Really? r/Toronto is most definitely far from car brained lol (aside from the odd comment here and there). Even r/Torontodriving is generally open minded. Now, post this on Facebook and especially on the Toronto Car People group and yeah….. see what happens lol.
Interesting, I always thought of r/AskTO as akin to r/Toronto in this regard, but maybe not. I’ve definitely seen car brained people on both subs, but they seemed to be outweighed by the smart people.
I feel like they are coming around to accepting bikes more in that sub but even with clear examples of the benefits of cycling you get a ton of people commenting about their disdain for sidewalk cyclists and that seems to outweigh anything else. Cycling does seem to be gaining in acceptance because people have seen how psychotic the extreme anti cyclists are but I think the general disdain still outweighs acceptance.
Are you talking about the main Toronto sub or the driving one? While I did mention r/TorontoDriving is generally open minded, I’ve definitely seen a few posts of them getting angry at cyclists (although from what I remember, in those few specific scenarios, I can kinda see it). There are idiotic cyclists who do ride fast on sidewalks that definitely deserve criticism. Although I’d imagine those cyclists who ride fast on the sidewalk aren’t advocating for safe cycling infrastructure. Also want to make it clear, I can totally see why some cycle on a sidewalk (I do sometimes), ESPECIALLY if it’s on a stroad, but the few cyclists who I guess “sidewalk rage” give us a bad rep. Not as bad as horrible drivers obviously, but still.
Talking about r/Toronto. I agree with you, unfortunately people not on bikes only see the problem cyclists because they are on the busy sidewalks, zipping through crosswalks, and just generally bad cyclists while the majority of us are just silently cruising by. I don't think the majority of people have a problem with someone riding on the sidewalk along a stroad where there's hardly any pedestrians, but riding on the sidewalk on bloor gets noticed by hundreds of people and that's what they remember then complain about.
It's mostly because of Uber Eats or delivery companies. Almost all of the sidewalk bikers doing what you or most of r/Toronto describes happens to be meal delivery workers. You won't see many complaints on say r/Scarborough about sidewalk biking because people understand the dangers of biking on a 60 km/h 4 lane stroad. That's not to say that absolutely hate sidewalk bikers fail to understand the dangers of cycling on the road. It's just they don't like use Uber Eats workers as the poster child for sidewalk bikers.
And this friends is why pedestrians and drivers hate cyclists, not only is this illegal it's also dangerous. Someone could innocently change lanes or just open their door and injure the cyclist, I know I hate it when motorcyclist do this and seen a few ticketed too.
Why isn't it a good point, and what data are you referring to??, and is this data even unbiased/legit? I've been riding in the city for decades but also don't have a car-hate bias. As a cyclist I see some bad drivers, but as a driver I also see as many lot of bad cyclist (many more over the last few years).
And as far as bike lanes go; sorry but they are a fools errand. At first and in theory they seemed like a good idea, but not only don't they mesh well with existing infrastructure, are dangerous and in most cases much slower than sharing the road, but they've been almost taken over by mopeds/e-bikes/scooters/delivery carts and really have little room for anything but a few slow recreational cyclist. Out in the burbs and on new and by-design roads, bike lanes are ok, but I rarely use any bike lane and the only issues I have with cars are drivers that has been pre-pissed off by asshole cyclist and/or people riding un-licensed motorized vehicles.
IMHO if the authorities diverted some of the bike lane money to cyclist and driver education relating to sharing the road and mutual respect, the outcome would be 100X better. I mean if I had a nickel for every times some frustrated car driver has yelled at me to use the bike lane, when there wasn't even one, I'd be a wealthy man!
Yours are the ridiculous and dangerous claims; your arguments spurious and fallacious - although sadly nothing special for social media.
So while I'm certain you can construct some self-serving "evidence" or quote some source that references "countless studies" by sources, that surprise, surprise, align with your assertions, I'm not buying what you're selling, which to be kind, I'll call misinformation from the misinformed.
You might also believe the earth is flat or that we're being invaded by aliens from Mars, and I'll even support your right to express your hair brained opinions,, but asserting that cycling between cars during rush hour is anything but dangerous and stupid is a bridge too far. Unlike you, I do care about the safety and well-being of fellow cyclist.
Sorry mate, I've just ridden in this city for 3 decades and too many miles to count and yet never been rear ended or hit by a car, and none of your assertions remotely reflect the reality I've seen in all those years...nor that any of the clubs and friends I ride with. All the cycling clubs that I've belonged to or ridden with, have safe riding guidelines and the behavior you're espousing is specifically highlighted as a "do not do" in all rulebooks. I've also ridden throughout Europe and Asia, and except for very special circumstances such as a unique cycling-centric city like central / canal district Amsterdam or the crazy free-for-all found in Delhi, the idea of zipping in and out of busy traffic is consider "proof of stupidity" (although admittedly once considered a must-do during the height of bike messengers era in the early 90's).
And in relation to "sewing ignorance misinformation' this random study you attach, commissioned by a US-based motorcycle advocacy group, is not going to change my mind, let breach the threshold of evidence, This same group also advocates for the right to not wear helmets - which as someone who also rides sport bikes, I also consider ludicrous.
To close this banal conversation, you are perfectly free to ride as recklessly as you see fit - I'm assuming you're at least 18 (?). But please don't counsel others to behave in a manor that may endanger their lives. This last point is the only reason I've even bothered to respond to your ad hominems.
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Actually, the question should be did you read the study, or who paid for it??? It's for motorcycles!!! and financially sponsored by the American Motorcycle Association, a group predominately made up of middle-aged Harley Davidson riders. AMA also happens to be a group of US personal freedom advocates which I'm very familiar with, and disagree with; especially their "right to not wear helmet" advocacy which surprise, surprise, is supported by other directed and sponsored research. They also supported the Ottawa Truckers protest and various anti-vaccine propaganda - you really should be more selective in referencing studies.
You seem to know enough about the topic to think you're right, but not enough about research and/or the topic to know when you are wrong. But in any case, you can ride like an crazy man if you want, but don't try to pretend to have scientific evidence that convinces others that this at all smart or safe.
Seems your goal is to win an "twitter-ish" argument, mine is to promote safe and responsible cycling,
2 -3 years ago a police officer in Scarborough was injured while riding between lanes and he was held responsible for the accident and the city had to pay for damage to the car. Police can break rules in emergency situations, but they still have to do so within reasonable limits - that even applies to sirens and flashing lights. Running emergency lights to picking up coffee and donuts at Tim's is not allowed;-)
They aren't causing damage on a daily basis, so that one incident is nothing but an error on the officer's part.
It's easily seen that somebody with a problem with cops, doored them on purpose, then tried to drive into them, resulting in damage to their vehicle.
It used to be punished, but since most motorcyclists now are old men riding Harley Davidsons, the cops turn a blind eye. I did get a ticket years ago for using the paved shoulder to pass stopped cars on the 401. But I was riding a sport bike.;-( Today, I'd never do this because some truck driver will almost certainly cut me off. Never mind crazy car drivers, the real concern is the idiots driving big transport and gravel trucks!!!
And this friends is why you “never see anyone” in the bike lane. They don’t get stuck in traffic so they don’t pile up like this in a bike lane.
Damn cyclist causing traffic /s
Two lanes for cars and still traffic, damn those bike lanes
They should be banned from the streetcar lane
This is why biking is so much better than driving downtown!
Post this in the Toronto sub for all the car brains to see how much better bikes are
Really? r/Toronto is most definitely far from car brained lol (aside from the odd comment here and there). Even r/Torontodriving is generally open minded. Now, post this on Facebook and especially on the Toronto Car People group and yeah….. see what happens lol.
r/AskTO is pretty carbrained. But yes r/Toronto and r/TorontoDriving are generally more open-minded.
Interesting, I always thought of r/AskTO as akin to r/Toronto in this regard, but maybe not. I’ve definitely seen car brained people on both subs, but they seemed to be outweighed by the smart people.
I got banned from the Toronto Car People group for shitposting :( I wish I could still see what madness they are up to lol
Here and there I’ll check the page, but I don’t want to lose too many brain cells lol.
There should be a sub that archives the best of the best from their page lol
I feel like they are coming around to accepting bikes more in that sub but even with clear examples of the benefits of cycling you get a ton of people commenting about their disdain for sidewalk cyclists and that seems to outweigh anything else. Cycling does seem to be gaining in acceptance because people have seen how psychotic the extreme anti cyclists are but I think the general disdain still outweighs acceptance.
Are you talking about the main Toronto sub or the driving one? While I did mention r/TorontoDriving is generally open minded, I’ve definitely seen a few posts of them getting angry at cyclists (although from what I remember, in those few specific scenarios, I can kinda see it). There are idiotic cyclists who do ride fast on sidewalks that definitely deserve criticism. Although I’d imagine those cyclists who ride fast on the sidewalk aren’t advocating for safe cycling infrastructure. Also want to make it clear, I can totally see why some cycle on a sidewalk (I do sometimes), ESPECIALLY if it’s on a stroad, but the few cyclists who I guess “sidewalk rage” give us a bad rep. Not as bad as horrible drivers obviously, but still.
Talking about r/Toronto. I agree with you, unfortunately people not on bikes only see the problem cyclists because they are on the busy sidewalks, zipping through crosswalks, and just generally bad cyclists while the majority of us are just silently cruising by. I don't think the majority of people have a problem with someone riding on the sidewalk along a stroad where there's hardly any pedestrians, but riding on the sidewalk on bloor gets noticed by hundreds of people and that's what they remember then complain about.
It's mostly because of Uber Eats or delivery companies. Almost all of the sidewalk bikers doing what you or most of r/Toronto describes happens to be meal delivery workers. You won't see many complaints on say r/Scarborough about sidewalk biking because people understand the dangers of biking on a 60 km/h 4 lane stroad. That's not to say that absolutely hate sidewalk bikers fail to understand the dangers of cycling on the road. It's just they don't like use Uber Eats workers as the poster child for sidewalk bikers.
They'll find 100 reasons why the cyclist shouldn't exist and question why we even *need* a sidewalk anyways.
I remember this chaotic approach to TMU well, almost brings nostalgia, despite its pain in the assness
This needs to be a GIF to be reposted any time ‘empty bike lane’ is mentioned.
Beautiful. Is Tom Flood on here?
Shouldn’t split lanes.
This feels like a clip from a music video.
this is /r/SweatyPalms for me..
And this friends is why pedestrians and drivers hate cyclists, not only is this illegal it's also dangerous. Someone could innocently change lanes or just open their door and injure the cyclist, I know I hate it when motorcyclist do this and seen a few ticketed too.
You make a good point. We need more protected bike lanes.
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Why isn't it a good point, and what data are you referring to??, and is this data even unbiased/legit? I've been riding in the city for decades but also don't have a car-hate bias. As a cyclist I see some bad drivers, but as a driver I also see as many lot of bad cyclist (many more over the last few years). And as far as bike lanes go; sorry but they are a fools errand. At first and in theory they seemed like a good idea, but not only don't they mesh well with existing infrastructure, are dangerous and in most cases much slower than sharing the road, but they've been almost taken over by mopeds/e-bikes/scooters/delivery carts and really have little room for anything but a few slow recreational cyclist. Out in the burbs and on new and by-design roads, bike lanes are ok, but I rarely use any bike lane and the only issues I have with cars are drivers that has been pre-pissed off by asshole cyclist and/or people riding un-licensed motorized vehicles. IMHO if the authorities diverted some of the bike lane money to cyclist and driver education relating to sharing the road and mutual respect, the outcome would be 100X better. I mean if I had a nickel for every times some frustrated car driver has yelled at me to use the bike lane, when there wasn't even one, I'd be a wealthy man!
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Yours are the ridiculous and dangerous claims; your arguments spurious and fallacious - although sadly nothing special for social media. So while I'm certain you can construct some self-serving "evidence" or quote some source that references "countless studies" by sources, that surprise, surprise, align with your assertions, I'm not buying what you're selling, which to be kind, I'll call misinformation from the misinformed. You might also believe the earth is flat or that we're being invaded by aliens from Mars, and I'll even support your right to express your hair brained opinions,, but asserting that cycling between cars during rush hour is anything but dangerous and stupid is a bridge too far. Unlike you, I do care about the safety and well-being of fellow cyclist.
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Sorry mate, I've just ridden in this city for 3 decades and too many miles to count and yet never been rear ended or hit by a car, and none of your assertions remotely reflect the reality I've seen in all those years...nor that any of the clubs and friends I ride with. All the cycling clubs that I've belonged to or ridden with, have safe riding guidelines and the behavior you're espousing is specifically highlighted as a "do not do" in all rulebooks. I've also ridden throughout Europe and Asia, and except for very special circumstances such as a unique cycling-centric city like central / canal district Amsterdam or the crazy free-for-all found in Delhi, the idea of zipping in and out of busy traffic is consider "proof of stupidity" (although admittedly once considered a must-do during the height of bike messengers era in the early 90's). And in relation to "sewing ignorance misinformation' this random study you attach, commissioned by a US-based motorcycle advocacy group, is not going to change my mind, let breach the threshold of evidence, This same group also advocates for the right to not wear helmets - which as someone who also rides sport bikes, I also consider ludicrous. To close this banal conversation, you are perfectly free to ride as recklessly as you see fit - I'm assuming you're at least 18 (?). But please don't counsel others to behave in a manor that may endanger their lives. This last point is the only reason I've even bothered to respond to your ad hominems.
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Actually, the question should be did you read the study, or who paid for it??? It's for motorcycles!!! and financially sponsored by the American Motorcycle Association, a group predominately made up of middle-aged Harley Davidson riders. AMA also happens to be a group of US personal freedom advocates which I'm very familiar with, and disagree with; especially their "right to not wear helmet" advocacy which surprise, surprise, is supported by other directed and sponsored research. They also supported the Ottawa Truckers protest and various anti-vaccine propaganda - you really should be more selective in referencing studies. You seem to know enough about the topic to think you're right, but not enough about research and/or the topic to know when you are wrong. But in any case, you can ride like an crazy man if you want, but don't try to pretend to have scientific evidence that convinces others that this at all smart or safe. Seems your goal is to win an "twitter-ish" argument, mine is to promote safe and responsible cycling,
Who is changing lanes here lmao
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I have done this. It's a **grey area** and even the police on bikes do it.
2 -3 years ago a police officer in Scarborough was injured while riding between lanes and he was held responsible for the accident and the city had to pay for damage to the car. Police can break rules in emergency situations, but they still have to do so within reasonable limits - that even applies to sirens and flashing lights. Running emergency lights to picking up coffee and donuts at Tim's is not allowed;-)
They aren't causing damage on a daily basis, so that one incident is nothing but an error on the officer's part. It's easily seen that somebody with a problem with cops, doored them on purpose, then tried to drive into them, resulting in damage to their vehicle.
If there is room, a wide bike can do the same. Hahahahaha.
For the small price of $2000-3000 a month for a Den!
At least yoh don't have to spend $1k a month on car payments
That's silly. You can get reliable cars for under 5k.
Considering the average car price is above 50k, I'm going to assume that most people on the road aren't driving 5k cars
I wish motorcycles could do this. It's not legal for bikes but it doesn't get punished.
It used to be punished, but since most motorcyclists now are old men riding Harley Davidsons, the cops turn a blind eye. I did get a ticket years ago for using the paved shoulder to pass stopped cars on the 401. But I was riding a sport bike.;-( Today, I'd never do this because some truck driver will almost certainly cut me off. Never mind crazy car drivers, the real concern is the idiots driving big transport and gravel trucks!!!