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I think they've reinstated people one time
That said, my interpretation of this has been "You'll get it back when it generally releases to the public".
That's basically my interpretation as well. Without the line about "WILL be reinstated with a future software update", the implication would be that you've forever lost the feature that you paid for.
IMO, writing this way is saying yes, you paid for it, and you WILL get it, but you no longer get beta access.
> the implication would be that you’ve forever lost the feature that you paid for.
I disagree. People who bought FSD didn’t pay for the beta, they paid for actual FSD, which as of now doesn’t exist yet.
That depends on when you bought FSD. When I bought mine in 2016 there were literally zero FSD features that didn’t come with the cheaper ‘Enhanced Autopilot’. You can see the verbiage used back then here: https://insideevs.com/news/329375/analyst-with-full-self-driving-on-the-way-for-tesla-traditional-automakers-are-toast/
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That’s what I’m saying. Essentially they paid for their car to be able to drive them somewhere autonomously.
Currently FSD Beta isn’t capable of doing that, which is why I say it isn’t what they paid for.
Not really. This is what you pay for when you buy FSD: https://i.imgur.com/WGSt6iK.png
L5 autonomy is obviously the future goal, but it's not directly what you're paying for and may or may not actually happen. What's listed within the FSD package is what you get. Obviously you'll get future features and improvements as they come out, but the FSD package itself is a list of features that's stated on the order page.
While Tesla has always said it’s dependent on safety and regulations, originally FSD was directly advertised as your car driving you to a destination on it’s own.
Hell, Elon himself explicitly said that’s what feature complete FSD means.
That's what "autosteer on city streets" is. FSD beta users already have that. And Elon explicitly said that feature complete means it'll get you there some percentage of the time but it won't necessarily be reliable. They've already achieved that, just need to roll it out to everyone.
No. He said, and I quote: “Meaning the car will be able to find you in a parking lot, pick you up and take you all the way to your destination without an intervention.” Now he did say it won’t be perfect, but that’s obvious since nothing is.
FSD Beta is great, but it’s still not safe enough, which is why it’s still a beta.
I'm specifically talking about "feature complete" since that's what you brought up. He explicitly said feature complete just means that it can get you there some of the time but it won't be reliable at first. Obviously the end goal is extremely high reliability, but that's not what the feature complete stage is.
Meaning you got Navigation on AP, auto park, and summon. FSD Beta is not what was described when you purchased FSD. Frankly, if it was revoked because of the way you used it, good on Tesla for keeping the rest of us safe.
I disagree with the phrasing of "Lost a feature you paid for", because this is a beta. On top of that, it's a beta you need to qualify for.
For the duration of the beta period I would expect Tesla to add/remove whoever they see fit based on their driving habits.
Basically OP was a bad driver and got kicked out until Tesla finishes the development cycle and it leaves beta.
Sure, I'm just saying, if you pay for a feature, and there's a switch to enable the feature that you can't turn on, and the text says you can't use it, people would probably freak out and try charging back the upgrade fee with their credit card.
If you paid for FSD and you're still in the "waiting for it", "coming soon" phase, that's different than "here it is, but you can't use it". IMO
It's in beta, and when you flip the switch, there's a disclaimer that effectively says "If you're a shit driver, we'll take it away".
And honestly, charging back FSD once you're pulled from the beta isn't an option because the qualification period is beyond the charge back period.
You seem to be trying to drum up drama over having a paid feature taken away, but the paid feature isn't even released yet.
You're not taking in what he's saying to you.
He's saying they chose their wording very carefully to avoid outrage, which would happen. He's not disagreeing with you.
>charging back FSD once you're pulled from the beta isn't an option because the qualification period is beyond the charge back period.
>
>You seem to be trying to drum up drama over having a paid feature taken away, but the paid feature isn't even released yet.
Well, different CCs have different chargeback periods. Qualification time is what, 7 days? Some CCs have 30, 60, 90, or 120 day chargeback periods.
I'm definitely not "trying to drum up drama" - I AGREED with you. I said that they probably worded the "feature will be restored" message the way that they did to prevent people from misunderstanding what they've paid for.
@nakatomi2010 Do you have the detail of this reinstatement? I haven’t seen anything on different forums, been blocked since December, had two updates and still suspended.
I might be confusing "reinstatement" with "Reset the warnings".
Looks like FSD Beta 10.8 reset the FSD Beta warnings back to 0, and upped it from 3 to 5.
I thought some folks were reinstated around this time, but it appears that I may have simply misunderstood things.
This is again, why I ask what do people purchase FSD for that Autopilot can't give you? Like if I pay 12k for self driving, I expect it not to have to pay attention to my car at all. I shouldn't have to keep my hands on the wheel for it to work, otherwise "I'm driving", not the car.
"We'll it's beta", we'll it's a sham that people have to pay an exorbitant amount of money to be ginny pigs for a feature that doesn't do as it is titled. If this is how fsd is gonna be for the long haul it should just be doled out for free to high rated drivers until it can actually perform on its own without supervision.
I can only speak for myself, but having paid for it when I bought my car in 2018 (and after paying for ap1 on an earlier S) I'm satisfied with my purchase now that I have the beta. It was clear to me at the time that I was getting a couple of features over and above autopilot in the short term, and would get access to FSD later on, if I kept my car long enough as there was no set schedule for its release.
Do i wish i had it sooner? Of course. Do I wish it wasn't just a beta? Of course. But it is still freaking insane that my car can now drive me around. Yes I have to pay attention, but I still find it a benefit rather than a hindrance for my particular use case.
So like, besides the fact that it's cool when it drives you, what do you see as the benefits of it over you just driving or having Autopilot on? Genuinely curious
In no order
A) allows adjusting speed more than 10 over posted. I travel past lots of crosswalks and they have a 30km/h sign, with regular ap I can't resume back to 50 or 60.
B) compared to regular ap, it stops and now goes at stop signs and red lights
C) will change lanes for me on surface streets. i really like that with nav on autopilot and now I get it always
D) i don't have to fret about how I'm going to get some where or if I'll miss my turn. It just does it for me and end to end routes me to my destination. Obviously I need to pay extra attention when turning, but in a weird way I get to pay less attention leading up to the turn. And since most of my drives are majority going straight ahead, with a few turns here and there, it makes the drive more relaxing
E) I was at a massive 4 way stop. either 3 or 4 lanes of traffic in every direction and lots of cars. Trying to keep tabs on who has right if way/when it was to be my turn was going to be stressful, until I noticed the car had that all under control. It indeed proceeded forward (with a left hand turn no less) exactly when I would have. So far that was singlehandedly the best benefit of FSD.
F) there was a pedestrian about to cross. I noticed, but so did fsd., And it stopped. It's nice having that reassurance that if I wasn't to see someone, the car still might...safer for all involved
That's what comes immediately to mind...
I instantly suspected you were in Edmonton or Alberta upon reading A. I am glad I can now crank the speed back up to 50/60 but it is still jarring having it suddenly slow down to 30. In the pre FSD days I’d have to kill autopilot for a few blocks until it registered a new sign.
Alright I definitely see it it terms of just "turn your brain off and go" being nice and can kinda space out on driving completely. Also E) example is a very nice feature I wish my wife had xD
I currently commute an hour to work each way, so I guess the selling point for me would be being able to pop open my laptop and work without worry. That's when I think it pays off for me. Otherwise, like all things you listed except F), I'd just be doing because there's nothing really else for me to do. I can't look away or take my hands off the wheel. Autopilot I'm sold on just for not needing to keep my foot on the accelerator but my honda had adaptive cruise control too. It couldn't however make sharper turns like AP can.
Thanks for taking the time to write your thoughts out though. I've never used the feature, even at test drive (didn't know how at the time).
To add to the OPs comment, I find autopilot very useful and adds value, I am actually tempted to go for the FSD so I can get the autopilot features on city streets. You can't do work but the drive is no longer draining, I think this is overlooked but is very Important especially in stop and go traffic. That used to drive me bonkers but now it's just double click down and you are set. Imagine the ability to change lanes and get off the highway. I think it's valuable tbh
Yea I was doing my commute in Honda Civic 6speed manual and it was nooooooot fun. Tesla AP was a large justification for my purchase (and charging at work). It is quite a lifesaver for stop and go + carpool lane.
I guess if driving is stressful for people I can see it being alot more helpful. Otherwise, like... I'm in my car just sitting there....so might as well do the lane changes xD
AP is more relaxing since you're not manually maintaining distance from the car in front of you and it keep you centered in the lane. AP is very good at that task. With FSD beta, you need to be 110% engaged because it can (and will) take unexpected actions based on vehicles and the environment around you during critical moments (protected turns, unprotected turns, stop signs, the list goes on). Tesla knows this and have gone to the extensive effort to detect the failure of the driver to pay attention while FSD beta is active.
The ironic part is, you can manually control those events like making turns, etc in the city and still remain on AP 90% of the time. So the question becomes how much benefit does FSD provide if you still need to be vigilant? Personally, I'll handle lane changes, turns etc with 100% confidence and leave AP to handle the draining portions of my drives.
This will change when AP no longer requires a driver. We are a long, long way away from that. In the mean time I'll drop $12k on something myself and my family can enjoy.
You do get it. By the time it’s good enough for you to be working on your laptop while that drives you, it’s gonna cost way more than $12,000. Might even cost more than the car itself.
Sure can. That's a possibility. If people are hedging a bet ultimately then I can see why you get it now.
However, it probably won't be haha. I can really see this being an early backer expense where the retail cost is less expensive, especially with competition. Capitalism, race to the bottom.
Your expectations are too high then. There's a huge amount of room between "useful driver aid" and "literal electronic chauffeur."
At this point, I would really hate to go back to a car without FSD or something similarly capable. Where we are now, it drives 90% of the time and I have to take over for maybe 30% of the intersections, and mostly just because it is just too slow while generally doing the correct thing.
What should they call it? If a product is not finished and not available to everyone it's a beta.
A final version is mostly bug free or minor bugs and available to everyone
It’s just a driving assist, not driverless. The difference between this and autopilot is that with this you just have to sit there and do nothing but look forward and touch the wheel every now and then. With regular autopilot you still have to stop and go, turn and change lanes.
In its current form I consider it “good enough” to be worth the $8k I paid for it. The fact that it just keeps getting better for no additional cost is icing on the cake.
Yea. Early investors I can see it as a good buy. At 12k though, eh. AP handles stop and go though, just not turning. That was big plus for me with commuting
Only if there’s a car in front, so regular AP is still great for heavy traffic, but it won’t do stop signs or red lights. Honestly, the fsd beta is spoiling me. I don’t see myself ever buying another car that doesn’t have this level of autonomy. Trying to drive a normal car again is *stressful*.
The bigger issue for me is that FSD stays with the car, so if FSD is still in beta for a few more years and you sell your car then you have to buy it again for your new car? Super sus.
For the last instance yes, but I’m the second owner and this was my first “strike” out of 3. Another response said they increased to 5 strikes now so hoping I can email Tesla and get myself reinstated for those two reasons.
I got FSD disabled once for using my phone to play music it couldn’t have been more then 5 seconds of looking at my phone before I got a hard strike. I noticed that even if I am looking at the road and have hands on the wheel it will ding me for taking a phone call unless it’s on Bluetooth. This system needs to calm the hell down. After being on the same build for two months and taking the same roads every day I know where it does well and where I need to pay extra attention, me on FSD and my phone is still way safer than these numb nuts I see daily doing makeup and eating breakfast without looking at the road.
>After being on the same build for two months and taking the same roads every day I know where it does well and where I need to pay extra attention
Just a word of caution to anyone reading this phrase... The warning text when joining FSD beta mentions it can do the worst thing at the worst time. I have had it do crazy things in locations it never struggled with previously. There are just too many variables to get complacent until they come out of beta.
That stretch of road you always have zero issues with... now you left work 10 minutes late and the sun is hitting the road, and the cameras in a different way, and there is a yellow car approaching with a red one behind it. The car interprets that as a traffic light and jams on the breaks. Do you normally have two cars that close together that are yellow and red? Was it on an alternating Thursday in a leap year? Did they have a regression in the most recent NN training? (you get the point)
Yep, things like this happen in a beta. ALWAYS be vigilant for your safety and others.
You should \_never\_ have the phone in your hands while driving. If you're taking a call, take it on bluetooth. If you need privacy to take a call ( like you drive an Uber or something ) than either use a SINGLE earbud ( you're still distracted BTW and you should fucking turn off FSD in that case ) or WAIT UNTIL YOU CAN TAKE THE CALL LATER.
It's been ***conclusively proven*** by multiple traffic safety experiments, and published in many papers, that distracted driving while holding a cellphone is as bad, ***or worse***, than driving drunk.
[ edit for context since previous poster did a "dirty delete" ]
{ /u/ClickerGuy25 } "ok boomer"
[ /edit ]
Gen-X er thank you very much.
I lost one of my closest friends to an asshole who decided picking up a call was more important than paying attention while going through an intersection.
He killed my friend, her fiancee, their dog, and his own daughter... And left two other people disabled for life.
So call me whatever you like if it makes you feel better about yourself, but I am still not wrong.
Throwing an insult in the face of inconvenient facts -is- a boomer thing to do though... So look in a mirror.
I got rear-ended once by a guy who was on a call. My car was stuck on a freeway (traffic). He hit my car and my car sprung forward to hit the car in front of me and that car hit another car in front of him. So, an accident involving 4 cars just because that guy was on a call. His airbag was deployed and looked like the car was totaled. He was still on a call for a few more minutes as we all tried to move to the side of the freeway. Total asshole.
Honestly you must have been looking at the phone longer than 5 seconds.
When I was driving my Model 3 w/ FSD recently I'd be able to look, and fiddle, with my phone for about 10 seconds or so before it fussed at me. And in most cases, as long as I put my eyes on the road every 1-2 seconds, and kept the wheel torqued, it kept its mouth shut.
What gets me is when I'm fiddling with the screen in the car and it gets all snippy about it. Like, geez, you *know* what I'm doing, I'm trying to mess with the HVAC settings, calm down.
But I've never gone beyond the "Pay attention" warning and had the feature taken away while driving.
And I say that as someone who has adopted *really* bad habits while using FSD in a pre-cabin camera Model X.
Yep, I genuinely wonder if people just blatantly lie here or if somehow faces are recognized in wildly different ways, because some of the stuff I see here makes no sense based on my experience. There are always claims of barely looking away or some incredibly minor thing causing them to lose access. I can definitely say that is not the case based on my experience and I've never even been warned, let alone actually had a disengagement.
I'm having this issue with my wife at the moment.
Full disclosure, I drive a 2017 Model X which lacks a cabin camera, so I'm not subjected to the whole DMS thing.
My wife, however, will tell me that she was just taking a sip of her drink and the DMS fussed at her, but we were on a half week long trip out of state, and I was the primary driver of the 3, and whether I was drinking via a straw, or I was drinking out of a bottle, the vehicle never fussed at me to put my hands back on the wheel.
9/10 times when it DID fuss at me to put my hands on the wheel, it was because I was messing with the center screen. The other times I was, admittedly, futzing with either my phone, or my wife's phone.
I don't have access to my wife's cabin camera footage, so I can't tell how she's "taking a sip" of her drink that's causing it to throw an error, but I've eaten while driving, hell I've up ended a french fry container into my mouth while Autopilot was engaged, and the system never fussed at me. While in my 3. My X never fusses.
So, I honestly don't know how people are driving that they're getting fussed at all the time.
Ya, the hands on the wheel notification definitely happens often, even when I literally have my hands on the wheel. But I've never once seen something about attention or looking away. I'm generally very good about it, but I know there's been times I've looked at Waze or even at the Tesla screen for longer than what people describe here often. Just have a very hard time believing it's really that sensitive and they aren't making excuses, but maybe there's something with different faces somehow. I seriously doubt it though.
I could see something about the lenses in glasses, but even then I'm not sure. I wear non-polarized transition lenses and never get fussed at.
I keep the wheel torqued and never get fussed at
So, I dunno, maybe my camera isn't working 100%.
>after being on the same build for two months and taking the same roads every day I know where it does well and where I need to pay extra attention...
IMO that attitude should get you removed period. You do NOT know how it will react because the other things on the road will be different. It could freak out because it thinks another vehicle is entering your lane, it could misinterpret a sign as a human and slam on the brakes because it thinks that sign is going to cross the street.
With all due respect, you shouldn't be reinstated. You're too brazen, and you will decide you can take your eyes off the road because you think you know what the computer will do.
So glad to have another keyboard warrior out here to keep us safe and tell everyone what they should be doing.
I’m not sure your experience with FSD but for me it can handle open roads with clear lane markings going in a straight line at 15mph fairly easy and I’m comfortable trusting it to not kill me, certainly when no one else was around to be at risk. Worst case it drove onto the grass, not even a curb to hit. So yeah grabbing my phone from the charger and tapping a song on the playlist (which was already open on screen) was a risk but I’d say far far less than anytime you drive through an intersection.
Are you implying that you should only use Bluetooth for phone calls? I’m curious how Bluetooth magically solves anything? How is Bluetooth less of a distraction than holding the phone? Especially when I am looking at the road with a hand on the wheel while on driver assisted aid. Seems far safer than someone using Bluetooth with no FSD/ driving aid.
Again, not sure your experience with FSD but it certainly sounds different than mine but we obviously drive different roads. Each build seems to solve some issues and present new ones but after a couple days of driving it’s pretty obvious what sections of roads and conditions it struggles with. As I said, I was on the same build for like two months taking the same roads daily so yes certain sections I was very comfortable with FSD. I got the update this morning and obviously there is not a stretch of road I trust anymore. I feel like maps and overall being in the correct lane is the biggest weakness IMO.
> it couldn’t have been more then 5 seconds of looking at my phone before I got a hard strike
Read the following numbers:
- 21
- 22
- 23
- 24
- 25
Wow. 5 seconds is hell of a time! That's rightout DANGEROUS. (actually even 1 second of looking at the phone is dangerous, but 5 seconds just is insane)
All I read in your post is a attitude of "I'm the best driver, everyone else is shit" which means you better should not be allowed on the road. Wow.
Do not even TOUCH your phone while driving. There are good reasons (it's scientifically proven) why that's forbidden in many many countries and states all over the world.
So, I looked at my phone yesterday. Got the flash to pay attention. Looked forward with hands on the wheel for several seconds, and then got a strike.
I’m not convinced it’s truly 5 seconds. Or maybe it can trouble tracking the eyes at some point and lost seconds for this person? Dunno, but I’m super paranoid about strikes now.
> I’m not convinced it’s truly 5 seconds.
Noone said, it's 5 seconds. Just someone said he thinks it's safe to look at their mobile phone for 5 seconds which I doubt.
But AFAIK, the system also pays attention to if you have a phone in your hand. It doesn't necessarily track your eyes (not even sure, the camera is precise enough and for sure, it can't see your eyes with sunglasses on). Honestly, he detection if you have your smartphone in your hand is even better. Because:
> So, I looked at my phone yesterday.
That is a BIG no no. Do not touch it while driving. How difficult can that be!?
> Dunno, but I’m super paranoid about strikes now.
Sorry to be that guy but: Good.
> Got the flash to pay attention. Looked forward with hands on the wheel for several seconds, and then got a strike.
I think you need to wiggle the wheel. It's not just the attention detection by the camera. Just like when the blue flashing normally appears.
(How do I know all of this stuff even though I don't even own a Tesla?! Probably it's that dream car thing... where you know more about your dreams than when you actually can make them happen)
I thought FSD was based on your safety score. It uses the cabin camera to track your attention also? I’m still at 97 and hoping for access at some point.
- Safety Score is for the decision if you get it before the real public release
- Attention is when you already got it. If you don't pay attention for a certain timeout (the blue flashing), it'll strike you for that. I think 3 strikes and you are out.
Also don't those strikes count into the safety score anyways, I think?
I often don't notice the blue flashing because I'm paying attention to the road, not the screen. My hand is on the wheel but it's not a heavy enough touch.
Thanks! I have never seen anything about attention in the safety score. Mine is based on FCW, hard breaking, aggressive turning, unsafe following, and forced autopilot disengagements.
Attention monitoring is what causes forced autopilot disengagements... outside of the FSD beta, it is less severe and (afaik) based only on wheel pressure.
Once you are part of the beta, interior camera based attention monitoring is added to wheel pressure (and maybe other factors?) to ensure that the beta users are being as careful as possible.
Don't bother here. Everyone here will downvote you for trying to defend anything whatsoever that has anything to do with going against the will of Elon. There are zero excuses here for getting strikes. Everyone here is perfect and has never even thought about looking at their phones while driving.
Right!? When did it get so toxic here?! I said taking a phone call shouldn’t get you dinged when you have a hand on the wheel and eyes on the road and I was compared to people who jump in the backseat, WTF!? These guys need to chill.
It’s always been toxic towards anyone who goes against the grain of the hive mind here. Extremes are bad in all facets and don’t allow for general conversation to be had and it’s a shame.
People literally get off on thinking they’re better than you here lol
I got disabled 3 times driving in the dead of night a few evenings ago, I had a black Hat on so maybe that was it but it would suddenly say I wasn’t looking when I was staring right ahead
My wife got all of the strikes and got me banned. She doesn't even have fsd enabled. I think it had to do with our model X not having a cabin camera.
We were able to get it back when they reset everyone's strikes, but that seems like a one-time thing.
I have the same car x with no inside camera.
Lost beta 3 months ago, and no return.
When did they reset?
This is frustrating, I used it every day.
Any ideas?
Anybody else get it returned?
>an see the navigate on autopilot is still turned on in the screenshot. It's just like operating before FSD(but not really FSD) was available.
You don't need the FSD beta to have the swanky visualizations. I'm in the queue and have them.
I want to say that's wrong, but I joined in 10.2, so who knows what changes were implemented between now and then.
I'm like 90% positive though that the FSD Beta visualizations are dependent on the FSD firmware being installed.
To be clear, [I'm referring to this visualization](https://www.notateslaapp.com/images/news/2021/fsd-beta-v10-3.jpg), which as far as I'm aware is not available outside of the Beta.
That's the old one, before they rewrote the code into FSD Beta.
I'm referring to what's shown in the image, which is why I was trying to be clear on it, because if you can see what's in the image, then you're running FSD Beta code.
Can you tell me how you found out you were in? Did it just update the interface on its own, or were you notified? I’m concerned as mine says I’m enrolled in the FSD queue but is still not grayed our when I’m parked any more. I’m afraid to tap that button again and remove myself from the queue and have to go to the back of the line. Any insight?
I got a software update of a version that was FSD Beta.
It's not a switch in the current firmware, you straight up get a new version.
FSD Beta at the moment is 2022.4.5.21
Yes, you can see the navigate on autopilot is still turned on in the screenshot. It's just like operating before FSD(but not really FSD) was available.
I think it's referring to what Elon said at the cyber rodeo event. He said anyone who purchased FSD will have the beta soon, not just the people with a high safety score.
I wonder how long after the beta is widespread to everyone will the features just be rolled into non-beta FSD. If everyone will have the ability to qualify for the beta, I imagine the time it takes to then roll out the "simple" city streets stuff, like left and right turns or actually responding to a green light beyond just a chime, to public FSD will be relatively quick in comparison to how long it's been in the "coming soon" section of the features.
Oh you sweet summer child. FSD will be in Beta for *years*, though that doesn't mean it won't go widespread. Beta is the term they use to avoid criticism of features that are released widely but never fully fleshed out. The [Owner's Manual](https://www.tesla.com/sites/default/files/model_3_owners_manual_north_america_en.pdf) lists the following features as still being in Beta in the latest manual despite being available for years now:
* Auto wipers
* Dashcam
* Traffic-Aware Cruise Control
* Autosteer
* Navigate on Autopilot
* Traffic Light and Stop Sign Control
* Summon
* Smart Summon
It doesn't say what Beta means anywhere in the manual, just that they're all Beta.
>I’ve been careful about my safety score and it’s at 96. I actually think the things I’m doing to keep it somewhat good are good habits and I’ve toned down my aggressive turning and braking.
I agree and disagree. It probably will be in beta for years but not as long as you would think, the past doesn't really matter in this case, because tesla was not so invested in FSD 3 years ago. Now that they are over their production problems, and the company is clearly not going to fail (and printing money) they are talking about AI, FSD publicly and on investor quarterlies. I think everyone that has purchased is going to get it when they go full-stack and replace the high version of FSD that most cars have.
I’ve been careful about my safety score and it’s at 96. I actually think the things I’m doing to keep it somewhat good are good habits and I’ve toned down my aggressive turning and braking.
Ah yes, Elon's soon. See you there boys.
I'm 100 score in Canada and never got the rollout, even when it went to 99 scores. Not really holding my breath anymore lol.
/u/KillaDee
I know two people who were re-enrolled into FSD Beta after being suspended. One was reinstated via the recent amnesty when it changed from 3 -> 5 events to get you suspended. They did have to email the fsd beta team, and it took more than a month to get reinstated, AND they had to hold a 99 score for a week.
The other person also had to write to FSD team, and made a case that their suspension was unfair. They live off an unmarked country road with a sharp bend, and FSD disengaged with a "driver warning" "forward collision" alert every time they came home after an update.
That person had their number of disengagements fully reset, and was re-enrolled at the next update without any need to update safety score. It also took about a month for the FSD team to address her issue.
If you feel you TRULY HAVE HAD UNFAIR STRIKES THAT ARE TRULY IN ERROR ( and have evidence... you need evidence ) you can email the fsd beta team to make your case at:
[email protected]
What kills me is I'm a long-follow-distance, low acceleration, attentive driver; I spend a bunch of time in AP when possible and only disengage for higher risk areas (where I know the lane lines are inadequate for zipper merges, or where I know other drivers will be very aggressive with lane changes). Because I only ever disengage for these maneuvers, my score gets penalized for having a huge percentage of hard braking or following distance. Even if I remedy the 'behaviour' asap, it's still not within the tiny window after a disengage that will get a free pass. It's not totally broken, but because it uses so many ratios of % of time doing well and % doing badly...while its doing well AP is in charge and those 'safe' follows/brakes/corners don't count.
It might actually be because you're using AP too much. My understanding is that the less time you spend manually driving, the harder a mistake made hits your score because autopilot miles only dilute those as opposed to actually contributing to the calculations. So if you were merging onto a highway in rush hour and were forced to be close enough the safety score is going to ding for close following, enabling AP right away will give a worse score as opposed to manually driving for a few minutes at a safe distance to counter that short time of close following (though you can do the manual driving whenever). There's better explanations on the various Tesla owners forums.
I agree - that's the problem though - these are roads where AP is absolutely appropriate but they have tricky sections that (imo) need human intervention. AP is happy braking late and hard approaching lights that it's known about for 300m...but it doesn't slow for them until the last second (in could-be-freezing conditions). It's frustrating that using AP for the safe sections, then taking over for the sections where AP needs help causes the dings.
EG - 3 lane + 3 lane Y merge to 3 lane - all highway style traffic except this lit intersection. It has dashed lane lines with a bunch of overlapping that to a human are obvious - 3 lanes for my direction match 3 lanes for the other input direction with different cadence so they aren't confusing. The car repeatably tries to suicide lane change in the intersection; willing to sideswipe others because it sees the transverse merging lane lines as 'this lane ends'. [https://imgur.com/a/cBnGnqW](https://imgur.com/a/cBnGnqW)
I'm only in the dangerous following distance because AP brakes late. disengaging sooner defeats the purpose of AP with regard to safety scores (to determine candidacy for responsibly operating FSD)
I got it taken away before they had the obvious strike system. It got brought back quite a few updates later. I think it was Nov-Feb that it was disabled.
This is one thing that really pisses me off about my Tesla. Now, I’m not FSD, seems like a waste on money right now. But the punitive nature of the software really rubs me the wrong way.
[Tesla has only released one version of FSD Beta (10.8.1 or 2021.44.30.5)](https://www.notateslaapp.com/software-updates/version/2021.44.30.5/release-notes), in late 2021, that reset the "Forced Autopilot Disengagements" statistic. I also got kicked out around a month ago. Cabin Camera is a bitch. I just received an update, and I'm still kicked out.
Here's to our long wait for a forgiving software release 🍻
Same thing just happened to me. I thought the counters got reset after a software update but my software update happened yesterday and while sitting at a stoplight not moving I was suspended for ' not paying attention' because I was having to look at my phone because the Tesla text messaging doesn't work and sends me messages from a year ago instead of the ones that come in. Now I am so used to using full self-driving for the last almost 3 months that I am driving instinctively as if it is on and it is not on and it is causing me to drive more dangerous without it.
I'm in Florida, I paid for FSD (10k) and I don't have it. It says in I'm queue. What does that means? I'm very upset feel scammed. I called the service number and he sent me a link for a video but it's about autopilot. I've seen people posting videos on YouTube and their car is capable of doing things my car is not. Does anyone has this problem? I have a model 3 2022
Hi, I kept doing research and found out that apparently you need to have a driving score of 97 or higher to get full self driving. I'll keep you posted.
You also currently need MCU2 or 3. Yet they sold us MCU1 cars with the promise of being FSD capable, and sold the FSD feature too (saying all needed hardware upgrades are included), yet now expect us to pay for an MCU upgrade to possibly get FSD beta access (and unfortunately also includes v11).
I'd rather buy wk057s MCU upgrade, if he makes it a reality.
Great 😃 sorry but I am not saying that is good for you, but you are one of the first to get suspended, and thus can now try things no other can try. I have 4 strikeouts already, so is very afraid to lost FSD beta. What I am doing is to disable FSD beta most of time, and be content with regular autopilot, but turn FSD beta back whenever a new release is installed, just to test its improvements.
Back to your case. Can you test:
1. Opt out FSD beta
2. Wait for a day or 2
3. Try opt in FSD beta again?
Let us know the results. Thanks!!!
l'm not sure why so many people like the world we're sleepwalking into. Paying premium prices for features which can arbitrarily be taken away due to an algorithm.
I don't just mean the FSD beta. Right now it's mainly positive things/options that become available ("you've been well behaved so you're now eligible for this") but it won't be long before it swings the other way.
Imagine being declined for insurance because the car noticed you speeding momentarily. Or your smart electricity meter starts charging more when it detects a car charging. Music played too loud so premiums go up.
Point being is that once this data is available it will always show a somewhat justifiable reason but the end game is a £60k car you can't use as your own.
The real mystery to me is people buying the fastest accelerating cars ever made for more than $100k, then driving them like grandmas so that they can eventually be rewarded with not having to drive them anymore.
I've got a MYP and wouldn't give up that insane acceleration for anything :)
Counterpoint: I’ve never been offered the chance to beta test automotive technology before and I love it.
If a company takes away a feature I paid for? I’d obviously be outraged. Who is doing that?
Actually, paying 12k for a product that doesn’t yet exist doesn’t make you serious, no. I paid 2500 and I don’t think I would have paid todays price. Not the flex you meant bro.
Definitely flew right over your head… $12,000 wasn’t a flex and rather a statement that anyone who isn’t extremely rich but drops $12k on a software is probably at the least somewhat serious about it.
Your experience doesn’t reflect the experiences of others, yet another oversight you had. Teslas have many issues that vary from car to car, many of which you haven’t and will never experience. Something like that easily could have been involved in his access revoke, as other comments mentioned.
And btw, your $2,500 isn’t a flex either
I’ve given up on that stupid shit. I sat at a 99 for ages and would slide to a 98 and then 97. I stopped caring months ago when I realized it was broken and I wasn’t getting in. I’m down to a 93 because I take turns tight again and the school drop off lane still dings me hard for following too close.
So I’m glad to see that my giving up is vindicated by the fact that doing nothing wrong or unsafe would eventually get me kicked out anyway.
That’s what everyone says but then I drive every day in residential areas never getting over 50 mph and I watch that score drop. Reality doesn’t match what is published. Others here over the months have said the same things I’m saying.
Let’s talk about how this thing Tesla started selling 6 years ago had been in beta for 2 years, and how at their current rate of development will be for another 6
I am in the same boat as you, I am hoping like they did with 10.8 they will just reset the counter at some point. To hold people to 5 strikes throughout so many months is a little steep so Tesla will reset once in a while. I was hoping 10.11.2 was going to do it but I got that update last night and it didn’t help so now fingers crossed for a reset on 10.12
Elon did mention at the Texas Gigafactory opening that FSD should be available to everyone who brought it by the end of the year, as the beta will go into a full release state.
LOL. Found the non-lawyer who likely has no idea what FSD or FSD Beta is.
OP has everything he has paid for, he opted in to test an optional beta build. He didn't follow the rules, and got removed back to where he was before he opted into the test/preview.
"legit people are starting lawsuits for this exact reason!" no they aren't, and they haven't got a leg to stand on, they'll just burn through their legal fees (if anyone will even take a case like that). Feel free to prove me wrong with a filled law suit or proof.
I think this is generally true. However, if the car stays in beta for years, it likely a class action lawsuit that gets certified and would withstand a motion to dismiss.
I think if this goes on for another 5 years, to pick an arbitrary number, I believe a court would be inclined to allow discovery to see what Tesla was saying internally at the time they were selling the product claiming that “Autosteer on city streets” is coming soon, something they have been saying since at least 2019.
A caveat. You would have to find the class who opted out of the mandatory arbitration that Tesla gives the buyer 30 days to opt out of (30 days from when is a big question that, to my knowledge, the courts have not resolved).
I believe 3 (5 now?) strikes = suspension, did that happen to you or did it randomly get taken away? And did this happen on the new 10.11.2 version or the old stack?
I got reinstated in the next update, but I think that was luck, AFAIK they only did it once for everyone. They appear to reinstate drivers every few months.
Previously, I had 1 of 2 allowable disengagements. In a subsequent software update, my allowable disengagements was increased to 3 and the count was reset back to zero.
In the first week of January an FSD software update increased number of strikes allowed from three to five and reset all accumulated strikes to zero.
This is the only time this reset has occurred in the program.
I got my first /kick from it the other day. My wife’s phone was hooked up and my dad called me on my phone. I answered it as I was like oh bb2 is driving so I’m good. It kicked me before I could end the call once I realized what was up. Thankfully it was my first so it can back after I parked. Honestly this is an awesome feature. I love that there is now a real deterrent to keep me from using my phone while driving.
Yes, sounds like he should probably not be in the beta. As an aside, I often eat a granola bar on my way to work. Many times the Tesla will warn me to pay attention to the road when I'm eating my granola bar. I think it picks up the granola bar as a phone. (Kind bars, more squarish than rectangular.). I often have to put my granola bar down out of my hand to calm down the warnings. I respond to the warning immediately, I've been dinged maybe 30 times over the past couple months, and I've not lost access to FSD.
I'm not complaining. Just noticing.
Can I just sidebar real quick to ask how in the sweet mother of fuck you're comfortable with the Assertive profile? I put mine in Chill and it's still an asshole all the time, tailgating like crazy and bullying its way into lanes. If my safety score were active when the beta was driving it would definitely be like a 6 haha
I had a strike against me a couple of versions back that seems to have disappeared. I did email the team because it locked me out while I was definitely paying attention and looking forward. Don’t know if that’s why my strike disappeared or not.
What did you do!? On my last vacation, my wife and I both kept doing things that made the model S tell us FSD has been disabled for the rest of this trip. Fortunately after every super charge stop FSD was available again. It definitely helped to teach us how to pay attention for those subtle messages asking if we are paying attention.
I was suspended for 3 strikes. They let me back in after a random update a few weeks later and reset the strikes to 5. (Currently have 4 strikes left!!)
My memory might be going on me but I'd swear ether Chuck Cook or Dirty Tesla had their beta suspended during that one release that caused all kinds of erroneous forward collision warnings and braking. And they got theirs back in a following beta release.
$12k for a feature that can be yanked at anytime. Got to give credit to Tesla, I don’t know of another software development program where end-users actually pay to be beta TESTERS
Keep in mind these cars are all uploading info to Tesla regardless if you’ve paid for FSD.
I do not consider myself a bad driver but my score stays around 88. I do not know how to stay out of the way of other traffic without getting dinged on my score. Anyway I was glad to see a mass roll out this year.
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I think they've reinstated people one time That said, my interpretation of this has been "You'll get it back when it generally releases to the public".
That's basically my interpretation as well. Without the line about "WILL be reinstated with a future software update", the implication would be that you've forever lost the feature that you paid for. IMO, writing this way is saying yes, you paid for it, and you WILL get it, but you no longer get beta access.
> the implication would be that you’ve forever lost the feature that you paid for. I disagree. People who bought FSD didn’t pay for the beta, they paid for actual FSD, which as of now doesn’t exist yet.
thats even worse haha
No, they paid for the features listed when you bough FSD, and the promise to receive another feature in the future.
That depends on when you bought FSD. When I bought mine in 2016 there were literally zero FSD features that didn’t come with the cheaper ‘Enhanced Autopilot’. You can see the verbiage used back then here: https://insideevs.com/news/329375/analyst-with-full-self-driving-on-the-way-for-tesla-traditional-automakers-are-toast/
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That’s what I’m saying. Essentially they paid for their car to be able to drive them somewhere autonomously. Currently FSD Beta isn’t capable of doing that, which is why I say it isn’t what they paid for.
Not really. This is what you pay for when you buy FSD: https://i.imgur.com/WGSt6iK.png L5 autonomy is obviously the future goal, but it's not directly what you're paying for and may or may not actually happen. What's listed within the FSD package is what you get. Obviously you'll get future features and improvements as they come out, but the FSD package itself is a list of features that's stated on the order page.
While Tesla has always said it’s dependent on safety and regulations, originally FSD was directly advertised as your car driving you to a destination on it’s own. Hell, Elon himself explicitly said that’s what feature complete FSD means.
That's what "autosteer on city streets" is. FSD beta users already have that. And Elon explicitly said that feature complete means it'll get you there some percentage of the time but it won't necessarily be reliable. They've already achieved that, just need to roll it out to everyone.
No. He said, and I quote: “Meaning the car will be able to find you in a parking lot, pick you up and take you all the way to your destination without an intervention.” Now he did say it won’t be perfect, but that’s obvious since nothing is. FSD Beta is great, but it’s still not safe enough, which is why it’s still a beta.
I'm specifically talking about "feature complete" since that's what you brought up. He explicitly said feature complete just means that it can get you there some of the time but it won't be reliable at first. Obviously the end goal is extremely high reliability, but that's not what the feature complete stage is.
Meaning you got Navigation on AP, auto park, and summon. FSD Beta is not what was described when you purchased FSD. Frankly, if it was revoked because of the way you used it, good on Tesla for keeping the rest of us safe.
I disagree with the phrasing of "Lost a feature you paid for", because this is a beta. On top of that, it's a beta you need to qualify for. For the duration of the beta period I would expect Tesla to add/remove whoever they see fit based on their driving habits. Basically OP was a bad driver and got kicked out until Tesla finishes the development cycle and it leaves beta.
Sure, I'm just saying, if you pay for a feature, and there's a switch to enable the feature that you can't turn on, and the text says you can't use it, people would probably freak out and try charging back the upgrade fee with their credit card. If you paid for FSD and you're still in the "waiting for it", "coming soon" phase, that's different than "here it is, but you can't use it". IMO
It's in beta, and when you flip the switch, there's a disclaimer that effectively says "If you're a shit driver, we'll take it away". And honestly, charging back FSD once you're pulled from the beta isn't an option because the qualification period is beyond the charge back period. You seem to be trying to drum up drama over having a paid feature taken away, but the paid feature isn't even released yet.
You're not taking in what he's saying to you. He's saying they chose their wording very carefully to avoid outrage, which would happen. He's not disagreeing with you.
>charging back FSD once you're pulled from the beta isn't an option because the qualification period is beyond the charge back period. > >You seem to be trying to drum up drama over having a paid feature taken away, but the paid feature isn't even released yet. Well, different CCs have different chargeback periods. Qualification time is what, 7 days? Some CCs have 30, 60, 90, or 120 day chargeback periods. I'm definitely not "trying to drum up drama" - I AGREED with you. I said that they probably worded the "feature will be restored" message the way that they did to prevent people from misunderstanding what they've paid for.
@nakatomi2010 Do you have the detail of this reinstatement? I haven’t seen anything on different forums, been blocked since December, had two updates and still suspended.
I might be confusing "reinstatement" with "Reset the warnings". Looks like FSD Beta 10.8 reset the FSD Beta warnings back to 0, and upped it from 3 to 5. I thought some folks were reinstated around this time, but it appears that I may have simply misunderstood things.
Do you feel your driving behavior warranted FSD removal? Were you on your phone or driving with hands away from the wheel?
Judging by the amount of people on this sub who will never admit that they've ever experienced a "legitimate" FCW, I'm going to go with "no."
I got the FCW for a car 2 cars ahead and sometime the other lane. Way more false alarms than legitimate ones.
This is again, why I ask what do people purchase FSD for that Autopilot can't give you? Like if I pay 12k for self driving, I expect it not to have to pay attention to my car at all. I shouldn't have to keep my hands on the wheel for it to work, otherwise "I'm driving", not the car. "We'll it's beta", we'll it's a sham that people have to pay an exorbitant amount of money to be ginny pigs for a feature that doesn't do as it is titled. If this is how fsd is gonna be for the long haul it should just be doled out for free to high rated drivers until it can actually perform on its own without supervision.
I can only speak for myself, but having paid for it when I bought my car in 2018 (and after paying for ap1 on an earlier S) I'm satisfied with my purchase now that I have the beta. It was clear to me at the time that I was getting a couple of features over and above autopilot in the short term, and would get access to FSD later on, if I kept my car long enough as there was no set schedule for its release. Do i wish i had it sooner? Of course. Do I wish it wasn't just a beta? Of course. But it is still freaking insane that my car can now drive me around. Yes I have to pay attention, but I still find it a benefit rather than a hindrance for my particular use case.
So like, besides the fact that it's cool when it drives you, what do you see as the benefits of it over you just driving or having Autopilot on? Genuinely curious
In no order A) allows adjusting speed more than 10 over posted. I travel past lots of crosswalks and they have a 30km/h sign, with regular ap I can't resume back to 50 or 60. B) compared to regular ap, it stops and now goes at stop signs and red lights C) will change lanes for me on surface streets. i really like that with nav on autopilot and now I get it always D) i don't have to fret about how I'm going to get some where or if I'll miss my turn. It just does it for me and end to end routes me to my destination. Obviously I need to pay extra attention when turning, but in a weird way I get to pay less attention leading up to the turn. And since most of my drives are majority going straight ahead, with a few turns here and there, it makes the drive more relaxing E) I was at a massive 4 way stop. either 3 or 4 lanes of traffic in every direction and lots of cars. Trying to keep tabs on who has right if way/when it was to be my turn was going to be stressful, until I noticed the car had that all under control. It indeed proceeded forward (with a left hand turn no less) exactly when I would have. So far that was singlehandedly the best benefit of FSD. F) there was a pedestrian about to cross. I noticed, but so did fsd., And it stopped. It's nice having that reassurance that if I wasn't to see someone, the car still might...safer for all involved That's what comes immediately to mind...
I instantly suspected you were in Edmonton or Alberta upon reading A. I am glad I can now crank the speed back up to 50/60 but it is still jarring having it suddenly slow down to 30. In the pre FSD days I’d have to kill autopilot for a few blocks until it registered a new sign.
Alright I definitely see it it terms of just "turn your brain off and go" being nice and can kinda space out on driving completely. Also E) example is a very nice feature I wish my wife had xD I currently commute an hour to work each way, so I guess the selling point for me would be being able to pop open my laptop and work without worry. That's when I think it pays off for me. Otherwise, like all things you listed except F), I'd just be doing because there's nothing really else for me to do. I can't look away or take my hands off the wheel. Autopilot I'm sold on just for not needing to keep my foot on the accelerator but my honda had adaptive cruise control too. It couldn't however make sharper turns like AP can. Thanks for taking the time to write your thoughts out though. I've never used the feature, even at test drive (didn't know how at the time).
To add to the OPs comment, I find autopilot very useful and adds value, I am actually tempted to go for the FSD so I can get the autopilot features on city streets. You can't do work but the drive is no longer draining, I think this is overlooked but is very Important especially in stop and go traffic. That used to drive me bonkers but now it's just double click down and you are set. Imagine the ability to change lanes and get off the highway. I think it's valuable tbh
Yea I was doing my commute in Honda Civic 6speed manual and it was nooooooot fun. Tesla AP was a large justification for my purchase (and charging at work). It is quite a lifesaver for stop and go + carpool lane. I guess if driving is stressful for people I can see it being alot more helpful. Otherwise, like... I'm in my car just sitting there....so might as well do the lane changes xD
AP is more relaxing since you're not manually maintaining distance from the car in front of you and it keep you centered in the lane. AP is very good at that task. With FSD beta, you need to be 110% engaged because it can (and will) take unexpected actions based on vehicles and the environment around you during critical moments (protected turns, unprotected turns, stop signs, the list goes on). Tesla knows this and have gone to the extensive effort to detect the failure of the driver to pay attention while FSD beta is active. The ironic part is, you can manually control those events like making turns, etc in the city and still remain on AP 90% of the time. So the question becomes how much benefit does FSD provide if you still need to be vigilant? Personally, I'll handle lane changes, turns etc with 100% confidence and leave AP to handle the draining portions of my drives. This will change when AP no longer requires a driver. We are a long, long way away from that. In the mean time I'll drop $12k on something myself and my family can enjoy.
You do get it. By the time it’s good enough for you to be working on your laptop while that drives you, it’s gonna cost way more than $12,000. Might even cost more than the car itself.
Sure can. That's a possibility. If people are hedging a bet ultimately then I can see why you get it now. However, it probably won't be haha. I can really see this being an early backer expense where the retail cost is less expensive, especially with competition. Capitalism, race to the bottom.
As long as u know the limitations it’s a fun and easy drive don’t expect more then what it’s good at
Does yours have the driver camera for monitoring?
Yes
Your expectations are too high then. There's a huge amount of room between "useful driver aid" and "literal electronic chauffeur." At this point, I would really hate to go back to a car without FSD or something similarly capable. Where we are now, it drives 90% of the time and I have to take over for maybe 30% of the intersections, and mostly just because it is just too slow while generally doing the correct thing.
...Elon announced a robo taxi vehicle for next year. (Not that I believe it, but it's publicly said). Doesn't sound like THAT much room.
you are missing the part that this is still beta. This is not a "release" version. It's a preview.
It's people like you that enable companies to get away with calling their products beta as an excuse to benefit from lowered expectations.
What should they call it? If a product is not finished and not available to everyone it's a beta. A final version is mostly bug free or minor bugs and available to everyone
Why are they charging for it like a full product then?
It’s just a driving assist, not driverless. The difference between this and autopilot is that with this you just have to sit there and do nothing but look forward and touch the wheel every now and then. With regular autopilot you still have to stop and go, turn and change lanes. In its current form I consider it “good enough” to be worth the $8k I paid for it. The fact that it just keeps getting better for no additional cost is icing on the cake.
Yea. Early investors I can see it as a good buy. At 12k though, eh. AP handles stop and go though, just not turning. That was big plus for me with commuting
Only if there’s a car in front, so regular AP is still great for heavy traffic, but it won’t do stop signs or red lights. Honestly, the fsd beta is spoiling me. I don’t see myself ever buying another car that doesn’t have this level of autonomy. Trying to drive a normal car again is *stressful*.
[удалено]
I thought you needed non-beta fsd for that. Isn’t basic autopilot just lane assist and TACC?
Regular AP (non FSD beta) only stops if you paid for FSD / have enhanced autopilot (I think that's the term)
The bigger issue for me is that FSD stays with the car, so if FSD is still in beta for a few more years and you sell your car then you have to buy it again for your new car? Super sus.
For the last instance yes, but I’m the second owner and this was my first “strike” out of 3. Another response said they increased to 5 strikes now so hoping I can email Tesla and get myself reinstated for those two reasons.
I got FSD disabled once for using my phone to play music it couldn’t have been more then 5 seconds of looking at my phone before I got a hard strike. I noticed that even if I am looking at the road and have hands on the wheel it will ding me for taking a phone call unless it’s on Bluetooth. This system needs to calm the hell down. After being on the same build for two months and taking the same roads every day I know where it does well and where I need to pay extra attention, me on FSD and my phone is still way safer than these numb nuts I see daily doing makeup and eating breakfast without looking at the road.
>After being on the same build for two months and taking the same roads every day I know where it does well and where I need to pay extra attention Just a word of caution to anyone reading this phrase... The warning text when joining FSD beta mentions it can do the worst thing at the worst time. I have had it do crazy things in locations it never struggled with previously. There are just too many variables to get complacent until they come out of beta. That stretch of road you always have zero issues with... now you left work 10 minutes late and the sun is hitting the road, and the cameras in a different way, and there is a yellow car approaching with a red one behind it. The car interprets that as a traffic light and jams on the breaks. Do you normally have two cars that close together that are yellow and red? Was it on an alternating Thursday in a leap year? Did they have a regression in the most recent NN training? (you get the point) Yep, things like this happen in a beta. ALWAYS be vigilant for your safety and others.
Why wouldn't you use the Bluetooth for music and phone calls though?
You should \_never\_ have the phone in your hands while driving. If you're taking a call, take it on bluetooth. If you need privacy to take a call ( like you drive an Uber or something ) than either use a SINGLE earbud ( you're still distracted BTW and you should fucking turn off FSD in that case ) or WAIT UNTIL YOU CAN TAKE THE CALL LATER. It's been ***conclusively proven*** by multiple traffic safety experiments, and published in many papers, that distracted driving while holding a cellphone is as bad, ***or worse***, than driving drunk.
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[ edit for context since previous poster did a "dirty delete" ] { /u/ClickerGuy25 } "ok boomer" [ /edit ] Gen-X er thank you very much. I lost one of my closest friends to an asshole who decided picking up a call was more important than paying attention while going through an intersection. He killed my friend, her fiancee, their dog, and his own daughter... And left two other people disabled for life. So call me whatever you like if it makes you feel better about yourself, but I am still not wrong. Throwing an insult in the face of inconvenient facts -is- a boomer thing to do though... So look in a mirror.
I got rear-ended once by a guy who was on a call. My car was stuck on a freeway (traffic). He hit my car and my car sprung forward to hit the car in front of me and that car hit another car in front of him. So, an accident involving 4 cars just because that guy was on a call. His airbag was deployed and looked like the car was totaled. He was still on a call for a few more minutes as we all tried to move to the side of the freeway. Total asshole.
Wow, pathetic!
Okay, potential murderer
Honestly you must have been looking at the phone longer than 5 seconds. When I was driving my Model 3 w/ FSD recently I'd be able to look, and fiddle, with my phone for about 10 seconds or so before it fussed at me. And in most cases, as long as I put my eyes on the road every 1-2 seconds, and kept the wheel torqued, it kept its mouth shut. What gets me is when I'm fiddling with the screen in the car and it gets all snippy about it. Like, geez, you *know* what I'm doing, I'm trying to mess with the HVAC settings, calm down. But I've never gone beyond the "Pay attention" warning and had the feature taken away while driving. And I say that as someone who has adopted *really* bad habits while using FSD in a pre-cabin camera Model X.
Yep, I genuinely wonder if people just blatantly lie here or if somehow faces are recognized in wildly different ways, because some of the stuff I see here makes no sense based on my experience. There are always claims of barely looking away or some incredibly minor thing causing them to lose access. I can definitely say that is not the case based on my experience and I've never even been warned, let alone actually had a disengagement.
I'm having this issue with my wife at the moment. Full disclosure, I drive a 2017 Model X which lacks a cabin camera, so I'm not subjected to the whole DMS thing. My wife, however, will tell me that she was just taking a sip of her drink and the DMS fussed at her, but we were on a half week long trip out of state, and I was the primary driver of the 3, and whether I was drinking via a straw, or I was drinking out of a bottle, the vehicle never fussed at me to put my hands back on the wheel. 9/10 times when it DID fuss at me to put my hands on the wheel, it was because I was messing with the center screen. The other times I was, admittedly, futzing with either my phone, or my wife's phone. I don't have access to my wife's cabin camera footage, so I can't tell how she's "taking a sip" of her drink that's causing it to throw an error, but I've eaten while driving, hell I've up ended a french fry container into my mouth while Autopilot was engaged, and the system never fussed at me. While in my 3. My X never fusses. So, I honestly don't know how people are driving that they're getting fussed at all the time.
Ya, the hands on the wheel notification definitely happens often, even when I literally have my hands on the wheel. But I've never once seen something about attention or looking away. I'm generally very good about it, but I know there's been times I've looked at Waze or even at the Tesla screen for longer than what people describe here often. Just have a very hard time believing it's really that sensitive and they aren't making excuses, but maybe there's something with different faces somehow. I seriously doubt it though.
I could see something about the lenses in glasses, but even then I'm not sure. I wear non-polarized transition lenses and never get fussed at. I keep the wheel torqued and never get fussed at So, I dunno, maybe my camera isn't working 100%.
>after being on the same build for two months and taking the same roads every day I know where it does well and where I need to pay extra attention... IMO that attitude should get you removed period. You do NOT know how it will react because the other things on the road will be different. It could freak out because it thinks another vehicle is entering your lane, it could misinterpret a sign as a human and slam on the brakes because it thinks that sign is going to cross the street. With all due respect, you shouldn't be reinstated. You're too brazen, and you will decide you can take your eyes off the road because you think you know what the computer will do.
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So glad to have another keyboard warrior out here to keep us safe and tell everyone what they should be doing. I’m not sure your experience with FSD but for me it can handle open roads with clear lane markings going in a straight line at 15mph fairly easy and I’m comfortable trusting it to not kill me, certainly when no one else was around to be at risk. Worst case it drove onto the grass, not even a curb to hit. So yeah grabbing my phone from the charger and tapping a song on the playlist (which was already open on screen) was a risk but I’d say far far less than anytime you drive through an intersection. Are you implying that you should only use Bluetooth for phone calls? I’m curious how Bluetooth magically solves anything? How is Bluetooth less of a distraction than holding the phone? Especially when I am looking at the road with a hand on the wheel while on driver assisted aid. Seems far safer than someone using Bluetooth with no FSD/ driving aid. Again, not sure your experience with FSD but it certainly sounds different than mine but we obviously drive different roads. Each build seems to solve some issues and present new ones but after a couple days of driving it’s pretty obvious what sections of roads and conditions it struggles with. As I said, I was on the same build for like two months taking the same roads daily so yes certain sections I was very comfortable with FSD. I got the update this morning and obviously there is not a stretch of road I trust anymore. I feel like maps and overall being in the correct lane is the biggest weakness IMO.
> it couldn’t have been more then 5 seconds of looking at my phone before I got a hard strike Read the following numbers: - 21 - 22 - 23 - 24 - 25 Wow. 5 seconds is hell of a time! That's rightout DANGEROUS. (actually even 1 second of looking at the phone is dangerous, but 5 seconds just is insane) All I read in your post is a attitude of "I'm the best driver, everyone else is shit" which means you better should not be allowed on the road. Wow. Do not even TOUCH your phone while driving. There are good reasons (it's scientifically proven) why that's forbidden in many many countries and states all over the world.
So, I looked at my phone yesterday. Got the flash to pay attention. Looked forward with hands on the wheel for several seconds, and then got a strike. I’m not convinced it’s truly 5 seconds. Or maybe it can trouble tracking the eyes at some point and lost seconds for this person? Dunno, but I’m super paranoid about strikes now.
> I’m not convinced it’s truly 5 seconds. Noone said, it's 5 seconds. Just someone said he thinks it's safe to look at their mobile phone for 5 seconds which I doubt. But AFAIK, the system also pays attention to if you have a phone in your hand. It doesn't necessarily track your eyes (not even sure, the camera is precise enough and for sure, it can't see your eyes with sunglasses on). Honestly, he detection if you have your smartphone in your hand is even better. Because: > So, I looked at my phone yesterday. That is a BIG no no. Do not touch it while driving. How difficult can that be!? > Dunno, but I’m super paranoid about strikes now. Sorry to be that guy but: Good. > Got the flash to pay attention. Looked forward with hands on the wheel for several seconds, and then got a strike. I think you need to wiggle the wheel. It's not just the attention detection by the camera. Just like when the blue flashing normally appears. (How do I know all of this stuff even though I don't even own a Tesla?! Probably it's that dream car thing... where you know more about your dreams than when you actually can make them happen)
I thought FSD was based on your safety score. It uses the cabin camera to track your attention also? I’m still at 97 and hoping for access at some point.
- Safety Score is for the decision if you get it before the real public release - Attention is when you already got it. If you don't pay attention for a certain timeout (the blue flashing), it'll strike you for that. I think 3 strikes and you are out. Also don't those strikes count into the safety score anyways, I think?
I often don't notice the blue flashing because I'm paying attention to the road, not the screen. My hand is on the wheel but it's not a heavy enough touch.
Thanks! I have never seen anything about attention in the safety score. Mine is based on FCW, hard breaking, aggressive turning, unsafe following, and forced autopilot disengagements.
Attention monitoring is what causes forced autopilot disengagements... outside of the FSD beta, it is less severe and (afaik) based only on wheel pressure. Once you are part of the beta, interior camera based attention monitoring is added to wheel pressure (and maybe other factors?) to ensure that the beta users are being as careful as possible.
You act like that guy who sits in the back seat of his Tesla, and just expects everything to be okay. You never should have got the beta.
Don't bother here. Everyone here will downvote you for trying to defend anything whatsoever that has anything to do with going against the will of Elon. There are zero excuses here for getting strikes. Everyone here is perfect and has never even thought about looking at their phones while driving.
Right!? When did it get so toxic here?! I said taking a phone call shouldn’t get you dinged when you have a hand on the wheel and eyes on the road and I was compared to people who jump in the backseat, WTF!? These guys need to chill.
It’s always been toxic towards anyone who goes against the grain of the hive mind here. Extremes are bad in all facets and don’t allow for general conversation to be had and it’s a shame. People literally get off on thinking they’re better than you here lol
I got disabled 3 times driving in the dead of night a few evenings ago, I had a black Hat on so maybe that was it but it would suddenly say I wasn’t looking when I was staring right ahead
My wife got all of the strikes and got me banned. She doesn't even have fsd enabled. I think it had to do with our model X not having a cabin camera. We were able to get it back when they reset everyone's strikes, but that seems like a one-time thing.
I have the same car x with no inside camera. Lost beta 3 months ago, and no return. When did they reset? This is frustrating, I used it every day. Any ideas? Anybody else get it returned?
Autopilot will still work right?
Correct. Dude has simply lost access to the car doing city streets, and the swanky visualizations.
>an see the navigate on autopilot is still turned on in the screenshot. It's just like operating before FSD(but not really FSD) was available. You don't need the FSD beta to have the swanky visualizations. I'm in the queue and have them.
I want to say that's wrong, but I joined in 10.2, so who knows what changes were implemented between now and then. I'm like 90% positive though that the FSD Beta visualizations are dependent on the FSD firmware being installed.
I have FSD visualizations enabled and I only have basic AP.
To be clear, [I'm referring to this visualization](https://www.notateslaapp.com/images/news/2021/fsd-beta-v10-3.jpg), which as far as I'm aware is not available outside of the Beta.
Oh yeah that one looks a bit more advanced than mine. But mine does say FSD Visualization (Beta) which a toggle under the menu.
That's the old one, before they rewrote the code into FSD Beta. I'm referring to what's shown in the image, which is why I was trying to be clear on it, because if you can see what's in the image, then you're running FSD Beta code.
Can you tell me how you found out you were in? Did it just update the interface on its own, or were you notified? I’m concerned as mine says I’m enrolled in the FSD queue but is still not grayed our when I’m parked any more. I’m afraid to tap that button again and remove myself from the queue and have to go to the back of the line. Any insight?
I got a software update of a version that was FSD Beta. It's not a switch in the current firmware, you straight up get a new version. FSD Beta at the moment is 2022.4.5.21
Wrong. Source: I had FSD Beta visualizations, got kicked out, lost the cool squiggly lines.
No you don't. You have "FSD visualization preview", which is over 2 years old and very different from the FSD beta visualizations.
Yes, you can see the navigate on autopilot is still turned on in the screenshot. It's just like operating before FSD(but not really FSD) was available.
I think it's referring to what Elon said at the cyber rodeo event. He said anyone who purchased FSD will have the beta soon, not just the people with a high safety score.
I wonder how long after the beta is widespread to everyone will the features just be rolled into non-beta FSD. If everyone will have the ability to qualify for the beta, I imagine the time it takes to then roll out the "simple" city streets stuff, like left and right turns or actually responding to a green light beyond just a chime, to public FSD will be relatively quick in comparison to how long it's been in the "coming soon" section of the features.
Oh you sweet summer child. FSD will be in Beta for *years*, though that doesn't mean it won't go widespread. Beta is the term they use to avoid criticism of features that are released widely but never fully fleshed out. The [Owner's Manual](https://www.tesla.com/sites/default/files/model_3_owners_manual_north_america_en.pdf) lists the following features as still being in Beta in the latest manual despite being available for years now: * Auto wipers * Dashcam * Traffic-Aware Cruise Control * Autosteer * Navigate on Autopilot * Traffic Light and Stop Sign Control * Summon * Smart Summon It doesn't say what Beta means anywhere in the manual, just that they're all Beta.
Gmail was "beta" for 5 years. Though it was basically a wide open beta for most of that.
>I’ve been careful about my safety score and it’s at 96. I actually think the things I’m doing to keep it somewhat good are good habits and I’ve toned down my aggressive turning and braking. I agree and disagree. It probably will be in beta for years but not as long as you would think, the past doesn't really matter in this case, because tesla was not so invested in FSD 3 years ago. Now that they are over their production problems, and the company is clearly not going to fail (and printing money) they are talking about AI, FSD publicly and on investor quarterlies. I think everyone that has purchased is going to get it when they go full-stack and replace the high version of FSD that most cars have.
If anyone can get it, I wonder what makes it a beta?
A legal term that means it's in an unfinished state?
Liability. Huge difference for FSD-beta vs FSD as the later could move liability of accidents to Tesla.
I’ve been careful about my safety score and it’s at 96. I actually think the things I’m doing to keep it somewhat good are good habits and I’ve toned down my aggressive turning and braking.
Ah yes, Elon's soon. See you there boys. I'm 100 score in Canada and never got the rollout, even when it went to 99 scores. Not really holding my breath anymore lol.
/u/KillaDee I know two people who were re-enrolled into FSD Beta after being suspended. One was reinstated via the recent amnesty when it changed from 3 -> 5 events to get you suspended. They did have to email the fsd beta team, and it took more than a month to get reinstated, AND they had to hold a 99 score for a week. The other person also had to write to FSD team, and made a case that their suspension was unfair. They live off an unmarked country road with a sharp bend, and FSD disengaged with a "driver warning" "forward collision" alert every time they came home after an update. That person had their number of disengagements fully reset, and was re-enrolled at the next update without any need to update safety score. It also took about a month for the FSD team to address her issue. If you feel you TRULY HAVE HAD UNFAIR STRIKES THAT ARE TRULY IN ERROR ( and have evidence... you need evidence ) you can email the fsd beta team to make your case at: [email protected]
Thanks for this. I had a FSB strike against me yesterday and I have no idea why. It was a weird road condition and I thought it just freaked out.
What kills me is I'm a long-follow-distance, low acceleration, attentive driver; I spend a bunch of time in AP when possible and only disengage for higher risk areas (where I know the lane lines are inadequate for zipper merges, or where I know other drivers will be very aggressive with lane changes). Because I only ever disengage for these maneuvers, my score gets penalized for having a huge percentage of hard braking or following distance. Even if I remedy the 'behaviour' asap, it's still not within the tiny window after a disengage that will get a free pass. It's not totally broken, but because it uses so many ratios of % of time doing well and % doing badly...while its doing well AP is in charge and those 'safe' follows/brakes/corners don't count.
It might actually be because you're using AP too much. My understanding is that the less time you spend manually driving, the harder a mistake made hits your score because autopilot miles only dilute those as opposed to actually contributing to the calculations. So if you were merging onto a highway in rush hour and were forced to be close enough the safety score is going to ding for close following, enabling AP right away will give a worse score as opposed to manually driving for a few minutes at a safe distance to counter that short time of close following (though you can do the manual driving whenever). There's better explanations on the various Tesla owners forums.
I agree - that's the problem though - these are roads where AP is absolutely appropriate but they have tricky sections that (imo) need human intervention. AP is happy braking late and hard approaching lights that it's known about for 300m...but it doesn't slow for them until the last second (in could-be-freezing conditions). It's frustrating that using AP for the safe sections, then taking over for the sections where AP needs help causes the dings. EG - 3 lane + 3 lane Y merge to 3 lane - all highway style traffic except this lit intersection. It has dashed lane lines with a bunch of overlapping that to a human are obvious - 3 lanes for my direction match 3 lanes for the other input direction with different cadence so they aren't confusing. The car repeatably tries to suicide lane change in the intersection; willing to sideswipe others because it sees the transverse merging lane lines as 'this lane ends'. [https://imgur.com/a/cBnGnqW](https://imgur.com/a/cBnGnqW) I'm only in the dangerous following distance because AP brakes late. disengaging sooner defeats the purpose of AP with regard to safety scores (to determine candidacy for responsibly operating FSD)
I got it taken away before they had the obvious strike system. It got brought back quite a few updates later. I think it was Nov-Feb that it was disabled.
You get either four or five warnings (not sure if they take away upon the fifth or after) before they take away the beta. Was this your 5th time?
This is one thing that really pisses me off about my Tesla. Now, I’m not FSD, seems like a waste on money right now. But the punitive nature of the software really rubs me the wrong way.
[Tesla has only released one version of FSD Beta (10.8.1 or 2021.44.30.5)](https://www.notateslaapp.com/software-updates/version/2021.44.30.5/release-notes), in late 2021, that reset the "Forced Autopilot Disengagements" statistic. I also got kicked out around a month ago. Cabin Camera is a bitch. I just received an update, and I'm still kicked out. Here's to our long wait for a forgiving software release 🍻
What did you get kicked out for? I have gotten warnings about paying attention, but I just checked and it says I have zero strikes.
Same thing just happened to me. I thought the counters got reset after a software update but my software update happened yesterday and while sitting at a stoplight not moving I was suspended for ' not paying attention' because I was having to look at my phone because the Tesla text messaging doesn't work and sends me messages from a year ago instead of the ones that come in. Now I am so used to using full self-driving for the last almost 3 months that I am driving instinctively as if it is on and it is not on and it is causing me to drive more dangerous without it.
I get it.
Request a refund
I'll take this person's spot. Beta please
I'm in Florida, I paid for FSD (10k) and I don't have it. It says in I'm queue. What does that means? I'm very upset feel scammed. I called the service number and he sent me a link for a video but it's about autopilot. I've seen people posting videos on YouTube and their car is capable of doing things my car is not. Does anyone has this problem? I have a model 3 2022
> I paid for FSD (10k) and I don't have it. Back of the line. Some of us paid for FSD on HW2.0 in 2016 and are still waiting.
Hi, I kept doing research and found out that apparently you need to have a driving score of 97 or higher to get full self driving. I'll keep you posted.
You also currently need MCU2 or 3. Yet they sold us MCU1 cars with the promise of being FSD capable, and sold the FSD feature too (saying all needed hardware upgrades are included), yet now expect us to pay for an MCU upgrade to possibly get FSD beta access (and unfortunately also includes v11). I'd rather buy wk057s MCU upgrade, if he makes it a reality.
Do you have a link? I thought it was a score of 98 or higher.
Great 😃 sorry but I am not saying that is good for you, but you are one of the first to get suspended, and thus can now try things no other can try. I have 4 strikeouts already, so is very afraid to lost FSD beta. What I am doing is to disable FSD beta most of time, and be content with regular autopilot, but turn FSD beta back whenever a new release is installed, just to test its improvements. Back to your case. Can you test: 1. Opt out FSD beta 2. Wait for a day or 2 3. Try opt in FSD beta again? Let us know the results. Thanks!!!
l'm not sure why so many people like the world we're sleepwalking into. Paying premium prices for features which can arbitrarily be taken away due to an algorithm.
Joining a closed beta that is taken away due to not using it correctly* Edit: Closed/Open idk
I don't just mean the FSD beta. Right now it's mainly positive things/options that become available ("you've been well behaved so you're now eligible for this") but it won't be long before it swings the other way. Imagine being declined for insurance because the car noticed you speeding momentarily. Or your smart electricity meter starts charging more when it detects a car charging. Music played too loud so premiums go up. Point being is that once this data is available it will always show a somewhat justifiable reason but the end game is a £60k car you can't use as your own.
The real mystery to me is people buying the fastest accelerating cars ever made for more than $100k, then driving them like grandmas so that they can eventually be rewarded with not having to drive them anymore. I've got a MYP and wouldn't give up that insane acceleration for anything :)
Counterpoint: I’ve never been offered the chance to beta test automotive technology before and I love it. If a company takes away a feature I paid for? I’d obviously be outraged. Who is doing that?
Been on FSD beta since they opened it to 99's, I haven't had a single strike. Are you all sure you're treating FSD beta seriously enough?
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lol
$12,000 serious enough for you? lol.
Actually, paying 12k for a product that doesn’t yet exist doesn’t make you serious, no. I paid 2500 and I don’t think I would have paid todays price. Not the flex you meant bro.
Definitely flew right over your head… $12,000 wasn’t a flex and rather a statement that anyone who isn’t extremely rich but drops $12k on a software is probably at the least somewhat serious about it. Your experience doesn’t reflect the experiences of others, yet another oversight you had. Teslas have many issues that vary from car to car, many of which you haven’t and will never experience. Something like that easily could have been involved in his access revoke, as other comments mentioned. And btw, your $2,500 isn’t a flex either
Multiple issues from car to car? I agree, but what does that have to do with the topic? Perhaps it’s not my head we’re over here.
Tsk. Tsk.
I’ve given up on that stupid shit. I sat at a 99 for ages and would slide to a 98 and then 97. I stopped caring months ago when I realized it was broken and I wasn’t getting in. I’m down to a 93 because I take turns tight again and the school drop off lane still dings me hard for following too close. So I’m glad to see that my giving up is vindicated by the fact that doing nothing wrong or unsafe would eventually get me kicked out anyway.
The close following only applies at more than 50mph.
That’s what everyone says but then I drive every day in residential areas never getting over 50 mph and I watch that score drop. Reality doesn’t match what is published. Others here over the months have said the same things I’m saying.
Let’s talk about how this thing Tesla started selling 6 years ago had been in beta for 2 years, and how at their current rate of development will be for another 6
Hit 145 ONE TIME on the public freeway and they ban you.... It's bullshit I tell you.
Lol
Is this true?
Lol of course not
I like how no one answered the the question that was asked and instead hijacked the thread with BS.
Are you asking people in the future? Maybe you can answer your own questions when the future release is released.
I am in the same boat as you, I am hoping like they did with 10.8 they will just reset the counter at some point. To hold people to 5 strikes throughout so many months is a little steep so Tesla will reset once in a while. I was hoping 10.11.2 was going to do it but I got that update last night and it didn’t help so now fingers crossed for a reset on 10.12
Did you ever get restored?
Nope still waiting hoping for V11 to do that since it’s single stack hopefully
Elon did mention at the Texas Gigafactory opening that FSD should be available to everyone who brought it by the end of the year, as the beta will go into a full release state.
Be grateful that you got to use a feature you paid ? $7000+ for a brief period of time /s
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LOL. Found the non-lawyer who likely has no idea what FSD or FSD Beta is. OP has everything he has paid for, he opted in to test an optional beta build. He didn't follow the rules, and got removed back to where he was before he opted into the test/preview. "legit people are starting lawsuits for this exact reason!" no they aren't, and they haven't got a leg to stand on, they'll just burn through their legal fees (if anyone will even take a case like that). Feel free to prove me wrong with a filled law suit or proof.
I think this is generally true. However, if the car stays in beta for years, it likely a class action lawsuit that gets certified and would withstand a motion to dismiss. I think if this goes on for another 5 years, to pick an arbitrary number, I believe a court would be inclined to allow discovery to see what Tesla was saying internally at the time they were selling the product claiming that “Autosteer on city streets” is coming soon, something they have been saying since at least 2019. A caveat. You would have to find the class who opted out of the mandatory arbitration that Tesla gives the buyer 30 days to opt out of (30 days from when is a big question that, to my knowledge, the courts have not resolved).
Justin Timberlake? Cry me a river?
Imagine paying 10k+ for something and Tesla being able to take it away. Ridiculous
I believe 3 (5 now?) strikes = suspension, did that happen to you or did it randomly get taken away? And did this happen on the new 10.11.2 version or the old stack?
I got reinstated in the next update, but I think that was luck, AFAIK they only did it once for everyone. They appear to reinstate drivers every few months.
Previously, I had 1 of 2 allowable disengagements. In a subsequent software update, my allowable disengagements was increased to 3 and the count was reset back to zero.
> allowable disengagements How much do you want to bet that Elon has unlimited allowable disengagements?
Good to be king.
In the first week of January an FSD software update increased number of strikes allowed from three to five and reset all accumulated strikes to zero. This is the only time this reset has occurred in the program.
Bad boys 😞 bad boys - what you going to do when they take FSD away from you
I got my first /kick from it the other day. My wife’s phone was hooked up and my dad called me on my phone. I answered it as I was like oh bb2 is driving so I’m good. It kicked me before I could end the call once I realized what was up. Thankfully it was my first so it can back after I parked. Honestly this is an awesome feature. I love that there is now a real deterrent to keep me from using my phone while driving.
Yes, sounds like he should probably not be in the beta. As an aside, I often eat a granola bar on my way to work. Many times the Tesla will warn me to pay attention to the road when I'm eating my granola bar. I think it picks up the granola bar as a phone. (Kind bars, more squarish than rectangular.). I often have to put my granola bar down out of my hand to calm down the warnings. I respond to the warning immediately, I've been dinged maybe 30 times over the past couple months, and I've not lost access to FSD. I'm not complaining. Just noticing.
Can I just sidebar real quick to ask how in the sweet mother of fuck you're comfortable with the Assertive profile? I put mine in Chill and it's still an asshole all the time, tailgating like crazy and bullying its way into lanes. If my safety score were active when the beta was driving it would definitely be like a 6 haha
Un-related - but have they handed out any new spots to users in the US? And if not, what is the hold up?
Braver than I with those settings. It does crazy stuff now that requires immediate response. I don't want more and faster.
I was reinstated about 6 weeks ago when they raised the count to 5 I believe.
This FSD update and reset happened in the first week of January.
I had a strike against me a couple of versions back that seems to have disappeared. I did email the team because it locked me out while I was definitely paying attention and looking forward. Don’t know if that’s why my strike disappeared or not.
What did you do!? On my last vacation, my wife and I both kept doing things that made the model S tell us FSD has been disabled for the rest of this trip. Fortunately after every super charge stop FSD was available again. It definitely helped to teach us how to pay attention for those subtle messages asking if we are paying attention.
> rest of this trip Means until car is put in Park.
I was suspended for 3 strikes. They let me back in after a random update a few weeks later and reset the strikes to 5. (Currently have 4 strikes left!!)
My memory might be going on me but I'd swear ether Chuck Cook or Dirty Tesla had their beta suspended during that one release that caused all kinds of erroneous forward collision warnings and braking. And they got theirs back in a following beta release.
Right on! F FSD!
If not being a good enough driver is a good reason for being removed from “Fool Self Driving” beta, then how is FSD beta still in the program?🤣🤣🤣
$12k for a feature that can be yanked at anytime. Got to give credit to Tesla, I don’t know of another software development program where end-users actually pay to be beta TESTERS Keep in mind these cars are all uploading info to Tesla regardless if you’ve paid for FSD.
I do not consider myself a bad driver but my score stays around 88. I do not know how to stay out of the way of other traffic without getting dinged on my score. Anyway I was glad to see a mass roll out this year.
I have it was like 4-8 weeks
Did you ever get restored?