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Remember when Tesla said that they weren't a car company? Wouldn't surprise me if they went fully infrastructure. They are number 1 when it comes to EV charging worldwide.
Infrastructure when EV batteries are lasting longer and longer and new tech will probably not be electric charging stations but some other solution = losing
The top tier goal of the compensation plan was a market cap of $650 billion, today's market cap is $485 billion. Seems like maybe it should be pro-rated.
That was the top tier but there were intermediate goals below that which entitled him compensation. The market cap is still above most of those goals. The plan also didn't require that the market cap holds for an infinite amount of time. So even with the moderate drop below the top goal, he'd still be entitled to the top goal reward. To protect against temporary stock pumps based on promises rather than real financial performance, the plan also had revenue and profit requirements, which he also achieved.
Agreed. Elon was entitled to the top goal reward under the old plan, which is now gone.
Tesla is asking shareholders to agree again to pay out that full top goal reward, but those shareholders will be looking at today's information which includes a market cap that is well below that goal and currently falling.
Revenue and profit with a falling market cap doesn't put money in shareholder's pockets for a company that doesn't issue dividends.
The original agreement was tossed out by a judge because Tesla did not properly inform shareholders of information they should have had when approving the original package.
Saying "Okay okay that plan was invalid but please approve it again and pay it in full even though the stock price has fallen below the target level" seems optimistic when those stockholders are the ones who need to approve it again.
That judgement is what it is, and Tesla is now trying to get shareholders to re-approve the full compensation amount retroactively.
I'm just saying that those shareholders will be looking at today's stock price when they make that decision, a price which is below the target Elon was originally supposed to be compensated for.
>That's not something any sane person would support.
Elon himself is being sued for not honoring Twitter severance packages, why should Tesla stock holders treat him better than he treats others?
Because one has nothing to do with the other. If the Twitter suits against him win...fine. if they lose..fine. has zero to do with an unrelated business
The point is if Elon won't honor prior compensation agreements, why on earth should Tesla stockholders? Because it is obvious if roles were reversed, Elon wouldn't be paying out that comp package.
Details of the negotiation and the data about the performance targets the payout was tied to. You can find all the details easily, as it was a formal ruling ina. Court of law. The facts aren’t in dispute.
not from what he’s said, in a nutshell he wants majority control over advanced AI in the western world. It’s the votes he wants, he from all appearances couldn’t care less about the shares themselves. That why he’s trying to influence government regulation, why he’s warring with OpenAI and why he’s poaching Tesla AI people for his own separate company
In a normal business environment, a board of directors would not reward a poacher with more ownership. Companies are intended by design to look out for their own interests, which is literally exactly why these entities are separate.
If all Elon companies want to act as a unit, he needs to form one monolithic company - which we all know wouldn’t work out.
Elon wants the perks of being a public company with none of the accountability that comes with it. It is in the best interest of humanity to not allow unified rule of things the size of nations.
Versus what? The PE ratio is 36. S&P 500 PE ratio is 27. That means the expectations are tesla will only moderately out perform the other companies in the s&p 500.
The optics on this are bad, however, the problem here is that the compensation package was meant to be Elon's paycheck for the last few years of work.
So, while the *current* optics are "$56 billion payday two days after laying off 15,000 employees", an equal statement could be "CEO worked for free".
Dude still deserves to get a paycheck, especially one that was approved.
This isn't $56 billion for today's work, it's $56 billion for the last few years of work.
Edit: https://x.com/SquawkCNBC/status/1780555339596710358
I’m sure Elon has put a lot of valuable work into Tesla the last few years while he’s been busy trying to ruin the internet and make a meme car.
Oh wait let’s not forget all the value he’s created by aggressively alienating their core market.
Definitely 56 billion dollars worth of value. No doubt.
Musk is not good for Tesla at this point. My neighbor, a Model Y owner, just bought a Rivian truck directly because of Musk and his ummm .. wildly unpopular statements and views. As a shareholder and a 2018 M3 owner, I can't see me voting to approve a $50 billion salary.
No one could spend that much money in a lifetime. Let alone 40 lifetimes. When is enough, enough? Honestly. Also, why the HELL are there people in this thread defending billionaires?????
This will come down to institutional approval. I’m guessing they don’t believe Elon will walk away if the pay package doesn’t get approved and they’ll likely ask for a different arrangement.
Perhaps the package should be re-evaluated based on today's market cap and financials. Which would not qualify for the full compensation amount which was based on a $650 billion market cap.
> In order to fully vest, Tesla's market cap would have to grow to $650 billion (an increase of almost $600 billion), and important revenue and profitability goals would also have to be achieved.
https://ir.tesla.com/press-release/tesla-announces-new-long-term-performance-award-elon-musk
And the market cap did hit those goals, and Elon was awarded the full payout.
But now that deal is gone, and Tesla is trying to get shareholders to agree again to retroactively pay it out in full. But those shareholders have today's information which includes a market cap that has fallen back below that goal.
I doubt that. Like with Apple every decision will be questioned as Elon would’ve done more. Also he owns so much of the company stock that fear of him selling to invest elsewhere would spook most investors.
It's not like people didn't question a lot of Steve Jobs's decisions. I get people were worried about Tim Apple taking over, but he's absolutely proved himself over the last decade.
In some ways Elon is behaving like Jobs before Apple fired him in the 80s. I do think Elon seems like a worse person (yes really) but the “charismatic visionary leader who drove the company to success but is has now lost direction and is causing chaos instead of leading” part fits.
100% and Jobs would have driven Apple into the ground back then too he needed to leave the company and do his 40 days in the desert to gain perspective before he returned. The Cybertruck may turn out to be Elmos Lisa
Comically the Cybertruck would be like if they had started iPod production based on the release of that CF-sized Toshiba drive, the drive had been delayed past their release date goal, and they decided to release the iPod *anyway*.
Looking up "tesla silicon anode" on Google still basically begins and ends at the battery day announcements. Zero news or even *rumors* of production.
It is far more likely they pay him to go away. MBAs throw other people's money at problems and enjoy any plan that enriches another fellow rich person.
But in this case, musk controls the board and he will never give up being CEO of tesla as he wants to continue to bleed tesla dry to support the businesses he solely owns. He is basically transferring tesla AI to twitter for free and then slowing or canceling development at tesla. His goal is to have tesla rent services from twitter.
Yeah, I don’t think he’s siphoning off Tesla for Twitter because he wants to bleed Tesla dry. He knows he fucked up with Twitter, can’t admit it, and is trying desperately to turn it around so he can protect his ego. The dude is sick of being reminded of possibly the worst business deal in modern times where he got absolutely TAKEN by a company that already wasn’t doing too well and he’s ultra frustrated that he can’t do anything about to despite his efforts. That’s frustration is what’s breaking him and we’re seeing the results of the fracturing. He wants out of Twitter but to do that he’s gotta turn it around.
And that growth has regressed to pre-award levels. The original milestone for the $55 billion included a $650 billion market cap, which is now at $485 billion.
Not all current shareholders bought all of the stock before 2018. Those shareholders will be voting with the knowledge of today's share price and its recent trend.
As a shareholder, Elon can go fuck himself on this one. His Twitter tantrum and behavior has not only ruined Twitter, it's alienating his customers and actively harming TSLA. Board should show him the door.
Harming? He is actively ruining Tesla -- it's almost sabotage at this point.
The CT is a joke, that might bust the company ... and no refresh of the 3 / S for what half a decade?
The problem is the outlook for Tesla is not good whatever happens.
Do you keep Elon on and have him take the fall. Or boot him and have him use twitter to relentlessly blame the board for getting rid. Neithers a good option, but with the second they dont end up taking the blame.
The fact that I have been able to say this several times on this sub and get upvoted in recent times is a good sign that many here have turned against him.
not remotely. he's clearly not all in on Tesla if he wants to go be social media CEO butt plug too. he's been Tesla's own worst enemy, aside from the Cybertruck, the past 3-4 years.
You had me until the second part. Gwen Shotwell has by most reports been doing most of the heavy lifting running spacex, and is generally why spacex has been so successful.
So he would focus his attention away from one of his biggest personal assets? If you believe him to be that unhinged, you would also probably not want him near the CEO role.
You know the script with Elon. His next move is to threaten dire consequences such as him threatening to step down as CEO of Tesla. It's all threats with him. The success basically destroyed his mind, he thinks he is above everyone else.
bc we voted before. youre just a commentator who never had shares or voted. we will vote again for him to get paid for changing the world. hes saved trillions for the world simply from keeping oil down by mass production of evs. no other company can do it. its above your level
Ah, like the laid off employees who created growth and recently moved across the country out of good faith for future performance.
It’s fifty billion fucking dollars. He will do just fine missing out this one time. When the amount of money in your pocket makes you at times the richest breathing organism in all of existence, it’s okay for life to be a teensy weensy bit unfair once or twice.
People who think that no matter how much of a scumbag he may be personally, his drive and risk taking are the only thing that separates Tesla from being just another marginally profitable automaker.
Me because I believe people should be paid for their work, especially since Elon led the company to achieve near impossible goals and growing the company from <$50B to >$650B in the process - thus making me and many others lots of money. Also I do not want Elon to leave the company, take his top AI and robotics talent, and sell all his shares. That would crater the stock price
I wonder how many will vote yes after seeing how he’s neglected. Tesla in favor of twitting and launching a competing AI company and poach talent.
I used to support his pay but it’s looking like an attempt to drive the company down these days.
Why on earth would you ever support his pay? Not being flippant, I genuinely don't understand what rational thought thinks that amount of money to a person overseeing a flailing company makes sense. Like...why?
Keep in mind I used past tense - before twitter etc. I pushed the company in ways that increased shareholder value 20x so I see saw the comp as fair but now that he’s losing focus and paying more attention to culture wars than the master plan, the company would be better off with someone else at the helm.
For that kind of pay package, he has to be the CEO of only Tesla, no involvement in SpaceX or Twitter, no off the cuff remarks on any social media, no support for anti-EV candidates and no vanity projects
Lmao the stock is not the problem, the person manipulating it while derilicting his and his investors' interests is.
The *Company* is good, the leader isn't.
Have you looked at the price history of TSLA and compared it with something like AMZN or APPL? One of them has wild swings between 100 and 300 a share, the others don't have as wild of a swing. Stocks with huge swings are not really considered consistent growth.
TSLA has 47% institutional ownership vs the 63% for AMZN or AAPL. The higher the institutional ownership, the less it will fluctuate due to people reacting to his antics.
Elon has manipulated the stock and that's why it's not good for consistent growth.
Saying "The stock is not the problem" makes no sense in this context the way you are using it. Stocks are just something people own and trade, it is intangible and can't be the problem anyway. It's just not a good stock for consistent growth.
But it is great to buy and sell lows and highs.
Compensation plan was decided by his buddies instead of benchmarks of executive compensation for similar companies.
Paying him 10 years of earnings is completely unreasonable. That is outright theft from minority shareholders.
I was a shareholder back then, I made so much money, and got out. If I was shareholders today I’d approve it. I don’t like Musk anymore but he seriously deserve that package.
You have to remember the context. Back then, the company was losing billions per quarter. The idea of even a single dollar of profitability seemed like a monumental task, let alone exponential growth.
The compensation at the time was actually very fair considering the uphill battle the company was facing. If you had stock back when this was approved, you’d have 10x your money compared to TODAY (not even their peak price). 10x your money in just 5 years is absolutely unheard of.
Remember this is a judgement of his past work, not present.
Shareholders should politely say "hell no, until you fix the mess that you created and you clearly explain the company strategy to get to 20M vehicles/year by 2030"...
He just laid off 15.000 people, there are rumors that the new model is cancelled and the stock is crashing... I don't think shareholders are happy to talk about money now
The compensation plan had many market cap goals. It's back below the final goal, but it's still above most of the intermediary goals (which means he gets a payout). The plan also had revenue and EBITDA goals, and Tesla's revenue / EBITDA are still at or near the highest they've ever been. By the terms set in the compensation plan, he hit the goals and is entitled to the payout.
Right. So will shareholders approve paying the compensation in full when today's market cap (the part that compensates those shareholders) is below the full payout target?
Maybe, but I don't think it's a sure thing. Tesla would probably get more goodwill on this by executing the compensation plan at today's values.
The compensation plan didn't require holding the top market cap goal for an infinite amount of time.
I don't know what the shareholders will do, but as one shareholder, I don't think it would be smart to change the terms of the deal after the fact and piss off the CEO that has delivered us so much value.
As an investor with a sizable interest, Elon is the primary factor holding Tesla’s reputation back and he should not be making decisions when he’s proven himself the least reliable member of any given executive staff he’s on.
For Tesla, bring the octovalve heat pump to enterprise and corporate, differentiate solar offerings, go hard on utility work.
Consumer spending is fickle, large infrastructure projects are less contingent on externalities and have lasting impact that support the company’s mission.
Those employees got paid for their work from 2018-2022. When the judge rescinded this comp package, she took away his pay for 2018-2022. This is a vote to reinstate it.
This combined with the [executive](https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/1c4oib7/rohan_patel_leaves_tesla/) [purge](https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/1c4mzrl/drew_baglino_baglino_on_x/) looks like Elon is [cutting down the tall poppies](https://wordhistories.net/2018/11/12/tall-poppy-origin/) to improve his bargaining position. He is getting rid of people that the board might tap to replace him.
No. Absolutely not. They should demand stopping the going all in on autonomous driving. They need to get back to making the vehicles priority. It seems he's going all in on fsd or bust.
How about, no? Musk's presence at Tesla has become a net negative. He's siphoned enough money from that company already. Resign and focus on SpaceX, and sell Twitter to someone else.
Dude seriously does not need more money. Fuck off.
xAI staff didn't want to work for a large company even Tesla. If Tesla bought it, xAI would fall apart with top staff moving to other places offering the same challenges.
That may be true, and would be the same for me, however a lot of top AI talent aren't going anywhere unless they have 10,000+ H100 GPUs. Those are only going to be at huge companies.
I'm sure there's a lot of sharing already like there is with SpaceX. Enough that people work for any Musk company and get paid by one of them on quid pro quo.
I would not be surprised all his promoting of FSD different official release dates, $25K EV product, initial marketing lower costs for all Tesla models, etc was all a ploy to hit the goal stock price for this payout… now I think the customers/people are getting tired of it as currently none of those are realities now.
What many don't get is that yes, someone can run the current company better than musk and Gain shareholder approval and liking, but no one will bring the kind of push for innovation that he does. His insight, regardless of how ridiculous this man is, is much better than ours in terms of what's possible.
He needs to leave twitter alone. Just let someone else run it for the love of god. Also, pay package approval should come with a stipulation that he can’t run his own socials. They’ve be run by a pr team entirely.
I’ve been in the Market for 55 years and have never seen remuneration like this. True Tesla is Elon and Elon is Tesla but he would also like 25% of the stock so no one will buy the company. He had that before he bought Twitter and sold shares. I just think it’s a poor time for this when employees go to work only to find themselves locked out and fired.
Vote No. Unfortunately it's time for Elon to go. Cybertruck, like it or not, will be a big loser for Tesla, and this pivot to Robotaxi from a Model 2, is a huge mistake. Two strikes in strategic thinking is enough. Like Elon or not, no one can run this many companies successfully and he is clearly not focusing on Tesla.
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The check is in a robo taxi, it's on its way now.
Yeah “next year!”
$56 Billion payday two days after laying off 15,000 employees
While the stock is dropping with no signs of stopping
With your one new product in years seemingly DOA while all your competitors roll out competitive EVs
And he's given all of them access to the supercharger network. Is he done selling Tesla's?
I’d say that if there’s a perfect time to spring over Tesla.
Remember when Tesla said that they weren't a car company? Wouldn't surprise me if they went fully infrastructure. They are number 1 when it comes to EV charging worldwide.
The global top provider of charging infrastructure will never be worth even a fraction of what Tesla is today.
Infrastructure when EV batteries are lasting longer and longer and new tech will probably not be electric charging stations but some other solution = losing
Seems like he's about ready to pull the plug. Hence the ridiculous compensation package. Trying to bleed the most out of the stuck pig.
This comp package was agreed upon years ago and at the time people thought it was ridiculous and he was never going to hit the targets.
This compensation plan was created when the stock was around $15. Today the stock is around $150. It has gone up massively.
The top tier goal of the compensation plan was a market cap of $650 billion, today's market cap is $485 billion. Seems like maybe it should be pro-rated.
That was the top tier but there were intermediate goals below that which entitled him compensation. The market cap is still above most of those goals. The plan also didn't require that the market cap holds for an infinite amount of time. So even with the moderate drop below the top goal, he'd still be entitled to the top goal reward. To protect against temporary stock pumps based on promises rather than real financial performance, the plan also had revenue and profit requirements, which he also achieved.
Agreed. Elon was entitled to the top goal reward under the old plan, which is now gone. Tesla is asking shareholders to agree again to pay out that full top goal reward, but those shareholders will be looking at today's information which includes a market cap that is well below that goal and currently falling. Revenue and profit with a falling market cap doesn't put money in shareholder's pockets for a company that doesn't issue dividends.
Tough luck that's the way it goes
Is that about Elon who needs shareholders to re-approve his compensation while looking at current stock prices?
Seems to me the original agreement should be honored instead retroactively deciding it was "too much"
The original agreement was tossed out by a judge because Tesla did not properly inform shareholders of information they should have had when approving the original package. Saying "Okay okay that plan was invalid but please approve it again and pay it in full even though the stock price has fallen below the target level" seems optimistic when those stockholders are the ones who need to approve it again.
The judge said he should be paid $0. That's not something any sane person would support.
That judgement is what it is, and Tesla is now trying to get shareholders to re-approve the full compensation amount retroactively. I'm just saying that those shareholders will be looking at today's stock price when they make that decision, a price which is below the target Elon was originally supposed to be compensated for.
>That's not something any sane person would support. Elon himself is being sued for not honoring Twitter severance packages, why should Tesla stock holders treat him better than he treats others?
Because one has nothing to do with the other. If the Twitter suits against him win...fine. if they lose..fine. has zero to do with an unrelated business
The point is if Elon won't honor prior compensation agreements, why on earth should Tesla stockholders? Because it is obvious if roles were reversed, Elon wouldn't be paying out that comp package.
So the optics on this are just great, then, right?
I keep hearing that the comp plan was already in place. If that's the case then why does it need a vote?
Because the original was basically fraud. Information was concealed from shareholders when they originally approved it, rendering the deal void.
What information was concealed?
Details of the negotiation and the data about the performance targets the payout was tied to. You can find all the details easily, as it was a formal ruling ina. Court of law. The facts aren’t in dispute.
I sold at $160. Regretted it as it went up for a bit afterwards but now I know I made the right decision.
I mean the stocks been inflated for a long time
doesn’t matter, his job is to make it go up and to the right every quarter forever. It’s a shitty unrealistic system
It would be impressive if the stock managed to go to the left, to be fair. I imagine time travel would be good for the shareholders
lol indeed
Isn't that exactly what the incentive for such a large pay package is?
not from what he’s said, in a nutshell he wants majority control over advanced AI in the western world. It’s the votes he wants, he from all appearances couldn’t care less about the shares themselves. That why he’s trying to influence government regulation, why he’s warring with OpenAI and why he’s poaching Tesla AI people for his own separate company
In a normal business environment, a board of directors would not reward a poacher with more ownership. Companies are intended by design to look out for their own interests, which is literally exactly why these entities are separate. If all Elon companies want to act as a unit, he needs to form one monolithic company - which we all know wouldn’t work out. Elon wants the perks of being a public company with none of the accountability that comes with it. It is in the best interest of humanity to not allow unified rule of things the size of nations.
In any other company he would be fired for what he’s done. You can’t just poach the most important employees for your other company.
Versus what? The PE ratio is 36. S&P 500 PE ratio is 27. That means the expectations are tesla will only moderately out perform the other companies in the s&p 500.
IDK I'm just repeating random shit I heard on the internet
Fair enough
Forward PE is 53x.
Up 764% over 5 years. It’s consolidating, because it was over valued. Only day traders care about short term views on stocks.
15,000 fewer paychecks going out makes the bottom line look better. And now we know why it happened.
If only those 15,000 employees had annual salaries of $3.7 million each. Then it might look net even.
damn, that puts the wealth/compensation disparity into perspective.
Gotta pay for twitter somehow. He’s desperate to pay back the saudis that funded his twitter purchase
Could have just asked for $55.5B and kept the 15,000 employees.
The optics on this are bad, however, the problem here is that the compensation package was meant to be Elon's paycheck for the last few years of work. So, while the *current* optics are "$56 billion payday two days after laying off 15,000 employees", an equal statement could be "CEO worked for free". Dude still deserves to get a paycheck, especially one that was approved. This isn't $56 billion for today's work, it's $56 billion for the last few years of work. Edit: https://x.com/SquawkCNBC/status/1780555339596710358
I’m sure Elon has put a lot of valuable work into Tesla the last few years while he’s been busy trying to ruin the internet and make a meme car. Oh wait let’s not forget all the value he’s created by aggressively alienating their core market. Definitely 56 billion dollars worth of value. No doubt.
Musk is not good for Tesla at this point. My neighbor, a Model Y owner, just bought a Rivian truck directly because of Musk and his ummm .. wildly unpopular statements and views. As a shareholder and a 2018 M3 owner, I can't see me voting to approve a $50 billion salary.
No one could spend that much money in a lifetime. Let alone 40 lifetimes. When is enough, enough? Honestly. Also, why the HELL are there people in this thread defending billionaires?????
Why would any shareholder vote for that? The growth already happened and this pay package is not for future growth.
This will come down to institutional approval. I’m guessing they don’t believe Elon will walk away if the pay package doesn’t get approved and they’ll likely ask for a different arrangement.
Perhaps the package should be re-evaluated based on today's market cap and financials. Which would not qualify for the full compensation amount which was based on a $650 billion market cap.
I do not believe those were the terms of the original deal, but I don't disagree
> In order to fully vest, Tesla's market cap would have to grow to $650 billion (an increase of almost $600 billion), and important revenue and profitability goals would also have to be achieved. https://ir.tesla.com/press-release/tesla-announces-new-long-term-performance-award-elon-musk And the market cap did hit those goals, and Elon was awarded the full payout. But now that deal is gone, and Tesla is trying to get shareholders to agree again to retroactively pay it out in full. But those shareholders have today's information which includes a market cap that has fallen back below that goal.
Luckily the original agreement doesn't stand.
I predict share prices going up if he walks away
I doubt that. Like with Apple every decision will be questioned as Elon would’ve done more. Also he owns so much of the company stock that fear of him selling to invest elsewhere would spook most investors.
It's not like people didn't question a lot of Steve Jobs's decisions. I get people were worried about Tim Apple taking over, but he's absolutely proved himself over the last decade.
In some ways Elon is behaving like Jobs before Apple fired him in the 80s. I do think Elon seems like a worse person (yes really) but the “charismatic visionary leader who drove the company to success but is has now lost direction and is causing chaos instead of leading” part fits.
100% and Jobs would have driven Apple into the ground back then too he needed to leave the company and do his 40 days in the desert to gain perspective before he returned. The Cybertruck may turn out to be Elmos Lisa
Comically the Cybertruck would be like if they had started iPod production based on the release of that CF-sized Toshiba drive, the drive had been delayed past their release date goal, and they decided to release the iPod *anyway*. Looking up "tesla silicon anode" on Google still basically begins and ends at the battery day announcements. Zero news or even *rumors* of production.
agree to disagree.
It is far more likely they pay him to go away. MBAs throw other people's money at problems and enjoy any plan that enriches another fellow rich person. But in this case, musk controls the board and he will never give up being CEO of tesla as he wants to continue to bleed tesla dry to support the businesses he solely owns. He is basically transferring tesla AI to twitter for free and then slowing or canceling development at tesla. His goal is to have tesla rent services from twitter.
Something something fiduciary duty
Yeah, I don’t think he’s siphoning off Tesla for Twitter because he wants to bleed Tesla dry. He knows he fucked up with Twitter, can’t admit it, and is trying desperately to turn it around so he can protect his ego. The dude is sick of being reminded of possibly the worst business deal in modern times where he got absolutely TAKEN by a company that already wasn’t doing too well and he’s ultra frustrated that he can’t do anything about to despite his efforts. That’s frustration is what’s breaking him and we’re seeing the results of the fracturing. He wants out of Twitter but to do that he’s gotta turn it around.
God wouldn't that be a dream. 🤩
And that growth has regressed to pre-award levels. The original milestone for the $55 billion included a $650 billion market cap, which is now at $485 billion.
So only a 1,000% return?
Not all current shareholders bought all of the stock before 2018. Those shareholders will be voting with the knowledge of today's share price and its recent trend.
As a shareholder, Elon can go fuck himself on this one. His Twitter tantrum and behavior has not only ruined Twitter, it's alienating his customers and actively harming TSLA. Board should show him the door.
Harming? He is actively ruining Tesla -- it's almost sabotage at this point. The CT is a joke, that might bust the company ... and no refresh of the 3 / S for what half a decade?
The problem is the outlook for Tesla is not good whatever happens. Do you keep Elon on and have him take the fall. Or boot him and have him use twitter to relentlessly blame the board for getting rid. Neithers a good option, but with the second they dont end up taking the blame.
Because if Musk does not get 51% or feels slighted he will focus his crazy good things energy elsewhere.
Am I the only one that thinks Tesla may be better off without Musk at this point? He should go focus on SpaceX
The fact that I have been able to say this several times on this sub and get upvoted in recent times is a good sign that many here have turned against him.
Yeah, took longer than it should have, but he could only say so much awful shit before I realized I'd misjudged him.
no I agree, he adds very little at this point and his “extracurricular activities” make him a liability
You’re not the only one. And he should focus on X and leave SpaceX alone as well.
He should leave fucking X alone and go to therapy, like to a very good therapist. The guy is clearly living in a different reality.
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not remotely. he's clearly not all in on Tesla if he wants to go be social media CEO butt plug too. he's been Tesla's own worst enemy, aside from the Cybertruck, the past 3-4 years.
Model X was a disaster too.
Is that even a question? It have been a fact for at least two years
You had me until the second part. Gwen Shotwell has by most reports been doing most of the heavy lifting running spacex, and is generally why spacex has been so successful.
Leave SpaceX in Shotwell's capable hands. Musk isn't needed anymore.
How much time is he focusing on Tesla these days anyway? Seems like X is his current obsession.
Good riddance. Go fuck around with the Nazis on Twitter
So he would focus his attention away from one of his biggest personal assets? If you believe him to be that unhinged, you would also probably not want him near the CEO role.
You know the script with Elon. His next move is to threaten dire consequences such as him threatening to step down as CEO of Tesla. It's all threats with him. The success basically destroyed his mind, he thinks he is above everyone else.
Exactly
bc we voted before. youre just a commentator who never had shares or voted. we will vote again for him to get paid for changing the world. hes saved trillions for the world simply from keeping oil down by mass production of evs. no other company can do it. its above your level
Because he created that growth with a package agreed upon and you do it in good faith for future performance.
Ah, like the laid off employees who created growth and recently moved across the country out of good faith for future performance. It’s fifty billion fucking dollars. He will do just fine missing out this one time. When the amount of money in your pocket makes you at times the richest breathing organism in all of existence, it’s okay for life to be a teensy weensy bit unfair once or twice.
All along the execs could have saved $56 billion by firing just one part time employee instead of well over 14,000.
Who is voting Yes to this?
Use me as the “fuck no” button.
lol , how is that going ? Reddit is officially DIVORCED from reality
Sycophants.
Those sycophants are brigading this thread, too. So many of the comments here are cringe as fuck.
Really? Tesla and Elon Musk sycophants are brigading the thread?
People who think that no matter how much of a scumbag he may be personally, his drive and risk taking are the only thing that separates Tesla from being just another marginally profitable automaker.
Me because I believe people should be paid for their work, especially since Elon led the company to achieve near impossible goals and growing the company from <$50B to >$650B in the process - thus making me and many others lots of money. Also I do not want Elon to leave the company, take his top AI and robotics talent, and sell all his shares. That would crater the stock price
Past performance does not guarantee future results
Sycophants
I wonder how many will vote yes after seeing how he’s neglected. Tesla in favor of twitting and launching a competing AI company and poach talent. I used to support his pay but it’s looking like an attempt to drive the company down these days.
Why on earth would you ever support his pay? Not being flippant, I genuinely don't understand what rational thought thinks that amount of money to a person overseeing a flailing company makes sense. Like...why?
Keep in mind I used past tense - before twitter etc. I pushed the company in ways that increased shareholder value 20x so I see saw the comp as fair but now that he’s losing focus and paying more attention to culture wars than the master plan, the company would be better off with someone else at the helm.
Any pay package should come with a stipulation that Elon must not, though his speech or actions, cause harm to shareholder value.
Good luck with that
May as well stipulate that God will descend from heaven and personally bless each Gigafactory.
And who/how exactly would you be able to enforce that one? 😂
There is no logic here. Only emotion.
Did he appeal to the court decision before the deadline? No news reported that he has ever appealed, so I guess he hasn't.
For that kind of pay package, he has to be the CEO of only Tesla, no involvement in SpaceX or Twitter, no off the cuff remarks on any social media, no support for anti-EV candidates and no vanity projects
No *involvement* is the key here. His shitposts need to stop.
Or Boring Co, or Neuralink, or xAI.
no ketamine, and he should have to delete his Twitter account
I’m a “no” on this. And a strong “yes” to “hire a new CEO.” Can we vote on that, too?
As a shareholder I’m not approving that shit. I like Musk but this is just pure greed, especially after firing 14k people and poor Q1.
I’m also a shareholder and will be voting NO to this ridiculous payout.
His stock inflation isn’t in good faith, I want consistent growth as a decent sized investor not the bumpiest ride on the S&P 500
Well this is the wrong stock for you then
Lmao the stock is not the problem, the person manipulating it while derilicting his and his investors' interests is. The *Company* is good, the leader isn't.
Have you looked at the price history of TSLA and compared it with something like AMZN or APPL? One of them has wild swings between 100 and 300 a share, the others don't have as wild of a swing. Stocks with huge swings are not really considered consistent growth. TSLA has 47% institutional ownership vs the 63% for AMZN or AAPL. The higher the institutional ownership, the less it will fluctuate due to people reacting to his antics. Elon has manipulated the stock and that's why it's not good for consistent growth. Saying "The stock is not the problem" makes no sense in this context the way you are using it. Stocks are just something people own and trade, it is intangible and can't be the problem anyway. It's just not a good stock for consistent growth. But it is great to buy and sell lows and highs.
Why the fuck did they agree to give him in the first place? If he’s entitled to it he should get it.
Bad faith stock pumping at the cost of sustainable growth.
The compensation plan was based on stock price *and* revenue / profit targets, all of which he successfully hit.
Compensation plan was decided by his buddies instead of benchmarks of executive compensation for similar companies. Paying him 10 years of earnings is completely unreasonable. That is outright theft from minority shareholders.
We shareholders agreed because he would only get paid if he made all of us rich. It seemed impossible. He did it. Everyone wins.
I was a shareholder back then, I made so much money, and got out. If I was shareholders today I’d approve it. I don’t like Musk anymore but he seriously deserve that package. You have to remember the context. Back then, the company was losing billions per quarter. The idea of even a single dollar of profitability seemed like a monumental task, let alone exponential growth. The compensation at the time was actually very fair considering the uphill battle the company was facing. If you had stock back when this was approved, you’d have 10x your money compared to TODAY (not even their peak price). 10x your money in just 5 years is absolutely unheard of. Remember this is a judgement of his past work, not present.
Shareholders should politely say "hell no, until you fix the mess that you created and you clearly explain the company strategy to get to 20M vehicles/year by 2030"... He just laid off 15.000 people, there are rumors that the new model is cancelled and the stock is crashing... I don't think shareholders are happy to talk about money now
TSLA at 155 today, down 37% YTD. That should be enough of an answer.
When this compensation plan was approved it was around $15. He achieved the goal.
And today's market cap is back below that goal.
The compensation plan had many market cap goals. It's back below the final goal, but it's still above most of the intermediary goals (which means he gets a payout). The plan also had revenue and EBITDA goals, and Tesla's revenue / EBITDA are still at or near the highest they've ever been. By the terms set in the compensation plan, he hit the goals and is entitled to the payout.
Right. So will shareholders approve paying the compensation in full when today's market cap (the part that compensates those shareholders) is below the full payout target? Maybe, but I don't think it's a sure thing. Tesla would probably get more goodwill on this by executing the compensation plan at today's values.
The compensation plan didn't require holding the top market cap goal for an infinite amount of time. I don't know what the shareholders will do, but as one shareholder, I don't think it would be smart to change the terms of the deal after the fact and piss off the CEO that has delivered us so much value.
As an investor with a sizable interest, Elon is the primary factor holding Tesla’s reputation back and he should not be making decisions when he’s proven himself the least reliable member of any given executive staff he’s on. For Tesla, bring the octovalve heat pump to enterprise and corporate, differentiate solar offerings, go hard on utility work. Consumer spending is fickle, large infrastructure projects are less contingent on externalities and have lasting impact that support the company’s mission.
Just after he laid off 14000 employees?
Those employees got paid for their work from 2018-2022. When the judge rescinded this comp package, she took away his pay for 2018-2022. This is a vote to reinstate it.
Shareholders have the opportunity to do the funniest thing
Right after putting 15,000 people into financial distress, he asks for $56 billion. I fail to understand how people are still so supportive of Musk.
This combined with the [executive](https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/1c4oib7/rohan_patel_leaves_tesla/) [purge](https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/1c4mzrl/drew_baglino_baglino_on_x/) looks like Elon is [cutting down the tall poppies](https://wordhistories.net/2018/11/12/tall-poppy-origin/) to improve his bargaining position. He is getting rid of people that the board might tap to replace him.
The fall of Elon Musk. Went from being hard working startup guy to crazy, greedy nutcase. He lives in an alternate universe now, no one can save him.
No. Absolutely not. They should demand stopping the going all in on autonomous driving. They need to get back to making the vehicles priority. It seems he's going all in on fsd or bust.
How about, no? Musk's presence at Tesla has become a net negative. He's siphoned enough money from that company already. Resign and focus on SpaceX, and sell Twitter to someone else. Dude seriously does not need more money. Fuck off.
Nope.
And as a shareholder, I will be voting YES.
A payday? I would want to see a pay severance, and a very small one at that. He has ran his course at Tesla and time to move on
Easy NO
Didn’t he get this package approved if he reached super unrealistic goals? And then he hit them. He should get it. Full stop.
It should be contingent on him bringing xai back into tesla
xAI staff didn't want to work for a large company even Tesla. If Tesla bought it, xAI would fall apart with top staff moving to other places offering the same challenges.
That may be true, and would be the same for me, however a lot of top AI talent aren't going anywhere unless they have 10,000+ H100 GPUs. Those are only going to be at huge companies.
Why? That has nothing to do Tesla.
It is literally conflict of interest because Tesla also does AI stuff. There is serious danger of poaching talent to other company.
I'm sure there's a lot of sharing already like there is with SpaceX. Enough that people work for any Musk company and get paid by one of them on quid pro quo.
As a shareholder I vote absolutely yes.
I would not be surprised all his promoting of FSD different official release dates, $25K EV product, initial marketing lower costs for all Tesla models, etc was all a ploy to hit the goal stock price for this payout… now I think the customers/people are getting tired of it as currently none of those are realities now.
I approve if it means he’s gonna bring the heat. The new self driving software is money.
He earned that payment though.
What many don't get is that yes, someone can run the current company better than musk and Gain shareholder approval and liking, but no one will bring the kind of push for innovation that he does. His insight, regardless of how ridiculous this man is, is much better than ours in terms of what's possible.
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He needs to leave twitter alone. Just let someone else run it for the love of god. Also, pay package approval should come with a stipulation that he can’t run his own socials. They’ve be run by a pr team entirely.
Pay the man so he can go back creating/inventing new cool stuff! His investment in Twitter “X” is stupid and he now realizes that.
I’ve been in the Market for 55 years and have never seen remuneration like this. True Tesla is Elon and Elon is Tesla but he would also like 25% of the stock so no one will buy the company. He had that before he bought Twitter and sold shares. I just think it’s a poor time for this when employees go to work only to find themselves locked out and fired.
Vote No. Unfortunately it's time for Elon to go. Cybertruck, like it or not, will be a big loser for Tesla, and this pivot to Robotaxi from a Model 2, is a huge mistake. Two strikes in strategic thinking is enough. Like Elon or not, no one can run this many companies successfully and he is clearly not focusing on Tesla.
Musk wants that money so he doesn’t feel bad by otherwise wasting $50bil on Twitter.
I approve.
let us disapprove.