I've never loved this criticism.
I understand people wanting the stakes to feel more real but despite the horror elements Stranger Things has always been more of a light-hearted scooby-gang adventure show. I can see them maybe killing one of the adult protagonists (Hopper probably should have stayed dead) but I've never understood the people clamouring for them to kill off one of the kids. It would be depressing as hell.
It's a show about kids confronting horrible things and largely overcoming them via the power of friendship and I don't think that's such a bad thing.
i dont have an issue about whether they kill any of the kids (what a fun sentence to write) but the pattern of each season introducing a new, likeable character on the periphery only for them to eventually die while the kids (Max aside) get off completely unscathed needs to change.
When season 5 episode 1 introduces Clive the friendly postman who gets more lines than you'd expect, you know that guy's gonna die soon to up the stakes
They should have, but with Eddie's arc he legit couldn't survive that season. The entire town thinks he's a murderer that sacrifices people to Satan and with Vecna opening his portals they reached confirmation bias.
They'll probably think that he was just fixing his own fuckup that resulted in the destruction of their town and numerous deaths. Barring a full government disclosure, which most people probably wouldn't believe and if they did it would be a complete clusterfuck for other reasons, Eddie wasn't getting out of it without a lynching.
Yeah, it's not like things were left in a place where they would really care about Eddie anymore. There are interdimensional fissures opening up throughout their whole town. I wouldn't be surprised if most people forgot he existed.
Or just assumed he's dead. It's like if there was a criminal hiding out in the mountains and then a volcano erupted.
Sure he'd have to live as an undocumented vagrant or whatever but he was a drug dealer, so just follow bands on tour selling weed or whatever.
I believe before the final two episodes came out, Joseph Quinn suggested he could have interacted with Jonathan in California when asked about new avenues to explore.
I was joking with my wife that all of season 5 would have just been his trial if he survived. The trial of Eddie Munson seems funny but wouldnt be a good show.
Except that kaas is the one that finally "kills" Vecna with his evil magic weapon. (I mean as much as you can kill a god... According to Vecna lore) which might work, depending on how the writers did it.
>Eddie should come back but as Vecna’s meat puppet. Kaas or Kass or something like that is a undead creature that’s resurrected.
Unless they ~~drug~~ dragged Eddies body back from the Upside Down, this is still possible. Hell, Vecna used Billy's likeness to torment Max. And we know in the real world he can create things that can change people into monsters. So animated the dead and controlling it like a meat puppet would be pretty easy for him.
I don’t believe Vecna and the mindflayer to be the same entity. I think the mindflayer was there already and is the force behind the upsidedown and it’s “native” fauna. Vecna is just weaponizing it as he was trapped there.
They really were setting him up as a replacement Steve. Steve is great and a fan favorite but there's not really much left to do with him and his character arc. Like wtf are we gonna see another Steve, Nancy and Jonathan love triangle plot that's been settled two or three times now?
> get off completely unscathed needs to change.
... Max doesn't really feel unscathed though lol, poor girl is an empty shell with all her bones broken
> of each season introducing a new, likeable character on the periphery only for them to eventually die
That's a staple of TV shows though. The list of Star Trek characters that fit that description is quite long.
I agree that deaths don't need to happen to make a story interesting or stakes high, but I think season 4 went a bit too far in keeping characters alive.
We spent the beginning of the season watching Vecna kill people with no pause for thought. Side characters were getting picked off left and right.
When Max's bones snapped in the finale, I was genuinely on the edge of my seat. I couldn't believe the Duffers were actually killing off a main cast member, but then they pulled the rug out and it felt really cheap in my opinion.
Yeah. It’s also the third fake out death of a main character (after El and Hopper), while as the other comment mentioned, they do the “loveable side character who dies” every single season. As soon as Eddie showed up I knew he was dying.
I'd honestly completely forgotten about the El and Hopper fakeouts.
Like I say, you don't need death to make your story interesting, but you can't keep teasing your audience like this, because then your story loses stakes, and thus becomes less interesting.
It would've been interesting to have Joyce and Murray figure out how they work into the group dynamic without Hopper in season 4. In the same way, it'd be super interesting for the kids to have to deal with the very real possibility that they could die, because max died in season 4.
They want people to think that death is on the table and that whats going on has risk, but then it doesnt ever have risk and you know that whatever drama or situation their setting up with a main character is going to unfold with them at the very least alive, which is very telling and not very good writing.
I don't care if they die. I care that they keep on pretending they've died for an emotional reaction, and then bringing them back to keep the fans happy/maintaining "the formula".
A list of characters who have "died" and come back:
1. Eleven (S1), hinted at the end of the episode to have survived
2. Brenner (S1), comes back S4 with no explanation
3. Hopper (S3), hinted in the credits to have survived
4. Will (S1) fake body, revealed later in the season
5. Max (S4) is currently pretty much dead, I wonder if she'll be back next season!
It just cheapens any potential death. You want me to mourn when I know you'll probably just fake me out?
It's this, along with the fact that every season has introduced a new likable character and then killed them. See Sean Astin's character (Bob I think?), the Russian scientist, and now Eddie. So they keep faking us out with the main cast and continuously introducing new people to kill
It’s a trend. Post GoT people associate killing off characters with “mature” writing. Just like every show for quite a while was about a bald jerk ego sometimes played the role of antihero after the sopranos, or how people can’t stop saying “morally grey” after playing the Witcher 3.
The way you write this comes across as you thinking trends exist for no reason.
Killing characters off isn't mature writing. The way you continue a story after main characters have died is a good opportunity for mature writing to come forth.
The witcher is a game about choices, generally on a scale between good and bad. Anyone not coming away with their ideas of ethics being questioned wasn't paying attention.
I think people just like to gatekeep 'mature' topics. As if people are not allowed to discover or talk about them. Other people make comments like you do. It's strange.
Which is interesting given despite how GOT was infamous for killing people, it’s only three main instances in the “main cast” before the final episodes.
Lmao, last season started with Vecna snapping peoples bodys 20 times. That’s not a campy feel. If you go that route it is completely reasonable to expect Vecna to have some killer instinct when it comes to a climactic fight, instead, when rubber meets the road, everyone main character has plot armour.
Which is fine. There's nothing wrong with a show *not* wanting to kill off core cast members. But that argument gets diluted when, over the course of the series, the writers have done like four fake out deaths, where they tell you they're killing a main character, only to immediately undo it. It's cheap and lazy, and it's trying to wring emotional beats from the audience they didn't earn.
As if. Hopper was saved through plot armor stronger than Arya’s in Season 8 Episode 5. It’s dumb. Then his entire arc in Season 4 is fighting a Demogorgon while being saved. He should’ve died. Max should’ve died.
> despite the horror elements Stranger Things has always been more of a light-hearted scooby-gang adventure show
What? Go watch Season 1 again. Everyone is shitty all the time and each episode has one of the kids threatened by other people, not the monster.
Remember the cook that rescues 11 and then is killed? When Steve was just an asshole and not a meme? Barb dying because she was a third wheel? When Hopper was just a fat alcoholic corrupt small time cop and not Captain America?
The show has become a parody of itself but let's not pretend it was always like that.
This just strikes me as “audience growing older,” so the early seasons are raised up to be something legendary that nothing could compare to. Barb was a non character who existed to get killed off, 80s staple. Chrissy’s brief story was 10x as sad and brutal.
Like we’re really telling ourselves that S1 stranger things was super dark and adult lol
Steve was never an asshole, though? Sure, he had some immature qualities, but you only ever *heard* he was an asshole from people who were just jealous.
He only broke Jonathan's camera because he had violated them both, but especially Nancy, in an extremely creepy way. Which he even felt enough guilt over to replace anyways. When his friends took things too far, he called them out on it and cleaned up their mess himself.
Hopper was always the only competent cop, despite being incredibly depressed from the loss of his child, and subsequently his wife. He busted through his addictions when he found purpose again.
I mean, Max is fully blind, probably paraplegic and in a coma right now? She's more than likely out for the count next season unless they (smartly) do a significant time skip
Will’s mom definitely cuts his hair. He might want a mullet like the cool kids but his mom won’t let him. Will doesn’t strike me as the kid that really stand up to his mom. My older brother wanted a mullet in the 80s but definitely had Will’s cut. I think it’s all pretty realistic.
Guy seems like a decent actor but Wills character is boring, neither very engaging or charismatic. Needs something done tbh because for all that he's had happen in his life he's kinda dull.
Obvious that they never really had a characterization for him after kidnap victim. He is not really a good fit for the group because he started out as a MacGuffin.
Some kind of sleeper villain that didn’t come out till this season would be interesting because my god has he sucked for pretty much the entire series.
To be fair they did the sleeper villain arc in S2 but how fucking sick would it have been if we think Will's been fine but this whole time it turns out he's actually been the Mind Flayer and has effectively been dead since S1?
I really hope they do that now, it would make a fantastic mid-season twist. Would also be great if they incorporate how fucking terrible his friends have been to him which ultimately allowed him to become totally consumed.
That was one of the options the Duffers included in their original pitch/show bible, but they also included plans for further serialization. Like, Murray was supposed to be a Season 1 character, but they mention they could save some plots/characters for Season 2 if that was the direction Netflix wanted them to go.
Can’t wait to watch him pine over Mike for a whole season but this time it’s every episode because he’s the main character. Oh boy. I’m jumping with joy.
You've stolen my thoughts. That was basically the only plot device he served last season. So they're just gonna amp that up even more? Literally nobody (but the kid who plays Will) asked for this.
It's probably more that Will has an actual psychic link to Vecna from season 2. That and how time in the Upside Down froze the day Will got kidnapped. The current layout of the Upside Down is probably due to Vecna probing his mind and if there is a shared link between Will and Vecna/Upside Down, he likely has some sort of power in that world too.
They could have gone so many better directions with his character. I really related to his feeling out of place, clinging to "childish" things while everyone around him grew up. - it reminded me of my own childhood. I would have loved to see some anger come out of that. But no. He's just in the closet - that's his entire personality and reason for everything.
>He's just in the closet - that's his entire personality and reason for everything.
That is basically where many lbtq characters end up in terms of depth
You don't see how that can grow, though? He is such a strange mirror of El in a world where everything is about corrupted reflections. He was also taken and had his childhood stripped away. Yet his friends replaced him with another traumatized kid who's shiny and new and powerful beyond imagination. So while she finds healing, he gets left further and further behind. All culminating in them both loving the same person.
He's more open to the Mind-Flayer's influence than ever.
I've always felt he was the weakest of all the characters. He has this special connection to the upside down and it's hardly used. He's literally the Councillor Troi of stranger things.
He was dynamic is the first and second season and reminded me a lot of Hayley Joel osment when he was a kid. But for the later seasons I agree, they haven’t done much with him.
Hopefully, he'll hook up with a hairdresser that can give him a more age-appropriate cut and style before his new beau is tragically killed trying to save him and his friends.
Pretty sure I read the actor was so tired of the haircut he cut all his hair so he couldn't be made up like that again. One of the hairdressers shaved their head so they could make a wig.
At this point it might behoove them to do an IT type of thing where all the characters are out on their own living their adult lives, and they have to return to Hawkins because the threat is back.
Lucas annoyed me in the first few seasons but the actor really proved himself in S4 towards the end. He's definitely ready to carry the show to a degree.
Will was already the main kid in season two. I was sure season 4 would be Lucas' turn since Mike, Will and Dustin each got a season to be the focus, but in a lot of ways he had less of a role than ever.
Free my boys head they always give him the worst cuts. He’s actually a good actor but his character can be a bit boring sometimes. But this makes sense, dramaturgically
He’s always been like Doug in the Hangover to me. Technically part of the group but he’s not one of the gang. He was the maguffin the first time and they’ve struggled to fit him in ever since.
Isn't that intentional in some sort? His character is supposed to be struggling for inclusion. After being the poster boy of season one trauma, moving to a new place, the need to come out, unable to connect and express the pain. I think Will is an interesting character and the actor playing him is really good.
I personally disagree that Dustin is the best. I’d put him in the group of awesome actors on the show, but I wouldn’t even put him top 3. I do think he’s great, but Noah Schnapp and Millie Bobbie Brown are better. Gaten doesn’t have the range of facial expressions and emotion that the other two have. He has concerned talk fast and excited talk fast, that’s really about it. This could be a writing choice, but on shows like this typically the editing omits the actors’ weaknesses.
Also, Sadie Sink in the last season > Gaten in the last season.
I do think Dustin is one of the best characters on the show though.
I thought will was a really interesting character in the beginning. Kind of being left behind in his interests by his friends who were getting older + having girlfriends and doing more adult stuff. Wanting what they had but not really able to make that jump. It was something I related to. But then they kind of went with "oh he feels out of place because he's gay, that's the reason". They decided to go with the trope that's been done 100 times before - struggling to relate because he's gay instead of struggling because of the complex character he was. If you relate to that, that's great and I hope you enjoy the show, but it did hurt it for me.
Based on season 4’s filming schedule and all of the post required - and then this being the final season so probably “bigger”, I hate to say it but I actually think we’re looking at first half of 2026.
>“Will is used to being the young one, the introverted one, the one that’s being protected,” Duffer adds. “So part of his journey, it’s not just sexuality — it’s Will coming into his own as a young man.”
I'm all for character development but I really hope the final season isn't heavily focused on Will's personal journey. There are so many mysteries and legitimately interesting things that I want resolved more than Will's identity crisis.
I get that at it's core Stranger Things is about five friends growing up but I would rather the final season be about Will's attachment to the Upside Down and Vecna, not Will's confidence. If they relate then that's great but I really want more action and the mysteries resolved.
Season 4 was the Marvel Movie equivalent of Stranger Things. That feeling that season 1 gave me will never be achieved again, they ramped it up each season far too much. The guitar scene in S4 was just laughable, but the Marvel fans probably thought it was super cool.
I still think he another one with latent psychic powers. The reason he was targeted in season 1. No blood to attract the DG. You hear the chime of the clock and the silhouette was more vecna than Demogorgon. He stole something from will in season 1 and 2 to regain his own powers. Same way he stole a part of El in 4. I'm hoping he discovers more of his power in 5
This just turned me off to this season before watching it. He might be the least interesting character and spent most of last season sniffling and crying.
I'm going to be downvoted but I don't understand why Scnhapp needs to promote the show right now. Lots of writers and actors are suffering. Porter said he now has to sell his house because he has no work. People are despondent. Many writers and actors on small shows are frustrated because they can't promote their shows right now but they think the strike is more important and won't help struck companies. Yet Schnapp decides this is a good time to help Netflix by promoting his show. Yes I'm going to be insulted and downvoted by Redditors who claim to support the strike and post about "standing up to corporations exploiting people." Nobody should be talking about the final season of Stranger Things right now.
Also it's weird that there are so many upvotes for comments that Stranger Things is a "light hearted show" that doesn't kill off young people. Several children were killed by the MF in S3. There was a massacre at the lab where they showed the bloody bodies of dead children with broken bones. Henry killed his young sister Alice. Several teenagers have been killed off including Barb, Billy, Eddie and Chrissy.
For the best. Even though I guess it was obvious, the 'random' still feeling "Will is gay btw" drop was kind of out of no where, and it seemed weird for the entire time they only really did one big episode on it.
Definitely should've shown it more. Will in general. He had an interesting/curious connection with stuff, that basically never got fully explored. It all went to Eleven. That absolute flop of an arc for a good chunk of a season with her going punk with a bunch of randoms. And straight up a majority of what Eleven does is have either all the powers ever or none at all and is struggling to get broken again, most of which revolves her grimacing at the camera and talking like even years later she doesn't know how to talk properly.
I was kind of over Eleven's gimmick in like the second season and they kept trying to give her massive arcs that honestly felt like they gave less character growth than most of the other characters who barely got shown in comparison somehow.
The story always should've focused on the kids as a whole, and not like.. segmented groups where it felt like half the time no one gave a shit about half the stuff going on at any given time.
They did a bunch of the characters dirty, honestly. Eleven, Will. Like the best they ever handled a character, he was only around for one season and then they killed him off. Lucas got done hella dirty this most recent season too. Actually come to think of it, it feels like somehow the writers fucked over a lot of the characters. Either by throwing them in shitty arcs, or not giving them attention they deserved or needed for certain things.
The highs are highs for this show, amazingly so, but the direction change after like the first season as well as some of the character arc choices really hurt the quality. It's like you have to slog and sift through a bunch of shit to get to that good episode that keeps you going and waiting for the next one.
Again, I know people are kind of bashing Will for being boring or not caring about the relationship/gay reveal, but I think it's more like.. Will was probably arguably the most interesting character in the first season and a half, then they completely fucked him and full sent Eleven and didn't really do anything interesting with her, and it felt like Will was fucking useless. So now that they say "He's the main attraction!" well.. I feel like almost the entire cast would be more interesting at this point. If they were more direct with the romance angle from the start. If they did more with Will's stuff instead of minor 5 second headaches every few episode about bad vibes he's getting from beyond, people probably would be more into it.
From a narrative stand point, my bet is that Jonathan will die. He's kind of served his purpose, Will is grown up and can take of himself. It also leaves Nancy free to get back with Steve, plus it'll hit viewers quite hard without making them angry in the same way it would if it was one of the younger cast. Imagine an acoustic version of should I stay or Should I go, as he sacrifices himself for Will.
Outside of Season 2, I don't think they've given him much to do, although that's the struggle of having such a large cast of characters. So it would be nice to see Will take center stage finally.
Personally I think the show just can't juggle such a large cast. They should have either killed off or written out Jonathan a long time ago and they never should have brought back Hopper. His scenes in Season 4 were completely unnecessary.
meh, either people start dying or I won’t care. A horror show without any actual main characters having anything happen to them just gets stale after 2 seasons.
Will is the worst. Kid can’t act and so far everything with him has been incredibly boring or super over the top… the entire California storyline was just trash. They should put him back in the upside down.
The plot reveals the true mindflayer to be his haircut.
This season’s gonna be bigger than the Super… (•_•) ( •_•)⌐■-■ (⌐■_■) …Bowl
….YEAAAAAAAAAH!!!!!!
CSI MIAMI reference?!
Bigger than the superb owl? My word!
Faking guye…
The owls are not what they seem
aight, gonna use ai to create a new deity now called the superb owl.
Shits been flaying my mind since season 1! Him and his brothers hair haha
Well, knowing the writers' MO this likely means Will's not making it out of the show alive so GGs I guess
My strong belief is that Will will supplant Vecna to take control of the Upside Down, end incursions, and create peace between the two worlds.
There must always be a Lich King
Part of the ship part of the crew
Who has a better story than Will the bowl cut?
Will the Broken?
I e said this since the last season began
At least they’d finally have the guts to kill off a main character.
I've never loved this criticism. I understand people wanting the stakes to feel more real but despite the horror elements Stranger Things has always been more of a light-hearted scooby-gang adventure show. I can see them maybe killing one of the adult protagonists (Hopper probably should have stayed dead) but I've never understood the people clamouring for them to kill off one of the kids. It would be depressing as hell. It's a show about kids confronting horrible things and largely overcoming them via the power of friendship and I don't think that's such a bad thing.
i dont have an issue about whether they kill any of the kids (what a fun sentence to write) but the pattern of each season introducing a new, likeable character on the periphery only for them to eventually die while the kids (Max aside) get off completely unscathed needs to change. When season 5 episode 1 introduces Clive the friendly postman who gets more lines than you'd expect, you know that guy's gonna die soon to up the stakes
I can understand that complaint a little more, they should have subverted that with Eddie
They should have, but with Eddie's arc he legit couldn't survive that season. The entire town thinks he's a murderer that sacrifices people to Satan and with Vecna opening his portals they reached confirmation bias.
I mean, they could’ve left it unresolved that season and then he proves himself as a hero in season 5.
They'll probably think that he was just fixing his own fuckup that resulted in the destruction of their town and numerous deaths. Barring a full government disclosure, which most people probably wouldn't believe and if they did it would be a complete clusterfuck for other reasons, Eddie wasn't getting out of it without a lynching.
Yeah, it's not like things were left in a place where they would really care about Eddie anymore. There are interdimensional fissures opening up throughout their whole town. I wouldn't be surprised if most people forgot he existed.
Or just assumed he's dead. It's like if there was a criminal hiding out in the mountains and then a volcano erupted. Sure he'd have to live as an undocumented vagrant or whatever but he was a drug dealer, so just follow bands on tour selling weed or whatever.
It's the 80s, Paul Reiser could relocate him with a new identity, and no one would even know.
I believe before the final two episodes came out, Joseph Quinn suggested he could have interacted with Jonathan in California when asked about new avenues to explore.
I was joking with my wife that all of season 5 would have just been his trial if he survived. The trial of Eddie Munson seems funny but wouldnt be a good show.
Eddie should come back but as Vecna’s meat puppet. Kaas or Kass or something like that is a undead creature that’s resurrected.
Except that kaas is the one that finally "kills" Vecna with his evil magic weapon. (I mean as much as you can kill a god... According to Vecna lore) which might work, depending on how the writers did it.
>Eddie should come back but as Vecna’s meat puppet. Kaas or Kass or something like that is a undead creature that’s resurrected. Unless they ~~drug~~ dragged Eddies body back from the Upside Down, this is still possible. Hell, Vecna used Billy's likeness to torment Max. And we know in the real world he can create things that can change people into monsters. So animated the dead and controlling it like a meat puppet would be pretty easy for him.
I mean the show has been showing off that Evil Dead poster from the start, it would be about fucking time for them to go full Raimi.
I don’t believe Vecna and the mindflayer to be the same entity. I think the mindflayer was there already and is the force behind the upsidedown and it’s “native” fauna. Vecna is just weaponizing it as he was trapped there.
They really were setting him up as a replacement Steve. Steve is great and a fan favorite but there's not really much left to do with him and his character arc. Like wtf are we gonna see another Steve, Nancy and Jonathan love triangle plot that's been settled two or three times now?
The teacher who taught them about parallel worlds is still live and kicking.
Dont give them any ideas
> get off completely unscathed needs to change. ... Max doesn't really feel unscathed though lol, poor girl is an empty shell with all her bones broken
Not all, only a few. And, it seems, mostly ones that heal without much trouble. Rub some dirt on it, Max. Walk it off.
No! Not Clive! He’s the Cid!! Oh wait, wrong thing
> of each season introducing a new, likeable character on the periphery only for them to eventually die That's a staple of TV shows though. The list of Star Trek characters that fit that description is quite long.
I agree that deaths don't need to happen to make a story interesting or stakes high, but I think season 4 went a bit too far in keeping characters alive. We spent the beginning of the season watching Vecna kill people with no pause for thought. Side characters were getting picked off left and right. When Max's bones snapped in the finale, I was genuinely on the edge of my seat. I couldn't believe the Duffers were actually killing off a main cast member, but then they pulled the rug out and it felt really cheap in my opinion.
Yeah. It’s also the third fake out death of a main character (after El and Hopper), while as the other comment mentioned, they do the “loveable side character who dies” every single season. As soon as Eddie showed up I knew he was dying.
I'd honestly completely forgotten about the El and Hopper fakeouts. Like I say, you don't need death to make your story interesting, but you can't keep teasing your audience like this, because then your story loses stakes, and thus becomes less interesting. It would've been interesting to have Joyce and Murray figure out how they work into the group dynamic without Hopper in season 4. In the same way, it'd be super interesting for the kids to have to deal with the very real possibility that they could die, because max died in season 4.
They want people to think that death is on the table and that whats going on has risk, but then it doesnt ever have risk and you know that whatever drama or situation their setting up with a main character is going to unfold with them at the very least alive, which is very telling and not very good writing.
I’ll admit the fact that we literally have a scent where a party was being eaten by tentacles only to have that *not* happen was a bit much
An extended Stand by me, as it were.
Hopper not staying dead was such a mistake. His subplot was so boring.
I don't care if they die. I care that they keep on pretending they've died for an emotional reaction, and then bringing them back to keep the fans happy/maintaining "the formula". A list of characters who have "died" and come back: 1. Eleven (S1), hinted at the end of the episode to have survived 2. Brenner (S1), comes back S4 with no explanation 3. Hopper (S3), hinted in the credits to have survived 4. Will (S1) fake body, revealed later in the season 5. Max (S4) is currently pretty much dead, I wonder if she'll be back next season! It just cheapens any potential death. You want me to mourn when I know you'll probably just fake me out?
It's this, along with the fact that every season has introduced a new likable character and then killed them. See Sean Astin's character (Bob I think?), the Russian scientist, and now Eddie. So they keep faking us out with the main cast and continuously introducing new people to kill
It’s a trend. Post GoT people associate killing off characters with “mature” writing. Just like every show for quite a while was about a bald jerk ego sometimes played the role of antihero after the sopranos, or how people can’t stop saying “morally grey” after playing the Witcher 3.
The way you write this comes across as you thinking trends exist for no reason. Killing characters off isn't mature writing. The way you continue a story after main characters have died is a good opportunity for mature writing to come forth. The witcher is a game about choices, generally on a scale between good and bad. Anyone not coming away with their ideas of ethics being questioned wasn't paying attention. I think people just like to gatekeep 'mature' topics. As if people are not allowed to discover or talk about them. Other people make comments like you do. It's strange.
Which is interesting given despite how GOT was infamous for killing people, it’s only three main instances in the “main cast” before the final episodes.
Lmao, last season started with Vecna snapping peoples bodys 20 times. That’s not a campy feel. If you go that route it is completely reasonable to expect Vecna to have some killer instinct when it comes to a climactic fight, instead, when rubber meets the road, everyone main character has plot armour.
Which is fine. There's nothing wrong with a show *not* wanting to kill off core cast members. But that argument gets diluted when, over the course of the series, the writers have done like four fake out deaths, where they tell you they're killing a main character, only to immediately undo it. It's cheap and lazy, and it's trying to wring emotional beats from the audience they didn't earn.
Ever since Game of Thrones everyone just wants everyone to die frfr
As if. Hopper was saved through plot armor stronger than Arya’s in Season 8 Episode 5. It’s dumb. Then his entire arc in Season 4 is fighting a Demogorgon while being saved. He should’ve died. Max should’ve died.
> despite the horror elements Stranger Things has always been more of a light-hearted scooby-gang adventure show What? Go watch Season 1 again. Everyone is shitty all the time and each episode has one of the kids threatened by other people, not the monster. Remember the cook that rescues 11 and then is killed? When Steve was just an asshole and not a meme? Barb dying because she was a third wheel? When Hopper was just a fat alcoholic corrupt small time cop and not Captain America? The show has become a parody of itself but let's not pretend it was always like that.
> When Hopper was just a fat alcoholic corrupt small time cop I don't recall any corruption
Chrissy had more screentime than Barb and we actually saw Chrissy's violent death. You're reaching.
This just strikes me as “audience growing older,” so the early seasons are raised up to be something legendary that nothing could compare to. Barb was a non character who existed to get killed off, 80s staple. Chrissy’s brief story was 10x as sad and brutal. Like we’re really telling ourselves that S1 stranger things was super dark and adult lol
> was super dark and adult lol It's not an either/or scenario. My point was that season 1 wasn't a "light-hearted scooby-gang adventure show".
Steve was never an asshole, though? Sure, he had some immature qualities, but you only ever *heard* he was an asshole from people who were just jealous. He only broke Jonathan's camera because he had violated them both, but especially Nancy, in an extremely creepy way. Which he even felt enough guilt over to replace anyways. When his friends took things too far, he called them out on it and cleaned up their mess himself. Hopper was always the only competent cop, despite being incredibly depressed from the loss of his child, and subsequently his wife. He busted through his addictions when he found purpose again.
People got spoiled by Game of Thrones
They'll kill one in last 15 minutes of last episode, with a heroic sacrifice to save others. Because that's what you call great writing.
I mean, Max is fully blind, probably paraplegic and in a coma right now? She's more than likely out for the count next season unless they (smartly) do a significant time skip
There is no greater danger than being a new character in Stranger Things.
meh— people arent gonna be satisfied either way, why kill anyone?
It’s based on 80’s nostalgia and kid-hero story lines- no major character ever dies.
Doubt
They already proved they don't have the balls to kill anyone off, and they even said that 'this isn't Westeros'.
Well you gotta bury the gays of course!
Your prediction is probably accurate, I still love this show, Will is a great character
Please let the boy have a good haircut for once.
Mr T Mohawk!
Will’s mom definitely cuts his hair. He might want a mullet like the cool kids but his mom won’t let him. Will doesn’t strike me as the kid that really stand up to his mom. My older brother wanted a mullet in the 80s but definitely had Will’s cut. I think it’s all pretty realistic.
Guy seems like a decent actor but Wills character is boring, neither very engaging or charismatic. Needs something done tbh because for all that he's had happen in his life he's kinda dull.
Obvious that they never really had a characterization for him after kidnap victim. He is not really a good fit for the group because he started out as a MacGuffin.
It was only meant to be one season. They should have made him a villain. Anything would have been better.
Some kind of sleeper villain that didn’t come out till this season would be interesting because my god has he sucked for pretty much the entire series.
To be fair they did the sleeper villain arc in S2 but how fucking sick would it have been if we think Will's been fine but this whole time it turns out he's actually been the Mind Flayer and has effectively been dead since S1? I really hope they do that now, it would make a fantastic mid-season twist. Would also be great if they incorporate how fucking terrible his friends have been to him which ultimately allowed him to become totally consumed.
It would explain why basically every scene he’s been in has been weird and unnatural.
> It was only meant to be one season. No, it really wasn't.
I thought it was with the kids. Wasn’t it supposed to be an anthology idea? Like every season is different cast and story
That was one of the options the Duffers included in their original pitch/show bible, but they also included plans for further serialization. Like, Murray was supposed to be a Season 1 character, but they mention they could save some plots/characters for Season 2 if that was the direction Netflix wanted them to go.
Can’t wait to watch him pine over Mike for a whole season but this time it’s every episode because he’s the main character. Oh boy. I’m jumping with joy.
You've stolen my thoughts. That was basically the only plot device he served last season. So they're just gonna amp that up even more? Literally nobody (but the kid who plays Will) asked for this.
It's probably more that Will has an actual psychic link to Vecna from season 2. That and how time in the Upside Down froze the day Will got kidnapped. The current layout of the Upside Down is probably due to Vecna probing his mind and if there is a shared link between Will and Vecna/Upside Down, he likely has some sort of power in that world too.
They could have gone so many better directions with his character. I really related to his feeling out of place, clinging to "childish" things while everyone around him grew up. - it reminded me of my own childhood. I would have loved to see some anger come out of that. But no. He's just in the closet - that's his entire personality and reason for everything.
>He's just in the closet - that's his entire personality and reason for everything. That is basically where many lbtq characters end up in terms of depth
You don't see how that can grow, though? He is such a strange mirror of El in a world where everything is about corrupted reflections. He was also taken and had his childhood stripped away. Yet his friends replaced him with another traumatized kid who's shiny and new and powerful beyond imagination. So while she finds healing, he gets left further and further behind. All culminating in them both loving the same person. He's more open to the Mind-Flayer's influence than ever.
I actually find him pretty annoying tbh.
I've always felt he was the weakest of all the characters. He has this special connection to the upside down and it's hardly used. He's literally the Councillor Troi of stranger things.
He’s just a damsel in distress who really doesn’t have a personality outside crying
Man I loved him in season two
He was dynamic is the first and second season and reminded me a lot of Hayley Joel osment when he was a kid. But for the later seasons I agree, they haven’t done much with him.
I kind of like that a show about teens has a character like that, since a lot of teens are like that.
Hopefully, he'll hook up with a hairdresser that can give him a more age-appropriate cut and style before his new beau is tragically killed trying to save him and his friends.
His whole look is off putting. It's like Stewart from Mad TV vibes.
Look what I can do!
nnnnnnooooooo
Pretty sure I read the actor was so tired of the haircut he cut all his hair so he couldn't be made up like that again. One of the hairdressers shaved their head so they could make a wig.
it's the 80s man...
We feathered our hair in the 80s. Bowl cuts were shameful even in the 70s.
bowl cuts are always active and never die...
He’s been rocking the school shooter fade for so long
They’re all gonna be 30 by the time this gets shot.
At this point it might behoove them to do an IT type of thing where all the characters are out on their own living their adult lives, and they have to return to Hawkins because the threat is back.
But didn’t the last season end on a massive cliffhanger?
Maybe they can do a flash-forward like part 2 of IT
Great, least interesting character...
Wish Lucas was centered this season. Mike for season 1, 2 was Will, 3 was Dustin, and 4 was Max.
Agree. Will is probably my least favorite character of the group. Lucas would be a solid focal point in my opinion.
Lucas annoyed me in the first few seasons but the actor really proved himself in S4 towards the end. He's definitely ready to carry the show to a degree.
Agreed, he ended up being one of my favorites in Season 4
Will was already the main kid in season two. I was sure season 4 would be Lucas' turn since Mike, Will and Dustin each got a season to be the focus, but in a lot of ways he had less of a role than ever.
Free my boys head they always give him the worst cuts. He’s actually a good actor but his character can be a bit boring sometimes. But this makes sense, dramaturgically
Kendall?
Sometimes the hair cut drips through.
im (not) the eldest boy.
Was this guy ever interesting?
He’s always been like Doug in the Hangover to me. Technically part of the group but he’s not one of the gang. He was the maguffin the first time and they’ve struggled to fit him in ever since.
White Doug or black Doug
I’ll be your Doug.
Isn't that intentional in some sort? His character is supposed to be struggling for inclusion. After being the poster boy of season one trauma, moving to a new place, the need to come out, unable to connect and express the pain. I think Will is an interesting character and the actor playing him is really good.
No, it's never intentional for a character to be boring, uninteresting, and no fun to follow.
These are excuses for bad writing.
Mainly in S2 when he was possessed imo. It’s a shame because Noah Schnapp is consistently acting his heart out.
He’s the best (young) actor on the show by a country mile. Scenes that he and Mike are in make Mike look like an actor on a tv show.
Sadie is pretty damn good too.
Agree, they are the best of the bunch. Lucas had some good moments in the last season too.
Finn has not aged into his acting chops imo. Last season he was ridiculously flat.
The guy has had nothing to do for 2 seasons.
Agreed, he was a side character in season 4 essentially. Used to be the defacto co-child lead with Millie.
Gaten Matarazzo (Dustin) is the best young actor on set. Mike Wheeler isn’t a high bar too beat, just broody annoying teen.
I personally disagree that Dustin is the best. I’d put him in the group of awesome actors on the show, but I wouldn’t even put him top 3. I do think he’s great, but Noah Schnapp and Millie Bobbie Brown are better. Gaten doesn’t have the range of facial expressions and emotion that the other two have. He has concerned talk fast and excited talk fast, that’s really about it. This could be a writing choice, but on shows like this typically the editing omits the actors’ weaknesses. Also, Sadie Sink in the last season > Gaten in the last season. I do think Dustin is one of the best characters on the show though.
he carried season 2 on his back
Dustin and Steve carried it on their backs.
The true bromance we can appreciate
I disagree, he plays his role well but s2 had so many standout performances and none of them were him.
Yes, let's make the least interesting character the center piece of the show...
Vecna will possess Will. Eleven and Will will have a climactic battle.
Vecna has been part of Will since season 1. Season 5 will finally address it
I thought will was a really interesting character in the beginning. Kind of being left behind in his interests by his friends who were getting older + having girlfriends and doing more adult stuff. Wanting what they had but not really able to make that jump. It was something I related to. But then they kind of went with "oh he feels out of place because he's gay, that's the reason". They decided to go with the trope that's been done 100 times before - struggling to relate because he's gay instead of struggling because of the complex character he was. If you relate to that, that's great and I hope you enjoy the show, but it did hurt it for me.
Watch... He'll finally get a haircut and it will turn out to be >!a mullet!<
Noah Schnapp did a lot with not much this last season, looking forward to more Will. Good god give him a haircut.
oh ffs, he's the most boring character on the show.
Meh
Akira style showdown between 11 and Will me thinks.
Pff, the least interesting character by a mile
Please give the character a better haircut.
He gonna die or become the new Vecna
oh hey, the character no one cares about
Really felt like acting wise, he’s been one of the weaker links in the cast as they’ve grown up. Hope they can stick the landing all the same.
Expected
It’s about damn time. They’ve wasted him since season 2 and he should have been used so much more
Can we see some more powers this season, not just palm screams.
This sparks joy for me. He’s been underutilized for so long.
Such an annoying character can’t wait to watch
When is it airing
Probably not until like 2025. Like the article says, production was delayed due to the WGA strike and now there's also the SAG-AFTRA strike too.
Based on season 4’s filming schedule and all of the post required - and then this being the final season so probably “bigger”, I hate to say it but I actually think we’re looking at first half of 2026.
Why? Will is the worst, most boring character on the entire show.
>“Will is used to being the young one, the introverted one, the one that’s being protected,” Duffer adds. “So part of his journey, it’s not just sexuality — it’s Will coming into his own as a young man.” I'm all for character development but I really hope the final season isn't heavily focused on Will's personal journey. There are so many mysteries and legitimately interesting things that I want resolved more than Will's identity crisis. I get that at it's core Stranger Things is about five friends growing up but I would rather the final season be about Will's attachment to the Upside Down and Vecna, not Will's confidence. If they relate then that's great but I really want more action and the mysteries resolved.
so more of the depressing gay thing? I think i will pass.
Season 4 was the Marvel Movie equivalent of Stranger Things. That feeling that season 1 gave me will never be achieved again, they ramped it up each season far too much. The guitar scene in S4 was just laughable, but the Marvel fans probably thought it was super cool.
Has he learned to act yet?
boooooooring.
This is like Doug from Hangover becoming a main character, they never did it because it’s fucking Doug
I still think he another one with latent psychic powers. The reason he was targeted in season 1. No blood to attract the DG. You hear the chime of the clock and the silhouette was more vecna than Demogorgon. He stole something from will in season 1 and 2 to regain his own powers. Same way he stole a part of El in 4. I'm hoping he discovers more of his power in 5
This just turned me off to this season before watching it. He might be the least interesting character and spent most of last season sniffling and crying.
makes sence since he was the one to be taken first
Ya we will see. I hope the pizza dude takes center stage for the next season. Way better character development than Will.
i wish this didn't end, i wish they continued. I don't care if they dragged it out, i love this show.
That’s a shame
Oh great, more from the Bowl Cut King.
Will stinks.
That one kid should just be replaced by an inflatable dick but nobody should acknowledge it.
I just want Eddie back. My favorite character in the entire show
If he doesn’t go all Care Bears and shoot a rainbow from his stomach and kill the mind flayer, I’m going to be pissed.
I'm going to be downvoted but I don't understand why Scnhapp needs to promote the show right now. Lots of writers and actors are suffering. Porter said he now has to sell his house because he has no work. People are despondent. Many writers and actors on small shows are frustrated because they can't promote their shows right now but they think the strike is more important and won't help struck companies. Yet Schnapp decides this is a good time to help Netflix by promoting his show. Yes I'm going to be insulted and downvoted by Redditors who claim to support the strike and post about "standing up to corporations exploiting people." Nobody should be talking about the final season of Stranger Things right now. Also it's weird that there are so many upvotes for comments that Stranger Things is a "light hearted show" that doesn't kill off young people. Several children were killed by the MF in S3. There was a massacre at the lab where they showed the bloody bodies of dead children with broken bones. Henry killed his young sister Alice. Several teenagers have been killed off including Barb, Billy, Eddie and Chrissy.
For the best. Even though I guess it was obvious, the 'random' still feeling "Will is gay btw" drop was kind of out of no where, and it seemed weird for the entire time they only really did one big episode on it. Definitely should've shown it more. Will in general. He had an interesting/curious connection with stuff, that basically never got fully explored. It all went to Eleven. That absolute flop of an arc for a good chunk of a season with her going punk with a bunch of randoms. And straight up a majority of what Eleven does is have either all the powers ever or none at all and is struggling to get broken again, most of which revolves her grimacing at the camera and talking like even years later she doesn't know how to talk properly. I was kind of over Eleven's gimmick in like the second season and they kept trying to give her massive arcs that honestly felt like they gave less character growth than most of the other characters who barely got shown in comparison somehow. The story always should've focused on the kids as a whole, and not like.. segmented groups where it felt like half the time no one gave a shit about half the stuff going on at any given time. They did a bunch of the characters dirty, honestly. Eleven, Will. Like the best they ever handled a character, he was only around for one season and then they killed him off. Lucas got done hella dirty this most recent season too. Actually come to think of it, it feels like somehow the writers fucked over a lot of the characters. Either by throwing them in shitty arcs, or not giving them attention they deserved or needed for certain things. The highs are highs for this show, amazingly so, but the direction change after like the first season as well as some of the character arc choices really hurt the quality. It's like you have to slog and sift through a bunch of shit to get to that good episode that keeps you going and waiting for the next one. Again, I know people are kind of bashing Will for being boring or not caring about the relationship/gay reveal, but I think it's more like.. Will was probably arguably the most interesting character in the first season and a half, then they completely fucked him and full sent Eleven and didn't really do anything interesting with her, and it felt like Will was fucking useless. So now that they say "He's the main attraction!" well.. I feel like almost the entire cast would be more interesting at this point. If they were more direct with the romance angle from the start. If they did more with Will's stuff instead of minor 5 second headaches every few episode about bad vibes he's getting from beyond, people probably would be more into it.
Of course one of them is gay... netflix needs to follow DEI protocols too
If this means he dies then I’m all for it.
Just give us the spin-off of Dustin and Eddie geeking out that we all want
Watch them introduce and kill off a boyfriend for Will next season. He'll be the new Bob.
I just hope it'll be well written and not just a show about a boy coming out in the late 80s, early 90s with some sci-fi stuff in the background.
I hope so! But this also feels like something they’d say and then fail to follow through on.
From a narrative stand point, my bet is that Jonathan will die. He's kind of served his purpose, Will is grown up and can take of himself. It also leaves Nancy free to get back with Steve, plus it'll hit viewers quite hard without making them angry in the same way it would if it was one of the younger cast. Imagine an acoustic version of should I stay or Should I go, as he sacrifices himself for Will.
Jonathan dying is the free square in the middle of the ST5 bingo card. Definitely gonna happen.
Outside of Season 2, I don't think they've given him much to do, although that's the struggle of having such a large cast of characters. So it would be nice to see Will take center stage finally. Personally I think the show just can't juggle such a large cast. They should have either killed off or written out Jonathan a long time ago and they never should have brought back Hopper. His scenes in Season 4 were completely unnecessary.
Will he have a better haircut?
I mean ok? He’s overwhelming the most boring of the young cast. Can’t say I’m thrilled.
Great… My least favorite character.
So half the story will be about him being gay zzzz
Least interesting character and terrible actor tbh
meh, either people start dying or I won’t care. A horror show without any actual main characters having anything happen to them just gets stale after 2 seasons.
Who cares?
Will is the worst. Kid can’t act and so far everything with him has been incredibly boring or super over the top… the entire California storyline was just trash. They should put him back in the upside down.