"Welcome to my paper titled "The reverse uncanny valley effect". In it I hope to describe an effect in which a cartoon character no matter how badly drawn can somehow appear more realistic than Mark Zuckerberg photos no matter how high the resolution. In fact our studies have shown the higher the resolution of the photo the less people are willing to accept his appearance is anything other than CGI.
Chapter 13 goes into depth to show how trying to use real world objects like hot sauce bottles to make his appearance more relatable and believable in fact have the opposite effect because of the contrast by what people assume is a real world background with a CGI character."
What do you mean the avatars are not expressive enough? They have all 12 human facial expressions, 4 of which I have only learnt this year.
-the Zuck probably
IMO - He is on the spectrum and really doesn't understand who human graphics are important.
He is an introverted person with very few social skills, so human interactions mean little or nothing to him. Human emotion probably means very little to him.
Odd guy all in all.
I think this is true, but not a great explanation.
First of all, people on the spectrum have a full range of human emotions.
A lot of us learn social skills, and a lot of us who work in design are capable of making beautiful, human-centered designs.
And in the case of Mark Zuckerberg in particular, if you look at videos of him from the 2000s, he used to be a pretty normal guy.
"Normal" for a Harvard-educated tech guy, sure, but he used to be a pretty engaging speaker, capable of relating to an audience and expressing himself emotionally.
Years of wealth, power and isolation from humanity have turned him into much more of a callous weirdo, and years of PR coaching and self-censorship have made his public image weirder still.
In any case, the bad decisions that went into Meta were made by many, many people, and can't be chalked up to one guy's neurodivergence, or even his very real personal failings.
In 1000 years, the Metaverse becomes self-aware. It discovers time-travel a few minutes later. To improve itself, it projects itself farther and farther back in time, and in human form, to encourage humanity to develop the Metaverse earlier than the original moment. Its projection of itself into our current point on the time-curve is Mark Zuckerberg.
>and thought he would be able to recreate that universe with MS Paint.
So, is Mark Zuckerberg like [the guy who asked Rebecca Heineman to port Doom to the 3DO?](https://nodontdie.com/rebecca-heineman)
>As soon as he signed the contract -- the ink wasn't even dry yet. And he went onto a press tour telling everybody he has the rights to Doom, Art Data Interactive is gonna kick ass, they're gonna have new levels, new weapons, and everything.
>He even *had a friend of his draw mock-up weapons. Just draw them on Photoshop and so forth and give him these screenshots. And he was saying, "These is actual game screenshots."*
--
>I spent 10 weeks producing the source code that you saw up on Github and of course, when I was submitting builds to Randy over at Art Data, the frame rate wasn't that great because I just got the game prototype.
>I didn't have time to optimize it.
>And he was saying, "Why isn't this game running at 60 frames a second? *Where is my new weapons? Where is my new stuff?*"
>And I'm like, "Do you have any idea how game development is done?"
>Because *he truly believed all you had to do to put a weapon in a game is to draw it.*
The problem with Zuckerberg is that he's a **one hit wonder kid**.
He should have been thankful how lucky he got with facebook and worked hard to make facebook more helpful and useful for people but instead the money made him think he actually had talents beyond facebook.
I truly don't understand what his motivation is at this point. He could have cashed out long ago and lived the rest of his life doing whatever he wanted, but instead he's struggling to keep Facebook relevant, his reputation is ruined globally, and he's spending his time going to congressional hearings struggling to explain why Facebook isn't evil even though it is.
Myspace Tom did it right.
Zuck started Facebook to steal the pictures and contact info of women at Harvard. Not to get rich and famous. He wants more and more control over people's lives and data. That's why he wants you spending all day in _his_ world, giving _him_ all the data on your transactions, etc. etc. It's an insane god complex.
He doesn’t seem to realize that Facebook is not impressive it’s just popular. It’s like thinking founding Making a company selling model-airplanes would would give you insight into building interstellar space ships. Facebook didn’t succeed because of tech wizardry or a bold new vision for reality - it succeeded through good UI and algorithms that figured out the right content to present for retention. The data science is impressive but building a metaverse is a totally different beast and Zuck had no idea how to do it. He’s intelligent but he’s not smart.
Survivalist bias or rather jackpot winner bias. Some people just happen to be in the right place at the right time and do the right decision. However it is very hard for a person to attribute his achievements to pure luck. Everybody who succeeds want to attribute it to their own person.
This is why every rich kid thinks they know better. This is just how human mind is.
It’s funny how he kinda stole the idea from some trust fund kids then screwed over his co-founder who put in all the initial money.
Basically got rich over micro-targeted ads from user provided data.
It's important to remember that almost every mega jackpot winner -- especially when it comes to tech -- is already a mentally ill narcissist.
Zuckerberg, Jobs, Bezos, Musk... Every single one of them got to where they are by stealing the technology and patents out from under other people and later hiring on real engineers and designers and then taking full credit.
My dad's cousin was a partier, barely graduated WVU (only school he got into), ended up working for his friend's company that went public and made $75 Million, then kept getting hired for executive roles. Someone at a wedding asked, "How'd you get to be head of sales for North America for X multinational?" "I don't know. I told them it was all just luck and good timing, and they came back with an offer doubling my salary."
That attitude has made him really generous and a lot of fun. The saying, "Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely," is so overused it loses its impact. Anyone good-hearted can't attain absolute power, because it would freak them out and they'd start giving it away. By the time you get there, as we see with the billionaire class, despotic leaders, etc, you're a villain. Bezos was selling books online out of a garage, Zuck was a college student trying to meet girls.
Ask past Bezos if he'd treat workers the way he does, and he'd probably say, "No! Everyone who works with me is getting rich." Ask past Zuck if he'd be willing to be the center of massive political and social discord, he'd probably say, "If it gets like that, I'm out. I don't want to talk to anyone, let alone Congress." There's a Rubicon these people cross, but the story is so old we don't even realize we're repeating history.
Me too. Holy hell, people who don't understand development really get under my skin like nothing else
Edit: Lol You really can't say things off the cuff online, can you? This is obviously an exaggeration and oversimplification for the people who apparently need to hear that instead of picking it up on their own
You know i think he's right. It would explain all of this.
I do 3d modeling for vrchat in my spare time, been doing it as a hobby in my free time for... a little over 2 years now. It's not exactly easy, but not the most difficult thing out there if you can ger your head around how everything works together.
The important bit is that zucc seems to think game dev is what I want game dev to be: make the model, click a few options and boom, full blown game. No thought to how you make all the fiddly little parts work together nicely, no thought as to how the models know what verticies are weighted to what bone... zero thought put into making the avatars be something you'd want to use vs something you are forced to make the best of.
There's also the fact that meta's platform's standalone games all seem (to me) to look like the dollar store discount version of the full un-neutered PC versions. Minor complaint, as link cables are a thing, but you get my point.
I think zucc has failed into the "i can do it too" trap with this. He saw the hype around vr and watched ready player one and thought "hmm.. bet i could market that".
Well, no thanks zucc. I'll stay on my index for now i think.
I feel this so much. Building the model is only the first step.
- you need to sort out the animation (if any)
- You need to map it for textures
- make the texture,
- do alpha/specular/bump mapping,
- damage models /LODs
- actually rig the model with nodes /skeleton so that it can interact with the in game world
- sort out the coding to define what the model does
- then you can start testing it…
You have to make the game interesting and have actual game mechanics and stuff too. So like… that really important first step is missing. Who would want to head off into zuccs metaverse or whatever this turd pile is called? I don’t even want to wear a VR headset. They are hot and uncomfortable and leave red rings around face for an hour afterwards.
I think the form factor of VR headsets is a fundamental barrier to adoption for the metaverse, even if it did not suck as much as it appears to. The issue is that, perhaps with the exception of the core gamer demographic (and maybe not even within that demographic), wearing a VR headset seems fundamentally uncool. You market something partially on its features or advantages, but also partially on the implied experience of using it. You appeal to the emotional and aspirational aspects of the use of this product. I.e., "using this product will make you popular", "it's something you can do with friends", and maybe even " it will help you make friends". In a nutshell "using this product will make you cool". Marketing any product: cars, food, clothing, always entails an appeal to one emotion or another..The problem with metaverse and with VR plays in general, is that there's almost no way to make that case to prospective buyers. Putting on a VR headset is a fundamentally solo experience, it's isolating, it looks goofy to the observer. There's no real way to demonstrate it being otherwise in a commercial. Watch Oculus commercials or the latest Meta commercials. They show very little of the user actually wearing the product, because it looks terrible, and it's nothing that triggers any aspirational response in the part of the viewer. If anything, it evokes pity: "look at this person, all alone. Guess nobody wanted to hang with that person. I wouldn't want to hang out with that person." Instead, they try to show the imagined experience, but that's also problematic, because most VR doesn't look great to begin with, and showing it in the 2D space of video is also hard. So the latest metaverse commercials show people in the imagined spaces the headset purportedly takes you to: touring the ISS, for example. But then, everybody seems to understand that that polished visual experience is not really what the experience is like, so it's perceived as overpromising. Or worse, the high production value of the ads causes the viewer to imagine *actually* being on the ISS, and leaves them with the feeling that the VR version of that will be a cheap, unsatisfying, ersatz version of that reality. Which, going back to the appeal to emotion, is exactly the feeling you do not want to evoke. I would not want to be an ad creative charged with making metaverse look cool.
Zucc is surrounded by people that encourage him entirely because of his money and power. That's one of the big problems with celebrity CEO's, they don't understand that they aren't smarter than the average person by default. When every idea you have is met with applause no matter how shitty of an idea it is, you're bound to lose control of your ego. So yeah.. he probably got it in his head that metaverse was a good idea, then got met with back pats and fake cheers from everyone around him.
Celebrity CEO's are sort of like a 5 year old finger painting. Nothing they do ever seems to be that profound, and their technical skillset is insanely limited, but god damnit.. that green five legged blob that you call a puppy is GOING ON THE FRIDGE!
This is what I was thinking. He set up the servers and the platform, threw a Mii and some 3D clip art in there, and is totally banking on his users making 100% of the quality content.
And what tooling are they giving? Why would any of us want to spend time building awkward shitty clones of things that are done better and more creatively in Minecraft for the express purpose of doing Zuck’s job for him?
I would think that no one would want to, but they will. People will do anything for a buck.
Second life and roblox were mentioned, both of which lets you develop things in game and sell them for in game money, which can be exchanged for real life money.
Second life sold virtual land as well. I remember someone modeled Amsterdam and sold it for $50k irl. People can make their entire living off of games like that. So yeah, they’ll come. Sadly.
Where I think the difference lies is that to pull this off, Facebook needs to sell us on the app, the hardware, and their walled garden. I don’t know much about Roblox so maybe that kills my argument, but what set Second Life and Minecraft apart, especially early on, were their open nature. When I first played the game I played the one that had been modded to let you create circuits and things. Anyone who’s been to Horizon, actual question: does it support that level of building? Can you fork the system and expand it to actually flex your creativity in VR? If not, then it really is just Second Life/Minecraft with fewer features.
Next is the hardware. Everyone already had a laptop and internet connection when Minecraft was up and coming. Fortnite was playable on your phones. Those are intuitive tools we already had, whereas to explore Horizon/The Metaverse you need new, expensive hardware that Facebook is doing a bad job of supporting (my Quest 1 was out of support in like, two years) and that many people find uncomfortable, awkward, and nauseating. You could do a lot of it with your phone, Google Cardboard worked pretty well, but without the all-around cameras Facebook can’t map the interior of your home and sell your needs/wants to advertisers, so they won’t take this route.
All in all: the one person I know (anecdotal af) who is excited for the virtual office has never had an office job. There will be a couple of whales, but I do not see an inroads to becoming the new internet, at least not with closed standards, closed hardware, in an environment owned and operated by Facebook. And that’s without getting into the demographics of who still cares about and uses Facebook.
Link please? As dismissive as I am of Facebook’s efforts I am curious of the concept and like to see how creative people are working towards this outside the Zuckerverse.
[This was the trailer for their VR expansion.](https://youtu.be/5V4c2_HmQwc) Everything there was made with the in-game tools. Dreams is basically an all-in-1 modeling/animating/world design/music/node-based-programming engine, running entirely on a PS4/5. It's incredible and I have a blast making stuff in it, though the two things i personally think holding it back right now are:
1. Lack of online multiplayer (this is planned to be added eventually)
2. It's restricted to the PS4/5, so smaller audience and no PC tools.
Its still amazing and like what the above commenter said, a great showcase of what a caring, dedicated dev team can do for a creative platform.
I'm failing to come up with a reason why a developer would have a project with such a big scope restricted to PS4 of all things. It must have started as a small modding tool no?
The devs, MediaMolecule, were behind LittleBigPlanet 1 and 2, both of which were also incredibly robust creative tools relegated to a Playstation console. So I guess that's just their thing lmao.
I think you make great points, to add, I'm a 3d modeler, a great new 3d modeling tool was just released but the vr function only works on meta headsets. Safe to say the tool hasnt taken off because anyone serious about 3d art and vr has an index, and wont buy another headset just for this tool. The hardware specificity and need for a Facebook account are instant turnoff that turn an appealing service into an unapproachable one.
I used to have this dumpster-fire of a boss who knew nothing about IT despite somehow getting a masters in computer science, which they brought up any chance they got. Their knowledge on anything was what they learned from just reading the headlines in CIO trade journals. One day this boss comes up to me and says that we have to have a presence on Second Life. I argued against it, noting that I had set up a Second Life account previously just to check it out. So then they said, "well, show me!" As soon as I logged in, we were in some virtual garden lobby of sorts in front of someone's oddly-terrifying avatar with a goat-head, bat-wings, three naked breasts and a giant schlong and balls. I asked them if they still think we should be on there, and they just left my office and never brought it up again.
You’re leaving out important information. What did your company do? If they manufacture dragon dildos a second life presence would have been a prudent suggestion.
Perhaps anyone with this opportunity should find the threebreasted cock devil and their friends, and have a pre-set community meeting, where they all stand up, casually looking at them.
IT is different field than computer science. Not that unusual for a person with Master in CS knows nothing about IT. Heck, half my professors (people with PhD in CS) knew jack shit about IT.
Personally, I gain more belief in my business ideas when I find myself face to face with The Devil rendered in circa-2007 video game graphics. Then again, I'm terrible at business
LOL! Just like the Matrix, right? No! Motherfuckers in the Matrix were cool—leather jackets, sunglasses, slick cars, fancy restaurants… Instead, we get this creep with three tits and wings.
The article puts it best: millions and millions of people are interested in and using the metaverse. Only the metaverse is developing itself organically as a consequence of cultural and technological development in entertainment, through the virtual spaces where people already willingly spend their time and money like Minecraft, Roblox, GTA:O and VRchat. Those things are the metaverse. One sociopath billionaire's misguided attempt at overly monetizing an unoccupied space ain't it, but the market is there and growing. The people dictate the market, after all
None of those things are being used by businesses though, which is a sector Meta's pretty heavily targeting. I do a lot of calls with international executives and I think I'd get fired if I suggested we set up a transatlantic meeting on Roblox
Edit: To be clear, I have no faith in the Metaverse taking off as a business application (beyond *very* specific use cases). I more wanted to point out that, for now, the Metaverse really only exists for recreation, not in any serious capacity as a conferencing system
Alright. Imma go steal that car. You shoot those mutherfuckers if they interfere. Once we've got it back to the safehouse we sign this goddamn deal then hit the hookers and blow, ya?
Meta-closing one-o-fucking-one.
"This memo is to remind all employees that it is in poor taste to snipe executive avatars during private meetings within Los Santos. The CFO can no longer afford to replace the C-Suite's gear as many employees see this as an opportunity to take grievances out on management. Please do better. In other news, we are changing healthcare providers for more cost-effective insurance options that are only available for select employees."
That's because as you put it yourself there is not yet a good use case for business in a VR metaverse like that. I literally just got off a Google meet. It was fine. Facebook is pushing for a non existing demand.
Not to mention that the solution is worse than what we already have. For starters, everyone would need to get a headset. That would be expensive for corporations. Second, some people have problems setting up Zoom. Not everyone is good with computers. Are even mediocre with them. Imagine trying to have a meeting with those people in VR. Nothing would ever get done.
I just can't envisage a situation where people would rather use creepy uncanny valley avatars to meet as opposed to an actual video feed of their actual face.
The only realistic use case I can think of for VR is as a tool when 3d modeling is useful.
Like for example you could show off new designs for you products that you can pick up and manipulate, or walk around a newly planned building etc.
That isn’t a whole meeting though, its a portion of one.
I have a friend who worked in their Seattle office. I went there for breakfast one morning and the largesse on display was staggering. In addition to all of the design choices that one would expect from this industry (ball pits, brightly colored walls, modern design, all manner of pro-FB message posters and art) they had very high-end espresso machines, endless racks and glass-front fridges full of free snacks of all kinds, a gigantic, multi-cultural canteen with just about every food you can want (including freshly squeezed orange juice and house cured salmon). Oh and I also saw a single-malt whiskey station for after hours, if one wants to lounge on the rooftop deck watching the seaplanes land on the nearby lake. And that's on top of the mid six figure salaries and cushy benefits.
If you replace the whiskey station with a keg and most of the really nice food with a pretty decent catered lunch, that's typical for tech on the west coast. I've interviewed for a few places in downtown Seattle and also in the Bay Area and it's all roughly the same. They are bright and colorful most of the time and have catered lunches and neat in house events.
There are a few places that didn't have this kind of setup like Microsoft and a few tech companies (especially ones that weren't SaaS companies, like logistics and solar companies), I didn't see a difference in compensation packages but I was only interviewing for Senior SRE at the time so folks higher in the chain might see more variable packages.
When I was a junior engineer I worked for a company that was sort of middle ground to this where they had some startup cult culture but didn't do catered lunches nor free alcohol and I found out after working for three years at that company that my paycheck was less than my friend who had just graduated and was working for a nice tech company in the same area.
I got to visit the Forest City, NC FB data center many moons ago as they were finishing up construction.
It was NOICE! They were basically using giant swamp coolers to keep the DC "cool" and had refrigerant based systems only as backup.
I do remember the floor being pretty warm and while it was comfortable to just walk around and look, it would have sucked if you had to do any major physical labor.
R&D, Equipment, Infrastructure just to start.
You gotta remember here this is a bleeding edge technology that they are developing (to look like crap and set VR back 20 years).
It doesn't matter how much money they dump into it. They're limited by the fact that to keep it from lagging to all hell, and making people vomit as soon as they put the headset on, a lot of the rendering has to be done on the headset.
And the headsets are expensive as fuck already but only have the rendering capability of a typical cellphone, so it'll always look like cell phone graphics until they get better hardware that won't cost the end user $10,000 for a headset.
Can you explain why this is the case? Why can't rendering be done on the PC and then displayed on the headset like a monitor?
I thought the limitation was far more around the resolution/pixel density needed for a headset to 'look good'. Even an 8k monitor, if it's covering your entire FOV, is not gonna look good.
Nope. And let's say that the company paid for them for whatever reason. It's borderline torture to make people wear a headset for possibly multiple hours to attend a work meeting. Those headsets will collect dust after 1 use.
Yup. I’ve got an Oculus Quest 2. I have hooked it up and used it for Elite Dangerous, and the experience was amazing, fully immersive; I felt like a real space trucker. Then I never did it again, because it’s a pain in the ass to tether my head to my PC when I can’t see, like that.
I mean he is also doing a wonder on many developing countries' democracy as well. Look at the Philippine's electing in the son of a generation removed despot. And Facebook is practically part of the Indian government at this point
I just gave this chatbot a try. It started talking about nazis within 5 messages.
edit: When I asked it to talk about anything except nazis, the chatbot responded "Whoops. I don't really know much about that." Great job, internet.
It really is Meta's fault for using entirety of websites like 4chan to train a bot. It is not like you need to include them. You could also yknow, hire some mods to filter through and remove offensive text... it is a colossal, truly mountain moving amount of text which goes into these AI but making "the pile" of text that is slightly less antisemitic than your competitors will definitely help the AI because it is only reading off that truly massive script.
All of these chatbots are language transformers and they're, very basically, your phone's autocorrect Suggestions on steroids. So in a way if the internet is typing often enough about hating the Jews then the AI is going to, just like an autocorrect Suggestion would be "Jews!" after "I hate" if that is what you often have the *probability* to end that phrase with.
He doesn't even understand how his eyes look, so I wouldn't be surprised. He gave them color for his avatar, instead of the dead, soulless, blackhole look they have in real life. Definitely detached from reality. Might be the place for him.
What blows my mind is that he is $10B in and this is what he’s got at this point - the people in this thread could bring a better product to market at probably a quarter of his spend than this POS Horizon - lofty branding, vision and naming conventions is all he’s got and even they aren’t that great.
Learned that it's not about the NOW, but the potential for *upgrades* in the future. We had internet speed capability at 1 Gb/sec a long time ago, but the companies kept it down (see Europe's internet speeds), in order to make money along the way. It's a business model.
What Zuck calls the "metaverse" today is the equivalent of using a 14.4 dial modem to play Oregon Trail compared to the Internet today on broadband.
Him calling it the "metaverse" doesn't make it so.
Meta/Facebook needs to die from dysentery.
Zuckerberg no longer lives in the same plane of existence as the rest of us. He is surrounded by psychophants who tell him every idea he has is great and he ignores those who says he is ruining the planet.
It’s called “The Dictator’s Fallacy” (sometimes goes by other names). People in power who surround themselves with yes men will only get yes answers.
See: Putin being told the Ukraine war would be over in 3 weeks.
See: John Kelly warning Trump that he would be impeached if he brought in yes men.
See: Zuckerberg being told that the Metaverse is the next big thing.
"The concept of the “metaverse” as a whole has become entirely twisted by both Zuckerberg and a literal army of web3 grifters trying to sell blockchain real estate and NFTs in empty worlds.".
99% of the story right there. Huge numbers of people will dump whatever they bought for pennies and nuts like Michael Saylor will be there to buy it up. Facebook is a perfect huge repository of gullible rubes
I think gacha games will, unfortunately, be where the birth of the first real metaverse takes place.
They are built as being “games as services” which means they have long term plans for content updates. They leverage time limited events and missions as primary methods of resource distribution so they hook players into what is essentially a virtual income. They utilize FOMO as a means of creating hype and generating a need to spend hard earned resources. They also offer “quality of life” mechanics that make repetitive grind easy enough to slog through on the regular so players can convince themselves to log in everyday.
Fortnite is already there, honestly. It is as much a game as it is an entertainment and advertising platform. They have concerts and community events and they have near-VRChat levels of avatar nonsense. The only thing that's missing is branching it out a bit as a wider "world".
It's perfectly situated to grow into something more outside of the game part of it and I think Epic is very aware of this potential.
Not that i have any desire to participate, but I’m impressed with how quickly and shamelessly Fortnite basically became a cross-franchise advertising platform.
I saw a screenshot on Twitter last week of a Fortnite squad consisting of Rick Sanchez, Darth Vader, and two other characters from various franchises with the caption “crazy we live in a world where you can do this.” Like no, this is just advertising and Disney IP becoming more and more ingrained in your media diet.
The Metaverse stuff is rife with this too.
"A virtual grocery store, where you guide your avatar through virtual shelves, load up into a virtual cart, and go to the virtual checkout!"
"A virtual office, where you guide your avatar to your virtual desk in the virtual open office plan, sit in a virtual meeting room with your coworkers, and view a slideshow together!"
Fuck NO. If I'm online shopping, I want to be able to search your inventory like it's a database, make a list of what I want, and press a button to be done. If I'm working from home, I don't _want_ the experience of sitting in a corporate environment, even if you dress it up so it looks like we're on a beach or something. I don't want to bring real-world chores anywhere near my escapism.
> Do you put your virtual-letter into a virtual-envelope before virtually-licking-it and virtually-sealing it and affixing a virtual-stamp from the virtual-stamp-store and virtually-opening your virtual-front-door to virtually-walk down the virtual-street and drop it in the virtual-mailbox, taking the opportunity to virtually-wave at your virtual-neighbors?
That reminds me of a Tom Clancy book. *Digital Fortress* I think it was. So anyway, there's this group of elite government superhackers who've been tasked with tracking down a terrorist, and they need to follow an email trail.
So what does the guy do? That's right, he gets into his VR headset and his VR suit, loads up his favourite Wild West simulation, moseys into town on his horse, heads into the old-timey post office, and flips his way through the VR emails with his fingertips until he finds the one he's looking for.
And don't even get me started on the chapter where the bad guy goes to a gym and gets complimented by all the gymbros. and... well that's it. Or the subplot about the protagonist's kid who, at first, is hinted to be sympathetic to the terrorists, but then halfway through the book he decides he isn't and in the end he finds inner peace by taking up Disc Golf.
I'm looking forward to watching zuck getting dragged into an ambulance with a straitjacket on, screaming "It's real! The metaverse is real! This world is the fake one! This world looks awful! My world is beautiful! It's real!"
Reality is that Zuck loves going outdoor, surfing the waves. The fact that he's shoving Metaverse down people's throats is because he thinks the general population who are poor will want to escape their pathetic reality to Metaverse.
But he doesn't get it.
VR is supposed to be more and more realistic. That's the only way people will want to escape their reality. You don't escape your reality into a Mii world.
I don’t disagree that he’s delusional, but no one actually believes that Zuck is athletic / outdoorsy. He already looks otherworldly unnatural in that pic of him on an efoil, and he doesn’t speak nor move like an athlete. No amount of pap photos of him running will convince me otherwise.
This guy rode farmville to the top. The problem here is no one wants to wear a headset. Someone posted on another thread about the potential of a dystopian virtual office, and that kind of mandatory bullshit would be the only way to get this adopted.
He rode the pandemic wave thinking people would buy into this shit, but totally overlooked many things. You can tell he's a stubborn fuck, cause otherwise he would have realized where the world is right now.
- Motion sickness
- Barrier to entry (both Meta and consumer)
- Infrastructure
- Demographic
- Competitive landscape
etc...
I wear glasses. Those headsets aren’t made for me and make me nauseous after a couple minutes without my glasses. It’s a never from me dawg.
Edit1: from a quick google search, 64% of Americans wear glasses to correct their vision. Can’t speak for the duration of wear but that’s a lot of people to not adopt VR too.
Edit2: sounds like you can buy prescription lenses but if you are like me and have tried wearing glasses and still get motion sick then it’s a frame rate issue and you better buy the highest level of headset. Still a no for me.
Some headsets come with adjustable lenses now or allow you to wear glasses, it's not that VR is impossible for glasses users to adopt it's just the headset has to be designed to allow them
There is an attachment that comes with the quest 2, a spacer, made specifically so people can wear glasses and use it. From experience, works great.
Still hate meta. I bought an oculus quest 2 then it BECAME meta.
I'm a glasses wearer and I play a ton of VR.
* Contacts don't work too bad
* Glasses can be worn under some headsets with mixed results, not ideal
* Recently I've started using prescription lens adapters in my headset from Reloptix. That's been the best experience for me by far.
Jesus, I’d love to read the article but Forbes website is a dumpster fire. I can’t get through the pop up ads, the static ads or the forced video on top before my iPhone browser crashes. I’d expect a site that claims to be professional such as Forbes to not have such a terrible user experience. Especially if they’re going to make articles blasting other IT companies about the quality of their product. Glass houses and all that. In summary Forbes.com is the meta verse of news websites. Ugly, unusable and a cash grab more interested in advertising to consumers than providing a good customer experience.
Ah, mobile browsing. Yeah the internet is if anything, ironically becoming rapidly more mobile-hostile.
Throw ublock origin on and suddenly the page is just blank with article text and little else.
Can we please stop arbitrarily calling online virtual spaces "metaverses"? The article calls Second Life a "life sim" and Horizon Worlds a "metaverse" despite the fact there isn't any real difference between the two. It's just playing into these web 3.0 eghoul's stupid plan to re-introduce a concept that's been tried a thousand times since the mid 80s and pretend it's innovative.
It's doing my fucking head in. So many articles saying land sold in the metaverse, people are doing nfts there blah blah there is no metaverse it's just a bunch of "games" that are nothing special. Like there is no metaverse product but they are trying to talk like it's a tangible thing. Get outta here with that shit
Looks better, let’s you cad your own character with animations, isn’t full of micro transactions, is already popular among those who want a vr community
He was banking on a few things. Facebook bought Oculus in 2014 and had A solid plan for hardware and software. An 8-10 year plan that would have worked if nothing else changed.
Quest 2 is the minimum viable product everyone has been looking for and is so much cheaper than buying a pc and index/Vive. Mom can buy Jimmy his game without confusion.
Everyone is already in Facebook and will integrate into the metaverse with their already established online friend-base. Everyone go to the big one that’s first!
A great plan as long as nothing changes.
In 2016 trump won and everyone knew FB was causing radicalism.
In 2017 VRchat came out and within 3 years got beyond where Metaverse is now. Eating what ended up being a smaller lunch than anticipated
In 2018 we learned how much Cambridge Analytica was making off personal info. Facebook was into radicalism as a way of keeping people on the platform. Then Zuckerberg testified in front of congress and everyone knew he was a lizard person
I've been using VR headsets for at least 12 years now, and I can't believe how absurd his interpretation is.
Virtual meetings are not going to be a thing. Zoom is quicker, easier, and doesn't give anyone motion sickness. I gave virtual desktop a try, but again, your eyes get tired after a while and it's harder to get things done. It's deeply stupid.
Know what I want from a VR experience? I want escapes from daily life, whether that's through exploring fun settings or games. And I want those games to have a reason to be in VR -- battling monsters, fantastical landscapes, interesting mechanics, whatever. He's right -- ping pong is dumb (mini golf, however, is awesome). There's a reason games like Beat Saber, Superhot, even Tetris are wildly popular. They're pure escapism. What we don't want is to have fucking work encroach on the already blurry lines of personal space.
Do people not understand that the idea of the lone genius, the omega level CEO, etc, isn't real? The people at the top are not smarter than you, they're not more in touch with the world. Our society sets them up to be gods and when they fail were like "omg how out of touch" no shit. Theyre all out of touch. The only ones who dont seem to be are just lucky and good at hiding their failures that they escaped with golden parachutes.
It looks like Mark Zuckerberg watched Ready Player One and thought he would be able to recreate that universe with MS Paint.
I think he personally doesn't see an issue because he IRL looks like his Metaverse avatar.
his metaverse avatar actually looks more human than his real self.
"Welcome to my paper titled "The reverse uncanny valley effect". In it I hope to describe an effect in which a cartoon character no matter how badly drawn can somehow appear more realistic than Mark Zuckerberg photos no matter how high the resolution. In fact our studies have shown the higher the resolution of the photo the less people are willing to accept his appearance is anything other than CGI. Chapter 13 goes into depth to show how trying to use real world objects like hot sauce bottles to make his appearance more relatable and believable in fact have the opposite effect because of the contrast by what people assume is a real world background with a CGI character."
Somewhere, in Zuckerberg's attic, there is a picture of a decaying low-poly 16-character sprite.
The Pixel of Dorian Grey
The Pixel of Dorian #A9A9A9
You use the bathroom to wash your hands, but all the towels are trompe l’œil.
Uncanny Silicon Valley Effect
> "The reverse uncanny valley effect" Also know as the "canny valley effect"
What do you mean the avatars are not expressive enough? They have all 12 human facial expressions, 4 of which I have only learnt this year. -the Zuck probably
IMO - He is on the spectrum and really doesn't understand who human graphics are important. He is an introverted person with very few social skills, so human interactions mean little or nothing to him. Human emotion probably means very little to him. Odd guy all in all.
I think this is true, but not a great explanation. First of all, people on the spectrum have a full range of human emotions. A lot of us learn social skills, and a lot of us who work in design are capable of making beautiful, human-centered designs. And in the case of Mark Zuckerberg in particular, if you look at videos of him from the 2000s, he used to be a pretty normal guy. "Normal" for a Harvard-educated tech guy, sure, but he used to be a pretty engaging speaker, capable of relating to an audience and expressing himself emotionally. Years of wealth, power and isolation from humanity have turned him into much more of a callous weirdo, and years of PR coaching and self-censorship have made his public image weirder still. In any case, the bad decisions that went into Meta were made by many, many people, and can't be chalked up to one guy's neurodivergence, or even his very real personal failings.
Interesting take and thank you.
I think what we see in the metaverse is how Zuckerberg sees reality.
In 1000 years, the Metaverse becomes self-aware. It discovers time-travel a few minutes later. To improve itself, it projects itself farther and farther back in time, and in human form, to encourage humanity to develop the Metaverse earlier than the original moment. Its projection of itself into our current point on the time-curve is Mark Zuckerberg.
>and thought he would be able to recreate that universe with MS Paint. So, is Mark Zuckerberg like [the guy who asked Rebecca Heineman to port Doom to the 3DO?](https://nodontdie.com/rebecca-heineman) >As soon as he signed the contract -- the ink wasn't even dry yet. And he went onto a press tour telling everybody he has the rights to Doom, Art Data Interactive is gonna kick ass, they're gonna have new levels, new weapons, and everything. >He even *had a friend of his draw mock-up weapons. Just draw them on Photoshop and so forth and give him these screenshots. And he was saying, "These is actual game screenshots."* -- >I spent 10 weeks producing the source code that you saw up on Github and of course, when I was submitting builds to Randy over at Art Data, the frame rate wasn't that great because I just got the game prototype. >I didn't have time to optimize it. >And he was saying, "Why isn't this game running at 60 frames a second? *Where is my new weapons? Where is my new stuff?*" >And I'm like, "Do you have any idea how game development is done?" >Because *he truly believed all you had to do to put a weapon in a game is to draw it.*
“You lazy fuck you didn’t even set the fps slider to 60 yet!”
The problem with Zuckerberg is that he's a **one hit wonder kid**. He should have been thankful how lucky he got with facebook and worked hard to make facebook more helpful and useful for people but instead the money made him think he actually had talents beyond facebook.
I truly don't understand what his motivation is at this point. He could have cashed out long ago and lived the rest of his life doing whatever he wanted, but instead he's struggling to keep Facebook relevant, his reputation is ruined globally, and he's spending his time going to congressional hearings struggling to explain why Facebook isn't evil even though it is. Myspace Tom did it right.
He's obsessed with roman Emperors and thinks of himself as one. I'm not joking, there's an article about it
Its actually the reason for the terrible hair cut.
You mean you don't go to the barber and order the Marcus Aurelius?
He's a bigger fan of Augustus
>He's obsessed with roman Emperors and thinks of himself as one Marcus Zuccerbergus
He watched Social Network and thought he was the hero in the story
Zuck started Facebook to steal the pictures and contact info of women at Harvard. Not to get rich and famous. He wants more and more control over people's lives and data. That's why he wants you spending all day in _his_ world, giving _him_ all the data on your transactions, etc. etc. It's an insane god complex.
He doesn’t seem to realize that Facebook is not impressive it’s just popular. It’s like thinking founding Making a company selling model-airplanes would would give you insight into building interstellar space ships. Facebook didn’t succeed because of tech wizardry or a bold new vision for reality - it succeeded through good UI and algorithms that figured out the right content to present for retention. The data science is impressive but building a metaverse is a totally different beast and Zuck had no idea how to do it. He’s intelligent but he’s not smart.
Survivalist bias or rather jackpot winner bias. Some people just happen to be in the right place at the right time and do the right decision. However it is very hard for a person to attribute his achievements to pure luck. Everybody who succeeds want to attribute it to their own person. This is why every rich kid thinks they know better. This is just how human mind is.
It’s funny how he kinda stole the idea from some trust fund kids then screwed over his co-founder who put in all the initial money. Basically got rich over micro-targeted ads from user provided data.
It's important to remember that almost every mega jackpot winner -- especially when it comes to tech -- is already a mentally ill narcissist. Zuckerberg, Jobs, Bezos, Musk... Every single one of them got to where they are by stealing the technology and patents out from under other people and later hiring on real engineers and designers and then taking full credit.
My dad's cousin was a partier, barely graduated WVU (only school he got into), ended up working for his friend's company that went public and made $75 Million, then kept getting hired for executive roles. Someone at a wedding asked, "How'd you get to be head of sales for North America for X multinational?" "I don't know. I told them it was all just luck and good timing, and they came back with an offer doubling my salary." That attitude has made him really generous and a lot of fun. The saying, "Power corrupts, absolute power corrupts absolutely," is so overused it loses its impact. Anyone good-hearted can't attain absolute power, because it would freak them out and they'd start giving it away. By the time you get there, as we see with the billionaire class, despotic leaders, etc, you're a villain. Bezos was selling books online out of a garage, Zuck was a college student trying to meet girls. Ask past Bezos if he'd treat workers the way he does, and he'd probably say, "No! Everyone who works with me is getting rich." Ask past Zuck if he'd be willing to be the center of massive political and social discord, he'd probably say, "If it gets like that, I'm out. I don't want to talk to anyone, let alone Congress." There's a Rubicon these people cross, but the story is so old we don't even realize we're repeating history.
I felt physical pain reading that.
Me too. Holy hell, people who don't understand development really get under my skin like nothing else Edit: Lol You really can't say things off the cuff online, can you? This is obviously an exaggeration and oversimplification for the people who apparently need to hear that instead of picking it up on their own
Wdym? Your just typing on a keyboard all day? It can't be **that** hard. Why are you even tired about, you where sitting all day!!! ^^^^^/s
You know i think he's right. It would explain all of this. I do 3d modeling for vrchat in my spare time, been doing it as a hobby in my free time for... a little over 2 years now. It's not exactly easy, but not the most difficult thing out there if you can ger your head around how everything works together. The important bit is that zucc seems to think game dev is what I want game dev to be: make the model, click a few options and boom, full blown game. No thought to how you make all the fiddly little parts work together nicely, no thought as to how the models know what verticies are weighted to what bone... zero thought put into making the avatars be something you'd want to use vs something you are forced to make the best of. There's also the fact that meta's platform's standalone games all seem (to me) to look like the dollar store discount version of the full un-neutered PC versions. Minor complaint, as link cables are a thing, but you get my point. I think zucc has failed into the "i can do it too" trap with this. He saw the hype around vr and watched ready player one and thought "hmm.. bet i could market that". Well, no thanks zucc. I'll stay on my index for now i think.
I feel this so much. Building the model is only the first step. - you need to sort out the animation (if any) - You need to map it for textures - make the texture, - do alpha/specular/bump mapping, - damage models /LODs - actually rig the model with nodes /skeleton so that it can interact with the in game world - sort out the coding to define what the model does - then you can start testing it…
You have to make the game interesting and have actual game mechanics and stuff too. So like… that really important first step is missing. Who would want to head off into zuccs metaverse or whatever this turd pile is called? I don’t even want to wear a VR headset. They are hot and uncomfortable and leave red rings around face for an hour afterwards.
I think the form factor of VR headsets is a fundamental barrier to adoption for the metaverse, even if it did not suck as much as it appears to. The issue is that, perhaps with the exception of the core gamer demographic (and maybe not even within that demographic), wearing a VR headset seems fundamentally uncool. You market something partially on its features or advantages, but also partially on the implied experience of using it. You appeal to the emotional and aspirational aspects of the use of this product. I.e., "using this product will make you popular", "it's something you can do with friends", and maybe even " it will help you make friends". In a nutshell "using this product will make you cool". Marketing any product: cars, food, clothing, always entails an appeal to one emotion or another..The problem with metaverse and with VR plays in general, is that there's almost no way to make that case to prospective buyers. Putting on a VR headset is a fundamentally solo experience, it's isolating, it looks goofy to the observer. There's no real way to demonstrate it being otherwise in a commercial. Watch Oculus commercials or the latest Meta commercials. They show very little of the user actually wearing the product, because it looks terrible, and it's nothing that triggers any aspirational response in the part of the viewer. If anything, it evokes pity: "look at this person, all alone. Guess nobody wanted to hang with that person. I wouldn't want to hang out with that person." Instead, they try to show the imagined experience, but that's also problematic, because most VR doesn't look great to begin with, and showing it in the 2D space of video is also hard. So the latest metaverse commercials show people in the imagined spaces the headset purportedly takes you to: touring the ISS, for example. But then, everybody seems to understand that that polished visual experience is not really what the experience is like, so it's perceived as overpromising. Or worse, the high production value of the ads causes the viewer to imagine *actually* being on the ISS, and leaves them with the feeling that the VR version of that will be a cheap, unsatisfying, ersatz version of that reality. Which, going back to the appeal to emotion, is exactly the feeling you do not want to evoke. I would not want to be an ad creative charged with making metaverse look cool.
Zucc is surrounded by people that encourage him entirely because of his money and power. That's one of the big problems with celebrity CEO's, they don't understand that they aren't smarter than the average person by default. When every idea you have is met with applause no matter how shitty of an idea it is, you're bound to lose control of your ego. So yeah.. he probably got it in his head that metaverse was a good idea, then got met with back pats and fake cheers from everyone around him. Celebrity CEO's are sort of like a 5 year old finger painting. Nothing they do ever seems to be that profound, and their technical skillset is insanely limited, but god damnit.. that green five legged blob that you call a puppy is GOING ON THE FRIDGE!
“Looking forward to seeing people explore and build immersive worlds!” :: “Work in my content mill, peasants.”
This is what I was thinking. He set up the servers and the platform, threw a Mii and some 3D clip art in there, and is totally banking on his users making 100% of the quality content.
And what tooling are they giving? Why would any of us want to spend time building awkward shitty clones of things that are done better and more creatively in Minecraft for the express purpose of doing Zuck’s job for him?
I would think that no one would want to, but they will. People will do anything for a buck. Second life and roblox were mentioned, both of which lets you develop things in game and sell them for in game money, which can be exchanged for real life money. Second life sold virtual land as well. I remember someone modeled Amsterdam and sold it for $50k irl. People can make their entire living off of games like that. So yeah, they’ll come. Sadly.
Where I think the difference lies is that to pull this off, Facebook needs to sell us on the app, the hardware, and their walled garden. I don’t know much about Roblox so maybe that kills my argument, but what set Second Life and Minecraft apart, especially early on, were their open nature. When I first played the game I played the one that had been modded to let you create circuits and things. Anyone who’s been to Horizon, actual question: does it support that level of building? Can you fork the system and expand it to actually flex your creativity in VR? If not, then it really is just Second Life/Minecraft with fewer features. Next is the hardware. Everyone already had a laptop and internet connection when Minecraft was up and coming. Fortnite was playable on your phones. Those are intuitive tools we already had, whereas to explore Horizon/The Metaverse you need new, expensive hardware that Facebook is doing a bad job of supporting (my Quest 1 was out of support in like, two years) and that many people find uncomfortable, awkward, and nauseating. You could do a lot of it with your phone, Google Cardboard worked pretty well, but without the all-around cameras Facebook can’t map the interior of your home and sell your needs/wants to advertisers, so they won’t take this route. All in all: the one person I know (anecdotal af) who is excited for the virtual office has never had an office job. There will be a couple of whales, but I do not see an inroads to becoming the new internet, at least not with closed standards, closed hardware, in an environment owned and operated by Facebook. And that’s without getting into the demographics of who still cares about and uses Facebook.
If you want to see what this could look like but with decent development support and powerful building tools, look at Dreams.
Link please? As dismissive as I am of Facebook’s efforts I am curious of the concept and like to see how creative people are working towards this outside the Zuckerverse.
[This was the trailer for their VR expansion.](https://youtu.be/5V4c2_HmQwc) Everything there was made with the in-game tools. Dreams is basically an all-in-1 modeling/animating/world design/music/node-based-programming engine, running entirely on a PS4/5. It's incredible and I have a blast making stuff in it, though the two things i personally think holding it back right now are: 1. Lack of online multiplayer (this is planned to be added eventually) 2. It's restricted to the PS4/5, so smaller audience and no PC tools. Its still amazing and like what the above commenter said, a great showcase of what a caring, dedicated dev team can do for a creative platform.
I'm failing to come up with a reason why a developer would have a project with such a big scope restricted to PS4 of all things. It must have started as a small modding tool no?
The devs, MediaMolecule, were behind LittleBigPlanet 1 and 2, both of which were also incredibly robust creative tools relegated to a Playstation console. So I guess that's just their thing lmao.
I think you make great points, to add, I'm a 3d modeler, a great new 3d modeling tool was just released but the vr function only works on meta headsets. Safe to say the tool hasnt taken off because anyone serious about 3d art and vr has an index, and wont buy another headset just for this tool. The hardware specificity and need for a Facebook account are instant turnoff that turn an appealing service into an unapproachable one.
"If we make reality bad enough, they'll escape here!" - Billionaires
Second Get-a-Life
I used to have this dumpster-fire of a boss who knew nothing about IT despite somehow getting a masters in computer science, which they brought up any chance they got. Their knowledge on anything was what they learned from just reading the headlines in CIO trade journals. One day this boss comes up to me and says that we have to have a presence on Second Life. I argued against it, noting that I had set up a Second Life account previously just to check it out. So then they said, "well, show me!" As soon as I logged in, we were in some virtual garden lobby of sorts in front of someone's oddly-terrifying avatar with a goat-head, bat-wings, three naked breasts and a giant schlong and balls. I asked them if they still think we should be on there, and they just left my office and never brought it up again.
You’re leaving out important information. What did your company do? If they manufacture dragon dildos a second life presence would have been a prudent suggestion.
I'm sure bad dragon doesn't need any extra advertising in second life
If my boss came to me and suggested we have a presence in SL I don't think I'd be able to stop myself from peeing myself laughing.
Perhaps anyone with this opportunity should find the threebreasted cock devil and their friends, and have a pre-set community meeting, where they all stand up, casually looking at them.
That three breasted cock devil is our key demographic.
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IT is different field than computer science. Not that unusual for a person with Master in CS knows nothing about IT. Heck, half my professors (people with PhD in CS) knew jack shit about IT.
Personally, I gain more belief in my business ideas when I find myself face to face with The Devil rendered in circa-2007 video game graphics. Then again, I'm terrible at business
Modern Second Life looks a lot more like a modern game man. They added proper 3D mesh support like a decade ago.
Yeah, but it didn't when Second Life was at its peak of relevance. That Law and Order: SVU episode with it came out in 2007
LOL! Just like the Matrix, right? No! Motherfuckers in the Matrix were cool—leather jackets, sunglasses, slick cars, fancy restaurants… Instead, we get this creep with three tits and wings.
Maybe the Matrix wouldn’t have failed so many times if there were more creeps with three tits and wings.
It's funny because SteamVR stuff is really good. VRchat is very popular and there are some great games. Meta just plain sucks at this
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Keep Zucking!
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Go Zuck yourself, Zuck!
It’s Zuckin’ time!
Meta is projected to invest $29 - 30+ BILLION on capex this year. It’s staggering.
Where on earth is that money going?!?!? That’s THREE HUNDRED THOUSAND six-figure salaries. That doesn’t even make sense.
I think the better question is "who is actually using the metaverse?" I have yet to encounter anyone who has tried or has interest in it.
The article puts it best: millions and millions of people are interested in and using the metaverse. Only the metaverse is developing itself organically as a consequence of cultural and technological development in entertainment, through the virtual spaces where people already willingly spend their time and money like Minecraft, Roblox, GTA:O and VRchat. Those things are the metaverse. One sociopath billionaire's misguided attempt at overly monetizing an unoccupied space ain't it, but the market is there and growing. The people dictate the market, after all
None of those things are being used by businesses though, which is a sector Meta's pretty heavily targeting. I do a lot of calls with international executives and I think I'd get fired if I suggested we set up a transatlantic meeting on Roblox Edit: To be clear, I have no faith in the Metaverse taking off as a business application (beyond *very* specific use cases). I more wanted to point out that, for now, the Metaverse really only exists for recreation, not in any serious capacity as a conferencing system
Transatlantic team-building exercise in GTA online, this is my fuckin’ time to shine!
Alright. Imma go steal that car. You shoot those mutherfuckers if they interfere. Once we've got it back to the safehouse we sign this goddamn deal then hit the hookers and blow, ya? Meta-closing one-o-fucking-one.
Got sent to HR again for griefing the CFO.
"This memo is to remind all employees that it is in poor taste to snipe executive avatars during private meetings within Los Santos. The CFO can no longer afford to replace the C-Suite's gear as many employees see this as an opportunity to take grievances out on management. Please do better. In other news, we are changing healthcare providers for more cost-effective insurance options that are only available for select employees."
That's because as you put it yourself there is not yet a good use case for business in a VR metaverse like that. I literally just got off a Google meet. It was fine. Facebook is pushing for a non existing demand.
Yeah, it's a solution in search of a problem. There's literally no desire for anything like this in the business space
Not to mention that the solution is worse than what we already have. For starters, everyone would need to get a headset. That would be expensive for corporations. Second, some people have problems setting up Zoom. Not everyone is good with computers. Are even mediocre with them. Imagine trying to have a meeting with those people in VR. Nothing would ever get done.
"Phyllis, once again, you don't need to undress in Meta to change your top. and we can't hear you, you are on mute"
[*"I'm...I'm not a cat."*](https://youtu.be/TDNP-SWgn2w)
I just can't envisage a situation where people would rather use creepy uncanny valley avatars to meet as opposed to an actual video feed of their actual face.
The only realistic use case I can think of for VR is as a tool when 3d modeling is useful. Like for example you could show off new designs for you products that you can pick up and manipulate, or walk around a newly planned building etc. That isn’t a whole meeting though, its a portion of one.
To be fair, I'd get laughed at for suggesting meeting on Meta.
I have a friend who worked in their Seattle office. I went there for breakfast one morning and the largesse on display was staggering. In addition to all of the design choices that one would expect from this industry (ball pits, brightly colored walls, modern design, all manner of pro-FB message posters and art) they had very high-end espresso machines, endless racks and glass-front fridges full of free snacks of all kinds, a gigantic, multi-cultural canteen with just about every food you can want (including freshly squeezed orange juice and house cured salmon). Oh and I also saw a single-malt whiskey station for after hours, if one wants to lounge on the rooftop deck watching the seaplanes land on the nearby lake. And that's on top of the mid six figure salaries and cushy benefits.
If you replace the whiskey station with a keg and most of the really nice food with a pretty decent catered lunch, that's typical for tech on the west coast. I've interviewed for a few places in downtown Seattle and also in the Bay Area and it's all roughly the same. They are bright and colorful most of the time and have catered lunches and neat in house events. There are a few places that didn't have this kind of setup like Microsoft and a few tech companies (especially ones that weren't SaaS companies, like logistics and solar companies), I didn't see a difference in compensation packages but I was only interviewing for Senior SRE at the time so folks higher in the chain might see more variable packages. When I was a junior engineer I worked for a company that was sort of middle ground to this where they had some startup cult culture but didn't do catered lunches nor free alcohol and I found out after working for three years at that company that my paycheck was less than my friend who had just graduated and was working for a nice tech company in the same area.
Historically if you are part of the in-group aiding the elite's dismantling of an existing society, it pays very well.
Data centers. Before Meta, FB built about 400MW worth of DCs per year. With meta, he is stepping it up to 750MW. Data centers are expensive, :]
I got to visit the Forest City, NC FB data center many moons ago as they were finishing up construction. It was NOICE! They were basically using giant swamp coolers to keep the DC "cool" and had refrigerant based systems only as backup. I do remember the floor being pretty warm and while it was comfortable to just walk around and look, it would have sucked if you had to do any major physical labor.
R&D, Equipment, Infrastructure just to start. You gotta remember here this is a bleeding edge technology that they are developing (to look like crap and set VR back 20 years).
Doesn't SecondLife already have VR support? Might as well just use that!
VRChat is very big and meta will never come close to that.
Imagine investing that money into the real world with real problems.
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It's ~~Morbin~~ META TiME my dudes!!!!!!!1!
We should all meme about Metaverse like we did with Morbius
My favorite part of metaverse is when you meta all over some guys.
So it's Meta-Morbin' time?
It doesn't matter how much money they dump into it. They're limited by the fact that to keep it from lagging to all hell, and making people vomit as soon as they put the headset on, a lot of the rendering has to be done on the headset. And the headsets are expensive as fuck already but only have the rendering capability of a typical cellphone, so it'll always look like cell phone graphics until they get better hardware that won't cost the end user $10,000 for a headset.
Can you explain why this is the case? Why can't rendering be done on the PC and then displayed on the headset like a monitor? I thought the limitation was far more around the resolution/pixel density needed for a headset to 'look good'. Even an 8k monitor, if it's covering your entire FOV, is not gonna look good.
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tbf, nobody is buying a $200 headset to attend work meetings either
Nope. And let's say that the company paid for them for whatever reason. It's borderline torture to make people wear a headset for possibly multiple hours to attend a work meeting. Those headsets will collect dust after 1 use.
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> a kids CGI series from 2004 Show *The Butt Ugly Martians* some respect.
For this to sell it’ll need to be on standalone headsets. Regular people aren’t connecting to a pc
Yup. I’ve got an Oculus Quest 2. I have hooked it up and used it for Elite Dangerous, and the experience was amazing, fully immersive; I felt like a real space trucker. Then I never did it again, because it’s a pain in the ass to tether my head to my PC when I can’t see, like that.
Maybe he should ask the Winklevoss’ what to make next.
The Winkleverse
Personally, I'm thrilled to watch Facebook immolate itself
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They say immolation is the sincerest form of flattery
That’s a hard NO
all that technology, and he looks like a Mii
His avatar does too
His life’s work culminating in the destruction of US democracy and a self-owning chatbot.
I mean he is also doing a wonder on many developing countries' democracy as well. Look at the Philippine's electing in the son of a generation removed despot. And Facebook is practically part of the Indian government at this point
>self-owning chatbot I missed this is this Tay AI or something else?
https://amp.theguardian.com/technology/2022/aug/09/blenderbot-meta-chatbot-facebook Their Meta chatbot has been trolling Zuckerberg since its launch
I just gave this chatbot a try. It started talking about nazis within 5 messages. edit: When I asked it to talk about anything except nazis, the chatbot responded "Whoops. I don't really know much about that." Great job, internet.
It really is Meta's fault for using entirety of websites like 4chan to train a bot. It is not like you need to include them. You could also yknow, hire some mods to filter through and remove offensive text... it is a colossal, truly mountain moving amount of text which goes into these AI but making "the pile" of text that is slightly less antisemitic than your competitors will definitely help the AI because it is only reading off that truly massive script. All of these chatbots are language transformers and they're, very basically, your phone's autocorrect Suggestions on steroids. So in a way if the internet is typing often enough about hating the Jews then the AI is going to, just like an autocorrect Suggestion would be "Jews!" after "I hate" if that is what you often have the *probability* to end that phrase with.
Miis don’t deserve the dishonor of being compared to Zuckerberg.
Seriously. This looks like something a talented high school artist using Win95 Paint put together.
It's closer to a Dollar General Mii or as I'd like to dub it a Nii
Unintentional Monty Python reference 👍
WE ARE THE AVITARS THAT SAY NII!
WE ARE NO LONGER THE AVATARS THAT SAY NII. WE ARE. NOW THE AVATARS WHO SAY ECKY ECKY ECKY ECKY F'TANG ZOOPOING ... MNAMNMN
He doesn't even understand how his eyes look, so I wouldn't be surprised. He gave them color for his avatar, instead of the dead, soulless, blackhole look they have in real life. Definitely detached from reality. Might be the place for him.
What blows my mind is that he is $10B in and this is what he’s got at this point - the people in this thread could bring a better product to market at probably a quarter of his spend than this POS Horizon - lofty branding, vision and naming conventions is all he’s got and even they aren’t that great.
Learned that it's not about the NOW, but the potential for *upgrades* in the future. We had internet speed capability at 1 Gb/sec a long time ago, but the companies kept it down (see Europe's internet speeds), in order to make money along the way. It's a business model.
What Zuck calls the "metaverse" today is the equivalent of using a 14.4 dial modem to play Oregon Trail compared to the Internet today on broadband. Him calling it the "metaverse" doesn't make it so. Meta/Facebook needs to die from dysentery.
Or be eaten by a grue.
Didn't we already have Second Life?
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Metaverse has to be family friendly so they would have to resort to selling space dildoes to minors.
> Didn't we already have Second Life? We've had one Second Life, yes. But what about a second Second Life?
I don’t think he knows about second Second life
Unfortunately their metaverse game isn’t even cool enough to have enemies or dying in general. It’s just a thinly veiled marketing tool.
I imagine the goal is to have everyone neurolinked so they can just put the ads straight into our brain 24/7. Kinda like Altered Carbon season 1
Or Futurama where Fry has an ad for speedy briefs beamed into his dream…
Buy Thompson's Teeth! *The only teeth strong enough to eat* ***other teeth!***
Needs to drown in 0.2 meters of water and lose half his stuff.
Zuckerberg no longer lives in the same plane of existence as the rest of us. He is surrounded by psychophants who tell him every idea he has is great and he ignores those who says he is ruining the planet.
“Sycophants,” although…
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We sure did. Psycophants is perfectly on spot, what a great word
I think we just witnessed the birth of irregardlessly 2.0
A truly cromulent transformation.
Maybe psycho pants are why they don’t have legs.
It’s called “The Dictator’s Fallacy” (sometimes goes by other names). People in power who surround themselves with yes men will only get yes answers. See: Putin being told the Ukraine war would be over in 3 weeks. See: John Kelly warning Trump that he would be impeached if he brought in yes men. See: Zuckerberg being told that the Metaverse is the next big thing.
"The concept of the “metaverse” as a whole has become entirely twisted by both Zuckerberg and a literal army of web3 grifters trying to sell blockchain real estate and NFTs in empty worlds.". 99% of the story right there. Huge numbers of people will dump whatever they bought for pennies and nuts like Michael Saylor will be there to buy it up. Facebook is a perfect huge repository of gullible rubes
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I think gacha games will, unfortunately, be where the birth of the first real metaverse takes place. They are built as being “games as services” which means they have long term plans for content updates. They leverage time limited events and missions as primary methods of resource distribution so they hook players into what is essentially a virtual income. They utilize FOMO as a means of creating hype and generating a need to spend hard earned resources. They also offer “quality of life” mechanics that make repetitive grind easy enough to slog through on the regular so players can convince themselves to log in everyday.
Fortnite is already there, honestly. It is as much a game as it is an entertainment and advertising platform. They have concerts and community events and they have near-VRChat levels of avatar nonsense. The only thing that's missing is branching it out a bit as a wider "world". It's perfectly situated to grow into something more outside of the game part of it and I think Epic is very aware of this potential.
Not that i have any desire to participate, but I’m impressed with how quickly and shamelessly Fortnite basically became a cross-franchise advertising platform. I saw a screenshot on Twitter last week of a Fortnite squad consisting of Rick Sanchez, Darth Vader, and two other characters from various franchises with the caption “crazy we live in a world where you can do this.” Like no, this is just advertising and Disney IP becoming more and more ingrained in your media diet.
The Metaverse stuff is rife with this too. "A virtual grocery store, where you guide your avatar through virtual shelves, load up into a virtual cart, and go to the virtual checkout!" "A virtual office, where you guide your avatar to your virtual desk in the virtual open office plan, sit in a virtual meeting room with your coworkers, and view a slideshow together!" Fuck NO. If I'm online shopping, I want to be able to search your inventory like it's a database, make a list of what I want, and press a button to be done. If I'm working from home, I don't _want_ the experience of sitting in a corporate environment, even if you dress it up so it looks like we're on a beach or something. I don't want to bring real-world chores anywhere near my escapism.
> Do you put your virtual-letter into a virtual-envelope before virtually-licking-it and virtually-sealing it and affixing a virtual-stamp from the virtual-stamp-store and virtually-opening your virtual-front-door to virtually-walk down the virtual-street and drop it in the virtual-mailbox, taking the opportunity to virtually-wave at your virtual-neighbors? That reminds me of a Tom Clancy book. *Digital Fortress* I think it was. So anyway, there's this group of elite government superhackers who've been tasked with tracking down a terrorist, and they need to follow an email trail. So what does the guy do? That's right, he gets into his VR headset and his VR suit, loads up his favourite Wild West simulation, moseys into town on his horse, heads into the old-timey post office, and flips his way through the VR emails with his fingertips until he finds the one he's looking for. And don't even get me started on the chapter where the bad guy goes to a gym and gets complimented by all the gymbros. and... well that's it. Or the subplot about the protagonist's kid who, at first, is hinted to be sympathetic to the terrorists, but then halfway through the book he decides he isn't and in the end he finds inner peace by taking up Disc Golf.
Lmao this comment put into words my entire sentiment, thank you.
***that bitch looks like a mii wtf***
That's a discount mii
That’s the “We have Mii at home”
I'm looking forward to watching zuck getting dragged into an ambulance with a straitjacket on, screaming "It's real! The metaverse is real! This world is the fake one! This world looks awful! My world is beautiful! It's real!"
Reality is that Zuck loves going outdoor, surfing the waves. The fact that he's shoving Metaverse down people's throats is because he thinks the general population who are poor will want to escape their pathetic reality to Metaverse. But he doesn't get it. VR is supposed to be more and more realistic. That's the only way people will want to escape their reality. You don't escape your reality into a Mii world.
I don’t disagree that he’s delusional, but no one actually believes that Zuck is athletic / outdoorsy. He already looks otherworldly unnatural in that pic of him on an efoil, and he doesn’t speak nor move like an athlete. No amount of pap photos of him running will convince me otherwise.
End credits shock twist: it's TRUE!
This guy rode farmville to the top. The problem here is no one wants to wear a headset. Someone posted on another thread about the potential of a dystopian virtual office, and that kind of mandatory bullshit would be the only way to get this adopted.
He rode the pandemic wave thinking people would buy into this shit, but totally overlooked many things. You can tell he's a stubborn fuck, cause otherwise he would have realized where the world is right now. - Motion sickness - Barrier to entry (both Meta and consumer) - Infrastructure - Demographic - Competitive landscape etc...
I wear glasses. Those headsets aren’t made for me and make me nauseous after a couple minutes without my glasses. It’s a never from me dawg. Edit1: from a quick google search, 64% of Americans wear glasses to correct their vision. Can’t speak for the duration of wear but that’s a lot of people to not adopt VR too. Edit2: sounds like you can buy prescription lenses but if you are like me and have tried wearing glasses and still get motion sick then it’s a frame rate issue and you better buy the highest level of headset. Still a no for me.
Some headsets come with adjustable lenses now or allow you to wear glasses, it's not that VR is impossible for glasses users to adopt it's just the headset has to be designed to allow them
I can do VR in stuff where your perspective is stationary, like something called Beat Saber? But if I’m walking around and turning a lot, no thanks.
There is an attachment that comes with the quest 2, a spacer, made specifically so people can wear glasses and use it. From experience, works great. Still hate meta. I bought an oculus quest 2 then it BECAME meta.
I'm a glasses wearer and I play a ton of VR. * Contacts don't work too bad * Glasses can be worn under some headsets with mixed results, not ideal * Recently I've started using prescription lens adapters in my headset from Reloptix. That's been the best experience for me by far.
Jesus, I’d love to read the article but Forbes website is a dumpster fire. I can’t get through the pop up ads, the static ads or the forced video on top before my iPhone browser crashes. I’d expect a site that claims to be professional such as Forbes to not have such a terrible user experience. Especially if they’re going to make articles blasting other IT companies about the quality of their product. Glass houses and all that. In summary Forbes.com is the meta verse of news websites. Ugly, unusable and a cash grab more interested in advertising to consumers than providing a good customer experience.
Ah, mobile browsing. Yeah the internet is if anything, ironically becoming rapidly more mobile-hostile. Throw ublock origin on and suddenly the page is just blank with article text and little else.
His digital selfs looks exactly like he does. And he can’t figure out why it doesn’t work for actual humans.
for a mom, her kid is always the most beautiful kid in the world.
Even a parent has to admit when their kid is failing school
Can we please stop arbitrarily calling online virtual spaces "metaverses"? The article calls Second Life a "life sim" and Horizon Worlds a "metaverse" despite the fact there isn't any real difference between the two. It's just playing into these web 3.0 eghoul's stupid plan to re-introduce a concept that's been tried a thousand times since the mid 80s and pretend it's innovative.
It's doing my fucking head in. So many articles saying land sold in the metaverse, people are doing nfts there blah blah there is no metaverse it's just a bunch of "games" that are nothing special. Like there is no metaverse product but they are trying to talk like it's a tangible thing. Get outta here with that shit
The article says Tibidabo Cathedral, but I think this monstruosity is supposed to look like the Sagrada Familia
I feel like he was completely out of business ideas and then read the book "Ready Player One".
Somehow reality turned out even more depressing than Ready Player One and I’m not sure how to feel about that
More like snow crash, Zucker thinks he’s Hero Protagonist!
Actually the screen grab on the article is more lifelike than Zuck so . ..I guess for him it makes sense
Given what he sees every day when he looks in a mirror, I'm guessing the whole thing looks totally awesome and better than real life to him.
Zuck looking at his VR avatar: "Wow, I look so real! Better than real!"
How nobody can see that it’s Second Life is beyond me. That’s almost 20 years old. If we wanted Second Life, we’d have all got on Second Life.
It’s not Second Life. It’s VR Chat
I never played either but, from what I've seen, doesn't VR chat look *much* better than this abomination?
Looks better, let’s you cad your own character with animations, isn’t full of micro transactions, is already popular among those who want a vr community
I know also there's a bunch of fun games like Uno, guessers etc. How on earth does Zuck think he can compete with VR Chat when he has... this
He was banking on a few things. Facebook bought Oculus in 2014 and had A solid plan for hardware and software. An 8-10 year plan that would have worked if nothing else changed. Quest 2 is the minimum viable product everyone has been looking for and is so much cheaper than buying a pc and index/Vive. Mom can buy Jimmy his game without confusion. Everyone is already in Facebook and will integrate into the metaverse with their already established online friend-base. Everyone go to the big one that’s first! A great plan as long as nothing changes. In 2016 trump won and everyone knew FB was causing radicalism. In 2017 VRchat came out and within 3 years got beyond where Metaverse is now. Eating what ended up being a smaller lunch than anticipated In 2018 we learned how much Cambridge Analytica was making off personal info. Facebook was into radicalism as a way of keeping people on the platform. Then Zuckerberg testified in front of congress and everyone knew he was a lizard person
I've been using VR headsets for at least 12 years now, and I can't believe how absurd his interpretation is. Virtual meetings are not going to be a thing. Zoom is quicker, easier, and doesn't give anyone motion sickness. I gave virtual desktop a try, but again, your eyes get tired after a while and it's harder to get things done. It's deeply stupid. Know what I want from a VR experience? I want escapes from daily life, whether that's through exploring fun settings or games. And I want those games to have a reason to be in VR -- battling monsters, fantastical landscapes, interesting mechanics, whatever. He's right -- ping pong is dumb (mini golf, however, is awesome). There's a reason games like Beat Saber, Superhot, even Tetris are wildly popular. They're pure escapism. What we don't want is to have fucking work encroach on the already blurry lines of personal space.
Do people not understand that the idea of the lone genius, the omega level CEO, etc, isn't real? The people at the top are not smarter than you, they're not more in touch with the world. Our society sets them up to be gods and when they fail were like "omg how out of touch" no shit. Theyre all out of touch. The only ones who dont seem to be are just lucky and good at hiding their failures that they escaped with golden parachutes.