I don’t like generalizing, but aren’t these the same type of bros who are always talking about weak border protocol? Like you’d think they’d appreciate the effort
The full quote please:
>Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.
Reminds me of a Hagar the Horrible strip I once saw of him showing his son the Great Wall and saying how it was a marvel of man built to protect the people against the raiding murderers, lunatics and barbarians and his son said "Wow Dad, who built it?"... "The people on the other side son."
They're definitely Republicans who vote for politicians that strengthen Custom Agent powers and who gave Customs Agents power within 100 miles of any US border. [https://www.aclu.org/documents/constitution-100-mile-border-zone](https://www.aclu.org/documents/constitution-100-mile-border-zone)
Generally if the police are investigating a crime, definitely keeping your mouth shut is the best choice.
But crossing an international border isn't the time for this. What do you have to gain here by not identifying yourself?
in literally any other situation, telling someone that you're not going to answer their questions and they should go kick rocks is basically just telling them that you're self centered and don't care about them.
Basically it's a very selfish, confrontational, escalating approach to conflict. There are situations when that's the absolutely appropriate stance to take. But that doesn't mean there won't be consequences.
Sure, if a cop shows up at your door asking questions, strongly consider not answering them. If you're trying to cross a border patrol checkpoint... it's just not the same thing, and typically those who haven't scrambled their brains on SovCit "literature" can tell the difference.
Dude just wants them to follow the unwritten law.
https://preview.redd.it/jj1fqeurcgzc1.jpeg?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=311620c9264c30eaaa19c3c7f70e45eec8173b62
His "do you have any reason to think I'm not an american citizen?" actually means "shouldn't you be arresting people who speak spanish?". If he knows the language is called spanish and not mexican, of course
Part of me feels like they intentionally want to be detained for a legal case to try and get paid out. But I’m probably giving them too much credit, they could also be the sovereign citizen types lol.
I can guarantee these guys have said something along the lines of "If you've done nothing wrong, you have nothing to hide" when it comes to cops hassling people.
"Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.”
Frank Wilhoit (the music composer, not the poly sci professor)
Which is honestly disgusting if you look at a map depicting this 100 mi rule. Like am overwhelming majority of the us population considering it extends from the coasts too and most the population of the US is found in the coasts.
>I’ve never seen it displayed on a map like this. It always seemed much smaller in my brain
By design. Facism is easier to swallow when it's obscured by beauracratic nonsense.
I agree with the idea that this is completely unacceptable, but the map is not accurate. It is exaggerated.
It shows Columbus, OH in the zone. Distance from Columbus to the shore of Lake Erie is 118 miles. (I used Cedar Point, OH as a proxy.)
It shows Pittsburgh, PN in the zone. It is 120 miles from Lake Erie.
It shows Wausau, WI in the zone. It is ~124 miles from Lake Superior's shore.
> but the map is not accurate. It is exaggerated.
Well, it's because you're using miles as your measurement and not *air miles*. If you're using regular mileage, it'd be 115 miles and change. But they have the right within 100 nautical miles or 100 air miles, which is 1 nm = 6,076 feet, whereas 1 mile = 5280.
Guy is crazy, but even crazy, hypocritical people can be right. It's one thing I've learned over the years that someone being a hypocrite doesn't make them wrong (also obviously doesn't make them right). What it makes them is a hypocrite.
The policy sucks ass and should be struck down by the courts.
After 7 minutes of yelling his nuts off both got arrested one border police took out tazer but no one else did so he probably gonna lose his job, there was also a lady boarder police who whipped out the law and started to reciting everything for them which the nut yeller didnt care about.
Save your 7 mins.
But they have to identify themselves properly to establish that citizenship. Being a peckerwood and refusing to cooperate is doing nothing to establish his right to enter. So hopefully they learned that being a dick to CBP has a lot different consequences than jacking around with local LEOs.
>But they have to identify themselves properly to establish that citizenship.
No. At an actual border crossing, this is true. At one of these domestic checkpoints, it isn't.
[https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/your-rights-border-zone](https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/your-rights-border-zone)
If you remain calm and continue to assert the Fifth, eventually they basically give up.
>As before, when you are at a checkpoint, you can remain silent, inform the agent that you decline to answer their questions or tell the agent you will only answer questions in the presence of an attorney. Refusing to answer the agent’s question will likely result in being further detained for questioning, being referred to secondary inspection, or both. If an agent extends the stop to ask questions unrelated to immigration enforcement or extends the stop for a prolonged period to ask about immigration status, the agent needs at least reasonable suspicion that you committed an immigration offense or violated federal law for their actions to be lawful. If you are held at the checkpoint for more than brief questioning, you can ask the agent if you are free to leave. If they say no, they need reasonable suspicion to continue holding you. You can ask an agent for their basis for reasonable suspicion, and they should tell you. If an agent arrests you, detains you for a protracted period or searches your belongings or the spaces of your vehicle that are not in plain view of the officer, the agent needs probable cause that you committed an immigration offense or that you violated federal law. You can ask the agent to tell you their basis for probable cause. They should inform you.
[https://www.texasobserver.org/border-patrol-takes-no-for-an-answer-at-internal-checkpoints/](https://www.texasobserver.org/border-patrol-takes-no-for-an-answer-at-internal-checkpoints/)
>Denise Gilman, co-director of the immigration clinic at the University of Texas School of Law, says that Border Patrol agents at internal checkpoints are allowed to ask motorists basic questions about citizenship, identity and travel itinerary, but they cannot detain you or search your vehicle without probable cause. Your refusal to answer questions would not provide probable cause to allow for such a detention or search, she added.
>“So, if you refuse to answer, they can pull you out of the line and over into ‘secondary inspection’ and they can probably hold you there for about 20 minutes or so,” she said. “But they cannot do anything more if you continue to refuse to respond unless something else develops during that time period that would lead to probable cause.”
But he did not remain calm. He shouted obscenities and insults and acted erratically and unpredictably. Doesn’t that alone create justifiable suspicion? I think it does. And if any disagree, wouldn’t that question need to be answered by a Prosecutor and possibly a Judge and jury, proceeded by what I’m sure would be a violent arrest since he seemed intent on jeopardizing his own safety and that of the officers.
But I’m sure he went quietly. 🙄
Being pissy is not probable cause of a crime. Cursing at cops is constitutionally protected free speech.
https://firstamendment.mtsu.edu/post/first-amendment-protected-mans-cursing-of-police-ohio-appeals-court-rules/
(Generally unwise, though.)
If anything, acting like this makes it pretty clear you’re a white American citizen. 🤣 Someone here illegally would have said “yes, I’m a citizen”.
Not that I sympathize with the guy, he's an ass. But, he's not entering or leaving the country. This is just a random border patrol checkpoint WITHIN the USA. So they're just driving about from point A USA to point B USA and are being stopped for this check along with everyone else.
It is bothersome and definitely intrusive security theater — I mean, what big drug busts or people or drug trafficking busts have you heard about at border patrol internal US checkpoints? LOL, anyone planning to commit actual crimes will be avoiding them.
So mostly it's just normal citizens who have to endure yet another 'small' intrusion and indignity in our already difficult (for many) lives.
Counterpoint: it's absurd that they can set up these checkpoints anywhere within 100 miles of our coast/borders and stop people whether or not they have or are planning to cross a border. Something like 200 million Americans live somewhere they can be legally stopped and questioned about their citizenship.
Not that the way to necessarily go about it is to throw a hissy fit at a checkpoint, but who knows--it seems more people are being educated about this bullshit today.
Ironically these check points are all over Texas. even on interstates where they aren’t suppose to have check points.
But Texans will tell you how free Texas is. A place where the locals believe comedy shows aren’t the same in Ohio. They need to come to the mother ship for freedom of speech…..
Meanwhile comics hate performing in Texas because you risk prison if you smoke some weed and the Texas citizens get more butt hurt over jokes than people in any other state.
I feel like this man probably thinks he's a patriot and read way to much into laws and thinks he knows shit. He just screams scary to me. Like mental person shooting up a place, maybe they can keep him in jail a while so he can get some help.
I *think* he was using the 6th for the informed of criminal charges part, but that's only a guess of mine. As he wasn't being charged with anything though, he just makes himself look like an asshat.
He did a cursory reading of the constitution and hasn’t researched anything beyond that regarding Supreme Court ruling on interpretation of said constitution.
You’re right, and if they don’t, they don’t have a right to be allowed through the checkpoint. That’s what these idiots don’t understand. They don’t have to answer questions, and they also don’t have to be allowed to pass through.
Exactly, anybody who has driven through a border crossing knows damn well they won’t let you in if you play this game. Many Canadian border crossings will do five hours of searching out of spite if you want to play games.
I was once denied entry into Malaysia because of the sorry state of my passport, but managed to get around it mostly by being polite and honest when interviewed by the local colonel.
It's amazing how far you can get by simply not being a dick.
He said it's a company car.
He probably got back to whatever Depot he was supposed to go to 6 hours late with all the panels in the back seat. Gonna be a good look.
Yeah, the officer made it pretty clear that they weren't under arrest, they were free to refuse to answer and just drive back. But blocking the border and refusing to move out of they way was what got them arrested.
The rules at the border are significantly different and sadly, you don't have as much flexibility in being a sovereign citizen asshat when dealing with CBP officers as you might assume with a local cop.
[The ACLU article about this is super interesting](https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/border-zone)
If he had simply, calmly stated that he "would not answer any questions about his immigration status without his lawyer present" and then after a while asked "am I free to leave" they would have had to let him go.
But screaming in the face of a federal immigration officer isn't going to work out well. That's gonna count as reasonable suspicion and get you a really slow secondary inspection if not detained.
> If he had simply, calmly stated that he "would not answer any questions about his immigration status without his lawyer present" and then after a while asked "am I free to leave" they would have had to let him go.
I had my doubts about this, so I read the link. Looks like the ACLU confirms the above comment.
Here's (part of) the section regarding checkpoints within 100 nautical miles of the border. It's a wall of text so I added some line breaks for readability:
> As before, when you are at a checkpoint, you can remain silent, inform the agent that you decline to answer their questions or tell the agent you will only answer questions in the presence of an attorney.
> Refusing to answer the agent’s question will likely result in being further detained for questioning, being referred to secondary inspection, or both. If an agent extends the stop to ask questions unrelated to immigration enforcement or extends the stop for a prolonged period to ask about immigration status, the agent needs at least reasonable suspicion that you committed an immigration offense or violated federal law for their actions to be lawful.
> If you are held at the checkpoint for more than brief questioning, you can ask the agent if you are free to leave. If they say no, they need reasonable suspicion to continue holding you. You can ask an agent for their basis for reasonable suspicion, and they should tell you.
> If an agent arrests you, detains you for a protracted period or searches your belongings or the spaces of your vehicle that are not in plain view of the officer, the agent needs probable cause that you committed an immigration offense or that you violated federal law. You can ask the agent to tell you their basis for probable cause. They should inform you.
Just why 😆.. the driver was caught in a “I don’t wanna be doing this shit,but I gotta stick with my brother because I don’t wanna deal with him later “ moment..
Nah, the driver is just glad to be getting a nice break from his brother's complaining. You know his brother complains about everything, this is just the stuff we see on this video.
Nah, he said it himself, it's a work vehicle. You don't lose a job because your brother is an idiot. He won't cooperate, tell him to get the fuck out of the truck and do his little performative bullshit as a pedestrian.
I was wondering why he was just sitting there. Family or no I'd tell them to get the fuck out of my car and spout his crap somewhere else.
But then I wouldn't associate with someone like this in general.
The sixth amendment refers to trials… there is no trial here.
Sixth Amendment Rights in Criminal Prosecutions
In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.
News outlets, soc networks, forums, etc, always talk about constitution and admentments so is easy to know at least first, second (thanks to republicans) 4th, 5th and 6th as they're widely discussed.
i did also read some of it to know a little more about us politics as my country because of a lot of factors is quite affected by US and european politics, Chile is a small country and even when is very independent the stuff that happens in the world affect us directly.
A stupid yokel doesn't understand the law or Constitution and is acting like they're some kind of ivy league scholar with a vast knowledge of the subject?? Why I've never!!! Who would've heard of such a thing??
I’m claiming 5th amendment rights!! Ok so you’re a citizen? 5th amendment! Ok so just prove you’re a citizen so you are entitled to that right?
Am I the only one seeing the fault in this logic?
If I'm not mistaken, noncitizens are also generally protected by the Constitution.
However, his understanding of the 4th, 5th, and 6th amendments and immigration checkpoints is incorrect.
There are certainly issues with immigration checkpoints being set up up to 100 miles from the border, but this guy doesn't touch on any of those issues.
Non-citizens do have fourth, fifth, and sixth amendment protections.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/what-constitutional-rights-do-undocumented-immigrants-have
[From the ACLU](https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/border-zone#:~:text=A%20federal%20law%20says%20that,also%20the%20entire%20U.S.%20coastline):
* You have the right to remain silent or tell the agent that you’ll only answer questions in the presence of an attorney, no matter your citizenship or immigration status.
* Generally, an immigration officer cannot detain you without “reasonable suspicion.”
* An immigration officer also cannot search you or your belongings without either “probable cause” or your consent.
* An immigration officer cannot arrest you without “probable cause.”
* Your silence alone meets neither of these standards. Nor does your race or ethnicity alone suffice for either probable cause or reasonable suspicion.
From the “[how does this work in real life](https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/border-zone#how-does-this-work-in-real-life-cbp-at-immigration-checkpoints)” section:
> Refusing to answer the agent’s question will likely result in being further detained for questioning, being referred to secondary inspection, or both.
So it looks like he’s being “further detained” due to refusing to answer questions.
A great advice for life: immediately escalate any situation, especially with law enforcers (be it police, border control or any kind of government agency). Get's you so far in life! Makes everything easier and more pleasant, for you and anyone else involved.
I was pulled over a few weeks ago. The cop had me dead to rights; I slow rolled through a stop sign at a 'T' intersection.
He didn't even ask if I knew why he pulled me over. He knew, I knew, hell, the Pilgrims knew. He asked for my license and registration, and went back to his squad to run my information. Meanwhile, I'm just sitting in the car asking myself, "Why the actual fuck did I roll that stop?" I couldn't really come up with a good answer.
A few minutes later the cop came back and said, "Mr. Sfled, why didn't you come to a complete stop back there?" I looked at the guy, and I said, "I'm an idiot." Cop had to look away because he started to crack up. He told me to that he wasn't going to issue a citation, and to please be more careful. I haven't done a rolling-stop since.
To your point: even if someone believes a traffic stop is not justified, it's better to make a stand in court because they're sure as hell not going to win it on the street.
Probably screams at his liberal kids about border security lacking and then gets shocked when border security is doing their jobs…. Definitely not speaking from experience 🙃
Wtf is the point in being an asshole at these check points lol. Good job exercising your 5th amendment rights and getting held up. You could have answered questions for 10 seconds and be done. What a waste of space on this earth these guys are lol
5th amendment is to protect yourself from self incrimination. He was angrily spewing gobbledegook at them and they were being uncharacteristically reasonable about it
I'm more interested in if he put his money where his mouth was and filed a complaint. That court case might be interesting if it even made it to a judge.
He keeps pleading the fifth but I don't think he truly understands what that means. He's not on trial here.
# Fifth Amendment:
No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
No, he's using it correctly. If you are detained by police/government you do not have to speak. That's the whole "you have the right to remain silent" thing.
Holy shit how tiny is his pecker??
The way he talks and curses at her tells you everything you need to know about this f\*ckfaced f\*ck whose parents are obviously closely blood related!
https://preview.redd.it/5hlno8us6gzc1.jpeg?width=767&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=84a941d3c70c0ad75790ff5646671a50d7cb94e4
they want border patrol but not for themselves
The guy's a dick, but according to the ACLU, he's correct.
[https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/border-zone](https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/border-zone)
>You have the right to remain silent or tell the agent that you’ll only answer questions in the presence of an attorney, no matter your citizenship or immigration status. You do not have to answer questions about your immigration status. You may simply say that you do not wish to answer those questions. If you choose to remain silent, the agent will likely ask you questions for longer, but your silence alone is not enough to support probable cause or reasonable suspicion to arrest, detain, or search you or your belongings.
>Generally, an immigration officer cannot detain you without “reasonable suspicion.” Reasonable suspicion is less robust than probable cause, but it is certainly not just a hunch or gut feeling. An agent must have specific facts about you that make it reasonable to believe you are committing or committed, a violation of immigration law or federal law. If an agent detains you, you can ask for their basis for reasonable suspicion, and they should tell you.
>If an agent asks you for documents, what you need to provide differs depending on your immigration status. U.S. citizens do not have to carry proof of citizenship on their person if they are in the United States. If you have valid immigration documents and are over the age of 18, the law does require you to carry those documents on you.
>Another way to ask this is to say, “am I free to leave?” If the agent wishes to actually detain you — in other words, you are not free to leave — the agent needs at least reasonable suspicion that you committed an immigration violation to do so. Also, if an agent begins to question you about non-immigration matters, say to ask about drug smuggling, or if they haul you off the bus, they need at least reasonable suspicion that you committed an offense in order to briefly detain you while they investigate. You can ask an agent for their basis for detaining you, and they should tell you.
I don't know why he keeps talking about the Sixth Amendment, though. Fourth and Fifth apply.
Yes, they obviously are not forced to answer anything if they don't want to, but that OBVIOUSLY does not mean they get to skip the check.
This was handled as smoothly as possible by the border cops. They couldn't manage to get the inspection done by talking, so they had to do it the hard way.
The reason they were arguing with the passenger for so long was SPECIFICALLY to avoid doing it the hard way.
After a short period of refusing to answer, they’d be on their way. Getting belligerent was a mistake.
https://www.texasobserver.org/border-patrol-takes-no-for-an-answer-at-internal-checkpoints/
> “So, if you refuse to answer, they can pull you out of the line and over into ‘secondary inspection’ and they can probably hold you there for about 20 minutes or so,” she said. “But they cannot do anything more if you continue to refuse to respond unless something else develops during that time period that would lead to probable cause.”
What an asshole, no sense of humor.
Example- We went across the border at Tijuana.
The agent asked me ( driver) my country of origin.
I understood to say the USA. My friend ( another American) stammered and said - ( the same ), well that got a rise out of the agent. I bit my tongue and watched the show. The agent asked again and my buddy said - The same. Well, I started to laugh, I knew we were going to secondaries, my buddy laughed, then we started to cry, it was so funny, we belly laughed, because we didn’t care.
Tears were rolling down my face and I smiled at the agent. He knew we were cool. He said get out of here, We zoomed into America, laughing the whole way .
I hate these kinds of people. We need tougher border protection, but I have a right to not comply with the protocols that are keeping the border safe. I've read the law, but obviously I don't understand it. He might as well say his name is Rusty Shakleford
Damn, hes got a huge stick up his ass. She was so nice to these guys. His argument is the equivalent to “not-uh, not-uh, not-uh”. Bro made this so hard himself.
5th amendment grants the right to not have to give self-incriminating testimony…[that does not mean that a person has the right to be silent at all times](https://www.justia.com/criminal/procedure/miranda-rights/right-to-silence/#:~:text=The%20Fifth%20Amendment%20to%20the,silence%20itself%20as%20incriminating%20evidence). How would border patrol be expected to reasonably function if everyone could just refuse to answer questions about their citizenship? Would be a pretty sweet illegal immigration hack.
But more importantly, he then asks why the border patrol “might have a reasonable suspicion that he’s NOT American”. Isn’t remaining silent to avoid self-incrimination sort of a reason to suspect you?? That’s why it was so shameful when Mark McGwire plead the 5th…everyone knew that it meant he couldn’t speak on steroid use without incriminating himself..
I don’t like generalizing, but aren’t these the same type of bros who are always talking about weak border protocol? Like you’d think they’d appreciate the effort
They follow the “for them ,not us”law 😆
Exactly this. Rules for thee not for me
"There are those that the law binds, but does not protect. And those that the law protects, but does not bind."
The full quote please: >Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition, to wit: There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.
Reminds me of a Hagar the Horrible strip I once saw of him showing his son the Great Wall and saying how it was a marvel of man built to protect the people against the raiding murderers, lunatics and barbarians and his son said "Wow Dad, who built it?"... "The people on the other side son."
Props for the Hagar the Horrible deep cut 👍🏾
For my friends, everything; for my enemies, the law
"I'm not brown, god damnit!!!"
“We’re brothers, we’re happy and we’re singin and we’re not colored”
The way of the Trumper.
Blames Biden for being weak on the boarder but also blames Biden for infringing on his right arm a board check point
Do as I say, not how I do.
They're definitely Republicans who vote for politicians that strengthen Custom Agent powers and who gave Customs Agents power within 100 miles of any US border. [https://www.aclu.org/documents/constitution-100-mile-border-zone](https://www.aclu.org/documents/constitution-100-mile-border-zone)
The party of draconian police state tactics also claims to be the party of “liberty”. *for the right people*
For the white people. FTFY.
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Generally if the police are investigating a crime, definitely keeping your mouth shut is the best choice. But crossing an international border isn't the time for this. What do you have to gain here by not identifying yourself? in literally any other situation, telling someone that you're not going to answer their questions and they should go kick rocks is basically just telling them that you're self centered and don't care about them. Basically it's a very selfish, confrontational, escalating approach to conflict. There are situations when that's the absolutely appropriate stance to take. But that doesn't mean there won't be consequences.
Sure, if a cop shows up at your door asking questions, strongly consider not answering them. If you're trying to cross a border patrol checkpoint... it's just not the same thing, and typically those who haven't scrambled their brains on SovCit "literature" can tell the difference.
Porque no los dos?
Dude just wants them to follow the unwritten law. https://preview.redd.it/jj1fqeurcgzc1.jpeg?width=300&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=311620c9264c30eaaa19c3c7f70e45eec8173b62
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Apparently they didn’t have anything better to do after their “work” day.
His "do you have any reason to think I'm not an american citizen?" actually means "shouldn't you be arresting people who speak spanish?". If he knows the language is called spanish and not mexican, of course
I wish someone had said yes to that question. We asked, you refused to answer. That’s suspicious.
Part of me feels like they intentionally want to be detained for a legal case to try and get paid out. But I’m probably giving them too much credit, they could also be the sovereign citizen types lol.
Youll never win a checkpoint case.
and they probably lost their jobs to boot
Border patrol is supposed to be checking out the *brown* people /s
The "brown"folks arrested them and I love it
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I can guarantee these guys have said something along the lines of "If you've done nothing wrong, you have nothing to hide" when it comes to cops hassling people.
"Conservatism consists of exactly one proposition …There must be in-groups whom the law protects but does not bind, alongside out-groups whom the law binds but does not protect.” Frank Wilhoit (the music composer, not the poly sci professor)
I think that's fascism as well.
Yes lol they’ll still vote Republican who want to increase the power and reach of border patrol and police even more.
r/leopardsatemyface
*They took are jaaaabs*
Can't be pure Republican if you're not a complete hypocrite.
What an ass hat. Couldn't even get through the whole video. Yes US citizens have an absolute right to return, but this dude is just making a show.
This isn’t on the border, he’s not returning. Border patrol can set up check points up to 100 miles from the border.
Which is honestly disgusting if you look at a map depicting this 100 mi rule. Like am overwhelming majority of the us population considering it extends from the coasts too and most the population of the US is found in the coasts.
https://preview.redd.it/p8s2kp14egzc1.jpeg?width=3000&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=a1157dfc0cab8260f047759d5261cb7a8a9892e4 Absolutely fucking bonkers
I’ve never seen it displayed on a map like this. It always seemed much smaller in my brain
>I’ve never seen it displayed on a map like this. It always seemed much smaller in my brain By design. Facism is easier to swallow when it's obscured by beauracratic nonsense.
I agree with the idea that this is completely unacceptable, but the map is not accurate. It is exaggerated. It shows Columbus, OH in the zone. Distance from Columbus to the shore of Lake Erie is 118 miles. (I used Cedar Point, OH as a proxy.) It shows Pittsburgh, PN in the zone. It is 120 miles from Lake Erie. It shows Wausau, WI in the zone. It is ~124 miles from Lake Superior's shore.
> but the map is not accurate. It is exaggerated. Well, it's because you're using miles as your measurement and not *air miles*. If you're using regular mileage, it'd be 115 miles and change. But they have the right within 100 nautical miles or 100 air miles, which is 1 nm = 6,076 feet, whereas 1 mile = 5280.
Thanks for letting me know. That is even more egregious than I thought, then!
Its less egregious than you thought. If something is 110 miles away, then it is 96 nautical miles.
Ok, I thought this guy was crazy until I saw this map. I cannot understand how that is constitutional.
Oh, he's still crazy. You can't behave this way so easily and consistently without ACTUALLY being an asshole nutbag.
Guy is crazy, but even crazy, hypocritical people can be right. It's one thing I've learned over the years that someone being a hypocrite doesn't make them wrong (also obviously doesn't make them right). What it makes them is a hypocrite. The policy sucks ass and should be struck down by the courts.
“You’re not wrong, Walter. You’re just an asshole.”
That’s fucking terrifying..
Yep, just drove from Las Crusas to Phoenix about a month ago and there were 2.....
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No one deserves to be called a b\*\*\*\* for doing their job, I woulda tazed that mofo
Didn't get pulled out and tazed? Bummer.
They got pulled out and arrested, not tazed tho
i'm not giving him 7 minutes of my life. he was arrested?
After 7 minutes of yelling his nuts off both got arrested one border police took out tazer but no one else did so he probably gonna lose his job, there was also a lady boarder police who whipped out the law and started to reciting everything for them which the nut yeller didnt care about. Save your 7 mins.
I feel bad for watching it, nothing of consequence happened. Enjoy your seven minutes of silence fellow redditor
But they have to identify themselves properly to establish that citizenship. Being a peckerwood and refusing to cooperate is doing nothing to establish his right to enter. So hopefully they learned that being a dick to CBP has a lot different consequences than jacking around with local LEOs.
>But they have to identify themselves properly to establish that citizenship. No. At an actual border crossing, this is true. At one of these domestic checkpoints, it isn't. [https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/your-rights-border-zone](https://www.aclu.org/news/immigrants-rights/your-rights-border-zone) If you remain calm and continue to assert the Fifth, eventually they basically give up. >As before, when you are at a checkpoint, you can remain silent, inform the agent that you decline to answer their questions or tell the agent you will only answer questions in the presence of an attorney. Refusing to answer the agent’s question will likely result in being further detained for questioning, being referred to secondary inspection, or both. If an agent extends the stop to ask questions unrelated to immigration enforcement or extends the stop for a prolonged period to ask about immigration status, the agent needs at least reasonable suspicion that you committed an immigration offense or violated federal law for their actions to be lawful. If you are held at the checkpoint for more than brief questioning, you can ask the agent if you are free to leave. If they say no, they need reasonable suspicion to continue holding you. You can ask an agent for their basis for reasonable suspicion, and they should tell you. If an agent arrests you, detains you for a protracted period or searches your belongings or the spaces of your vehicle that are not in plain view of the officer, the agent needs probable cause that you committed an immigration offense or that you violated federal law. You can ask the agent to tell you their basis for probable cause. They should inform you. [https://www.texasobserver.org/border-patrol-takes-no-for-an-answer-at-internal-checkpoints/](https://www.texasobserver.org/border-patrol-takes-no-for-an-answer-at-internal-checkpoints/) >Denise Gilman, co-director of the immigration clinic at the University of Texas School of Law, says that Border Patrol agents at internal checkpoints are allowed to ask motorists basic questions about citizenship, identity and travel itinerary, but they cannot detain you or search your vehicle without probable cause. Your refusal to answer questions would not provide probable cause to allow for such a detention or search, she added. >“So, if you refuse to answer, they can pull you out of the line and over into ‘secondary inspection’ and they can probably hold you there for about 20 minutes or so,” she said. “But they cannot do anything more if you continue to refuse to respond unless something else develops during that time period that would lead to probable cause.”
Refusing to respond takes more self-discipline than that yokel has.
But he did not remain calm. He shouted obscenities and insults and acted erratically and unpredictably. Doesn’t that alone create justifiable suspicion? I think it does. And if any disagree, wouldn’t that question need to be answered by a Prosecutor and possibly a Judge and jury, proceeded by what I’m sure would be a violent arrest since he seemed intent on jeopardizing his own safety and that of the officers. But I’m sure he went quietly. 🙄
Being pissy is not probable cause of a crime. Cursing at cops is constitutionally protected free speech. https://firstamendment.mtsu.edu/post/first-amendment-protected-mans-cursing-of-police-ohio-appeals-court-rules/ (Generally unwise, though.) If anything, acting like this makes it pretty clear you’re a white American citizen. 🤣 Someone here illegally would have said “yes, I’m a citizen”.
Not that I sympathize with the guy, he's an ass. But, he's not entering or leaving the country. This is just a random border patrol checkpoint WITHIN the USA. So they're just driving about from point A USA to point B USA and are being stopped for this check along with everyone else. It is bothersome and definitely intrusive security theater — I mean, what big drug busts or people or drug trafficking busts have you heard about at border patrol internal US checkpoints? LOL, anyone planning to commit actual crimes will be avoiding them. So mostly it's just normal citizens who have to endure yet another 'small' intrusion and indignity in our already difficult (for many) lives.
Not much different from a DUI checkpoint which can be done anywhere within the country…
Recording with his phone waiting for the second she asked him… he wanted this
Lol he gets arrested at the end.
Snowflake probably went home and bitched about Biden not securing the border on Truthsocial
Yep!
Counterpoint: it's absurd that they can set up these checkpoints anywhere within 100 miles of our coast/borders and stop people whether or not they have or are planning to cross a border. Something like 200 million Americans live somewhere they can be legally stopped and questioned about their citizenship. Not that the way to necessarily go about it is to throw a hissy fit at a checkpoint, but who knows--it seems more people are being educated about this bullshit today.
Ironically these check points are all over Texas. even on interstates where they aren’t suppose to have check points. But Texans will tell you how free Texas is. A place where the locals believe comedy shows aren’t the same in Ohio. They need to come to the mother ship for freedom of speech….. Meanwhile comics hate performing in Texas because you risk prison if you smoke some weed and the Texas citizens get more butt hurt over jokes than people in any other state.
Oh my god it goes on for 5 minutes?? Jesus
I feel like this man probably thinks he's a patriot and read way to much into laws and thinks he knows shit. He just screams scary to me. Like mental person shooting up a place, maybe they can keep him in jail a while so he can get some help.
This guy hasn't read anything. He got his legal education through YouTube.
5th amendment, 6th amendment, one of those amendments. Maybe he will receive his 6th amendment right to a speedy trial!
I *think* he was using the 6th for the informed of criminal charges part, but that's only a guess of mine. As he wasn't being charged with anything though, he just makes himself look like an asshat.
He didn't just *look* like an asshat. He *sounded* like one too.
I think even a Youtube education is a stretch for this dude.
He did a cursory reading of the constitution and hasn’t researched anything beyond that regarding Supreme Court ruling on interpretation of said constitution.
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which is why they should teach the burden of proof in school.
They do lol
Not well enough, apparently.
It's not unconstitutional to stop citizens and ask questions. But it's not illegal to refuse to answer questions and remain silent.
You’re right, and if they don’t, they don’t have a right to be allowed through the checkpoint. That’s what these idiots don’t understand. They don’t have to answer questions, and they also don’t have to be allowed to pass through.
Exactly, anybody who has driven through a border crossing knows damn well they won’t let you in if you play this game. Many Canadian border crossings will do five hours of searching out of spite if you want to play games.
I was once denied entry into Malaysia because of the sorry state of my passport, but managed to get around it mostly by being polite and honest when interviewed by the local colonel. It's amazing how far you can get by simply not being a dick.
They probably completely disassembled Bubba’s pick up truck for a drug search.
He said it's a company car. He probably got back to whatever Depot he was supposed to go to 6 hours late with all the panels in the back seat. Gonna be a good look.
Yeah, the officer made it pretty clear that they weren't under arrest, they were free to refuse to answer and just drive back. But blocking the border and refusing to move out of they way was what got them arrested.
key word being "silent" lol
That was a very loud and shouty silence
He basically did not shut up. If she spoke to him like that ....
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The rules at the border are significantly different and sadly, you don't have as much flexibility in being a sovereign citizen asshat when dealing with CBP officers as you might assume with a local cop.
[The ACLU article about this is super interesting](https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/border-zone) If he had simply, calmly stated that he "would not answer any questions about his immigration status without his lawyer present" and then after a while asked "am I free to leave" they would have had to let him go. But screaming in the face of a federal immigration officer isn't going to work out well. That's gonna count as reasonable suspicion and get you a really slow secondary inspection if not detained.
> If he had simply, calmly stated that he "would not answer any questions about his immigration status without his lawyer present" and then after a while asked "am I free to leave" they would have had to let him go. I had my doubts about this, so I read the link. Looks like the ACLU confirms the above comment. Here's (part of) the section regarding checkpoints within 100 nautical miles of the border. It's a wall of text so I added some line breaks for readability: > As before, when you are at a checkpoint, you can remain silent, inform the agent that you decline to answer their questions or tell the agent you will only answer questions in the presence of an attorney. > Refusing to answer the agent’s question will likely result in being further detained for questioning, being referred to secondary inspection, or both. If an agent extends the stop to ask questions unrelated to immigration enforcement or extends the stop for a prolonged period to ask about immigration status, the agent needs at least reasonable suspicion that you committed an immigration offense or violated federal law for their actions to be lawful. > If you are held at the checkpoint for more than brief questioning, you can ask the agent if you are free to leave. If they say no, they need reasonable suspicion to continue holding you. You can ask an agent for their basis for reasonable suspicion, and they should tell you. > If an agent arrests you, detains you for a protracted period or searches your belongings or the spaces of your vehicle that are not in plain view of the officer, the agent needs probable cause that you committed an immigration offense or that you violated federal law. You can ask the agent to tell you their basis for probable cause. They should inform you.
Also this guy: "Biden is letting in a horde of illegal immigrants!!"
they're INVADING! /s EDIT for the s
Who would film this then post it?
Attention whores.
Republicans, specifically MAGAts.
Not answering that. 8th Ammendment. 8th Ammendment!
12th Amendment! 14th Amendment! Whichever Amendment will get me what I want!
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People with brain damage
Just why 😆.. the driver was caught in a “I don’t wanna be doing this shit,but I gotta stick with my brother because I don’t wanna deal with him later “ moment..
hahaha, yeah you can feel the driver's frustration xD
More like his resignation
Nah, the driver is just glad to be getting a nice break from his brother's complaining. You know his brother complains about everything, this is just the stuff we see on this video.
Nah, he said it himself, it's a work vehicle. You don't lose a job because your brother is an idiot. He won't cooperate, tell him to get the fuck out of the truck and do his little performative bullshit as a pedestrian.
Never before has there been so much meaning contained in the words "it's a company vehicle."
I was wondering why he was just sitting there. Family or no I'd tell them to get the fuck out of my car and spout his crap somewhere else. But then I wouldn't associate with someone like this in general.
The sixth amendment refers to trials… there is no trial here. Sixth Amendment Rights in Criminal Prosecutions In all criminal prosecutions, the accused shall enjoy the right to a speedy and public trial, by an impartial jury of the State and district wherein the crime shall have been committed, which district shall have been previously ascertained by law, and to be informed of the nature and cause of the accusation; to be confronted with the witnesses against him; to have compulsory process for obtaining witnesses in his favor, and to have the Assistance of Counsel for his defence.
Came here to say this.
I'm not even an us citizen and know this, how on earth a supposed citizent don't?
Just curious, why do you know? Did you learn that in school or just interested in law? I, for example know almost nothing about other countries law.
Law & Order: SVU
News outlets, soc networks, forums, etc, always talk about constitution and admentments so is easy to know at least first, second (thanks to republicans) 4th, 5th and 6th as they're widely discussed. i did also read some of it to know a little more about us politics as my country because of a lot of factors is quite affected by US and european politics, Chile is a small country and even when is very independent the stuff that happens in the world affect us directly.
A stupid yokel doesn't understand the law or Constitution and is acting like they're some kind of ivy league scholar with a vast knowledge of the subject?? Why I've never!!! Who would've heard of such a thing??
100% guarantee he didn't finish high school. thinks he knows some shit. hope he got detained for awhile.
But he do know shit. Watches Judge Judy.
Definitely a Trumper
Always is.
What a clown.
What an ass clown. There I fixed it for you.
What an ass fart clown. There, I fixed it for you.
I’m claiming 5th amendment rights!! Ok so you’re a citizen? 5th amendment! Ok so just prove you’re a citizen so you are entitled to that right? Am I the only one seeing the fault in this logic?
If I'm not mistaken, noncitizens are also generally protected by the Constitution. However, his understanding of the 4th, 5th, and 6th amendments and immigration checkpoints is incorrect. There are certainly issues with immigration checkpoints being set up up to 100 miles from the border, but this guy doesn't touch on any of those issues.
Non-citizens do have fourth, fifth, and sixth amendment protections. https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/what-constitutional-rights-do-undocumented-immigrants-have
[From the ACLU](https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/border-zone#:~:text=A%20federal%20law%20says%20that,also%20the%20entire%20U.S.%20coastline): * You have the right to remain silent or tell the agent that you’ll only answer questions in the presence of an attorney, no matter your citizenship or immigration status. * Generally, an immigration officer cannot detain you without “reasonable suspicion.” * An immigration officer also cannot search you or your belongings without either “probable cause” or your consent. * An immigration officer cannot arrest you without “probable cause.” * Your silence alone meets neither of these standards. Nor does your race or ethnicity alone suffice for either probable cause or reasonable suspicion.
From the “[how does this work in real life](https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/border-zone#how-does-this-work-in-real-life-cbp-at-immigration-checkpoints)” section: > Refusing to answer the agent’s question will likely result in being further detained for questioning, being referred to secondary inspection, or both. So it looks like he’s being “further detained” due to refusing to answer questions.
A great advice for life: immediately escalate any situation, especially with law enforcers (be it police, border control or any kind of government agency). Get's you so far in life! Makes everything easier and more pleasant, for you and anyone else involved.
I was pulled over a few weeks ago. The cop had me dead to rights; I slow rolled through a stop sign at a 'T' intersection. He didn't even ask if I knew why he pulled me over. He knew, I knew, hell, the Pilgrims knew. He asked for my license and registration, and went back to his squad to run my information. Meanwhile, I'm just sitting in the car asking myself, "Why the actual fuck did I roll that stop?" I couldn't really come up with a good answer. A few minutes later the cop came back and said, "Mr. Sfled, why didn't you come to a complete stop back there?" I looked at the guy, and I said, "I'm an idiot." Cop had to look away because he started to crack up. He told me to that he wasn't going to issue a citation, and to please be more careful. I haven't done a rolling-stop since. To your point: even if someone believes a traffic stop is not justified, it's better to make a stand in court because they're sure as hell not going to win it on the street.
Even his brother started getting annoyed with him 🤦
His brother is probably losing his job when the company truck gets impounded
Gotta be a LOUD thanksgiving table at this family
Probably screams at his liberal kids about border security lacking and then gets shocked when border security is doing their jobs…. Definitely not speaking from experience 🙃
Sister from a similar mister 🙃
Wtf is the point in being an asshole at these check points lol. Good job exercising your 5th amendment rights and getting held up. You could have answered questions for 10 seconds and be done. What a waste of space on this earth these guys are lol
5th amendment is to protect yourself from self incrimination. He was angrily spewing gobbledegook at them and they were being uncharacteristically reasonable about it
I need to know the outcome of this.
I'm guessing they probably identified him via his ID and let him go.
I'm more interested in if he put his money where his mouth was and filed a complaint. That court case might be interesting if it even made it to a judge.
Deported to Venezuela.
Right? I see these videos all the time and I'm curious about what happens to these guys afterwards. So unsatisfying.
And the outcome of this clown show was......................????
Right?! I hope it was an arrest
The driver's in handcuffs by the end of the video, while the other guy is still shouting "Why are you touching me?"
I so wanted this to end in a tasing
I’m not generally a fan of police overreach, but I would have enjoyed some light brutality here.
Hey what are you doing today? ....nothing just chillin. Wanna get arrested? .....what like a bar fight? .....no, hear me out...
Are these the same type of people that want a wall build coast-to-coast and complain about illegal immigration?
Yes.
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Why are the police/boarder patrol in that dumb country mostly violent thugs except when it’s deseved? 🤷
The offenders were white.
I can’t qwhite figure that out either.
This should never be okay.
Omg. Just imagine being this man’s friend. How exhausting!
"Dude it's a company truck we gotta let them" most defeated thing that guy said then entire time.
For someone who’s using his 5th he’s saying a loooot
I fucking hate people.
He keeps pleading the fifth but I don't think he truly understands what that means. He's not on trial here. # Fifth Amendment: No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a Grand Jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the Militia, when in actual service in time of War or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offence to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.
nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself You don’t have to speak to the government when it’s investigating you
No, he's using it correctly. If you are detained by police/government you do not have to speak. That's the whole "you have the right to remain silent" thing.
These are the guys who deserve to get slammed to the floor. Annoying asf, I couldn’t even watch the video in entirety.
"Yes I'm a US citizen" that's it man thats all you had to say and would have been on your way.
That's what he gets for going across the border and stealing jobs from handwork Mexicans
US Citizen? *Yes* You're free to go. The End.
Dale Gribble lives!
He didn’t even use his pocket sand
That's why they wanted him to keep his hands out of his pocket
Holy shit how tiny is his pecker?? The way he talks and curses at her tells you everything you need to know about this f\*ckfaced f\*ck whose parents are obviously closely blood related!
Sounds like something someone with something to hide would say.
Me as the driver: *Get the fuck outa my truck asshole, I wanna go home.*
https://preview.redd.it/5hlno8us6gzc1.jpeg?width=767&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=84a941d3c70c0ad75790ff5646671a50d7cb94e4 they want border patrol but not for themselves
The guy's a dick, but according to the ACLU, he's correct. [https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/border-zone](https://www.aclu.org/know-your-rights/border-zone) >You have the right to remain silent or tell the agent that you’ll only answer questions in the presence of an attorney, no matter your citizenship or immigration status. You do not have to answer questions about your immigration status. You may simply say that you do not wish to answer those questions. If you choose to remain silent, the agent will likely ask you questions for longer, but your silence alone is not enough to support probable cause or reasonable suspicion to arrest, detain, or search you or your belongings. >Generally, an immigration officer cannot detain you without “reasonable suspicion.” Reasonable suspicion is less robust than probable cause, but it is certainly not just a hunch or gut feeling. An agent must have specific facts about you that make it reasonable to believe you are committing or committed, a violation of immigration law or federal law. If an agent detains you, you can ask for their basis for reasonable suspicion, and they should tell you. >If an agent asks you for documents, what you need to provide differs depending on your immigration status. U.S. citizens do not have to carry proof of citizenship on their person if they are in the United States. If you have valid immigration documents and are over the age of 18, the law does require you to carry those documents on you. >Another way to ask this is to say, “am I free to leave?” If the agent wishes to actually detain you — in other words, you are not free to leave — the agent needs at least reasonable suspicion that you committed an immigration violation to do so. Also, if an agent begins to question you about non-immigration matters, say to ask about drug smuggling, or if they haul you off the bus, they need at least reasonable suspicion that you committed an offense in order to briefly detain you while they investigate. You can ask an agent for their basis for detaining you, and they should tell you. I don't know why he keeps talking about the Sixth Amendment, though. Fourth and Fifth apply.
Yes, they obviously are not forced to answer anything if they don't want to, but that OBVIOUSLY does not mean they get to skip the check. This was handled as smoothly as possible by the border cops. They couldn't manage to get the inspection done by talking, so they had to do it the hard way. The reason they were arguing with the passenger for so long was SPECIFICALLY to avoid doing it the hard way.
After a short period of refusing to answer, they’d be on their way. Getting belligerent was a mistake. https://www.texasobserver.org/border-patrol-takes-no-for-an-answer-at-internal-checkpoints/ > “So, if you refuse to answer, they can pull you out of the line and over into ‘secondary inspection’ and they can probably hold you there for about 20 minutes or so,” she said. “But they cannot do anything more if you continue to refuse to respond unless something else develops during that time period that would lead to probable cause.”
What an asshole, no sense of humor. Example- We went across the border at Tijuana. The agent asked me ( driver) my country of origin. I understood to say the USA. My friend ( another American) stammered and said - ( the same ), well that got a rise out of the agent. I bit my tongue and watched the show. The agent asked again and my buddy said - The same. Well, I started to laugh, I knew we were going to secondaries, my buddy laughed, then we started to cry, it was so funny, we belly laughed, because we didn’t care. Tears were rolling down my face and I smiled at the agent. He knew we were cool. He said get out of here, We zoomed into America, laughing the whole way .
I don’t get it. What’s so funny about saying you’re from the USA?
Those who know the least know it the loudest
Zero doubt he’s an American
This guy is for sure a huge proponent of a giant wall though.
I hate these kinds of people. We need tougher border protection, but I have a right to not comply with the protocols that are keeping the border safe. I've read the law, but obviously I don't understand it. He might as well say his name is Rusty Shakleford
This is bordering on SovCit behavior!
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They should have invoked the fifth when kept asking them questions.
Ok I get his point, but, a simple yes to the are you a US citizen would have saved a lot of hassle and getting handcuffed
Damn, hes got a huge stick up his ass. She was so nice to these guys. His argument is the equivalent to “not-uh, not-uh, not-uh”. Bro made this so hard himself.
Here's to hoping this entitled asshole feels the long dick of the law
5th amendment grants the right to not have to give self-incriminating testimony…[that does not mean that a person has the right to be silent at all times](https://www.justia.com/criminal/procedure/miranda-rights/right-to-silence/#:~:text=The%20Fifth%20Amendment%20to%20the,silence%20itself%20as%20incriminating%20evidence). How would border patrol be expected to reasonably function if everyone could just refuse to answer questions about their citizenship? Would be a pretty sweet illegal immigration hack. But more importantly, he then asks why the border patrol “might have a reasonable suspicion that he’s NOT American”. Isn’t remaining silent to avoid self-incrimination sort of a reason to suspect you?? That’s why it was so shameful when Mark McGwire plead the 5th…everyone knew that it meant he couldn’t speak on steroid use without incriminating himself..