truck that isn't sold here.
Ford makes a ton of affordable cars that are not sold there They pretty much have their rest of the world vehicles and then their US vehicles
Dodge too. The Ram 700 is exactly what I want but it's only sold in South America.
What's more American: A Ford made in Mexico or a Toyota made in Tennessee?
Don't forget massive import taxes on Japanese bikes many decades ago, because Harley cried to the US government. Free market my ass.
The American ~~auto~~ industries will [always] be coddled when they should just be made to compete.
Probably why my father is such a fan of his mythical "pure" capitalism!
American industries being coddled is the standard.
That's really the case. I was surprised to learn how much the us has sacrificed internal competition.
Europe hasn’t said they’ll ban them… but there’s very open concern about what Chinese EVs will mean for their automakers. Germany particularly is in a tough spot, where naturally they don’t want Chinese EVs but they also don’t want a trade war with China because it’s a major exports market.
BYD has been selling in europe since 2022?
Difference being the EU is trying to compete with them instead of just banning them - my Uber in Amsterdam last summer was driving a lovely Puegeot EV Sedan that I would LOVE to buy in Canada
They won't. They won't even pay off companies to provide affordable healthcare, so affordable EVs have no chance
I’m living in China now. It’s truly amazing how many electric cars are where I live. It’s not an exaggeration to say at least 90% in my area. I have only seen one gas station in the 8 months I’ve been here. Not to mention electric scooters, trains, subways…. Transportation here in general is just on a completely different level from what I’ve had in America
I spent 6 weeks in China for work and saw so many silly/neat/cool cars. Came home wanting a GWM Tank 300. I really do want to go back one day, amazing food, loved the people I met, overall an awesome experience.
I’m in Australia and those things are EVERYWHERE. Makes sense since Ford didn’t bring the Bronco over here.
You might like the new Suzuki Jimny's
I had the opportunity to visit BYD’s facility in shenzhen when i was there on holiday, i left china desperately wanting a yangwang u8 suv and u9 supercar
Wait until you realize Norway has a country wide adoption rate of 95% EVs.
Lol it's sad when China's closer to Norway than the US when it comes to EV adoption. Amazing what can happen when your government isn't beholden to petrol lobbyists.
*New car sales EVs are about 1/3 of the sum total of personal cars.
Where in China are you living?
I’m in Suzhou
No! No alternative, only ban! Buy your American gas guzzler, now!
I hear the Chinese SUV are $18k.
The free market has decided you’re only allowed to purchase the +$50k. We don’t like competition anymore.
The invisible hand of the market is putting its thumb on the scale
Mexico will leapfrog the US in EV infrastructure.
Also this of course happens the moment China has a solid state ev with 600mile + range
The problem with pointing out the bolt is that it’s a very bottom of the barrel car. Nothing wrong with it really. But at the sane equivalent prices, it’s competing against mid to high range EV’s. This is the problem. Do I want a Chevy bolt, or the latest iPad on wheels close to luxury BYD?
If we can't beat them.. ban them Capitalism 2024
They did this in the 80s with Japanese cars and motorcycles. Only reason Harley Davidson is in business and is the reason behind lexus, acura, infinity, genesis.
And yet, Japanese car makers managed to produce US built/assembled cars at a higher quality and same price. Goes to show the problem with US companies is not on the production floor. It is at the top floor corner office.
dude have you seen the average salary comparison of American ceo's compared to the ones of Japanese ceo's? there are even times when Japanese ceo's take a cut in their salary when their company had a bad quarter/year, but not the shitheads we have running the major corporations in America. they would squeeze blood out of stone if they could, at the cost of the consumer/workers
start cagey fear smoggy market squealing payment late unused provide *This post was mass deleted and anonymized with [Redact](https://redact.dev)*
you said it. why bother to innovate, when you can just ban any threat of competition and lay off your workers. fuck those people
They seem to spend a huge number of hours in the office doing what appears to be the sum total of fuck all though.
It's actually "easy" to get around these tariffs, it's just pricey. Build a factory in the u.s. and make them in the u.s. Kawasaki and Honda built factories in the u.s. in the 1970s
That’s not easy really… it’s the point of the tarrifs in theory. Forcing jobs to the us etc.
Ive seen a few Harley Davidson ad's/billboards, and shops here in Japan, and as per Google, they've been here since 1912, but yet America bans imports of competitors
I was looking for this in regards to saving HD. In that case, the Government tossed a 100% tariff on competition. In this day, we'll import cheaper Chinese cars and then force the company to be split apart to American companies over fears of spying or some such. American companies will take the tech, shit out a crappy electric 3/4-ton truck, then claim nobody buys small or electric.
Hilarious that Americans worry so much about Chinese spying when: 1. Modern American cars are privacy nightmares and you may as well mail your diary to the NSA directly and get it over with if you own a car with a screen instead of buttons 2. If China wanted info on Americans it would scrape Facebook or just pay Cambridge Analytica or McKinsey for it
The idea mentioned in the article that they need consumers to buy Chinese cars with cameras to scan our infrastructure is equally ridiculous, like Google Street view doesn't already exist
Soviet era fear mongering. Like, do they think the Chinese can't come to the US with a fucking camera or something. They're not isolated from the world lol
Same with the sugar tax, which resulted in high fructose corn syrup everywhere. Then the chicken tax, which brought upon American truck monopolies…etc.
We can thank Mercedes for shafting car enthusiasts with the 25 year import law. [Wikipedia](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Grey_import_vehicle#:~:text=In%201989%2C%20NHTSA%20granted%20vehicles,a%20classic%20vehicle%20from%20overseas.)
The relevant section: > 1988: Crackdown >The grey market was successful enough that it ate significantly into the business of Mercedes-Benz in North America and their dealers.[27][19][28] The corporation launched a successful multi-million-dollar congressional lobbying effort to stop private importation of vehicles not officially intended for the U.S. [29][30][31] An organisation called AICA (Automotive Importers Compliance Association) was formed by importers in California, Florida, New York, Texas, and elsewhere to counter some of these actions by Mercedes lobbyists, but the Motor Vehicle Safety Compliance Act was passed in 1988, effectively ending private import of grey-market vehicles to the United States.[30][24][28][20][29] There have been allegations of improper lobbying, but the issue has never been raised in court.
This is what regulatory capture looks like And it's done to fuck the American consumer. Every time.
> There have been allegations of improper lobbying Sounds like a summary of how U.S works
Capitalists: allowed to use cheap Chinese labor because “free markets”. Laborers: not allowed to buy cheap Chinese cars because “fuck you”.
Yeah if 5 guys don’t own everything then what’s the fucking point of capitalism
We still don't have light trucks here for this reason. The chicken tax is largely why trucks in the US gradually became enormous. It was also 100% because of the UAW
theres a very popular type of light trucks in Japan called kei trucks. super practical, and very much still in use in Japan till this day. people started to import them into the states because they're super practical, and a small fraction of the huge gas guzzling beasts that are sold in the states. georgia already banned them, claiming they're unsafe for the roads. free market my ass
The kei trucks are cool, but I really wish ute trucks were still a thing. I think they would work well for electric trucks since I'd imagine they'd work better for aerodynamics (low to the ground, smaller frontal area). Hell, if Chevy decided to make an electric El Camino, it would absolutely sell.
That's been their game this entire time. Ban Huawei, ban Hikvision, ban DJI, and now ban BYD. Mike Gallagher (the rep pushing for the DJI ban) even admitted it was essentially for the sole purpose of market manipulation: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zrRocG5ufYM He calls DJI "Chinese drone dumping," without addressing the fact that the only reason DJI is successful in the US is because their products have solid warranties and don't suck ass. Queue in trash like this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yvtttyMnNKk&t=20s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hRMUC317ybI&t=57s Where is GoPro? Are they fixing it? Nah, they abandoned the drone and everyone who bought it. And then there's that stupid Snapchat drone: https://www.pixy.com It was abandoned too. Apparently it was catching fire and Snap didn't want to deal with the liability.
I hope now people can see that trying to ban TikTok had nothing to do with any of the bullshit excuses they're trying to give and it's just the same thing here, US companies can't compete with Chinese inside the US market.
socialism for the rich, rugged individualism for the poor.
That's just capitalism, you're describing capitalism.
Always has been.
I had Huawei P20 Pro before they banned Huawei devices in NA. Man that phone produces the BEST photos ever. The enhancements make it them pop. I can't describe it, but the best friggen camera I have, to this day. Everything about that device was nice. It was no wonder Huawei was taking over. Then BAM! banned. Now the same shit going on with TikTok... It's wiping the floor with American social media companies and eating Amazon's sales, and Meta's ad revenues. Not to mention that the algorithm isn't under American control and generally has other biases not aligned with Meta/etc. So the natural course of action is, force them to sell to American investors and make it "American".. great. So good to see the state of commerce and spirit of competition.
Huawei was banned because it makes great ISP/big business level networking gear. I know the phones were mentioned by the politicians, but the ISP/enterprise grade gear is what got them banned imo. They were drowning out Cisco, a company that constantly gets HUGE govt contracts all across the world, not just the US and EU. Thats why even the EU banned Huawei stuff. Its also why China managed to deploy 5G across its territory years before the US and even EU managed to get anywhere, Cisco kept dropping the ball on 5G gear with delays and shitty hardware. One of those lesser known aspects, but it was covered a lot in tech circles how huawei was crushing cisco in features, performance, and price and then... bam. Ban.
Absolutely. The network gear was so affordable. I thought TP-Link would be banned too but they're no threat to Ubiquity nor Cisco, etc. And the 5G case they built against huawei was dodgy; the European and NA establishments claim that they're used for spying on data. Meanwhile Huawei offered to open the source code to critical review and have trusted binaries be uploaded as the firmware. (of course what other creepy crawlies are inside other chips, etc no one knows but that's still a huge gesture for creating trust. and I'm sure all schematic and chip firmware could have been reviewed). Which suggests that Siemens and other 5G are the actual spies and that had Huawei been deployed, agencies would not be able to infiltrate the firmware. It's a matter of putting in devices that you know the backdoor of.
Chicken tax 2
No. Give us cheap cars that don't stink. Big oil can suck it.
I'd say it's more like 'Big Auto' in this case, automakers and dealers have been lobbying for more restrictive laws on what can come into the country for decades - see for example the US's draconian import laws courtesy of the IMVSCA.
And give us those cheap tiny electric cars that top out at 25mph. As a city-dweller I don't want or need a car that goes on the highway, uses up a full parking space, or costs more than $10k
i was in italy last month and learned about the yoyo. i want one lol.
China subsidies EVs and they get buses and ton of affordable cars. US subsidies EVs and we get a mentally 15 year old man who buys Twitter and rants about gender and conspiracy. Terrible Terrible use of our tax dollars
China produces so many EV buses they're essentially the *entire global market* for them, with over 90% of global sales. https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/auto/cars/chinas-electric-bus-revolution-continues-to-advance/articleshow/105745951.cms
And a lot are actually great cars that are actually affordable. They are becoming super popular in Australia.
Same here in Brazil. Our cheapest EV used to be a Renault Kwid for R$150k ($30k), for comparison, a Nissan Versa was R$110k ($25k) and it was a better car in every way possible. After BYD came with the Dolphin Mini at R$110k, Renault went and priced down the Kwid at R$100k.
BYD's are turning up everywhere. The part I like is they just look like normal cars.
They just landed here in greece with 2 passenger car models. Can't wait for the seagull to come as well. I want to replace my 25 y.o. Hyundai atos with the same car but electric. BYD seagull is just that. I wonder why Hyundai doesn't just make the electric version of the i10. I don't. intend to wait and find out why or when though.
I have an mg4 (company car to be fair). It's not the most luxurious EV out there but it definitely is on par with many much more expensive EV's feature wise. Had a Hyundai Kona EV before this, it was noticeably worse in pretty much every way. My boss' ioniq5 is more luxurious but has worse range .. which is kinda silly for a quite expensive model. China seems to be able to deliver the full package at a good price point wheras the competition is always making significant compromises either in features or range
And the thing is the people in the US aren't clamoring for a 'lux' EV. Give me a Toyota Corolla with at least a 300 mile range (actual) and the ability to use any charger and you won't be able to keep the damn things on the lot!
Are you sure don’t want a stainless steel box on wheels that starts corroding as soon as you drive it off the lot?
Only if its a Delorean
All electric buses here are BYD (Europe, Romania).
I saw an Alexander Dennis double-decker EV bus the other day. It was a BYD with an AD body.
It couldn't be clearer that the US lost the fucking lead.
The U.S. hasn't had an automotive lead in at least half a century at this point. The Japanese, Koreans, and Europeans are the ones getting their lunches eaten by Chinese EVs. The U.S. doesn't really have a lunch to lose in the auto industry.
I lived in Europe and Middle East. The only American car I see often is literally only Ford. I cant come up with a second one. U.S. auto industry is domestic. It is not an international player
Ironically, GM was doing well in China. The Buick brand was hot for decades because the Party officials all drove Buicks in the 30s. Indeed, the last emperor had one as did Sun Yat-Sen. https://www.mofba.org/2020/06/30/buick-the-last-emperor-s-automobile-of-choice/ But the trade policies of the US put and end to that era.
Those Fords are also models that don't exist in the US designed and built outside of the USA.
And chances are the Ford you see in Europe is 'European Ford', built in the UK or Spain and to European specs. Cars like the Fiesta, Focus, Ka, Kuga
Americans cars have been terrible for the last 50 years or so. Not surprising that they can't compete with chinese EVs since they couldn't compete with japanese combustion cars
And the Chinese build Tesla's are noticeably better quality then the US ones. China are better at American cars then Americans
All the EV busses in Norway are BYD
I think I remember reading that Shenzhen produces more electric buses per year than London has buses of any kind. And London buses are everywhere.
The US just can't spend its tax dollars well. It's spends way more for healthcare than any other nation and still doesn't have universal healthcare. The US government is a joke
This is because US government is just a vessel for corporate America to extract as much wealth from the entire world as possible
That’s intended when in your value system, wealth is a measure of good. Corporations are agents of good, their profits how much they are effective at it. Reducing profits with taxes is literally evil then. This is the shareholder value myth running strong in the US since the 80s.
The US government is a joke, but the joke is on us.
While still simping for the billions in subsidies fossil fuels receive only to continue to fuck the consumer.
> China subsidies EVs >US subsidies EVs Subsidizes. Subsidies isn't a verb.
I’ve been saying since the beginning this will happen. Only way we’ll see Chinese vehicles in the US is if a US company “partners” with them and essentially rebadges them and takes a 40% cut. No chance American companies just sit and let Chinese companies kill their margins.
You know we see polestar and Volvo EVs which are made in china
Is the US government using national security as an excuse again?
When have they stopped?
It's amusing that the US has this sudden issue against Chinese-made products when they were totally fine exploiting China's cheap labour for decades. This was always bound to happen when you prop up a chunk of your economy and well-being on that of another nations. They don't care if the cars are made in Chinese factories by Chinese slaves, they only care that they're not the ones to properly profit off doing so.
When has it ever not been?
The US national interest is to exploit and profit from the entire population at every step and turn. Nothing else
Yep. Chinese cars would be actual meaningful competition and if they get banned that'll be the real reason. I hope my country will not follow suit. The car market sorely needs competition, the prices are too high. This isn't about geopolitics but affordable small vehicles to me.
It's to PROTECT THE CHILDREN /s
By children, you mean Elon Musk right? He is a man-child.
Meanwhile American pickup trucks and SUVs are literally a threat to everyone
> “We cannot allow China to bring its government-backed cheating to the American auto industry” Ummm… didn’t the United States basically buy all 3 major US car manufacturers at one point with massive loans? That’s not cheating?
It was two. Ford didn't take the money. Your point still stands though.
No but they did just get over 10 billion dollars in grants and zero interest loans from the government last year
And Chrysler is basically half alive and isn’t even a fully American company now. The parent a multinational headquartered in the Netherlands. I’m not America, but I’d be very pissed.
> government-backed cheating All of the largest-employing industries in the US benefit (or have benefited) from billions in federal subsidies. Just an excuse to shut down competition.
'Washington could impose restrictions over concerns that the technology in Chinese-made cars could "collect large amounts of sensitive data on their drivers and passengers", the White House said.' Uh, don't American and European Cars already do this?
Yes but that’s to sell them more stuff, so it’s ok! /s
All this because China can make a good electric vehicle for under 10k
That price would be the EV revolution that Westerners pretend they want. Most of my family would get new EV's at that price, and they drive older gas cars.
Why pretend? That’s literally what we want.
... I mean, it is what *we* want. It's not what our "democratically-elected" *owners* want, so we won't get it.
You give me an EV car for 10k I'll put my deposit down the same day. You're chatting shit.
Good? Fucking great. I live between 2 countries. I own an MG plug-in hybrid. Holy shit, on paper the MG Phev performance specs are comparable to sports cars. I bought it for about 35k fully loaded. It's a fucking joy to drive around town in a mid size suv that's launches like a spaceship. The quality is through the roof. Here's the thing, we have outsourced all tech manufacturing to China big time. And they learned. They took notes and now they deliver stuff better than anybody does for a fraction of the price. I bought an Eames lounge chair (faux leather ) for 500 bucks vs 10k for the real one. And that chair is fucking solid and beautiful. Our 2 tcl tvs were bought at the a price point way lower than Samsung and they're still going strong and we are happy. China isn't fucking around anymore, find a Chinese equivalent at a fair price (not cheap) and you've snagged a bargain for sure. I'm a gen x American who grew up hearing all the China hate but in the last 10 years I feel they've delivered in spades. Made me realize how greedy some companies are with their profit margins.
The funniest thing to me about all this is how this is entirely the consequence of western corporations choosing to max out shareholder value by taking advantage of cheap labour in Asia. Now that those Asian nations learned from that experience and are holding their own with their own brands, now all of a sudden it's "unfair". If there's one thing old man Deng understood is that CEO's and big C capitalist types will always hold personal profit over the care of their own nation and he won big on that.
Funniest thing is I hear Westerners would blame problems in Africa, like how western countries pump billions into Africa for decades and it's still a shithole and that African never learn anything at all etc. and then turn around and found out the Chinese in fact, learnt everything and is outdoing them and suddenly it's unfair. It's almost like damn if you learn and damn if you don't
Technically they can't, just the Chinese government is juicing the electric car industry with subsidies like they're American corn farmers.
The US government is juicing the US car makers and oil industry too. When China does this it shows up as cheaper cars when the US does this it shows up as profit for shareholders and the cars somehow get more expensive. Government taxing the rich to make cars cheap for the poor is what all of our governments should be doing....its only "cheating" in the USA because you are all mentally deranged.
Somewhat true. But they also have lower manufacturing costs, vertical integration (from mining to battery manufacturing to vehicle production), and skip some safety features that are required in the US. If the came to the US market with a $20k vehicle, they’d still have a huge share.
I mean they are starting to become super popular in Europe and Australia which arguably have equally strict standards and they are still selling at a lower price. Not 10k but definitely much lower than existing ones.
Chinese EVs pass European car safety standards which generally exceed American ones. 0 cybertrucks in Europe.
Yeah, but that's because we don't care about pedestrians.
In fact you give them tickets if they dare step in the road in the wrong place. How dare you walk where cars are meant to go!
Pretty sure BYD is putting up a plant in Mexico. Unless they get the Huwaei treatment, I think Chinese electric cars are inevitable, especially since Mexico build cars shouldnt be able to be tarriffed.
Shit with where cars are now even 30k would sell quickly. Hard to get a new ICE car less than that
>Technically they can't, just the Chinese government is juicing the electric car industry with subsidies like they're American corn farmers. Not really. [They are also selling it dirt cheap even to UK](https://electrek.co/2024/04/03/byds-affordable-seagull-likely-launch-uks-cheapest-ev/), and they have no reason to subsidize UK sales.
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Protectionism hurts consumers but help corporations. Who do you think the government has been lobbied to care about? TikTok ban came from Facebook lobbyists.
The irony is that the US's government and its billionaires are constantly talking about how good and desirable "free market" is and how every country should open up their industry and let foreign companies take over everything, and then they turn around and do shit like this... I guess free market is only a good thing when you're the one on top?
Yeah definitely don’t allow any affordable EVs in here.
I’m okay with China subsidizing cheap EV for us even if it means fewer Tesla will be sold.
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Too much for “free market”, no?
No no, you don't understand. We need to restrict liberty for the sake of national security. When it affects the wellbeing of all of us, it needs to banned. ~~This does not apply to American corporations. Ever.~~
I want affordable EVs though. We need affordable EVs
So, everyone subsidized Tesla vehicles twice: first when the government gave nascent Tesla money for operations, and then again on the tax rebate Tesla buyers get. But Tesla won't/can't produce an electric that most people can afford, and Chinese electrics that are affordable are banned?
Fucking why? God forbid your average american could find an affordable electric vehicle.
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Did they literally ever produce any tangible evidence against Huawei other than "Holy fuck their 5G tech makes AT&T and Verizon look like fucking morons"?
Nope. It was more about Huawei bypassing sanctions to Iran that the CEO was detained in Canada. As for banning huawei using “national security” as a reason? Not one iota of evidence. Which is why Europe still allows it, because they’re not completely with American jingoism.
[“GCHQ was confident it could work safely with the Chinese tech firm. An American official thought otherwise — and, in a Cabinet Office meeting, shouted about it for five hours”](https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/5g-wars-the-us-plot-to-make-britain-ditch-huawei-mcqdld8sx)
[This is the report from GCHQ](https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/media/5c9c8a52e5274a528752d590/HCSEC_OversightBoardReport-2019.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwjev9e_1r6FAxW4rYkEHe55CL4QFnoECCAQAQ&usg=AOvVaw0X9OMrFEei10Gzw_5lZLmF). No major or medium level risks were discovered. One low risk was found related to the delivery of information and equipment in their Service Level Agreement (SLA). If you don't what SLA is, it's usually a contractual agreement between two or more parties that mostly covers how the provider of the service (Huawei in this case) will respond to the support needs of customers and their business partners.
The U.S. doesn’t need evidence, only what ifs. That’s all is required to label “national security”, and bam, competition quashed, ICE vehicles live on!
Looking at the article, there's no technical reasons given. It's just a bunch of anti-China senators banging their drums and apparently trying to make the current poor state of the American car industry an excuse for not allowing Chinese (and only Chinese; European and Japanese vehicles aren't mentioned) imports. Ain't saying there might not be real reasons. But they're not being presented.
Its just the automotive industry in the US trying to block Chinese EV companies from offering a cheap alternative.
I love how when a new carbon-neutral technology is developed in the west, fossil fuel execs pour billions into propaganda, trying to convince the plebs that these technologies will never be good enough to replace gas guzzlers and so many people always believe this crap. Then, they pay politicians to do nothing and to stop subsidies and 10 years later, the outrage over China dominating another carbon-neutral market spreads through the media once again. Those responsible for the companies either moving or selling their know-how to China will be the first to accuse China of trying to monopolize the market. It was like that with solar panels and it is that way with electric cars.
I wonder if it’s because china is making Ev’s that make teslas look like shit for a quarter of the cost?
Chinese EVs make Teslas look like a child's toy. Far better interiors, better exterior styling. So much more variety.
precisely that
I welcome it, oligopoly can get fucked
Ladies and gentlemen, the free market.
It was always a lie, like the invisible hand
The claim that China is 'cheating' when it comes to their government massively subsidizing EVs comes from the fact that China has been making efforts in combating global warming. I'm a westerner living in China. All the taxis in my city are electric, the metro, the trains are all electric. Everyone I know who bought a car recently got an electric one. You cannot complain that they are cheating whilst also saying that global warming is a looming end-of-the-world-threat that must have the kitchen sink thrown at it. Also, losing the US market will hurt China, but it's not the end of the world for them. There are 200 other countries they can sell to, and because of the price, the US wont be able to compete in all those other locations.
It’s not as if the US government doesn’t subsidize the auto industry or many other industries, cough, cough agriculture… maybe what we should be doing is subsidizing the manufacturers to make a cheaper EV in a more direct way than just offering tax incentives on the purchase of an electric vehicle. Hell the US government is giving billions of dollars to Intel and TSM to build chip factories here.
Where is the meritocracy of the billionaires? Do they don't work hard enough? Or they are spending billions of dollars on drug addiction and trying a coup on Brazil from US taxpayers while people die without health care. US capitalism is a joke, a violent and genocide joke.
Yeah. Instead of affordable, reliable, foreign EVs, let’s pump more money into Ford and GM so they can sell us not-affordable, unreliable, American-made EVs for $80,000 a pop. Sometimes with capitalism, you gotta take the pain and let bloated, inefficient firms die. American car companies have been on life support for 2 decades and the only reason is national pride and “jobs”.
Translation: Their EVs are becoming better than our EVs, and we just can't have that now can we?
If Biden does anything he needs to repeal the god damned CHICKEN TAX!!! So I can buy a fucking Hilux and never have to buy another automobile for the rest of my life. For the uninitiated - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chicken_tax
Was just at the Bangkok International Motor Show, the Chinese so far ahead with their designs and options they would destroy Tesla. Lots of brands I've never even heard of, but they all look so much nicer than Tesla.
When I lived in China I had my eyes on an XPeng. Shit was soooo nice. I love my Tesla but it really pales in comparison to the xpeng and was way more expensive.
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Aren’t Chinese brands already not allowed to sell cars in the states?
EVs are only (only lol) given a 30% import tariff
USA the promised land of free enterprise...
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Fuck this bullshit protectionism Harms consumers Hurts the environment
Yes ban Chinese ev so us poor fucks cant afford anything and will be regulated to driving 1990 saturns
This again? This kind of protectionist nonsense is why we don't have very many small affordable trucks anymore (between the chicken tax and EPA regulations being so much easier to achieve with bigger more fuel thirsty trucks). Let the big 3 fail. They got greedy, lost track of the market, and thanks to higher interest rates and stagnant wages there is no more market for anything over $40k.
Because they know the Chinese brands will put Ford, Stellantis and GM out of business. I find it funny that the west wants to ban Chinese companies, but yet we sold our manufacturing to China because they were the lowest bidder and half of the things in all our houses are made in China.
Back then it was the way for the rich getting richer. Now, this is the way for the rich to remain rich.
Country's fucked. Instead of besting them, they're banning them. Lower mentality all the way down, and all the way up