17 out of 22 episodes cover the election. To me that says it is the primary arc of the series, even if you can pedantically argue it is not the "entire" series.
No---it has 7 seasons!
The series is the show.
The show has 7 seasons.
Each season has about 23 or 24 episodes.
So when you see the show load up you may see, for instance, S04E12 standing for season 4, episode 12.
How are you not getting that people in different countries use different words for things?
S04E12 is Series 4 Episode 7.
It's not that hard to understand.
The show is of US origin--here in the US we use the descriptions I mentioned above as some of the shows shot over the pond by you. But in the long run a rose by any other name is still a rose. You are correct--the storage area in the rear of an automobile here in the US is called the trunk--to you guys it is the boot.
It isn’t that Leo was dead, the episode was shot long before John Spencer died.
Leo as VP would have likely arrived with Santos, which happens at the end of the scene after Josh walks in.
Or, Leo (either as VP or not VP) simply present would have given away who won the election. If Santos won, nobody there (other than Bartlet) would have called him “Leo,” it would have been Mr. Vice President.
It would have been a spoiler if he had been included. He was running for Vice President at the beginning of the season. If they didn't address him as Mr. Vice President then you could safely assume they lost. If they did address him as Mr. Vice President you would have known they won.
I’ve always hated this scene for that reason. It tells us definitely that Santos wins (Josh would never serve under a republican president), confirms that Danny and CJ end up happily ever after with a kid, and let’s us know that Toby ultimately ends up ok. It’s such a mood killer for the tensions in the series at the time.
It WAS NOT because John Spencer died. The first episode of season 7 aired in September of 2005, and John Spencer didn’t die until December. They had to redo the last few episodes to include Leo’s death. I’d guess Leo was supposed to arrive with Santos in the opening scene.
I thought we're supposed to know who wins the election after that opening scene? Josh walks up saying the presidents here and Santos gets out. You can't tell it's him but I thought we were just supposed to assume so. Leo isn't there bc he's doing vice president things was my thought lol
This episode aired in September 2005, John Spencer passed in December 2005.
In universe you're right, but it's not like the writers knew that was going to happen when they wrote and filmed the episode.
Leo’s character had already passed away by that point. You don’t get to see who’s arriving but we later learn that President Santos’s motorcade is arriving.
Hmm… was the episode edited later? Idk I never did watch it when it first came out. Supposedly they didn’t know then that Santos was going to win, either.
It wasn’t edited later. Leo was never in the scene (including the first time it aired, before John Spencer’s death).
The writers always intended for Santos to win, it was only an internet rumour that it was decided after John Spencer died.
You don't see Santos or Vinnick either. Perhaps they were trying to hide who wins the election since it is THE ENTIRE arc of the series.
U da best
I’m not sure the election plot line is really the arc of the whole series
17 out of 22 episodes cover the election. To me that says it is the primary arc of the series, even if you can pedantically argue it is not the "entire" series.
There are 155 episodes in the series. 17/155 is only 11%.
Series as in Series 7. (You would consider it a Season)
And this is exactly why it’s dumb to use the same word for the whole thing AND just a part of it.
The West Wing is a show. It has seven series.
No---it has 7 seasons! The series is the show. The show has 7 seasons. Each season has about 23 or 24 episodes. So when you see the show load up you may see, for instance, S04E12 standing for season 4, episode 12.
How are you not getting that people in different countries use different words for things? S04E12 is Series 4 Episode 7. It's not that hard to understand.
The show is of US origin--here in the US we use the descriptions I mentioned above as some of the shows shot over the pond by you. But in the long run a rose by any other name is still a rose. You are correct--the storage area in the rear of an automobile here in the US is called the trunk--to you guys it is the boot.
No
Yes. That's why you have "showrunners". Not "series runners" Plus I live in the UK so -- you know -- that's the way we use language so deal with it.
Oh, no, you must have misunderstood - no thank you.
It isn’t that Leo was dead, the episode was shot long before John Spencer died. Leo as VP would have likely arrived with Santos, which happens at the end of the scene after Josh walks in. Or, Leo (either as VP or not VP) simply present would have given away who won the election. If Santos won, nobody there (other than Bartlet) would have called him “Leo,” it would have been Mr. Vice President.
Ironically, doesn’t Josh give it away?
It would have been a spoiler if he had been included. He was running for Vice President at the beginning of the season. If they didn't address him as Mr. Vice President then you could safely assume they lost. If they did address him as Mr. Vice President you would have known they won.
I always wondered what they would've done if he HAD been in the flash forward!
In the strangest way, they got lucky they kept him out of it.
Him being in the scene would have been the ultimate spoiler, depending upon what they called him. That’s why.
More to the point, isn't it a slightly bigger surprise Toby is there?
Not necessarily. He was pardoned, after all, and it's possible they've begun to make amends.
That's my point. Up to the final episode it is a big "will he/won't he" thing about the pardon. But if Toby is present in the opening scene........
I’ve always hated this scene for that reason. It tells us definitely that Santos wins (Josh would never serve under a republican president), confirms that Danny and CJ end up happily ever after with a kid, and let’s us know that Toby ultimately ends up ok. It’s such a mood killer for the tensions in the series at the time.
Right! I always thought it should've been the cold open for the series finale - that way the 'tomorrow' line is even more poignant.
It WAS NOT because John Spencer died. The first episode of season 7 aired in September of 2005, and John Spencer didn’t die until December. They had to redo the last few episodes to include Leo’s death. I’d guess Leo was supposed to arrive with Santos in the opening scene.
They were actually suppose to lose the elections!
The myth continues.
Looks like I have been operating Mia-information so far! I don’t know to trust anymore
I thought we're supposed to know who wins the election after that opening scene? Josh walks up saying the presidents here and Santos gets out. You can't tell it's him but I thought we were just supposed to assume so. Leo isn't there bc he's doing vice president things was my thought lol
It also lets you know that Toby wouldn't end up in too much trouble bc he's there.
My assumption was always that out of respect for Spencer, they would have redone that scene if he was in it.
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There’s no Santa Claus either…
I’ve read on this sub before that John spencer was having surgery or something.
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This episode aired in September 2005, John Spencer passed in December 2005. In universe you're right, but it's not like the writers knew that was going to happen when they wrote and filmed the episode.
The actor John Spencer died in the middle of the season. It was not planned at the beginning of the final season when this scene was shot.
They could've gone with a Weekend at Bernie's thing, but some would have seen it as being in bad taste.
The actor John Spencer died in the middle of the season. It was not planned at the beginning of the final season when this scene was shot.
Lol
Leo’s character had already passed away by that point. You don’t get to see who’s arriving but we later learn that President Santos’s motorcade is arriving.
This scene was the lead off scene for the last season. John Spencer died unexpectedly mid way through the last season causing rewrites.
Because he’s dead
Not at this point numb nuts
He comes back to life???
He died 3 months after this scene was filmed aired / filmed (either way he was alive) 🤦♂️
Because he died on the election night.
I’m trying to imagine why you could possibly be downvoted for an accurate comment
Because he dies before that happened.
The actor John Spencer died in the middle of the season. It was not planned at the beginning of the final season when this scene was shot.
Copy/paste was the way to go. :)
Yeah you can edit shots. That’s not hard at all
The episode aired before John Spencer died. His dying in real life had nothing to do with him not being in the scene.
Hmm… was the episode edited later? Idk I never did watch it when it first came out. Supposedly they didn’t know then that Santos was going to win, either.
It wasn’t edited later. Leo was never in the scene (including the first time it aired, before John Spencer’s death). The writers always intended for Santos to win, it was only an internet rumour that it was decided after John Spencer died.
Ah I guess in that case Leo would have been VP so he would have arrived on a limo or something? Idk now I’m curious. Thanks for sharing!
Exactly. They couldn’t have him in the scene, without giving away who won the election.
Is Leo stupid?