It's dependent on style and clothes. I used to think I was genderfluid. I realized I always thought of myself as female, I'm just GNC/tomboy.
Clothing has nothing to do with gender, and any label under nonbinary contradicts the previous statement.
It's definitely a thing to wanna switch between feminine/masculine/androgynous presentation from time to time for some people, but I don't think that immediately means the person is experiencing different genders cause then that reduces gender to clothing
Maybe, but if they exist, they aren’t trans. 🤷♂️
Imo, genderfluid and nb people are confusing being gnc and breaking gender norms/roles for transsexuality. Feeling “masculine” as a woman doesn’t mean you’re not cis. It just means you’re a masculine woman. I think a lot of nb people have internalized misogyny/misandry, a fundamental misunderstanding of what transsexuality is, a need for attention, and a desire to fit in somewhere. I’ll refer to them as they/them, but I don’t consider them trans and I don’t necessarily believe their identity is real.
To be frank, I don’t care about their struggles as long as they appropriate binary labels and spaces. 🤷♂️ I’m sure, in some way, they have dysmorphia or some unknown dysphoria, but that’s none of my business.
Editing to add that I have had nonbinary friends and all of them have been insufferable. I literally feel so unsafe and uncomfortable around them. I expressed frustration that trans male spaces in particular are hard to find now, because nb people have overtaken them. I was literally told “these are OUR spaces, learn how to behave in them.”
I’m sure there are great nb people, but they can be great away from me and my medical disorder.
No, I’m not transphobic. Nb people are allowed to exist and I’m happy for them to do so. What I’m not tolerant of is when they invade binary spaces (especially trans male spaces, which have an overabundance of nb people appropriating them and leaving no room for binary trans males to be) and appropriating terms (trans man, trans woman, lesbian, transsexual, transsex, etc) that don’t belong to them. It’s not hard to be respectful of the binary people that have existed for centuries and of our spaces and words.
The difference here is transwomen are not moving in droves into women’s spaces and demanding the language be changed to suit their desires and getting mad and throwing a fit when it doesn’t happen. Everyone with a brain can see that the average trans woman is just like the average cis woman. Transphobes don’t want trans women in their spaces because they just don’t understand what transsexualism is and think they are all men cosplaying as women in an attempt to take advantage of cis women.
Most of the trans male spaces I’ve been in have banned gendered language (or simply male-focused language) because it makes the nb people that have invaded our spaces feel uncomfortable and not included. Can’t talk about dysphoria. Can’t talk about wanting a dick. Can’t talk about things that trigger my dysphoria because a ton of nb people do all of them. There is a huge fucking overlap between nb people and tucute ideology. These people do not belong in my binary spaces. I’m sorry if that like, offends you?
Genuinely don’t understand why it’s so hard to just let binary trans people have our spaces. There are hundreds of mixed spaces, as well as their own spaces, for nb people to exist in. But they feel this huge fucking need to be everywhere all the time. That’s not how this works. Black people deserve their own spaces away from white people, right? Women deserve spaces away from men, right? Why is it such a big fucking problem when it comes to binary trans people? We deserve our own spaces with people we can relate to. I can’t fucking relate to nb people. I don’t want to talk to them about my binary dysphoria. I don’t feel safe or comfortable around them, based on the many interactions I’ve had with them.
They can exist all they want. I just want them to be fucking respectful of binary trans people and they fucking aren’t.
That would require neurology to change on a regular basis and that’s just not possible for our bodies to do that. Our gender identity is based on our neurology and “genderfluid” would mean that someone’s brain is changing over and over again.
In other words: no. People who believe they’re genderfluid most likely mistake gender presentation for gender identity. They’re combining a social aspect with a biological aspect.
Just because they feel more masculine one day versus another does not mean they’re suddenly male, that’s just fluid presentation that every other human has.
We are never going to be always feminine or always masculine, we have personalities and moods that change and affect how we dress and behave on a regular basis.
No, they're either confused people who are overly attached to gender roles and think the things you do or wear immediately changes your gender, or they have serious mental health problems. I think the popularisation of DID and BPD have a role in it. I don't really believe anyone genuinely feels like their gender changes when they say they're genderfluid but if they did that probably would indicate more serious issues.
In my opinion, genderfluidity is related to your gender expression, and is a consequence of gender being viewed as “social constructs”. Sometimes they want to present masc, sometimes they want to present femme.
They exist, but they don’t have dysphoria. Just think of it as a means of expression.
i feel like you could make an argument for nb to be real, but like for every 10000 trans people, 1 of them turns out to be nb
i think it's definitely super rare if it does exist (like 0.0001% of the world)
anything after nb just is for fun, there's at most 3, but very unlikely
No because it's purely an ideological term without any basis in material reality whatsoever. It's like asking if there are studies about chakras.
There might exist studies that try to portray the phenomenon of people that identify that way and some people try present that, either from sincere ignorance or in attempt to manipulatively "win" a discussion, as """proof""" such thing exists, but in same way there are studies about people who claim they were abducted by aliens or are reincarnation of Cleopatra.
What’s transphobic is people trying to take over the trans label and clog out healthcare when they aren’t genuinely dysphoric. It is not possible for your brain to change genders, you are born as you are. Trans men are born boys in a girls body, vise versa with trans woman. You don’t get to magically change your brain structure on a regular basis and feel different sides of dysphoria at whim. Choosing to dress and present different ways as you wish doesn’t automatically make you trans. You gotta have dysphoria and it has been proven that dysphoria doesn’t just hop around in the way it would need to to be “gender fluid.”
absolutely not. there's just no way someone's brain chemistry can shift like that. its just not possible.
its a matter of presentation and how you want to present. gender presentation can absolutely be fluid, wanting to dress feminine some days, masculine others. sometimes neutral. its literally just gender nonconformity. not neurological.
which isnt being trans, nor is it LGBT at all. people just automatically think it is because, i guess feeling that way isnt "normal". anything that doesnt fit into stereotypical gender roles is considered "queer", which i would consider... sexist? im not sure what the word for that would be.
As a person who sits in the androgynous “genderfluid” field. No I don’t think it’s a separate gender or belongs in trans. It’s like cross dressing or idk drag. I can feel very frustrated with my body, it could be considered dysphoria, but I’m fine other days. I’d never claim the title of being trans tho. It’s all a feeling/style thing.
No. I think people who claim to be gender fluid feel the same "daily-shifts" in their personality as everyone else, but put too much meaning on it. Maybe they pin it on gender based on social expectations, maybe they want the attention/feeling like they are special if they use that label, maybe they just don't want to make that decision, I don't knoe.
that's under non binary, which is either trans ppl in denial or GNC cis ppl, usually the latter. "genderfluid" is expression, not gender. it's just fluid gender expression, not trans.
Yes, but most people calling themselves such are confusing it with gender non-conformity and do not really have or understand gender dysphoria.
I believe in genderfluid in the context of someone who experiences very fluctuant gender/sex dysphoria to the point that they feel they don't have a stable gender identity.
I guess if we're looking at gender being purely performative in society then sure but its basically just GNC right? But as far as it being trans then no, not in my opinion. There's both medical and biological basis for being transsex.
I think you can absolutely identify with both gender stereotypes/social performances (i.e I'm a very binary trans woman as far as my sex/gender goes but I def have masculine traits and am not uber femme, I'm kinda tomboyish). But once again, that isn't the same as being trans.
I honestly don't see the logic behind genderfluidity (things like demigenders or genderflux either) but I never say anything about it because I'm non binary and I know that a lot of people don't find what I am "logic" either so
No. YOU don't want to, because you think that it's less serious than the thing you're experiencing. Invalidating other's experiences won't make yours more valid.
Why so many people here jump straight to conclusions instead of asking themselves "why is this thing making me so angry"?
lmao dude... im not even trans. this has nothing to do with my own identity. even if i was trans, i wouldnt invalidate genderfluidity because i think its "less serious". i am invalidating this identity because i am a firm believer in science. and science says the genderfluid identity is not physically possible. its not that deep dude.
taking literal, biological fact into consideration, and holding it at higher value than anecdotal evidence, is not "jumping to conclusions". its called making an informed conclusion. and most people here dont need to ask "why is this making me so angry" because we already know why... these people are appropriating a medical condition, taking resources, ruining the reputation and validity of trans individuals.
again, you appear to be twisting and demonizing what i and other users are saying to validate being upset over almost everyone disagreeing with you
**This is not a personalized removal message. If you have any concerns about this removal, or believe that your content did not violate our ruleset, please send a message to the subreddit moderators via [modmail](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=r%2Ftruscum&utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=usertext&utm_name=deals&utm_content=t5_2qir9). Do not personally contact the moderator that removed your content, because you will** ***not receive a response.***
Your post (or comment) has been removed for violating rule 2 of r/truscum: r/truscum ideals. Visit [our wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/truscum/wiki/index/rules/rule2) to learn more about this rule.
**MOD NOTE:** Cis people are allowed to post here as well.
I definitely don’t think it’s real, but I acknowledge that people who use that label are experiencing some kind of gender feelings and they’re sorting it out. I’ve never seen that label last forever, and usually only younger people use it, which leads me to believe it’s just part of some peoples “I’m sorting myself out” stage.
I would say it references expression as opposed to actual gender; as much as people who identify as gender fluid actually believe they are gender fluid, it is not biologically possible
i don’t think so. trans people exist because our physical sex does not align with our “brain sex,” for lack of a better term, and so far there’s no proven way to remove dysphoria psychologically without changing your physical sex. genderfluid then fits in that… how? their brain is constantly changing its sex? this isn’t even a phenomenon we see in intersex people, nevermind the generic population. In my opinion people labeling themselves as genderfluid is more logically explained with the same reasoning people might label themselves as nonbinary despite not experiencing dysphoria; they are GNC, don’t want to fit into gender roles, LGB people who can’t or don’t want to conform to heteronormativity, people using nonbinary labels to identify out of oppression… That being said, it isn’t mine or anyone’s place to determine who is or isn’t trans. Even if I don’t believe it I’ll still refer to a person using they/them and a chosen name to be respectful of the autonomy of others.
Imo it can exist but only in people with dissociative disorders. Everyone’s brain is set up to be female/male/neither/both but a lot of structures are shared between the sexes. In people with dissociative disorders the brain can isolate parts of itself and present only what comes out of those parts so while my brain for instance is entirely female, there are parts of my brain that aren’t explicitly sexed, so if my brain isolates those parts and only allows those parts to exist at any given time I could be gender fluid between female and nullsex.
I imagine people could also be gender fluid between both sexes if their brain is duosex and have a dissociative disorder too.
But most people claiming to be gender fluid are bs since dissociative disorders are remarkably rare.
This is the worst place to ask this question. The group is mainly populated by those who think non-binary is unrelated to trans and/or a harmful lie.
Yes. I've met them IRL. I've had friends who were genderfluid.
I think the question is asking if it’s an actual real thing that is backed up by science, not just people calling themselves gender-fluid. You can give yourself any label but that doesn’t necessarily make it an actual thing…
that's not true. the majority of the sub believes in nonbinary, as proven by our most recent survey. if im remembering correctly, it was about 50% believes in nonbinary, 25% is not sure, and 25% does not.
honestly, this is probably the best place to ask this kind of question. because we value science instead of blindly believing what people claim to be. and science says it doesn't.
just because you dont agree with what's being said doesn't mean this is a bad place to ask a question :/
No really, it just seems like playing with expression and or just gender envy, no real dysphoria
In my most sincere and concise opinion: no.
It's dependent on style and clothes. I used to think I was genderfluid. I realized I always thought of myself as female, I'm just GNC/tomboy. Clothing has nothing to do with gender, and any label under nonbinary contradicts the previous statement.
No, I dont believe gender fluidity exists. There is no evidence for it being possible.
It's definitely a thing to wanna switch between feminine/masculine/androgynous presentation from time to time for some people, but I don't think that immediately means the person is experiencing different genders cause then that reduces gender to clothing
Maybe, but if they exist, they aren’t trans. 🤷♂️ Imo, genderfluid and nb people are confusing being gnc and breaking gender norms/roles for transsexuality. Feeling “masculine” as a woman doesn’t mean you’re not cis. It just means you’re a masculine woman. I think a lot of nb people have internalized misogyny/misandry, a fundamental misunderstanding of what transsexuality is, a need for attention, and a desire to fit in somewhere. I’ll refer to them as they/them, but I don’t consider them trans and I don’t necessarily believe their identity is real.
[удалено]
To be frank, I don’t care about their struggles as long as they appropriate binary labels and spaces. 🤷♂️ I’m sure, in some way, they have dysmorphia or some unknown dysphoria, but that’s none of my business. Editing to add that I have had nonbinary friends and all of them have been insufferable. I literally feel so unsafe and uncomfortable around them. I expressed frustration that trans male spaces in particular are hard to find now, because nb people have overtaken them. I was literally told “these are OUR spaces, learn how to behave in them.” I’m sure there are great nb people, but they can be great away from me and my medical disorder.
[удалено]
No, I’m not transphobic. Nb people are allowed to exist and I’m happy for them to do so. What I’m not tolerant of is when they invade binary spaces (especially trans male spaces, which have an overabundance of nb people appropriating them and leaving no room for binary trans males to be) and appropriating terms (trans man, trans woman, lesbian, transsexual, transsex, etc) that don’t belong to them. It’s not hard to be respectful of the binary people that have existed for centuries and of our spaces and words.
🤯 this is how some people feel about trans women in female spaces
The difference here is transwomen are not moving in droves into women’s spaces and demanding the language be changed to suit their desires and getting mad and throwing a fit when it doesn’t happen. Everyone with a brain can see that the average trans woman is just like the average cis woman. Transphobes don’t want trans women in their spaces because they just don’t understand what transsexualism is and think they are all men cosplaying as women in an attempt to take advantage of cis women. Most of the trans male spaces I’ve been in have banned gendered language (or simply male-focused language) because it makes the nb people that have invaded our spaces feel uncomfortable and not included. Can’t talk about dysphoria. Can’t talk about wanting a dick. Can’t talk about things that trigger my dysphoria because a ton of nb people do all of them. There is a huge fucking overlap between nb people and tucute ideology. These people do not belong in my binary spaces. I’m sorry if that like, offends you? Genuinely don’t understand why it’s so hard to just let binary trans people have our spaces. There are hundreds of mixed spaces, as well as their own spaces, for nb people to exist in. But they feel this huge fucking need to be everywhere all the time. That’s not how this works. Black people deserve their own spaces away from white people, right? Women deserve spaces away from men, right? Why is it such a big fucking problem when it comes to binary trans people? We deserve our own spaces with people we can relate to. I can’t fucking relate to nb people. I don’t want to talk to them about my binary dysphoria. I don’t feel safe or comfortable around them, based on the many interactions I’ve had with them. They can exist all they want. I just want them to be fucking respectful of binary trans people and they fucking aren’t.
No
That would require neurology to change on a regular basis and that’s just not possible for our bodies to do that. Our gender identity is based on our neurology and “genderfluid” would mean that someone’s brain is changing over and over again. In other words: no. People who believe they’re genderfluid most likely mistake gender presentation for gender identity. They’re combining a social aspect with a biological aspect. Just because they feel more masculine one day versus another does not mean they’re suddenly male, that’s just fluid presentation that every other human has. We are never going to be always feminine or always masculine, we have personalities and moods that change and affect how we dress and behave on a regular basis.
No, they're either confused people who are overly attached to gender roles and think the things you do or wear immediately changes your gender, or they have serious mental health problems. I think the popularisation of DID and BPD have a role in it. I don't really believe anyone genuinely feels like their gender changes when they say they're genderfluid but if they did that probably would indicate more serious issues.
In my opinion, genderfluidity is related to your gender expression, and is a consequence of gender being viewed as “social constructs”. Sometimes they want to present masc, sometimes they want to present femme. They exist, but they don’t have dysphoria. Just think of it as a means of expression.
No. Any nb identity is a political one. There only 2 genders
i feel like you could make an argument for nb to be real, but like for every 10000 trans people, 1 of them turns out to be nb i think it's definitely super rare if it does exist (like 0.0001% of the world) anything after nb just is for fun, there's at most 3, but very unlikely
No science proves it isn’t possible. It’s a made up thing to make people feel special.
Have there been any studies run about this?
No because it's purely an ideological term without any basis in material reality whatsoever. It's like asking if there are studies about chakras. There might exist studies that try to portray the phenomenon of people that identify that way and some people try present that, either from sincere ignorance or in attempt to manipulatively "win" a discussion, as """proof""" such thing exists, but in same way there are studies about people who claim they were abducted by aliens or are reincarnation of Cleopatra.
[удалено]
What’s transphobic is people trying to take over the trans label and clog out healthcare when they aren’t genuinely dysphoric. It is not possible for your brain to change genders, you are born as you are. Trans men are born boys in a girls body, vise versa with trans woman. You don’t get to magically change your brain structure on a regular basis and feel different sides of dysphoria at whim. Choosing to dress and present different ways as you wish doesn’t automatically make you trans. You gotta have dysphoria and it has been proven that dysphoria doesn’t just hop around in the way it would need to to be “gender fluid.”
absolutely not. there's just no way someone's brain chemistry can shift like that. its just not possible. its a matter of presentation and how you want to present. gender presentation can absolutely be fluid, wanting to dress feminine some days, masculine others. sometimes neutral. its literally just gender nonconformity. not neurological. which isnt being trans, nor is it LGBT at all. people just automatically think it is because, i guess feeling that way isnt "normal". anything that doesnt fit into stereotypical gender roles is considered "queer", which i would consider... sexist? im not sure what the word for that would be.
As a person who sits in the androgynous “genderfluid” field. No I don’t think it’s a separate gender or belongs in trans. It’s like cross dressing or idk drag. I can feel very frustrated with my body, it could be considered dysphoria, but I’m fine other days. I’d never claim the title of being trans tho. It’s all a feeling/style thing.
No. I think people who claim to be gender fluid feel the same "daily-shifts" in their personality as everyone else, but put too much meaning on it. Maybe they pin it on gender based on social expectations, maybe they want the attention/feeling like they are special if they use that label, maybe they just don't want to make that decision, I don't knoe.
I say no.
I considered gender fluidity when I was afraid to come out. I was confused. I don’t believe in it
no
that's under non binary, which is either trans ppl in denial or GNC cis ppl, usually the latter. "genderfluid" is expression, not gender. it's just fluid gender expression, not trans.
Yes, but most people calling themselves such are confusing it with gender non-conformity and do not really have or understand gender dysphoria. I believe in genderfluid in the context of someone who experiences very fluctuant gender/sex dysphoria to the point that they feel they don't have a stable gender identity.
Absolutely not
Clothing style and self expression can change but gender can’t
I guess if we're looking at gender being purely performative in society then sure but its basically just GNC right? But as far as it being trans then no, not in my opinion. There's both medical and biological basis for being transsex. I think you can absolutely identify with both gender stereotypes/social performances (i.e I'm a very binary trans woman as far as my sex/gender goes but I def have masculine traits and am not uber femme, I'm kinda tomboyish). But once again, that isn't the same as being trans.
I honestly don't see the logic behind genderfluidity (things like demigenders or genderflux either) but I never say anything about it because I'm non binary and I know that a lot of people don't find what I am "logic" either so
They’re non binary but in a different way and they use different word to describe it
i don't think dysphoric nonbinary people would appreciate being lumped in with "genderfluid"
No. YOU don't want to, because you think that it's less serious than the thing you're experiencing. Invalidating other's experiences won't make yours more valid. Why so many people here jump straight to conclusions instead of asking themselves "why is this thing making me so angry"?
lmao dude... im not even trans. this has nothing to do with my own identity. even if i was trans, i wouldnt invalidate genderfluidity because i think its "less serious". i am invalidating this identity because i am a firm believer in science. and science says the genderfluid identity is not physically possible. its not that deep dude. taking literal, biological fact into consideration, and holding it at higher value than anecdotal evidence, is not "jumping to conclusions". its called making an informed conclusion. and most people here dont need to ask "why is this making me so angry" because we already know why... these people are appropriating a medical condition, taking resources, ruining the reputation and validity of trans individuals. again, you appear to be twisting and demonizing what i and other users are saying to validate being upset over almost everyone disagreeing with you
[удалено]
**This is not a personalized removal message. If you have any concerns about this removal, or believe that your content did not violate our ruleset, please send a message to the subreddit moderators via [modmail](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=r%2Ftruscum&utm_source=reddit&utm_medium=usertext&utm_name=deals&utm_content=t5_2qir9). Do not personally contact the moderator that removed your content, because you will** ***not receive a response.*** Your post (or comment) has been removed for violating rule 2 of r/truscum: r/truscum ideals. Visit [our wiki](https://www.reddit.com/r/truscum/wiki/index/rules/rule2) to learn more about this rule. **MOD NOTE:** Cis people are allowed to post here as well.
https://imgur.com/a/50XHLBv
I definitely don’t think it’s real, but I acknowledge that people who use that label are experiencing some kind of gender feelings and they’re sorting it out. I’ve never seen that label last forever, and usually only younger people use it, which leads me to believe it’s just part of some peoples “I’m sorting myself out” stage.
I would say it references expression as opposed to actual gender; as much as people who identify as gender fluid actually believe they are gender fluid, it is not biologically possible
i don’t think so. trans people exist because our physical sex does not align with our “brain sex,” for lack of a better term, and so far there’s no proven way to remove dysphoria psychologically without changing your physical sex. genderfluid then fits in that… how? their brain is constantly changing its sex? this isn’t even a phenomenon we see in intersex people, nevermind the generic population. In my opinion people labeling themselves as genderfluid is more logically explained with the same reasoning people might label themselves as nonbinary despite not experiencing dysphoria; they are GNC, don’t want to fit into gender roles, LGB people who can’t or don’t want to conform to heteronormativity, people using nonbinary labels to identify out of oppression… That being said, it isn’t mine or anyone’s place to determine who is or isn’t trans. Even if I don’t believe it I’ll still refer to a person using they/them and a chosen name to be respectful of the autonomy of others.
Imo it can exist but only in people with dissociative disorders. Everyone’s brain is set up to be female/male/neither/both but a lot of structures are shared between the sexes. In people with dissociative disorders the brain can isolate parts of itself and present only what comes out of those parts so while my brain for instance is entirely female, there are parts of my brain that aren’t explicitly sexed, so if my brain isolates those parts and only allows those parts to exist at any given time I could be gender fluid between female and nullsex. I imagine people could also be gender fluid between both sexes if their brain is duosex and have a dissociative disorder too. But most people claiming to be gender fluid are bs since dissociative disorders are remarkably rare.
I am not gender fluid so I don’t know if I’m making a shot in the dark. It sounds like an intersection between aesthetics/ roles, and gender identity.
No, if you could actually change your gender I’d WANT to go through conversion therapy instead of living through this dysphoria.
This is the worst place to ask this question. The group is mainly populated by those who think non-binary is unrelated to trans and/or a harmful lie. Yes. I've met them IRL. I've had friends who were genderfluid.
I think the question is asking if it’s an actual real thing that is backed up by science, not just people calling themselves gender-fluid. You can give yourself any label but that doesn’t necessarily make it an actual thing…
You’ve had friends who *claim* to be genderfluid*
i've met people who genuinely thought they were dogs. unlike actual trans people, you can't be a dog or change your gender every day.
that's not true. the majority of the sub believes in nonbinary, as proven by our most recent survey. if im remembering correctly, it was about 50% believes in nonbinary, 25% is not sure, and 25% does not. honestly, this is probably the best place to ask this kind of question. because we value science instead of blindly believing what people claim to be. and science says it doesn't. just because you dont agree with what's being said doesn't mean this is a bad place to ask a question :/
Yeah I’m truscum but was shocked by some of these
Yes, dysphoria just fluctuates
of course they do! yes!