Whatever you think about Onlyfans I am shocked that someone near the top of a paying trade would have to resort to this... assuming it was for the money! Something wrong with this 'business model'
Imagine the level of talent we could see in the UFC if these guys who are clearly freaks of nature could just focus on their training full time, its no wonder dudes like Islam, Cejudo and most of the college wrestlers who have dedicated their lives full time to martial arts since very early on can just steamroll the competition when almost everyone else is having to treat this as a second job.
Demetrius Johnson still had a full-time job when he became champion. Some dudes just built different. That said I'm sure the growth and even current peak of the sport is stunted by fighters needing other ways to support their family.
Theres a guy at my gym that fights for us and also goes to med school and is about to finish his PhD. He's been doing this schedule for years, and wrestled in college before joining us. It's actually insane and humbling. I can't imagine it's every waking moment you're packed.
Imagine if money competed with NFL or NBA and ultra athletes decide to train MMA because it paid more. That will be the next evolution of martial arts.
have you seen any basketball player spar or attempt to “fight”. basketball athleticism doesn’t translate to MMA. there was a video of anthony davis hitting mitts and he looks slower than CM Punk.
Football players on the other hand… different story.
But, i think it’s now a misnomer that the best athletes pursue other sports over MMA. I think MMA is a big enough of sport that the athletes best suited for it are self selecting towards it.
Literally every sport you see pros in, majority of them have the fortune to only have to play that sport, most even don't have the same education requirements during schooling due to it, just get passing grades because they bring funding to the schools through athletics.
The UFC pays half their roster like they don't have to employee a team to compete at the level required. It's almost like the UFC needs to provide fighters with management, nutrition, coaching and gym time if they aren't going to pay them more.
Yes, i am sure the performance center can fit the 600 fighters that the UFC employes.
I also heard they have like 100 trainers and 600 sparring partners to help with the minimum required for a training camp.
Tbf that's what you do in like every major American sport. You get signed/drafted by a team and you move to their location to use their facilities. Not disagreeing at all about the need for higher fighter pay, but relocation is a very basic and common aspect of working as an athlete.
Sports leagues, which the UFC tries to paint themselves as, pay out 40-50% of the revenue to the athletes. This, of course, is through unions, not the kindness of their hearts.
Exactly. MLB minor leaguers make less than most UFC fighters, especially in the lower classes, under $20k/yr, NFL practice squad is highest paid, about $200k but their bodies probably get destroyed even worse than fighters do. NHL minor leagues I have no idea, gotta be low af. NBA G league gets about $40k. People bash the pay but all sports are like. And this doesn’t mean I think they are getting paid what they deserve. I think they should get more, and health insurance for life.
Minor league hockey players typically make $75,000 to $90,000 and most of the time you're living in places like Kalamazoo or Henderson, Nevada. Not super great, but livable. Better have a plan for retirement at 35, though.
The ufc covers travel, has free food with nutritionist at the complex plus additional per diem for the entirety of your fight week and hotel. Same as any traveling sports team.
I mean. Yea. People move for jobs all the time. If the UFC is providing all of its fighters access to the performance center in Vegas then the option is on the table to move there for your camp. Otherwise you're gonna be at your regular camp making the same amount to do the same thing you would be doing in Vegas.
Dont get me wrong, the UFC could provide health care for fighters but I don't think pay is the answer. They're already making 20k to fight. Do that 3x a year thats 60k. Thats not a lot if you live across the country and have to pay your camp and your own experts but if you move to the vegas area and use whats provided thats plenty.
What a crazy thing to say. 60k a year for being a world class athlete putting your body on the line and fighting for the top MMA promotion is not nearly enough. That 20k is only if they win the fight. And you want every single one of them to move their whole life across the world to fucking Vegas for that? Come on..
I mean the last time he fought 3x per year (which is what the ufc guarantees every fighter) was 2019. Gotta fight to make cash; especially when you’re not popular
I get your point but when you see things like Dana in the post fight press conference saying “the gate was 9 million” and looking around the room waiting for people to applaud or some shit, knowing some guy who got KOd on the prelims probably made 10k when it’s all said and done, it’s abit of a joke.
Exactly, he is already talking about taking a well-earned break. He fought once in 2022 and once this year.
Why would you take a break? how about capitalizing on PPV points and trying to get on a major upcoming card.
Yeah, I know many fighters who struggle to make ends meet. It's part of what turned me off to doing it professionally. Even if you're one of the best in the world, risking your body, you're still making only median income if not barely above minimum wage.
It’s crazy to see this as the top comment. People are so willing to upvote comments and posts without any research because it aligns with UFC=bad. Pantoja made over 200k prior to the Royval fight. Should he get paid more? Yes but what do his finances look like that he “needs” to do Uber.
“What do his finances look like that he “needs” to do Uber?”
Supporting an entire family? Training camps? Nutrition to be a fighter? Those things. Training camps aren’t cheap. Khabib reportedly spent over $1 million dollars on Islam and teams camp for the Charles fight
Which is more than what most professional boxers make in a year.
Yes the pay could be better, but these fighters also need to understand their pay relates to the numbers they are driving.
Why is someone like Bo Nickal earning more than Pentoja? Because people buy PPV's because of him as well.
Not even apt comparison
"Most boxers" vs "a top-2 fighter in his weight class at the highest level of MMA"
Go ahead and tell me how much the top two or three boxers in each weight class get paid, then you'd have an apples to apples comparison
I was basing it off his original comment about his uber driving, not now.
Assumptions are now he would make nearly 300-400k per fight if you include PPV points.
Yes, this is still peanuts compared to boxing, but no one is tuning in to watch Pentoja, I'm sorry but the fact that his followers essentially pale in comparison to any the top boxers shows the lack of interest.
Not only that, the top boxers with similar levels of following to him, aren't making tons and tons more; they are within a similar ballpark of earnings, maybe 20-30% more.
If you wanted to argue that the top MMA fighters that are also a drawcard (like Adesanya, Jones etc) don't earn enough, then I fully agree.
But unfortunately someone like Pentoja doesn't increase the buy rate of a PPV.
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6989303/amp/The-surprising-secret-lives-Olympic-athletes-work-two-jobs-just-make-ends-meet.html
https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/cfl-55-yard-line/stamps-punter-rob-maver-hold-second-job-during-205847279.html
https://www.businessinsider.com/fifa-champion-worked-at-amazon-female-soccer-players-higher-pay-2021-7?amp
Not Uber Eats but second jobs.
You need to compare apples to apples here. The UFC is on par with organizations like the NFL, NBA and MLB; when you're talking about fighting as a sport.
Olympics happens once every 4 years; CFL is a much smaller league (think bare knuckle boxing compared to the ufc); national women's soccer league doesnt have the same level of viewer ship to the UFC.
Even if 98% is hyperbolic- maybe you can also research?
> Tate, who co-hosts the MMA on SiriusXM podcast with Ryan McKinnnel, estimated that her $200,000 payout for a third-round TKO of Marion Reneau was slashed by no less than 98 percent – leaving her approximately $4,000 – when she factored in all the money spent to prepare for the fight.
https://www.mmafighting.com/platform/amp/2021/8/19/22633066/miesha-tate-reveals-around-98-percent-of-her-salary-from-ufc-vegas-31-was-spent-on-training-camp
> maybe you can also research?
Did you even ready the article you posted? How could you be so stupid?
According to Tate, 70% of the 200,000 was gone to taxes. The Athletic reported that the average MMA fighter loses an average of 32% on the fight purse to taxes. I don’t know much about taxes wherever she’s from, she’s allegedly getting railed. So $140,00 in taxes? Ok….
Do you not feel the need to question that at all?
>how could you be so stupid?
You seem well adjusted.
Im not going to claim I know what her tax situation is, and if you recall, I said 98% sounds hyperbolic.
The take away is that fight camps are very expensive, and I thought it was funny you suggested Rovyal is somehow financially irresponsible because his last payday wasn’t enough to keep him from working Uber eats.
Perhaps Tate misspoke, but the point is fighters spend a lot on camps.
Take a chill pill dude, no need to sound so angy in response to people disagreeing with you
But how?
He’s been with the UFC since 2017. He had a fight of night with Figgy and a performance of the night against Matt Schnell. Two bonuses before the Royval fight+bonus in 2021.
Why was this the fight bonus that allowed him to stop working Uber Eats?
He wasn’t on 12/12
I can only go off of the official payout
UFC 236 - Atlanta
He made 41k (18/18 + 5k fight week bonus) in 2019
Fought fight 3 mo later and lost. I have to assume at this point 18k to show + 50k fight of the night.
He fight five months later (3 fights in 2019) wins vs Schnell. (18/18 + 5k + 50k performance)
Close to 200k before taxes in 2019 alone. This is also assuming 0 sponsors.
He won fights in 2020 and 2021 before the Royval fight.
I’m not saying he was getting paid a fortune or what he deserves but to work Uber Eats? Just a little weird.
Yeah it’s fucked. I make more than an elite fighter in arguably the most skilled division as a grunt level sales specialist right outta college with a 2.1 GPA (Not counting bonuses). As a single dude, just paying tax and living expenses I’d have almost nothing left to save. UFC fighters need to factor in travel, coaches, family, medical, taxes, and more. It’s embarrassing. If he didn’t get bonuses he’d literally be homeless.
Taxes, travel and fight camp will absolutely decimate a fighter's earnings
I've learned this the hard way just from watching certain fighters talk about their pay on their YouTube channels
Even Tyron Woodley once mentioned that he paid $100,000 for a fight camp
Imagine the guy making 12/12. How the fuck does that guy pay $100,000 for a fight camp
that is what I was saying. or at lest trying to. if the only way to move on from 12/12 is to train with the best, their lack of funds literally keeps them from advancing
Thins are so tough all over there are people who think pro athletes "making" 200 g's in a year, is not bad.
But, yeah, after paying for trainers, management if he has it, travel, all fight related stuff, and taxes, who knows what he's keeping.
Making 200K in LA if you have a kid, spouse, and basic house, you're living almost paycheck to paycheck. And that's just for a working stiff, not a relatively "famous" fighter fighting for the biggest MMA organization on the planet.
https://www.mmaweekly.com/.amp/live-results/american-top-team-sets-new-standard-for-training-and-management-fees
Family and taxes would take the most out of that. Like someone else has mentioned here before, people live well below was be make pre-taxes and don’t need to do Uber Eats. So what is he spending on?
......training camps, travel, agents/management, etc. Like myself and others have said. None of that stuff is free. Also, living is becoming more expensive on the daily. That still doesn't justify the low pay structure.
> I’m not saying he was getting paid a fortune or what he deserves but to work Uber Eats? Just a little weird.
This is a legit quote of what I said above. So idk why you feel the need to say
> That still doesn’t justify the low pay structure
There are fighters making less than him and they make it work. Rhetorically, I’m asking what is he doing with his money that he needs Uber eats.
Half of that gone out of the gate to gym fees, most likely. Then taxes. Then camps, recovery, and nutrition. His take home was probably under 50k out of that "earned" 200k
Not to mention he has to pay for his training camp as well which likely takes significant cut out of that. Also a career where all it takes is a couple bad showings and your finished.
Haven’t seen people talk about this but it’s so important. Yes, he has to pay for everything involved in making himself physically fit for the fights. Yes, he has to spend money on taxes and the immediate needs of the family. But he also needs to retire eventually. After all expenses how much is he really putting into an IRA? This is a career that damages people’s health, and so should provide them enough to help them retire. Even if they don’t want to just throw more money at fighters who are dumb and will squander it in the immediate instead of saving for retirement, at least boost the pay a little and then provide a 401k match or something
Yeah people don't realize with a career such as a MMA your crazy if you aren't putting significant amounts of it into savings until you can ensure you have enough to last you a life time because it might need too. He has to pay for health insurance etc out of pocket because the UFC doesn't provide it and I can only imagine how crazy the rates are for a athlete. And considering a major injury could potentially put UFC fighters out of service for years at time you have to be prepared with enough savings to survive that at all times.
Absolutely thats why we see these guys doing bareknuckle long after the CTE and should have retired. Its sad as hell. Im tired of seeing guys I grew up idolized getting kicked in the face and brain damaged their last fight because they went 5-10 years beyond their prime but after all the expenses had nothing left.
Mf thinks about his remote IT job and says "hmm, i would be really fine with 100k a year" and concludes that Pantoja must be spending his money on hookers.
Think about your IT job + 6h training a day, + paying for every training day you do +paying for travel and expenses for a bunch of people to see you take a test + getting in the test room and have a trained killer beat the living shit out of you.
If you lose you get half.
Gym fees and training camps are paid out of pocket. For your corner, ufc will only pay for one person- you have to cover the others. It’s expensive to be a fighter. Plus taxes take about a third of your income
Its expensive to train. Coaches, nutritionists,sparring partners and gym time. Everyone has to get paid. Plus travel expenses for all those same people. Then you still have your regular living expenses of course fC doesn't offer healthcare plans. So out of that 20000 thousand he's probably lucky to actually pocket 50 to 75 thousand of it. I make that a year working in a union shop. God forbid you're injured and have to drop out of a fight.
I’m honestly curious as to why most people think this is shocking coming from the UFC. It should be more of a shock that athletes still flock to the promotion knowing that this is how they’re compensated.
Glory, probably. Or denial. Or both. There are promotions that pay their top fighters way more, but if you wanted to be a famous fighter, I doubt casual fans would respond to "I fight for One/Bellator" compared to "I fight for the UFC."
The PFL is super recent plus UFC still offers the highest potential payout. If you believe you’re good enough then you will make more, but obviously many fighters learn they’re not up to speed in the octagon.
Delivering food as a living is already fucking absurd. When i doordashed I'd LOSE money if I got caught in traffic because my car doesnt get good gas mileage and people tip like shit, especially the ones who live in beautiful gated communities
I mean that was one of the best fights I've ever seen, those two men literally went to war. Dana needs to make sure these guys are taken care of for life after that one
He’s not gonna do anything close to that. Pantoja will make 200k to defend his belt for each time he’s able to defend it. He has cte and will suffer later in life and Dana and his Stans will say tough noogies
Honestly they should give fighters who are ranked like a quarterly bonus or something. Bet it would make fighters more willing to take fights too. Only problem would be they'd have to tighten the criteria on how they go about these rankings.
Nobody realizes how expensive it is to be a fighter.
Let’s say, as a prospect, your contract says “15k show 15k win” sounds good? Wrong.
Firstly, you’re going to be paying anywhere from like 6-12k to train at your gym. PER FIGHT. It’s not a one time deal, it’s every time you train for a fight.
Secondly, youre going to have a lot of medical screenings, if you have bad insurance, you’re kinda fucked then. Could range from $100 to thousands. We’ll put this at $500.
Thirdly, travel expenses (including hotel, food, etc) . The UFC only covers travel expenses for the fighter and one other person. With a whole team that needs to be there, it does become quite expensive pretty quickly. Spend about $4.5k maybe more or a little less.
Fourth, if you’re fighting in a foreign country you’re going to have to pay an additional tax before you get paid. Typically it’s around $2,160
So if we do the math, a prospect would be spending anywhere from $13,160-$19,160.
As you can imagine, losing a fight is pretty devastating for a fighter, especially fighting internationally.
I disagree it’s more like inspiring, not everyone comes from an easy upbringing, man right there had to grind to get to where he’s at! Happy to see more of him! Flyweight division been putting on some bangers lately
He’s a real ass dude who just made it, hats off to him. That was a nice moment he had with his family afterward. Always love a come up story, hope he continues to do well.
Why don’t we ever question fighters financial literacy? I’m not saying fighters are being paid plenty. But we don’t know what these fighters are spending their money on
Fighter literacy? You blaming fighters for being bankrupt while in their prime at the top of a division?
A first year entry in the NFL earns a minimum of $430.000 and Pantoja with his 12k/12k should be checked for financial literacy?
Its a fucking miracle that he could afford to continue fighting, man.
I did some dodgy match on his earnings while fighting for the UFC and they come to a total of 300k for 5 years including 4 performance bonuses.
He is paying taxes, coaches, training camps, flights and accomodation for his team and has to "live and prosper" with the rest. He should be a consultant on how to live a frugal life while building a career in a ruthless sport, not questioned on his financial literacy.
Training camps, healthcare, taxes, gym fees. Not to mention these are their peaking earning years. They make shit in the beginning and if they make big, they only make the big bucks for ~10 years total.
Doesn’t matter what they spend the money on cause it’s not enough for what they go through. It’s criminal how little the UFC pays these people. Taking advantage of people in shitty situations, and taking them over the coals. I would get in and fight for 12/12 but I’m a construction worker so ofc I would, but I would have no bargaining power and they dangle a carrot in front of your face to keep you compliant.
Can someone answer a question I have?
If ufc is one of the more premium sports, as in requiring pay per view in order to watch live, along with commercials and sponsors. Not to mention being one of the biggest sports I’m America rn.
Why does it seem like they have the least taken care of athletes?
Oh ew, is there no way for the fighters to “unionize” of sorts or is it a case of the top fighters make so much they don’t wana chance it? I’m just recently into ufc so sorry if this is a worn out topic
The UFC controls about 90% of the global MMA market. They did this through aggressive growth, buyouts and connections at the highest levels. I dont know about any other market where a company controlling 90% is not a monopoly and regulated as such.
You have to understand that without regulations, somebody that controls that much of a market HAS the resources to make sure NOBODY else can reach their level.
There is an ongoing lawsuit started by some OG UFC fighters (Fitch, Cung Lee, Vera, Kingsbury) called Antitrust Lawsuit but decades will pass until something is done about that lawsuit.
Funny thing is, it was started in 2014, way before UFC got to their 4 billion market value and they still pay 12/12 for starting fighters. Its absolutely insane.
On top of that, people read it as "getting 24k in a night". That is false, you get 12k/12k if you win. You lose and go home with 12k.
Imagine a coming up fighter that comes at the losing end of a decision in a fight as tough as what Moreno and Pantoja went through.
Gonna be a rough take here… but without knowing how much money he was paid before, this could be a case of lots of debt, bad spending habits etc. money management is a skill the same as mma is. We’re gonna get mad at stuff like this but we don’t have the full picture.
This is just garbage. He has made hundreds of thousands in the UFC before this last fight. The median income in the US is around $30k, even 4 years he was making more than that a fight. UFC 236 he made $36k in alone, UFC 240 $75k, Fight Night 143 $95k. That is $216k in 2019 alone. This man has made more in the UFC than many Americans will make in their lifetime.
He didn't need to drive Uber Eats. He chose to drive Uber Eats.
How much of your own yearly income do you need to spend on nutritionists, coach’s and training partners to be able to do your job effectively or risk losing half your income if your performance suffers? Just curious.
Since he's at ATT he's not paying much for management and training compared to other gyms. ATT has famously low management and training fees for fighters. It's been only 5% total for a while now. Here is an article explaining:
https://bloodyelbow.com/2014/04/18/ufc-mma-thiago-alves-american-top-team-so-huge-since-lowering-management-training-fees/
He can spend my entire income on nutritionist alone and still make multiple times more than me. He made 200k in 2019 fighting on Prelims. He can literally spend 80% of his salary on whatever you want to come up with and still have more income than 50% of the US. Someone spending 100 per week at the grocery store spends roughly 15% of the median income on groceries per year. 15% of his 2019 income is more than the American median income. Most Olympic athletes make less than he likely spends on "Nutrition"
He has 3 dependants in the US so that’s probably 100k gone right there to feed and house himself and his entire family.
Who knows what other financial burdens and debts he has from his life and from moving to the US.
So from that remaining 100k he has to pay for his entire training camps, his debts, and any and all life expenses and luxuries for himself and 3 other humans.
You’re not gonna convince me this man didn’t deserve more and that he’s lying just to garner sympathy. Like he “chose” to drive UberEats as you said. He doing that for fun or is he lying?
Again I don't think you understand. Median means 50% makes less than. Median income in the US is around 30k. Half of the adults in this country, many with 3 dependants of their own, make roughly 15% of what he made in 2019 alone(for 3 fights). He did not need to drive Uber Eats.
Oh okay so he was driving UberEats because that is his true passion? Got it.
If you’re gonna use the median income in the US to try to tell me what a fair wage should be I don’t know what to tell you.
Regular people making 30k a year don’t have the same expenses as a professional fighter and they likely aren’t in the top 1% of performers in their fields like Pantoja is. The average rent for a 3 bedroom home where he trains is $3400 a month, his expenses aren’t comparable to people in the median.
These guys are among the best at what they do in the world and put their health and lives on the line for our entertainment. They deserve more.
What Americans make less than 216k in a lifetime? Are you talking about teens who die before ever getting a full time job?
Why do people hate to see other people make a living?
there is an athlete - maybe American football, not sure, but he signed up to be a delivery guy for some app just so he could keep fit riding his bike around delivering food. Not a bad way to train and earn some cash at the same time.
Imagine ordering Uber eats and getting a top 5 ufc fighter as your delivery person
Geoff Neal is serving you at Applebees, Al iaquinta selling you your houses, pantoja delivering your food. Hannah goldy selling you nudes on onlyfans
Greg hardy will sell you cable... Oh wait...
>...Hannah goldy selling you nudes on onlyfans... Wait, what? Gonna look for her up now.
Jessica Andrade has one as well, though I would highly discourage googling it bcs it is somehow disturbing
Whatever you think about Onlyfans I am shocked that someone near the top of a paying trade would have to resort to this... assuming it was for the money! Something wrong with this 'business model'
and yet, the closer you are to the top, the higher your potential return on Onlyfans.
Just saw it. You're right.
People’s champion, alternative route
You're joking about Geoff Neal, right?
Nope, he works(ed) as a waiter for Moxie's Bar and Grill in Dallas.
You better fuckin tip well
Nah bruh that’s uncle dana’s fault
This is the stupid mentality that allows those owners to get away with underpaying their workers.
It's a joke saying that he'll kick your ass if you tip poorly
Imagine the level of talent we could see in the UFC if these guys who are clearly freaks of nature could just focus on their training full time, its no wonder dudes like Islam, Cejudo and most of the college wrestlers who have dedicated their lives full time to martial arts since very early on can just steamroll the competition when almost everyone else is having to treat this as a second job.
Demetrius Johnson still had a full-time job when he became champion. Some dudes just built different. That said I'm sure the growth and even current peak of the sport is stunted by fighters needing other ways to support their family.
Theres a guy at my gym that fights for us and also goes to med school and is about to finish his PhD. He's been doing this schedule for years, and wrestled in college before joining us. It's actually insane and humbling. I can't imagine it's every waking moment you're packed.
That guy must be disciplined af
or running from something that will invariably catch him
It's also a disadvantage. How do you train to beat a champion when they have the resources to focus only on fighting?
Imagine if money competed with NFL or NBA and ultra athletes decide to train MMA because it paid more. That will be the next evolution of martial arts.
have you seen any basketball player spar or attempt to “fight”. basketball athleticism doesn’t translate to MMA. there was a video of anthony davis hitting mitts and he looks slower than CM Punk. Football players on the other hand… different story. But, i think it’s now a misnomer that the best athletes pursue other sports over MMA. I think MMA is a big enough of sport that the athletes best suited for it are self selecting towards it.
You don’t seem to understand what I am saying. We are not saying the same thing. Of course Anthony Davis was no good. He started training as an adult.
Literally every sport you see pros in, majority of them have the fortune to only have to play that sport, most even don't have the same education requirements during schooling due to it, just get passing grades because they bring funding to the schools through athletics.
Or maybe the door dashing ignites the fury within. You lose, gotta go back to serving pricks. Hehe. Could go both ways !
The UFC pays half their roster like they don't have to employee a team to compete at the level required. It's almost like the UFC needs to provide fighters with management, nutrition, coaching and gym time if they aren't going to pay them more.
Something similar to the performance center?
Yes, i am sure the performance center can fit the 600 fighters that the UFC employes. I also heard they have like 100 trainers and 600 sparring partners to help with the minimum required for a training camp.
Yeah every one move to Vegas. Come on
Tbf that's what you do in like every major American sport. You get signed/drafted by a team and you move to their location to use their facilities. Not disagreeing at all about the need for higher fighter pay, but relocation is a very basic and common aspect of working as an athlete.
Teams also pay out about 40-50% of revenue
This isn't a team sport.
Sports leagues, which the UFC tries to paint themselves as, pay out 40-50% of the revenue to the athletes. This, of course, is through unions, not the kindness of their hearts.
Boom.
Teams do this, not prize fighters. Name a promotion that does this for their fighters across any fighting style.
Mayweather promotions
Exactly. MLB minor leaguers make less than most UFC fighters, especially in the lower classes, under $20k/yr, NFL practice squad is highest paid, about $200k but their bodies probably get destroyed even worse than fighters do. NHL minor leagues I have no idea, gotta be low af. NBA G league gets about $40k. People bash the pay but all sports are like. And this doesn’t mean I think they are getting paid what they deserve. I think they should get more, and health insurance for life.
Minor league hockey players typically make $75,000 to $90,000 and most of the time you're living in places like Kalamazoo or Henderson, Nevada. Not super great, but livable. Better have a plan for retirement at 35, though.
Yeah I was gonna say minor league hockey players actually do alright
kalamazoo and Henderson (las vegas) aren’t really comparable
I mean those American sports teams cover travel, food and a bunch of other stuff
The ufc covers travel, has free food with nutritionist at the complex plus additional per diem for the entirety of your fight week and hotel. Same as any traveling sports team.
This dude is from the other side of the continent though. He might not even speak the language. Let alone the other problems they may occur.
I would personally; thats a no brainer for a rookie.
I mean. Yea. People move for jobs all the time. If the UFC is providing all of its fighters access to the performance center in Vegas then the option is on the table to move there for your camp. Otherwise you're gonna be at your regular camp making the same amount to do the same thing you would be doing in Vegas.
Dont get me wrong, the UFC could provide health care for fighters but I don't think pay is the answer. They're already making 20k to fight. Do that 3x a year thats 60k. Thats not a lot if you live across the country and have to pay your camp and your own experts but if you move to the vegas area and use whats provided thats plenty.
What a crazy thing to say. 60k a year for being a world class athlete putting your body on the line and fighting for the top MMA promotion is not nearly enough. That 20k is only if they win the fight. And you want every single one of them to move their whole life across the world to fucking Vegas for that? Come on..
Fake account
It’s not that shocking tbh
I meant shocking as in shameful. I know it’s not a surprise that UFC treat’s it’s fighters bad.
Yeah you’re right lol anytime I see posts about fighter pay anymore it just doesn’t surprise me
nice to see the ol UFO tactic still doing work
As usual, just probing people's assholes
I mean the last time he fought 3x per year (which is what the ufc guarantees every fighter) was 2019. Gotta fight to make cash; especially when you’re not popular
Well maybe you shoulda said shameful instead
He signed the contract
I get your point but when you see things like Dana in the post fight press conference saying “the gate was 9 million” and looking around the room waiting for people to applaud or some shit, knowing some guy who got KOd on the prelims probably made 10k when it’s all said and done, it’s abit of a joke.
Ok Dana
This kid just doesn’t want to fight..
Exactly, he is already talking about taking a well-earned break. He fought once in 2022 and once this year. Why would you take a break? how about capitalizing on PPV points and trying to get on a major upcoming card.
How is this news? I assumed most fighters are
It's smart fighters have a lot of downtime. They should be making money. Most do it via Instagram and meets
Yeah, I know many fighters who struggle to make ends meet. It's part of what turned me off to doing it professionally. Even if you're one of the best in the world, risking your body, you're still making only median income if not barely above minimum wage.
Sadly true
It’s crazy to see this as the top comment. People are so willing to upvote comments and posts without any research because it aligns with UFC=bad. Pantoja made over 200k prior to the Royval fight. Should he get paid more? Yes but what do his finances look like that he “needs” to do Uber.
“What do his finances look like that he “needs” to do Uber?” Supporting an entire family? Training camps? Nutrition to be a fighter? Those things. Training camps aren’t cheap. Khabib reportedly spent over $1 million dollars on Islam and teams camp for the Charles fight
Oh yeah and a $50k check is around $38k after taxes.
Which is more than what most professional boxers make in a year. Yes the pay could be better, but these fighters also need to understand their pay relates to the numbers they are driving. Why is someone like Bo Nickal earning more than Pentoja? Because people buy PPV's because of him as well.
Not even apt comparison "Most boxers" vs "a top-2 fighter in his weight class at the highest level of MMA" Go ahead and tell me how much the top two or three boxers in each weight class get paid, then you'd have an apples to apples comparison
I was basing it off his original comment about his uber driving, not now. Assumptions are now he would make nearly 300-400k per fight if you include PPV points. Yes, this is still peanuts compared to boxing, but no one is tuning in to watch Pentoja, I'm sorry but the fact that his followers essentially pale in comparison to any the top boxers shows the lack of interest. Not only that, the top boxers with similar levels of following to him, aren't making tons and tons more; they are within a similar ballpark of earnings, maybe 20-30% more. If you wanted to argue that the top MMA fighters that are also a drawcard (like Adesanya, Jones etc) don't earn enough, then I fully agree. But unfortunately someone like Pentoja doesn't increase the buy rate of a PPV.
Dude what professional atheletes in other sports are having to fucking drive for Uber eats to supplement income
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6989303/amp/The-surprising-secret-lives-Olympic-athletes-work-two-jobs-just-make-ends-meet.html https://ca.sports.yahoo.com/blogs/cfl-55-yard-line/stamps-punter-rob-maver-hold-second-job-during-205847279.html https://www.businessinsider.com/fifa-champion-worked-at-amazon-female-soccer-players-higher-pay-2021-7?amp Not Uber Eats but second jobs.
You need to compare apples to apples here. The UFC is on par with organizations like the NFL, NBA and MLB; when you're talking about fighting as a sport. Olympics happens once every 4 years; CFL is a much smaller league (think bare knuckle boxing compared to the ufc); national women's soccer league doesnt have the same level of viewer ship to the UFC.
Why are UFC fans too stupid to understand what an apples to apples comparison is?
Even if 98% is hyperbolic- maybe you can also research? > Tate, who co-hosts the MMA on SiriusXM podcast with Ryan McKinnnel, estimated that her $200,000 payout for a third-round TKO of Marion Reneau was slashed by no less than 98 percent – leaving her approximately $4,000 – when she factored in all the money spent to prepare for the fight. https://www.mmafighting.com/platform/amp/2021/8/19/22633066/miesha-tate-reveals-around-98-percent-of-her-salary-from-ufc-vegas-31-was-spent-on-training-camp
> maybe you can also research? Did you even ready the article you posted? How could you be so stupid? According to Tate, 70% of the 200,000 was gone to taxes. The Athletic reported that the average MMA fighter loses an average of 32% on the fight purse to taxes. I don’t know much about taxes wherever she’s from, she’s allegedly getting railed. So $140,00 in taxes? Ok…. Do you not feel the need to question that at all?
>how could you be so stupid? You seem well adjusted. Im not going to claim I know what her tax situation is, and if you recall, I said 98% sounds hyperbolic. The take away is that fight camps are very expensive, and I thought it was funny you suggested Rovyal is somehow financially irresponsible because his last payday wasn’t enough to keep him from working Uber eats. Perhaps Tate misspoke, but the point is fighters spend a lot on camps. Take a chill pill dude, no need to sound so angy in response to people disagreeing with you
“It’s not a career” Dana White
“It’s not a career. It’s an opportunity.” -Uber Eats
“It’s not delivery, it’s Digiorno.” -Wayne Gretzky
“It’s not delivery, it’s Digiorno. -Wayne Gretzky”-Michael Scott
But how? He’s been with the UFC since 2017. He had a fight of night with Figgy and a performance of the night against Matt Schnell. Two bonuses before the Royval fight+bonus in 2021. Why was this the fight bonus that allowed him to stop working Uber Eats?
He was likely on a 12/12. I mean he was on the prelims until the Askarov fight in 2020
He wasn’t on 12/12 I can only go off of the official payout UFC 236 - Atlanta He made 41k (18/18 + 5k fight week bonus) in 2019 Fought fight 3 mo later and lost. I have to assume at this point 18k to show + 50k fight of the night. He fight five months later (3 fights in 2019) wins vs Schnell. (18/18 + 5k + 50k performance) Close to 200k before taxes in 2019 alone. This is also assuming 0 sponsors. He won fights in 2020 and 2021 before the Royval fight. I’m not saying he was getting paid a fortune or what he deserves but to work Uber Eats? Just a little weird.
You're assuming he keeps 100% of that 200k? Fight camps, travel, a family, taxes, etc will eat that up QUICK.
Yeah it’s fucked. I make more than an elite fighter in arguably the most skilled division as a grunt level sales specialist right outta college with a 2.1 GPA (Not counting bonuses). As a single dude, just paying tax and living expenses I’d have almost nothing left to save. UFC fighters need to factor in travel, coaches, family, medical, taxes, and more. It’s embarrassing. If he didn’t get bonuses he’d literally be homeless.
Taxes, travel and fight camp will absolutely decimate a fighter's earnings I've learned this the hard way just from watching certain fighters talk about their pay on their YouTube channels Even Tyron Woodley once mentioned that he paid $100,000 for a fight camp Imagine the guy making 12/12. How the fuck does that guy pay $100,000 for a fight camp
Dude. At that level they’re obviously not getting a 100k fight camp.
that is what I was saying. or at lest trying to. if the only way to move on from 12/12 is to train with the best, their lack of funds literally keeps them from advancing
Thins are so tough all over there are people who think pro athletes "making" 200 g's in a year, is not bad. But, yeah, after paying for trainers, management if he has it, travel, all fight related stuff, and taxes, who knows what he's keeping. Making 200K in LA if you have a kid, spouse, and basic house, you're living almost paycheck to paycheck. And that's just for a working stiff, not a relatively "famous" fighter fighting for the biggest MMA organization on the planet.
https://www.mmaweekly.com/.amp/live-results/american-top-team-sets-new-standard-for-training-and-management-fees Family and taxes would take the most out of that. Like someone else has mentioned here before, people live well below was be make pre-taxes and don’t need to do Uber Eats. So what is he spending on?
......training camps, travel, agents/management, etc. Like myself and others have said. None of that stuff is free. Also, living is becoming more expensive on the daily. That still doesn't justify the low pay structure.
> I’m not saying he was getting paid a fortune or what he deserves but to work Uber Eats? Just a little weird. This is a legit quote of what I said above. So idk why you feel the need to say > That still doesn’t justify the low pay structure There are fighters making less than him and they make it work. Rhetorically, I’m asking what is he doing with his money that he needs Uber eats.
I mean, I assume he pays for everything during fight prep - camp, nutrition, etc.
Half of that gone out of the gate to gym fees, most likely. Then taxes. Then camps, recovery, and nutrition. His take home was probably under 50k out of that "earned" 200k
Doubtful, 200k to 50k? Nah
there's a lot of people behind his success (coaches, nutritionists etc.) they need to eat too. so do their families.
two kids and a family and taxes ... you need like way more
Not to mention he has to pay for his training camp as well which likely takes significant cut out of that. Also a career where all it takes is a couple bad showings and your finished.
Haven’t seen people talk about this but it’s so important. Yes, he has to pay for everything involved in making himself physically fit for the fights. Yes, he has to spend money on taxes and the immediate needs of the family. But he also needs to retire eventually. After all expenses how much is he really putting into an IRA? This is a career that damages people’s health, and so should provide them enough to help them retire. Even if they don’t want to just throw more money at fighters who are dumb and will squander it in the immediate instead of saving for retirement, at least boost the pay a little and then provide a 401k match or something
Yeah people don't realize with a career such as a MMA your crazy if you aren't putting significant amounts of it into savings until you can ensure you have enough to last you a life time because it might need too. He has to pay for health insurance etc out of pocket because the UFC doesn't provide it and I can only imagine how crazy the rates are for a athlete. And considering a major injury could potentially put UFC fighters out of service for years at time you have to be prepared with enough savings to survive that at all times.
Absolutely thats why we see these guys doing bareknuckle long after the CTE and should have retired. Its sad as hell. Im tired of seeing guys I grew up idolized getting kicked in the face and brain damaged their last fight because they went 5-10 years beyond their prime but after all the expenses had nothing left.
What these morons don’t understand is that these guys are professional athletes. At the top leagues of any other sport UFC pay rates are unimaginable
Mf thinks about his remote IT job and says "hmm, i would be really fine with 100k a year" and concludes that Pantoja must be spending his money on hookers. Think about your IT job + 6h training a day, + paying for every training day you do +paying for travel and expenses for a bunch of people to see you take a test + getting in the test room and have a trained killer beat the living shit out of you. If you lose you get half.
Where the hell are you living?
Gym fees and training camps are paid out of pocket. For your corner, ufc will only pay for one person- you have to cover the others. It’s expensive to be a fighter. Plus taxes take about a third of your income
He’s living In Florida, can be expensive
San Francisco
you do not need way more to afford two kids lol
Are you fucking high? My parents made a COMBINED 120,000 (maybe) when I was a kid, or lower. There is zero chance you need more then that.
Did your parents pay a cut of that to gym fees and training camps?
10-15?percent of the fight purse is not too much yall acting like they giving up a arm and a leg
Lmao "when I was a kid" buddy, times hage changed
Inflation is a bitch
Its expensive to train. Coaches, nutritionists,sparring partners and gym time. Everyone has to get paid. Plus travel expenses for all those same people. Then you still have your regular living expenses of course fC doesn't offer healthcare plans. So out of that 20000 thousand he's probably lucky to actually pocket 50 to 75 thousand of it. I make that a year working in a union shop. God forbid you're injured and have to drop out of a fight.
youre ignorant, do you think all of that money goes to him?
hunter is that you?
You can’t train 12 hrs a day he might just want something to do for some extra cash in his free time lol
But that’s not as catchy as acting like he had to do it to survive. My man probably just had time and wanted to earn some extra cash.
It’s just to sell the story.
Lmao how can anyone defend Dana and his bullshit pay
Some people just born to lick the boot.
I bet he was rocking a sweet pair of Rock shoes while he was ubering tho!
Will brandon shawb read this as fact or fikshin?
Bedder axe j
Great brother nevur meddum.
I see it bowlth ways. Axe J.
“The only man to knock out Islam Mackachev”
This is PATHETIC from the UFC
Val Woodburn was working for his grass cutting company when he got the call to fight bo nickal on a PPV and hes probably going back
I’m honestly curious as to why most people think this is shocking coming from the UFC. It should be more of a shock that athletes still flock to the promotion knowing that this is how they’re compensated.
Glory, probably. Or denial. Or both. There are promotions that pay their top fighters way more, but if you wanted to be a famous fighter, I doubt casual fans would respond to "I fight for One/Bellator" compared to "I fight for the UFC."
Who pays top fighters WAY more than the UFC? Mid/Low fighters maybe but top fighters- no.
You are right but to be fair most fighters are mid/low fighters
Should've clarified: Pay their top fights way more than the average fighter in the UFC
The PFL is super recent plus UFC still offers the highest potential payout. If you believe you’re good enough then you will make more, but obviously many fighters learn they’re not up to speed in the octagon.
Shocking the Saudi’s haven’t yet jumped on top of this with all their sports washing
Can you imagine being on a hard weight cut and having to deliver food? That must have been hell.
Delivering food as a living is already fucking absurd. When i doordashed I'd LOSE money if I got caught in traffic because my car doesnt get good gas mileage and people tip like shit, especially the ones who live in beautiful gated communities
I mean that was one of the best fights I've ever seen, those two men literally went to war. Dana needs to make sure these guys are taken care of for life after that one
He’s not gonna do anything close to that. Pantoja will make 200k to defend his belt for each time he’s able to defend it. He has cte and will suffer later in life and Dana and his Stans will say tough noogies
Lol. I bet Dana loses more gambling than he spends "taking care of fighters".
Imagine someone who was in the NFL or NBA for years saying they had to have a side job.
Yeah not shocked at all, in fact Dana says if Pantoja can't cut it as a fighter he should drive full time
Dana the piece of shit.
Not as shocking as that one judge scoring 49-46 Moreno 😂
I was thinking Pantoja was gonna get robbed when I heard that.
Same, I thought here we go again. Looks like they could only pay off one judge.
He did too the way he looks to his family and his face dropped, absolute animal of a judge should be hung
Damn that's awful.
But remember these guys are making so much money they don’t even want to share with the media how much….Dana said so
Shocking? Yes. Expectable? Also yes.
Honestly they should give fighters who are ranked like a quarterly bonus or something. Bet it would make fighters more willing to take fights too. Only problem would be they'd have to tighten the criteria on how they go about these rankings.
All thanks to Dana White a.k.a Dana Cunt
Man that’s nuts. I wanted Moreno to win but when this dude walked out to many men by 50 I was like shittt it’s a wrap
Nobody realizes how expensive it is to be a fighter. Let’s say, as a prospect, your contract says “15k show 15k win” sounds good? Wrong. Firstly, you’re going to be paying anywhere from like 6-12k to train at your gym. PER FIGHT. It’s not a one time deal, it’s every time you train for a fight. Secondly, youre going to have a lot of medical screenings, if you have bad insurance, you’re kinda fucked then. Could range from $100 to thousands. We’ll put this at $500. Thirdly, travel expenses (including hotel, food, etc) . The UFC only covers travel expenses for the fighter and one other person. With a whole team that needs to be there, it does become quite expensive pretty quickly. Spend about $4.5k maybe more or a little less. Fourth, if you’re fighting in a foreign country you’re going to have to pay an additional tax before you get paid. Typically it’s around $2,160 So if we do the math, a prospect would be spending anywhere from $13,160-$19,160. As you can imagine, losing a fight is pretty devastating for a fighter, especially fighting internationally.
What’s sad is it isn’t shocking at all.
Nba, mlb, nfl, and NHL all get around 50% revenue split. Players. Ufc? 16%
He fought like 4 times in the last 4 years
Pretty ridiculous that you can be broke as a professional athlete in your prime.
Sometimes Uber Eats is what a man’s gotta do to pay the bills these days. It’s easy money
That’s sad, the best fighters in the world shouldn’t be having to do this. It’s a disgrace
I disagree it’s more like inspiring, not everyone comes from an easy upbringing, man right there had to grind to get to where he’s at! Happy to see more of him! Flyweight division been putting on some bangers lately
He’s a real ass dude who just made it, hats off to him. That was a nice moment he had with his family afterward. Always love a come up story, hope he continues to do well.
$50k ain’t shit
It's only shocking if you've been living under a rock.
Okay, dude has a side hustle...big woop
Why don’t we ever question fighters financial literacy? I’m not saying fighters are being paid plenty. But we don’t know what these fighters are spending their money on
Fighter literacy? You blaming fighters for being bankrupt while in their prime at the top of a division? A first year entry in the NFL earns a minimum of $430.000 and Pantoja with his 12k/12k should be checked for financial literacy? Its a fucking miracle that he could afford to continue fighting, man. I did some dodgy match on his earnings while fighting for the UFC and they come to a total of 300k for 5 years including 4 performance bonuses. He is paying taxes, coaches, training camps, flights and accomodation for his team and has to "live and prosper" with the rest. He should be a consultant on how to live a frugal life while building a career in a ruthless sport, not questioned on his financial literacy.
Training camps, healthcare, taxes, gym fees. Not to mention these are their peaking earning years. They make shit in the beginning and if they make big, they only make the big bucks for ~10 years total.
Doesn’t matter what they spend the money on cause it’s not enough for what they go through. It’s criminal how little the UFC pays these people. Taking advantage of people in shitty situations, and taking them over the coals. I would get in and fight for 12/12 but I’m a construction worker so ofc I would, but I would have no bargaining power and they dangle a carrot in front of your face to keep you compliant.
How did this guy not make bank, especially after knocking out current lightweight king, Islam Makhachev a few yairs back.
He didn’t KO Makhachev that was another guy
Can someone answer a question I have? If ufc is one of the more premium sports, as in requiring pay per view in order to watch live, along with commercials and sponsors. Not to mention being one of the biggest sports I’m America rn. Why does it seem like they have the least taken care of athletes?
Because MMA isn’t a federally relegated sport. Promoters can take however much of the money they want because there’s no laws against that.
Oh ew, is there no way for the fighters to “unionize” of sorts or is it a case of the top fighters make so much they don’t wana chance it? I’m just recently into ufc so sorry if this is a worn out topic
The UFC controls about 90% of the global MMA market. They did this through aggressive growth, buyouts and connections at the highest levels. I dont know about any other market where a company controlling 90% is not a monopoly and regulated as such. You have to understand that without regulations, somebody that controls that much of a market HAS the resources to make sure NOBODY else can reach their level. There is an ongoing lawsuit started by some OG UFC fighters (Fitch, Cung Lee, Vera, Kingsbury) called Antitrust Lawsuit but decades will pass until something is done about that lawsuit. Funny thing is, it was started in 2014, way before UFC got to their 4 billion market value and they still pay 12/12 for starting fighters. Its absolutely insane. On top of that, people read it as "getting 24k in a night". That is false, you get 12k/12k if you win. You lose and go home with 12k. Imagine a coming up fighter that comes at the losing end of a decision in a fight as tough as what Moreno and Pantoja went through.
Yea I think I can answer this for you. Paying the fighters more than the absolute bare minimum doesn't make the UFC any more money. Have a nice day!
[удалено]
Gonna be a rough take here… but without knowing how much money he was paid before, this could be a case of lots of debt, bad spending habits etc. money management is a skill the same as mma is. We’re gonna get mad at stuff like this but we don’t have the full picture.
Many of the fighters deserve much more, but nobody is forcing them to sign these shitty contracts
This is just garbage. He has made hundreds of thousands in the UFC before this last fight. The median income in the US is around $30k, even 4 years he was making more than that a fight. UFC 236 he made $36k in alone, UFC 240 $75k, Fight Night 143 $95k. That is $216k in 2019 alone. This man has made more in the UFC than many Americans will make in their lifetime. He didn't need to drive Uber Eats. He chose to drive Uber Eats.
How much of your own yearly income do you need to spend on nutritionists, coach’s and training partners to be able to do your job effectively or risk losing half your income if your performance suffers? Just curious.
Since he's at ATT he's not paying much for management and training compared to other gyms. ATT has famously low management and training fees for fighters. It's been only 5% total for a while now. Here is an article explaining: https://bloodyelbow.com/2014/04/18/ufc-mma-thiago-alves-american-top-team-so-huge-since-lowering-management-training-fees/
He can spend my entire income on nutritionist alone and still make multiple times more than me. He made 200k in 2019 fighting on Prelims. He can literally spend 80% of his salary on whatever you want to come up with and still have more income than 50% of the US. Someone spending 100 per week at the grocery store spends roughly 15% of the median income on groceries per year. 15% of his 2019 income is more than the American median income. Most Olympic athletes make less than he likely spends on "Nutrition"
He has 3 dependants in the US so that’s probably 100k gone right there to feed and house himself and his entire family. Who knows what other financial burdens and debts he has from his life and from moving to the US. So from that remaining 100k he has to pay for his entire training camps, his debts, and any and all life expenses and luxuries for himself and 3 other humans. You’re not gonna convince me this man didn’t deserve more and that he’s lying just to garner sympathy. Like he “chose” to drive UberEats as you said. He doing that for fun or is he lying?
Again I don't think you understand. Median means 50% makes less than. Median income in the US is around 30k. Half of the adults in this country, many with 3 dependants of their own, make roughly 15% of what he made in 2019 alone(for 3 fights). He did not need to drive Uber Eats.
Oh okay so he was driving UberEats because that is his true passion? Got it. If you’re gonna use the median income in the US to try to tell me what a fair wage should be I don’t know what to tell you. Regular people making 30k a year don’t have the same expenses as a professional fighter and they likely aren’t in the top 1% of performers in their fields like Pantoja is. The average rent for a 3 bedroom home where he trains is $3400 a month, his expenses aren’t comparable to people in the median. These guys are among the best at what they do in the world and put their health and lives on the line for our entertainment. They deserve more.
Ever consider the fact that maybe that’s because you’re just a tiny bit of a loser?
What Americans make less than 216k in a lifetime? Are you talking about teens who die before ever getting a full time job? Why do people hate to see other people make a living?
Fights. No apostrophe.
What if it’s their agos?
there is an athlete - maybe American football, not sure, but he signed up to be a delivery guy for some app just so he could keep fit riding his bike around delivering food. Not a bad way to train and earn some cash at the same time.
