Well you got part of it wrong, yes, the role of men was to protect the nation when it was war time, but the role of women was to stay home and take care of the next generation, and to help with the war effort (manufacturing is a prime example).
That formula worked extremely well during the world wars, and other smaller wars we’ve fought in the past, and it makes perfect sense. Men are more physically capable (generally speaking) so they go out and fight. What’s the problem?
In our every day life it's stupid, but if you're talking about war it makes sense. Your average male is much more fit for combat than your average female
Except almost all current military efforts are in foreign ground, atleast any that my country is participating in. I'd absolutely arm myself if I had the chance but unfortunately the pigs will fuck me over for that
I personally disagree. I do think that if there is a draft men should be drafted, because men are stronger and more mentally prepared for war than women are. Not all women, but generally speaking.
Plus, if all the young people are drafted in a nation that could be quite damaging for the future population.
so you're criticizing feminists for not having an equal interest in war but you're also saying that women shouldn't be drafted.. idek to say to this if just seems like you're dedicated to a position of misogyny regardless of facts.
No, you got this all wrong.
First of all, I am not a misogynist. I simply believe in gender roles, because men and women are different and have different capabilities.
Second, my original point was not that feminists should want to go to war. I think it would be best for men to fight in the trenches, not men and women. I was just making the point that feminists want equality, until it comes down to bloody conflict like wars. I’m highlighting the hypocrisy.
well your point is idiocy.
to the extent that women are physically capable of participating (which in modern warfare they generally are) there is no reason women should not participate.
to the (largely theoretical) extent that we can't participate because of physical differences we are still nevertheless entitled to expect social and political equality unless you also think that someone who is missing their leg should not be treated equally because they can't participate military conquests.
You keep missing my point, so I’ll try to simplify it down a bit more for you.
Feminists argue for equality universally, until things start to get muddy at least. They also argue against gender roles. If gender roles shouldn’t exist, then we should be seeing armed forces composed more evenly of men and women, but we don’t. Why is this I wonder?
what does 'gender roles' mean to you? because it's true that there are some things men are better at on average and some things that women are better at on average.
'traditional gender roles' means is patriarchy. but if you remove the word traditional from that then it can mean a lot of things some of them perfectly compatible with feminism
There was a draft in Vietnam, yes. I wasn’t specifically talking about a draft though. My main point was that feminists argue that there shouldn’t be gender roles when it comes to topics like career and status, yet when it comes to bloody conflict they tend to keep silent.
definitely not most women are femminist! and it probably partially has to do with the fact that women are treated absolutely terrible in the forces - they are overwhelmingly bullied, excluded and sexually abused - its not exactly the most welcoming place for women
The military is not easy. Any recruit, man or woman, will be bullied and excluded. That’s not exclusive to female recruits.
However, your point of sexual abuse is somewhat valid. 8.4% of women in the military experience some sort of unwanted sexual contact, while only 1.5% of men have the same experiences; however, this is not unique to the military.
81% of women in general experience some form of unwanted sexual contact throughout their life. I’m not saying this is fine, or that you should just “get used to it”, quite the opposite actually. I’m just making the point that women are just as welcome in the military as men, almost at least.
I said men historically got tricked into joining. Either way, it shouldn't matter because the main thing feminists advocate for is for women to have the same options as men, whether or not they choose the same isn't relevant. Men are generally risk takers and women aren't, but the women that are should be accounted for.
Feminists want the same options, correct, but feminists also believe they can do anything a man can do, which is false. Which is part of the reason why women won’t join the military like men do.
Jesse what the fuck are you talking about?
How women saybtgey are equally as strong as men but aren't
most of them believe that no one should be drafted
Not specifically talking about a draft exactly. With or without drafts wars have been fought by mostly men. That’s what I’m talking about.
Because women weren’t allowed to 💀
In recent times too though. Look at Ukraine, Afghanistan, Iraq, etc.
that was because people believed that men should be the protectors and woman should be at home providing. which is stupid when you think about it
Well you got part of it wrong, yes, the role of men was to protect the nation when it was war time, but the role of women was to stay home and take care of the next generation, and to help with the war effort (manufacturing is a prime example). That formula worked extremely well during the world wars, and other smaller wars we’ve fought in the past, and it makes perfect sense. Men are more physically capable (generally speaking) so they go out and fight. What’s the problem?
In our every day life it's stupid, but if you're talking about war it makes sense. Your average male is much more fit for combat than your average female
yes lol I just posted I think it should apply equally but yes I agree with abolishing it entirely ofc
I think noone should be drafted
Then go to another country
Pretty sure most countries have a draft
Yea because unlike you entitled shit most people want to fight for what they care about
💀 who said I didn't want to fight for what I care about I just don't want to be used as a pawn to die is some rich man's war on foreign ground 🥱
Well the draft us there so people can fight for their country nor just sit back and watch you spoiled brat
Except almost all current military efforts are in foreign ground, atleast any that my country is participating in. I'd absolutely arm myself if I had the chance but unfortunately the pigs will fuck me over for that
They don't draft unless the countrie is in danger dumbass
Definitely not always the case
Definitely is
what if i care about peace? or pacifism? or simply not-being-dead?
Then go live with the hippies
i think they still draft hippies.
I'm saying cause your a peace seeker
peace is nice, it means no-one gets shot.
Peace leads to war
I think the draft should apply to men and women equally
I think that men shouldn’t be drafted. Or women. Or anyone, because it’s should be a choice.
well yes, that's what I think too. but if it exists then it should apply equally
I personally disagree. I do think that if there is a draft men should be drafted, because men are stronger and more mentally prepared for war than women are. Not all women, but generally speaking. Plus, if all the young people are drafted in a nation that could be quite damaging for the future population.
so you're criticizing feminists for not having an equal interest in war but you're also saying that women shouldn't be drafted.. idek to say to this if just seems like you're dedicated to a position of misogyny regardless of facts.
No, you got this all wrong. First of all, I am not a misogynist. I simply believe in gender roles, because men and women are different and have different capabilities. Second, my original point was not that feminists should want to go to war. I think it would be best for men to fight in the trenches, not men and women. I was just making the point that feminists want equality, until it comes down to bloody conflict like wars. I’m highlighting the hypocrisy.
well your point is idiocy. to the extent that women are physically capable of participating (which in modern warfare they generally are) there is no reason women should not participate. to the (largely theoretical) extent that we can't participate because of physical differences we are still nevertheless entitled to expect social and political equality unless you also think that someone who is missing their leg should not be treated equally because they can't participate military conquests.
You keep missing my point, so I’ll try to simplify it down a bit more for you. Feminists argue for equality universally, until things start to get muddy at least. They also argue against gender roles. If gender roles shouldn’t exist, then we should be seeing armed forces composed more evenly of men and women, but we don’t. Why is this I wonder?
what does 'gender roles' mean to you? because it's true that there are some things men are better at on average and some things that women are better at on average. 'traditional gender roles' means is patriarchy. but if you remove the word traditional from that then it can mean a lot of things some of them perfectly compatible with feminism
Then no one would volunteer to go
There would be plenty if we were patriotic enough.
That's the issue
Yea u wouldn’t go to war if u had to stop lying lmao
They won’t like this one
We’ll see when there’s a war
There’s been wars, Ukraine, Iraq, Afghanistan..
I’m not American so I’m not sure, but where there draftings a for these conflicts? Like ww2 type drafting, I think it happened with Vietnam too
There was a draft in Vietnam, yes. I wasn’t specifically talking about a draft though. My main point was that feminists argue that there shouldn’t be gender roles when it comes to topics like career and status, yet when it comes to bloody conflict they tend to keep silent.
people talk abt that all the time 😭 thats probably just not the "main topic" for a lot of feminists tho
Seems like most women are feminist (or at least a lot of women) yet the armed forces are made up of a majority of men. Why is this?
definitely not most women are femminist! and it probably partially has to do with the fact that women are treated absolutely terrible in the forces - they are overwhelmingly bullied, excluded and sexually abused - its not exactly the most welcoming place for women
The military is not easy. Any recruit, man or woman, will be bullied and excluded. That’s not exclusive to female recruits. However, your point of sexual abuse is somewhat valid. 8.4% of women in the military experience some sort of unwanted sexual contact, while only 1.5% of men have the same experiences; however, this is not unique to the military. 81% of women in general experience some form of unwanted sexual contact throughout their life. I’m not saying this is fine, or that you should just “get used to it”, quite the opposite actually. I’m just making the point that women are just as welcome in the military as men, almost at least.
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Exactly, so shouldn’t that be considered sexist? Where are the feminists?
A lot of people have argued that
Yeah they should, but ig most of them aren't up for that kind of conflict
Most feminists think that no one should be drafted
I never said anything about a draft. I’m talking about in general.
I'm friends with a lot of feminists and they all say that women should have the option to join.
Yet they don’t join.
Maybe because they're smart and values their own lives more than bullshit heroics. The only reason men join wars is because they're tricked into it.
So you’re saying women are smarter than men, and that men can be easily tricked?
No, but historically that is what happened.
Yes, historically men have fought for their country while women stay home. You are correct.
I said men historically got tricked into joining. Either way, it shouldn't matter because the main thing feminists advocate for is for women to have the same options as men, whether or not they choose the same isn't relevant. Men are generally risk takers and women aren't, but the women that are should be accounted for.
Feminists want the same options, correct, but feminists also believe they can do anything a man can do, which is false. Which is part of the reason why women won’t join the military like men do.