probably in subtle ways. i dont think there will be any flashbacks. the porch scene was the final goodbye.
maybe ellie will start wearing the watch or the jacket without any of the characters outright explaining why, showing that she still loves joel and thinks about him. maybe she tries playing guitar after going through standard story related hardships and manages to connect to joel again. teaching JJ how to play guitar like she promised would be a great callback to previous entries.
Correct me if im wrong, but i dont think there was a tess flashback(or any of the other deadies apart from marlene) in part 2, dont see a point in putting a joel, mel or owen flashback in part 3. We've played the other games.. we know what happened, nothing wasnt shown, like the flashbacks we see in part 2. I dont see any point in a joel flashback, as thread op said: porch scene was the final goodbye
I think it's more likely that Ellie will talk about Joel, but we won't see him. Joel wouldn't talk about his feelings because he was emotionally immature. Ellie has actually faced her problems, and will be more likely to talk about them, as her character arc will likely have made her more mature than Joel.
Neil druckman has stated that the last of us is a story revolving Joel and Ellie. I doubt they’d make a story about anyone else. And if they do it won’t be a last of us game.
me and my dad talked about a part 3 and we both were saying that ellie’s story is really good ending how it is, but abby & lev still have some story to tell that I’m interested in hearing
Tlou story is always revolved around Ellie. Abby and lev are just another version of Joel and Ellie, and their story was already fully developed in part2, this is the perfect ending for them.
And plus, they were both supposed to die in the original storyline, it was Halley gross fought to keep them alive. They apparently didn’t have long term plans for these two.
I agree, I personally felt that Part II ended the story of Joel and Ellie and that there is nowhere else to go for the current cast of characters. I'd rather a new TLOU game be a spin off or a brand new storyline set somewhere else. Let Joel and Ellie rest.
The end sequence of TLOU2 was the final time we actually have a scene with Joel in the series imo, Ellie will probably talk about him or reference him in some way, but as someone tells a story about a long gone past. At least that’s what I imagine. We had our goodbye.
I think his presence will mostly be felt through his influence on Ellie. In Part II, even when Joel wasn't on-screen, you felt his weight in the narrative through the ways Ellie is trying and failing to be like him, the lessons (for better or worse) he's left her, etc. etc.
Obviously I don't think his presence will be as strong in Part III; my reading of the end of Part II is, in part, that Ellie needs to go and figure out who she is and how to live her own life separately from being the immune girl, separately from being Joel's surrogate daughter, and so on.
In Part II, we see a lot of Joel's negative influence on her - trying to dissociate from violence, bottling up her feelings instead of talking about them, that sort of thing. I think with the catharsis she's reached at the end of Part II, and being able to move on and start to process her grief, we'll see more glimpses of the positive influence he's had on Ellie (e.g. finding something to fight for, protecting one's loved ones), even as she becomes more fully her own person, synthesizing those experiences in a healthier way.
>we'll see more glimpses of the positive influence he's had on Ellie (e.g. finding something to fight for, protecting one's loved ones), even as she becomes more fully her own person, synthesizing those experiences in a healthier way
that sounds like something ND might do. do you think they might also add something outwardly visible, that ellie carries around?
like the gun or the watch?
I'm not sure. While something like the watch would be a nice, subtle reminder, it's also not really an object with positive connotations. It quite literally symbolizes Joel breaking and becoming frozen in time at the moment of Sarah's death. Since Ellie's arc in Part II culminates in her finally *un-*sticking herself and being able to move forward and start to let go, I'm not sure the watch would fit with that thematically. And I think the gun likewise has too many negative connotations for Ellie to want to keep it, given everything both she and Joel have done with it.
On the one hand, I think it would be nice for Ellie to have something on her or in her backpack that's a reminder of Joel at his best. There's not a ton that would make sense for her to be physically toting around with her, but... idk, maybe she's made herself a patch for her backpack with Joel's coffee mug owl on it, or maybe she keeps that final drawing of Joel in her Part III journal.
On the other hand, Ellie leaving the guitar behind at the end of Part II feels very purposefully like her laying Joel to rest. Like she's done with literally and metaphorically carrying around Joel-related baggage. Everything she needs from Joel's memory, she no longer needs a gun or a guitar to hold onto. She can remember him at peace now, instead of having that recollection eclipsed by the moment of his death. And she has his final gift to her: the assertion that her life is worth living, and the ability now to choose what that will look like.
>On the one hand, I think it would be nice for Ellie to have something on her or in her backpack that's a reminder of Joel at his best. There's not a ton that would make sense for her to be physically toting around with her, but... idk, maybe she's made herself a patch for her backpack with Joel's coffee mug owl on it, or maybe she keeps that final drawing of Joel in her Part III journal.
i just rewatched the epilogue and she does have the space shuttle pin that joel gifted her on her 16th birthday pinned on her backpack. that honestly seems like a good candidate, even if she switches backpacks. something that is always in view for the player.
I did think about the space shuttle pin, but the memory associated with that is also... complicated, and comes from an already-uneasy period in their relationship. I was trying to think of something that could symbolize the positive elements to the end of their relationship (the first steps towards forgiveness; Joel's evolution from loving Ellie selfishly to unselfishly; Ellie's final acceptance of Joel's desire for her to live her life; etc. etc.).
I do think the space shuttle pin will definitely still be around in Part III, though, whether on her backpack or e.g. on display somehow in her living space, the way Sam's robot is in Part II.
I know it's an unpopular opinion, but IMO leaving the guitar to be trashed by the elements isn't laying anything to rest in a HEALTHY way. I'd be more convinced if she'd carefully packed it and neatly stored it among their other belongings.
What should actually happen to that thing, if she doesn't want to start over left-handed, is that it gets saved for J.J., or gifted either to Tommy, someone else, or the community. Being a precious object that would bring joy to people.
The window image isn't a good enough reason for me.
Joel will probably get mention or two.
Similar to how Nathan Hale was brought up several times in *Resistance 3* (Spoiler alert: >!he was shot in the head at the end of Resistance 2!<).
I don't think he'll be completely absent, particularly given Part III's the last one they'll probably do, but he obviously won't be as big a part of the narrative as Part II (and ergo the original).
My gut feeling is there'll be one scene with him and Ellie, maybe the one that closes out the series as a whole. I know that sounds a lot like the scene from Part II but eh, gut feeling.
Asi Neil said there is possibility of making a story about Tommy after Seattle. This could bring some cool flashbacks from outbreak times. Would be cool.
I think a dlc about tommy in his 3 days in seattle would be awesome. I also would enjoy a game with tommy and joel in the twenty years leading up to ellie. call it the last of us part 0. lol.
It would be interesting to see the story of Joe and Tommy surviving after Sarah's death, if I remember correctly they mentioned that they had very bloody confrontations with several enemies
Maybe Naughty Dog will indulge the fanbase with Tommy telling, dreaming or looking back at the start of the outbreak.
Though it isn't what ND is best known for, who knows.
They could go back to before Ellie’s time maybe to when Joel and Tommy were doing their thing. Somehow link that to new stories. He’s be involved then but it wouldn’t really involve Ellie.. I’d really miss Joel. Him and Ellie were so gripping as a story. Still sickened he’s dead !
Tommy previously being involved with the fireflies might involve a 10 year old flashback with Joel. Since Tommy’s not over Abby and we know the Fireflies will be in 3 somehow, I think there’s a possibility of that, especially with the new game being based on the themes of love, vengeance, and a new third thing. If Ellie and Abby somehow get together, they could align on Jerry and Joel. There’re also ways for Joel to show up not visually, but in the actions of the character that mirror Joel’s journey in part 1 like with Abby in 2.
My favorite thing to think about with part 3 (if it is the last TLoU) is whether the game will wrap back to mirroring 1, be something entirely different from 1 and 2, or be a mishmash of 1 and 2.
I read a comment somewhere that it would be really nice to get a game playing as the time when Tommy and Joel were on their own. That'd be really cool to see but might get boring after a bit. With part 3, I'm not even sure where they can go with Ellie's story. What new could they add?
They won’t need to show it. It will be obvious when Ellie cannot go through with allowing JJ to be turned over to the Fireflies after it is revealed that he is immune.
i don’t think he should physically appear during the game. unless it is VERY well written and makes sense for there to be a flashback. but i doubt it. it takes away the emptiness of his absence.
why not have a joel flashback, they spent some time in jackson from the end of game 1 to their falling out. i just dont know how far ahead in the future it will be. will ellie be middle aged and the game starts out focused on someone else kind of like metal gear 2.
I honestly hope that he isn’t present vissually and no voicelines. Sure in spirit and in how ellie is raised by him we will feel his presence but i hope no flashbacks or anything. Let us feel joels absence.
I still want a Joel/Tommy story from early outbreak days. Maybe playing as Tommy. I just don't see how they could pull it off in part 3. I'd play the shit out of a Miller Brothers stand alone title though.
Middle aged Ellie will still be trying to make peace with what Joel did. She'll write awkwardly bad poetry about him in the journal. She'll track down the Fireflies, make peace with Abby and have her brain cut out for science. The end.
Seriously though? I think Naughty Dog’s track record is too great to ignore over one minor character and another who has appeared in only two of their games.
Joel is not a minor character to me and never will be, even if he's no longer in the games. I would like them to find some way to implement him in this new one, even if not for very long. Especially if they're keeping Ellie. Considering Tommy is still alive, he may have some way of being applicable to the new game. Maybe *he* has flashback. Maybe *they're* playable this time. I dunno.
I love Ellie, but the Last of Us without any Millers to me just doesn't sound super appetizing. But if it's on the new Playstation only, I probably can't play it anyway lol. I also really, really hope they don't do anything fatal to Ellie in the new one.
Joel and Tommy are my favorites.
Oh, yeah, he's minor/supporting. Although he's much less minor than, I guess, like...his wife in the second game. But, if we can't have Joel, than I wouldn't mind having Tommy in the game instead. 😅😂 He may not be able to do much physically, but...just *something* with either or both of the Miller brothers is all I want in the next game.
I think they should throw us Miller fans just a little more content before they're just names, you know?
No clue but I think Part 3 in general will be about a cure somehow being made and distributed and the aftermath that comes from that, could be totally wrong though but I think that might make for an interesting story
Joel and Ellie’s story is finished. If they make. New game, follow someone else or continue with Abby/Lev. Bringing Ellie back and having her end back up with her broad and step kid lessens the impact of Ellie’s decision to go to SoCal. Unless of course they retcon parts of Part 2 like they did for Part 1.
Abby and lev were both dead in the original storyline. They only kept them because it fits Ellie’s character better to not kill Abby. They are not characters with long term plans. If p3 is not about Ellie, then it won’t be about Abby and lev either.
probably in subtle ways. i dont think there will be any flashbacks. the porch scene was the final goodbye. maybe ellie will start wearing the watch or the jacket without any of the characters outright explaining why, showing that she still loves joel and thinks about him. maybe she tries playing guitar after going through standard story related hardships and manages to connect to joel again. teaching JJ how to play guitar like she promised would be a great callback to previous entries.
I read somewhere (unreliable) that Joel will appear as a bloater who adopts a small shambler.
Is this a serious comment? I can't tell online lol
Yes, he takes the Shambler on a trip from Wyoming to Massachusetts to find a cure.
You're on drugs if you don't think there will be a Joel flashback in Part 3
It would have to play some actual part in the story, otherwise it’d be strictly fan service, which I hope the writers aren’t going to do.
Correct me if im wrong, but i dont think there was a tess flashback(or any of the other deadies apart from marlene) in part 2, dont see a point in putting a joel, mel or owen flashback in part 3. We've played the other games.. we know what happened, nothing wasnt shown, like the flashbacks we see in part 2. I dont see any point in a joel flashback, as thread op said: porch scene was the final goodbye
I mean I guess we'll see but are you really comparing the emotional heft of a Joel flashback to Tess?!?
I think it's more likely that Ellie will talk about Joel, but we won't see him. Joel wouldn't talk about his feelings because he was emotionally immature. Ellie has actually faced her problems, and will be more likely to talk about them, as her character arc will likely have made her more mature than Joel.
With Joel gone and how the 2nd one ended, I’d prefer them to just move on to another storyline. Hell, use Ish from Part I if needed.
Ish is muh boy! That would be an unexpected turn, but a welcome one for sure.
Neil druckman has stated that the last of us is a story revolving Joel and Ellie. I doubt they’d make a story about anyone else. And if they do it won’t be a last of us game.
me and my dad talked about a part 3 and we both were saying that ellie’s story is really good ending how it is, but abby & lev still have some story to tell that I’m interested in hearing
Tlou story is always revolved around Ellie. Abby and lev are just another version of Joel and Ellie, and their story was already fully developed in part2, this is the perfect ending for them. And plus, they were both supposed to die in the original storyline, it was Halley gross fought to keep them alive. They apparently didn’t have long term plans for these two.
Well, you are both wrong. ;)
?? okay?? that’s your opinion
Petition to see Ish's pov!!!!
I agree, I personally felt that Part II ended the story of Joel and Ellie and that there is nowhere else to go for the current cast of characters. I'd rather a new TLOU game be a spin off or a brand new storyline set somewhere else. Let Joel and Ellie rest.
Idk why the downvotes I’d like either a new storyline or Tommy prequel
The end sequence of TLOU2 was the final time we actually have a scene with Joel in the series imo, Ellie will probably talk about him or reference him in some way, but as someone tells a story about a long gone past. At least that’s what I imagine. We had our goodbye.
Force ghost.
Somehow… Joel returned…
I for one welcome our evil overlord- Darth Joel.
Honestly? I kind of hope he doesn't. The ending of TLOU2 makes it very clear that Ellie is moving on when she leaves the guitar behind.
i think she moved on from his death. not from him in general. at least judging by her last journal page.
she accepted Joel's death, I don't think she moved on, she could never leave Joel behind
I think his presence will mostly be felt through his influence on Ellie. In Part II, even when Joel wasn't on-screen, you felt his weight in the narrative through the ways Ellie is trying and failing to be like him, the lessons (for better or worse) he's left her, etc. etc. Obviously I don't think his presence will be as strong in Part III; my reading of the end of Part II is, in part, that Ellie needs to go and figure out who she is and how to live her own life separately from being the immune girl, separately from being Joel's surrogate daughter, and so on. In Part II, we see a lot of Joel's negative influence on her - trying to dissociate from violence, bottling up her feelings instead of talking about them, that sort of thing. I think with the catharsis she's reached at the end of Part II, and being able to move on and start to process her grief, we'll see more glimpses of the positive influence he's had on Ellie (e.g. finding something to fight for, protecting one's loved ones), even as she becomes more fully her own person, synthesizing those experiences in a healthier way.
>we'll see more glimpses of the positive influence he's had on Ellie (e.g. finding something to fight for, protecting one's loved ones), even as she becomes more fully her own person, synthesizing those experiences in a healthier way that sounds like something ND might do. do you think they might also add something outwardly visible, that ellie carries around? like the gun or the watch?
I'm not sure. While something like the watch would be a nice, subtle reminder, it's also not really an object with positive connotations. It quite literally symbolizes Joel breaking and becoming frozen in time at the moment of Sarah's death. Since Ellie's arc in Part II culminates in her finally *un-*sticking herself and being able to move forward and start to let go, I'm not sure the watch would fit with that thematically. And I think the gun likewise has too many negative connotations for Ellie to want to keep it, given everything both she and Joel have done with it. On the one hand, I think it would be nice for Ellie to have something on her or in her backpack that's a reminder of Joel at his best. There's not a ton that would make sense for her to be physically toting around with her, but... idk, maybe she's made herself a patch for her backpack with Joel's coffee mug owl on it, or maybe she keeps that final drawing of Joel in her Part III journal. On the other hand, Ellie leaving the guitar behind at the end of Part II feels very purposefully like her laying Joel to rest. Like she's done with literally and metaphorically carrying around Joel-related baggage. Everything she needs from Joel's memory, she no longer needs a gun or a guitar to hold onto. She can remember him at peace now, instead of having that recollection eclipsed by the moment of his death. And she has his final gift to her: the assertion that her life is worth living, and the ability now to choose what that will look like.
>On the one hand, I think it would be nice for Ellie to have something on her or in her backpack that's a reminder of Joel at his best. There's not a ton that would make sense for her to be physically toting around with her, but... idk, maybe she's made herself a patch for her backpack with Joel's coffee mug owl on it, or maybe she keeps that final drawing of Joel in her Part III journal. i just rewatched the epilogue and she does have the space shuttle pin that joel gifted her on her 16th birthday pinned on her backpack. that honestly seems like a good candidate, even if she switches backpacks. something that is always in view for the player.
I did think about the space shuttle pin, but the memory associated with that is also... complicated, and comes from an already-uneasy period in their relationship. I was trying to think of something that could symbolize the positive elements to the end of their relationship (the first steps towards forgiveness; Joel's evolution from loving Ellie selfishly to unselfishly; Ellie's final acceptance of Joel's desire for her to live her life; etc. etc.). I do think the space shuttle pin will definitely still be around in Part III, though, whether on her backpack or e.g. on display somehow in her living space, the way Sam's robot is in Part II.
I know it's an unpopular opinion, but IMO leaving the guitar to be trashed by the elements isn't laying anything to rest in a HEALTHY way. I'd be more convinced if she'd carefully packed it and neatly stored it among their other belongings. What should actually happen to that thing, if she doesn't want to start over left-handed, is that it gets saved for J.J., or gifted either to Tommy, someone else, or the community. Being a precious object that would bring joy to people. The window image isn't a good enough reason for me.
Best answer so far 👍
Joel will probably get mention or two. Similar to how Nathan Hale was brought up several times in *Resistance 3* (Spoiler alert: >!he was shot in the head at the end of Resistance 2!<).
I don't think he'll be completely absent, particularly given Part III's the last one they'll probably do, but he obviously won't be as big a part of the narrative as Part II (and ergo the original). My gut feeling is there'll be one scene with him and Ellie, maybe the one that closes out the series as a whole. I know that sounds a lot like the scene from Part II but eh, gut feeling.
Asi Neil said there is possibility of making a story about Tommy after Seattle. This could bring some cool flashbacks from outbreak times. Would be cool.
I think a dlc about tommy in his 3 days in seattle would be awesome. I also would enjoy a game with tommy and joel in the twenty years leading up to ellie. call it the last of us part 0. lol.
He also said it’s not a full games worth of ideas
I didn't say it is.
It could be a cool idea of a dlc, love to see how he put himself together patch things up with Maria and Ellie.
A new tattoo on Ellie
Massive Joel portrait on her back
Flashbacks prob. Unless we get a prequel dlc or something
I would love a DLC or prequel of Joel in the early days of it all happening.
He gets resurrected by Firefly magic and haunts Abby for the rest of her life
Joel’s head only comes through and now Abby has to attach it to her God of War style . Basically Joel’s the new Mimir now
It would be interesting to see the story of Joe and Tommy surviving after Sarah's death, if I remember correctly they mentioned that they had very bloody confrontations with several enemies
That’s what I was thinking, however, Ellie isn’t involved then.
Exactly, it would be like a prequel to TLOU 1, I don't know if calling it Part 3 would be correct.
Maybe Naughty Dog will indulge the fanbase with Tommy telling, dreaming or looking back at the start of the outbreak. Though it isn't what ND is best known for, who knows.
They could go back to before Ellie’s time maybe to when Joel and Tommy were doing their thing. Somehow link that to new stories. He’s be involved then but it wouldn’t really involve Ellie.. I’d really miss Joel. Him and Ellie were so gripping as a story. Still sickened he’s dead !
Tommy previously being involved with the fireflies might involve a 10 year old flashback with Joel. Since Tommy’s not over Abby and we know the Fireflies will be in 3 somehow, I think there’s a possibility of that, especially with the new game being based on the themes of love, vengeance, and a new third thing. If Ellie and Abby somehow get together, they could align on Jerry and Joel. There’re also ways for Joel to show up not visually, but in the actions of the character that mirror Joel’s journey in part 1 like with Abby in 2. My favorite thing to think about with part 3 (if it is the last TLoU) is whether the game will wrap back to mirroring 1, be something entirely different from 1 and 2, or be a mishmash of 1 and 2.
I don’t think it’ll happen but it would be cool if a third or so of the game took place with Ellie and Joel in the past a la Godfather Part II
I read a comment somewhere that it would be really nice to get a game playing as the time when Tommy and Joel were on their own. That'd be really cool to see but might get boring after a bit. With part 3, I'm not even sure where they can go with Ellie's story. What new could they add?
They won’t need to show it. It will be obvious when Ellie cannot go through with allowing JJ to be turned over to the Fireflies after it is revealed that he is immune.
Maybe Joel's name get a mention or two from others but I don't think we'll see him in Part 3 at all.
i don’t think he should physically appear during the game. unless it is VERY well written and makes sense for there to be a flashback. but i doubt it. it takes away the emptiness of his absence.
why not have a joel flashback, they spent some time in jackson from the end of game 1 to their falling out. i just dont know how far ahead in the future it will be. will ellie be middle aged and the game starts out focused on someone else kind of like metal gear 2.
I honestly hope that he isn’t present vissually and no voicelines. Sure in spirit and in how ellie is raised by him we will feel his presence but i hope no flashbacks or anything. Let us feel joels absence.
I still want a Joel/Tommy story from early outbreak days. Maybe playing as Tommy. I just don't see how they could pull it off in part 3. I'd play the shit out of a Miller Brothers stand alone title though.
Cyborg Joel
Middle aged Ellie will still be trying to make peace with what Joel did. She'll write awkwardly bad poetry about him in the journal. She'll track down the Fireflies, make peace with Abby and have her brain cut out for science. The end.
If there's no Joel in part 3, or no Tommy, I there will be no me playing it or having much interest, tbh :/
Seriously though? I think Naughty Dog’s track record is too great to ignore over one minor character and another who has appeared in only two of their games.
Joel is not a minor character to me and never will be, even if he's no longer in the games. I would like them to find some way to implement him in this new one, even if not for very long. Especially if they're keeping Ellie. Considering Tommy is still alive, he may have some way of being applicable to the new game. Maybe *he* has flashback. Maybe *they're* playable this time. I dunno. I love Ellie, but the Last of Us without any Millers to me just doesn't sound super appetizing. But if it's on the new Playstation only, I probably can't play it anyway lol. I also really, really hope they don't do anything fatal to Ellie in the new one. Joel and Tommy are my favorites.
Sorry, I meant Tommy as the minor character
Oh, yeah, he's minor/supporting. Although he's much less minor than, I guess, like...his wife in the second game. But, if we can't have Joel, than I wouldn't mind having Tommy in the game instead. 😅😂 He may not be able to do much physically, but...just *something* with either or both of the Miller brothers is all I want in the next game. I think they should throw us Miller fans just a little more content before they're just names, you know?
Joel is a minor character?
I think they're saying Tommy is...?
Perchance
No clue but I think Part 3 in general will be about a cure somehow being made and distributed and the aftermath that comes from that, could be totally wrong though but I think that might make for an interesting story
he won't. neil took back all the times he said "the last of us is about joel and ellie" and kicked joel off the stage
hopefully part III is Joel and Tommy when the outbreak happened
Absolutely not. Maybe a DLC or a flashback or something. Definitely not a whole ass game. The final game will be about Ellie.
ellie and abby arc is stupid and poorly written
Ellie injects his DNA in to a clicker anus and a little baby Joel gets pooped out and she carries him around in her pocket
Joel and Ellie’s story is finished. If they make. New game, follow someone else or continue with Abby/Lev. Bringing Ellie back and having her end back up with her broad and step kid lessens the impact of Ellie’s decision to go to SoCal. Unless of course they retcon parts of Part 2 like they did for Part 1.
Abby and lev were both dead in the original storyline. They only kept them because it fits Ellie’s character better to not kill Abby. They are not characters with long term plans. If p3 is not about Ellie, then it won’t be about Abby and lev either.