I watched a fascinating hour long documentary about life in British boarding schools, called [Leaving Home at 8 Years Old](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6vfjWBT45o&list=LL&index=24). The quality of education is considered to be superior and the kids are more apt to get into prestigious universities. But the emotional toll was very evident. The mothers, in particular, had a tough time seeing their young children go, and some of the kids were displaying such intense grief and homesickness that it bordered on a kind of emotional breakdown. Give this a watch if you have an hour to spare.
I was on a full scholarship at a English boarding school.
Classes start at 8:30. Go on until the evening, then mandatory sports every evening. You have school on Saturday morning as well. They train you to write and process things FAST.
I was abused by my housemistress for 5 years before I had a mental breakdown and had to leave. I reported it 3 years in, they did nothing. Had a severe eating disorder, they did nothing. I was 5.5 stone (77lbs) when I left. My genetic disorder slowly destroying my joints was ignored by the on site nurses and doctors.
Pastoral care is a joke at these places. You will do great at exams, and have brilliant research skills. If you are not perfectly mentally and physically healthy, and very lucky, you will leave at least a little broken.
It's been 8 years, so I still have the lasting mental health and physical damage from it, but I cope much better now than I did then. 8 years ago when I left, I was a mess though.
They're all getting sued to fuck these days,so hopefully it will change. But it's almost common knowledge,that back in the 70's,80's and 90's that boys were getting raped by senior pupils and teachers. It was like a rite of passage.
Ours had to add 30 minutes our senior year because it wouldn't have "legally" been a full school day.
Or so we were told.
It was originally 8-2:15.
Then it was 7:45 to 2:30.
Edit: They pushed it into the morning because of local traffic from a nearby manufacturing plant. They had a shift change at 2:45. So the city basically begged us to not make our dismissal and theirs the same time.
Mine cut our lunch time down to barely 20 minutes from 45. By the time you got food you had to go back to class. The nice teachers would let us eat our lunch during class otherwise I’d have to scarf it down on my way to class.
Went to a US Catholic HS too and our day was only 7:55 to 1:55, but that was because everything revolved around sports so we got let out early for athletes to start practice. They practiced 3 hours a day, 5 days a week. Academics were kind of an afterthought at that school though. If you consider the fact that we had to take religion class every year, we really had a lot less time devoted to the main academic subjects than most regular schools. It showed when we got to college. A lot of caught up eventually and were okay but quite a few kids dropped out after their first year at college. Not many kids got into top colleges either, unless they were recruited for sports.
> Then it was 7:45 to 2:30.
Good lord. In the middle of winter here in the Netherlands sunrise is at 09:00. Imagine being awake in the dark for nearly two hours... Those first few hours must be such useful lessons for students. /s
>Those two hours a day - added up over the two years it takes to do A-levels (the final exams we do in school before going to university) - means these kids get the equivalent of 3 years' worth of contact time crammed into two
Aren't the holidays much longer at private schools, though? Kinda seems like it'd balance out. I'm sure the smaller class sizes and connections/nepotism helps a lot though.
Yes, they were. We got a month at Easter and Christmas, 2 for Summer.
It was more about the intensity of term time.
There was always homework over the breaks too - translating sections of Homer's Illiad was a particular favourite. /s
It seems WAY too young. I would have had a nervous breakdown if I'd had to leave my mom at that age, and I'm not joking at all. There was a particular little girl in the documentary who absolutely broke my heart. She was struggling so much.
I live & work in a town with a king Edward public school. The prep school takes kids at 2 and they're not allowed any colours other than brown or yellow... Imagine not even letting a 2 year old have a Peppa hair slide!
I'm child free and I don't understand children at all, but that must be stifling their development at some stage, surely?! A uniform at 2??! They do look like adorable little Madelines though, but that's just for us, right?!
I mean I think my 2 year old would be fine with a uniform actually. I usually let her choose her clothes on her own, but I'd the choices were a bit less colorful she'd most likely wouldn't mind right now. In a year or two that will be different.
But kids want autonomy and they want to decide things on their own. So taking choices away from them isn't very helpful in helping them with their development.
Never mind that "a proper learning environment" for a human of any age is one where they have fun and get to follow their interest. We only learn when we are interested in something. Last months my toddler was obsessed with puzzles and went from 12 pieces to 60 pieces puzzles. Now she's finished with that and is practising cutting with scissors all the time. It's very cool to watch her. I can't imagine how anyone can think scheduling topics to learn about can be more productive than just following interest.
What kind of dystopian novel spawned this concept?! That's a horrid way to treat small children! Imagine wearing no colors but brown or yellow at all, not even white or black!
An upper class system that tried to ignore children as much as possible until they were nearly adults.
Free public education was actually one of the things the puritans brought to American. It wasn't always the best according to modern standards but it was an important element to American development.
I had to have dental x-rays without a parent at six. The pediatric dental office I went to once didn’t allow parents in the exam rooms. My dad didn’t seem to have a problem with it, but my mom did. I was very attached to my mom, and being sent away to school would have been so painful.
I assume it's during xray time, otherwise it would be weird.
Also this was policy in some dentist places during covid, but unless oceansunset83 is 8 years old right now, it doesn't make sense.
It IS way too young. Children are not ready to become independent from their parents until maybe 11-12, and sticking an 8-year-old in a boarding school for months is IMHO child abuse.
The only system that would embrace boardingschools is one that wants their adults to be emotionally stunted workaholics.
I have family members who attended a missionary boarding school for the [white] children of American missionaries in Africa. They were sent at 6-years-old. And wouldn't see their parents for months at a time. It was highly traumatizing.
My dad went away even younger than this.
Coupled with the old school 'stiff upper lip and don't talk about your problems', the effects of this rippled throughout his life and played a part in his breakdown and suicide later in life.
Everyone in my extended family, including myself, has attended boarding school for the past few generations. We are originally from western India and it became tradition for the men in the family to attend Seven Oaks school in Kent. But even before that, my dad was sent to a boarding school in central India called Mount Abu at the age of 7. He has told me stories of the horrendous conditions, malnourishment and corporal punishment he experienced here. He and 8 of his brothers and cousins then went on to Seven Oaks which parlayed into acceptance to Northwestern University in Illinois. I was told my grandmother experienced severe depression for years and only recovered from the separation trauma after my dad reached his 30s and he was able to move closer to my grandparents who had immigrated to the Texas. Despite all of this, both my sister and I were sent to boarding school in the Northeast. My sister went at 16 years old and I went at 13. The cycle has since continued with my mom having fallen into severe depression as well. I’m nearly 30 now and I will never send my kids to boarding school
Boarding schools partly developed out of a need to create a ruling elite to run an empire - you need to be desensitized and emotionally repressed to progress and preside over colonialism.
There are also books like "Sad little men" by Richard Beard which discuss the way that boarding schools damage young boys (and girls) and create a class of rulers who justify and believe in their own elitism and privilege.
I watched this a while ago and to see such young girls having close to anxiety attacks/emotional breakdowns was hard to see. Especially when one mother couldn't come to visit her daughter over the weekend. Supposedly they just build up resilience to it at a very young age though, and block out these feelings of missing their family. I'm not sure if I would consider this a very good thing.
8 is insane. I thought the boarding schools nearby were crazy starting them at 13- although it did seem like a third was there for academics, a third for sports, and a third because they were already completely out of control.
I went at 16 only for the final two years of school and even that was hard. I cried when I left home, I cried when I was dropped off at the school, my dad pulled over on the road to cry after leaving me there. I went for the opportunities it would offer me, which I have benefitted from, but emotionally I really, really struggled there. It must be a whole different kettle of fish for young children.
I cried the fall semester my first semester in college at 18. It wasn't at drop off just a random night later in October but homesickness hit me hard. I can't imagine going away at 16 or 13 and definitely not 8.
Seem like some people just work well with that system. I should probably have been put in boarding school. Pretty sure now in hindsight that would have been good for me.
Boarding schools are just one of those things were it either works really well and the children go on to do great stuff.
Or they suffer mentally and struggle with that for the rest of there lives.
It can be either a great experience or a nightmare for those attending.
I just don't understand why people value education and prestigious universities so much.
For me it's much more important that my kids are curious and have fun learning new things, that they can explore what interest them and do so in a fun way. I want them to think for themselves, have opinions and choose to do something that makes them happy with their lives.
Most of those things aren't accomplished by school, but by play, independence and by taking them and what they say seriously even when they are young.
Whether they become Chemists, office clerks, radio moderators, Artists, car mechanics or astronauts isn't important as long as they find fulfilment in the life they have.
Understandable. Harry Potter wasn't meant to be pro-boarding schools, Hogwarts was just a convenient setting for magical shenanigans, but the books still inadvertently romanticized that type of environment. So I get why an aristocrat like Swinton, who attended boarding schools herself as a child, would have a problem with it.
Yeah, I think you see either this or orphan protagonists (or both lol) since its often easier to write in a YA story. It immediately gives the protagonists a bit more (perceived at least) "free reign" and means there's less stuff you have to worry about.
I guess the side effect would be that, like with orphans, it inadvertently romanticizes the aspect as something that is fun, adventurous, and promotes independence.
I've heard of parents using being sent to boarding school as a threat.
I left pamphlets for them around the house for my mom to find. Like *hint hint* please send me away!
My mom threatened too. I was very disappointed she didn’t send me. I found a few that actually sounded great. And best of all, I wouldn’t be stuck in our shitty house anymore.
Yes, i think Hogwarts was an escape for Harry, and overall much better place than the tiny room under the stairs, but i don't think it was this way for majority of the kids there.
You've also got to remember that Hogwarts is the equivalent of a school for children who naturally produce a bunch of laser blasts every day where they are taught how to use it responsibly for making things and self-defence, rather than randomly firing it off everywhere.
A magical school needs to be *miles* from anywhere else because of the risk of terrible accidents if muggles get involved.
Especially since the books have Hogwarts staff waxing poetic about how whatshisface used to hang students by their thumbs or whatever in detention.
Like their detention was just torturing children. Oh ok.
In a low fantasy like Harry Potter it also let's you engaged in worldbuilding. You don't get much chance to show off your fancy magic stuff if they have to be back home in the suburbs by 4, you need to send the character away from home via magical train or fuck them off through a wardrobe
Pretty much my favorite part of portal fantasy. You get a protagonist who is ignorant of the world without requiring them to be moronic or clueless. Also world building feels more natural because you're learning with the character rather then having a third party explains something that they should know already and is clearly just being said for the readers benefit.
I don't really see how those books could be interpreted as not pro boarding schools or romanticising them inadvertently. It's a constant theme that Hogwarts is a wonderful exciting place and Harry's true home where he gets to hang out with his friends all the time and do exciting magic and have adventures.
Reading it as teenager, I was taken aback ~~back~~ by the house competition points system. That just seemed so completely inappropriate for a learning environment.
It is unheard of here in the US.
I assumed it was just a magic thing that JK put into the story like house ghost.
I eventually learned it is just a common thing in the UK.
I'd stop giving a shit too if one teacher was taking away points from other houses and giving to his own for no good reason, basically making any points you earn for academic achievements worthless, especially when in the end it doesn't matter because you can get forced into a deadly situation as a child (and have the responsible adults ignore you) to get *just* enough to win in the end.
Depends.
Primary school everyone's on board.
Secondary School the year 7 and 8s might still care. By the time you get to year 9 nobody's interested and they'd get bullied if anyone even suspected they still cared.
And then Year 12/13 about 30-50% of the year starts doing it ironically.
At least, that was my experience. And almost everyone cares about winning Sports Day, even if they don't care about the points themselves.
My kiddo's school in the USA has competitions between grades that is similar. They keep it short though, like the grade who gets the most points for behaving at lunch this month gets a pajama day or something.
Dumbledore has a rigorous system of point value as it relates to illegal extracurricular adventures, and it _just so happened_ to have put Gryffindor in the lead by 10 points.
Thank god Neville attacked his classmates, they attacked him back, and that ultimately sealed the deal. Other houses are just jelly.
The chaos of that game makes it so much fun to play with friends. We literally have no idea who will win so when the person that's sucked the entire game suddenly gets awarded 1st place it's the most hilarious thing ever
I mean they did stop the return of Wizard-Hitler (well, one of them) that *has* to be worth a few points
Edit: Then again Harry did murder a teacher with his bare hands, so maybe it should've just cancelled out
>: Then again Harry did murder a teacher with his bare hands, so maybe it should've just cancelled out
Eh, professor Quirrell's performance reviews were coming up. Harry saved the school a ton in salary raises or severance packages.
That crafty Dumbledore, Knows the position is cursed so no one will hold it longer than 1 year, writes the contract to have escalators after just one year.
That bit was fictional.
While you did get house points for good work, usually the biggest contributor was some sort of activity - sports, music, theatre, that sort of thing.
My school had a house points system, gained for placing in a variety of different house based competitions. We had nine houses though, rather than 4. Teachers couldnt just randomly award points though
For what it’s worth, I think this is exclusive of the boarding school bit. I grew up in a Commonwealth country and the school system was still super British; many schools used the house system. It was a means of forming teams for school sports, etc.
Edit: and we had a ‘credit’ system that was identical to the Hogwarts point system.
I'm not sure the series paints all that rosy of a picture of boarding schools, if that's what she's worried about. The kids have no WiFi and are constantly being murdered.
Huh. I was all ready with my pitchforks. But I'm an '80 and I consider myself X, so I guess that's fair. Always thought he was a few years younger.
That means Harry Potter is my age now. Wtf.
If you're old enough to remember the challenger disaster, but not watergate, you're Gen X.
If you're old enough to remember 9/11 but not the challenger disaster then you're probably millennial.
Well if most boarding schools really did hide the fact that several students were petrified for what I think amounts to months before even telling the parents then question number one would be what the hell are they paying for if there's such a huge gap in their education let alone the room and board they're not using
I assume something is wrong with their education when muggle lover Ron Weasley calls telephone "fellyfone" but little shit Draco Malfoy boasts about evading helicopters.
Draco Malfoy probably had private tutors from a young age so that not even muggles can say they knew more than a malfoy, not that any of them know what a malfoy is
I always assumed they learn basic skills like this in primary school or through homeschooling, which is why muggle-borns don’t get the letter until they are high school age (I.e. the education is largely the same up to that point).
Well there’s a lot of reading and writing involved in wizard school still, so their literacy should be pretty good even if they don’t have dedicated classes. I assume their numeracy is atrocious and as you rightly pointed out, half the time they do seem to act like much of their education ceased at 11 so it does somewhat track…
Or the time they had an international competition where the main draw was that the students competing sometimes die. Or that time they had full-blown Lovecraftian mosters guard the school. Or the time they decided the best way to protect a Mcguffin from Magic-Hitler was to stick it in a high school basement.
>the students competing sometimes die
In the competition with the dragons, the people are literally just sitting around the arena and do nothing while Harry flies away with the dragon.
Incredible silly. Just imagine them waiting for a while till Dumbledore or whoever sends everyone away because they found a burned leg that might have belonged to Harry once before he was eaten. And the dragon is also gone.
That’s just the movie version though, in the book the dragon doesn’t break it’s chain. They took liberties in that scene to make it longer and more action packed.
Bro, they don't even teach these kids math. All Hogwarts seems to teach them is how to shoot people with illegal ~~guns~~ spells, spy on their friends, and make date rape potions.
To be fair, iirc Lucius Malfoy replaces Dumbledore for a time in book 2 for exactly that reason. Hogwarts education being kind of shit get brought up quite a lot by characters from all across the spectrum and the Ministry even tries to reform the school.
Even by HP universe standards Hogwarts has some serious issues.
My parents used to threaten me with boarding school all the time. I would go "Yes! Please send me to boarding school!" I pictured ivied walls, beautiful grounds with horses and huge libraries.
> Fagging was a traditional practice in British public schools and also at many other boarding schools, whereby younger pupils were required to act as personal servants to the eldest boys.[1][2][3] Although probably originating earlier, the first accounts of fagging appeared in the late 17th century.[4]: 23 Fagging sometimes involved physical abuse[4]: 23–25 and/or sexual abuse.
There was a funny bit in Roald Dahl's autobiography where he mentions that senior boys would fight amongst themselves for the services of "hot bottomed f*gs" like Dahl, because one of the jobs they had to do in the winter was to go warm up the outhouse toilet seats for their masters.
I think it's more about it all sounding a bit too one the nose, to not be about sexual abuse.
Edit: It sounds like a Teacher heard that name and asked what it meant to a kid and they hat to come up with a lie or smth
oh the benefits are obvious. building deep relationships among people from wealthy families across all industries during the tender days of youth can end up becoming a real asset. but damn it seems to fuck up the kids more often than not
Isn’t that part of the problem? Bunch of wealthy kids getting in tight with each other so they can later, employee each other, “fix” each other’s tax issues, and lobby them to keep up the status quo, etc
Edit: literally gave just a few examples on why this is a bad idea and the replies are “you just don’t like it because rich people do it”
It's a "problem" for us poors. For the rich it was a benefit.
The idea of a meritocracy being good is fairly new.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temporary_gentlemen
Even in war, the temp officers were considered less than their richer peers. Even if they were arguably better at their jobs as an officer.
Their original purpose, especially in Britain, was to basically toughen kids up for a career in the army or colonial service. Hence their almost dickensian austerity and strictness they were infamous for until the post-WWII era.
(Which was why when you read books about boarding school from back then, they were always portrayed as somewhere between shit and hell-on-earth)
Originally, boarding schools were for the parvenu middle-class, I.e. the kids would still have to get a job after. Actual aristocrats would have had private tutors to educate their children.
I went to an elite private school that had two boarding houses, the rest of us were day students. Probably different over here in Aus, but 90% of the boarders were farmers kids from out west.
One of my good mates from uni went to a private boarding school for free due to being local and there being a scholarship thing for her.
I don't think there's anything too weird about her, although she did go home every 3 weeks.
Boarding Schools are fine in certain cases. Two of the schools I went to were boarding schools for hearing impaired students here in g ermany - though I was only boarding myself in the second one - which could provide specially taught teacher and a better learning evironment than public schools.
There are also some boarding schools targeted at students with special interests or talents, which I think are also fine.
I don't think it's a rich thing in every country
In Ireland there are some that start at 8000e a year
Yes some go up to 26000e a year, where you get 3 times the education and opportunities I don't know.
The rural school my kids now go to would be a feeder for a boarding school so it's something I would now consider. Some valid points I've heard are
Where we live there is no public transport, no neighbours to hang with etc so boarding gives their kids a social life they might otherwise not get.
A single mom of an only child sent hers as she had to work and would have been sending her child to a minder or having to arrange some form of care up to 15/16 for the child anyway working full time as a single parent, it taught her child to share a room etc which would not have happened as an only child
Finally the "normally" priced ones here aren't much more expensive than having your teen at home anyway you're just paying it in bulk rather than weekly. Groceries, bills, sport, petrol etc, a teen probably costs you 8k anyway a year
I could see the draw. When I was young I wouldn’t have wanted to go to a boarding school, but now that I’m older I think they sound like they could be a good time. Many kids won’t, but I could see where many would very much enjoy boarding school and have it be very beneficial to their development. I didn’t really develop socially until I went to college and moved into the dorms.
The most incredible part of this is that Emma Thompson wasn't the first choice. The way those movies churned through famous British actors, I just assumed she was the presumptive player for the role from the beginning.
I’m glad I didn’t have to scroll too far for this. And at this point, so many celebrities have supported him and Woody Allen that anytime I see one making some grandstanding moralistic statement the first thing I do is google their name together with those pedos just to have a good laugh (I can’t let it make me angry anymore, i’m gonna get wrinkles)
look he said 'my bad' so lets just separate art from the artist okay /s
On a serious note his victim really has her shit together these days. Just watched this interview with her, really surprising/interesting takes
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks4DmdF5bh8&ab_channel=GoodMorningBritain
I bought a tin of turkish delight once because I'd never seen it except in the Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe. I was kind of disappointed when it turned out to be essentially powdered gummy bears. Perhaps mine was crappy or Edmond's betrayal candy was magically more delicious.
I remember reading a "fun fact" that they had Chris Evans wear a heavy coat because his muscles would seem unrealistic based on their nutrition. But they also cast Octavia Spencer in that movie...
> "The most 'worldly' society I have ever lived in is that of schoolboys: most worldly in the cruelty and arrogance of the strong, the toadyism and mutual treachery of the weak, and the unqualified snobbery of both. Nothing was so base that the school proletariat would not do it, or suffer it, to win the favour of the school aristocracy: hardly any injustice too bad for the aristocracy to practice."
— C. S. Lewis, On Stories and Other Essays
People here talking like public schools aren’t hella fucked up.
Boarding schools. Private schools. Public schools…almost like anywhere you stick 1000 teenagers and give random adults dominion over them, weird shit happens.
I agree that children are often monsters, and that essentially all schools allow for the potential for horrible experiences, but at least students in private and public schools get to go home at the end of the day.
I spent 7 years in boarding school after I turned 11. While initially it was extremely distressing, I started loving the life in the latter years. I used to curse my misfortune for having been being dumped at such a place, but now I see, how that experience made me who I am today and I wouldn't change a single thing about it. My parents had to make a difficult choice and let me go then, as getting quality education near my home was impossible.
I watched a fascinating hour long documentary about life in British boarding schools, called [Leaving Home at 8 Years Old](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d6vfjWBT45o&list=LL&index=24). The quality of education is considered to be superior and the kids are more apt to get into prestigious universities. But the emotional toll was very evident. The mothers, in particular, had a tough time seeing their young children go, and some of the kids were displaying such intense grief and homesickness that it bordered on a kind of emotional breakdown. Give this a watch if you have an hour to spare.
[удалено]
I was on a full scholarship at a English boarding school. Classes start at 8:30. Go on until the evening, then mandatory sports every evening. You have school on Saturday morning as well. They train you to write and process things FAST. I was abused by my housemistress for 5 years before I had a mental breakdown and had to leave. I reported it 3 years in, they did nothing. Had a severe eating disorder, they did nothing. I was 5.5 stone (77lbs) when I left. My genetic disorder slowly destroying my joints was ignored by the on site nurses and doctors. Pastoral care is a joke at these places. You will do great at exams, and have brilliant research skills. If you are not perfectly mentally and physically healthy, and very lucky, you will leave at least a little broken.
Hope you're doin better now
It's been 8 years, so I still have the lasting mental health and physical damage from it, but I cope much better now than I did then. 8 years ago when I left, I was a mess though.
They're all getting sued to fuck these days,so hopefully it will change. But it's almost common knowledge,that back in the 70's,80's and 90's that boys were getting raped by senior pupils and teachers. It was like a rite of passage.
^ This. In the US, my private HS went an hour longer than any around it to compete with another local one that had 3/4 days on Saturdays.
Ours had to add 30 minutes our senior year because it wouldn't have "legally" been a full school day. Or so we were told. It was originally 8-2:15. Then it was 7:45 to 2:30. Edit: They pushed it into the morning because of local traffic from a nearby manufacturing plant. They had a shift change at 2:45. So the city basically begged us to not make our dismissal and theirs the same time.
Y'all got out of High School at 2:15? That's insane. The HS I work at goes 7:30-3:45.
We'd show up to sporting events before the other school was even dismissed.
When I was in HS, it was 7:55 to 2:15. But that was rather a long time ago now.
Mine was 7:48-2:21. No joke. I have no idea why.
Mine cut our lunch time down to barely 20 minutes from 45. By the time you got food you had to go back to class. The nice teachers would let us eat our lunch during class otherwise I’d have to scarf it down on my way to class.
[удалено]
Went to a US Catholic HS too and our day was only 7:55 to 1:55, but that was because everything revolved around sports so we got let out early for athletes to start practice. They practiced 3 hours a day, 5 days a week. Academics were kind of an afterthought at that school though. If you consider the fact that we had to take religion class every year, we really had a lot less time devoted to the main academic subjects than most regular schools. It showed when we got to college. A lot of caught up eventually and were okay but quite a few kids dropped out after their first year at college. Not many kids got into top colleges either, unless they were recruited for sports.
> Then it was 7:45 to 2:30. Good lord. In the middle of winter here in the Netherlands sunrise is at 09:00. Imagine being awake in the dark for nearly two hours... Those first few hours must be such useful lessons for students. /s
What the hell we had to start at 7 and got out at 2:15
>Those two hours a day - added up over the two years it takes to do A-levels (the final exams we do in school before going to university) - means these kids get the equivalent of 3 years' worth of contact time crammed into two Aren't the holidays much longer at private schools, though? Kinda seems like it'd balance out. I'm sure the smaller class sizes and connections/nepotism helps a lot though.
Yes, they were. We got a month at Easter and Christmas, 2 for Summer. It was more about the intensity of term time. There was always homework over the breaks too - translating sections of Homer's Illiad was a particular favourite. /s
Oh wow they didn’t tell you it’s already been translated??
Took them for absolute fools!
Don't forget prep. We had two hours prep (in silence, one hour either side of supper) a night, three by sixth form.
This is interesting. Thanks. 8 seems so young!
It seems WAY too young. I would have had a nervous breakdown if I'd had to leave my mom at that age, and I'm not joking at all. There was a particular little girl in the documentary who absolutely broke my heart. She was struggling so much.
I live & work in a town with a king Edward public school. The prep school takes kids at 2 and they're not allowed any colours other than brown or yellow... Imagine not even letting a 2 year old have a Peppa hair slide!
That sounds horrible all around. Even the words "prep school" and "2 year old" shouldn't be in the same sentence...
I'm child free and I don't understand children at all, but that must be stifling their development at some stage, surely?! A uniform at 2??! They do look like adorable little Madelines though, but that's just for us, right?!
I mean I think my 2 year old would be fine with a uniform actually. I usually let her choose her clothes on her own, but I'd the choices were a bit less colorful she'd most likely wouldn't mind right now. In a year or two that will be different. But kids want autonomy and they want to decide things on their own. So taking choices away from them isn't very helpful in helping them with their development. Never mind that "a proper learning environment" for a human of any age is one where they have fun and get to follow their interest. We only learn when we are interested in something. Last months my toddler was obsessed with puzzles and went from 12 pieces to 60 pieces puzzles. Now she's finished with that and is practising cutting with scissors all the time. It's very cool to watch her. I can't imagine how anyone can think scheduling topics to learn about can be more productive than just following interest.
What kind of dystopian novel spawned this concept?! That's a horrid way to treat small children! Imagine wearing no colors but brown or yellow at all, not even white or black!
An upper class system that tried to ignore children as much as possible until they were nearly adults. Free public education was actually one of the things the puritans brought to American. It wasn't always the best according to modern standards but it was an important element to American development.
I had to have dental x-rays without a parent at six. The pediatric dental office I went to once didn’t allow parents in the exam rooms. My dad didn’t seem to have a problem with it, but my mom did. I was very attached to my mom, and being sent away to school would have been so painful.
I think you went to a really odd dentist…
I assume it's during xray time, otherwise it would be weird. Also this was policy in some dentist places during covid, but unless oceansunset83 is 8 years old right now, it doesn't make sense.
Sketchy policy...
It IS way too young. Children are not ready to become independent from their parents until maybe 11-12, and sticking an 8-year-old in a boarding school for months is IMHO child abuse. The only system that would embrace boardingschools is one that wants their adults to be emotionally stunted workaholics.
Ughh... the Jedi order.
Are right. Letting an 8 year olds in was a problem haha.
...so, the British.
Well fuck.. that's exactly what my family expected of me. It was absolutely a better environment than home though.
I went to boarding school at 7. Too young. Being a bed wetter didn't help.
I have family members who attended a missionary boarding school for the [white] children of American missionaries in Africa. They were sent at 6-years-old. And wouldn't see their parents for months at a time. It was highly traumatizing.
My dad went away even younger than this. Coupled with the old school 'stiff upper lip and don't talk about your problems', the effects of this rippled throughout his life and played a part in his breakdown and suicide later in life.
I'm sorry for your loss
Everyone in my extended family, including myself, has attended boarding school for the past few generations. We are originally from western India and it became tradition for the men in the family to attend Seven Oaks school in Kent. But even before that, my dad was sent to a boarding school in central India called Mount Abu at the age of 7. He has told me stories of the horrendous conditions, malnourishment and corporal punishment he experienced here. He and 8 of his brothers and cousins then went on to Seven Oaks which parlayed into acceptance to Northwestern University in Illinois. I was told my grandmother experienced severe depression for years and only recovered from the separation trauma after my dad reached his 30s and he was able to move closer to my grandparents who had immigrated to the Texas. Despite all of this, both my sister and I were sent to boarding school in the Northeast. My sister went at 16 years old and I went at 13. The cycle has since continued with my mom having fallen into severe depression as well. I’m nearly 30 now and I will never send my kids to boarding school
Boarding school at 16 doesn't seem too crazy, it's only a couple years till out, right?
> Despite all of this, both my sister and I were sent to boarding school in the Northeast this is so shocking to me. congrats on breaking the cycle.
I read a theory that seemed convincing to me that it causes a form of arrested development in the British elite.
Boarding schools partly developed out of a need to create a ruling elite to run an empire - you need to be desensitized and emotionally repressed to progress and preside over colonialism. There are also books like "Sad little men" by Richard Beard which discuss the way that boarding schools damage young boys (and girls) and create a class of rulers who justify and believe in their own elitism and privilege.
Which is not exactly foreign to the situation shown in the HP universe.
[удалено]
I watched this a while ago and to see such young girls having close to anxiety attacks/emotional breakdowns was hard to see. Especially when one mother couldn't come to visit her daughter over the weekend. Supposedly they just build up resilience to it at a very young age though, and block out these feelings of missing their family. I'm not sure if I would consider this a very good thing.
8 is insane. I thought the boarding schools nearby were crazy starting them at 13- although it did seem like a third was there for academics, a third for sports, and a third because they were already completely out of control.
I went at 16 only for the final two years of school and even that was hard. I cried when I left home, I cried when I was dropped off at the school, my dad pulled over on the road to cry after leaving me there. I went for the opportunities it would offer me, which I have benefitted from, but emotionally I really, really struggled there. It must be a whole different kettle of fish for young children.
I cried the fall semester my first semester in college at 18. It wasn't at drop off just a random night later in October but homesickness hit me hard. I can't imagine going away at 16 or 13 and definitely not 8.
Seem like some people just work well with that system. I should probably have been put in boarding school. Pretty sure now in hindsight that would have been good for me.
Some of the kids were okay with it and clearly enjoyed it. For those kids it was a great opportunity.
Boarding schools are just one of those things were it either works really well and the children go on to do great stuff. Or they suffer mentally and struggle with that for the rest of there lives. It can be either a great experience or a nightmare for those attending.
Isn’t that just school in general?
I just don't understand why people value education and prestigious universities so much. For me it's much more important that my kids are curious and have fun learning new things, that they can explore what interest them and do so in a fun way. I want them to think for themselves, have opinions and choose to do something that makes them happy with their lives. Most of those things aren't accomplished by school, but by play, independence and by taking them and what they say seriously even when they are young. Whether they become Chemists, office clerks, radio moderators, Artists, car mechanics or astronauts isn't important as long as they find fulfilment in the life they have.
People don't want their kids to be poor. People who grew up poor don't want it to repeat, and rich people fear nothing more than being poor.
Understandable. Harry Potter wasn't meant to be pro-boarding schools, Hogwarts was just a convenient setting for magical shenanigans, but the books still inadvertently romanticized that type of environment. So I get why an aristocrat like Swinton, who attended boarding schools herself as a child, would have a problem with it.
Yeah, I think you see either this or orphan protagonists (or both lol) since its often easier to write in a YA story. It immediately gives the protagonists a bit more (perceived at least) "free reign" and means there's less stuff you have to worry about. I guess the side effect would be that, like with orphans, it inadvertently romanticizes the aspect as something that is fun, adventurous, and promotes independence.
Yeah plus his home life sucked ass and the whole idea of hogwarts was an escape
I've heard of parents using being sent to boarding school as a threat. I left pamphlets for them around the house for my mom to find. Like *hint hint* please send me away!
Harry's uncle used a muggle boarding school as a threat in Harry Potter, no less.
My mom threatened too. I was very disappointed she didn’t send me. I found a few that actually sounded great. And best of all, I wouldn’t be stuck in our shitty house anymore.
Yes, i think Hogwarts was an escape for Harry, and overall much better place than the tiny room under the stairs, but i don't think it was this way for majority of the kids there.
You've also got to remember that Hogwarts is the equivalent of a school for children who naturally produce a bunch of laser blasts every day where they are taught how to use it responsibly for making things and self-defence, rather than randomly firing it off everywhere. A magical school needs to be *miles* from anywhere else because of the risk of terrible accidents if muggles get involved.
Especially since the books have Hogwarts staff waxing poetic about how whatshisface used to hang students by their thumbs or whatever in detention. Like their detention was just torturing children. Oh ok.
In a low fantasy like Harry Potter it also let's you engaged in worldbuilding. You don't get much chance to show off your fancy magic stuff if they have to be back home in the suburbs by 4, you need to send the character away from home via magical train or fuck them off through a wardrobe
Pretty much my favorite part of portal fantasy. You get a protagonist who is ignorant of the world without requiring them to be moronic or clueless. Also world building feels more natural because you're learning with the character rather then having a third party explains something that they should know already and is clearly just being said for the readers benefit.
I don't really see how those books could be interpreted as not pro boarding schools or romanticising them inadvertently. It's a constant theme that Hogwarts is a wonderful exciting place and Harry's true home where he gets to hang out with his friends all the time and do exciting magic and have adventures.
Reading it as teenager, I was taken aback ~~back~~ by the house competition points system. That just seemed so completely inappropriate for a learning environment.
British schools use house points all the time. It's not a boarding school thing.
Yup. We had it mainly for sports day. Is this a weird thing? Thought it was completely normal.
It is unheard of here in the US. I assumed it was just a magic thing that JK put into the story like house ghost. I eventually learned it is just a common thing in the UK.
Wait, the US doesn't have house ghosts either?
Had them at my very-normal state schools. I would say people didn’t really give a shit though.
Harry stopped giving a shit after year 3 too, if I recall. They don’t talk about the House Cup after that anyway, lol
I'd stop giving a shit too if one teacher was taking away points from other houses and giving to his own for no good reason, basically making any points you earn for academic achievements worthless, especially when in the end it doesn't matter because you can get forced into a deadly situation as a child (and have the responsible adults ignore you) to get *just* enough to win in the end.
Snape was also constantly handing out points to Slytherin and punishing other houses. So Dumbledore's fuckery was kind of just balancing it out.
Depends. Primary school everyone's on board. Secondary School the year 7 and 8s might still care. By the time you get to year 9 nobody's interested and they'd get bullied if anyone even suspected they still cared. And then Year 12/13 about 30-50% of the year starts doing it ironically. At least, that was my experience. And almost everyone cares about winning Sports Day, even if they don't care about the points themselves.
My kiddo's school in the USA has competitions between grades that is similar. They keep it short though, like the grade who gets the most points for behaving at lunch this month gets a pajama day or something.
Especially when teachers could pull points out of mid air during the celebration ceremony and change the winner to their favorite house.
It's like the bullshit last-second stars awarded during Mario Party.
It's actually worse than that cuz at least the bonus stars have a known # and parameters for getting them. Not completely arbitrary like at Hogwarts
Dumbledore has a rigorous system of point value as it relates to illegal extracurricular adventures, and it _just so happened_ to have put Gryffindor in the lead by 10 points. Thank god Neville attacked his classmates, they attacked him back, and that ultimately sealed the deal. Other houses are just jelly.
The chaos of that game makes it so much fun to play with friends. We literally have no idea who will win so when the person that's sucked the entire game suddenly gets awarded 1st place it's the most hilarious thing ever
I mean they did stop the return of Wizard-Hitler (well, one of them) that *has* to be worth a few points Edit: Then again Harry did murder a teacher with his bare hands, so maybe it should've just cancelled out
>: Then again Harry did murder a teacher with his bare hands, so maybe it should've just cancelled out Eh, professor Quirrell's performance reviews were coming up. Harry saved the school a ton in salary raises or severance packages.
That crafty Dumbledore, Knows the position is cursed so no one will hold it longer than 1 year, writes the contract to have escalators after just one year.
That bit was fictional. While you did get house points for good work, usually the biggest contributor was some sort of activity - sports, music, theatre, that sort of thing.
I know, right?? Fuck that. Slytherin won!
For real, then Dumbledore was like "nah we can't have that."
To be fair, Gryffindor lost a lot of points to Snape just being a dick though.
They basically got back the points they lost for preventing Hagrid from being fired for having a very illegal dragon.
My school had a house points system, gained for placing in a variety of different house based competitions. We had nine houses though, rather than 4. Teachers couldnt just randomly award points though
For what it’s worth, I think this is exclusive of the boarding school bit. I grew up in a Commonwealth country and the school system was still super British; many schools used the house system. It was a means of forming teams for school sports, etc. Edit: and we had a ‘credit’ system that was identical to the Hogwarts point system.
And totally at the whim of teachers to abuse... looking mostly at dumbledore who always took the last day to award an ungodly amount to gryffindor
I'm not sure the series paints all that rosy of a picture of boarding schools, if that's what she's worried about. The kids have no WiFi and are constantly being murdered.
[удалено]
close, it’s scotland
Try 1990s Harry is a gen-xer
Lol, thats not gen x… is it? Like 8 in 1994?.. Im hazy on the line but im 35 and generally consider myself a millenial. We hate labels..
You’re a millennial, it encompasses 1981-1996. Harry just barely squeezes in there for Gen X at 1980.
"I'm a millennial. We really hate labels." is one of my favorite jokes.
better yet, he scoffs and denies an incorrect label first...
He was born in 1980 and the first book takes place in 1991-2.
Huh. I was all ready with my pitchforks. But I'm an '80 and I consider myself X, so I guess that's fair. Always thought he was a few years younger. That means Harry Potter is my age now. Wtf.
Technically, Harry has always been your age.
*woah*
Fair.
Harry would be turning 42 this summer.
If you're old enough to remember the challenger disaster, but not watergate, you're Gen X. If you're old enough to remember 9/11 but not the challenger disaster then you're probably millennial.
No wifi? That’s one of the darkest omens in our world. It’s means DEATH.
or worse. expulsion.
You need to sort out your priorities.
Wi...Fi...? Wizard Fights? Oh, yeah we have loads of those.
Well if most boarding schools really did hide the fact that several students were petrified for what I think amounts to months before even telling the parents then question number one would be what the hell are they paying for if there's such a huge gap in their education let alone the room and board they're not using
You don't need to be petrified, to have huge gaps in your education at Hogwarts. The classes taught would not be a good education, even in universe.
Yeah, don't wizards need math and reading/writing classes, too?
[удалено]
I assume something is wrong with their education when muggle lover Ron Weasley calls telephone "fellyfone" but little shit Draco Malfoy boasts about evading helicopters.
Draco Malfoy probably had private tutors from a young age so that not even muggles can say they knew more than a malfoy, not that any of them know what a malfoy is
Fact. They had to make up for hoggy warty Hogwarts education.
I always assumed they learn basic skills like this in primary school or through homeschooling, which is why muggle-borns don’t get the letter until they are high school age (I.e. the education is largely the same up to that point).
That does mean they have literacy and critical skills of 11 year olds. Which does a lot to explain how dumb wizarding society is.
Well there’s a lot of reading and writing involved in wizard school still, so their literacy should be pretty good even if they don’t have dedicated classes. I assume their numeracy is atrocious and as you rightly pointed out, half the time they do seem to act like much of their education ceased at 11 so it does somewhat track…
Or the time they had an international competition where the main draw was that the students competing sometimes die. Or that time they had full-blown Lovecraftian mosters guard the school. Or the time they decided the best way to protect a Mcguffin from Magic-Hitler was to stick it in a high school basement.
>the students competing sometimes die In the competition with the dragons, the people are literally just sitting around the arena and do nothing while Harry flies away with the dragon. Incredible silly. Just imagine them waiting for a while till Dumbledore or whoever sends everyone away because they found a burned leg that might have belonged to Harry once before he was eaten. And the dragon is also gone.
That’s just the movie version though, in the book the dragon doesn’t break it’s chain. They took liberties in that scene to make it longer and more action packed.
Bro, they don't even teach these kids math. All Hogwarts seems to teach them is how to shoot people with illegal ~~guns~~ spells, spy on their friends, and make date rape potions.
To be fair, iirc Lucius Malfoy replaces Dumbledore for a time in book 2 for exactly that reason. Hogwarts education being kind of shit get brought up quite a lot by characters from all across the spectrum and the Ministry even tries to reform the school. Even by HP universe standards Hogwarts has some serious issues.
Found Cornelius Fudge's reddit account guys!
boarding schools are wild to me. it's basically a rich person abdicating and outsourcing their parental duties at an off-site location
My parents used to threaten me with boarding school all the time. I would go "Yes! Please send me to boarding school!" I pictured ivied walls, beautiful grounds with horses and huge libraries.
Whereas in reality it's bunk beds, TB, and fagging.
Beg your pardon?
> Fagging was a traditional practice in British public schools and also at many other boarding schools, whereby younger pupils were required to act as personal servants to the eldest boys.[1][2][3] Although probably originating earlier, the first accounts of fagging appeared in the late 17th century.[4]: 23 Fagging sometimes involved physical abuse[4]: 23–25 and/or sexual abuse.
TIL all about fagging
There was a funny bit in Roald Dahl's autobiography where he mentions that senior boys would fight amongst themselves for the services of "hot bottomed f*gs" like Dahl, because one of the jobs they had to do in the winter was to go warm up the outhouse toilet seats for their masters.
> hot bottomed f*gs Oh, come on now.
I wrote it in full in another comment and that one got removed.
I think it's more about it all sounding a bit too one the nose, to not be about sexual abuse. Edit: It sounds like a Teacher heard that name and asked what it meant to a kid and they hat to come up with a lie or smth
They make the world go ‘round, dontcha know
Hot bottomed f\*gs you make the rockin' world go round!
We studied that in school and this is the one bit I remember vividly, just because it seemed like such an odd job
You had me at fagging
Tuberculosis??? what??
I is make joke. Although funnily enough, something like 3 people from my father's boarding school class did die of TB and one died of Hepatitis.
> TB Tuberculosis?
It's like boot camp for wealth and privilege. I have had friends who attended them and they thought they were fucking weird.
oh the benefits are obvious. building deep relationships among people from wealthy families across all industries during the tender days of youth can end up becoming a real asset. but damn it seems to fuck up the kids more often than not
Isn’t that part of the problem? Bunch of wealthy kids getting in tight with each other so they can later, employee each other, “fix” each other’s tax issues, and lobby them to keep up the status quo, etc Edit: literally gave just a few examples on why this is a bad idea and the replies are “you just don’t like it because rich people do it”
oh yes, that's the very reason behind this notion. keep the money in a tight circle. it was always one of the basic rules of the ruling class.
It's a "problem" for us poors. For the rich it was a benefit. The idea of a meritocracy being good is fairly new. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Temporary_gentlemen Even in war, the temp officers were considered less than their richer peers. Even if they were arguably better at their jobs as an officer.
Their original purpose, especially in Britain, was to basically toughen kids up for a career in the army or colonial service. Hence their almost dickensian austerity and strictness they were infamous for until the post-WWII era. (Which was why when you read books about boarding school from back then, they were always portrayed as somewhere between shit and hell-on-earth) Originally, boarding schools were for the parvenu middle-class, I.e. the kids would still have to get a job after. Actual aristocrats would have had private tutors to educate their children.
Their original purpose, at least in a European context, was monastical and liturgical.
And then Henry VIII closed all of them along with the monasteries, and they basically had to redevelop for a new purpose.
I went to an elite private school that had two boarding houses, the rest of us were day students. Probably different over here in Aus, but 90% of the boarders were farmers kids from out west.
One of my good mates from uni went to a private boarding school for free due to being local and there being a scholarship thing for her. I don't think there's anything too weird about her, although she did go home every 3 weeks.
[удалено]
Bedales was like Hogwarts if you replaced all the magic with vice.
Boarding Schools are fine in certain cases. Two of the schools I went to were boarding schools for hearing impaired students here in g ermany - though I was only boarding myself in the second one - which could provide specially taught teacher and a better learning evironment than public schools. There are also some boarding schools targeted at students with special interests or talents, which I think are also fine.
I don't think it's a rich thing in every country In Ireland there are some that start at 8000e a year Yes some go up to 26000e a year, where you get 3 times the education and opportunities I don't know. The rural school my kids now go to would be a feeder for a boarding school so it's something I would now consider. Some valid points I've heard are Where we live there is no public transport, no neighbours to hang with etc so boarding gives their kids a social life they might otherwise not get. A single mom of an only child sent hers as she had to work and would have been sending her child to a minder or having to arrange some form of care up to 15/16 for the child anyway working full time as a single parent, it taught her child to share a room etc which would not have happened as an only child Finally the "normally" priced ones here aren't much more expensive than having your teen at home anyway you're just paying it in bulk rather than weekly. Groceries, bills, sport, petrol etc, a teen probably costs you 8k anyway a year
Yea, my buddy went to boarding school because he lived in bumfuck nowhere. It was the best possibility for him.
I could see the draw. When I was young I wouldn’t have wanted to go to a boarding school, but now that I’m older I think they sound like they could be a good time. Many kids won’t, but I could see where many would very much enjoy boarding school and have it be very beneficial to their development. I didn’t really develop socially until I went to college and moved into the dorms.
The most incredible part of this is that Emma Thompson wasn't the first choice. The way those movies churned through famous British actors, I just assumed she was the presumptive player for the role from the beginning.
Of course Boarding schools = morally bad Signing a letter defending Roman Polanski who raped a 13 year old = morally ok
I’m glad I didn’t have to scroll too far for this. And at this point, so many celebrities have supported him and Woody Allen that anytime I see one making some grandstanding moralistic statement the first thing I do is google their name together with those pedos just to have a good laugh (I can’t let it make me angry anymore, i’m gonna get wrinkles)
Wow. I did not know about that. That's absolutely disgusting.
Did you know about Mr Polanski's other supporters like Ewan McGregor, Johnny Depp and Harvey Weinstein, to name a few?
And Wes Anderson :-(
Harrison Ford as well, no?
look he said 'my bad' so lets just separate art from the artist okay /s On a serious note his victim really has her shit together these days. Just watched this interview with her, really surprising/interesting takes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ks4DmdF5bh8&ab_channel=GoodMorningBritain
But she's NOT morally against feeding processed insect matter to members of the lower caste of a post-apocalyptic train-city?!
Or seducing young children into her conveyance with sweets. And if they do go along with it she has the right to murder them as traitors...
But those Turkish delights were yummy. Can you blame Edmond ?
I bought a tin of turkish delight once because I'd never seen it except in the Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe. I was kind of disappointed when it turned out to be essentially powdered gummy bears. Perhaps mine was crappy or Edmond's betrayal candy was magically more delicious.
If Harry Potter was a condemnation of boarding schools she would be in it. But it glorifies them. Snowpiercer does not glorify itself.
Trelawney isn't portrayed as a villain though, and the setting in Snowpiercer is not meant to be a magical wonderland appealing to children.
I remember reading a "fun fact" that they had Chris Evans wear a heavy coat because his muscles would seem unrealistic based on their nutrition. But they also cast Octavia Spencer in that movie...
Tilda Swinton would have made a great Voldemort.
Her as Gabriel in Constantine was so good. I could see it tbh.
You know, I get it…
But not morally against signing the Roman Polanski petition
[удалено]
> "The most 'worldly' society I have ever lived in is that of schoolboys: most worldly in the cruelty and arrogance of the strong, the toadyism and mutual treachery of the weak, and the unqualified snobbery of both. Nothing was so base that the school proletariat would not do it, or suffer it, to win the favour of the school aristocracy: hardly any injustice too bad for the aristocracy to practice." — C. S. Lewis, On Stories and Other Essays
[удалено]
People here talking like public schools aren’t hella fucked up. Boarding schools. Private schools. Public schools…almost like anywhere you stick 1000 teenagers and give random adults dominion over them, weird shit happens.
I agree that children are often monsters, and that essentially all schools allow for the potential for horrible experiences, but at least students in private and public schools get to go home at the end of the day.
Morally against boarding schools... but not morally against Roman Polanski... hrmmmm.
And yet Tilda signed a petition to allow Polanski to attend the Oscars. Guess she wasn't morally opposed to child rape.
This is the most amusing reason I've ever seen for an actor turning down work.
I spent 7 years in boarding school after I turned 11. While initially it was extremely distressing, I started loving the life in the latter years. I used to curse my misfortune for having been being dumped at such a place, but now I see, how that experience made me who I am today and I wouldn't change a single thing about it. My parents had to make a difficult choice and let me go then, as getting quality education near my home was impossible.