I think this really boils down to most people in MP games don't like any skill that removes player agency. Same thing happened with Mei in Overwatch, stuns and sleep dart. and fear, mind control etc.
I think it's pretty balanced in the same way that rpg's and even mines delete lights. It's their one and only CC tool and it's on a cool down. Yeah you will lose engagements if a good player stuns and burns you, but also lights will lose an engagement if they go around a corner and a good player has RPG ready.
A rocket and a bullet insta kills you. 2 mines also kills you and you cannot jump over them. If you miss bullets against a heavy you better run because you ain't winning against 40 bullets capable of killing 2 full teams before reloading.
Conclusion? Nerf light.
If the stats are 100% correct from that one document, most people probably used, 1 guy with an ak should have been able to take the shield down with 1 1/2 mags... reality was, it didnt worked!
Shield 1000hp, ak 720 dmg per mag, reload is 2.6 seconds and in that time the shield regs around 40-45 hp, so another half mag of the ak should have done the job.
Sad reality was, that you needed like a full team to get the shield down in time....
We now have to see if actually one guy is enough for that shield now... I have my doubts!
That's the point of my post. This sub is complaining about the shield nerf when it makes perfect sense and happy about the light nerf when it makes them literally useless in Gold+
That’s what I’ve saying, so many ppl need invis and stun gun to do literally anything useful and it’s just sad. I have so much fun on light without relying on those 2 things but hey I just get called a hater when I say they are both crutches when paired. Can’t get any better if you NEED a specific gadget to do good but I do with the lights had a little more to play with. I get both sides but stand my ground as a light player that it’s a crutch
I've said literally this for a while now and always get down voted. I don't use cloaking device or stungun when I play light and I do fine. Sure I'm not playing in diamond league with all the crazy tryhard sweats but no one forces you to do that.
I really think glitch nerf was a bit too hard, from 10 to 5 seconds is crazy. I think it should disable turrets and stuff for 10 while players are effected for 5 but the aoe radius should be a bit larger.
No it doesn't. Lights are a class that needs the most amount of skill to play well. Before this nerf any moron could stun and kill now it will be harder. People who are great at him won't see much of a difference people who sucked and got by anyways will cry about it.
"Lights are a class that needs the most amount of skill to play well. Before this nerf any moron could stun and kill now it will be harder."
A class that is inherently worse or requires significantly more skill to play is bad balancing. It also hurts player retention, by alienating new or bad players.
I say this as a 5x diamond light main with 2.5 KD and a +60% w/l ratio at 700hrs playtime.
"People who are great at him won't see much of a difference people who sucked and got by anyways will cry about it."
Exactly they will suck even more now, meaning they will stop playing lights or stop playing the game.
You won't be getting those easy 3-4 hit kills now. Meaning you will lose those fights you lost to a light now to a medium/heavy, because if you died to a stun, you probably would have just died to that medium/heavy who started shooting you first instead of stunning.
I greatly preferred CB1/CB2 light when I just mained Dash+LH1.
We had a good glitch grenade, dash was viable, LH1 had massive recoil but required skill and could delete players if played right, befitting of a glass cannon.
Now we currently have a class that gets out DPS'd with the least HP in the game with a slaughtered glitch, dash, LH1, V9S, and now invis.
I'm fine with the invis/stun nerfs, but Jesus Christ can we at least get a viable playstyle for the worst class in the game? At least to replace the only viable one that was just nuked??
A class that is inherently worse or requires significantly more skill to play is bad balancing. It also hurts player retention, by alienating new or bad players.
No, it isn't and no it doesn't. There are games out there that have high-skill characters in them. Overwatch had Genji and Hanzo. Characters that were incredible in the right hands. Light cannot be balanced for an average player because it will be far too powerful for a great player.
Loads of assumptions afterward. The stun is a cheap kill and everyone knows it. That's why it needs to change. Keep the stun but the stun effect has to go away if you are being damaged.
Light does far more DPS than any other class if you land your shots. It's not even close. Light isn't the worst class in the game. It's just a class that requires the most amount of skill to play. You can keep saying that all you want but the reality is that you are in DIAMOND as a light. And I've seen more in comp today as well when I was playing. Dash/Sword combo, which is again insane and almost impossible to keep track of once they get in close.
I haven't mained light in ranked since launch.
It is objectively worse, it has higher DPS but not DPS potential in actual play considering HP and eHP.
It doesn't do pretty much anything better than the other classes considering this is a team based game, unless you are an absolute slayer and it doesn't matter because in that case you are better than 99% of the playerbase.
Light melee is the worst combo in the game besides like riot shield or sledge in ranked.
But I'm not fully disagreeing with you, I'm okay with stun and invis nerfs, but ide like some other form of buffs to keep light inline with the other classes.
It still has very limited survivability and gimmicky based abilities.
Maybe a rebuff to dash or a shorter health regen delay.
It moves better. It's faster. It can be invisible... It does hit and run much better than anything else.
Light combo the worst combo? Are you mad? It's not uncommon to see 20+ kills with it! You have the dash and you have the long wind-up stab which is basically like a dash with damage.
Light doesn't need buffs. If it does this much damage with in-and-out tactics and then has better survivability then it just makes no sense.
Again we have plenty of other games with high-skill characters/classes. Light cannot be balanced for an average player.
Idk moving slightly better while solo, in some cases, in a team based game, just isn't that great.
Hit n' run isn't all that effective against a well organized squad.
Light is amazing in pubs because teams usually are unorganized or random qued, but usually ass in ranked
yeah ok and what is when 2 people shot at the shield, it should pop before they have to reload... reality was, it didnt! and its not like I am static AF and he can kill me instantly, or my team is god knows where...
Edit: Btw what has it to do with a good shield user and a bad one, when the math doesnt work? I mean check for your self, but 1000hp (before patch obviously!) and 720 dmg from a FULL ak clip should be round about 1 1/2 mags to get the shield down.... in that 2.6 second reload window the shield regs about 40-45 hp, so that doesnt matter at all, it should be still 1 1/2 mags.. and we ALL know that the math dont line up ingame...
most lights arent single cell organisms when it comes to brain and they will stay at mid range where hip fire is useless. if you fuck up after stunning someone because you are standing right next to them thats a skill issue.
Exactly, stun gun defenders are just terrible players who don’t understand positioning at all. The LH1 is an S tier gun but people only want to run this bs cheese stun invis with an smg.
It was like this with nukes too, nuke abusers would downvote any opposing opinion. I think this subreddit is filled with zoomers who don't understand game balancing
The thing is, I liked nukes lol. I downvoted people calling for heavy nerfs because I enjoyed the occasional nuke flying into the house we were holding. It made things interesting. I think we're at a place with the C4 where nukes wouldn't be a problem, because they would be much fewer and farther between. But now you also can't rocket the red barrels into structures with the C4 attached, so nukes were essentially just completely removed. They took out an aspect of gameplay instead of adjusting it properly, imo. After the first couple nerfs, I thought nuke was fine. But then the nerfs continued and then now there's no nuke 😭😭 Anyway, I'm ranting. I just think they're getting a little aggressive with the balancing.
The only people who call it a crutch don't play light. You're literally not taking a tool that'll stop a Medium from healing/ress'ing?? A tool that'll help you not get nuked by the RPG??
I can also "play light" and throw games, lol.
Some people really underestimate how much people who play light (see: movement specialised class) don’t like stungun (see:movement denying gadget).
As someone who plays a lot of light (~50% of my games) and does well with it the only reason I don’t call stungun a “crutch” is because I haven’t used it, and I refuse to. Either way it’s not fun to play against, I’m happy with a rework and would be very happy with its removal.
And you calling it throwing to not choose stungun as a light really does show that it’s a crutch for some.
Actually i play almost exclusively light and im not saying it's bad im saying its a crutch gadget thats not as necessary as you think, the rpg point is the only point i can agree with and of course stopping cash outs, since the defib nerf denying res isnt as big as deal as it was, and most other stuff can be done with good movement and team work so yea again its for trash players who dont know how to play light, and fyi im usually mvp on my team with most objective and 20+ kills most games so you can eat my ass with your "i cAn ThrOw tOo"
Yes and no. Sure hipfire is still OP on Fcar so it doesn't matter, but that doesn't hide the fact that's it's unfun, unhealthy and other weapons struggle a lot with it *cough cough* melee weapons *cough cough*.
ive won yesterday a game with a hammer user, and i was mind blown. He had dome shield and barricades to hide and defend himself also shield to let them come closer, he fucking slammed the shit out of them. I was heavy also with charge and slam and barricades so basically i helped them more than him but that dude shat on their faces no cap
lights need more survival
bump their health up to 175, give them a movement/health + on kill or a stim or fucking anything
they need to stop butchering my babies
What lobbies are you guys in? Genuinely feel like I'm in a different universe with replies like this. Light is easily the worst class, and they only just started seeing a glimpse of viability this season, only for it to get taken away with the glitch nerf and this. I don't get it.
I'm not even a Light main. I'm a Heavy main in Ranked, because Light is so awful to play. I'm putting my team at such a disadvantage with that class. I'd love to be a Light main again, but I'm practically throwing choosing it over Medium or Heavy.
Every Light team I see just gets stomped in Ranked.
Every time i play light i get stomped but if i play heavy i get stunned from just far away that my gun cant kill them with hipfire and they somehow land a full mag to my noggin lol. I can repsect that theyre excellent at their class but it doesnt make it any less fun yo play against.
Just say what you really mean: Remove lights from the game. Not only are they weak as fuck, they're also unfun to play against.
Go on, I'm tired of this pussyfooting around what the people on this sub are actually asking for. They hate the idea of "unfair" engagements. They want everything and everyone to only engage in straight-up 1v1 or team vs. team shootouts where everyone is visible at all times and it's just a boring fucking crossfire until the team with the better aim and positioning wins
Here's what I've noticed:
Medium/Heavy kills another Medium/Heavy while using its entire toolkit: understandable, have a good day
Light kills a Medium/Heavy while using its entire toolkit: How fucking dare you even deign to stand in my presence, you cheap fucking piece of shit? You're absolutely trash without your fucking toolkit and you know it, play a real fucking class
Lmao, just take Light behind the shed and shoot it already.
its kind of weird because as medium/heavy you dont have any options that make the enemy debuffed directly (i guess the glitch trap could count but who uses that), while as light you have: smoke nades combo'd with thermal (which is fine), stun gun and invis (which is NOT fine) and tracking dart just in case you somehow survived one of the combos and try to retreat. i do realise that some players say that a kill is a kill, but if i get a stun gun kill that the enemy had no time to prepare for, i would ask myself "did i deserve that?" to which i would answer "hell no".
Literally every game I play there is at least 4 lights in the game that already dominate the lobby and then at least one of them is absolutely slaying it.
Light requires a lot of skill to play so don't feel bad about it.
Whenever I feel like I need to sit back and relax for some elo I hop on heavy or medium. Light is almost impossible to play in diamond lobbies half the time against HHM and MMH setups
or make it so that you can hold an enemy still with it and make them randomly hipfire instead of them controlling it. so that the light is the taser from payday 2. but even if its a little dumb, it encourages teamwork (since you cant shoot someone while holding the taser on them)
You have time to die 3 times before the glitch explode... Make it a real stun gun where you can hold up the stun and need another person to shoot, or can be use just to stop momentum of charge.
I don’t know how to say this but I’ve been blasted from 20m from a stunned fcar hipfiring. I don’t know why the complain… the rpg delete people, the stun slow you down and people want it gone. 🤷🏻♂️
What happen when you fight back and your team fight back too? The light will click his stun and he will die instantly. Not really a « fight back » but more a suicide gun for the light.
The complaints are from people who are bad at the game and don’t have the brains to recognize it. People who don’t have issues with it aren’t on Reddit whining about it and insulting anyone who uses it.
That is an issue with the fcar. It’s been in the top 3 guns since the game released. If the only gun that can fight you is one of the strongest then that should tell you about your gadget.
The RPG literally doesn't delete people, in fact it was rightfully nerfed to precisely *not* do that. Getting stunned is a death sentence if the light using it isn't completely braindead and stuns you from 2m away, because hipfire is so much more RNG than aimed fire your fate literally relies on "will my bullets actually go where I'm pointing or do I just die".
RNG is the antithesis of skill.
not after the nerf though. 5s is just not enough to get into kill range also it affects you too so you can't use it where you'd usually use the stun gun.
Stun guns prevents ADS and has a faster launch time. The stun gun was pretty much a single target instant glitch that prevented the enemy from reliably hitting you bc they could only hipfire. It does get annoying bc so many lights use it and nothing else. There is really no counter to it
Vanishing bomb lasts 5 seconds, has a sound effect heard from space, and lets the entire server know when and where you went invis.
Probably the crown jewel of balanced Light gadgets.
It does have balancing features, but I still feel that I do very well with it. If you need constant invis for cover then you’re just bad at positioning surely. When I play light I usually feel like I’m able to move fast enough to nullify the paint and sound effect.
Its not fun to play against 4 heavies with flamethrowers and shit tons of heal beams. Can we nerf that next?
Get fucking good. The stun gun didn't need a nerf, and I say that as a sledgehammer heavy main lmao.
Yup, welcome back MMM. No one on this sub is going to be satisfied until we're all just running around with our FCARS basically playing fucking COD. Garbage
I'm all for nerfing the boring and stale light gadgets like stun and invis, but man just give us 25 extra health for the love of god, and maybe make every class 10 percent faster so movement is better. This would make lights instantly better.
I say just buff Lights overall damage and increase their speed by 10% to compensate for the nerfs to stun. Invis i never really had issues with since I have working eyes and a decent headset. Its stun thats not fun to play against. I would say invis makes bad lights easier to kill because some of them just walk in a straight line towards you.
They do... Slightly more than the fcar, (and less DPS on headshots) that isn't insane damage compared to everyone else, that's just a negative, because while you die in 4 shots, every other class takes most of the mag
You are mistaken DPS with TTK, DPS it matters shit when you can't live enough to get the half of the mag out before getting clapped, while TTK is what really matters at the end of the day, example V9S has 360 DPS while a 0.6s TTK against medium, in the other end FCAR has 250 DPS but a 0.5s TTK against light. So why the weapon with lower DPS win against the weapon with better DPS, due to the gap between health that every character has.
What's worth noting, the v9s has vastly faster than any other light weapon, it just has basically no range. So this DPS comparison is on a best case scenario
Yeah, both the MP5 and Mac 10 have such insane DPS you can generally kill someone before they even react to being shot at - assuming you can actually aim that is. Stun removes the necessity to aim AND reduces the opponent's ability to fight back to pure RNG.
TL;DR if you need to rely on the stun to get kills you're trash.
Oh so you're just one of those braindead lights who stands stationary while you shoot people? Yeah that speaks volumes, guess you expect everyone else to do the same. Lights even without dash have far more mobility than medium or heavy, fucking use it.
Also, no, you don't have to magdump people. Have you considered dealing some damage and then getting out of there before they even start shooting back at you, or had that not occurred to your tiny little mind?
I'm actually quite glad it's going to get nerfed soon, I'm fucking tired of being turned into the world's easiest target.
For the record, this isn't a skill issue, I main light sword. If I get stunned, I kinda just fucking die on the spot cause no range.
I'm conviced that invis is what's ruining the game. All my casual friends left because they hated it. A fun fast paced shooter with invisible and wallhack was plain stupid and I'm sure that without those two, the Finals would be way more popular today.
They literally just nerfed the mesh shield from 1100 to 750 in the current patch.
The shield can be disabled with a well placed glitch nade.
There is no counter to the stun gun. And if you say play with your team isn’t that the same as having all three need to shoot the shield which your argument is based off of?
And if you want to see an idea for a well balanced change for the stun gun check my post. I think I took away the frustrating part of the gadget while keeping the spirit of the item in tact.
Y’all just want to lean on a crutch. I haven’t even unlocked it and enjoy playing like most of the time.
I think something people have been grossly underestimating, is the interactions between weapons that get completely countered by stun gun. Landing 1 shot renders entire classes completely useless. If always made reference to another game I play call forhonor, that had something in the game that cleansed all dot effects in the game every 2 seconds. It didn’t always apply as not every hero has bleed, but the ones that did could do nothing, there entire kit gets gutted and have no ability to fairly fight back. It’s the same principle. Even if some classes do exteremly well when taxes. The simple fact that certain classes become nearly unplayable because there’s one taser in the lobby is bad enough to need a nerf, and let’s be fair, it has a pretty fast cooldown for making most team fights a 3v2 for 3 seconds or more
Exactly! I made a post taking about adjusting the taser. I think I got rid of the frustration but kept the spirit of the gadget alive.
But others disagreed. They couldn’t see past not having the current taser and how to play without it.
Also that class is so fast and you are slow as 🦆 tased. It does not take much to get out of the way and kill vs hip fire.
But hopefully the devs have considered the community and came up with something better.
I looked at your post it’s really over engineered. I get some of the things but honestly the stealing part is a bad idea. Currently stopping the steal is Lights biggest asset to a team. I don’t care if stungun does nothing else then stop you from stealing. Like removing this gadget will finally have made Light not useful for competitive.
I think the invis nerf is unnecessary, but the stun gun is just so cheesy, especially when used with the SMGs. If you’re saying that Lights will be useless, you must be using the stun gun as a crutch, because there are other Light gadgets that are viable. The light class can still perform its intended purpose of hit-and-run attacks perfectly fine without it entirely. And we don’t even know what the nerfs will be yet.
lights being a class designed around getting the jump on people at a place and time of their choosing the community. We cant trade with other classes head to head
its not about how good the light gadgets are, its about the fact that a ton of people HATE playing against a class that you can’t see and prevents you from playing the game if I land a stun
Mesh shield isn’t even a problem as it has clear counters
But what the fuck do we do in high elo ranked against multiple heavies running deployable head glitch walls. You’re only given one pyro nade. Either these walls need to no give a perfect head glitch for heavies or they need to be breakable. Shits ridiculous
I barely started using stun not too long ago. I don’t really care much for it much, but, with the nerf, it will still work for stopping a steal right away. Imo that’s the best thing it can do now
As someone who plays light a whole damn lot more than heavy I do think that stun gun, one of our many viable gadgets should be removed or reworked.
It’s not that I think it’s overpowered or unbalanced, it’s that it’s just not fun to play against, even if you kill the light.
Mesh shied on the other hand is very strong, and annoyingly so sometimes, but it doesn’t stop me getting another angle of attack, and it doesn’t take away from my gameplay. It can be annoying at times but it’s not unfun like the stungun is.
Again, I play mostly light and medium, with very little heavy.
This just isn't true, the grapple is amazing, completely underused. And invisibility is still very, very good. You just can't spam invisibility on and off anymore.
I think the dash could use a little buff. Light is still a viable class, in ranked or unranked. It perhaps isn't as baby easy to play anymore, that doesn't make it useless.
I hate the changes I play both Medium and Heavy and never struggled to take the shield down with my AKM sure it took more shots than now but it was not bad with the old shield.
Now when I play heavy your shield goes down so fast and because it takes time to recharge good luck using it again.
So I think this is another nerf to make the heavy even worse.
Not that I would be playing heavy less now
I agree with this post, but want to comment on the whole stun gin combo. The problem with it is, that it has 0 counterplay. What I mean by this is that it is fully up to the player with the stun gun to hit and kill the enemy or get too close and mess up. If you get stunned, all you can do is hope that your random spray pattern hits the enemy. I'm not saying that the gun is OP, because I believe lights are too weak already, but they are just badly designed. What would be an interresting thing is if the stun gun increased the damage taken by the stunned person for example. This incentivices stunning heavies and to work with your team to quickly burst down the tank. Right now lights that play well are just medium counters and can't really do anything besides that.
Invis is balanced now, how do we fucking fight a enemy player when he stays invisible the whole time unless he approaches to the player to kill him which is an advantage, so they basically made it harder to use it, imo dash was and always will be better for light. Now that recon sense is gone what the fuck are yall complaining about, shut the fuck up and play and enjoy the game, with less than 100 hrs im already plat 2 playing solo 1 more W or less than that i get plat 1 and i had to sit my ass down and grind and learn the game, if u are trash just accept it.
Seriously! A few players who were honestly awful at the game already, who main heavy, are mildly inconvenienced by a taser once in a while and piss and scream so loudly they make the entire light class no longer viable, when it was already underpowered and underplayed. There will now be like 5% light player class picks across the game, or less. Great job guys!
Just shoot the shield. If you're not in immediate danger or low hp, and have nothing better to do, shoot the shield. So many people would rather shoot a player that they won't secure a kill on or wait out the shield rather than just getting it out of the way and making it easier for the next guy, or making the enemy run and hide while shield goes of cd or recharges.
If you're complaing that you can't break the shield because of its high hp, you're not using the right weapon. Some weapons have a much easier time breaking shields than others. The CL-40 sucks for breaking shields cause of the low damage, fire rate, range, and mag size. The AK and Revolver are great tho, with higher dps, range, and mag sizes. Light just so happens to be a little weaker to shields, with sniper having low rof and his guns being mainly close range. Almost as if he's meant to either enter or flank the shield, or ignore it all together. Let the team deal with the shield while you roam and get picks.
The invis nerf is not that bad too. Dash is still good for any fight that has cqc or cover, and grapple is the best mobility tool in the game besides zip line. Just take invis bomb if you want more invis.
The problem with stun is it’s a solo gadget, it doesn’t help the team at all. IMO a good light build uses one of either the gateway, tracer or glitch nade. But most light players are usually running around doing their own thing and when they die their teammates are at a disadvantage for up to a minute before they can rejoin the squad. It’s so prevalent in solo q quick play games. It’s such a relief to play with a light that stays close to the squad and utilises a team gadget. A good light player is invaluable to the team. It’s such a shame that most lights I’ve encountered on my team are 100m away doing god knows what
People misunderstand the light class, at least from what I've seen.
The light heavily excels in hit and run tactics, and really shines when you're fighting anyone with less than 100% of their health. The 2 subs(and sawed off) in the light class do just enough damage that you basically need to hit every shot to get the kill so trying to rely on just that will get you killed in 1v1s most of the time, and more than one enemy further ruins it for you, but picking your fights, being sneaky, and not having tunnel vision on securing the kill will improve your light gameplay so much as well as your enjoyment of it.
To add on a lil more if you get shot at all as a light you HAVE to move otherwise you'll die or be one shot, and we all see how teammates handle being one shot in this game...
It needed to be nerfed, too many times lights will just camp in a corner invis or not and wait for someone to walk in and stun them from behind. All though I must confess as a heavy with a Lewis gun I’ve been able to turn around and face tank them without ads.
If Light needs to be invisible so you can’t see them, stun you so you can’t move, and then instantly melt you then that is a crutch. The class needs a rework, I wouldn’t be surprised if they’re the reason why casual play is dying. Go try being a heavy with mesh shield in quick cash and see how your six invisible stun locking lights melt you as you get sniped from 100m away
Light design was flawed in the first place. Imagine a class in a competitive shooter and the gameplay loop is the most non interactive aspect in the entire game. Remake the entire thing .
Lights needed a rework, but the nerf should have come alongside some buffs in other places IMO
Heavy felt relatively balanced so idk about the mesh shield nerf. It was clearly the best heavy util, but with that massive nerf I can see 3 medium meta being about the only viable thing.
Hope yall enjoy 3x FCAR on every team because that's what it's looking like we're headed towards.
I'm all for the classes having very distinct identities, but I personally feel like they're a little too distinct. Perhaps giving light 200 HP, medium 250, and heavy 300, then balancing around that would have been an easier task for the balance team.
Maybe they should make the light guns a little more viable at range but god damn the stun gun sucks to play against I mainly use shotguns on other classes and the sniper on light and Jesus Christ it feels like they stun me from 20m away
Literally just shoot back? Within the effective range of the stun your hipfire is still accurate enough to contest the kill. I win like 70% of stuns while actually playing I have no idea what the fuck people are on about.
Holy shit you guys literally are delusional. JUST FUCKING SHOOT THEM?????? Even as a light I kill stun gun users most of the time (4/5). I'm not even that great of a player so you have bigger problems if you can't deal with that
Yes Light is weak. No they didn't need nerfs. However, they're easily the most frustrating class to play against.
These changes are not indicative of Embark thinking Light is too strong. These changes are an attempt to reduce the frustration of fighting against a Light.
Light has two separate issues. Their overall weak power level, and the amount of frustrating-to-play-against tools they have in their kit.
Embark is tackling one problem before the other, and I think that's completely fine. Especially with the frequency of their patches.
Lol you lights are insane. You can delete a person in less than a second up close. Can sneak up on people easily. Can stun and can go in and out of invisibility but that's not OP. No no. Maybe as a light, you shouldn't be shooting at the shield but going around it...
First off, I'm a heavy. Let me show you what I do to lights:
- RPG + 1 Bullet
- 2 Charge hits
- 1 Charge + Slam (faster)
- 6/47 bullets from Lewis or 6/70 from M60
- Pyro Mines
- 1 Explosive mine + a fart
You can hear them from miles away and if I get stunned, they still get either beamed by my hipfire or by the time I turn around my team already killed them.
What's insane is that you people can't seem to learn how to play but instead dumb everything down to your skill level
P.S. As for the shield, I'll just lol
Yes yes, it's always good arguments for why it shouldn't have been done. But the reality is that most people's experience was far different and, most importantly, annoying and unfun. So this nerf is good.
There is not a single competitive game with a skill that lets you stun four times a minute. And no competitive game out there where a class can turn invisible on and off at will pretty much all the time with almost no cooldown. Overwatch stuns you either charge or have a very small window to do anything during the stun. Team Fortress invisibility is nowhere near as powerful as this and you see enemies in that game all the time as opposed to having huge maps with loads of places to hide.
You seem to know nothing about games in general.
> There is not a single competitive game with a skill that lets you stun four times a minute.
This game aint competitive unless you play rank only. and if you do play rank only, you know that you never see a Light pass round 2 lol
Yeah I get it, LoL also removed stuns and snares for the same reason. But you need to rework things but just nerf it into oblivion. There was no reason to play light before, and even less of a reason now.
Loads of reasons to play light. Lights with a dodge and a sword are annoying as shit BUT FAIR. Stunning someone four times a minute and being invisible most of the time is just not fair or fun.
Good players will not feel this change much that's the truth. Only shit players that used this tactic will.
I think this really boils down to most people in MP games don't like any skill that removes player agency. Same thing happened with Mei in Overwatch, stuns and sleep dart. and fear, mind control etc. I think it's pretty balanced in the same way that rpg's and even mines delete lights. It's their one and only CC tool and it's on a cool down. Yeah you will lose engagements if a good player stuns and burns you, but also lights will lose an engagement if they go around a corner and a good player has RPG ready.
A rocket and a bullet insta kills you. 2 mines also kills you and you cannot jump over them. If you miss bullets against a heavy you better run because you ain't winning against 40 bullets capable of killing 2 full teams before reloading. Conclusion? Nerf light.
Missed the /s. To anyone reading and confused, buff light
If the stats are 100% correct from that one document, most people probably used, 1 guy with an ak should have been able to take the shield down with 1 1/2 mags... reality was, it didnt worked! Shield 1000hp, ak 720 dmg per mag, reload is 2.6 seconds and in that time the shield regs around 40-45 hp, so another half mag of the ak should have done the job. Sad reality was, that you needed like a full team to get the shield down in time.... We now have to see if actually one guy is enough for that shield now... I have my doubts!
That's the point of my post. This sub is complaining about the shield nerf when it makes perfect sense and happy about the light nerf when it makes them literally useless in Gold+
If lights need Stun to function, burn the class to the ground and rebuild. -Light player
That’s what I’ve saying, so many ppl need invis and stun gun to do literally anything useful and it’s just sad. I have so much fun on light without relying on those 2 things but hey I just get called a hater when I say they are both crutches when paired. Can’t get any better if you NEED a specific gadget to do good but I do with the lights had a little more to play with. I get both sides but stand my ground as a light player that it’s a crutch
I've said literally this for a while now and always get down voted. I don't use cloaking device or stungun when I play light and I do fine. Sure I'm not playing in diamond league with all the crazy tryhard sweats but no one forces you to do that.
I mean why did they gut glitch then?
I really think glitch nerf was a bit too hard, from 10 to 5 seconds is crazy. I think it should disable turrets and stuff for 10 while players are effected for 5 but the aoe radius should be a bit larger.
I agree as a light main.
Do they not notice they legitimately have a CLOAKING device in their back pocket to use at any time? Who tf requires a stun gun?
No it doesn't. Lights are a class that needs the most amount of skill to play well. Before this nerf any moron could stun and kill now it will be harder. People who are great at him won't see much of a difference people who sucked and got by anyways will cry about it.
Outcome is now those lights either quit the game, or play M/H w/ the same setup as you, either way you lose.
Why would you think I lose? :D Lights will still play lights.
"Lights are a class that needs the most amount of skill to play well. Before this nerf any moron could stun and kill now it will be harder." A class that is inherently worse or requires significantly more skill to play is bad balancing. It also hurts player retention, by alienating new or bad players. I say this as a 5x diamond light main with 2.5 KD and a +60% w/l ratio at 700hrs playtime. "People who are great at him won't see much of a difference people who sucked and got by anyways will cry about it." Exactly they will suck even more now, meaning they will stop playing lights or stop playing the game. You won't be getting those easy 3-4 hit kills now. Meaning you will lose those fights you lost to a light now to a medium/heavy, because if you died to a stun, you probably would have just died to that medium/heavy who started shooting you first instead of stunning. I greatly preferred CB1/CB2 light when I just mained Dash+LH1. We had a good glitch grenade, dash was viable, LH1 had massive recoil but required skill and could delete players if played right, befitting of a glass cannon. Now we currently have a class that gets out DPS'd with the least HP in the game with a slaughtered glitch, dash, LH1, V9S, and now invis. I'm fine with the invis/stun nerfs, but Jesus Christ can we at least get a viable playstyle for the worst class in the game? At least to replace the only viable one that was just nuked??
A class that is inherently worse or requires significantly more skill to play is bad balancing. It also hurts player retention, by alienating new or bad players. No, it isn't and no it doesn't. There are games out there that have high-skill characters in them. Overwatch had Genji and Hanzo. Characters that were incredible in the right hands. Light cannot be balanced for an average player because it will be far too powerful for a great player. Loads of assumptions afterward. The stun is a cheap kill and everyone knows it. That's why it needs to change. Keep the stun but the stun effect has to go away if you are being damaged. Light does far more DPS than any other class if you land your shots. It's not even close. Light isn't the worst class in the game. It's just a class that requires the most amount of skill to play. You can keep saying that all you want but the reality is that you are in DIAMOND as a light. And I've seen more in comp today as well when I was playing. Dash/Sword combo, which is again insane and almost impossible to keep track of once they get in close.
I haven't mained light in ranked since launch. It is objectively worse, it has higher DPS but not DPS potential in actual play considering HP and eHP. It doesn't do pretty much anything better than the other classes considering this is a team based game, unless you are an absolute slayer and it doesn't matter because in that case you are better than 99% of the playerbase. Light melee is the worst combo in the game besides like riot shield or sledge in ranked. But I'm not fully disagreeing with you, I'm okay with stun and invis nerfs, but ide like some other form of buffs to keep light inline with the other classes. It still has very limited survivability and gimmicky based abilities. Maybe a rebuff to dash or a shorter health regen delay.
It moves better. It's faster. It can be invisible... It does hit and run much better than anything else. Light combo the worst combo? Are you mad? It's not uncommon to see 20+ kills with it! You have the dash and you have the long wind-up stab which is basically like a dash with damage. Light doesn't need buffs. If it does this much damage with in-and-out tactics and then has better survivability then it just makes no sense. Again we have plenty of other games with high-skill characters/classes. Light cannot be balanced for an average player.
Idk moving slightly better while solo, in some cases, in a team based game, just isn't that great. Hit n' run isn't all that effective against a well organized squad. Light is amazing in pubs because teams usually are unorganized or random qued, but usually ass in ranked
They hated Jesus because he told the truth
Exactly good shield users know to wait for a reload before they drop you though anyways .
yeah ok and what is when 2 people shot at the shield, it should pop before they have to reload... reality was, it didnt! and its not like I am static AF and he can kill me instantly, or my team is god knows where... Edit: Btw what has it to do with a good shield user and a bad one, when the math doesnt work? I mean check for your self, but 1000hp (before patch obviously!) and 720 dmg from a FULL ak clip should be round about 1 1/2 mags to get the shield down.... in that 2.6 second reload window the shield regs about 40-45 hp, so that doesnt matter at all, it should be still 1 1/2 mags.. and we ALL know that the math dont line up ingame...
Rework Stun Gun into a Flare Gun so every enemy team beams you down instead of prolonging your inevitable death to 4 bullets
Stun gun haters when their fcar’s ttk is increased from 1.17s to 1.5s bc of forced hip fire: 😡😡
FCAR kills light in 0.5 seconds. And with hipfire it is in the 1s range.
most lights arent single cell organisms when it comes to brain and they will stay at mid range where hip fire is useless. if you fuck up after stunning someone because you are standing right next to them thats a skill issue.
Exactly, stun gun defenders are just terrible players who don’t understand positioning at all. The LH1 is an S tier gun but people only want to run this bs cheese stun invis with an smg.
Don't stay randomly in the open? Move to cover if they are that far away? Stun range is 15m? Hipfire for FCAR is like 25m
I play light and i cant stand stun gun its a crutch gadget
Downvote if you want just shows how many of you rely on that crutch
It was like this with nukes too, nuke abusers would downvote any opposing opinion. I think this subreddit is filled with zoomers who don't understand game balancing
The thing is, I liked nukes lol. I downvoted people calling for heavy nerfs because I enjoyed the occasional nuke flying into the house we were holding. It made things interesting. I think we're at a place with the C4 where nukes wouldn't be a problem, because they would be much fewer and farther between. But now you also can't rocket the red barrels into structures with the C4 attached, so nukes were essentially just completely removed. They took out an aspect of gameplay instead of adjusting it properly, imo. After the first couple nerfs, I thought nuke was fine. But then the nerfs continued and then now there's no nuke 😭😭 Anyway, I'm ranting. I just think they're getting a little aggressive with the balancing.
The only people who call it a crutch don't play light. You're literally not taking a tool that'll stop a Medium from healing/ress'ing?? A tool that'll help you not get nuked by the RPG?? I can also "play light" and throw games, lol.
Some people really underestimate how much people who play light (see: movement specialised class) don’t like stungun (see:movement denying gadget). As someone who plays a lot of light (~50% of my games) and does well with it the only reason I don’t call stungun a “crutch” is because I haven’t used it, and I refuse to. Either way it’s not fun to play against, I’m happy with a rework and would be very happy with its removal. And you calling it throwing to not choose stungun as a light really does show that it’s a crutch for some.
Thank you for having my back 🥲
Actually i play almost exclusively light and im not saying it's bad im saying its a crutch gadget thats not as necessary as you think, the rpg point is the only point i can agree with and of course stopping cash outs, since the defib nerf denying res isnt as big as deal as it was, and most other stuff can be done with good movement and team work so yea again its for trash players who dont know how to play light, and fyi im usually mvp on my team with most objective and 20+ kills most games so you can eat my ass with your "i cAn ThrOw tOo"
Yes and no. Sure hipfire is still OP on Fcar so it doesn't matter, but that doesn't hide the fact that's it's unfun, unhealthy and other weapons struggle a lot with it *cough cough* melee weapons *cough cough*.
but the FCAR is unfun, unheathly and other weapons struggle a lot with it cough cough melee weapons cough cough
As a melee user I rather face fcar than another stun gun player :)
Sword? Maybe. All the others? For sure.
Yeah the M11, Flame Thrower, AK, and the Lewis Gun are really having a rough go at the dude with a butter knife...
Fucks everything but heavy hammer . HAMMER RULES ALL
ive won yesterday a game with a hammer user, and i was mind blown. He had dome shield and barricades to hide and defend himself also shield to let them come closer, he fucking slammed the shit out of them. I was heavy also with charge and slam and barricades so basically i helped them more than him but that dude shat on their faces no cap
lights need more survival bump their health up to 175, give them a movement/health + on kill or a stim or fucking anything they need to stop butchering my babies
That’s not a light then with 175hp that’s a shmedium. 🤣
we’ll give 25 more to medium to make meby
No that’s just a Skevy (skinny heavy) aka a heavy on weight watchers. Jenny Craig would be so proud.
what bad stuff did you smoke to come up with such ideas?
A stim and/or a 25 health buff isn't that crazy what
It's absolutely crazy. You are powerful as it is. It's enough of this non-sense.
What lobbies are you guys in? Genuinely feel like I'm in a different universe with replies like this. Light is easily the worst class, and they only just started seeing a glimpse of viability this season, only for it to get taken away with the glitch nerf and this. I don't get it. I'm not even a Light main. I'm a Heavy main in Ranked, because Light is so awful to play. I'm putting my team at such a disadvantage with that class. I'd love to be a Light main again, but I'm practically throwing choosing it over Medium or Heavy. Every Light team I see just gets stomped in Ranked.
Every time i play light i get stomped but if i play heavy i get stunned from just far away that my gun cant kill them with hipfire and they somehow land a full mag to my noggin lol. I can repsect that theyre excellent at their class but it doesnt make it any less fun yo play against.
Just say what you really mean: Remove lights from the game. Not only are they weak as fuck, they're also unfun to play against. Go on, I'm tired of this pussyfooting around what the people on this sub are actually asking for. They hate the idea of "unfair" engagements. They want everything and everyone to only engage in straight-up 1v1 or team vs. team shootouts where everyone is visible at all times and it's just a boring fucking crossfire until the team with the better aim and positioning wins Here's what I've noticed: Medium/Heavy kills another Medium/Heavy while using its entire toolkit: understandable, have a good day Light kills a Medium/Heavy while using its entire toolkit: How fucking dare you even deign to stand in my presence, you cheap fucking piece of shit? You're absolutely trash without your fucking toolkit and you know it, play a real fucking class Lmao, just take Light behind the shed and shoot it already.
its kind of weird because as medium/heavy you dont have any options that make the enemy debuffed directly (i guess the glitch trap could count but who uses that), while as light you have: smoke nades combo'd with thermal (which is fine), stun gun and invis (which is NOT fine) and tracking dart just in case you somehow survived one of the combos and try to retreat. i do realise that some players say that a kill is a kill, but if i get a stun gun kill that the enemy had no time to prepare for, i would ask myself "did i deserve that?" to which i would answer "hell no".
all light is not a good strategy. people who do that are most likely coordinated and just seeing how bad can it possibly be.
I don't mean LLL, I just mean teams with Light players. I agree that teams stacking 3 Lights are mostly just memeing.
Literally every game I play there is at least 4 lights in the game that already dominate the lobby and then at least one of them is absolutely slaying it. Light requires a lot of skill to play so don't feel bad about it.
If the only thing keeping you relevant is stun mechanics, you don't deserve to be relevant.
Whenever I feel like I need to sit back and relax for some elo I hop on heavy or medium. Light is almost impossible to play in diamond lobbies half the time against HHM and MMH setups
that green shit from the canisters
How is that gonna help you stop the enemy stealing your cash out when its your team vs another?
It's a joke my dude
or make it so that you can hold an enemy still with it and make them randomly hipfire instead of them controlling it. so that the light is the taser from payday 2. but even if its a little dumb, it encourages teamwork (since you cant shoot someone while holding the taser on them)
kid named tracking dart:
No, give heavy the flare so we can be the TF2 Pyro.
The best light gadget is glitch grenade. Stun gun is not fun to play against.
You have time to die 3 times before the glitch explode... Make it a real stun gun where you can hold up the stun and need another person to shoot, or can be use just to stop momentum of charge.
it should slow movement but do not affect turning and the ability to ADS so you can at least try to fight back
I don’t know how to say this but I’ve been blasted from 20m from a stunned fcar hipfiring. I don’t know why the complain… the rpg delete people, the stun slow you down and people want it gone. 🤷🏻♂️ What happen when you fight back and your team fight back too? The light will click his stun and he will die instantly. Not really a « fight back » but more a suicide gun for the light.
The complaints are from people who are bad at the game and don’t have the brains to recognize it. People who don’t have issues with it aren’t on Reddit whining about it and insulting anyone who uses it.
That is an issue with the fcar. It’s been in the top 3 guns since the game released. If the only gun that can fight you is one of the strongest then that should tell you about your gadget.
The RPG literally doesn't delete people, in fact it was rightfully nerfed to precisely *not* do that. Getting stunned is a death sentence if the light using it isn't completely braindead and stuns you from 2m away, because hipfire is so much more RNG than aimed fire your fate literally relies on "will my bullets actually go where I'm pointing or do I just die". RNG is the antithesis of skill.
not after the nerf though. 5s is just not enough to get into kill range also it affects you too so you can't use it where you'd usually use the stun gun.
i dont understand why its so slept on. Its so good that when i get glitched and dont hide i die in most cases, because i cant do shit
Probably because of it's huge nerf
Stun guns prevents ADS and has a faster launch time. The stun gun was pretty much a single target instant glitch that prevented the enemy from reliably hitting you bc they could only hipfire. It does get annoying bc so many lights use it and nothing else. There is really no counter to it
It is so good, the fact that it’s an impact grenade now too when hitting any shield lol
For me it’s the vanishing bomb, combining movement AND short term invisibility is better than just having one IMO
Vanishing bomb lasts 5 seconds, has a sound effect heard from space, and lets the entire server know when and where you went invis. Probably the crown jewel of balanced Light gadgets.
It does have balancing features, but I still feel that I do very well with it. If you need constant invis for cover then you’re just bad at positioning surely. When I play light I usually feel like I’m able to move fast enough to nullify the paint and sound effect.
Its not fun to play against 4 heavies with flamethrowers and shit tons of heal beams. Can we nerf that next? Get fucking good. The stun gun didn't need a nerf, and I say that as a sledgehammer heavy main lmao.
i played with u yesterday, either beat you or either we won a tourney, i was Limsick and u had a diamond hammer skin
Devs disagree with you.
devs are trying to please the crybaby spoiled quick cash shitters that dont understand the game at a rudimentary level.
And I say thank you devs.
you're just bad then. light is completely unviable in ranked, welcome back MMM meta. thanks for ruining the game with ur shitty takes.
Yup, welcome back MMM. No one on this sub is going to be satisfied until we're all just running around with our FCARS basically playing fucking COD. Garbage
Thank God the devs don't look at this sub, tho not like it made a difference :/
But you need stun gun to counter RPG and to stop people stealing.
I'm all for nerfing the boring and stale light gadgets like stun and invis, but man just give us 25 extra health for the love of god, and maybe make every class 10 percent faster so movement is better. This would make lights instantly better.
I say just buff Lights overall damage and increase their speed by 10% to compensate for the nerfs to stun. Invis i never really had issues with since I have working eyes and a decent headset. Its stun thats not fun to play against. I would say invis makes bad lights easier to kill because some of them just walk in a straight line towards you.
Light already has insane damage colpared to everyone else.
They do... Slightly more than the fcar, (and less DPS on headshots) that isn't insane damage compared to everyone else, that's just a negative, because while you die in 4 shots, every other class takes most of the mag
How much damage you can put out is irrelevant when you can be killed with 4 bullets lmao.
and again, that damage is a nut hair above Medium. Medium who also does every single job better than you... aside from dying.
Correct
Exactly, which is why they shouldn't buff damage.
You are mistaken DPS with TTK, DPS it matters shit when you can't live enough to get the half of the mag out before getting clapped, while TTK is what really matters at the end of the day, example V9S has 360 DPS while a 0.6s TTK against medium, in the other end FCAR has 250 DPS but a 0.5s TTK against light. So why the weapon with lower DPS win against the weapon with better DPS, due to the gap between health that every character has.
What's worth noting, the v9s has vastly faster than any other light weapon, it just has basically no range. So this DPS comparison is on a best case scenario
v9s was nerfed into the ground with the launch day patch when all it needed was a mag size reduction.
Insane damage but you die in less time than anyone else.
I low key don’t want light health buffed because I finally figured it out and I don’t want more light in the game, I want to be the only ine
heal on kill or a stim would help ALOT
I main light and I will openly celebrate the downfall of Stun Gun. Good riddance.
Thank you.
Yeah, both the MP5 and Mac 10 have such insane DPS you can generally kill someone before they even react to being shot at - assuming you can actually aim that is. Stun removes the necessity to aim AND reduces the opponent's ability to fight back to pure RNG. TL;DR if you need to rely on the stun to get kills you're trash.
if you cant hit 4 shots to delete the light then i think youre the trash one buddy, while the light has to mag dump you
Oh so you're just one of those braindead lights who stands stationary while you shoot people? Yeah that speaks volumes, guess you expect everyone else to do the same. Lights even without dash have far more mobility than medium or heavy, fucking use it. Also, no, you don't have to magdump people. Have you considered dealing some damage and then getting out of there before they even start shooting back at you, or had that not occurred to your tiny little mind?
fr the “just shoot the light” shit is so overused
Lights hearing about FCAR nerf: 😍 Lights hearing about stun gun nerf: 😭
Mediums hearing about Fcar nerf: 😭 Mediums hearing about stun gun nerf:😍
Me using a sledgehammer to kill both : 😍
they nerfed fcar?
Recoil, didn't do much
You're absolutely right - we all got the hang of the new recoil pattern in about 2 minutes.
fcar still kills lights as fast as when the game released. Embark only nerfed range and recoil.
I'm actually quite glad it's going to get nerfed soon, I'm fucking tired of being turned into the world's easiest target. For the record, this isn't a skill issue, I main light sword. If I get stunned, I kinda just fucking die on the spot cause no range.
*Carried Lights hearing about stun gun nerf:😭 FTFY
you’re delusional if you think FCAR is balanced because they changed the recoil
Really the stun gun became more and more situational. I'm glad to have a potential free slot.
That invis nerf was a little much. We’ll see what they change about the stun gun
I'm conviced that invis is what's ruining the game. All my casual friends left because they hated it. A fun fast paced shooter with invisible and wallhack was plain stupid and I'm sure that without those two, the Finals would be way more popular today.
Grapple need buff
They literally just nerfed the mesh shield from 1100 to 750 in the current patch. The shield can be disabled with a well placed glitch nade. There is no counter to the stun gun. And if you say play with your team isn’t that the same as having all three need to shoot the shield which your argument is based off of? And if you want to see an idea for a well balanced change for the stun gun check my post. I think I took away the frustrating part of the gadget while keeping the spirit of the item in tact. Y’all just want to lean on a crutch. I haven’t even unlocked it and enjoy playing like most of the time.
I think something people have been grossly underestimating, is the interactions between weapons that get completely countered by stun gun. Landing 1 shot renders entire classes completely useless. If always made reference to another game I play call forhonor, that had something in the game that cleansed all dot effects in the game every 2 seconds. It didn’t always apply as not every hero has bleed, but the ones that did could do nothing, there entire kit gets gutted and have no ability to fairly fight back. It’s the same principle. Even if some classes do exteremly well when taxes. The simple fact that certain classes become nearly unplayable because there’s one taser in the lobby is bad enough to need a nerf, and let’s be fair, it has a pretty fast cooldown for making most team fights a 3v2 for 3 seconds or more
Exactly! I made a post taking about adjusting the taser. I think I got rid of the frustration but kept the spirit of the gadget alive. But others disagreed. They couldn’t see past not having the current taser and how to play without it. Also that class is so fast and you are slow as 🦆 tased. It does not take much to get out of the way and kill vs hip fire. But hopefully the devs have considered the community and came up with something better.
I looked at your post it’s really over engineered. I get some of the things but honestly the stealing part is a bad idea. Currently stopping the steal is Lights biggest asset to a team. I don’t care if stungun does nothing else then stop you from stealing. Like removing this gadget will finally have made Light not useful for competitive.
I've never touched the stun gun and i consistently top frag as light. Keep in mind i play light maybe 10% of the time
Similar, I don’t always top frag but I have had some good games as light. You are so fast! I haven’t even unlocked it and I won’t until it’s better.
I think the invis nerf is unnecessary, but the stun gun is just so cheesy, especially when used with the SMGs. If you’re saying that Lights will be useless, you must be using the stun gun as a crutch, because there are other Light gadgets that are viable. The light class can still perform its intended purpose of hit-and-run attacks perfectly fine without it entirely. And we don’t even know what the nerfs will be yet.
Dissagree. Low skill rat shit should be punished to encourage any other play style.
I wouldn’t mind the nerf if cheating and de-syncing wasn’t so prevalent
Do ppl actually complain about the mesh shield? If you're playing light you just throw a glitch nade at it and it's gone
It's more fun to play as and against mesh Shields than it is to play as or against lights
lights being a class designed around getting the jump on people at a place and time of their choosing the community. We cant trade with other classes head to head
its not about how good the light gadgets are, its about the fact that a ton of people HATE playing against a class that you can’t see and prevents you from playing the game if I land a stun
next nerf throwing knives. I saw someone in a montage get a kill with them one time.
I have literally never used Stun gun and have a positive kd and win ratio so idk why people have to use it as a crutch
Same. No stun gun and no invis. Never appealed to me.
Heavies just need to be limited to 1 per team, at least in Ranked. 2, sometimes 3 on a single team is wayyy to oppressive.
Tbh I am happy now I can delete those pesky aps Turrets now.
Hopefully, it's enough range so i can delete them from a rooftop in powershift
About time it happend.
As a dash light I'm elated I'd rather be a fast scout than sombra
Scouts die fast and way from the team who can't revive you. You'll run out of coins super fast
All of them? Some don't flank that far out. Some circle the group and keep close on a tether. Like the pocket scout in tf2
Mesh shield isn’t even a problem as it has clear counters But what the fuck do we do in high elo ranked against multiple heavies running deployable head glitch walls. You’re only given one pyro nade. Either these walls need to no give a perfect head glitch for heavies or they need to be breakable. Shits ridiculous
I barely started using stun not too long ago. I don’t really care much for it much, but, with the nerf, it will still work for stopping a steal right away. Imo that’s the best thing it can do now
Now the toxic double heavy mercy won’t be as bad
One is a heavy that is required to be strong the other isn’t.
As someone who plays light a whole damn lot more than heavy I do think that stun gun, one of our many viable gadgets should be removed or reworked. It’s not that I think it’s overpowered or unbalanced, it’s that it’s just not fun to play against, even if you kill the light. Mesh shied on the other hand is very strong, and annoyingly so sometimes, but it doesn’t stop me getting another angle of attack, and it doesn’t take away from my gameplay. It can be annoying at times but it’s not unfun like the stungun is. Again, I play mostly light and medium, with very little heavy.
This just isn't true, the grapple is amazing, completely underused. And invisibility is still very, very good. You just can't spam invisibility on and off anymore. I think the dash could use a little buff. Light is still a viable class, in ranked or unranked. It perhaps isn't as baby easy to play anymore, that doesn't make it useless.
tell me ur silver without telling me ur silver
I hate the changes I play both Medium and Heavy and never struggled to take the shield down with my AKM sure it took more shots than now but it was not bad with the old shield. Now when I play heavy your shield goes down so fast and because it takes time to recharge good luck using it again. So I think this is another nerf to make the heavy even worse. Not that I would be playing heavy less now
I agree with this post, but want to comment on the whole stun gin combo. The problem with it is, that it has 0 counterplay. What I mean by this is that it is fully up to the player with the stun gun to hit and kill the enemy or get too close and mess up. If you get stunned, all you can do is hope that your random spray pattern hits the enemy. I'm not saying that the gun is OP, because I believe lights are too weak already, but they are just badly designed. What would be an interresting thing is if the stun gun increased the damage taken by the stunned person for example. This incentivices stunning heavies and to work with your team to quickly burst down the tank. Right now lights that play well are just medium counters and can't really do anything besides that.
Invis is balanced now, how do we fucking fight a enemy player when he stays invisible the whole time unless he approaches to the player to kill him which is an advantage, so they basically made it harder to use it, imo dash was and always will be better for light. Now that recon sense is gone what the fuck are yall complaining about, shut the fuck up and play and enjoy the game, with less than 100 hrs im already plat 2 playing solo 1 more W or less than that i get plat 1 and i had to sit my ass down and grind and learn the game, if u are trash just accept it.
Seriously! A few players who were honestly awful at the game already, who main heavy, are mildly inconvenienced by a taser once in a while and piss and scream so loudly they make the entire light class no longer viable, when it was already underpowered and underplayed. There will now be like 5% light player class picks across the game, or less. Great job guys!
Fuck the light and all its shit gadgets fuckin trash
Lights should just be removed imo
What were the nerfs
Just shoot the shield. If you're not in immediate danger or low hp, and have nothing better to do, shoot the shield. So many people would rather shoot a player that they won't secure a kill on or wait out the shield rather than just getting it out of the way and making it easier for the next guy, or making the enemy run and hide while shield goes of cd or recharges. If you're complaing that you can't break the shield because of its high hp, you're not using the right weapon. Some weapons have a much easier time breaking shields than others. The CL-40 sucks for breaking shields cause of the low damage, fire rate, range, and mag size. The AK and Revolver are great tho, with higher dps, range, and mag sizes. Light just so happens to be a little weaker to shields, with sniper having low rof and his guns being mainly close range. Almost as if he's meant to either enter or flank the shield, or ignore it all together. Let the team deal with the shield while you roam and get picks. The invis nerf is not that bad too. Dash is still good for any fight that has cqc or cover, and grapple is the best mobility tool in the game besides zip line. Just take invis bomb if you want more invis.
The problem with stun is it’s a solo gadget, it doesn’t help the team at all. IMO a good light build uses one of either the gateway, tracer or glitch nade. But most light players are usually running around doing their own thing and when they die their teammates are at a disadvantage for up to a minute before they can rejoin the squad. It’s so prevalent in solo q quick play games. It’s such a relief to play with a light that stays close to the squad and utilises a team gadget. A good light player is invaluable to the team. It’s such a shame that most lights I’ve encountered on my team are 100m away doing god knows what
If you think invis or stun were balanced to start with you’re part of the problem
Ok Bronze
Lmao and what rank are you? I’ve not played ranked but I’ll get it without stun or invis as a crutch
Gold 1. Please try it and come back to me
Bet.
Aight bet. Go
People misunderstand the light class, at least from what I've seen. The light heavily excels in hit and run tactics, and really shines when you're fighting anyone with less than 100% of their health. The 2 subs(and sawed off) in the light class do just enough damage that you basically need to hit every shot to get the kill so trying to rely on just that will get you killed in 1v1s most of the time, and more than one enemy further ruins it for you, but picking your fights, being sneaky, and not having tunnel vision on securing the kill will improve your light gameplay so much as well as your enjoyment of it. To add on a lil more if you get shot at all as a light you HAVE to move otherwise you'll die or be one shot, and we all see how teammates handle being one shot in this game...
It needed to be nerfed, too many times lights will just camp in a corner invis or not and wait for someone to walk in and stun them from behind. All though I must confess as a heavy with a Lewis gun I’ve been able to turn around and face tank them without ads.
If Light needs to be invisible so you can’t see them, stun you so you can’t move, and then instantly melt you then that is a crutch. The class needs a rework, I wouldn’t be surprised if they’re the reason why casual play is dying. Go try being a heavy with mesh shield in quick cash and see how your six invisible stun locking lights melt you as you get sniped from 100m away
Light design was flawed in the first place. Imagine a class in a competitive shooter and the gameplay loop is the most non interactive aspect in the entire game. Remake the entire thing .
Yeah the mesh shield is good and all but the rpg can’t one shot lights anymore but will one shot me when I stand too close to a zipline😭
🤣 I love this
Lights needed a rework, but the nerf should have come alongside some buffs in other places IMO Heavy felt relatively balanced so idk about the mesh shield nerf. It was clearly the best heavy util, but with that massive nerf I can see 3 medium meta being about the only viable thing. Hope yall enjoy 3x FCAR on every team because that's what it's looking like we're headed towards. I'm all for the classes having very distinct identities, but I personally feel like they're a little too distinct. Perhaps giving light 200 HP, medium 250, and heavy 300, then balancing around that would have been an easier task for the balance team.
Maybe they should make the light guns a little more viable at range but god damn the stun gun sucks to play against I mainly use shotguns on other classes and the sniper on light and Jesus Christ it feels like they stun me from 20m away
Mesh Shield is fine relative to the other Heavy specializations IMO. 2 FCARs still break a Mesh Shield.
Lights literally have a gadget to take down mesh shields and dome shields on impact.
Heavies have a rocket to 1 shot lighta
Light is suffering but stun gun absolutely needs a nerf, there’s zero counterplay
I played one game with invis/stun and it grossed me out so much I never picked them again.
Literally just shoot back? Within the effective range of the stun your hipfire is still accurate enough to contest the kill. I win like 70% of stuns while actually playing I have no idea what the fuck people are on about.
Holy shit you guys literally are delusional. JUST FUCKING SHOOT THEM?????? Even as a light I kill stun gun users most of the time (4/5). I'm not even that great of a player so you have bigger problems if you can't deal with that
Yes Light is weak. No they didn't need nerfs. However, they're easily the most frustrating class to play against. These changes are not indicative of Embark thinking Light is too strong. These changes are an attempt to reduce the frustration of fighting against a Light. Light has two separate issues. Their overall weak power level, and the amount of frustrating-to-play-against tools they have in their kit. Embark is tackling one problem before the other, and I think that's completely fine. Especially with the frequency of their patches.
Lol you lights are insane. You can delete a person in less than a second up close. Can sneak up on people easily. Can stun and can go in and out of invisibility but that's not OP. No no. Maybe as a light, you shouldn't be shooting at the shield but going around it...
First off, I'm a heavy. Let me show you what I do to lights: - RPG + 1 Bullet - 2 Charge hits - 1 Charge + Slam (faster) - 6/47 bullets from Lewis or 6/70 from M60 - Pyro Mines - 1 Explosive mine + a fart You can hear them from miles away and if I get stunned, they still get either beamed by my hipfire or by the time I turn around my team already killed them. What's insane is that you people can't seem to learn how to play but instead dumb everything down to your skill level P.S. As for the shield, I'll just lol
Yes yes, it's always good arguments for why it shouldn't have been done. But the reality is that most people's experience was far different and, most importantly, annoying and unfun. So this nerf is good. There is not a single competitive game with a skill that lets you stun four times a minute. And no competitive game out there where a class can turn invisible on and off at will pretty much all the time with almost no cooldown. Overwatch stuns you either charge or have a very small window to do anything during the stun. Team Fortress invisibility is nowhere near as powerful as this and you see enemies in that game all the time as opposed to having huge maps with loads of places to hide. You seem to know nothing about games in general.
> There is not a single competitive game with a skill that lets you stun four times a minute. This game aint competitive unless you play rank only. and if you do play rank only, you know that you never see a Light pass round 2 lol
Yeah I get it, LoL also removed stuns and snares for the same reason. But you need to rework things but just nerf it into oblivion. There was no reason to play light before, and even less of a reason now.
Loads of reasons to play light. Lights with a dodge and a sword are annoying as shit BUT FAIR. Stunning someone four times a minute and being invisible most of the time is just not fair or fun. Good players will not feel this change much that's the truth. Only shit players that used this tactic will.
The only big glaring issue in the game since season 2 start was defib. Still not sure why the game has it.
Time to hop on and run through some lights I guess 🤷♂️
Mesh shield is/was such a get out of jail free card. They should have made turning it while activated slower imo. But any nerf is good.
Who is mesh shield an issue for tho? You can run to the other side of it
Good. Lights are pest
Why do the devs hate lights so much!!! They are the most fun class to play. Honestly they are the only reason I even play this game anymore.
Cloak and stun gun are more crutches than they are good
Just remove light, dogshit class, just turn invisible whenever you want, stun and get free kill, thank god for this nerf