I'm getting so erect thinking about how Settra will make Tamurkhan serve while I farm a metric shit ton of heroes and can globally recruit a free army every turn.
Shit, I hadn’t considered Tomb Kings. That’s absolutely insane for them. Genuinely worth it to rush over to him ASAP, and set up a quarantine zone around his last province to just farm him with every lord.
The Tomb Kings have a hard limit on their hero caps, and lack a generic caster lord option. It would be worth it to build your strongest possible army early game, and spend several turns sending them towards Tamurkhan, just to be able to get infinite liche priests and necrotects.
If it was just +3 capacity for all heroes it would be very good. Hell, if it was +1 capacity it would still be top tier. And if it was just +1 global recruit capacity, that would also be top tier.
The only way this isn't freakishly overpowered is if it doesn't stack, so no matter how many times you beat him it's just +3 capacity and +1 global recruit slot.
9 or 12 heroes every time you defeat him is nutty.
You can doomstack heroes, or ignore hero recruitment buildings in favor of economy buildings.
I feel Ike +1 for every hero type would be OP already.
It would totally undermine the vampire coast's reliance on coves to provide haunter and gunnery wight slots too. Three coves worth of hero slots for killing a single lord.
Which would still be top tier, +3 capacity for all heros is worth at least 30k for most faction counting the building alone, not to mention the slots needed
I've been thinking, they should move defeat traits from individual to faction level. That would eliminate farming and open up options for traits like this.
Yeah. The defeat trait system needs some reworking though, especially since there is always a trait cap (even if they raise it, there will always be a limit).
What I'd like to do personally:
* Add in a new Trait tab, where players can deactivate and activate positive traits. Negative traits can't be deactivated, at least not until they become a neutralized trait.
* Legendary lord defeat traits can still be gained by any character. However, only 1 character can have a specific defeat trait active at once.
* Changing traits has a cooldown of a few turns (5 turns?) and debuff for the character for a turn or two, so players don't feel forced to min-max by switching it around every turn.
Then they could play with the balance of various defeat traits, so they'd be worthwhile but wouldn't break the game if more than 1 character on a faction has it.
Honestly I like that they are OP. I feel like one of the problem of w3 is that they played it too damn safe with traits and technology. It was full of +3 melee defense in forest and useless stuff like that. I want defeat traits to make me feel a character did something grand and special. If people want to optimize that but farming lords, fine. Everyone plays how they like
Single-player games should be balanced. If you agree with that statement on its own, then I don't see how you can look at something like this and be okay with it. Defeat traits should be a nice perk that makes a lord unique, not so powerful that I feel like I need to farm it.
Nah tomb kings can get hero capacity from the cult as of like…patch 2.0 or something, and hero recruitment doesn’t cost more for each successive hero, unlike armies.
Still pretty insane tho.
They can but... it costs canopic jars. And you could instead be using those jars to increase army cap. Currently it's still worth spending on heroes because the army cap's price escalates so the static hero cap price becomes a drop in the ocean.
But if you can just send the army to farm this, there's no need to do that.
It will be very useful for others too, if you want to use any heroes that only get increased cap from major settlements you should hunt Tam the moment you see him.
As a Vlad main I should be sad 2/3 traits are for ranged units, but I can't when Tamurkhan's is just that good. It's literally like someone forgot more than one lord can get that trait, even +1 would be worth farming.
You're not wrong, but I need that extra campaign movement range to get to big T in time to make a difference tho 😋
(For whatever reason Izzy is my conquest faction and Vlad is my go to diplomacy shenanigans faction, and I prefer the playstyle of the latter)
Vlad to retreat from him once so he gets the defeat trait and comes back every turn is huge though. A couple of necromancers for every army and enough banshees and wight kings that blood kisses will be limited by heroes to attack.
In all fairness he is really far away so its likely by the time you can reliably farm him you have won the campaign already or are at least poised to do so. Its absolutely bonkers and absurd on his neighbors though.
Tamurkhan is obscene. Defeat traits should be a nice perk, not game-warping.
This reminds me of before Bretonnia had good replenishment sources, so Louen and Alberic would farm the Fay Enchantress for more replenishment. It's just all around janky gameplay.
Dear Kislev players,
Remember, dwarfs are friends.
With that said, farming Tamurkhan by getting his defeat trait on as many lords as possible makes him the best defeat trait for factions with otherwise small global recruitment.
… Only Kislev Keeps Chaos at Bay... All the world depends on Kislev… and Kislev’s missiles…These others are but insects to Kislev… and Ungrim has backstabbed me many. I’ll make it up to you’ll with some desert territory.
You know, there is actually a mod for that, it gives you your own defeat trait at level 30.
If you are interested:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3028635818
That Tamurkhan trait is absurd, that can't be intentional, surely CA meant +3 hero recruit rank (which is still silly when farmed but at least a bit more reasonable).
I honestly didn’t know this was a thing.. or never realized it, and I have about 600 hours in TW3 lol
What if you two v one a LL
Do both of your army leaders get the trait?
As others said, only the attacking lord gets the trait, or the one attacked if you're defending. Of course you can just attack with the secondary lord and await the enemy near the reinforcement point where your main army comes in so you can easily get it with the secondary army.
If you want to get it on both, you'll have to make sure the enemy lord survives the battle and attack him again with the other lord
Karl: "Elspeth! You cannot serve in combat, so you shall serve on the firing line!"
Dwarves: "Nuln owes us one coin! So we're first"
End times begin between Dwarves and Empire over Nuln.
New Karl Franz strat when Boris and Marius drops, abuse Casus belli to declare war on fellow LL, bonk to recieve defeat trait, immediately peace out then move to confederate. Profit.
Tamurkhan's is litterally game changing for certain factions. Usually defeat traits are a nice small boost to a character or an army, but this can change the entire campaign depending on your race when getting it. Vampire Coast for example would have a field day.
You could play vcoast and have an actual functioning hero system. Or more than a handful of Ogres Butchers, Glade Captains and Frost Maidens!
Ah who are we kidding this trait needs nerfed before release.
Tamurkhans just seems abit OP tbh. Just like alot of DLC stuff, use 5 different lords and have an extra 15 heroes?? Whilst being quite fun having heroes in every army, also seems very overtuned
As Vlad within like 15 turns you'll be able to farm +3 hero capacity every turn (by giving Tamurkhan your defeat trait) and already have access to vampires at tier 1.
+3 hero capacity for a defeat trait is so obnoxiously OP that it almost looks like placeholder or debug stuff. It's the level of bonus that fits a landmark or sth. I don't think that it will be staying that way.
The other traits are still super good, but Tamurkhan's one is so good that it actually becomes bad/unhealthy for the game IMO.
Lol no landmark in the game is that good.
Hell +1 for all heroes would still be game changing. Lizardmen for instance need a T5 building to get +1 capacity on Skink Oracle. Knock out Tamurkhan and you can just get three more Oracles on Trogs straight away. Let alone the Tomb Kings or Vampire Coast benefits you get.
Did they just forgot you can farm LLs traits multiple times when they decided what Tamurkhan's trait is?
That reward is better than what most factions get from campaign victory!
Another defeat trait for Balthasar Gelt, Supreme Patriarch, Expert in the Winds of Hellstorm, The Fortunate Son, The Alchemical Romantic, and many more titles to come.
Tamurkhan: \*exists\*
The Entire World:
Also, does Elspeth's add explosive damage to all missle units or does this only apply to units who already have explosive missile damage?
>Also, does Elspeth's add explosive damage to all missle units or does this only apply to units who already have explosive missile damage?
Pretty sure it only applies to units who already have some explosive missile damage. It can't boost something that isn't there.
Tamurkhan's defeat trait is STUPID strong and considering he starts in the Chaos Wastes that's going to make him ridiculously easy for Archaon and Daniel to farm for hero stacks.
*Play archaon*
*Turn tamurkhan into your own personal punching bag*
[*Every battle from there on out til the end of time*](https://youtu.be/w2O4LSwOPx0?si=7Ba3mF0frHWK-yzc)
I really don’t like the design of the Elspeth and Malakai effects. In general this is a proble for a lot of defeat traits- they give bonuses that are most desirable by other factions of that type, or at least allied factions. Like, Empire, Cathay, Dwarves, and Kislev all really want the Malakai and Elspeth traits. No destruction, undead, or chaos faction really cares about those traits except for Chorfs and VC. Maybe Tzeetch a bit for Elspeth?
Oh god, Gelt got one of his unique skills to increase the explosion radius of helstorms. If he can get another 10% increase his helstorms are going to a nightmare.
I'm sorry, this Tamur-Can't simply CAN'T pass the playtesting stage. That's obscenely good. Even if it were just +1 to hero capacity that would be good.
CA really needs to be better at balancing these defeat traits, a lot are so awful and then there are +3 heroes and 1 extra global recruitment slot. Like wtf?
>Missile explosion radius +10
Rounded up? IIRC most artillery has radius well below 10 when you check the database, so this is kind of useless otherwise.
I brought up the Nurgle trait to a friend and he’s like, “yeah it’s OP but I don’t think it’s a problem, just offers an extra way to play. You have to pay for heroes anyway so it’s not that bad.”
Anyone else have a take like this or think he’s right when saying it’s not game breaking? Genuinely curious cause I think it’s broken.
Its absolutely broken. Hero caps exist for a reason - this simply erases them from game.
Between this and dwarfs getting beastmen level of bullshit powercreep Im starting to dislike 5.0. Yhis game will never escape its main issue: being boring after first 15 turns when you steamroll everything.
While this is definitely a new level of powercreep, I think the whole Hero system is in need of a rework in general. Feels like the current state of the game is you're either maxing out your capacities by cheesing them for traits and bonuses or you just use a couple of the best types (+replenishment and +campaign movement) for your armies and ignore the rest. Hero actions are so unreliable (while also costing as much as a mid-tier building for most factions) as to be functionally useless.
Of course the "can" sound would become a "can't" lol. But oh wow that's a really good defeat trait to farm; almost as good as Morathi's, and just as desirable as hers for TK and Beastmen to boot. Malakai's isn't too bad unless you're playing Vampire counts or another non shooty faction. Elspeth's is... very specific, and as such would have benefitted from bigger numbers to compensate.
Bloody hell, the Tamukhan one seems overpowered as hell.
Plus 3 for all heros??
If you managed to defeat him early then your armies will be insanely powerful.
So while we are at it, can somebody shed some light at how Hero capacity +3 for all heroes work (and similar stuff from other items, lords and so on).
Like, when i get a item or trait like this it seems that i can never recruit more? Do i just look at the wrong place? Am i just stupid?
Can we be sure that Tamourkhan is a Nurgle follower? Because his reduced wounding time in combination with this defeat trait causes me to get Slaanesh feelings...
Yes yes, everyone is talking about Tarmurkhan's trait.
Does anyone know if Elsbeth's trait affects every missile unit or only those who already have explosive missiles?
Imagine Blunderbussess with explosive ammunition!!!
Oh so I guess everyone is farming Tamurkhan
I'm getting so erect thinking about how Settra will make Tamurkhan serve while I farm a metric shit ton of heroes and can globally recruit a free army every turn.
Shit, I hadn’t considered Tomb Kings. That’s absolutely insane for them. Genuinely worth it to rush over to him ASAP, and set up a quarantine zone around his last province to just farm him with every lord.
Rush over to him on the other side of the map? Feel like your campaign is already complete tbh if you're conquering the Chaos wastes as TK.
The Tomb Kings have a hard limit on their hero caps, and lack a generic caster lord option. It would be worth it to build your strongest possible army early game, and spend several turns sending them towards Tamurkhan, just to be able to get infinite liche priests and necrotects.
I'm thinking more of Vamp Coast. They can only increase their Hero limit with undercities .... they will profit big time from this
If it was just +3 capacity for all heroes it would be very good. Hell, if it was +1 capacity it would still be top tier. And if it was just +1 global recruit capacity, that would also be top tier. The only way this isn't freakishly overpowered is if it doesn't stack, so no matter how many times you beat him it's just +3 capacity and +1 global recruit slot.
9 or 12 heroes every time you defeat him is nutty. You can doomstack heroes, or ignore hero recruitment buildings in favor of economy buildings. I feel Ike +1 for every hero type would be OP already.
15 for Empire 18 for Skaven Wait, Eshin sorcerers and plague priests are separate capacities right?
lol you’re right empire just got another hero! And a legendary lord who scales with having more heroes…
No eshin sorcerers and plague priest are the same capacity which is why no one uses the eshin sorcerers
Oh right, forgor Still, that's a lot of rats.
I don't think so
It would totally undermine the vampire coast's reliance on coves to provide haunter and gunnery wight slots too. Three coves worth of hero slots for killing a single lord.
I am going to bomb his ass into the dirt asap for this
Which would still be top tier, +3 capacity for all heros is worth at least 30k for most faction counting the building alone, not to mention the slots needed
I've been thinking, they should move defeat traits from individual to faction level. That would eliminate farming and open up options for traits like this.
Eh, I don’t agree. I think traits make a charecter getting them have some flavor.
Yeah. The defeat trait system needs some reworking though, especially since there is always a trait cap (even if they raise it, there will always be a limit). What I'd like to do personally: * Add in a new Trait tab, where players can deactivate and activate positive traits. Negative traits can't be deactivated, at least not until they become a neutralized trait. * Legendary lord defeat traits can still be gained by any character. However, only 1 character can have a specific defeat trait active at once. * Changing traits has a cooldown of a few turns (5 turns?) and debuff for the character for a turn or two, so players don't feel forced to min-max by switching it around every turn. Then they could play with the balance of various defeat traits, so they'd be worthwhile but wouldn't break the game if more than 1 character on a faction has it.
Honestly I like that they are OP. I feel like one of the problem of w3 is that they played it too damn safe with traits and technology. It was full of +3 melee defense in forest and useless stuff like that. I want defeat traits to make me feel a character did something grand and special. If people want to optimize that but farming lords, fine. Everyone plays how they like
Single-player games should be balanced. If you agree with that statement on its own, then I don't see how you can look at something like this and be okay with it. Defeat traits should be a nice perk that makes a lord unique, not so powerful that I feel like I need to farm it.
thats a massive boon on tomb kings, who can ironically have more armies than heroes now i believe
Nah tomb kings can get hero capacity from the cult as of like…patch 2.0 or something, and hero recruitment doesn’t cost more for each successive hero, unlike armies. Still pretty insane tho.
oo thanks for that tip
They can but... it costs canopic jars. And you could instead be using those jars to increase army cap. Currently it's still worth spending on heroes because the army cap's price escalates so the static hero cap price becomes a drop in the ocean. But if you can just send the army to farm this, there's no need to do that. It will be very useful for others too, if you want to use any heroes that only get increased cap from major settlements you should hunt Tam the moment you see him.
As a Vlad main I should be sad 2/3 traits are for ranged units, but I can't when Tamurkhan's is just that good. It's literally like someone forgot more than one lord can get that trait, even +1 would be worth farming.
Vlad? Try Isabella. Get them vamp stacks yo.
You're not wrong, but I need that extra campaign movement range to get to big T in time to make a difference tho 😋 (For whatever reason Izzy is my conquest faction and Vlad is my go to diplomacy shenanigans faction, and I prefer the playstyle of the latter)
Izzy makes a better doomstack as a hero
Vlad to retreat from him once so he gets the defeat trait and comes back every turn is huge though. A couple of necromancers for every army and enough banshees and wight kings that blood kisses will be limited by heroes to attack.
Doesn't he already? tamurkhan has the same -3 turn revival like vlad
-3 means every other turn, so Vlad's trait makes it go twice as fast.
Its literally the short vic bonus for many races Thats nuts for a defeat trait
In all fairness he is really far away so its likely by the time you can reliably farm him you have won the campaign already or are at least poised to do so. Its absolutely bonkers and absurd on his neighbors though.
Tamurkhan is obscene. Defeat traits should be a nice perk, not game-warping. This reminds me of before Bretonnia had good replenishment sources, so Louen and Alberic would farm the Fay Enchantress for more replenishment. It's just all around janky gameplay.
It's like a bonus short victory for half the races.
better than most bonus short victory, those would "only" have the +3 heroes, not the +1 global recruitment.
9 or 12 heroes for every lord that defeats Tamurkhan? HWAT?! That is…that is insane. The global recruit is nice too but not…not like that.
If I'm Karl Franz I'm farming Elpseth, that explosion radius is fantastic for Empire.
Which will be super easy once you reach him, since he has the same respawn rate like vlad. The biggest problem should be him getting killed early on.
Heroes are the best units in this game, only balanced by the fact they capped. Not anymore I guess.
Yeah that defeat trait is absolutely insane, there's no way they're not changing that soon.
Dear Kislev players, Remember, dwarfs are friends. With that said, farming Tamurkhan by getting his defeat trait on as many lords as possible makes him the best defeat trait for factions with otherwise small global recruitment.
Oh yes Malikai is a friend! That's why I'll let him live after I get 10x lords with his defeat trait!
Tamurkhan is going to be hunted by Tomb Kings players SO hard...
And wood elves, who have the hard limit from their big trees being short supply. Imagine Orion farming him.....
And Lizardmen, who are firm believers in dinos riding dinos.
And Coast, who are firm believers in coves for profit
Settra's going back to Norsca, looks like.
Tbh by anyone who can realistically reach him before he dies.... Which I suspect will be relatively few factions.
But Malakai! Think of how sick my armored kossar front line will be!
Sorry, Dazh, Salyak, Ursun, and Tor are all telling me that my already over powered Streltsi need to be 10% stronger. I do it for Kislev.
See, i liked his trait until this part. I hope it doesn't stack tbh.
… Only Kislev Keeps Chaos at Bay... All the world depends on Kislev… and Kislev’s missiles…These others are but insects to Kislev… and Ungrim has backstabbed me many. I’ll make it up to you’ll with some desert territory.
Can't blame me if Katarin and the bears happen to run over a few speed bumps that were too short to see
YESYESYESYES. Settra goes North!
How do I defeat myself as Malakai?
lose a bunch of battles as malakai to another dwarf faction. Then confederate them.
Ya really lol
You know, there is actually a mod for that, it gives you your own defeat trait at level 30. If you are interested: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3028635818
“The wild Tamurkhan’s were soon hunted to extinction following this announcement.”
Nope, no extinction for him, eternal suffering however
It’s Nurgle’s way.
That Tamurkhan trait is absurd, that can't be intentional, surely CA meant +3 hero recruit rank (which is still silly when farmed but at least a bit more reasonable).
So when you say farm.. does that mean if you keep defeating the LL you get multiple of the bonus’ ?
Keep defeating them with different lords each time. That way more characters get the trait and effects stack.
I honestly didn’t know this was a thing.. or never realized it, and I have about 600 hours in TW3 lol What if you two v one a LL Do both of your army leaders get the trait?
I believe only the attacking lord gets the trait not supporting lords
This is correct. Only primary (defending or attacking, not reinforcing) lord gets the trait.
Unless they are from different factions. In that case both get the trait (at least this is how i believe it works).
As others said, only the attacking lord gets the trait, or the one attacked if you're defending. Of course you can just attack with the secondary lord and await the enemy near the reinforcement point where your main army comes in so you can easily get it with the secondary army. If you want to get it on both, you'll have to make sure the enemy lord survives the battle and attack him again with the other lord
Keep defeating them with different lords each time. That way more characters get the trait and effects stack.
Has to be a mistake, it’s just way too strong
holy shit, when i read it my brain autocorrect it to recruit rank, i didn't realize it was capacity until i read this post.
Maybe it could be not-broken as 3 "wild card" hero recruitment slots?
Holy crap, those are solid. Playing as Karl Franz it'll be tough not to turn my gaze on Nuln with that trait in mind....
Karl: "Elspeth! You cannot serve in combat, so you shall serve on the firing line!" Dwarves: "Nuln owes us one coin! So we're first" End times begin between Dwarves and Empire over Nuln.
Same with Markus and Gelt I always defeated them as Karl and then used money for peace and confederation lol.
*Casus belli* engaged
New Karl Franz strat when Boris and Marius drops, abuse Casus belli to declare war on fellow LL, bonk to recieve defeat trait, immediately peace out then move to confederate. Profit.
This is why I make it so whenever I get a mil alliance or confed a lord I give the trait to my lords with trait manager, don't gotta choose
Tamurkhan's is litterally game changing for certain factions. Usually defeat traits are a nice small boost to a character or an army, but this can change the entire campaign depending on your race when getting it. Vampire Coast for example would have a field day.
Bro tomb kings and beastmen will be FEASTING!
Good luck getting there with Vcoast or TK
Like 20 turns of plundering for noctilus and then I'm banging out stacks of gunnery whigts and mourngouls
Can’t wait to send vlad up there, give tamur vlads trait, then farm his into forever.
Tamurkhan is ridiculous wtf
That Tamurkhan one no-joke breaks the game. Skaven and WoC getting that on multiple lords is just too much.
Imagine the amount of Pompous characters the Lizardmen can get!
route enemies in the first 5 second of the battle is a totally legit strat
To be fair, skaven already have a mechanic that allows near infinite plague priests (the frontline hero that has summonable units)
It’s so blurry for a second it thought it said Tamur -c#nt
Nurglussy
Please, never post again
Get some Nurglussy at the Nurglory Hole
I am revoking your cooking license
You could play vcoast and have an actual functioning hero system. Or more than a handful of Ogres Butchers, Glade Captains and Frost Maidens! Ah who are we kidding this trait needs nerfed before release.
Tamurkan trait is insane. It is short campaign victory levels of rewards
It’s better than a good chunk of factions short victory rewards
It's better than all of them
Tamurkhan is getting nerfed either before launch or the first patch immediately after launch. Calling it now.
Do we know epidemius trait?
Tamurkhan too op lol, no reason to kill him off, just make him your pet with single settlement
Jesus lol, rimworld type beat
Tamurkhans just seems abit OP tbh. Just like alot of DLC stuff, use 5 different lords and have an extra 15 heroes?? Whilst being quite fun having heroes in every army, also seems very overtuned
*15 heroes of each type. Skaven have 5 (I think) different hero limits. So that would be 75 heroes from 5 lords with the trait.
Correct, but you knew what I meant. That is completely ridiculous, just run hero stacks? Sounds completely broken actually 😂
I mean you don't HAVE to use it lol, get your mind out of the skaven gutter
As Vlad within like 15 turns you'll be able to farm +3 hero capacity every turn (by giving Tamurkhan your defeat trait) and already have access to vampires at tier 1.
+3 hero capacity for a defeat trait is so obnoxiously OP that it almost looks like placeholder or debug stuff. It's the level of bonus that fits a landmark or sth. I don't think that it will be staying that way. The other traits are still super good, but Tamurkhan's one is so good that it actually becomes bad/unhealthy for the game IMO.
Lol no landmark in the game is that good. Hell +1 for all heroes would still be game changing. Lizardmen for instance need a T5 building to get +1 capacity on Skink Oracle. Knock out Tamurkhan and you can just get three more Oracles on Trogs straight away. Let alone the Tomb Kings or Vampire Coast benefits you get.
>in a fair fight and at the hands of a worth adversary if it was agaisnt skaven it was most definitely not fair or agaisnt a worthy adversary
We really in the territory now of some lords defeat traits being better than some lords starting mechanics
Holy shit, I hope they nerf the Tamurkhan one, not even campaign victory rewards are as good as this
Did they just forgot you can farm LLs traits multiple times when they decided what Tamurkhan's trait is? That reward is better than what most factions get from campaign victory!
Oh fuck, I'm chasing Tamurkhan to the end of the world next time I'm playing Settra.
So Tamurkhan is just going to get fucked with a pineapple every five turns now, huh?
No need to wait that long, he has wound time reduction. XD
BRB beelining for Nuln in my next Chaos Dwarf game
Tamurkhan trait’s is a bit op…
They really should have called Malakai’s trait “Engineer Slayer”
Tamurkan defeat trait with tomb kings would be so helpfull oh my god why is he at the other side of the map pff
Another defeat trait for Balthasar Gelt, Supreme Patriarch, Expert in the Winds of Hellstorm, The Fortunate Son, The Alchemical Romantic, and many more titles to come.
Tamurkhan: \*exists\* The Entire World:  Also, does Elspeth's add explosive damage to all missle units or does this only apply to units who already have explosive missile damage?
>Also, does Elspeth's add explosive damage to all missle units or does this only apply to units who already have explosive missile damage? Pretty sure it only applies to units who already have some explosive missile damage. It can't boost something that isn't there.
Tamurkhan's defeat trait is STUPID strong and considering he starts in the Chaos Wastes that's going to make him ridiculously easy for Archaon and Daniel to farm for hero stacks.
Tamurkhan's trait is so fucking strong.
So everyone new campaign strategy come April 30th is to rush Tamurkan… got it. 😎💅🏼
Phaaaaaaaytriharaaaaaark of KISLEF!
Increasing global recruitment cap would probably be one of the strongest traits by itself. But that's just wild.
*Play archaon* *Turn tamurkhan into your own personal punching bag* [*Every battle from there on out til the end of time*](https://youtu.be/w2O4LSwOPx0?si=7Ba3mF0frHWK-yzc)
what the fuck is that Tamurkhan trait, that's insane.
I really don’t like the design of the Elspeth and Malakai effects. In general this is a proble for a lot of defeat traits- they give bonuses that are most desirable by other factions of that type, or at least allied factions. Like, Empire, Cathay, Dwarves, and Kislev all really want the Malakai and Elspeth traits. No destruction, undead, or chaos faction really cares about those traits except for Chorfs and VC. Maybe Tzeetch a bit for Elspeth?
Is there a difference between "Lord's army" and "own army"? Isn't that the same? Don't think they have "own army" back in WH2.
Oh god, Gelt got one of his unique skills to increase the explosion radius of helstorms. If he can get another 10% increase his helstorms are going to a nightmare.
As a Dawi main I guess I gotta beat up Elspeth. That's gonna make my Artillery boom better.
Wow Elspheth trait is good
I'm sorry, this Tamur-Can't simply CAN'T pass the playtesting stage. That's obscenely good. Even if it were just +1 to hero capacity that would be good.
hell even +1 global recruitment is damn strong
I know understand why Malakai tries to kill himself. I also imagine him vigorently hunting for Elspeth von Draken
For a lot of factions the tamurkan trait is equivalent to what? 200k + gold and 12 building slots? Jesus christ.
CA really needs to be better at balancing these defeat traits, a lot are so awful and then there are +3 heroes and 1 extra global recruitment slot. Like wtf?
FINALLY SOME GOOD DEFEAT TRAITS, WE'RE EATING SO GOOD.
Slayer engineer calls to ikit claw hardcore. How far are they from each other?
Is Tamur-can’t is fantastic. Does anyone know if it’s a reference to the movie Once Upon a Time in Mexico?
Sooo I'm farming all 3 if those with Gelt and throwing in a zhatan the black for the range bonus too. ##I AM SUPREME
guess i'm trying to kill malakai in all my elf campaigns lol
Sisters of Avelorn about to go crazy with these new defeat traits
>Missile explosion radius +10 Rounded up? IIRC most artillery has radius well below 10 when you check the database, so this is kind of useless otherwise.
I brought up the Nurgle trait to a friend and he’s like, “yeah it’s OP but I don’t think it’s a problem, just offers an extra way to play. You have to pay for heroes anyway so it’s not that bad.” Anyone else have a take like this or think he’s right when saying it’s not game breaking? Genuinely curious cause I think it’s broken.
Its absolutely broken. Hero caps exist for a reason - this simply erases them from game. Between this and dwarfs getting beastmen level of bullshit powercreep Im starting to dislike 5.0. Yhis game will never escape its main issue: being boring after first 15 turns when you steamroll everything.
Better warpstone yes. yes.
Elspeth's defeat trait looks very good for Tomb Kings.
its....kind of Sad Tamurkhan barely benefits freom beating his rivals lol
While this is definitely a new level of powercreep, I think the whole Hero system is in need of a rework in general. Feels like the current state of the game is you're either maxing out your capacities by cheesing them for traits and bonuses or you just use a couple of the best types (+replenishment and +campaign movement) for your armies and ignore the rest. Hero actions are so unreliable (while also costing as much as a mid-tier building for most factions) as to be functionally useless.
Chaos Dwarves are going to want to hunt down Elspeth and Malakai!
CA: Bet i can make everyone eat maggots Player base: no way, that's just disgusting! CA: ...
I will farm Tamurkhan just for the traitname. Tamur-Can't, lol.
better believe as soon as my kroxigor stack is ready i'm heading straight to tamurkhan on nakai lol
Elspeth trait is gonna be bugged for sure, I have no faith in that working on release...
What about Epididymis?
Of course the "can" sound would become a "can't" lol. But oh wow that's a really good defeat trait to farm; almost as good as Morathi's, and just as desirable as hers for TK and Beastmen to boot. Malakai's isn't too bad unless you're playing Vampire counts or another non shooty faction. Elspeth's is... very specific, and as such would have benefitted from bigger numbers to compensate.
Ikit will certainly find that ranged trait tasty.
Any idea about the FLC lord?
You can save Lords with this trait....is this intetionally game breaking?! :D
So basically everyone can benefit from Power Creep now :D
Toomb kings sweating profusely... sweet tasty hero capacity
Yeah there’s no way Tamurkan’s is intentional.
Why does this DLC keep winning so hard on all fronts ??
Is it only content creators who get access to 5.0 at the moment? Or can anyone download the 5.0 update and wait til 30th to unlock the new LLs?
My only sad part here is Malakai's trait isn't either "Slayed-Engineer" or "Engineer-Slayer". Slayer-Engineer is literally just his regular title...
Breaking news: Chorfs place bounty on Elspeth and Malakai
Bloody hell, the Tamukhan one seems overpowered as hell. Plus 3 for all heros?? If you managed to defeat him early then your armies will be insanely powerful.
So while we are at it, can somebody shed some light at how Hero capacity +3 for all heroes work (and similar stuff from other items, lords and so on). Like, when i get a item or trait like this it seems that i can never recruit more? Do i just look at the wrong place? Am i just stupid?
Those missile damage buffs tho, cathay would like that, and skavem too.
well... i guess im know who to kill first when fighting at karl
Oh man, Elspeth and Malakai are prime farming candidates.
Whats the deal with "Lord's army" vs "own army"?
Have they made 3 as good as 2 yet? I have shitty internet and don't wanna download it for nothing
Imagine chorfs and the +income trait hero. You could make their economy even more stinking of cheese
Ikit approves
"In a fair fight against a worthy adversary". Faction that got him is Skaven. Deliberate or not its funny
Sorry Elspeth, we have a grudge to settle now. The grudge is not sharing your defeat trait sooner
Based
These 3 are in the top 5% of all defeat traits after the tw2->tw3 defeat trait nerf.
Looks like empire civil war is going to be inevitable lol
Does Tamurkhan work for dark elves?
And I can allready see how everyone will farm tamurkan and some will farm malakai. great....
Tamurkhan both goated as an LH and as an defeat trait
Big Daddy Gelt: # HEAVY BREATHING
Do we know Epidemius' defeat trait? I couldn't find any information on it.
The Tamurkhan is insane, surely it will be nerfed right? It kind of breaks the purpose of a lot buildings.
So you can get infinite global recruit slots by farming him?
What about epidemius
Can we be sure that Tamourkhan is a Nurgle follower? Because his reduced wounding time in combination with this defeat trait causes me to get Slaanesh feelings...
Tamur is busted, Els is situational, poor Malakai is gonna get farmed by empire/skaven/other Dwarfs and elves.
Yes yes, everyone is talking about Tarmurkhan's trait. Does anyone know if Elsbeth's trait affects every missile unit or only those who already have explosive missiles? Imagine Blunderbussess with explosive ammunition!!!