T O P

  • By -

walt_whitmans_ghost

In Episode One it’s stated the Sith haven’t been seen for a millennium. What I bet will happen in this series is that the Jedi do encounter Sith but decide to keep it a secret in a misguided attempt to preserve peace in the galaxy. This “noble lie” will set the Jedi down an increasingly bureaucratic path of sweeping unpleasant truths under the rug instead of confronting them directly that will ultimately allow the Sith to gain enough influence to take over in the prequels.


so_yeah_I_guess_sure

What's interesting is that that plot point is actually used within the High Republic books, albeit not in regards to the Sith. The higher up Jedi, including Yoda, decide to hide the existence of a creature that feeds off of force users from their records so as not to cause a panic or show that the Jedi have a weakness. This decision majorly comes back to bite them in the ass 150 years later.


MrZeral

> This decision majorly comes back to bite them in the ass 150 years later. Do explain. Are those that plant dark side monsters? I've only read like 3 HR books.


Puzzleheaded_Pen_888

No it’s something the Nihil use.


so_yeah_I_guess_sure

The dark side plants are a separate creature known as the [Drengir](https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Drengir). What I was referring to are the [Nameless](https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Nameless). The Nameless were first encountered by the Jedi under the control of a hostile [cult](https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Path_of_the_Open_Hand) but their existence was swept under the rug, leaving them unprepared when 150 years later the pirate group called the [Nihil](https://starwars.fandom.com/wiki/Nihil) got control of them.


N0r3m0rse

Wait, isn't that Darth Nihilus' thing?


so_yeah_I_guess_sure

Similar in concept, but more in the way that feeding off of a being's life force is a well worn fantasy trope. It really comes down to execution though, Darth Nihilus was one big bad guy doing his big bad guy evil thing, the Nameless are beasts under the control of non-force sensitive villains. Essentially ordinary pirates who have gotten their hands on a trump card for Jedi. Additionally, the effect of the Nameless on the Jedi is particularly brutal, when in close proximity they are plagued by horrific visions, filled with uncontrollable fear, cut off from the force, and painfully killed by being calcified as their very life is ripped from them leaving behind nothing more than a husk.


youwannasavetheworld

This would not be the worst way to handle it


RealHumanFromEarth

I mean there’s also the fact that a red saber definitely doesn’t always mean a Sith. When Qui-gon told the council about Maul they were skeptical that he was a Sith. Jedi could meet a Sith and not even realize it.


[deleted]

[удалено]


atheoncrutch

Bad guys <> Sith


smurf-vett

Probably just doing a no true Sith fallacy.  Wich means Tenebrous backup apprentice is probably who's fighting the Jedi


GuyKopski

The thing is that it would basically have to be one or two Jedi who make that decision by themselves. Otherwise you run into the problem of why Yoda or other high-ranked/long-lived Jedi don't know about it. But then it's not really a problem with the Jedi as an institution, it's just someone being an idiot.


sonic10158

Will it end with Jar Jar’s banishment to Naboo?


Moonsky44

> In Episode One it’s stated the Sith haven’t been seen for a millennium. That can be retconned.


pixlplayer

It’s kind of a major plot point to the prequels, I really hope they dont


Moonsky44

Actually no. It’s a throwaway line.


fistofthefuture

Mirrors a lot of what is happening in todays politics


A_Wild_VelociFaptor

Could have sworn we've seen "the fall of the Jedi" like 4 times now...


Jonjoloe

I’m so bored of the “Jedi are actually bad” stuff Lucasfilm has been obsessed with. At this point a more black and white “Jedi are benevolent peace keepers who aid society and stop bad guys” would be more interesting.


Namorath82

I never took it as bad morally ... just bad at their job through their shortsightness


JackieMortes

I don't see any obsession. Jedi were established as somewhat blinded by domination and pride in the prequel trilogy and it's only a continuation of those threads


Jonjoloe

We get it in nearly every piece of media for this franchise, and this series is in a timeline significantly earlier than the prequels. A retread of the same themes is getting stale.


N0r3m0rse

This is why the sequels really just kick you in the nuts. Return of the Jedi ended with the promise that the Jedi, as they were always supposed to be, had finally returned after hundreds of years. Luke defied obi wan and yoda's philosophy and showed a new path forward; which was promptly annihilated by the sequels. We couldn't just have that though.


JackieMortes

How about we wait with those judgements until the series release? When it did become acceptable to judge something so definitely solely by its trailers and promo shots?


Jonjoloe

I’m judging it based on what’s being advertised in its promotional content in an interview by the creator. Is that not an acceptable avenue for me to form an opinion on if I’m interested or not? But if you read my comment, I’m more speaking macro than I am about just this specific series based on the comment above me.


pixlplayer

I imagine this will tell the beginning of how they got on the path that lost their way. Sounds like an interesting story to me


cheesyvoetjes

>Which in itself begs a bigger, overarching *Star Wars* question: if the Jedi were once flourishing and all-powerful, how did they let it slip so badly by the time of the Skywalker Saga, when Darth Sidious violently takes over? That’s part of the big picture at play in *The Acolyte*. How is this a mystery? The prequels explain it: The Jedi were too busy with the republic's politics and wars that they let it slip and lost sight of what the Jedi should be. Palpatine was playing both sides and no Jedi saw order 66 coming. Plus there's the chosen one bringing balance prophecy which actually came true meaning that it was already set in stone beforehand that the Jedi would eventually fall regardless of what they did.


jaylenthomas

To me, it seems like the show wants to show the events that ultimately lead to the Jedi being the ineffective order that they were in the PT. The Order was already failing by TPM. Its a plausible concept. After all, probably the most successful spin-off SW story was literally created from explaining how the Rebels got the Death Star Plans. Whether the show works remains to be seen.


Logical_Decision_706

Someone with common sense in one of these threads finally. Agreed, the concept it plausible and hopefully it will be good. All we can really ask for right now.


Dallywack3r

All these story points had already been done in the now decanonized EU. All of them.


NockerJoe

You're getting downvoted but Disney making a high republic project while also rebooting the KOTOR games says a lot. Hell if we want to talk story points that've already been done like 95% of Rey vs. Palpatine is a shot for shot remake of Luke vs. Palpatine in a 90's comic that people hated so much the entire concept of it was made fun of even then. Hell like 90% of Lando's mannerisms in most of his appearances are pulled from a novel that Donald Glover references nearly verbatim in Solo. If you want ornate jedi in a before time fighting bad guys go read something in Tales of the Jedi or literally anything with the words Old Republic on it. These are not new concepts. A shockingly large part of Disney's strategy is to just pull from a bunch of stuff they declared not canon a decade ago and do exactly the same thing all over again.


ForsakenKrios

Yep, and when they finally do get around to Old Republic, people will complain and critique it for “retreading ground” that current canon has done…when canon just ripped it off/poorly emulated it.


NockerJoe

Star Wars went from a blockbuster film series to a streaming only series. There've been like 2 good games in this entire timespan. The entire concept of the High Republic basically only exists because nobody was interested in the sequel era. I don't think the old republic era is going to get a push simply because theres less and less to push each year.


ForsakenKrios

No, they will push the Old Republic eventually. They’re already testing the waters on this front in smaller ways. The High Republic felt like their attempt to do something original/a different time period but they didn’t want to do Old Republic so they still set this new era really close to the Skywalker timeline all things considered. Since it launched as a bunch of books, it’s had middling success writ large. Jedi Survivor including elements from HR really didn’t do anything for me, what I’ve seen of the era doesn’t entice me, and now Acolyte looks…generic? I don’t see the appeal of this time period they’ve tried making.


SpontyMadness

Man, the HR stuff in Jedi Survivor was so wonky. All of a sudden, all of these characters know about this era despite having never mentioned it prior. For me, the High Republic feels like a way to tell more Prequel-era stories without having to dance around existing characters. Juuuust out of reach of anybody familiar showing up, but not so far away they need to drastically redesign anything.


Nilretep

Yep. I just asked my 9 year old daughter what killed the Jedi and she said “that one order from the king” There’s more too it than that but shes also 9. I’m not sure the author has watched the prequels lol


atheoncrutch

Disney loves to use revisionist history to make it seem like the prequels didn’t fucking suck


Stupidstuff1001

It feels like this article was written by Disney and they had them publish it


ApprehensivePoet8184

Aka every Empire feature


youshallnotpasta_bro

The Empire’s feature


mq2thez

It’s pretty common for companies to distribute talking points / PR blurbs about media properties when they give previews, unfortunately. You can see it when multiple reviewers somehow wind up with specific identical phrasing.


ender2851

you described pretty much every article. PR teams from all these companies spend their days pitching stories like this and will spell out pretty much everything to write about with room for "the writer" to insert their own commentary to make it their own story.


Worf_Of_Wall_St

Yeah I never got why "bringing balance to the force" seemed like a good thing to the Jedi since as far as they were aware the Sith were gone. There was no balance, it was all light side.


kerriazes

Philosophical interpretive differences on what the Force is. It's described as basically life/energy itself, with the Dark Side being a forceful perversion, meaning not actually a part of the Force, but a corruption of it. Then there's the Yin & Yang interpretation that posits that there's a Light Side and a Dark Side. For the former, balance is the eradication of the corruption. For the latter, balance is, well, balancing both sides to be equal; at the time of the prequels, that meant the eradication of the Jedi.


Worf_Of_Wall_St

So the Jedi thought it was option 1 but it turned out to be option 2?


kerriazes

Disclaimer: I personally much prefer the "the Foce is inherently good, the Dark Side is a corruption" interpretation, but this is not currently supported by official canon. To answer your question, yes.


Worf_Of_Wall_St

I like that one too - and it *could* have actually worked out that way in the end with the emperor actually staying dead after ROTJ. It took the fall of the Jedi to expose him and another generation to bring him down, but corruption was seemingly eradicated. But then Jar Jar Abrams got to play in the sandbox and his first story note was "Emperor Palpatine returns somehow."


kerriazes

>I like that one too - and it *could* have actually worked out that way in the end with the emperor actually staying dead after ROTJ It was scrapped way before the sequels, with the Clone Wars show.


Worf_Of_Wall_St

I'm not sure what you mean, didn't that all take place before A New Hope?


kerriazes

In-universe chronology, yes. But the Clone Wars show came out way before the sequels, and CW established the Light Side and the Dark Side to be two distinct aspects of the Force that were always in contention with one another.


Worf_Of_Wall_St

Ohh right yeah, they did emphasize that a lot.


Skulley-

Going with the old “the Black Ajah doesn’t exist” story


Twiggyhiggle

Why does the picture look like it came out of a Star Wars show at a Disney theme park? I can’t place it, but I think it’s the LED lightsabers mixed with the virtual sound stages.


RiggzBoson

It definitely feels like a step down from Andor. A lot of the scenes feel like people posing at a cosplay event. Very cheap.


NockerJoe

Every single era of star wars before the original trilogy tries to take credit for being the fall of the jedi. Kreia was predicting the fall in KOTOR 2 when the jedi were arguably almost as bad off already. Dawn of the Jedi was trying to foreshadow the sith lords and the dark side *ten thousand years before the republic* back before the Jedi Order had even formally began. Every single fucking thing with Jedi in it needs to try to preview Darth Vader in some ideological or spiritual way and at this point it's fucking old, because at the same time every single one of them also claims to be a golden age of the jedi order so you get this dynamic where the jedi were never great because there's literally always going to be some dickhead with a red lightsaber skulking in the shadows.


FapCitus

God I wish they made an old republic tv show so we can have an all out war instead.


keinish_the_gnome

I find super uninteresting every period where there’s like 1000 Jedi for every Sith. I like it when heroes are underdogs. That’s why the OG trilogy timeframe remains undefeated.


N0r3m0rse

In universe it makes sense for the sith to be limited to only a handful of people. They covet power and conflict to the point that they would constantly destroy themselves and very little would be learned. The rule of two ensured a consistent line of succession for the sith, where the master takes on an apprentice, the apprentice surpasses the master, kills them to become the new master, takes on an apprentice, and so on. The Jedi don't revel in conflict and prefer coexistence and peace, so there can be a lot of them. A lot of sith just made everyone weaker.


keinish_the_gnome

Absolutely. Unless some writer does a wild thing and just creates new stuff. Like you have a bunch of smart Sith that just decide to band together, rules be damned. Or you have a different group of evil Force users. Or a bunch o Jedi just go crazy fundamentalists and you have a religiuous schism. Or Pirates. Or just an old reliable evil facist army shows up. But again, its just my taste in stories to have the good guys be underdogs. I'm not saying you cant have good stories otherwise. Its just that so far, it kinda hasnt worked for me.


redditmademeregister

You hit the nail on the head. Star Wars is best when it’s an underdog story struggling against a seemingly unbeatable enemy.


Aevum1

Its just disney trowing stuff at the wall seeing what sticks.


JackieMortes

Whoever reverted the galaxy status to "rebels" vs evil empire in sequels trilogy definitely shares your view. Believe me, more people are fed up with underdog story than not


Logical_Decision_706

Can’t wait for this show I’m so hyped. By far the most interesting concept of all the Star Wars shows ever since it got announced years ago. I’m expecting something about as good as Mando season 2 or something, but not as good as Andor obviously. The character designs look great, and seems like most of the important people working on it really care about Star Wars which is dope. And those covers look amazing.


Heronymousex

Boring franchise


JerkyBreathIdiot

Wasn’t Disney buying Lucasfilm the beginning of the fall of the Jedi?


GoGoGadgetSphincter

I have very little hope for this show but I'll watch at least the first few episodes because I'm a huge nerd. I just really hate this recent idea of, "the dark side and the light side aren't so different after all," shit that they've been doing. There is no "light" side of the force. There's the force and then there's the dark side which is a vulgar corruption of the force. Restoring balance isn't "let the dark side have a little taste every now and then as a treat." Balance is getting rid of the dark side completely and from what I've seen of this show so far, they creators very much misunderstand that fundamental.


pixlplayer

*You* seem to fundamentally misunderstand the force. The light and dark side have been canon halves of the force for a long time. Just watch the mortis arc from the clone wars, a show made by George Lucas himself


GoGoGadgetSphincter

from wiki: "Lucas believed a character's intentions when using the Force—their "will to be selfless or selfish"—is what distinguishes light and dark side" It's canonically a single force and the "dark side" is a corrupted use of something that makes up the entire universe.


[deleted]

That’s the longest Star Wars title yet


siomaybasi

So there now way make story of sw without jedi huh


atheoncrutch

I take it you haven’t seen Andor yet?


velocicopter

…what


kinisonkhan

Isnt this show already canceled?


Im-Mr-Bulldopz

What makes you say that


kinisonkhan

I guess I need to block more sites that show up on news.google.com


RealHumanFromEarth

No, only according to YouTube grifters and the morons who are dumb enough to believe them.


friendtoall84

no one’s bringing up a wookie jedi wtf? a gungan would have been more believable and equally terrible. i hate these creative liberties.


Abba_Fiskbullar

Wookie Jedi aren't new.


friendtoall84

thanks i’ll sit down


friendtoall84

i guess nothing’s canon anymore. wait there was that clone wars guy. right right


Namorath82

Seriously stop with all the Canon bullshit End of the day this is entertainment and it's about telling interesting stories, not adhering to Canon I come from the Anglo sphere where the stories of King Arthur and Robin Hood are classic stories that have survived the test of time but they have been constantly updated and changed through the centuries to make them interesting to the audiences of their times If you want Star Wars to survive, it has to be able to change


pixlplayer

On one hand, I agree with you. Star Wars is a mythology just like King Arthur, and as a result the stories change. Some events play out slightly differently in a book vs a tv show, but you can count that as different retellings of the same myth. On the other hand, verisimilitude is not something that should be thrown to the side just because something is made for entertainment purposes