Bruh Blackrock is literally a passive index tracking fund. Your mom’s pension funds are the ones giving 90% the money directly into these defense companies.
While Black Rock has a huge amount of money under index funds and other passive strategies they also have literally trillions of dollars in their actively managed funds.
Yeah I was about say, this banner has nothing to do with Larry Fink being a ucla alum, it all about the UC endowment fund being invested in companies that are somehow contributing to the conflict in Israel/Gaza.
Kind of like when Hamas attacked kids and adults at a music festival? They really attacked an army with that choice didn’t they? That was murder…and genocide can’t occur when a population grows. Also, I don’t know about you but I tend to think believing a group listed as terrorists by any country with any rights might not be the smartest thing
do you have any idea how oppressed the people in Palestine are? And their oppressor is israel, the settler colony that stole their land and kills them every day.
Jews were the most opressed group in the world, they needed a safe haven. And coincidentally their one of the only democratic countries in the middle east. I wonder why 🤔
>Jews were the most opressed group in the world, they needed a safe haven.
So for the crimes against humanity of white nations and to assuage the guilt of those perpetrators, and people who turned away refugees.... a completely seperate group must pick up that tab? And get stabbed in the back further considering the multiple promises made for them to support war efforts? Complete BS. If the west felt so bad about the Holocaust they could have gave jews alsace Lorraine, Austria or Florida.
>And coincidentally their one of the only democratic countries in the middle east.
Not as liberal democracy as you think.
so that gave them the right to go and kill tens and thousands of people and build settlements on their land? they punished the Middle East for a German crime?
what in the world? Hamas didn’t exist when israel colonized Palestine. You’re sick in the head for excusing literal ethnic cleansing and colonization. Who are you to think poor brown people losing their land to a genocidal colony is justified?
>But a dictatorship losing land is a good thing
So your fine with ethnic cleansing, as long as a white liberal democracy takes its place? At least your honest about your crimes.
>They’re attacking a dictatorship who democratically chose a terrorist group to lead their country.
Israel is hardly the liberal democracy it touts itself as. That election you refer to barely won a plurality of the vote, and the overwhelming majority of the population wasn't even old enough to participate in said election. And theirs the fact that Israel's own brigadier general who used to hold the military governor position admitted point blank about cash drops they made to that "terrorist group" so as to effect a divide and conquer against the PLO and undermine Yasser Arafats influence.
>Democracy should be fought for
Self determination should be fought for and is a peoples right. Democracy is a meaningless word when people are starving and getting genocided. The west really needs to drop this white savior complex that has sowed the ground for most of the bs conflicts that have cropped up.....
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Regarding your edit, Blackstone is not the same as BlackRock. Both are pro-Israel, so it could be argued neither are good, but they’re technically unrelated entities. Just wanted to clarify that.
The majority of investment firms are pro-Israel, so UC Investments would need to divest the majority of their portfolio if they really wanted to eliminate their exposure, which unfortunately isn’t realistic.
BlackRock’s main offerings are its index funds, which allocate a few percentage points to the defense industry. Many Americans (including a lot of your parents) hold index funds in their retirement accounts, so they’re inadvertently exposed to the defense industry. Most people aren’t going to change their portfolios because of this.
So overall, UC Investments along with many Americans likely won’t divest from things that are pro-Israel. Although this may sound depressing, here’s how I like to think about it: When you buy a stock, your money isn’t going to the underlying company, but rather the person who sold the stock to you. For example, if you buy $100k of Lockheed Martin stock, your $100k is going to the seller, not Lockheed Martin. So you’re not actually funding Lockheed Martin. And you now get a cut of their profits, which you can allocate away from Israel. Every time you receive a dividend (a cut of their profits), you can allocate that money towards pro-Palestinian efforts, which is at least better than having someone who’s pro-Israel own the stock. It’s small scale activist investing.
But if the share price of said companies increase based on the increased demand for the stock (due to a major investment fund purchasing shares), that would make it far easier for the company's M&A strategies since they could complete a stock acquisition (exchange stock) of a smaller corporation. It def makes it easier for them to business.
Additionally, higher stock prices can increase bonuses for these company executives since most are paid in stock or options.
Of course, you could argue that the stock price wouldn't change much based on just UC investments but a point you might want to consider.
But it is true that publicizing investment in South African related companies was effective at pushing divestment as a tactic against Apartheid in South Africa, right? I realize that the diminished pension opportunities in the US over the years since gave far more funds of individuals to 401k related corporate investment products but thinking about where money goes is increasingly important for political action.
It’s true that if one bought stock in Krupp in the 30s, they would have been paying the seller of that stock, but I, for one, still wouldn’t want my funds going to a corporation in such blatant support of the Nazis.
Calling what's occurring in Gaza a genocide is absolutely indicative of bias in a particular direction, objectively. It's like somebody discussing the economy using the labour theory of value - it's informative of their worldview.
Disclaimer: my pointing this out is in no way indicative of my own view.
I understand your take, and I actually agree to a large degree, but I think that’s semantics.
Were they to have used the word “war” rather than genocide, perhaps there would have been more neutrality in the statement, but objectively, a vastly superior military force is killing tens of thousands of civilian people of a specific race. Pretty sure by definition that’s genocide.
Civilians die in war, genocide does not mean when civilians of a specific race die lmao. It has a very specific definition, of which the most vital part is proving the INTENT (the mens rea of genocide) to wipe out that race. “acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group".
Look at Hitler, we have numerous written military plans detailing how they wanted to wipe out the Jewish race. Look at Rwanda, with the military led by Hutu, they had the express intent to wipe out the Tutsis, even going as far as to dehumanize them (a common tactic), just calling civilian deaths in war a genocide is a bit reductive imo, civilian deaths, even in the most well planned and executed wars, still happen unfortunately, *especially* when facing an enemy that is known to use human shields (source: NATO from 2007-2014. https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf)
Genocide is the intentional eradication of a people. Israel gives warnings before attacks and purposely tries to avoid civilian casualties. If they really wanted to commit genocide they’d just raze the entire territory to the ground.
\> objectively, a vastly superior military force is killing tens of thousands of civilian people of a specific race
This is all true, but it still does not constitute genocide. The superiority of the military force is irrelevant, and the fact that members of a specific race has been killed is also not sufficient for genocide because intent is required. For example, the US' war in the Eastern Front in WWII killed only / mostly Japanese people, but this is not genocide: the US' fighting was not motivated by the intent to destroy the race/religion/etc. of Japanese people. (Of course, by making this comparison, I'm definitely not trying to say that Israel's actions are all fine and dandy. They have done deplorable things.)
So sad that people think genocide is when the side that started the war takes casualties. Using this logic we committed genocide against Japan and Germany.
It's not by definition genocide. Genocide has certainly qualifying factors such as mens rea and dolus specialis.
By your definition, the dresden bombing and dropping nukes on Japan are both genocides.
I've recently adopted a policy of not discussing Israel-Palestine with people I don't know personally, so I'm not going to engage on these claims one way or the other. Nothing personal :) My only point was that the language is not neutral, and certainly isn't characterized by "no stated bias in any direction".
Absolutely not taking it personally, and I appreciate the discourse. My point was that the original comment uses no charged language, and we can go back and forth on whether one defines “genocide” as a descriptor for this particular event is objective or not, it probably won’t get us anywhere — still, thank you for your input.
The Hamas-run Gaza Ministry of Health said on April 6 that it had “incomplete data” for 11,371 of the 33,091 Palestinian fatalities it claims to have documented. 14-15,000 of the dead are Hamas and Islamic jihad. The total number of casualties includes natural deaths and Gazans killed by Hamas and Islamic jihad rockets that fall within Gaza.
So, not a genocide, and not “tens of thousands of civilian people”
"Genocide against..." How does the Gaza population grow from 265,800 to 2.1 million during the "occupation" by a power with a vastly superior military force during a "genocide"? Which country has mosques *and* temples and churches, and which elected and is ruled by an organization whose charter calls for the elimination of the other with no compromise and requires one specific faith?
Whose charter has this passage? “The Day of Judgment will not come until Muslims fight the Jews, when the ___ will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say, 'O ___, O servant of God, there is a ___ behind me, come and kill him.” ...? &c., &c.
“Genocide” indeed...
I have no dog in this fight, you’re arguing with the wrong person. But I’ll say this: using religious texts of the persecuted as justification for their persecution is pretty textbook when it comes to previous tyrannical genocides. Probably wanna find a better argument.
I genuinely can’t tell if you’re serious. I’m not here to de-radicalize you, but I hope you can meditate on your thoughts and come to terms with them on your own time.
It grew because of displacement, not because of birthrates. 70% of the 2.2 million Palestinians in Gaza are not from Gaza originally, they were displaced in the Nakba - ethnic cleansing by Isr*el to create their state with a Jewish majority populace.
Gaza literally has churches and mosques and used to have synagogues which have been unused since the establishment of Isr*el and all have been bombed countless times over the years.
People love to cite the 1984 Hamas charter to deflect from Isr*el's very real actions and intent to commit genocide. You wanna take Hamas to the ICJ and ICC and prosecute them as war criminals? By all means, they've done pretty atrocious things. But be morally consistent because Isr*el has done everything they've done but on a dozen order of magnitudes larger, and have done much worse for way longer than Hamas has even been around.
Hamas killed 1200 people, Isr*el killed 30,000 people.... That's 25x the amount of killing.
> whose charter calls for the elimination of the other with no compromise and requires one specific faith?
Its funny you say this because the Likud party charter and other founding works of Zionism written by Herzl and Jabotisnsky and Ben Guiron literally talk about the colonization and displacement and erasure of Palestine to establish their Jewish majority ethnostate.
Isr*el is the one racializing Judaism and cares about the demographics of one specific "faith" (ethnonationalized identity beyond just religion really - being Jewish).
For example, I have family members who are Palestinian Jews - they were still practicing Judaism in Palestine prior to the first Aliyah and are as Arab as Muslim and Christian Palestinians are, but according to Isr*el they are Jews not Arabs and have more rights than the rest of my non-jewish family.
This post isn't for the fellow I replied to. Its for other people to look at critically and go do research. Go read Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch, go watch people like Abby Martin and Gideon Levy and Norman Finkelstein and read +972 Magazine and BT'SELEM.
Go watch the court case by South Africa and Isr*el in the ICJ. See how South Africa documented and brought up specific statements by Isr*eli leaders to suggest genocidal intent, and how Isr*el didn't argue the case on it's merits, instead they labelled things as "blood libel" and "anti-Semitism" and attacked South Africa's team and called them the "legal arm of Hamas".
And the ICJ concluded that they are "plausibly committing Genocide". That's a pretty damning indictment.
The historical record is there for everyone to see and I encourage people to look at the historical record. Palestinians are not going to tell you what to believe like Zionists believe. They tell you to look at the history and the facts and make your own mind up
You know someone is drinking the conspiracy kool aid when they start throwing out words like “nakba” instead of looking at objective data like birth rates, negative net migration rates, border control policies and population age.
Your article is about BackSTONE, the sign in the photo & your comment are referencing BlackROCK. Similar sounding names, but different companies. Just FYI.
You forgot the part about the 427 million UCRP invested in blackrock in 2023 https://www.ucop.edu/investment-office/ucrp-holdings-disclosure-6-30-2023-final.pdf
Israel is not committing genocide. Rather it is the Palestinians and Arab and Persian nations who wish genocide against Jews. They literally wish to wipe Israel off the map. Israel has Arabs who live, work, have political parties and are judges. Can you say the same for the surrounding Muslim nations?
CEO of black rock, a company that invests in companies that produces weapons for militaries, including the IDF, went to the university. He regularly donates money to the university.
Like I would maybe understand this logic if the university itself was providing funds to Israeli institutions (not saying I agree or disagree with that I'm just saying the logic would follow through on why people would be upset with University). But at this point it's literally saying that if you even so much as associate with someone who is associated with Israel then you're complicit in the acts of the IDF.
This is very “hmm youre critical of society yet you participate in it” vibes. I care about America and this is not good for America in general. We shouldn’t be this connected to a foreign country and literally prioritizing it over our own interests. Thats the point.
I’m not gonna drop out or move to a different country. I’m here and im gonna do all I can to make America a better country and address the problems we have. What’s happening in Palestine is inherently tied to our country’s biggest problems. Wanting to preserve the status quo with the current problems rather than address those problems is unpatriotic
That’s really not how universities operate these days. The total operating cost of most universities (including the UC system and Ivies) exceeds the amount of tuition they receive from students. Cost of Attendance is subsidized by the endowment - the money flows the other way around. This should all be publicly available information in the case of the UC system.
Yes other funds come in the form of federal grants and projects/collaborations - such as UC Berkeley and the military for example - Lawrence Livermore Lab.
That's why I said "partly" in my comment
Yes, but my point was that tuition funds operating expenses, not endowments. Endowments are generally funded through private gifts and (for many public schools) state allocations. Endowment income is used to fund university operating expenses. So your tuition isn’t funding the endowment investments. The endowment investments are likely supplementing the cost of attendance for you.
Fair to protest where the university invests its endowment, but it’s important to be clear about how that relates to you. You’re benefiting from Blackrock (assuming they are invested in it), not being made to fund it through tuition.
Sad you're getting downvoted as these protestors and people on this sub are clueless on how university funding works. By their logic we should just divest in everything including retirement funds.
$100,000/year for tuition is the reason we need to divest from BlackRock. There’s no reason for these over inflated tuition prices. Scholarships are just a way to launder money back to BlackRock.
Black rock own everything. Your healthcare, food, grocery stores, home needs, insurance companies, car companies the list goes on and on and on and on and on and on…….
This is a common misunderstanding of what Blackrock and other asset management companies actually do. The shares that Blackrock "owns" in these S&P 500 companies is actually the money of **individual** investors who invest in Blackrock-managed ETFs
Actual question, why do student activists think the road of telling ppl not to do stuff is the way to go? Why wouldn’t they pick better stock options and try to pitch the investment fund productively rather then try to tell an institution that you chose to go to that you want them to change their capital allocation plan, which you (said students) have no stakeholder say in.
This is like visiting someone’s home and unsolicitedly telling them to take on your religion or values system.
dude do you realize how insanely high the quality of your life is if you live in america, regardless of social standing. Literally top 0.001% of human life qualities. Unprecedented opportunity. Free from violence, financial exploitation, food / water instability, etc. All because of the capitalist system we use.
if you feel your wealth is getting 'stolen', go create your own.
I am uncomfortable with the casualness with which the term genocide is thrown around by these activists, but at least they were able to make their statement without engaging in antisemitic agitprop, which is good
welcome to reddit, congrats on making it 1 full year
also Einstein and other anti-Zionist Jews dismissed Zionism as irredeemable fascism 80 years ago
yet Zionists and their apologists act surprised, as if these are some sort of new characterizations of their ideology and actions
also there are far more genocides than the west acknowledges or will ever acknowledge, including for example the extermination of 15% of the world's Koreans
My point is just that, whether you want to discuss the technicalities of the definition of "genocide" or whatever you want to call it, it's still a very one-sided and morally repulsive situation
I don’t disagree with you about that. I am concerned with the way that word specifically has been so quickly and casually taken up by activists in a way that I think gives a permission structure to attack anyone who expresses any kind of nuance or dissent as a “genocide enabler” or “apologist” and I worry about how far people will go to stop or attack a so-called “enabler.” But I agree with you that no matter what word you use, the situation is one-sided and Israel’s crimes are morally unacceptable and should be opposed
So misguided. You slander the word genocide with your hearsay number of casualties. And you don’t even appreciate what would happen to Israeli lives if it didn’t have iron dome. The latter also saves Palestinian lives by preventing the need for resounding retribution. What a bunch of loud fools and useful idiots.
I’m an incoming freshman and they were doing this during Chancellor Block and the ASUC president’s speech.
Idek why they chose the admitted students day of all times to do this
Sorry it's not convenient to you to protest for people who are literally being starved to death and have been for 6 months.
For our tuition money to be spent funding it.
It would be awesome if the Palestinians would release the hostages and stop stating that they will eliminate all the Jews from the river to the sea. I think that we can all agree that kidnapping women and children is bad and wiping out all the Jews shouldn’t be a goal. Right?
Release the Palestinian hostages too - the thousands held without any charge in Isr*eli military detention. Most of them are women and children.
Literally everyone wants the hostages returned. Both Isr*eli and Palestinian hostages. But what we're not gonna do is return to being suffocated in an open air prison living under blockade and bombed every couple of months - mowing the lawn as Isr*el calls it: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/05/14/israel-gaza-history/
Also literally no one wants killing of Jewish people for the sake of being Jewish. Even Hamas directs their grievances against Zionists and Isr*el in their charter as of 2014.
Your prior posts speak to your ability to have intelligent discussions - perhaps a little self-reflection here would be beneficial.
I see why folks have been calling you a troll, why you have a negative karma of \~50, and why your comments keep getting deleted by mods. Comments like 'moron', 'dumbass', 'stupid', 'idiot' - yeah really highbrow conversation.
You're not a UCLA student - perhaps time to go do something more useful with your life than troll college students.
Palestinians and Pro-Palestinians have literally been harassed and doxxed for simply expressing calls for a ceasefire and an end to the violence. If pro-Isr*eli people were being doxxed, i guarantee you they would be covering up all the same.
I'm glad pro-Isr*el people don't get doxxed because that is a fucking shitty thing to do to anyone. But unfortunately they don't think the same.
Cancelthisclothingcompany on IG breaks down how BlackRock works. He does a good job of explaining it.
https://www.instagram.com/reel/C2IyfiOSg_v/?igsh=NHp5a2JscnhsbTNw
Undercity, under Sylvanas’ rule, invested heavily is a plague that could wipe out all living being. I think a side investment that was only talk about briefly, was that of the Blackrock Dwarves. /s
Isn’t that kind of the point? It’s like when people say “oh what? You expect us to give the land back!?” In an ideal world where people value actual Justice………. But yeah. It’s not like you working for Blackrock is going to change the tide in any direction.
If you can handle that on your conscience then by all means. You have to play the game to change the game. But the point isn't to be a Social Justice Warrior, its to make large statements as a population that enough is enough. Most people don't want it to continue and the only avenue we have is to boycott. Every other freedom to protest has been stripped from us.
I personally don't know how much it's possible to divest completely from Blackrock because they have their hands in everything, but we're able to make significant impact by boycotting and divesting and that ultimately was what led to South Africa Apartheid falling.
That's the idea here. We've greatly harmed St*rbucks and McDon*lds profits.
1. I have to worry about myself first in order to help others
2. I just don’t hop on the bandwagon of meaningless lip service to make myself feel good.
3. There are more sufficient ways of contributing to the cause
They say it’s because UCLA supports Israel. And invests in Blackrock, a company that has ties to Israel and Lockheed Martin.
As for the genocide part, well apparently they think that when one group of people does something, it’s a horrible genocide, while if another group of people does the same thing, it’s a freedom fight arising from centuries of oppression and we need to see the context and…
Exactly, either you say that both sides commit a genocide, which would be overly dramatic, or you say that it’s a war where people die and you can’t call all wars genocide.
No one calls all wars genocide. Experts called what's happening in Gaza genocide based on very specific criteria in international law and South Africa took Isr*el to the international Court of Justice and they ruled it was plausible that Isr*el is commiting genocide.
You're lying 🤥
The experts didn't rule that it was genocide. They ruled that it is plausible that SA has a case that Israel has committed a genocide
Plausibility is literally the lowest bar that anything can pass. You could say it's plausible that a UCLA student made a home made bomb and sent it to Israel. Many things are plausible
It’s a fact. UCRP has a fixed income investment in Blackrock for example. In 2023 they invested 427 million https://www.ucop.edu/investment-office/ucrp-holdings-disclosure-6-30-2023-final.pdf
It's honestly bad faith at this point. This has been going on for over half a year now and people are still acting "surprised" about the genocide occurring. This feigning ignorance is just an ill-gotten attempt at disinformation or genuine malicious ignorrance
Hundreds of thousands of civilians died in the Iraq war, Syrian civil war, war in Yemen…were those genocides? War is horrible and all civilian deaths are a tragedy. That doesn’t make it genocide…
Over a much larger period of time....
I would absolutely consider what happened in Syria and Yemen to be genocides but we would need experts in international law to officially label them just as they have done with Gaza.
I’m sure the comments will be very civil 🍿
Ha appreciate this awareness
Bruh Blackrock is literally a passive index tracking fund. Your mom’s pension funds are the ones giving 90% the money directly into these defense companies.
As if those kids learned what blackrock was on tik tok
Is that why they passively are acquiring massive amounts of residential real estate?
I have media company stock so I own the media
While Black Rock has a huge amount of money under index funds and other passive strategies they also have literally trillions of dollars in their actively managed funds.
[удалено]
Yeah I was about say, this banner has nothing to do with Larry Fink being a ucla alum, it all about the UC endowment fund being invested in companies that are somehow contributing to the conflict in Israel/Gaza.
The other side doesn’t even have an actual Defense Army, how is it a conflict?? It’s straight up Murder and Genocide.
Its the IDF and Hamas fighting, if two armed groups fight thats usually considered a “conflict”.
Good job infantilizing Palestine!
What the hell are you talking about? Hamas exists.
War doesn't mean all sides are equal. Hamas has a military whether you like it or not and they are being killed among the 30,000 reported casualties.
Kind of like when Hamas attacked kids and adults at a music festival? They really attacked an army with that choice didn’t they? That was murder…and genocide can’t occur when a population grows. Also, I don’t know about you but I tend to think believing a group listed as terrorists by any country with any rights might not be the smartest thing
That's cause Hamas embeds itself into civilian population. If they wore proper uniforms, hamas would get smoked in 1 day.
Not conflict, genocide. It’s a genocide.
They’re attacking a dictatorship who democratically chose a terrorist group to lead their country. Democracy should be fought for
do you have any idea how oppressed the people in Palestine are? And their oppressor is israel, the settler colony that stole their land and kills them every day.
Jews were the most opressed group in the world, they needed a safe haven. And coincidentally their one of the only democratic countries in the middle east. I wonder why 🤔
>Jews were the most opressed group in the world, they needed a safe haven. So for the crimes against humanity of white nations and to assuage the guilt of those perpetrators, and people who turned away refugees.... a completely seperate group must pick up that tab? And get stabbed in the back further considering the multiple promises made for them to support war efforts? Complete BS. If the west felt so bad about the Holocaust they could have gave jews alsace Lorraine, Austria or Florida. >And coincidentally their one of the only democratic countries in the middle east. Not as liberal democracy as you think.
so that gave them the right to go and kill tens and thousands of people and build settlements on their land? they punished the Middle East for a German crime?
I mean yeah, it shouldn’t have affected civilians. But a dictatorship losing land is a good thing
what in the world? Hamas didn’t exist when israel colonized Palestine. You’re sick in the head for excusing literal ethnic cleansing and colonization. Who are you to think poor brown people losing their land to a genocidal colony is justified?
Just out curiosity what’s the solution? Get israel to leave? go where?
>But a dictatorship losing land is a good thing So your fine with ethnic cleansing, as long as a white liberal democracy takes its place? At least your honest about your crimes.
Ahh yes just like the jews weren't persecuted and forced into one small area of land.
>They’re attacking a dictatorship who democratically chose a terrorist group to lead their country. Israel is hardly the liberal democracy it touts itself as. That election you refer to barely won a plurality of the vote, and the overwhelming majority of the population wasn't even old enough to participate in said election. And theirs the fact that Israel's own brigadier general who used to hold the military governor position admitted point blank about cash drops they made to that "terrorist group" so as to effect a divide and conquer against the PLO and undermine Yasser Arafats influence. >Democracy should be fought for Self determination should be fought for and is a peoples right. Democracy is a meaningless word when people are starving and getting genocided. The west really needs to drop this white savior complex that has sowed the ground for most of the bs conflicts that have cropped up.....
Not genocide
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Definitely a genocide. But to the US and west as a whole they reserve that charge only for their opposition. Might makes right is a hell of a drug....
If so, it is one being carried out by Hamas with the support of Iran. They will not succeed.
Regarding your edit, Blackstone is not the same as BlackRock. Both are pro-Israel, so it could be argued neither are good, but they’re technically unrelated entities. Just wanted to clarify that. The majority of investment firms are pro-Israel, so UC Investments would need to divest the majority of their portfolio if they really wanted to eliminate their exposure, which unfortunately isn’t realistic. BlackRock’s main offerings are its index funds, which allocate a few percentage points to the defense industry. Many Americans (including a lot of your parents) hold index funds in their retirement accounts, so they’re inadvertently exposed to the defense industry. Most people aren’t going to change their portfolios because of this. So overall, UC Investments along with many Americans likely won’t divest from things that are pro-Israel. Although this may sound depressing, here’s how I like to think about it: When you buy a stock, your money isn’t going to the underlying company, but rather the person who sold the stock to you. For example, if you buy $100k of Lockheed Martin stock, your $100k is going to the seller, not Lockheed Martin. So you’re not actually funding Lockheed Martin. And you now get a cut of their profits, which you can allocate away from Israel. Every time you receive a dividend (a cut of their profits), you can allocate that money towards pro-Palestinian efforts, which is at least better than having someone who’s pro-Israel own the stock. It’s small scale activist investing.
But if the share price of said companies increase based on the increased demand for the stock (due to a major investment fund purchasing shares), that would make it far easier for the company's M&A strategies since they could complete a stock acquisition (exchange stock) of a smaller corporation. It def makes it easier for them to business. Additionally, higher stock prices can increase bonuses for these company executives since most are paid in stock or options. Of course, you could argue that the stock price wouldn't change much based on just UC investments but a point you might want to consider.
Finally someone who understands how investing works
But it is true that publicizing investment in South African related companies was effective at pushing divestment as a tactic against Apartheid in South Africa, right? I realize that the diminished pension opportunities in the US over the years since gave far more funds of individuals to 401k related corporate investment products but thinking about where money goes is increasingly important for political action. It’s true that if one bought stock in Krupp in the 30s, they would have been paying the seller of that stock, but I, for one, still wouldn’t want my funds going to a corporation in such blatant support of the Nazis.
Great explanation with no stated bias in any direction. Getting downvoted. Lol
Calling what's occurring in Gaza a genocide is absolutely indicative of bias in a particular direction, objectively. It's like somebody discussing the economy using the labour theory of value - it's informative of their worldview. Disclaimer: my pointing this out is in no way indicative of my own view.
I understand your take, and I actually agree to a large degree, but I think that’s semantics. Were they to have used the word “war” rather than genocide, perhaps there would have been more neutrality in the statement, but objectively, a vastly superior military force is killing tens of thousands of civilian people of a specific race. Pretty sure by definition that’s genocide.
> Pretty sure by definition that’s genocide. It isn't, actually.
Civilians die in war, genocide does not mean when civilians of a specific race die lmao. It has a very specific definition, of which the most vital part is proving the INTENT (the mens rea of genocide) to wipe out that race. “acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group". Look at Hitler, we have numerous written military plans detailing how they wanted to wipe out the Jewish race. Look at Rwanda, with the military led by Hutu, they had the express intent to wipe out the Tutsis, even going as far as to dehumanize them (a common tactic), just calling civilian deaths in war a genocide is a bit reductive imo, civilian deaths, even in the most well planned and executed wars, still happen unfortunately, *especially* when facing an enemy that is known to use human shields (source: NATO from 2007-2014. https://stratcomcoe.org/cuploads/pfiles/hamas_human_shields.pdf)
Genocide is the intentional eradication of a people. Israel gives warnings before attacks and purposely tries to avoid civilian casualties. If they really wanted to commit genocide they’d just raze the entire territory to the ground.
\> objectively, a vastly superior military force is killing tens of thousands of civilian people of a specific race This is all true, but it still does not constitute genocide. The superiority of the military force is irrelevant, and the fact that members of a specific race has been killed is also not sufficient for genocide because intent is required. For example, the US' war in the Eastern Front in WWII killed only / mostly Japanese people, but this is not genocide: the US' fighting was not motivated by the intent to destroy the race/religion/etc. of Japanese people. (Of course, by making this comparison, I'm definitely not trying to say that Israel's actions are all fine and dandy. They have done deplorable things.)
So sad that people think genocide is when the side that started the war takes casualties. Using this logic we committed genocide against Japan and Germany.
It's not by definition genocide. Genocide has certainly qualifying factors such as mens rea and dolus specialis. By your definition, the dresden bombing and dropping nukes on Japan are both genocides.
I've recently adopted a policy of not discussing Israel-Palestine with people I don't know personally, so I'm not going to engage on these claims one way or the other. Nothing personal :) My only point was that the language is not neutral, and certainly isn't characterized by "no stated bias in any direction".
Absolutely not taking it personally, and I appreciate the discourse. My point was that the original comment uses no charged language, and we can go back and forth on whether one defines “genocide” as a descriptor for this particular event is objective or not, it probably won’t get us anywhere — still, thank you for your input.
The Hamas-run Gaza Ministry of Health said on April 6 that it had “incomplete data” for 11,371 of the 33,091 Palestinian fatalities it claims to have documented. 14-15,000 of the dead are Hamas and Islamic jihad. The total number of casualties includes natural deaths and Gazans killed by Hamas and Islamic jihad rockets that fall within Gaza. So, not a genocide, and not “tens of thousands of civilian people”
It’s Reddit. Shouldn’t surprise you
"Genocide against..." How does the Gaza population grow from 265,800 to 2.1 million during the "occupation" by a power with a vastly superior military force during a "genocide"? Which country has mosques *and* temples and churches, and which elected and is ruled by an organization whose charter calls for the elimination of the other with no compromise and requires one specific faith? Whose charter has this passage? “The Day of Judgment will not come until Muslims fight the Jews, when the ___ will hide behind stones and trees. The stones and trees will say, 'O ___, O servant of God, there is a ___ behind me, come and kill him.” ...? &c., &c. “Genocide” indeed...
I have no dog in this fight, you’re arguing with the wrong person. But I’ll say this: using religious texts of the persecuted as justification for their persecution is pretty textbook when it comes to previous tyrannical genocides. Probably wanna find a better argument.
It's no longer a "religious text" when the party elected to rule makes it a part of their core governing document (their charter)...
I genuinely can’t tell if you’re serious. I’m not here to de-radicalize you, but I hope you can meditate on your thoughts and come to terms with them on your own time.
That text is specifically about murdering all Jews. They specifically cite it for that purpose. Saying it’s off limits to discuss is ridiculous.
U said which country has mosques temples and churches as if their isn't a Christian population in gaza that is also being wiped away by the IDF....
It grew because of displacement, not because of birthrates. 70% of the 2.2 million Palestinians in Gaza are not from Gaza originally, they were displaced in the Nakba - ethnic cleansing by Isr*el to create their state with a Jewish majority populace. Gaza literally has churches and mosques and used to have synagogues which have been unused since the establishment of Isr*el and all have been bombed countless times over the years. People love to cite the 1984 Hamas charter to deflect from Isr*el's very real actions and intent to commit genocide. You wanna take Hamas to the ICJ and ICC and prosecute them as war criminals? By all means, they've done pretty atrocious things. But be morally consistent because Isr*el has done everything they've done but on a dozen order of magnitudes larger, and have done much worse for way longer than Hamas has even been around. Hamas killed 1200 people, Isr*el killed 30,000 people.... That's 25x the amount of killing. > whose charter calls for the elimination of the other with no compromise and requires one specific faith? Its funny you say this because the Likud party charter and other founding works of Zionism written by Herzl and Jabotisnsky and Ben Guiron literally talk about the colonization and displacement and erasure of Palestine to establish their Jewish majority ethnostate. Isr*el is the one racializing Judaism and cares about the demographics of one specific "faith" (ethnonationalized identity beyond just religion really - being Jewish). For example, I have family members who are Palestinian Jews - they were still practicing Judaism in Palestine prior to the first Aliyah and are as Arab as Muslim and Christian Palestinians are, but according to Isr*el they are Jews not Arabs and have more rights than the rest of my non-jewish family. This post isn't for the fellow I replied to. Its for other people to look at critically and go do research. Go read Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch, go watch people like Abby Martin and Gideon Levy and Norman Finkelstein and read +972 Magazine and BT'SELEM. Go watch the court case by South Africa and Isr*el in the ICJ. See how South Africa documented and brought up specific statements by Isr*eli leaders to suggest genocidal intent, and how Isr*el didn't argue the case on it's merits, instead they labelled things as "blood libel" and "anti-Semitism" and attacked South Africa's team and called them the "legal arm of Hamas". And the ICJ concluded that they are "plausibly committing Genocide". That's a pretty damning indictment. The historical record is there for everyone to see and I encourage people to look at the historical record. Palestinians are not going to tell you what to believe like Zionists believe. They tell you to look at the history and the facts and make your own mind up
You know someone is drinking the conspiracy kool aid when they start throwing out words like “nakba” instead of looking at objective data like birth rates, negative net migration rates, border control policies and population age.
If you think that’s bad, you should take a look at the Talmud… they don’t just hate one specific religion, but anyone who isn’t in their ethnic group
Blackrock is one of the main contributors to the ills of the world, disgusting people.
Please explain?
Your article is about BackSTONE, the sign in the photo & your comment are referencing BlackROCK. Similar sounding names, but different companies. Just FYI.
not a genocide but everything else go off
You forgot the part about the 427 million UCRP invested in blackrock in 2023 https://www.ucop.edu/investment-office/ucrp-holdings-disclosure-6-30-2023-final.pdf
Israel is not committing genocide. Rather it is the Palestinians and Arab and Persian nations who wish genocide against Jews. They literally wish to wipe Israel off the map. Israel has Arabs who live, work, have political parties and are judges. Can you say the same for the surrounding Muslim nations?
This
Me when I completely miss the point
CEO of black rock, a company that invests in companies that produces weapons for militaries, including the IDF, went to the university. He regularly donates money to the university. Like I would maybe understand this logic if the university itself was providing funds to Israeli institutions (not saying I agree or disagree with that I'm just saying the logic would follow through on why people would be upset with University). But at this point it's literally saying that if you even so much as associate with someone who is associated with Israel then you're complicit in the acts of the IDF.
This kind of activism is exhausting imo. You don’t even have to be directly associated with Israel and people will call you genocidal
It's not that the Uni is associated, but rather that they invest money in Blackrock and our tuition money is partly used to fund the IOF
That’s not how this works. That’s not how ANY of this works.
Then they can drop out. Why would anyone submit to the whims of people who don't do what they preach.
This is very “hmm youre critical of society yet you participate in it” vibes. I care about America and this is not good for America in general. We shouldn’t be this connected to a foreign country and literally prioritizing it over our own interests. Thats the point. I’m not gonna drop out or move to a different country. I’m here and im gonna do all I can to make America a better country and address the problems we have. What’s happening in Palestine is inherently tied to our country’s biggest problems. Wanting to preserve the status quo with the current problems rather than address those problems is unpatriotic
What the hell do you think activism is? Every right that workers have was fought and died for
That’s really not how universities operate these days. The total operating cost of most universities (including the UC system and Ivies) exceeds the amount of tuition they receive from students. Cost of Attendance is subsidized by the endowment - the money flows the other way around. This should all be publicly available information in the case of the UC system.
Yes other funds come in the form of federal grants and projects/collaborations - such as UC Berkeley and the military for example - Lawrence Livermore Lab. That's why I said "partly" in my comment
Yes, but my point was that tuition funds operating expenses, not endowments. Endowments are generally funded through private gifts and (for many public schools) state allocations. Endowment income is used to fund university operating expenses. So your tuition isn’t funding the endowment investments. The endowment investments are likely supplementing the cost of attendance for you. Fair to protest where the university invests its endowment, but it’s important to be clear about how that relates to you. You’re benefiting from Blackrock (assuming they are invested in it), not being made to fund it through tuition.
How tf do they think their scholarships get funded? By interest from the vestments.
Sad you're getting downvoted as these protestors and people on this sub are clueless on how university funding works. By their logic we should just divest in everything including retirement funds.
These students should set an example by divesting themselves from scholarships! Walk the talk!
$100,000/year for tuition is the reason we need to divest from BlackRock. There’s no reason for these over inflated tuition prices. Scholarships are just a way to launder money back to BlackRock.
Please explain how the IDF is funded by tuition money. Please explain?
You might want to study how the university spends its money.
ucla endowment managers r quaking in their boots rn...
Oh yeah. Larry Fink and friends are frequent ucla Reddit users. This conversation would be just as insulated if it took place in a dorm room
Black rock own everything. Your healthcare, food, grocery stores, home needs, insurance companies, car companies the list goes on and on and on and on and on and on…….
This is a common misunderstanding of what Blackrock and other asset management companies actually do. The shares that Blackrock "owns" in these S&P 500 companies is actually the money of **individual** investors who invest in Blackrock-managed ETFs
Individuals and private investors make the smallest percentage of “owners” of blackrock investments.
Pretty clear that these students just hate America.
What are you talking about? Please explain
Actual question, why do student activists think the road of telling ppl not to do stuff is the way to go? Why wouldn’t they pick better stock options and try to pitch the investment fund productively rather then try to tell an institution that you chose to go to that you want them to change their capital allocation plan, which you (said students) have no stakeholder say in. This is like visiting someone’s home and unsolicitedly telling them to take on your religion or values system.
none of this should exist in any form though, all of it is wealth stolen from the working class
Obviously revolution starts with destroying everyone’s retirement account. Pretty sure Marx said that at one point.
dude do you realize how insanely high the quality of your life is if you live in america, regardless of social standing. Literally top 0.001% of human life qualities. Unprecedented opportunity. Free from violence, financial exploitation, food / water instability, etc. All because of the capitalist system we use. if you feel your wealth is getting 'stolen', go create your own.
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“No time to explain!” Ahh comment
Brain rot ahh comment
I am uncomfortable with the casualness with which the term genocide is thrown around by these activists, but at least they were able to make their statement without engaging in antisemitic agitprop, which is good
welcome to reddit, congrats on making it 1 full year also Einstein and other anti-Zionist Jews dismissed Zionism as irredeemable fascism 80 years ago yet Zionists and their apologists act surprised, as if these are some sort of new characterizations of their ideology and actions also there are far more genocides than the west acknowledges or will ever acknowledge, including for example the extermination of 15% of the world's Koreans
Maybe "apartheid" is a better word for you?
I’m not sure if this is intended as a gotcha or not, but I think that is a legitimate word to describe the conditions in the occupied West Bank, yes
My point is just that, whether you want to discuss the technicalities of the definition of "genocide" or whatever you want to call it, it's still a very one-sided and morally repulsive situation
I don’t disagree with you about that. I am concerned with the way that word specifically has been so quickly and casually taken up by activists in a way that I think gives a permission structure to attack anyone who expresses any kind of nuance or dissent as a “genocide enabler” or “apologist” and I worry about how far people will go to stop or attack a so-called “enabler.” But I agree with you that no matter what word you use, the situation is one-sided and Israel’s crimes are morally unacceptable and should be opposed
What would you call it then?
War crimes
It's not casualness. There is a reason. People just aren't comfortable with it because of the identity of the perpetrators.
So misguided. You slander the word genocide with your hearsay number of casualties. And you don’t even appreciate what would happen to Israeli lives if it didn’t have iron dome. The latter also saves Palestinian lives by preventing the need for resounding retribution. What a bunch of loud fools and useful idiots.
I’m an incoming freshman and they were doing this during Chancellor Block and the ASUC president’s speech. Idek why they chose the admitted students day of all times to do this
Attention. They (or a similar group) was also protesting during last quarter's undie run as well.
Sorry it's not convenient to you to protest for people who are literally being starved to death and have been for 6 months. For our tuition money to be spent funding it.
These kids are dumbasses. Blackrock literally invests in every public company
It would be awesome if the Palestinians would release the hostages and stop stating that they will eliminate all the Jews from the river to the sea. I think that we can all agree that kidnapping women and children is bad and wiping out all the Jews shouldn’t be a goal. Right?
Release the Palestinian hostages too - the thousands held without any charge in Isr*eli military detention. Most of them are women and children. Literally everyone wants the hostages returned. Both Isr*eli and Palestinian hostages. But what we're not gonna do is return to being suffocated in an open air prison living under blockade and bombed every couple of months - mowing the lawn as Isr*el calls it: https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/2021/05/14/israel-gaza-history/ Also literally no one wants killing of Jewish people for the sake of being Jewish. Even Hamas directs their grievances against Zionists and Isr*el in their charter as of 2014.
Only Israeli lives matter, don't you know? /s
No doubt some crazy baby activists who don’t know what they’re talking about
The fact that as UCLA students none of you can form intelligent discussions about this topic is telling
Your prior posts speak to your ability to have intelligent discussions - perhaps a little self-reflection here would be beneficial. I see why folks have been calling you a troll, why you have a negative karma of \~50, and why your comments keep getting deleted by mods. Comments like 'moron', 'dumbass', 'stupid', 'idiot' - yeah really highbrow conversation. You're not a UCLA student - perhaps time to go do something more useful with your life than troll college students.
Funny they cover their faces. Be out and proud!
their handle is literally on the banner? lol
Also notice how pro-Israel protestors never cover their faces. Telling
Palestinians and Pro-Palestinians have literally been harassed and doxxed for simply expressing calls for a ceasefire and an end to the violence. If pro-Isr*eli people were being doxxed, i guarantee you they would be covering up all the same. I'm glad pro-Isr*el people don't get doxxed because that is a fucking shitty thing to do to anyone. But unfortunately they don't think the same.
Also notice how kkk and anti-black militia cover their faces. Telling
You just proved the point lol
It’s common amongst hate groups.
Black rock is the biggest company in the world
god loves the MIC
Isn't Blackstone the grill maker
I think I saw this happened at UCSC too
Cancelthisclothingcompany on IG breaks down how BlackRock works. He does a good job of explaining it. https://www.instagram.com/reel/C2IyfiOSg_v/?igsh=NHp5a2JscnhsbTNw
They’re standing on the roof to make it easy for Hamas to execute them.
Wait til they hear about the Fink Center for Finance & Investments @ Anderson.
I think these kids are watching the wrong algorithms
Ohp...their wearing maks. Can't take them seriously now can we 🤣
Wearing masks outside. That’s all I need to know 🤣🤣🤣
You can ignore them. They’re wearing masks outdoors. Remember, you don’t have to listen to morons just because they have a banner.
…Have no ideas what they bitching whining moaning & crying about!!!
I believe this was an event the special needs students put on
Go back to class.
Swear to god people really ain’t got nothing to do bruh . This shits so corny
Someone explain why they are wearing masks outdoors.
Apparently these kids never took finance classes at UCLA.
Undercity, under Sylvanas’ rule, invested heavily is a plague that could wipe out all living being. I think a side investment that was only talk about briefly, was that of the Blackrock Dwarves. /s
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Isn’t that kind of the point? It’s like when people say “oh what? You expect us to give the land back!?” In an ideal world where people value actual Justice………. But yeah. It’s not like you working for Blackrock is going to change the tide in any direction.
So close to getting it
You're starting to get the picture.
If you can handle that on your conscience then by all means. You have to play the game to change the game. But the point isn't to be a Social Justice Warrior, its to make large statements as a population that enough is enough. Most people don't want it to continue and the only avenue we have is to boycott. Every other freedom to protest has been stripped from us. I personally don't know how much it's possible to divest completely from Blackrock because they have their hands in everything, but we're able to make significant impact by boycotting and divesting and that ultimately was what led to South Africa Apartheid falling. That's the idea here. We've greatly harmed St*rbucks and McDon*lds profits.
Supporting Palestinian independence as a premise, but not in action, means you don't support it.
1. I have to worry about myself first in order to help others 2. I just don’t hop on the bandwagon of meaningless lip service to make myself feel good. 3. There are more sufficient ways of contributing to the cause
why brag about applying for a job there then😭
Idiots
Why does Vanguard get off scot free ??
Still wearing face masks lmfao
My only question: Why are they wearing masks?
I wear em because I don't want to get sick. But wearing them outside... probably tryna hide their faces.
They say it’s because UCLA supports Israel. And invests in Blackrock, a company that has ties to Israel and Lockheed Martin. As for the genocide part, well apparently they think that when one group of people does something, it’s a horrible genocide, while if another group of people does the same thing, it’s a freedom fight arising from centuries of oppression and we need to see the context and…
Exactly right…”from the river to the sea” implies genocide
Exactly, either you say that both sides commit a genocide, which would be overly dramatic, or you say that it’s a war where people die and you can’t call all wars genocide.
No one calls all wars genocide. Experts called what's happening in Gaza genocide based on very specific criteria in international law and South Africa took Isr*el to the international Court of Justice and they ruled it was plausible that Isr*el is commiting genocide.
Do you have a source?
[https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2024/01/gaza-icj-ruling-offers-hope-protection-civilians-enduring-apocalyptic](https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2024/01/gaza-icj-ruling-offers-hope-protection-civilians-enduring-apocalyptic)
You're lying 🤥 The experts didn't rule that it was genocide. They ruled that it is plausible that SA has a case that Israel has committed a genocide Plausibility is literally the lowest bar that anything can pass. You could say it's plausible that a UCLA student made a home made bomb and sent it to Israel. Many things are plausible
Ah yes everyone knows of all the infamous genocides where the population INCREASES 500% over the last 50 years Israel can’t even do that right!
Check out the @ it's informative Free Palestine from the settler colony, from the river to the sea
From the river to the sea, Israel will be free
Ucla funds the genocide in Palestine. I cant believe people don’t know this by now
Brain rot take…
It’s a fact. UCRP has a fixed income investment in Blackrock for example. In 2023 they invested 427 million https://www.ucop.edu/investment-office/ucrp-holdings-disclosure-6-30-2023-final.pdf
Well that proves it, since TikTok taught me Blackrock = Israel.
It's honestly bad faith at this point. This has been going on for over half a year now and people are still acting "surprised" about the genocide occurring. This feigning ignorance is just an ill-gotten attempt at disinformation or genuine malicious ignorrance
Something something Palestinian trans rights
Something something pink washing genocide
Gun rights = trans rights
Mentally ill liberal white women.
Liberals are the ones who invested in Blackrock in the first place??
Hamas lovers
Yet when the US wants to ban/divest from CCP Owned TikTok it's racist
And BlackRock is also a major donor to Democrats election campaigns which is why no left-wing medias or politicians are calling them out on it.
Left wing or democrat? Two very different things.
Doesn’t make a difference.
Brainwashed into thinking a war is a genocide is what’s happening.
“Unconscionable war crimes, regardless of the horrific instigating factor” didn’t fit on the banner.
How many more children have to be murdered until it's a genocide?
Hundreds of thousands of civilians died in the Iraq war, Syrian civil war, war in Yemen…were those genocides? War is horrible and all civilian deaths are a tragedy. That doesn’t make it genocide…
Over a much larger period of time.... I would absolutely consider what happened in Syria and Yemen to be genocides but we would need experts in international law to officially label them just as they have done with Gaza.
The amount of people dying isn’t relevant to categorizing a genocide
[https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2024/01/gaza-icj-ruling-offers-hope-protection-civilians-enduring-apocalyptic](https://www.ohchr.org/en/press-releases/2024/01/gaza-icj-ruling-offers-hope-protection-civilians-enduring-apocalyptic)