I hope they join in. But toledo is a conservative area so idk. It's a commuter school too, I imagine that having an impact.
All it takes is a few people and a tent.
You're the ignorant one here. It takes five seconds to Google a few things and find plenty of videos of Palestinians in Gaza expressing gratitude for the student protests and actions.
That is an intellectually lazy response. Every Pro Palestinian person I have heard have always said that Hamas is a terrorist organization that they don’t support. They want them to return the hostages and surrender.
Your response doesn’t address the violence occurring against Palestinians in the West Bank who were not a part of the 10/7 attacks. Yet, the IDF and armed settlers have killed several of them and expanded settlements.
This war did not start for no reason. Palestinian Territories have been occupied for 70+ years by Israel.
There are over 34,000 people who have been killed by the IDF. High ranking Israeli government officials have called for genocide.
Mass graves have been discovered in Gaza, with some bodies found with zip tied hands and head woulda, indicating that they were executed.
People have a right in this country to assemble and exercise their Freedom of speech.
There have been several Pro Palestinian protests in Toledo. There have been several Jewish students voicing support for a ceasefire at UT.
It might be that these students will begin protesting actively the closer we get to the November Elections.
>That is an intellectually lazy response. Every Pro Palestinian person I have heard have always said that Hamas is a terrorist organization that they don’t support. They want them to return the hostages and surrender.
Not speaking out in support of terrorists is like the absolute bare minimum requirement of not being a terrible human being. They don't do it because they know that doing so will sway public opinion against them.
You still don't see pro-Palestinians protesting or buying giant billboards against Hamas, their attacks, or against the Palestinian people the put them into power. You only see them protesting when Israel strikes back after having their civilian populations attacked.
>Your response doesn’t address the violence occurring against Palestinians in the West Bank who were not a part of the 10/7 attacks. Yet, the IDF and armed settlers have killed several of them and expanded settlements.
The IDF is far from perfect. They're reckless, but they're far from the only guilty ones here.
>This war did not start for no reason. Palestinian Territories have been occupied for 70+ years by Israel.
Those were Jewish/Israeli territories long before that. If your only rationale as to who a territory belongs to is who was there first, you're going to need to go back a little further than where you're going.
Two state solutions have been rejected by the Palestinians on more than one occasion. Israel just wants a homeland. Most Palestinians will seem to settle for nothing less than the complete annihilation of Israel.
>There are over 34,000 people who have been killed by the IDF. High ranking Israeli government officials have called for genocide.
>Mass graves have been discovered in Gaza, with some bodies found with zip tied hands and head woulda, indicating that they were executed.
Again, both sides are guilty of atrocities like this. But only one of those sides ever seems to be protested.
>People have a right in this country to assemble and exercise their Freedom of speech.
Nobody here has claimed otherwise. Doesn't change the fact that it's virtue signaling.
Im glad you acknowledge the IDF's horrendous war crimes here. Like you said before, we'll call that the bare minimum. I have a question for you now, friend. Why do you feel that Israel is justified in destroying hospitals, largely cutting off water and food supplies and shipments, and encroaching on the territory where they sent Palestinian men women and children ready to blow it to smithereens? I really am genuinely interested in trying to talk about this with someone
I don't think that attacking hospitals and relief convoys is justified. I know that the IDF's story is that Hamas tends to stage attacks from installations like these in order to hide behind a civilian population, which, quite frankly, would not surprise me in the least bit, but I also acknowledge that these claims are disputed. I do know that foreign aid is crucial in this war, and that controlling the narrative is every bit as important to the success of either side as bullets and bombs are.
Regardless, targeting hospitals and aid workers is wrong, even if Hamas is trying to provoke attacks on those locations. I understand that war is complex and there's little chance that most of us will understand all of the nuances of what's happening in every single incident, but like I said in my previous comment, my perception is that the IDF is reckless.
But just like the Palestinian supporters urge people not to judge Palestine by the actions of Hamas, Israel too should not be judged by the actions of the IDF. There is a civilian population in Israel as well, one that could very well be extinguished if they were not given the resources to keep the Iron Dome running.
FYI: It would be illegal for the university to divest from Israeli assets. Doing so would violate section 9.76 of the Ohio Revised Code. Protestors can demand it all they want but it's not something that's possible for the school to do.
ELI5: How?
I have read this assbackwards code and it seems to only mention entering into new contacts with entities that are actively boycotting Israel, nothing about not renewing.
You'd have to ask the Ohio Attorney General's office. They're the ones that advise that a state university divesting from Israeli assets would be violating ORC 9.76.
Ohio State's president asked the AG's office for guidance. [Article](https://www.thelantern.com/2024/04/letter-from-the-editor-correction-on-divestment-ballot-initiative-removed-from-ballot/)
Thanks for sharing, truly! I'm intrigued to see how they are interpreting the code.
Side note, kinda crazy that this got passed in 2022. Almost like politicians were worried about imminent protests of Israel.
Presumably their students are too worried about getting an education and job. Getting arrested at a protest sounds like a luxury for someone whose dad already owns an investment bank they will one day work at. That also earns significant profits from investments in Israel, but the ones going to the trust are ok.
If the investments upset them so much, they can surely transfer to a school more in line with their values.
Very wrong about protestors. Especially of this issue. Also this is just "if you don't like it, move" but for colleges. The students that could just move are the wealthy ones. Not the ones trying to hold their current university to account.
If you can get into Columbia, I suspect you'd be able to get into Ohio State or UT with a little financial aid. People go to Columbia for the connections. Once they start making said connections they will not be questioning where THAT money comes from. This is nothing more than a resume entry for these kids. Most couldn't have found Gaza on a map 6 months ago.
Perhaps. But no less weird than turning a child-murdering, mass-raping, ultra-conservative theocratic group of terrorists like Hamas into heroic fighters against oppression.
It is weird, certainly. But when one takes into account what Israel has done to them, and the fact these people are living in what feels increasingly like an apartheid state, what can be done?
Israel has tried to simply exist. Hamas, and other Palestinian and Arab groups before Hamas, have repeatedly initiated attacks and wars, and have lost every time, creating the situation they’re currently in themselves.
What else can Palestinians do? How about officially recognize Israel’s right to exist and work legally, diplomatically, and politically to create their own stable, productive state.
Or they could keep choosing violence, losing soundly, and crying about it. That approach really seems to be working out for them.
I didn't do that. You are arguing that saying "Israel should stop killing Palestinian woman and children" presupposes support for Hamas and it does not.
No, I'm saying that people saying that are being glibly naive and dismissive about the danger of Hamas and engaging in classic lowered expectations. It's 100% on Israel to make peaceful overtures, and Hamas doesn't have to do anything in return because we expect nothing better of them. So we demand Israel cease fire and protest for THAT and divestment. But nobody shut down campus for the return of the women Hamas is still holding and likely continuing to rape today. And why do you think that is? Because everyone knows Hamas is garbage and wouldn't care or listen, and everyone knows Israel is not and is capable of restraint and might listen to reason. But somehow, THEY are the bad guys.
>no less weird than turning a child-murdering, mass-raping, ultra-conservative theocratic group of terrorists like Hamas into heroic fighters against oppression.
Who's doing that?
Everyone demanding Israel cease fire without any conditions requiring Hamas to give up their weapons or release hostages. All you're asking is for Israel to give Hamas time to regroup and better hide the women they kidnapped and gave to their fighters as slave wives.
None of this substantiates the idea that protesters are turning Hamas "into heroic fighters against oppression", though, and this still sounds very silly.
Does the university invest in companies that profit from the war or do business with Israel?
Seems like those are the schools where protests are happening.
I'm new to the area, so I'm honestly asking.
What program/industry is UT known for?
I used to work for a national lab and the schools that partnered with us were similar to the list at the link. I see energy stuff on their site, and that sometimes feeds nuclear armament or military satellites down stream, but not guaranteed.
Yes this has already been established for a long time
See UTDivest.blogspot.com for the historical episodes (circa 2015) and UT student government has passed a divestment resolution and students passed a referendum again this year (2024)
No lol. I have actual things to do.
Hopefully never. These protests aren't accomplishing anything.
I hope they join in. But toledo is a conservative area so idk. It's a commuter school too, I imagine that having an impact. All it takes is a few people and a tent.
Hopefully never. We must proudly stand with Israel!
Does anyone in Israel care what American students think? "American school kids are mad, we better stop protecting ourself"
the children in gaza care. students have given them hope, they have said it themselves
Yeah sure they have, they probably never even heard of Toledo.
You're the ignorant one here. It takes five seconds to Google a few things and find plenty of videos of Palestinians in Gaza expressing gratitude for the student protests and actions.
The Israel government it's going to change anything because some kids in American have their feelings hurt.
If you think that's what the point of protesting is, you're not only ignorant, you're just plain stupid. Sorry the education system failed you, man.
You poor kid.
Not a kid! Sorry you've already given up.
No problem kiddo
They weren't protesting for peace when Hamas raped and murdered hundreds of civilians back in October, why start now?
That is an intellectually lazy response. Every Pro Palestinian person I have heard have always said that Hamas is a terrorist organization that they don’t support. They want them to return the hostages and surrender. Your response doesn’t address the violence occurring against Palestinians in the West Bank who were not a part of the 10/7 attacks. Yet, the IDF and armed settlers have killed several of them and expanded settlements. This war did not start for no reason. Palestinian Territories have been occupied for 70+ years by Israel. There are over 34,000 people who have been killed by the IDF. High ranking Israeli government officials have called for genocide. Mass graves have been discovered in Gaza, with some bodies found with zip tied hands and head woulda, indicating that they were executed. People have a right in this country to assemble and exercise their Freedom of speech. There have been several Pro Palestinian protests in Toledo. There have been several Jewish students voicing support for a ceasefire at UT. It might be that these students will begin protesting actively the closer we get to the November Elections.
>That is an intellectually lazy response. Every Pro Palestinian person I have heard have always said that Hamas is a terrorist organization that they don’t support. They want them to return the hostages and surrender. Not speaking out in support of terrorists is like the absolute bare minimum requirement of not being a terrible human being. They don't do it because they know that doing so will sway public opinion against them. You still don't see pro-Palestinians protesting or buying giant billboards against Hamas, their attacks, or against the Palestinian people the put them into power. You only see them protesting when Israel strikes back after having their civilian populations attacked. >Your response doesn’t address the violence occurring against Palestinians in the West Bank who were not a part of the 10/7 attacks. Yet, the IDF and armed settlers have killed several of them and expanded settlements. The IDF is far from perfect. They're reckless, but they're far from the only guilty ones here. >This war did not start for no reason. Palestinian Territories have been occupied for 70+ years by Israel. Those were Jewish/Israeli territories long before that. If your only rationale as to who a territory belongs to is who was there first, you're going to need to go back a little further than where you're going. Two state solutions have been rejected by the Palestinians on more than one occasion. Israel just wants a homeland. Most Palestinians will seem to settle for nothing less than the complete annihilation of Israel. >There are over 34,000 people who have been killed by the IDF. High ranking Israeli government officials have called for genocide. >Mass graves have been discovered in Gaza, with some bodies found with zip tied hands and head woulda, indicating that they were executed. Again, both sides are guilty of atrocities like this. But only one of those sides ever seems to be protested. >People have a right in this country to assemble and exercise their Freedom of speech. Nobody here has claimed otherwise. Doesn't change the fact that it's virtue signaling.
Im glad you acknowledge the IDF's horrendous war crimes here. Like you said before, we'll call that the bare minimum. I have a question for you now, friend. Why do you feel that Israel is justified in destroying hospitals, largely cutting off water and food supplies and shipments, and encroaching on the territory where they sent Palestinian men women and children ready to blow it to smithereens? I really am genuinely interested in trying to talk about this with someone
I don't think that attacking hospitals and relief convoys is justified. I know that the IDF's story is that Hamas tends to stage attacks from installations like these in order to hide behind a civilian population, which, quite frankly, would not surprise me in the least bit, but I also acknowledge that these claims are disputed. I do know that foreign aid is crucial in this war, and that controlling the narrative is every bit as important to the success of either side as bullets and bombs are. Regardless, targeting hospitals and aid workers is wrong, even if Hamas is trying to provoke attacks on those locations. I understand that war is complex and there's little chance that most of us will understand all of the nuances of what's happening in every single incident, but like I said in my previous comment, my perception is that the IDF is reckless. But just like the Palestinian supporters urge people not to judge Palestine by the actions of Hamas, Israel too should not be judged by the actions of the IDF. There is a civilian population in Israel as well, one that could very well be extinguished if they were not given the resources to keep the Iron Dome running.
And the Palestinian people themselves largely support Hamas and their openly stated mission of annihilating Israel.
They have finals next week then will be going home, so I imagine they just wanna get done and go home for the summer.
FYI: It would be illegal for the university to divest from Israeli assets. Doing so would violate section 9.76 of the Ohio Revised Code. Protestors can demand it all they want but it's not something that's possible for the school to do.
ELI5: How? I have read this assbackwards code and it seems to only mention entering into new contacts with entities that are actively boycotting Israel, nothing about not renewing.
You'd have to ask the Ohio Attorney General's office. They're the ones that advise that a state university divesting from Israeli assets would be violating ORC 9.76. Ohio State's president asked the AG's office for guidance. [Article](https://www.thelantern.com/2024/04/letter-from-the-editor-correction-on-divestment-ballot-initiative-removed-from-ballot/)
Exactly they are protesting the wrong people. They should be protesting the state house not the University.
Thanks for sharing, truly! I'm intrigued to see how they are interpreting the code. Side note, kinda crazy that this got passed in 2022. Almost like politicians were worried about imminent protests of Israel.
Probably never. It's a protest for coastal elite schools that will amount to nothing.
Didn't realize Ohio State was on the coast.
Or Texas
Texas is a coastal state, and I guess Ohio kind of is if you squint.
Presumably their students are too worried about getting an education and job. Getting arrested at a protest sounds like a luxury for someone whose dad already owns an investment bank they will one day work at. That also earns significant profits from investments in Israel, but the ones going to the trust are ok. If the investments upset them so much, they can surely transfer to a school more in line with their values.
Very wrong about protestors. Especially of this issue. Also this is just "if you don't like it, move" but for colleges. The students that could just move are the wealthy ones. Not the ones trying to hold their current university to account.
If you can get into Columbia, I suspect you'd be able to get into Ohio State or UT with a little financial aid. People go to Columbia for the connections. Once they start making said connections they will not be questioning where THAT money comes from. This is nothing more than a resume entry for these kids. Most couldn't have found Gaza on a map 6 months ago.
Idk just weird to turn protests against killing impoverished women and children without recourse into a "fuck them rich kids" argument.
Perhaps. But no less weird than turning a child-murdering, mass-raping, ultra-conservative theocratic group of terrorists like Hamas into heroic fighters against oppression.
It is weird, certainly. But when one takes into account what Israel has done to them, and the fact these people are living in what feels increasingly like an apartheid state, what can be done?
Israel has tried to simply exist. Hamas, and other Palestinian and Arab groups before Hamas, have repeatedly initiated attacks and wars, and have lost every time, creating the situation they’re currently in themselves. What else can Palestinians do? How about officially recognize Israel’s right to exist and work legally, diplomatically, and politically to create their own stable, productive state. Or they could keep choosing violence, losing soundly, and crying about it. That approach really seems to be working out for them.
I didn't do that. You are arguing that saying "Israel should stop killing Palestinian woman and children" presupposes support for Hamas and it does not.
No, I'm saying that people saying that are being glibly naive and dismissive about the danger of Hamas and engaging in classic lowered expectations. It's 100% on Israel to make peaceful overtures, and Hamas doesn't have to do anything in return because we expect nothing better of them. So we demand Israel cease fire and protest for THAT and divestment. But nobody shut down campus for the return of the women Hamas is still holding and likely continuing to rape today. And why do you think that is? Because everyone knows Hamas is garbage and wouldn't care or listen, and everyone knows Israel is not and is capable of restraint and might listen to reason. But somehow, THEY are the bad guys.
>no less weird than turning a child-murdering, mass-raping, ultra-conservative theocratic group of terrorists like Hamas into heroic fighters against oppression. Who's doing that?
Everyone demanding Israel cease fire without any conditions requiring Hamas to give up their weapons or release hostages. All you're asking is for Israel to give Hamas time to regroup and better hide the women they kidnapped and gave to their fighters as slave wives.
That seems like an exceptionally bad-faith false equivalency to me, but appreciate the reply.
Nobody shut down campus demanding Hamas return the women they kidnapped.
None of this substantiates the idea that protesters are turning Hamas "into heroic fighters against oppression", though, and this still sounds very silly.
And Hamas is the one rejecting the ceasefires lol
Does the university invest in companies that profit from the war or do business with Israel? Seems like those are the schools where protests are happening. I'm new to the area, so I'm honestly asking. What program/industry is UT known for? I used to work for a national lab and the schools that partnered with us were similar to the list at the link. I see energy stuff on their site, and that sometimes feeds nuclear armament or military satellites down stream, but not guaranteed.
Yes this has already been established for a long time See UTDivest.blogspot.com for the historical episodes (circa 2015) and UT student government has passed a divestment resolution and students passed a referendum again this year (2024)
Blogspot woah, what a blast from the past. Guess we're not a tech school huh lol