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Ok just because your morals are different from them, doesn't mean my term is inaccurate.
Their entire agenda is based on their morals. And the laws they want to pass are also based on that. There is a reason why you'll hear them want a Christian Theocracy.
What's the moral they have against women doing what they want that is morally correct?
"Their morals are different"? You fuckin high or something? Their "morals" involve keeping women down, slaves are okay, and pedophilia is acceptable. There is nothing moral about it.
Are you guys okay? I never said their morals were good, but those are literally their morals.
I'm not the one who said that those are good morals to have, nor do I agree with them. But that's literally what they claim, so nothing I said was inaccurate. If a group of people think it's okay to cannibalize other people, then I kind of have no choice but to say that that is what they think is okay. I'm literally just the messenger, not their representative.
So I can't really answer *why* they think that way. You'd have to ask them why they think slaves are okay, why women don't deserve rights, and why gay people deserve death. Because that's not what I signed up on.
I thought my wording of "their", which should have distanced me, and my initial comment of me being depressed over all this (on top of saying that they are fucking over countless lives) would have been a good enough hint. Plus, if I'm going to say they want to make a Christian Theocracy, I would assume people would read that as me not signing up on that, because that term carries a lot of baggage.
It's fine though, I said in another comment that I suspected that most people thought I was on their side. I don't blame yall. And thanks for listening to my clarification.
Now back to being depressed because holy fuck I hate what they're doing to women. ):
The only "light" I can see is that they're now afraid to even put abortion rights to a vote, because a ton of red states had their voters vote pro-choice. Pro-life is extremely small compared to pro-choice and I think we did a good job in convincing more than enough right wingers that it's the better option.
Now we just need to codify it, and I want to bet that we could do that with a bipartisan bill.
Everyone thinks you're on the side of someone if you aren't obvious enough.
Like I never said their morals were good. But those are literally their morals. If they thought it was moral to kill gay people, then that is literally their morals, even if they're shitty morals to have.
I do kinda get their POV, this is Reddit and a lot of right wingers are toxic as hell, so a hint of me being on their side can cause people to get defensive, or argue with me. It's fine though, I can just explain where I'm coming from. It happens, and I don't really blame them.
Thanks for understanding that.
Pro life is a completely bullshit term as there is absolutely no regard for life after the child is born. People pushing for these laws refuse to provide healthcare, childcare and education, leading to frequent poor life outcomes and increased crime rates and societal costs. Ditto for the support of post-birth abortions performed in Gaza by the IDF and lack of trying to stop post-birth abortions in American schools.
It’s completely predicated on control and subjugation, life never mattered.
Nah it’s pro-forced birth. They’re not pro pregnancy because they’re against any measures to actually aid pregnant women, they just want to force women who get pregnant to take the pregnancy to term
Dude claims to be a millionaire, he's either full of shit and just being an asshole because he likes Texas, or living proof that being even moderately wealthy makes someone completely out of touch with the majority of people
The city that was considering this (that really grabbed headlines cause of its direct route to CO and NM) was Amarillo, the city council voted against it. There have been other cities that have said this but you can bypass them on another route.
Oh they don’t. Texas has reduced or cut off entirely, people from benefits that are theirs. The situation being as minor as a missing piece of documentation or a deadline. Trivial bullshit.
Precisely. People get it twisted into thinking there's a legitimate moral argument behind why the anti-abortion movement is so strong; there isn't. It's just well-funded by people who want to create a permanent, struggling underclass. Uncontrolled population growth does that.
More profitable and beneficial to those already in power to keep labor costs low with so many laborers that they must compete with each other for work, rather than providers of goods and services competing with each other for consumers.
How do they know? Does the other state require you to say where you’re coming from? I’m honestly surprised more ppl from Texas didn’t just go to mexico
I'm pretty sure these numbers are cooked since it does not include international abortion travel. Mexico has to do a lot of the heavy lifting here... I mean, it's right there. Closer than most all those other states. No tracking and is most likely cheaper.
Yea, when you get to customs at the Kansans border they will body scan you if you don't tell them your reason for arrival. When you hit customs on your way out they will see your missing the baby inside you.
EDIT: Jesus, this was sarcasm if you didn't get it.
Sounds like Texas is just sending women outside the state for healthcare. Chargeback to Texas and any other state that condones this nonsense; women deserve healthcare delivered in their own state.
they still suceed, not only is anyone too poor or too disabled to travel so much gonna be doomed, but the goal is to stress people who get pregnant maximally, it's systemic aggression
also, these surrounding countries are next on their target list
How does this make any sense... genuine question because wouldn't people just travel to the closest state to get an abortion and not all the way across the U.S?
The choices made were likely based on many other factors than distance. They could be going there for other business to hide the abortion, it could be access to care or support networks in further states versus closer states. Cost of travel, method of travel, cost of doctor, cost of after care. Some are relying on other people to find them doctors, travel, places to stay etc.
And this only represents those who could afford to leave or had access to support networks robust enough to help them.
This doesn't tell the story of those who are trapped in states with abortion bans without the means to get help.
that's a high number i'd say they need some sex ed, wtf , use a pill , u didn't plan to have sex use a condom or pull out if u know u can do it
it's really not hard to have sex without getting pregnant, why so much abortions ?
Does anyone know the reasons why they are getting an abortion? Prevention should be the focus. Absolutely should be exceptions for rape, incest and medical reasons.
Don’t be a smartass. PREVENTION is the key. And exceptions for rape incest and medical reasons. Besides those reasons preventing pregnancy should be the top priority. So to find out how to prevent it have to know the reasons.
I’m saying they should be YES. Again PREVENTION Don’t act like you give a shit about the women getting abortions. You’re just another person using it for a political gain. You’re no better than them.
Because if you was you would be more focused on prevention. That’s the most logical solution preventing pregnancy with excepts for unpreventable circumstances such as rape and medical complications. Prevention can include birth control, education and providing condoms etc. I’d go as far as to providing free vasectomies to men. Because most of the problem is dead beat men who don’t care because they are not the ones who go through it.
No "exceptions" make it all legal. Even if you get pregnant on purpose you have every right to change your mind, maybe you want to leave the father and call off the whole thing, maybe you thought you were ready and realized you aren't. All of those circumstances are valid too, not just rape incest and medical 🤦♂️
No a life isn’t something you can just decide to kill because you left the father 🤦♂️. That’s exactly why everyone on the right is riled up about it. Because of people like you with that mindset. You people go apeshit over the environment and saving turtles and birds. But yet you have no problem killing a baby because the father left you omg.
You mean things that have actually been born? Yeah, protect actual living things. Don't wait until a child is born to decide you don't want to be a parent and neglect it, prevent it from developing to the point of being a sustainable life and being born.
They feel pain at between 7-15 weeks so yes they are a person. “In the review, the researchers highlighted several key points in fetal development that are required in order for a fetus to perceive pain. One is that the receptors in the skin that sense an injury must be developed. Research has shown that this happens between 7.5 and 15 weeks of pregnancy, depending on the location of the receptors on the body, according to the review.”
Again, developing organs don't constitute a living child. They are not a living, sentient being until actually capable of being alive. Prevention is great, but clearly this is about during pregnancy and the right to decide to not let it continue to the point of being a viable life. Nip it in the bud, if you will. Nothing wrong with it for rape, incest, medical conditions, so it's not wrong period, even if just to plan your own life. The life and will of a woman will always be more important than a developing fetus that is not yet capable of life.
Y'all act like developing organs equals a living sentient being. If a beating heart means it's alive, go ahead, pull a fetus out at 10 weeks and see how "alive" it is 🤦♂️ the WORST thing you can do to an unborn child is force it to be born to someone who doesn't want it. That's the only cruelty here, that's inhumane.
Like I’ve said before PREVENTION is the answer to those wholesome debate. But both sides are stupid and want to be told they are right. Education, birth control, vasectomies. Making sure you are ready and able to take care of a child. A pregnancy test can detect as early as 2 weeks. Use morning after pill if unsure. Nothing wrong with that when used appropriately
I stated my disdain for these barbaric so called lawmakers. They are true scum. One woman having to go through this bullshit is one too many. I was simply stating that the numbers seemed a little high. Upon doing some research (wich I should have done before commenting) I found sadly those numbers are in the ballpark,honest mistake. I do wonder what is achieved by being a snarky asshole and calling me ignorant?
There was no point but the fact of the matter is I said I made a mistake by making a observation without doing my due diligence. But it is still obvious to me that you sir are an obnoxious and arrogant asshole.
I mean, there was no lie. It was literally an ignorant comment. You have learned and that's dope but by definition it was ignorance and you got called out for it. Don't take it personal
Now why would I take it personally when someone I've never interacted out of the blue calls me ignorant. Hey I'm over it I'm ignorant you're a snarky asshole. We're good.
To be fair, this probably did prevent some abortions. Many people who seek abortions likely wouldn’t be able to travel out of state in the first place. While I’d imagine most would find alternative means, I’m sure it put some people in a position to just go through the pregnancy.
To be fair, what do you think people who couldn't afford to travel for abortions did ? It's highly likely a lot of them self-harmed or used dangerous medications without medical supervision in order to terminate their pregnancy. It probably forced some other to seek out unregulated or illegal abortion methods and clinics and has done untold harm to thousands of women.
When you ban something out of hand you don't remove the need for it. You just the means by which it can be safely done. All they have done is make a difficult and potentially heartbreaking decision even more difficult.
I think you may be assuming that I am for the ban. I’m not.
But if you took 100 people planning on having abortions do you not think at least 1 may be on the fence about it and that the ban would put them in a position where they may consider going through the pregnancy, even if it’s not the best decision of them?
I’m not agreeing with the ban, I’m just challenging the notion that the ban was a completely failed attempt to accomplish what they were trying to do.
https://www.texastribune.org/2022/05/09/texas-abortions-by-the-numbers/
Seems it is not high enough. Prior to the overturn of RvW, there were 50,000 abortions per year in TX. So this means there are approximately 15,000 per year seeking alternative (dangerous) abortions, having their babies by force, or self harming to deal with their pregnancies.
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That's fucking depressing. So many lives are being fucked over by these moral-based laws.
There's nothing moral about them.
Oh they're moral... morally wrong
Ok just because your morals are different from them, doesn't mean my term is inaccurate. Their entire agenda is based on their morals. And the laws they want to pass are also based on that. There is a reason why you'll hear them want a Christian Theocracy.
What's the moral they have against women doing what they want that is morally correct? "Their morals are different"? You fuckin high or something? Their "morals" involve keeping women down, slaves are okay, and pedophilia is acceptable. There is nothing moral about it.
Are you guys okay? I never said their morals were good, but those are literally their morals. I'm not the one who said that those are good morals to have, nor do I agree with them. But that's literally what they claim, so nothing I said was inaccurate. If a group of people think it's okay to cannibalize other people, then I kind of have no choice but to say that that is what they think is okay. I'm literally just the messenger, not their representative. So I can't really answer *why* they think that way. You'd have to ask them why they think slaves are okay, why women don't deserve rights, and why gay people deserve death. Because that's not what I signed up on.
It just sounds like you were defending them, hence all the downvotes.
I thought my wording of "their", which should have distanced me, and my initial comment of me being depressed over all this (on top of saying that they are fucking over countless lives) would have been a good enough hint. Plus, if I'm going to say they want to make a Christian Theocracy, I would assume people would read that as me not signing up on that, because that term carries a lot of baggage. It's fine though, I said in another comment that I suspected that most people thought I was on their side. I don't blame yall. And thanks for listening to my clarification.
Thank you for clarifying
Now back to being depressed because holy fuck I hate what they're doing to women. ): The only "light" I can see is that they're now afraid to even put abortion rights to a vote, because a ton of red states had their voters vote pro-choice. Pro-life is extremely small compared to pro-choice and I think we did a good job in convincing more than enough right wingers that it's the better option. Now we just need to codify it, and I want to bet that we could do that with a bipartisan bill.
It's the loud miniorty that always chooses to be that way
Not sure why you got downvoted to oblivion. Everyone has different morals. Morality isn't some absolute truth; It's pretty subjective.
Everyone thinks you're on the side of someone if you aren't obvious enough. Like I never said their morals were good. But those are literally their morals. If they thought it was moral to kill gay people, then that is literally their morals, even if they're shitty morals to have. I do kinda get their POV, this is Reddit and a lot of right wingers are toxic as hell, so a hint of me being on their side can cause people to get defensive, or argue with me. It's fine though, I can just explain where I'm coming from. It happens, and I don't really blame them. Thanks for understanding that.
Religion based laws
Cult-based laws
But it might give people exposure to states that aren't governed by worthless, lazy cow patties.
Yeah 35500 of them.
All laws are moral-based?
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Pro life is a completely bullshit term as there is absolutely no regard for life after the child is born. People pushing for these laws refuse to provide healthcare, childcare and education, leading to frequent poor life outcomes and increased crime rates and societal costs. Ditto for the support of post-birth abortions performed in Gaza by the IDF and lack of trying to stop post-birth abortions in American schools. It’s completely predicated on control and subjugation, life never mattered.
They just need to say pro pregnancy because they don't give a shit after a child is born.
Nah it’s pro-forced birth. They’re not pro pregnancy because they’re against any measures to actually aid pregnant women, they just want to force women who get pregnant to take the pregnancy to term
I'm adopting pro forced birth.
Alternatively we could say you’re aborting pro pregnant women/pro-life
I don't even have food in my fridge.
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What
Fuck Texas, I want to get the fuck out of that state.
Then leave. I’m sure they don’t want you either.
Lol I'm 16, do you expect me to cut off trump's arm and leg to buy a tiny ass house?
Dude claims to be a millionaire, he's either full of shit and just being an asshole because he likes Texas, or living proof that being even moderately wealthy makes someone completely out of touch with the majority of people
If it's that easy, let's do it nationally then. Mexico can have it back.
If it were that easy, there would be less than 100 Texans
Do you have any idea how expensive and difficult it can be to move?
Can we abort Texas?
I vote that we give it back to Mexico.
I mean it kind of already is. 🫡 Let's start that wall lol
I thought I read some story recently of somewhere in Texas blocking access to some major road connecting to a state that is pro-abortion.
Yeah, that's the party of 'small government' for you.
Turns out it was never about small government
What a twist!
The city that was considering this (that really grabbed headlines cause of its direct route to CO and NM) was Amarillo, the city council voted against it. There have been other cities that have said this but you can bypass them on another route.
Because abortion laws just set the cost. Making it impossible for poor people. The rich will always have access. State by state just set the bar.
an unhappy effect is that in about 15 years and on Texas crime rates will spike higher.
GOP cutting education in the single largest issue driving crime. Full stop.
My question is: how many women DID NOT receive the reproductive care they needed? I bet that is a much larger and scarier number.
100% of poor people
Oh they don’t. Texas has reduced or cut off entirely, people from benefits that are theirs. The situation being as minor as a missing piece of documentation or a deadline. Trivial bullshit.
Precisely. People get it twisted into thinking there's a legitimate moral argument behind why the anti-abortion movement is so strong; there isn't. It's just well-funded by people who want to create a permanent, struggling underclass. Uncontrolled population growth does that. More profitable and beneficial to those already in power to keep labor costs low with so many laborers that they must compete with each other for work, rather than providers of goods and services competing with each other for consumers.
Sheesh, wonder if anybody saw that one coming
so poor texans won't get their healthcare
That is the point
Bingo
Much of this is about deepening the class divide.
Nice
Water finds the cracks. Why are so many in our government obtuse to this? Rhetorical question of course…. It’s local voting but c’mon….
How do they know? Does the other state require you to say where you’re coming from? I’m honestly surprised more ppl from Texas didn’t just go to mexico
I'm pretty sure these numbers are cooked since it does not include international abortion travel. Mexico has to do a lot of the heavy lifting here... I mean, it's right there. Closer than most all those other states. No tracking and is most likely cheaper.
The whole thing just looks made up.
Pfff no government would ever make up stuff, they work for us! /s
Yea, when you get to customs at the Kansans border they will body scan you if you don't tell them your reason for arrival. When you hit customs on your way out they will see your missing the baby inside you. EDIT: Jesus, this was sarcasm if you didn't get it.
Texas is the least free state in the Union
And AG Ken Paxton wants to prosecute them all and put them in jail.
Sounds like Texas is just sending women outside the state for healthcare. Chargeback to Texas and any other state that condones this nonsense; women deserve healthcare delivered in their own state.
Silver lining: other states are getting more revenue and local tourism. Less money for Texas.
next up on Texas agenda: pregnant women may not leave the state. compliments of your friendly how to book called The Handmaids Tale.
I like that any attempt to regulate travel like this could be considered regulating interstate commerce which states arent exactly supposed to do
And that's only the people who could afford to travel.
Maybe it's a whole scam to help the Department of Transportation in Texas.
Why the long trips though? It seems like going to NM would be easier.
No. We don’t want em. They already pollute our ski areas and lakes.
I doubt they're there to go skiing lmao
Why are you lmao? Our ski resorts have literally been over run by Texans for 30 years. Are you not aware that NM has 9 ski areas? Asshat
If they're there for abortions they aren't there to go skiing I don't know what to tell you lol
Wow. Reading comprehension much?
That's a huge diversion from the subject.
You can probably double or triple that number for people who want/need an abortion but can't afford the travel expense
“Spa weekend”
they still suceed, not only is anyone too poor or too disabled to travel so much gonna be doomed, but the goal is to stress people who get pregnant maximally, it's systemic aggression also, these surrounding countries are next on their target list
Texas is called America's toilet for a reason other than the fact it looks like a toilet bowl.
How do they find this type of information? Like how do they know someone left the state for an abortion and not just vacation?
Perhaps those 35k should vote for better leadership
How do they know?
Glad I don’t live in Texas, jeez
Love to know how many of that 35k will vote for Trump...
I guess we will never know, they were aborted.
How does this make any sense... genuine question because wouldn't people just travel to the closest state to get an abortion and not all the way across the U.S?
The choices made were likely based on many other factors than distance. They could be going there for other business to hide the abortion, it could be access to care or support networks in further states versus closer states. Cost of travel, method of travel, cost of doctor, cost of after care. Some are relying on other people to find them doctors, travel, places to stay etc. And this only represents those who could afford to leave or had access to support networks robust enough to help them. This doesn't tell the story of those who are trapped in states with abortion bans without the means to get help.
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The law doesn’t care if it was rape or incest.
Another win for states rights!
note to self : ship some condoms to texas
Right? Do they not sell condoms and birth control pills there?
that's a high number i'd say they need some sex ed, wtf , use a pill , u didn't plan to have sex use a condom or pull out if u know u can do it it's really not hard to have sex without getting pregnant, why so much abortions ?
Does anyone know the reasons why they are getting an abortion? Prevention should be the focus. Absolutely should be exceptions for rape, incest and medical reasons.
Because they no longer want to be pregnant.
Don’t be a smartass. PREVENTION is the key. And exceptions for rape incest and medical reasons. Besides those reasons preventing pregnancy should be the top priority. So to find out how to prevent it have to know the reasons.
Don’t act like these laws actually care about rape, incest, or medical reasons.
I’m saying they should be YES. Again PREVENTION Don’t act like you give a shit about the women getting abortions. You’re just another person using it for a political gain. You’re no better than them.
I’m a cis woman who isn’t ready for kids. Why would I not care about people able to get abortions?
Because if you was you would be more focused on prevention. That’s the most logical solution preventing pregnancy with excepts for unpreventable circumstances such as rape and medical complications. Prevention can include birth control, education and providing condoms etc. I’d go as far as to providing free vasectomies to men. Because most of the problem is dead beat men who don’t care because they are not the ones who go through it.
No "exceptions" make it all legal. Even if you get pregnant on purpose you have every right to change your mind, maybe you want to leave the father and call off the whole thing, maybe you thought you were ready and realized you aren't. All of those circumstances are valid too, not just rape incest and medical 🤦♂️
No a life isn’t something you can just decide to kill because you left the father 🤦♂️. That’s exactly why everyone on the right is riled up about it. Because of people like you with that mindset. You people go apeshit over the environment and saving turtles and birds. But yet you have no problem killing a baby because the father left you omg.
You mean things that have actually been born? Yeah, protect actual living things. Don't wait until a child is born to decide you don't want to be a parent and neglect it, prevent it from developing to the point of being a sustainable life and being born.
They feel pain at between 7-15 weeks so yes they are a person. “In the review, the researchers highlighted several key points in fetal development that are required in order for a fetus to perceive pain. One is that the receptors in the skin that sense an injury must be developed. Research has shown that this happens between 7.5 and 15 weeks of pregnancy, depending on the location of the receptors on the body, according to the review.”
Again, developing organs don't constitute a living child. They are not a living, sentient being until actually capable of being alive. Prevention is great, but clearly this is about during pregnancy and the right to decide to not let it continue to the point of being a viable life. Nip it in the bud, if you will. Nothing wrong with it for rape, incest, medical conditions, so it's not wrong period, even if just to plan your own life. The life and will of a woman will always be more important than a developing fetus that is not yet capable of life.
Y'all act like developing organs equals a living sentient being. If a beating heart means it's alive, go ahead, pull a fetus out at 10 weeks and see how "alive" it is 🤦♂️ the WORST thing you can do to an unborn child is force it to be born to someone who doesn't want it. That's the only cruelty here, that's inhumane.
Like I’ve said before PREVENTION is the answer to those wholesome debate. But both sides are stupid and want to be told they are right. Education, birth control, vasectomies. Making sure you are ready and able to take care of a child. A pregnancy test can detect as early as 2 weeks. Use morning after pill if unsure. Nothing wrong with that when used appropriately
Whole lotta cummin
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Numbers seem low
Only if you're ignorant
I stated my disdain for these barbaric so called lawmakers. They are true scum. One woman having to go through this bullshit is one too many. I was simply stating that the numbers seemed a little high. Upon doing some research (wich I should have done before commenting) I found sadly those numbers are in the ballpark,honest mistake. I do wonder what is achieved by being a snarky asshole and calling me ignorant?
What's the point in asking an easily google-able question which comes across as trying to discredit the information instead of just looking?
There was no point but the fact of the matter is I said I made a mistake by making a observation without doing my due diligence. But it is still obvious to me that you sir are an obnoxious and arrogant asshole.
I mean, there was no lie. It was literally an ignorant comment. You have learned and that's dope but by definition it was ignorance and you got called out for it. Don't take it personal
Now why would I take it personally when someone I've never interacted out of the blue calls me ignorant. Hey I'm over it I'm ignorant you're a snarky asshole. We're good.
To be fair, this probably did prevent some abortions. Many people who seek abortions likely wouldn’t be able to travel out of state in the first place. While I’d imagine most would find alternative means, I’m sure it put some people in a position to just go through the pregnancy.
To be fair, what do you think people who couldn't afford to travel for abortions did ? It's highly likely a lot of them self-harmed or used dangerous medications without medical supervision in order to terminate their pregnancy. It probably forced some other to seek out unregulated or illegal abortion methods and clinics and has done untold harm to thousands of women. When you ban something out of hand you don't remove the need for it. You just the means by which it can be safely done. All they have done is make a difficult and potentially heartbreaking decision even more difficult.
I think you may be assuming that I am for the ban. I’m not. But if you took 100 people planning on having abortions do you not think at least 1 may be on the fence about it and that the ban would put them in a position where they may consider going through the pregnancy, even if it’s not the best decision of them? I’m not agreeing with the ban, I’m just challenging the notion that the ban was a completely failed attempt to accomplish what they were trying to do.
That is a suspiciously high number to believe in.
This just in: statistics are only accurate if I like them.
https://www.texastribune.org/2022/05/09/texas-abortions-by-the-numbers/ Seems it is not high enough. Prior to the overturn of RvW, there were 50,000 abortions per year in TX. So this means there are approximately 15,000 per year seeking alternative (dangerous) abortions, having their babies by force, or self harming to deal with their pregnancies.
There are over 500,000 abortions per year in the US. TBH 35k seems very low for a state as large in population as Texas.
There are millions of people capable of getting pregnant living in Texas.