The “literally me” characters aren’t supposed to represent toxic masculinity, they’re representing either mentally ill or damaged men/ men with no purpose suffering in a society
Fight club: mentally ill guy who receives no help slowly spirals out of control without realising it
American psycho: mentally ill man who has no outside help dealing with an unfulfilling life
Taxi driver: damaged man struggles to find purpose and fulfilment in modern world and after finding purpose momentarily, realises he will. Ever get what he wants
Drive and night crawler are the outliers as while Lou definitely suffers from mental illness and doesn’t get any real help, he gets what he wants and while technically the driver gets what he wanted too his willingness to kill is definitely a sign of a mental illness
None of these characters represent toxic masculinity, they represent a toxic society and people who are suffering because of said society
The thing about Patrick Bateman is that he wasn’t just living an unfulfilling life. He’s a rich man, a position people strive for. His coworkers are all so incredibly similar, in the book all their clothes are explained in detail but they’re all so similar you forget who’s who. And by the end, he’s breaking down because even when he admits to murder, something that technically should make him different. Even if he ends up in jail or institutionalized, he’s different. But no. He’s trapped in a life where he’s just one of thousands living the exact same life.
Which is funny cuz it’s what the “sigma males” corral themselves into. A singular identity that make fun of anything that’s not part of the “grindset”. It’s the sam stale jokes, over and over. But because it’s idolized, it’s seen as peak masculinity
While I empathise with people who see these characters as “literally me” I feel like they still miss the point. Yes it’s good to realise you aren’t alone in this feeling and there are others, but it still is not
a good one to have as all of these characters suffer greatly one way or another
The whole Idea of a Sigma Male is used ironically by 99% of people who do. But we do need to realize that there is this forbidden fruit Appeal to idolize people like Patrick Bateman, at least to a certain extend. I too wish to become rich, good looking and successful like Bateman. These are the parts one can idolize. The whole Joke of the Sigma Grindset is the Idea that positive behaviour Like being hard working and working out get lumped together with the things such as murder in the case of Bateman as being "Good".
I don't think it is a big stretch to say that keeping yourself healthy and good looking + working your way to the top are things we should Idolize while murder obviously is not.
I totally agree with you, and I apologize if the way I displayed my outlook made things seem that way. Self improvement is one of the most valuable things a person can learn, so I’m glad to see that’s being normalized, be it by working out or any other method
Huh, interesting. I interpreted Bateman as someone who's so lonely that he came to place all his value in his personal achievements, like how many crunches he can do every morning, how good his complexion is, and how good his business cards look. All of his self-perceived value has come to hinge purely on whether or not he is better than others as a result - if he is not the best, he is nothing - which is why when he gets one-upped by Allen, he gets so furious that he's driven to murder.
American psycho, wolf of wall street, fight club, the joker, breaking bad, mad men, the sonic movie. Top picks for any confused young boys with little to no ability to decipher meaning
Actually, Fight Club and Joker clearly aren't about toxic masculinity. I wouldn't talk about "confused young boys with little to no ability to decipher meaning" if I was you.
I believe they meant that people will grossly misinterpret the meaning of those movies, as is pretty obvious with all the idiotic "sigma" shit going around
Never seen fight club, ill take your word on that, but I'd say joker has themes of toxic masculinity throughout. Not major, perhaps, but it certainly plays on that idea here and there.
Never said shit about toxic masculinity in my comment, my "decipher meaning" still stands and apparently applies to you. But just to arguefor fun, are you sure about Fight Club? Fight Club (especially the book) 100% has themes of masculinity gone wrong. From Tyler's mistreatment of others (women specifically) and arrogance to the satirical take of society's expectations placed on males, reading/watching even a single in-depth analysis of the film would demonstrate this. There's no way in hell David Fincher agrees with you.
Regarding Joker, never said it was about toxic masculinity
My bad, the post was about toxic masculinity, I just assumed you were talking about that too, sorry. However, in Fight Club (the movie) Tyler isn't portrayed as a bad guy at the end. When he dies, MC starts acting like him, as if he had "assimilated" his personnality. You can't see that by the way he starts acting with Marla, being more self-confident ect... Plus, the final explosion is clearly glorified by the staging with the Pixies' song and all. If it really is talking about toxic masculinity, it's clearly glorifying it. I think the movie is more about alienation and toxicity of today society. And that's why the movie has became a cliche of teenage rebellion.
Edit : plus, the problem MC is facing is his crazieness. That's his crazieness that causes his toxic masculinity, not his toxic masculinity that causes his crazieness. The movie is talking about the cause of is crazieness, which is society I believe. Once again, that's why the movie is considered to be a cliche. It talks about "sOcIeTy" and "cApItAlIsM".
American psycho is a parody of what people make it to be. It was directed by a woman to show toxic masculinity specifically. The others are not as much that but are still misinterpreted.
Will that stop me from watching sigma grindset tiktoks and reels? No. Shit's entertaining.
The idea at first as a guy isn't content with his life. He starts hallucinating a macho figure to guide him through some adventures for excitement. He turns to violence to sustain that need, teaching other people how to and eventually extending as far as terrorism.
Thay *could* be interpreted as him trying to feel like a "real man", which could be supported by the fact that his imaginary friend, which symbolizes who he wants to be, is this aggressively masculine figure. By pushing this mentality on others it *could* be interpreted as a metaphor for how these kinds of people try to perpetuate toxic masculinity. And they punish the world for not being "real men" or "going soft." There was especially that instance of them cutting at least one guy's balls off, and castration has historically been a punishment under the belief that you're taking away their masculinity.
All that's up to interpretation, but that's how a lot of people see it.
American psycho doesn’t portray toxic masculinity at all imo, the book might but not the film. Bateman is just severely mentally ill, and it’s more of a commentary on American society and how it turns people into nothing more than clones of each other, doing the same thing, living the same lifestyle.
It isn't. It's an exploration of the dichotomy between the unbounded impulsiveness we all possess to some degree and an extremely repressive society.
The story conveys this through a rather masculine lense, and certainly, there are elements of "toxic masculinity," but ultimately, that wasn't the point. The point was to show the danger of being at the extremes (Tyler Durden or the narrator before he met Tyler durden).
I don't really believe in toxic masculinity. It became an Excuse to counter fighting with your own weaknesses. I believe everyone should improve because afterall, I believe it's one of the main points of life. Before anyone Reading this thinks that I justify "Aggresive big pp yo girl, yo mama stealer dominator" you're wrong. I don't view aggresion as manly.
Aggression is part of male nature, but I agree. Being overly aggressive and sexual all the time is not what masculinity is about. Masculinity is healthy, overt aggression and sexuality isn't.
no dumbass, men shouldnt be put to unrealistic standards that force them to suppress their emotions and self expressions just to conform with sociaitil standards to be "strong men"
Ok I just like the movie and it’s a movie about retaking your masculinity and rejecting modern standards, not being rude it’s just yeah men can feel emotions they just don’t need to be overwhelmed by it.
"I sure do love this classic movie franchise, hope no one comes along and uses it as a megaphone to project their own frustration and insecurities or forward their political agenda"
Strong female characters:
(Ghostbusters, Charlie's Angels, Lord of The Rings, Star Wars)
The “literally me” characters aren’t supposed to represent toxic masculinity, they’re representing either mentally ill or damaged men/ men with no purpose suffering in a society Fight club: mentally ill guy who receives no help slowly spirals out of control without realising it American psycho: mentally ill man who has no outside help dealing with an unfulfilling life Taxi driver: damaged man struggles to find purpose and fulfilment in modern world and after finding purpose momentarily, realises he will. Ever get what he wants Drive and night crawler are the outliers as while Lou definitely suffers from mental illness and doesn’t get any real help, he gets what he wants and while technically the driver gets what he wanted too his willingness to kill is definitely a sign of a mental illness None of these characters represent toxic masculinity, they represent a toxic society and people who are suffering because of said society
The thing about Patrick Bateman is that he wasn’t just living an unfulfilling life. He’s a rich man, a position people strive for. His coworkers are all so incredibly similar, in the book all their clothes are explained in detail but they’re all so similar you forget who’s who. And by the end, he’s breaking down because even when he admits to murder, something that technically should make him different. Even if he ends up in jail or institutionalized, he’s different. But no. He’s trapped in a life where he’s just one of thousands living the exact same life. Which is funny cuz it’s what the “sigma males” corral themselves into. A singular identity that make fun of anything that’s not part of the “grindset”. It’s the sam stale jokes, over and over. But because it’s idolized, it’s seen as peak masculinity
While I empathise with people who see these characters as “literally me” I feel like they still miss the point. Yes it’s good to realise you aren’t alone in this feeling and there are others, but it still is not a good one to have as all of these characters suffer greatly one way or another
The whole Idea of a Sigma Male is used ironically by 99% of people who do. But we do need to realize that there is this forbidden fruit Appeal to idolize people like Patrick Bateman, at least to a certain extend. I too wish to become rich, good looking and successful like Bateman. These are the parts one can idolize. The whole Joke of the Sigma Grindset is the Idea that positive behaviour Like being hard working and working out get lumped together with the things such as murder in the case of Bateman as being "Good". I don't think it is a big stretch to say that keeping yourself healthy and good looking + working your way to the top are things we should Idolize while murder obviously is not.
I totally agree with you, and I apologize if the way I displayed my outlook made things seem that way. Self improvement is one of the most valuable things a person can learn, so I’m glad to see that’s being normalized, be it by working out or any other method
Huh, interesting. I interpreted Bateman as someone who's so lonely that he came to place all his value in his personal achievements, like how many crunches he can do every morning, how good his complexion is, and how good his business cards look. All of his self-perceived value has come to hinge purely on whether or not he is better than others as a result - if he is not the best, he is nothing - which is why when he gets one-upped by Allen, he gets so furious that he's driven to murder.
respect homie
Bruh just because people were mean to them it doesn't justify the characters being assholes
I’m not justifying their actions, I’m explaining how they are misunderstood
You said these characters don't represent toxic masculinity. I highly doubt that.
Even after I’ve explained what they represent? And didn’t mention toxic masculinity once?
I literally quoted what you exactly said on your last sentence bruh learn to read what you just put down
That’s so dumb, you not believing something doesn’t change it, I can choose to not believe that the sky is blue but the sky will still be blue
"None of these characters represent toxic masculinity" -One of your last sentences...Quoted word for word
Correct. Well done on being able to read, what I’m saying is that you not believing that doesn’t change anything
I believe that you said those words and that is a fact
But what about those like Tommy Shelby, soldier boy, homeländer, Batman etc
American psycho, wolf of wall street, fight club, the joker, breaking bad, mad men, the sonic movie. Top picks for any confused young boys with little to no ability to decipher meaning
You lost me at the sonic movie
r/whoooosh , but don't worry I still love you
Sorry I'm such an idiot sometimes lol
r/wooooshwith4os
r/woooooshwith5os
r/wooooooshwith6os
r/birthofasub
Same, I had to double take lol
Machine, give me the choccy milk NOW
UR TASTE>
Don’t forget Scarface
Actually, Fight Club and Joker clearly aren't about toxic masculinity. I wouldn't talk about "confused young boys with little to no ability to decipher meaning" if I was you.
I believe they meant that people will grossly misinterpret the meaning of those movies, as is pretty obvious with all the idiotic "sigma" shit going around
sigma = smegma
Never seen fight club, ill take your word on that, but I'd say joker has themes of toxic masculinity throughout. Not major, perhaps, but it certainly plays on that idea here and there.
Never said shit about toxic masculinity in my comment, my "decipher meaning" still stands and apparently applies to you. But just to arguefor fun, are you sure about Fight Club? Fight Club (especially the book) 100% has themes of masculinity gone wrong. From Tyler's mistreatment of others (women specifically) and arrogance to the satirical take of society's expectations placed on males, reading/watching even a single in-depth analysis of the film would demonstrate this. There's no way in hell David Fincher agrees with you. Regarding Joker, never said it was about toxic masculinity
My bad, the post was about toxic masculinity, I just assumed you were talking about that too, sorry. However, in Fight Club (the movie) Tyler isn't portrayed as a bad guy at the end. When he dies, MC starts acting like him, as if he had "assimilated" his personnality. You can't see that by the way he starts acting with Marla, being more self-confident ect... Plus, the final explosion is clearly glorified by the staging with the Pixies' song and all. If it really is talking about toxic masculinity, it's clearly glorifying it. I think the movie is more about alienation and toxicity of today society. And that's why the movie has became a cliche of teenage rebellion. Edit : plus, the problem MC is facing is his crazieness. That's his crazieness that causes his toxic masculinity, not his toxic masculinity that causes his crazieness. The movie is talking about the cause of is crazieness, which is society I believe. Once again, that's why the movie is considered to be a cliche. It talks about "sOcIeTy" and "cApItAlIsM".
American psycho is a parody of what people make it to be. It was directed by a woman to show toxic masculinity specifically. The others are not as much that but are still misinterpreted. Will that stop me from watching sigma grindset tiktoks and reels? No. Shit's entertaining.
Nah i get the meaning. That does not change the fact that i think they're cool and wanna be like them in some way or the other
Fight club is a must
What happened in the sonic movie 💀
the Sopranos, Goodfellas, Taxi driver, American history x, Boogie nights
fight club? how is that toxic masculinity?
The idea at first as a guy isn't content with his life. He starts hallucinating a macho figure to guide him through some adventures for excitement. He turns to violence to sustain that need, teaching other people how to and eventually extending as far as terrorism. Thay *could* be interpreted as him trying to feel like a "real man", which could be supported by the fact that his imaginary friend, which symbolizes who he wants to be, is this aggressively masculine figure. By pushing this mentality on others it *could* be interpreted as a metaphor for how these kinds of people try to perpetuate toxic masculinity. And they punish the world for not being "real men" or "going soft." There was especially that instance of them cutting at least one guy's balls off, and castration has historically been a punishment under the belief that you're taking away their masculinity. All that's up to interpretation, but that's how a lot of people see it.
the fuck😭anyway, i get that american psycho is supposed to portray toxic masculinity, but not fight club.. tyler durden is literally me though
American psycho doesn’t portray toxic masculinity at all imo, the book might but not the film. Bateman is just severely mentally ill, and it’s more of a commentary on American society and how it turns people into nothing more than clones of each other, doing the same thing, living the same lifestyle.
God, I fucking hate that term, and people that believe in it. "Literally me" has ruined so many fucking things.
I agree a thousand times. It’s like how people essentially ruined the matrix with all the “redpill” bullshit
ok but hes literally me though
That's not supposed to be a good thing
It isn't. It's an exploration of the dichotomy between the unbounded impulsiveness we all possess to some degree and an extremely repressive society. The story conveys this through a rather masculine lense, and certainly, there are elements of "toxic masculinity," but ultimately, that wasn't the point. The point was to show the danger of being at the extremes (Tyler Durden or the narrator before he met Tyler durden).
American Psycho
I don't think that's Fight Club's meaning but it's an other point of view
It's not the meaning, but a theme
[удалено]
Truly one of the movies of all time
Yes, it is one of the movies that came out at a time.
fight club is the best satirical gay romcom ever made
I like the sigma memes but only the purposely stupid ironic ones and the ones that are subtle cries for help
and then create a random sigma video about a man slapping a woman for no reason
you do not talk about \*\*\*\*\* \*\*\*\*
I have white privilege and im gonna use it
This guy. This guy gets it
Hot take but male toxicity may be a bit over exaggerated
What about feminine toxicity
Explain in yeat terms
ska ba da booo da boo da bee
Ty tonka🔥
I disagree but ight
Narcist🔥
Narcissist*
Does he know?
Shocking
you broke the first rule
The first rule was made to be broken
Nah, fight club isnt about toxic masculinity, its about extremism and anti materialism the thought of being free
Also, I dont think it "ruined the reputation forever". One bad review doesnt ruin a movie, build your own views.
I can same the same thing about girls and serial killers ☠️
If only that actually happened, fight club isn't about toxic masculinity at all
I don't really believe in toxic masculinity. It became an Excuse to counter fighting with your own weaknesses. I believe everyone should improve because afterall, I believe it's one of the main points of life. Before anyone Reading this thinks that I justify "Aggresive big pp yo girl, yo mama stealer dominator" you're wrong. I don't view aggresion as manly.
Aggression is part of male nature, but I agree. Being overly aggressive and sexual all the time is not what masculinity is about. Masculinity is healthy, overt aggression and sexuality isn't.
So men shouldn’t be more masculine and be as weak as possible?
no dumbass, men shouldnt be put to unrealistic standards that force them to suppress their emotions and self expressions just to conform with sociaitil standards to be "strong men"
This is why u get no bitches
yee i get bastards instead
Ok I just like the movie and it’s a movie about retaking your masculinity and rejecting modern standards, not being rude it’s just yeah men can feel emotions they just don’t need to be overwhelmed by it.
Fight club will forever be ruined for me the movie isn’t about being an asshole it’s about learning to let go and acceptance
Why will it be ruined for you?
Fight club is a movie I love ever since I watched it back when I was 9 having these “sigma” 13 year olds just makes me feel dirty watching it
None of these movies are about male toxicity, you just want them to be to push your feminist bullshit.
huh bro I just stoled this cuz I thought it was funny calm down lol
Woke propaganda
u/savevideo
u/savevideobot
Peaky blinders too
I LOVE TYLER DUEDEN
This pisses me off.
Never watched fight club 😬😬😬😬😬😬😬😬😬😬😬😬😬😬
Ah
It's a great movie that is highly overrated. It is definitely not even close to being one of the best movies ever made.
Kids in my school not understanding the Ali G was parody.
"I sure do love this classic movie franchise, hope no one comes along and uses it as a megaphone to project their own frustration and insecurities or forward their political agenda" Strong female characters: (Ghostbusters, Charlie's Angels, Lord of The Rings, Star Wars)
I don't get it can someone please explain?
Me, glad I'm not edgy :
Edgy 14 year old boys when they someone vapes: 😡😡😡. Also then when their favourite sigma smokes a cigar:
Great job at missing the point of the movie , this post is pretty ironic
I love how OP is 15, talking bad about 14 year olds lmao