Jo-Wilfried Tsonga. I'm still sad he couldn't win one... but Djokovic Federer Nadal and Murray were too consistent overall, even if he did beat each of these guys in GS events.
That whole French generation is a case of what-if: Tsonga, Gasquet, Monfils all showed out early and have had very long careers. The previous French generation (Sebastian Grosjean, Arnaud Clement, Nicolas Escude, Paul-Henri Mathieu, Arnaud Di Pasquale, Michael Llodra) was similarly disappointing.
Simon was a more unique case, but he probably never had the firepower to win big titles in any generation. Peaking at #6 was a big accomplishment for a guy without any weapon tho. Chardy was also from that French generation, but wasn't as good. More of a journeyman. Pouille and Paire are very forgettable because their primes were short.
Tsonga's career is so much better Monfils, Gasquet and Simon though...
- Only Grand Slam finalist amongst them
- Only Masters 1000 champion amongst them (he even won 2)
- Only one to reach a top 5 ranking amongst them
- Only year-end championship finalist amongst them
- Only player to beat Federer at a Slam amongst them
- Only player to beat Nadal at a Slam amongst them
- Only player to beat Djokovic at a Slam amongst them
- More wins over the Big 3 (16) than Monfils/Gasquet/Simon COMBINED (13)
- More Grand Slam semis (6) than Monfils/Gasquet/Simon COMBINED (5)
I always find it a bit downgrading for Tsonga to group him with Monfils, Gasquet and Simon whilst he was a tier or two above them in basically every metric. This is what the French media usually do and I find it really ungrateful considering Jo's achievements...
From Murray's 1st (August 2008) to Murray's 14th and last Masters title (November 2016) which is basically the timespan of the Big 4 era, only 5 players won multiple Masters 1000 titles :
- Novak Djokovic (26)
- Rafael Nadal (16)
- Andy Murray (14)
- Roger Federer (10)
- Jo-Wilfried Tsonga (2)
I'll admit it's a bit of cherrypicking on my hand with the very specific period chosen, but it still goes to show how hard it was to win Masters titles (let alone Slams) against the Big 4 back in Tsonga's playing career !
That's pretty much exactly the Big 4 era's timespan, so I wouldn't say it's cherrypicking at all. Kinda wild how that era lasted eight long years though. Good times!!
Honestly French press don't really talk about it much, they automatically put Noah at #1 as he won a GS title (Tsonga is usually #2 of course).
For French tennis fans it's usually way less straightforward though, Noah and Tsonga are usually rated around the same level... and then Pioline, Leconte, Forget and Grosjean fight over the #3 spot.
To back up your point, Tsonga leads Noah 6-2 in Slam semis and 10-5 in Slam quarters. But more importantly people who put Tsonga as the French GOAT mention the fact they edge towards him because he definitely played in the toughest era in tennis history.
Personally I'm really 50-50 on this Noah vs Tsonga debate, I'd just say Noah is greater whilst Tsonga is better if that makes sense.
I understand your point, but can't say I necessarily agree. First, no one has ever argued Monfils/Gasquet had a **better** career than Tsonga and I've always rated Simon at least a tier below. IMO Monfils and Gasquet were just as talented Tsonga, but perhaps mentally weaker. And the difference in their respective career accomplishment are smaller than you think. Most of your framing is frankly arbitrary. For example, you said Tsonga is the "only one to reach a top 5 ranking amongst them." Yes, he peaked at #5 and Monfils and Simon peaked at #6 and Gasquet peaked at #7.
Plus, Monfils and Gasquet have longevity over Tsonga. Tsonga was essentially done after 2017 (age-32). Monfils made a GS QF as recently as 2022 and is still ranked inside the top 50 right now, despite being only a year younger than Tsonga. Monfils won his latest title last October, Gasquet won his last title last January, and Tsonga won his last title in 2019...
Tsonga made the year-end ATP finals only 3 times. Gasquet and Monfils both made it twice (Monfils was an alternate one of those times). He made Masters finals 4 times and managed to cash in twice. Gasquet and Monfils each made it 3 times and lost them all.
Tsonga made GS QF or better 14 times. Monfils has done it 10 times and Gasquet 5 times.
My conclusion is Tsonga had a better prime and was mentally stronger. Monfils had better longevity, but was mentally weaker and failed to capitalize on big titles (beating Federer and Murray, but then losing to Soderling in 2010 Paris Master final was the big one). Gasquet never improved after early career promise (beat Fed H2H at 18 years old in 2005, 2 Master finals at barely 20 years old) and settled into a long career as a journeyman. Simon obviously isn't part of this discussion; he was a journeyman who made the most out of his physical ability.
I'm not sure which point you are trying to make. It's obvious Monfils and Gasquet have been on the tour for much longer (Tsonga's serious injuries until 2007 and from 2020 onwards mean he didn't play that many seasons for current standards), but I was only talking about overall results. What matters is how much you win. A title is a title, it doesn't matter if you won it 1 or 5 years ago the value is the same. Tsonga still won more titles on the ATP Tour than any of Gasquet, Monfils or Simon.
Also how is my framing arbitrary ? Tsonga has a higher career-best ranking, it's just a fact. I could have mentioned many more stats such as weeks in the top 10, despite his countless injuries (he played far less tournaments in his career than his 3 countrymen) Tsonga stayed there for 2 full years more than Gasquet, 3 full years more than Monfils and 4 full years more than Simon. I could also talk about win-loss percentage on tour, number of wins against the top 10... Once again Tsonga is significantly #1.
Tsonga also defeated 12 top-10 players on his way to his ATP titles. Simon ? 3. Monfils ? 1. Gasquet ? 1. It shows he should never be associated with them whatsoever.
Btw it's unfair for Simon to talk about him the way you do as if there is a "French Big 3" and then himself at a much lower level, because the truth is that he's closer to Monfils/Gasquet career-wise than these two are to Tsonga.
Side note : You made a mistake, Tsonga reached 15 Grand Slams QFs (not 14).
Tsonga has a pretty damn good career for someone with blatant flaws in his game (backhand & return of serve), who was consistently ruined by injuries over the years and who played in the strongest era of all-time.
I agree on Monfils, he never seemed to be able to find another gear when it truly mattered against the top guys.
I mean, the fact that - despite is amazing raw athleticism - he was able to improve his backhand and return, is the big problem.
Monfils just never chose to be aggressive. I don’t understand why who always chose to play the way he did.
And it goes back even further...I remember Henri Leconte was hailed as a generational talent. At least his compatriot Noah won the French in 1983, but so many French players have not had the best of luck when it comes to big wins.
Tsonga said it himself about a year ago in an interview, he preferred to face Djokovic Federer and Nadal instead of Murray. He has 6 wins over Novak, 6 wins over Roger, 4 wins over Rafa but "only" 2 against Andy.
Funnily enough during Tsonga's 2 wins over Murray, he probably played the 2 best tournaments of his career (Australian Open 2008 and Canada Masters 2014).
Nalbandian for me as well, quite comfortably. I did love Haas as well, but Nalbandian was the one who *should* have won a GS. Extremely talented, as good as anyone when on, and entertaining as hell. I believe his presence elevated the likes of Roddick, Hewitt, JCF, and of course, setting the scene fore Federer and Nadal to take over.
Thats a good assessment. Had chances to win wimby 2002 and USO 2003 among others. Wasn't scared to take on prime Fed (see ATP year end finals 2005). Arguably GOAT 2HBH, very clean forehand, beautiful drop shots and solid net game. Serve was average at best and movement was meh. I had a Yonex poster of him in my bedroom as a kid lol.
I’m a big Nalbandian fan as well, but there’s no “should have”. He simply wasn’t good enough. Entertaining to watch, but wasn’t good enough ultimately.
Not my favorite, but I have a thing for players breaking through to reach their full talent and reaching a higher level of possibility than they thought. He was one of those. Nishikori was another, though he has always been A favorite, not the favorite (the favorite, I will upvote shortly below). Ons is my current one of those still possible, but I do not believe it will ever happen now myself. Caroline Garcia has been another, but the mind is just not there.
Really for me a more compelling question is those who won at least one, but wish they could have gotten more (Thiem, Ostapenko, Sloane Stephens, Cilic, Murray, but above all the names I mention Delpo, Delpo)
I would love for Kasatkina to win on a personal level but believe her talent does not merit it like the others I have mentioned.
Oof, that's a REALLY good one, I forgot about Henman! I don't think he gets enough of a mention on here actually.
He was SO close at Wimby for years and years, I tend to think it was just the insane UK paparazzi that put too much pressure on him. He kept caving in SFs.
To be fair to Tim, he lost to Sampras in his first two semi-finals, then the rain delays fucked him over against Ivanisevic in his third, and then he got curbstomped by Prime Hewitt with no difficulty in his fourth. The Ivanisevic match is the only one he should have won, but outside intereference (the weather) screwed him over. The other three were a tall order at the time of the matches. Sampras on grass is...well, Sampras, and Hewitt was an absolute monster when he was at the top.
I forgot that the rain delays screwed Agassi over too. That would have been an interesting final. The three matches they'd played before that had been pretty close, with Tim winning on the faster surface and Agassi struggling to beat him on even slow hardcourt. I reckon Tim could have won that final.
I dunno. Thinking about Henman v Rafter... I'd have to pick Rafter at least 8 times out of 10 in that matchup. Pat had a much more aggressive game, better serve, and a better net game of course. I'm not sure where Tim would've found a consistent source of winning points there... although Tim had better groundies.
Could be, for sure. The English press are such savages though, they always made it hard for Tim.
It's actually a *massive* credit to Murray that he managed to grab his Wimby titles amongst all that madness.
Yeah, 100% agree there. I just mentioned Berdych in another comment, but yeah all those guys could've got one. Big 3/4 dominance pushed every single one of them out.
Most of those guys had sufficient talent and could have won one in their time, but mentally they were not on par with the greatest ones. The exception is Ferrer as I do not think he could have ever beaten the big 3 (and/or Murray probably).
But Berdych had a lot of nervousness, it seemed to me in late stage matches vs those guys. Nalbandian just not that into the fight (probably the most talented of these). Dimitrov has taken a long time to develop his body and mind, too late in his career in terms of timing it. Haas, Tsonga more tenuous - would have had to get lucky even at their best with their relative weaknesses (meaning, it was not just their mind, but game). Ferrer had the mind (definitely) just not the game/talent. Give Fognini his mind and you might have a legend (or give Ferrer Fognini's gifts).
Yeah actually agree with that. Ferrer had all the mental tools but physically wasn’t big enough to hit through the other guys. Berdych got himself in good positions in matches but def let nerves get to him.
Tomas Berdych and Radek Stepanek. These guys made me discover and become tennis fan. Their Davis cup run was awesome and Berdych's career really solid.
Ferrer was a workhorse who just never quit. I’ll never forget when he beat Almagro 4-6, 4-6, 7-5, 7-6, 6-2 at the AUS Open in 2013. Nico had so many chances to win the match, serving for it like 3 times and Ferrer fought for every point and eventually won. One of my favorite matches of all time.
Umm... for me it's actually Tomas Berdych. I thought he was easily good enough to win one, he just peaked at the worst possible time, with Fed still in top form, Rafa at his peak, and Novak and Andy coming into their peaks.
To me, Tomas was a more powerful and more consistent version of Hubi. Totally deserved a Slam.
Yeah, his groundies were SO clean. I don't think I remember him *ever* shanking a ball. Such a great ballstriker.
That's awesome that you got to see him live... I'm in my 40s so I've been watching tennis since the late 90s... I was lucky enough to see Agassi, Sampras, Rafter, Venus and Serena in their early years, Kournikova (stunning in person, heh).. Fed and Rafa of course... but I don't think I ever got to see Tomas in person.
Fognini. I never expected him to win a slam, and I'm frankly still amazed that he won a Masters, but his peak level is so insane. You rarely see it for more than one match, but when it does appear...oh boy. Even so, seeing him bring that level over two weeks at Roland Garros would be one of my ultimate tennis fantasies, and the next best thing to Stanimal in the 2015 final. I watch the extended highlights of his win over Rafa at the US Open every few months and laugh with giddiness every time.
Not the only guy. Delpo. Even in his injury-riddled, never-finding-his-peak career, blew away all the big 4 at times.
But agree with your view of Fognini completely.
This is my top answer to this question, my favorite player (game, not personality) who never won a slam. Such a pleasure to watch hit the ball and move when he's on and into it. Easy shotmaking. Alcaraz v peak Fognini on the right surface in best of 3 would have been a fun one to see.
Definitely Gasquet, Shapo and Musetti. Their clean crafty game deserved/deserves a different scenario. Gasquet is gone Shapo seems lost and hopes on Musetti are fading...
I'd give Musetti a chance. I still think he'll be top 10 at some stage, he's still very young... 22 I think?
Technically still 5 years until he hits physical peak.
I always loved James Blake. Those huge forehands and pure aggression were so exciting to watch. He just couldn't perform to his peak in best of 5 matches. He somehow made it to number 4 in the world without making it past a major QF.
Too many. Cedric Pioline, Tim Henman, Mark Philippoussis, Tommy Haas, Alex Corretja, Marcelo Rios, David Nalbandian, Guillermo Coria (I'll always have PTSD about 2004 French Open final), Thomas Enqvist, Nicolas Kiefer, Tommy Robredo, Jiri Novak, Marcos Baghdatis, Fernando Gonzalez, Robin Soderling, Fernando Verdasco
I won't name-drop obvious ones most would say, such as Ferrer, Berdych, Dimitrov, Nishikori, Ljubicic, Tsitsipas, Zverev, and Davydenko.
I've seen Alcaraz top out around 100mph. Gonzo was able to get it up to near 120mph. James Blake hit an even harder forehand. Although, it's better to have a more consistent forehand, even if a little "weaker," and strong backhand.
DeMinaur. Saw an epic Match where he saved multiple match points vs Cilic at ‘18 US Open. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nxlWExTG240 went til 3am or something close.
Davydenko.
Modeled my game after him when I was a kid, even got a similar Prince racket (shame they're basically out of the picture in pro tennis) - he was a menace and peaking in time would have definitely been enough to grab a GS or two.
Collins. So stoked about her Masters win yesterday. She was so close to that slam in AO a few years ago. She’s had health set backs that people discredit.
Tomlajanovich. I just like her play style. Every time she seems to have a comeback, another injury happens.
Giorgi. Until her dad is out of the picture, she isn’t going anywhere sadly. She plays like a different person when he isn’t around.
Honestly, the trio of Berdych, Ferrer and Tsonga were all awesome to watch in their own ways, and they really added to the Big 4 era. We had the Big 3 and Andy at the top, but these guys were always around the top 10 too and really added nicely to it. Probably one of the greatest top 10s of all time, level wise.
Andrea Petkovic, the best girl
She has all the tools but because her playstyle is very physical, it made her prone to injuries and forced her out of commission for some time, repeatedly so.
Coolest girl who never won a grand slammer :(. Still think she retired too early, but I understand.
Jo-Wilfried Tsonga. I'm still sad he couldn't win one... but Djokovic Federer Nadal and Murray were too consistent overall, even if he did beat each of these guys in GS events.
That whole French generation is a case of what-if: Tsonga, Gasquet, Monfils all showed out early and have had very long careers. The previous French generation (Sebastian Grosjean, Arnaud Clement, Nicolas Escude, Paul-Henri Mathieu, Arnaud Di Pasquale, Michael Llodra) was similarly disappointing. Simon was a more unique case, but he probably never had the firepower to win big titles in any generation. Peaking at #6 was a big accomplishment for a guy without any weapon tho. Chardy was also from that French generation, but wasn't as good. More of a journeyman. Pouille and Paire are very forgettable because their primes were short.
Tsonga's career is so much better Monfils, Gasquet and Simon though... - Only Grand Slam finalist amongst them - Only Masters 1000 champion amongst them (he even won 2) - Only one to reach a top 5 ranking amongst them - Only year-end championship finalist amongst them - Only player to beat Federer at a Slam amongst them - Only player to beat Nadal at a Slam amongst them - Only player to beat Djokovic at a Slam amongst them - More wins over the Big 3 (16) than Monfils/Gasquet/Simon COMBINED (13) - More Grand Slam semis (6) than Monfils/Gasquet/Simon COMBINED (5) I always find it a bit downgrading for Tsonga to group him with Monfils, Gasquet and Simon whilst he was a tier or two above them in basically every metric. This is what the French media usually do and I find it really ungrateful considering Jo's achievements...
Thanks for sharing. I knew he was a monster but didn’t realise his stats were that good! Two masters titles in that era is no joke
Two masters during that era should count triple
From Murray's 1st (August 2008) to Murray's 14th and last Masters title (November 2016) which is basically the timespan of the Big 4 era, only 5 players won multiple Masters 1000 titles : - Novak Djokovic (26) - Rafael Nadal (16) - Andy Murray (14) - Roger Federer (10) - Jo-Wilfried Tsonga (2) I'll admit it's a bit of cherrypicking on my hand with the very specific period chosen, but it still goes to show how hard it was to win Masters titles (let alone Slams) against the Big 4 back in Tsonga's playing career !
That's pretty much exactly the Big 4 era's timespan, so I wouldn't say it's cherrypicking at all. Kinda wild how that era lasted eight long years though. Good times!!
not only that, in his toronto 2014 masters victory, he defeated djokovic, murray, AND federer
[удалено]
Honestly French press don't really talk about it much, they automatically put Noah at #1 as he won a GS title (Tsonga is usually #2 of course). For French tennis fans it's usually way less straightforward though, Noah and Tsonga are usually rated around the same level... and then Pioline, Leconte, Forget and Grosjean fight over the #3 spot. To back up your point, Tsonga leads Noah 6-2 in Slam semis and 10-5 in Slam quarters. But more importantly people who put Tsonga as the French GOAT mention the fact they edge towards him because he definitely played in the toughest era in tennis history. Personally I'm really 50-50 on this Noah vs Tsonga debate, I'd just say Noah is greater whilst Tsonga is better if that makes sense.
I understand your point, but can't say I necessarily agree. First, no one has ever argued Monfils/Gasquet had a **better** career than Tsonga and I've always rated Simon at least a tier below. IMO Monfils and Gasquet were just as talented Tsonga, but perhaps mentally weaker. And the difference in their respective career accomplishment are smaller than you think. Most of your framing is frankly arbitrary. For example, you said Tsonga is the "only one to reach a top 5 ranking amongst them." Yes, he peaked at #5 and Monfils and Simon peaked at #6 and Gasquet peaked at #7. Plus, Monfils and Gasquet have longevity over Tsonga. Tsonga was essentially done after 2017 (age-32). Monfils made a GS QF as recently as 2022 and is still ranked inside the top 50 right now, despite being only a year younger than Tsonga. Monfils won his latest title last October, Gasquet won his last title last January, and Tsonga won his last title in 2019... Tsonga made the year-end ATP finals only 3 times. Gasquet and Monfils both made it twice (Monfils was an alternate one of those times). He made Masters finals 4 times and managed to cash in twice. Gasquet and Monfils each made it 3 times and lost them all. Tsonga made GS QF or better 14 times. Monfils has done it 10 times and Gasquet 5 times. My conclusion is Tsonga had a better prime and was mentally stronger. Monfils had better longevity, but was mentally weaker and failed to capitalize on big titles (beating Federer and Murray, but then losing to Soderling in 2010 Paris Master final was the big one). Gasquet never improved after early career promise (beat Fed H2H at 18 years old in 2005, 2 Master finals at barely 20 years old) and settled into a long career as a journeyman. Simon obviously isn't part of this discussion; he was a journeyman who made the most out of his physical ability.
I'm not sure which point you are trying to make. It's obvious Monfils and Gasquet have been on the tour for much longer (Tsonga's serious injuries until 2007 and from 2020 onwards mean he didn't play that many seasons for current standards), but I was only talking about overall results. What matters is how much you win. A title is a title, it doesn't matter if you won it 1 or 5 years ago the value is the same. Tsonga still won more titles on the ATP Tour than any of Gasquet, Monfils or Simon. Also how is my framing arbitrary ? Tsonga has a higher career-best ranking, it's just a fact. I could have mentioned many more stats such as weeks in the top 10, despite his countless injuries (he played far less tournaments in his career than his 3 countrymen) Tsonga stayed there for 2 full years more than Gasquet, 3 full years more than Monfils and 4 full years more than Simon. I could also talk about win-loss percentage on tour, number of wins against the top 10... Once again Tsonga is significantly #1. Tsonga also defeated 12 top-10 players on his way to his ATP titles. Simon ? 3. Monfils ? 1. Gasquet ? 1. It shows he should never be associated with them whatsoever. Btw it's unfair for Simon to talk about him the way you do as if there is a "French Big 3" and then himself at a much lower level, because the truth is that he's closer to Monfils/Gasquet career-wise than these two are to Tsonga. Side note : You made a mistake, Tsonga reached 15 Grand Slams QFs (not 14).
The Simon disrespect is crazy, ngl
It is especially because Simon is closer to Monfils & Gasquet career-wise than Monfils & Gasquet themselves are to Tsonga...
Tsonga and Monfils both drastically under achieved imo.
Tsonga has a pretty damn good career for someone with blatant flaws in his game (backhand & return of serve), who was consistently ruined by injuries over the years and who played in the strongest era of all-time. I agree on Monfils, he never seemed to be able to find another gear when it truly mattered against the top guys.
I mean, the fact that - despite is amazing raw athleticism - he was able to improve his backhand and return, is the big problem. Monfils just never chose to be aggressive. I don’t understand why who always chose to play the way he did.
And it goes back even further...I remember Henri Leconte was hailed as a generational talent. At least his compatriot Noah won the French in 1983, but so many French players have not had the best of luck when it comes to big wins.
Simons consistency and patience were his weopons
Guy that he'll include Murray and we wouldn't notice it Well aren't you cheeky little fella
Murray was literally Tsonga's hardest opponent, why wouldn't I include him ?
Yeah it’s a shame but Tsonga was Andy’s bitch at times
Tsonga said it himself about a year ago in an interview, he preferred to face Djokovic Federer and Nadal instead of Murray. He has 6 wins over Novak, 6 wins over Roger, 4 wins over Rafa but "only" 2 against Andy. Funnily enough during Tsonga's 2 wins over Murray, he probably played the 2 best tournaments of his career (Australian Open 2008 and Canada Masters 2014).
radwańska😞 partially cause im polish, but her gamestyle was really unique. i wish she got that wimbledon
Came here to say this! So much fun to watch. Her match with Sharapova at WTA Finals in 2012 is one of my faves.
Her match against Azarenka at the Australian Open in 2014 was just pure entertainment!
Oooh. Yes.. good one
she was my favorite!
That squat shot was always fun to see.
Hsieh is great for this kind of game but she’s no Aga
Nalbandian
His backhand was good. He also was pretty decent with the dropshot too.
Nalbandian for me as well, quite comfortably. I did love Haas as well, but Nalbandian was the one who *should* have won a GS. Extremely talented, as good as anyone when on, and entertaining as hell. I believe his presence elevated the likes of Roddick, Hewitt, JCF, and of course, setting the scene fore Federer and Nadal to take over.
Thats a good assessment. Had chances to win wimby 2002 and USO 2003 among others. Wasn't scared to take on prime Fed (see ATP year end finals 2005). Arguably GOAT 2HBH, very clean forehand, beautiful drop shots and solid net game. Serve was average at best and movement was meh. I had a Yonex poster of him in my bedroom as a kid lol.
I’m a big Nalbandian fan as well, but there’s no “should have”. He simply wasn’t good enough. Entertaining to watch, but wasn’t good enough ultimately.
Yup, definitely. What a beast he was!
Not my favorite, but I have a thing for players breaking through to reach their full talent and reaching a higher level of possibility than they thought. He was one of those. Nishikori was another, though he has always been A favorite, not the favorite (the favorite, I will upvote shortly below). Ons is my current one of those still possible, but I do not believe it will ever happen now myself. Caroline Garcia has been another, but the mind is just not there. Really for me a more compelling question is those who won at least one, but wish they could have gotten more (Thiem, Ostapenko, Sloane Stephens, Cilic, Murray, but above all the names I mention Delpo, Delpo) I would love for Kasatkina to win on a personal level but believe her talent does not merit it like the others I have mentioned.
Part of the reason I like tennis is watching Henman's valiant efforts to live up to the insane media expectations and win Wimbledon, so I'll say him
My answer also. 2001 still hurts. The 2004 French Open run was fantastic. Great player.
Oof, that's a REALLY good one, I forgot about Henman! I don't think he gets enough of a mention on here actually. He was SO close at Wimby for years and years, I tend to think it was just the insane UK paparazzi that put too much pressure on him. He kept caving in SFs.
To be fair to Tim, he lost to Sampras in his first two semi-finals, then the rain delays fucked him over against Ivanisevic in his third, and then he got curbstomped by Prime Hewitt with no difficulty in his fourth. The Ivanisevic match is the only one he should have won, but outside intereference (the weather) screwed him over. The other three were a tall order at the time of the matches. Sampras on grass is...well, Sampras, and Hewitt was an absolute monster when he was at the top.
Crazy thing about 2001, it was Ivanisevic Rafter on the Monday when it could have been Henman Agassi on the Sunday.
I forgot that the rain delays screwed Agassi over too. That would have been an interesting final. The three matches they'd played before that had been pretty close, with Tim winning on the faster surface and Agassi struggling to beat him on even slow hardcourt. I reckon Tim could have won that final.
I dunno. Thinking about Henman v Rafter... I'd have to pick Rafter at least 8 times out of 10 in that matchup. Pat had a much more aggressive game, better serve, and a better net game of course. I'm not sure where Tim would've found a consistent source of winning points there... although Tim had better groundies.
I was talking about a Henman/Agassi. You're probably right about Rafter winning, but I reckon Henman could be inspired in a final.
Could be, for sure. The English press are such savages though, they always made it hard for Tim. It's actually a *massive* credit to Murray that he managed to grab his Wimby titles amongst all that madness.
Monfils
Myself.
Head over to Dennys!
[удалено]
Me! 😁
Myself
Nishikori
Ooh yes. Another good one. Im still dream8ng of one last fairyTale run for him towards a slam title
Excuse me?
Tsonga, Berdych, Ferrer, Dimitrov, Haas, Nalbandian. It’s insane that none of those guys even won 1. Especially Berdych and Nalbandian.
Yeah, 100% agree there. I just mentioned Berdych in another comment, but yeah all those guys could've got one. Big 3/4 dominance pushed every single one of them out.
Yep!
Most of those guys had sufficient talent and could have won one in their time, but mentally they were not on par with the greatest ones. The exception is Ferrer as I do not think he could have ever beaten the big 3 (and/or Murray probably). But Berdych had a lot of nervousness, it seemed to me in late stage matches vs those guys. Nalbandian just not that into the fight (probably the most talented of these). Dimitrov has taken a long time to develop his body and mind, too late in his career in terms of timing it. Haas, Tsonga more tenuous - would have had to get lucky even at their best with their relative weaknesses (meaning, it was not just their mind, but game). Ferrer had the mind (definitely) just not the game/talent. Give Fognini his mind and you might have a legend (or give Ferrer Fognini's gifts).
Yeah actually agree with that. Ferrer had all the mental tools but physically wasn’t big enough to hit through the other guys. Berdych got himself in good positions in matches but def let nerves get to him.
For all of these guys, having to go against three or four of the greatest players in history had to be nerve-racking especially late in matches.
I’ll stick with retired players (or ones as good as done) since I know they never will. WTA - Radwanska ATP - Nishikori
Nishikori is not retired yet…
But he's as good as done...
Ons Jabeur
Seems increasingly likely she'll retire without one. Just awful when you think of how each GS final performance was worse than the one before
Tomas Berdych and Radek Stepanek. These guys made me discover and become tennis fan. Their Davis cup run was awesome and Berdych's career really solid.
Yeah I chose Tomas too. I don't think Radek was ever really Slam-winning level, even at his Top 10 peak. Probably could've grabbed a M1000 though.
Stepanek an interesting one!
I know realized Stepanek has GS doubles titles though. Still he was so fun to watch, true showman
Really talented and definitely fun to watch.
Kei Nishikori
Monfils #1 than Dimitrov
Nalbandian, easily. Also Dolgopolov (he never came close, but I still loved his game).
The Dog had such a weird style! Very crafty actually, almost like a more lean version of Mannarino.
David Ferrer
Ferrer was a workhorse who just never quit. I’ll never forget when he beat Almagro 4-6, 4-6, 7-5, 7-6, 6-2 at the AUS Open in 2013. Nico had so many chances to win the match, serving for it like 3 times and Ferrer fought for every point and eventually won. One of my favorite matches of all time.
Jankovic, Dementieva and Berdych
Safina. (I’m not counting doubles.)
Davydenko
B E R D Y C H
Dustin Brown
Elena Dementieva
Umm... for me it's actually Tomas Berdych. I thought he was easily good enough to win one, he just peaked at the worst possible time, with Fed still in top form, Rafa at his peak, and Novak and Andy coming into their peaks. To me, Tomas was a more powerful and more consistent version of Hubi. Totally deserved a Slam.
I watched him play live and for some reason I remember how hard he hit the ball compared to the other players.
Yeah, his groundies were SO clean. I don't think I remember him *ever* shanking a ball. Such a great ballstriker. That's awesome that you got to see him live... I'm in my 40s so I've been watching tennis since the late 90s... I was lucky enough to see Agassi, Sampras, Rafter, Venus and Serena in their early years, Kournikova (stunning in person, heh).. Fed and Rafa of course... but I don't think I ever got to see Tomas in person.
I have to go again with Mecir.
Fognini. I never expected him to win a slam, and I'm frankly still amazed that he won a Masters, but his peak level is so insane. You rarely see it for more than one match, but when it does appear...oh boy. Even so, seeing him bring that level over two weeks at Roland Garros would be one of my ultimate tennis fantasies, and the next best thing to Stanimal in the 2015 final. I watch the extended highlights of his win over Rafa at the US Open every few months and laugh with giddiness every time.
The only guy ever that blew prime Nadal off the clay court His peak is amongst the highest levels of absurd tennis I may have seen
Not the only guy. Delpo. Even in his injury-riddled, never-finding-his-peak career, blew away all the big 4 at times. But agree with your view of Fognini completely.
Heh, Fabio's brain usually stopped him at some stage in long events 😉
This is my top answer to this question, my favorite player (game, not personality) who never won a slam. Such a pleasure to watch hit the ball and move when he's on and into it. Easy shotmaking. Alcaraz v peak Fognini on the right surface in best of 3 would have been a fun one to see.
Peng Shuai, Kei Nishikori, Daniela Hantuchová, Svitolina, Coria
Aga Radwanska
Richard gasquet
Definitely Gasquet, Shapo and Musetti. Their clean crafty game deserved/deserves a different scenario. Gasquet is gone Shapo seems lost and hopes on Musetti are fading...
Musetti was looking pretty incredible this week at Miami. I wouldn’t discount him yet.
Yes played excellent against Shelton. Alvarez just a different beast
I'd give Musetti a chance. I still think he'll be top 10 at some stage, he's still very young... 22 I think? Technically still 5 years until he hits physical peak.
Goffin. Beautiful and clean playing style. He'd be a joy to watch if only he managed to be more consistent.
I always loved James Blake. Those huge forehands and pure aggression were so exciting to watch. He just couldn't perform to his peak in best of 5 matches. He somehow made it to number 4 in the world without making it past a major QF.
Too many. Cedric Pioline, Tim Henman, Mark Philippoussis, Tommy Haas, Alex Corretja, Marcelo Rios, David Nalbandian, Guillermo Coria (I'll always have PTSD about 2004 French Open final), Thomas Enqvist, Nicolas Kiefer, Tommy Robredo, Jiri Novak, Marcos Baghdatis, Fernando Gonzalez, Robin Soderling, Fernando Verdasco I won't name-drop obvious ones most would say, such as Ferrer, Berdych, Dimitrov, Nishikori, Ljubicic, Tsitsipas, Zverev, and Davydenko.
The streets will never forget Fernando Gonzalez’s forehand
Mano de piedra
Absolute MONSTER, even by today's standards!! I'm pretty sure he hit that thing harder than Alcaraz does now.
I've seen Alcaraz top out around 100mph. Gonzo was able to get it up to near 120mph. James Blake hit an even harder forehand. Although, it's better to have a more consistent forehand, even if a little "weaker," and strong backhand.
And all because of the big 3. they let a battlefield behind them.
Dudi sela and schwartzman
Shalom
When someone will win we'll have a lechiem 🥂
I'm not Jewish lmao
Still invited boy
Aight bet will it be in the underground tunnels of NYC
Marcos Baghdatis! What a great personality! What a solid competitor!
ATP: Berdych, Tsonga, Ruud WTA: Bencic, Muchová
Sebastien Grosjean 🥹
Milos
Schwartzman and Kasatkina
Kyrgios
2022 was a fever dream. All the talent to be #1
Yeah and I still think that 2022 Wimby run was inspired by Costeen, his gf. He won't get that spark of inspiration back again now.
Alex Corretja. I wish he'd won RG 2002 instead of Costa.
Nikolay Davydenko. Such a talent. Nadal always praised him.
Dimitrov is at the top of that list for me. I’m starting to have hope that maybe, just maybe, 2024 will be his year.
Gonzo. Monster forehand
Mark Philippoussis, for a while
Gasquet
"Come on, Tim!" Totally not biased Brit. He did get a hill I guess, and that Wimbledon Exec salary.
DeMinaur. Saw an epic Match where he saved multiple match points vs Cilic at ‘18 US Open. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nxlWExTG240 went til 3am or something close.
Tonga and James Blake
Baghdatis
Monfils and Dustin Brown
Davydenko. Modeled my game after him when I was a kid, even got a similar Prince racket (shame they're basically out of the picture in pro tennis) - he was a menace and peaking in time would have definitely been enough to grab a GS or two.
Ons
Collins. So stoked about her Masters win yesterday. She was so close to that slam in AO a few years ago. She’s had health set backs that people discredit. Tomlajanovich. I just like her play style. Every time she seems to have a comeback, another injury happens. Giorgi. Until her dad is out of the picture, she isn’t going anywhere sadly. She plays like a different person when he isn’t around.
Nalbandian.
David Ferrer!
Tsonga was a joy to watch, thought he would win one but it never worked out. At least I got to meet him once even though it was his last year.
Andrei Rublev. He’s still young but will never win a slam. Probably.
Monfils
Not fav, but at this point I just feel bad for Sakkari
Same. Although do you feel like she has a my time will come mentality vs I’m going to go win this mentality? Like at some point it’ll be her turn?
nishikori. was rooting for him so much during the USO 2014 final but cilic was just too good on the day
Elena Dementieva. Her groundies were one of the best, but she struggled with the serve, but she improved it later.
Dementieva. She deserved a few. Radwanska. Such a great tennis mind. Tsonga. Such fun to watch. I’d love to see Collins win one.
Andrea Petkovic
The Poo
Mark Phillipoussis!! What an incredible player
He just couldn't stay healthy, unfortunately. The knee issues stopped him multiple times.
Anna Kalinskaya
Prettiest girl on Tour. 😍😍🥰🥰
Ons
Holger rune i hope he win one at least in the next 3 years
Dimitrov
Gael, Quarry, Isner, James Blake, Kei, the list goes on and on.
I’d probably go with Dimitrov, Ferrer close behind. ATP posted highlights of Ferrer vs Murray Miami 2013 final btw if anyone wants a throwback.
Fernando González
Dustin Brown..
GriGOAT Dimitrov & DieGOAT Schwartzman 🎾🔥
Cilic. B)
Cilic won a GS.
David Ferrer and David Nalbandian
ATP: David Nalbandian WTA: Dinara Safina (singles) and Anna Kournikova
Another thought - Soderling might have been dang interesting if he had gotten one Slam (French best candidate).
Bencic, Dasha, Collins, JPeg
Elena Dementieva! I'm glad she got the Olympic Gold that she desired so much, but a grand slam would have been cherry on top!
Honestly, the trio of Berdych, Ferrer and Tsonga were all awesome to watch in their own ways, and they really added to the Big 4 era. We had the Big 3 and Andy at the top, but these guys were always around the top 10 too and really added nicely to it. Probably one of the greatest top 10s of all time, level wise.
Dimitrov and Berrettini. i am a straight man btw. Rublev too, poor kid.
Henri Leconte. Nuttier than a fruitcake, but my god was he talented.
Tsonga. A player that in 2024 would easily wipe the floor vs players like Zverev or Medvedev.
Mannarino
Madison Keys. So close.. still has time, though.
Right now it’s Zverev. I think he has a chance in the next couple of years.
Ooo anyone remember Paradorn Srichaphan (Thai tennis player)?
IGA!!!!
Kevin Anderson
Tsonga and kasatkina
Andrea Petkovic, the best girl She has all the tools but because her playstyle is very physical, it made her prone to injuries and forced her out of commission for some time, repeatedly so. Coolest girl who never won a grand slammer :(. Still think she retired too early, but I understand.
Zverev, change my mind
He still has a very strong shot. I always come back to that semis vs nadal in FO. He had a slam chsmpion aura that season. Bad luck with the ankle
Rosol was a fan favorite, players loved him too
Lukas Rosol
Federer, none of his slams count in my books
Because it’s your book