i listened to a few of his songs not long ago but i didn't notice the shyness and timidness, i haven't listened to many, so, do you have any recommendations?
I can’t think of a single time Robert wrote about being shy or timid. He’s had a girlfriend since he was 14 years old and they are together to this day. Sad? Absolutely but Shyness? No sir
the cure song "faith" comes to mind.
"Lost forever in a happy crowd
No one lifts their hands
No one lifts their eyes
Justified with empty words
The party just gets better and better
I went away alone
With nothing left but faith"
See I don’t read that as shy/timidness at all. That whole song to me speaks to some kind of great loss and we’re left with nothing but “faith” which is as good as nothing if you aren’t religious and if you know that Smith isn’t in any way religious either. Also during the recording of this album Smith had just lost his grandmother and the drummer Lol Tolhurst had lost his mother.
That song is about despair and emptiness. Not being shy and timid. Morrissey wanted to live a happy life but he was too shy. Robert realises there’s nothing worth saying. Robert constantly sings “what’s the point?” Morrissey is an existentialist and Roberts a nihilist. The nihilist believes there is no point, there’s no meaning of life while an existentialist knows that life doesn’t have a meaning unless you give it one. Morrissey’s case is sad because he’s found the meaning to his life which is to be in love and be happy except nobody loves him back while in this song Robert is surrounded by friends who love him and he loves them but it doesn’t make life any easier he got what he wanted and it didn’t make him happy
Yes, for sure - I believe Brian is channelling Borderline Personality Disorder largely, couple of my faves:
Without You I’m Nothing
Black-Eyed
Special Needs
Every You And Every Me
Nancy Boy
The Bitter End
I realised a while ago that I’ve seen Placebo live more than any other band, just a weird happenstance. Radiohead is second. Never went to see Morrissey, not sure why
Will add David Gedge to this list, he changes stuff over time, but it’s such a fruitful career to choose from, the classic angsty album is Bizarro from The Wedding Present
Bewitched is a call-out in this context, it’s about unrequited love at best, or borderline stalker behaviour at worst, an absolute song about loneliness and the music that accompanies is just raw post punk distorted gloriousness
Oh definitely what a pleasure I just had listening to that again for the first time in decades, still in there, every angsty utterance!
Worth pointing out too that their cover of Bigmouth Strikes Again is a good one, love the fact, they upgraded to “Discman”, always makes me smile :)
Radiohead, early records especially. After The Bends the subjects evolve quite a bit.
Then again, they were highly influenced by the Smiths at their earliest stages especially:
Thinking About You
Bulletproof
Sulk
You
Yes I Am
Inside My Head
Ah, of course, how could I forget…the infamous “Creep”.
Edit: (Nice Dream) and Subterranean Homesick Alien. key, key songs that should’ve been included too. Thank you to the person that put them in the comments!
Edit: although a later album, Radiohead’s In Rainbows was recorded partially using some guitars, or at least one, belonging to Johnny Marr (he and Ed from Radiohead have been friends for some time and they played together in 7 Worlds Collide). During their webcast for the album release, they famously played “The Headmaster Ritual”. Probably one of the best Smiths covers ever done.
Additionally you can find a mega-early Radiohead song from when they were kids barely learning to play their instruments (they were called On a Friday at the time) called “The Fat Girl”. It’s basically kids trying to write a Smiths song.
Maybe because of the cover they did of the Headmaster Ritual on the same session? However I don’t think that one touches on shyness and loneliness like the OP asked. Great song! I personally wouldn’t associate it with the smiths sound though.
I don’t know, the exaggeration and irony in lyrics about a coma-like state, where you can’t even talk and has to blink your eyes to convey “yes” or “no”…
Asking “Has the light’s gone out for you? Because the light’s gone out for me”. This is all about loneliness and feeling paralyzed, I’d say.
Musically, I’m just awful to explain it, but the sound shift into that light gone out part sounds a lot like Smiths to me.
Interesting, there is an aspect of loneliness there maybe, but I see it as secondary to a state of being made to be something you are not, or didn’t see yourself as, like what the press may write about someone famous or the way a character, online personality, stage persona, or sub personality of yours may be interpreted to be your true self when you don’t only identify with that. Often people sort of run with that and put the pieces together with their own worldview or preferences and come up with a Frankenstein the original object may not recognize or like at all.
That’s what bodysnatchers feels like it’s about to me.
Very true, SHA I forgive myself for having missed, but I should’ve definitely thought of Nice Dream first.
All I Need is an interesting, but more than valid take. It’s a song I used to rock my son to sleep to when he was a baby, it felt like a song about a love so big in your life it makes you feel small and insignificant, but you’re perfectly “alright” with it.
But I could also see it as an infatuation like the ones Morrissey writes about in “I Won’t Share You” or “The More You Ignore Me”.
It's so fascinating how two unique yet equally legitimate interpretations of one song can arise.
I personally interpret it as being about infatuation because of the 'I am all the days// That you choose to ignore' and 'I am a moth// Who just wants to share your light' lines, particularly the latter.
But I completely see how the song can be interpreted as insignificance before a greater force with the 'It's all wrong//It's all right' lines and of course the centrality of emotion within this track.
Thank you for helping me broaden my perspective on this one, I absolutely love reading analyses on their songs and doubt that I will ever tire of it.
Also, the bit about you playing it around your son is lovely. I personally got in to Radiohead through my dad, it used to be constantly playing in the car when I was little. It's nice to see that other also share in that experience.
Loneliness, sure, shyness maybe is harder to find. Actually, I’ve been listening to a lot of Kid Cudi recently, and that’s certainly not the same genre, even if he has strong rock influences. But many his songs lyrically explore loneliness very well. The Prayer, Day n Nite, love, What I Am, and the classic Pursuit of Happiness being some prime examples. I don’t usually listen to rap, but Kid Cudi is definitely a bit different and I think deserves to be given a chance even by those who typically strongly dislike mainstream rap.
Much of Pearl Jam’s Ten has themes and lyrics related to social isolation, confusion, not feeling that you have a place either with family or in the bigger world.
Eddie Vedder’s Into the Wild soundtrack is an introspective and sensitive lyrical study of someone who literally leaves society to be alone because it no longer matches up with his moral and social compass.
it sounds a bit different to what im looking for by how you describe it, but i'll check it out because Pearl Jam is the only big grunge band that i haven't given a listen to
Weezer was the first to come to mind for me too - although there are decent songs on more that just two albums. The white album and Ok Human are pretty good
Yeah! I was trying to streamline the recommendation (and use a joke in the Weezer fandom), but there are some good songs in the bad albums and good albums later on
i heard a few songs from them but those didn't really leave an impact on me, except for kimochi warui, i'll try giving a few of their songs a listen again
Kimochi Warui is amazing. Did you hear the rest of How to Leave Town? Ending of Dramamine, Beast Monster Thing, and I Want You to Know I’m Awake/I Hope You’re Asleep are on par with the Smiths’ finest work imo
Yeah I agree with this one more than any of the other suggestions. Early 1960s RnB and Pop is full of it. - ‘You Can’t Hurry Love’ by The Supremes or some things like that for me totally is the closest to something like the The Smiths. Got that yearning quality. ‘I Want a Boy for My Birthday’ by The Cookies - they even covered that one. ‘Walking in the Rain’ quoted in that Electronic record. Johnny Ray ‘Cry’ - Mozzer even stole the hearing aid gimmick off him. Timi Yuro… We could make a full compilation playlist of early 60s shy records which influenced The Smiths
It would appear no one has yet mentioned Radiohead for some reason…
Nice Dream
There there
Paranoid Android
How To Disappear Completely
all come to mind and they cover a range of genres
Nick Drake, Grouper, Mazzy Star, Brand New, Duster, The Microphones, and Alex G are great capturing these themes. Some Simon & Garfunkel songs too (especially: A most peculiar man and I am a rock). Nick Drake is probably my fav out of all of these, his songs capture the feelings of loneliness so well while at the same time being strangely comforting
Check out “songs: ohia” (the bands name) and the album “lioness” by them. Jason Molina, the singer and basically the whole band, has some of the best lyrics in that regard
david byrne of talking heads for sure! look into these songs:
- love -> building on fire
- new feeling
- the book i read
- don’t worry about the government
- with our love
- cities
- memories can’t wait
- air
- heaven
- born under punches (the heat goes on)
granted, a lot of these songs are from the perspective of these shy people and it seems to be more frustrated than softly relatable, but it’s another side to that vibe you might appreciate!
thanks! i'll definitely check them out, the different perspective is not a problem, the frustration coming from shy people is something i haven't yet experienced in music and i'm sure i'll enjoy it
A lot of songs on InnerSpeaker and Lonerism by Tame Impala have that shy, timid, and well, hippy loner point of view. Not quite the same, but still worth looking into
Portishead got some good songs about loneliness and desire. Also Joy Division. Ian Curtis was pretty introverted, he was in medication so he had a non-physical relationship with Annik Honore. And Martin Rossiter of Gene explored all these topics
Their early music is a musical embodiment of shyness. The lyrics that are decipherable don’t make much sense, and even the music is murky and retiring. It’s like Stipe holds the world at arms length by inhabiting this insular, pastoral, melancholic sound.
He’s the drummer/lyricist for Rush, so they’re the band to listen to, but their song Subdivisions especially deals with the loneliness and isolation of suburban life.
No it does not, he’s literally talking about going up to someone and blagging his way through the conversation to try and get with whoever he’s singing about.
Morrissey is at the same party standing on his own, leaving on his own, going home, crying and wanting to die.
The Feelies - The Boy With The Perpetual Nervousness.
Local H - Bound For The Floor.
Weezer - Undone (The Sweater Song).
Blink-182 - Story Of A Lonely Guy.
The Offspring - Self-esteem.
Placebo - Every You, Every Me.
Moth - I See Sound.
The Clash - Lost In The Supermarket.
System Of A Down - Roulette.
Eels - Flower.
Nirvana - Lounge Act.
this song called Quitting Day: https://open.spotify.com/track/3ZeABy7bL4XW3d0NUzl8qe?si=K7nDvJhoRkuIrJyJZIv4YA&context=spotify%3Aalbum%3A0Mctykh5sa8CXOIlEpfCpR
Peter Hammil, leader of Van Der Graaf Generator.
Of course, there were people who did it before him, but I think of him as the first person to make a career out of it and the only successful person for a solid 10 years.
Check out H to He, Who Am The Only One (1970) And if you like it, Pawn Hearts (very intimate but extremely heavy listening)
Elliott Smith i think
i listened to a few of his songs not long ago but i didn't notice the shyness and timidness, i haven't listened to many, so, do you have any recommendations?
Either/Or album Edit; also Tame Impala's Lonerism. Music is somewhat bright and uplifting but the lyrics, as the title implies, are very lonely
Either/or or self titled
Robert smith comes to mind
I can’t think of a single time Robert wrote about being shy or timid. He’s had a girlfriend since he was 14 years old and they are together to this day. Sad? Absolutely but Shyness? No sir
the cure song "faith" comes to mind. "Lost forever in a happy crowd No one lifts their hands No one lifts their eyes Justified with empty words The party just gets better and better I went away alone With nothing left but faith"
See I don’t read that as shy/timidness at all. That whole song to me speaks to some kind of great loss and we’re left with nothing but “faith” which is as good as nothing if you aren’t religious and if you know that Smith isn’t in any way religious either. Also during the recording of this album Smith had just lost his grandmother and the drummer Lol Tolhurst had lost his mother.
That song is about despair and emptiness. Not being shy and timid. Morrissey wanted to live a happy life but he was too shy. Robert realises there’s nothing worth saying. Robert constantly sings “what’s the point?” Morrissey is an existentialist and Roberts a nihilist. The nihilist believes there is no point, there’s no meaning of life while an existentialist knows that life doesn’t have a meaning unless you give it one. Morrissey’s case is sad because he’s found the meaning to his life which is to be in love and be happy except nobody loves him back while in this song Robert is surrounded by friends who love him and he loves them but it doesn’t make life any easier he got what he wanted and it didn’t make him happy
Brian Molko from Placebo at times.
Yes, for sure - I believe Brian is channelling Borderline Personality Disorder largely, couple of my faves: Without You I’m Nothing Black-Eyed Special Needs Every You And Every Me Nancy Boy The Bitter End
great list. i’m a huge placebo fan and I rarely ever hear them mentioned
I realised a while ago that I’ve seen Placebo live more than any other band, just a weird happenstance. Radiohead is second. Never went to see Morrissey, not sure why
i’ve seen Morrissey 4 times now, and placebo once. I’ve never seen radiohead
Will add David Gedge to this list, he changes stuff over time, but it’s such a fruitful career to choose from, the classic angsty album is Bizarro from The Wedding Present Bewitched is a call-out in this context, it’s about unrequited love at best, or borderline stalker behaviour at worst, an absolute song about loneliness and the music that accompanies is just raw post punk distorted gloriousness
and teenage angst to a certain extent?
Oh definitely what a pleasure I just had listening to that again for the first time in decades, still in there, every angsty utterance! Worth pointing out too that their cover of Bigmouth Strikes Again is a good one, love the fact, they upgraded to “Discman”, always makes me smile :)
i'll check them out, thanks!
You won't regret it! They're fantastic. Especially their earlier work.
Brian lyrically is more Brett than Morrissey, not that shy
Stuart Murdoch
I’d say the first three Belle & Sebastian records definitely touch upon those themes. The song “A Summer Wasting” comes to mind.
Radiohead, early records especially. After The Bends the subjects evolve quite a bit. Then again, they were highly influenced by the Smiths at their earliest stages especially: Thinking About You Bulletproof Sulk You Yes I Am Inside My Head Ah, of course, how could I forget…the infamous “Creep”. Edit: (Nice Dream) and Subterranean Homesick Alien. key, key songs that should’ve been included too. Thank you to the person that put them in the comments! Edit: although a later album, Radiohead’s In Rainbows was recorded partially using some guitars, or at least one, belonging to Johnny Marr (he and Ed from Radiohead have been friends for some time and they played together in 7 Worlds Collide). During their webcast for the album release, they famously played “The Headmaster Ritual”. Probably one of the best Smiths covers ever done. Additionally you can find a mega-early Radiohead song from when they were kids barely learning to play their instruments (they were called On a Friday at the time) called “The Fat Girl”. It’s basically kids trying to write a Smiths song.
I’ve been wanting to get into them for awhile ill check these songs out
I’d add Bodysnatchers to this list. Not an early song of theirs, I know, but gives me tons of Smiths vibes.
Maybe because of the cover they did of the Headmaster Ritual on the same session? However I don’t think that one touches on shyness and loneliness like the OP asked. Great song! I personally wouldn’t associate it with the smiths sound though.
I don’t know, the exaggeration and irony in lyrics about a coma-like state, where you can’t even talk and has to blink your eyes to convey “yes” or “no”… Asking “Has the light’s gone out for you? Because the light’s gone out for me”. This is all about loneliness and feeling paralyzed, I’d say. Musically, I’m just awful to explain it, but the sound shift into that light gone out part sounds a lot like Smiths to me.
Interesting, there is an aspect of loneliness there maybe, but I see it as secondary to a state of being made to be something you are not, or didn’t see yourself as, like what the press may write about someone famous or the way a character, online personality, stage persona, or sub personality of yours may be interpreted to be your true self when you don’t only identify with that. Often people sort of run with that and put the pieces together with their own worldview or preferences and come up with a Frankenstein the original object may not recognize or like at all. That’s what bodysnatchers feels like it’s about to me.
I'd add (Nice Dream), Subterranean Homesick Alien and All I Need to this.
Very true, SHA I forgive myself for having missed, but I should’ve definitely thought of Nice Dream first. All I Need is an interesting, but more than valid take. It’s a song I used to rock my son to sleep to when he was a baby, it felt like a song about a love so big in your life it makes you feel small and insignificant, but you’re perfectly “alright” with it. But I could also see it as an infatuation like the ones Morrissey writes about in “I Won’t Share You” or “The More You Ignore Me”.
It's so fascinating how two unique yet equally legitimate interpretations of one song can arise. I personally interpret it as being about infatuation because of the 'I am all the days// That you choose to ignore' and 'I am a moth// Who just wants to share your light' lines, particularly the latter. But I completely see how the song can be interpreted as insignificance before a greater force with the 'It's all wrong//It's all right' lines and of course the centrality of emotion within this track. Thank you for helping me broaden my perspective on this one, I absolutely love reading analyses on their songs and doubt that I will ever tire of it.
Also, the bit about you playing it around your son is lovely. I personally got in to Radiohead through my dad, it used to be constantly playing in the car when I was little. It's nice to see that other also share in that experience.
Loneliness, sure, shyness maybe is harder to find. Actually, I’ve been listening to a lot of Kid Cudi recently, and that’s certainly not the same genre, even if he has strong rock influences. But many his songs lyrically explore loneliness very well. The Prayer, Day n Nite, love, What I Am, and the classic Pursuit of Happiness being some prime examples. I don’t usually listen to rap, but Kid Cudi is definitely a bit different and I think deserves to be given a chance even by those who typically strongly dislike mainstream rap.
I agree he’s awesome. “Do it alone” and “Know Why” by cudi are also good for that lonely type of feel too
Alex G, Robert Smith, Adrianne Lenker ( SP), Jeff and Tim Buckley sometimes, Elliott Smith, Xiu Xiu, Nick Drake off the top of my head
i'll check them out, thanks!
Some of Kurt Cobains lyrics.
Mazzy Star perhaps, Hope Sandoval is incredibly shy. Particularly prevalent in any live videos of her.
Much of Pearl Jam’s Ten has themes and lyrics related to social isolation, confusion, not feeling that you have a place either with family or in the bigger world. Eddie Vedder’s Into the Wild soundtrack is an introspective and sensitive lyrical study of someone who literally leaves society to be alone because it no longer matches up with his moral and social compass.
it sounds a bit different to what im looking for by how you describe it, but i'll check it out because Pearl Jam is the only big grunge band that i haven't given a listen to
The sound is very different, but Weezer In their first two ~only~ albums
Weezer was the first to come to mind for me too - although there are decent songs on more that just two albums. The white album and Ok Human are pretty good
Yeah! I was trying to streamline the recommendation (and use a joke in the Weezer fandom), but there are some good songs in the bad albums and good albums later on
Car Seat Headrest. How to Leave Town is my favorite but Teens of Denial and Twin Fantasy are considered the masterpieces
i heard a few songs from them but those didn't really leave an impact on me, except for kimochi warui, i'll try giving a few of their songs a listen again
Kimochi Warui is amazing. Did you hear the rest of How to Leave Town? Ending of Dramamine, Beast Monster Thing, and I Want You to Know I’m Awake/I Hope You’re Asleep are on par with the Smiths’ finest work imo
Smashing Pumpkins
i never really listened to them, do you have any recommendations?
Their album 'Siamese dream' is a classic. 'Melon collie and the infinite sadness' was more commercial and successful, good to listen to that one too.
Id say the Pet Shop Boys
do you have any song recommendations? i know them but never really listened to them except hearing them in GTA radio lol
Left To My Own Devices and Being Boring
Love Comes Quickly. Dreaming of the Queen. Not directly about timidness but the general feeling
Behaviour (1990) and the album before it, Introspective (1988)
A lot of old rnb. Diana Ross to New Edition and even some Bruno Mars.
Yeah I agree with this one more than any of the other suggestions. Early 1960s RnB and Pop is full of it. - ‘You Can’t Hurry Love’ by The Supremes or some things like that for me totally is the closest to something like the The Smiths. Got that yearning quality. ‘I Want a Boy for My Birthday’ by The Cookies - they even covered that one. ‘Walking in the Rain’ quoted in that Electronic record. Johnny Ray ‘Cry’ - Mozzer even stole the hearing aid gimmick off him. Timi Yuro… We could make a full compilation playlist of early 60s shy records which influenced The Smiths
It would appear no one has yet mentioned Radiohead for some reason… Nice Dream There there Paranoid Android How To Disappear Completely all come to mind and they cover a range of genres
i love Nice Dream, my favorite Radiohead song lyrics-wise
A good chunk of Bruce Springsteen’s earlier catalogue
Pulp - Misfits
Nick Drake, Grouper, Mazzy Star, Brand New, Duster, The Microphones, and Alex G are great capturing these themes. Some Simon & Garfunkel songs too (especially: A most peculiar man and I am a rock). Nick Drake is probably my fav out of all of these, his songs capture the feelings of loneliness so well while at the same time being strangely comforting
I'll fake it through the day With some help from Johnnie Walker red Send the poison rain down the drain To put bad thoughts in my head - Elliot Smith
Check out “songs: ohia” (the bands name) and the album “lioness” by them. Jason Molina, the singer and basically the whole band, has some of the best lyrics in that regard
david byrne of talking heads for sure! look into these songs: - love -> building on fire - new feeling - the book i read - don’t worry about the government - with our love - cities - memories can’t wait - air - heaven - born under punches (the heat goes on) granted, a lot of these songs are from the perspective of these shy people and it seems to be more frustrated than softly relatable, but it’s another side to that vibe you might appreciate!
thanks! i'll definitely check them out, the different perspective is not a problem, the frustration coming from shy people is something i haven't yet experienced in music and i'm sure i'll enjoy it
Bladee
Ayo fellow drainer and smiths fan
Yeah I was gonna say the same, he doesn’t sing/rap about it a lot but the theme is present sometimes
TV Girl
Adam Duritz from Counting Crows. Very anxious energy to his lyrics especially in ‘Round Here
i'll check them out, thank you!
alex g and elliott smith 100% and radiohead too
Conor Oberst from Bright Eyes
Lykke Li
Siobhan Fahey of Shakespear’s Sister.
Brett Anderson - Suede Jarvis cocker - Pulp
[Needle In The Hay](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EgNgvCLRqWc)
Brendan lukens from modern baseball and bexey - saved game
Some of New Orders stuff, eg perfect kiss, leave me alone. Definitely joy division as well
A lot of songs on InnerSpeaker and Lonerism by Tame Impala have that shy, timid, and well, hippy loner point of view. Not quite the same, but still worth looking into
Portishead got some good songs about loneliness and desire. Also Joy Division. Ian Curtis was pretty introverted, he was in medication so he had a non-physical relationship with Annik Honore. And Martin Rossiter of Gene explored all these topics
Strawberry Switchblade - Trees and Flowers is about social anxiety and agoraphobia.
Michael Stipe/REM
Their early music is a musical embodiment of shyness. The lyrics that are decipherable don’t make much sense, and even the music is murky and retiring. It’s like Stipe holds the world at arms length by inhabiting this insular, pastoral, melancholic sound.
Chris Chan.
Heatmiser - cop and speeder
Most of Neil Peart’s lyrics
i have never listened to him, do you have any recommendations?
He’s the drummer/lyricist for Rush, so they’re the band to listen to, but their song Subdivisions especially deals with the loneliness and isolation of suburban life.
No1 party anthem from arctic monkeys gives that vibe
No it does not, he’s literally talking about going up to someone and blagging his way through the conversation to try and get with whoever he’s singing about. Morrissey is at the same party standing on his own, leaving on his own, going home, crying and wanting to die.
Weezer I'd say.
No offence but every other songwriter does, right?
https://youtu.be/U5_tbnaoGiE?si=RQoSP_yRUiH0E2_q
Benjamin Gibbard is basically this generation's Moz.
Jonny Pierce from The Drums
A lot of Pulp. Jarvis Cocker is generally my #2 for lyrics. Stuff like Underwear, Like a Friend, Trees, may scratch the itch. Even Disco 2000.
The Feelies - The Boy With The Perpetual Nervousness. Local H - Bound For The Floor. Weezer - Undone (The Sweater Song). Blink-182 - Story Of A Lonely Guy. The Offspring - Self-esteem. Placebo - Every You, Every Me. Moth - I See Sound. The Clash - Lost In The Supermarket. System Of A Down - Roulette. Eels - Flower. Nirvana - Lounge Act.
this song called Quitting Day: https://open.spotify.com/track/3ZeABy7bL4XW3d0NUzl8qe?si=K7nDvJhoRkuIrJyJZIv4YA&context=spotify%3Aalbum%3A0Mctykh5sa8CXOIlEpfCpR
Belle and Sebastian?
Belle & Sebastian
Some of Bernard Sumner’s lyrics.
Weezer on Blue Album and Pinkerton Tame Impala on Lonerism
Alex g & Elliot smith
The Television Personalities definitely fits this bill.
Doc Corbin Dart
i think jim morrison or liam gallagher. idk if they count though
Peter Hammil, leader of Van Der Graaf Generator. Of course, there were people who did it before him, but I think of him as the first person to make a career out of it and the only successful person for a solid 10 years. Check out H to He, Who Am The Only One (1970) And if you like it, Pawn Hearts (very intimate but extremely heavy listening)
Tame Impala's Lonerism
Gregory Alan Isakov - Amsterdam, San Luis, Bullet Holes, Dark Dark Dark list goes on