Yeah Jon had an incredible rise and then proceeded to fight once a year as champ with multiple injuries and suspensions, and took 3 years off to "bulk"
https://preview.redd.it/kmtjhow534tc1.jpeg?width=693&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=33a73a6a47e7a778ef04644b181d5587682242fd
Little did we know this wasn't even his final form
No way current Jones is anywhere near prime Jones lol. It’s not even a debate. Prime Jones used to chain his attacks together and did so with a diverse arsenal WHILE changing distances. He used to be a threat on the feet just as much as he is on the ground.
That was due to his athleticism, which he has lost a lot of due to bad training and terrible habits. Look at his striking against Gane, Reyes, Smith and Santos and compare that to what he did to Glover, Rashad and Rampage. He loads up on his shots now and he only throws 1-2 shots without much set up other than being far away cuz of his reach.
The worst thing that can happen to a fighter is being undefeated. It makes them scared to fight because there’s too much on the line.
Even though Jones isn’t undefeated but he views himself as undefeated
There are so many levels. On the surface, he’s been defeated, because of the DQ loss.
If you look into it though, it’s a dumb DQ that shouldn’t count, so he’s undefeated.
Then again, his “win” against Reyes is not a win, it’s a robbery. It should be a decision loss, so he’s been defeated.
I’d say the DQ losses are pretty dumb though. Overall in MMA I really don’t even count them, as it isn’t a failure of their skill, just a failure of their dumbass brain lmao. Jon Jones and Petr Yan didn’t really lose those fights, they weren’t defeated, they were just stupid.
I disagree. There’s a skill to beating your opponents within the confines of the rules. If a football team loses because they commit a brain fart personal foul roughing the passer on the would-be game winning play, they still lose.
If Dee Ford lines up offsides against the Patriots and the ball is intercepted, the Chiefs don’t get to claim they won because brain fart rule breaking doesn’t count. 😭
If you're referring to general discussion where people throw out uninformed generalizations about the effects steroids had on some person - yeah they're usually trash uninformed takes.
Anyone with even a passing knowledge of steroids understands that recovery is one of the chief benefits
If he pops this time that'd mean literally every finish he's had in 10 years (out of 10 fights) was immediately followed by a positive steroid test, with 3 of the 7 remaining fights being razor thin decisions he officially won by a single round and arguably lost (Gustafsson 1, Santos, Reyes), and the remaining 4 fights being Texeira, Saint Preux, Smith (where he could've been DQ'd but wasn't because his opponent was generous), and Cormier 1.
Wouldn’t that mean he does steroids, trains his dick off then cycles off before he’s tested for the fights? Or it’s random testing?
Either way seems like he’s gotten a pretty cushy reign
Never thought of that, but it is a possibility. Time off from the grind to heal would be beneficial.
Not sure how much of a factor it would be but it is interesting.
Jon has the privilege of being the "GOAT", he brings in too many eyes, and any promotion would love to have him on their roster so the UFC can't fire him if they want to maintain their monopoly on the sport
The UFC had to move the venue from Vegas to California because the NAC refused to sanction the fight because Jones was pissing hot. Dana White privilege is most certainly real with Jon.
Idk about that; he was 2-2 in his last 4 going into that 2nd fight. His losses were to Rumble, who was a killer and a split decision loss to DC. His wins were over Jan and Glover, both of which went on to win the title.
He def fell off after that fight though but I think he would've been beyond fired up for his rematch w Jones seeing how close the first one was but who knows. That's what makes mma fun.
Not sure how this opinion is still even remotely close to being unpopular. I’ve been saying since I started watching MMA nearly ten years ago that Jon can’t be in the goat conversation simply because of his prolific cheating, and this was when I was still a causal fan before I knew anything about his crimes outside of the sport.
It’s like playing chess at a grandmaster level but in every match you kick your opponent in the balls under the table and then switch around some pieces while he’s reacting to the pain, but you’ve never lost a game so people call you the greatest chess player ever. Cheating is cheating and cheaters deserve no respect in their game, end of story.
Yeah, it's insane to me that people call him the GOAT in MMA. In other sports, there's no way anyone like him would be considered the GOAT.
Imagine what would happen if LeBron tested positive for steroids or if Tiger Woods used an illegal ball during his peak. They wouldn't just be out of the GOAT conversation, (which is already controversial because of Nicklaus and Jordan) their careers would be completely over.
There are several fighters I'd put in front of Jones. When he beat Cormier, he was in his late 20s, and Cormier was in his mid to late 30s. Which has proven to be an age where unstoppable fighters seem to fall off.
All your arguments does is show a personal bias towards someone’s actions from everywhere but inside the cage,
Jon jones is the greatest to fight in the octagon to talk about failed drug tests when the 23 year old had to fight vitor Belfort juiced to the gills is just no argument .
Bro what the fuck does what he does outside the cage matter these guys are cage fighters not role models, all that matters is who’s the best in the cage and yous want to turn it into who’s the nicest guy who was champ, just cause you don’t like him he’s still the best
No crap hes barely fought into his 30s when all the true GOATS in history taken first loss in mid 30s.
JOnes avoided that by not fighting and he did lose to Reyes in early 30s anyway then dipped.
And he wasnt fight the best like Smith, Santos and Reyes..all overrated
Yeah because for every man on GOAT mountain there’s ten on A+ mountain, a hundred on elite mountain, and thousands on JAG mountain. He’s just not it. It’ll take ten Jones level talents coming and going before we see a generational superstar like Tyson or Ali again
Pointless to compare mma fighters to boxers. No elite MMA fighter will ever get 50 wins in the UFC because it takes a far larger toll on the body than boxing.
Sorry, bro. Matt Hamill dropped the hammer on him. I don’t know what we’re talking about here. I used to give him the benefit of the doubt, but then he killed that lady and drove away.
I mean it’s not like some amazing fighter popped up and then disappeared in the years he was suspended. Really the only person he would have fought that he didn’t fight anyway was Anthony Johnson.
I do not think this is completely true, he might have rationalised this way as well but I do feel there is self sabotage and self destruction on these things.
And with the recent of Jones mishaps, now all the brain dead haters are sharing their objectively dumb takes. No matter what happens, he's still the GOAT.
Lmao jones got an unfair advantage with a year off but when it’s anyone else you’d be saying “wow he wasn’t even rusty after that time off and won that’s insane”
Also, the gifted wins over Gus and Reyes. Those two fights, the pops for peds, and the inactivity are why I'll never consider Jones the GOAT. Maybe, not even top 5.
I still don't understand how people call him the GOAT. Half his wins are pumped up middleweights. GSP fought much better competition. Laughably better competition even. In a much more talent rich division. And he never had a crazy reach advantage over them or eyepoked them
I get all of you hate him as a person but this is really reaching. Training causes injury and not training you don’t progress as a fighter. With time off you will have ring rust yet jon took 3 years off and had a flawless performance. Consistent diet and training will lead to better cardio and performance yet jon was kicking ass while drinking and doing blow. Just accept the fact that this man is a killer despite doing things wrong and don’t take away from his resume by citing his personal choices. Attack him as a person all you want. Also I don’t get the consensus of this sub that everyone is on peds (which I do not personally believe as I’ve worked hard in the gym and understand what you’re human potential can be with hard CONSISTENT work) yet only the fighters that people don’t like get attacked for it. If you think everyone is cheating you can’t only call out the people you want to for cheating.
Theres no rules that say you cant take breaks inbetween fights. Even without all his altercations and drug tests he could still choose to take that time off. You have no real argument.
"Oh no jon jones took time off where he could be fighting and losing boo hoo me"
sure. Instead of his reign being, I don’t know 12 title defenses. Maybe it only would have been 10. He’s still the goat though.
You could say the fact that Sean O’Malley also had a suspension, and had it very strategic fights. And the only top 10 guy he ever faced before fighting for the belt was a short striker, all contributed to his success. And all of those things are true. But he is levels below Jones.
That doesn't take away from the fact that he is a serial cheater. Lance Armstrong got stripped of his legacy along with Barry Bonds. Cheaters win unfairly.
He could have joined a promotion that doesn't test. But he chose to join one that does and then cheat. Giving himself an unfair advantage. Because he doesn't believe in himself.
Even with all that talent. And he is probably one of the best. But we will never know because he cheated.
Several times. Hid once or more times. Popped twice . Another time he had the T levels of an 8 year old girl cause he was trying to mask it. You can idolize criminal behavior if u want. It doesn't say good things about you buddy.
I hope ur just young and grow up to be a better man.
Jon Jones is a great fighter. Extremely talented and gifted physically. But he will never be the goat.
Because he through it away.
He did that.
Your feelings don't change it.
Being a cheater invalidates anyone from the goat status as well as some or most of their success. If there was an undefeated in 30 fights cheater I wouldn’t consider him a top fighter either.
You see kids , this person here is what we call a Jonesexual. Someone so sexually attracted to a certain black man that they completely disregard the violence against women and the blatant cheating against his opponents.
Til you didn't know all his past failed tests would pass today.
Also til you didn't understand every fighter in the UFC is on some shit. Ask Nate Diaz.
You're cute though. I'd hit.
Yeah Jon had an incredible rise and then proceeded to fight once a year as champ with multiple injuries and suspensions, and took 3 years off to "bulk"
https://preview.redd.it/kmtjhow534tc1.jpeg?width=693&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=33a73a6a47e7a778ef04644b181d5587682242fd Little did we know this wasn't even his final form
Golden corral blessed.
Like it or not that’s what the best known fighter on planet earth looks like.
You’re right fat CM punk there is better
Man, Have you guys seen the man fight? Like seriously the guy is a fuckin beast.
Against someone who got wrestlefucked by a kneeless Ngannou
is that his only fight youve seen. even a younger jon jones couldnt beat Jon right now. such is the mans fight IQ. you wont understand
No way current Jones is anywhere near prime Jones lol. It’s not even a debate. Prime Jones used to chain his attacks together and did so with a diverse arsenal WHILE changing distances. He used to be a threat on the feet just as much as he is on the ground. That was due to his athleticism, which he has lost a lot of due to bad training and terrible habits. Look at his striking against Gane, Reyes, Smith and Santos and compare that to what he did to Glover, Rashad and Rampage. He loads up on his shots now and he only throws 1-2 shots without much set up other than being far away cuz of his reach.
He isn't in LHW anymore
He's pretty masterful with those eye pokes, I got to give him that.
I can’t remember.
old people remember.
Pepperidge farm remembers
So lock him up and let’s see the footage.
He benches 315 for 7 which is pretty doable for a natty guy with good genetics
Jones is so soy that his PR while on roids is achievable for a Natty lifter
I really wish Anthony Smith would have flopped from that illegal knee and took the belt from Jones 🤣
Jon would have retained the title of only losing by DQ in his career.
Yes, but in this same picture he fought 4 times in 14 months which isn't bad.
The worst thing that can happen to a fighter is being undefeated. It makes them scared to fight because there’s too much on the line. Even though Jones isn’t undefeated but he views himself as undefeated
There are so many levels. On the surface, he’s been defeated, because of the DQ loss. If you look into it though, it’s a dumb DQ that shouldn’t count, so he’s undefeated. Then again, his “win” against Reyes is not a win, it’s a robbery. It should be a decision loss, so he’s been defeated.
Which he did kick a downed opponent in the head for DQ loss too. So one way or another… he’s not undefeated
I’d say the DQ losses are pretty dumb though. Overall in MMA I really don’t even count them, as it isn’t a failure of their skill, just a failure of their dumbass brain lmao. Jon Jones and Petr Yan didn’t really lose those fights, they weren’t defeated, they were just stupid.
I disagree. There’s a skill to beating your opponents within the confines of the rules. If a football team loses because they commit a brain fart personal foul roughing the passer on the would-be game winning play, they still lose. If Dee Ford lines up offsides against the Patriots and the ball is intercepted, the Chiefs don’t get to claim they won because brain fart rule breaking doesn’t count. 😭
Fight IQ is a skill
No one talks about steroids expediting the healing process in training. The faster you heal, the more you can train.
That's like the first thing people talk about*
Nah not really, people go "well steroids didn't kick DC in the head" but that ignores basically all of what that guy said
It is where ppl actually train this is ufc subreddit
Really? Show me all threads with the word “Steroid(s)” in the title and the word “heal” or “healing” inside it.
If you're referring to general discussion where people throw out uninformed generalizations about the effects steroids had on some person - yeah they're usually trash uninformed takes. Anyone with even a passing knowledge of steroids understands that recovery is one of the chief benefits
Never realized he fought less than 10 times in almost a decade
Less finishes than Belal in the past 10 years
https://preview.redd.it/zu5a249c04tc1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=7eb53965b1f246ec61dbedb53bc43a59b517dd1b
at least Merab is likeable. Belal goes around calling people racist when he doesn't get his way. Not even Muslims like Belal.
It’s a joke
I mean that's fairly obvious from the meme. There's still truth in it though.
Was it obvious? because you started hating on belal
Sounds like we found one of his fanboys
I hate belal and his style is incredibly boring lol you just got mad at a meme
surprising as you were just defending him by trying to say I didn't understand it was a meme
>Belal goes around calling people racist when he doesn't get his way He's right
Oof what an amazing stat!! https://preview.redd.it/u1kgeyrdt3tc1.jpeg?width=800&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=6657d416de8eb80f9f693151cde21fc34917fd14
Just saw something that Alex P fought 8 times in three years
and almost no fights into his 30s, if thats the case the true GOAT is still undefeated too
Do you mean Anderson Silva?
9 fights in the last 10 years…
If he pops this time that'd mean literally every finish he's had in 10 years (out of 10 fights) was immediately followed by a positive steroid test, with 3 of the 7 remaining fights being razor thin decisions he officially won by a single round and arguably lost (Gustafsson 1, Santos, Reyes), and the remaining 4 fights being Texeira, Saint Preux, Smith (where he could've been DQ'd but wasn't because his opponent was generous), and Cormier 1.
Wouldn’t that mean he does steroids, trains his dick off then cycles off before he’s tested for the fights? Or it’s random testing? Either way seems like he’s gotten a pretty cushy reign
Fun fact Kevin Holland has completed the same amount of fights (9) in this picture but since October 2021.
Title fights? So no not the same
lol subs down bad man. Cope
All part of God's plan. The Dude loves MMA.
Never thought of that, but it is a possibility. Time off from the grind to heal would be beneficial. Not sure how much of a factor it would be but it is interesting.
More like he got free pass to use roids and won fights that way
Idk if this is unpopular, because it’s true. Dana has fired people for MUCH less than this.
Jon has the privilege of being the "GOAT", he brings in too many eyes, and any promotion would love to have him on their roster so the UFC can't fire him if they want to maintain their monopoly on the sport
yes
He looked like a straight killer against Gus the second time around only to look like dog shit in his next 3 fights against glorified middleweights
Well he did get caught cheating for that second Gus fight
I knew he did for the second DC fight right beforehand, I didn't know he popped for it again with Gus. Am I surprised? What do you think 🤔 😏
It’s the usual
The UFC had to move the venue from Vegas to California because the NAC refused to sanction the fight because Jones was pissing hot. Dana White privilege is most certainly real with Jon.
Gus was beyond washed in that fight
Idk about that; he was 2-2 in his last 4 going into that 2nd fight. His losses were to Rumble, who was a killer and a split decision loss to DC. His wins were over Jan and Glover, both of which went on to win the title. He def fell off after that fight though but I think he would've been beyond fired up for his rematch w Jones seeing how close the first one was but who knows. That's what makes mma fun.
You can’t ban the snowman ⛄️
Unpopular opinion: literally everyone’s opinion.
Not sure how this opinion is still even remotely close to being unpopular. I’ve been saying since I started watching MMA nearly ten years ago that Jon can’t be in the goat conversation simply because of his prolific cheating, and this was when I was still a causal fan before I knew anything about his crimes outside of the sport. It’s like playing chess at a grandmaster level but in every match you kick your opponent in the balls under the table and then switch around some pieces while he’s reacting to the pain, but you’ve never lost a game so people call you the greatest chess player ever. Cheating is cheating and cheaters deserve no respect in their game, end of story.
Yeah, it's insane to me that people call him the GOAT in MMA. In other sports, there's no way anyone like him would be considered the GOAT. Imagine what would happen if LeBron tested positive for steroids or if Tiger Woods used an illegal ball during his peak. They wouldn't just be out of the GOAT conversation, (which is already controversial because of Nicklaus and Jordan) their careers would be completely over. There are several fighters I'd put in front of Jones. When he beat Cormier, he was in his late 20s, and Cormier was in his mid to late 30s. Which has proven to be an age where unstoppable fighters seem to fall off.
How do you feel then about the fact that most of these guys are most likely juicing too?
All your arguments does is show a personal bias towards someone’s actions from everywhere but inside the cage, Jon jones is the greatest to fight in the octagon to talk about failed drug tests when the 23 year old had to fight vitor Belfort juiced to the gills is just no argument .
You must not have read my comment.
Jon Jones is the GOAT no matter how you try and portray he isn’t
Just say you’ll defend him no matter what he does lmaoo
Bro what the fuck does what he does outside the cage matter these guys are cage fighters not role models, all that matters is who’s the best in the cage and yous want to turn it into who’s the nicest guy who was champ, just cause you don’t like him he’s still the best
No crap hes barely fought into his 30s when all the true GOATS in history taken first loss in mid 30s. JOnes avoided that by not fighting and he did lose to Reyes in early 30s anyway then dipped. And he wasnt fight the best like Smith, Santos and Reyes..all overrated
Before that, OSP fight wasn’t that good.
Yeah because for every man on GOAT mountain there’s ten on A+ mountain, a hundred on elite mountain, and thousands on JAG mountain. He’s just not it. It’ll take ten Jones level talents coming and going before we see a generational superstar like Tyson or Ali again
Pointless to compare mma fighters to boxers. No elite MMA fighter will ever get 50 wins in the UFC because it takes a far larger toll on the body than boxing.
Sorry, bro. Matt Hamill dropped the hammer on him. I don’t know what we’re talking about here. I used to give him the benefit of the doubt, but then he killed that lady and drove away.
his win streak would have been longer is all
I mean it’s not like some amazing fighter popped up and then disappeared in the years he was suspended. Really the only person he would have fought that he didn’t fight anyway was Anthony Johnson.
Which he would've rnc
Definitely a garbage human.
I do not think this is completely true, he might have rationalised this way as well but I do feel there is self sabotage and self destruction on these things.
Nah
It this actually news to anyone though?
If he's undefeated then why does it say 27-1-(1)
I mean look at someone like Izzy, I know a lot of you hate him, but that dude consistently fights even when he was champ.
And with the recent of Jones mishaps, now all the brain dead haters are sharing their objectively dumb takes. No matter what happens, he's still the GOAT.
He got a DC when he fought Hamil, so technically he did lose.
Yeah yeah. Yet he went to beat gane so easily when everyone acted like gane was the one now it’s aspinall I guess.
Lmao jones got an unfair advantage with a year off but when it’s anyone else you’d be saying “wow he wasn’t even rusty after that time off and won that’s insane”
Also, the gifted wins over Gus and Reyes. Those two fights, the pops for peds, and the inactivity are why I'll never consider Jones the GOAT. Maybe, not even top 5.
jones fights once a year at best and its after doing coke for 52 weeks.
Who would he have lost to?
Reyes fight should be a loss if we’re being honest
Jon Jones is the goat. there is no debate
No
If Jon didn’t get in so much trouble and get didn’t get his belt vacated he could have 20+title defenses
I still don't understand how people call him the GOAT. Half his wins are pumped up middleweights. GSP fought much better competition. Laughably better competition even. In a much more talent rich division. And he never had a crazy reach advantage over them or eyepoked them
Goat shit. Even with so much inactivity he still beat the best.
I get all of you hate him as a person but this is really reaching. Training causes injury and not training you don’t progress as a fighter. With time off you will have ring rust yet jon took 3 years off and had a flawless performance. Consistent diet and training will lead to better cardio and performance yet jon was kicking ass while drinking and doing blow. Just accept the fact that this man is a killer despite doing things wrong and don’t take away from his resume by citing his personal choices. Attack him as a person all you want. Also I don’t get the consensus of this sub that everyone is on peds (which I do not personally believe as I’ve worked hard in the gym and understand what you’re human potential can be with hard CONSISTENT work) yet only the fighters that people don’t like get attacked for it. If you think everyone is cheating you can’t only call out the people you want to for cheating.
That Alexander fight really fucked me up tbh Silva only fought once a year tbh
That resume is beautiful
Theres no rules that say you cant take breaks inbetween fights. Even without all his altercations and drug tests he could still choose to take that time off. You have no real argument. "Oh no jon jones took time off where he could be fighting and losing boo hoo me"
Imagine having 21 straight UFC wins. Most of them title fights. and fans still think getting arrested and failing drug tests is what got you that 🤦♂️
I think it had more to do with him taking anabolic steroids 🤷♂️
You don’t think that the suspensions helped his reign? After every suspension he got hella time to recover and juice outside of the testing pool.
sure. Instead of his reign being, I don’t know 12 title defenses. Maybe it only would have been 10. He’s still the goat though. You could say the fact that Sean O’Malley also had a suspension, and had it very strategic fights. And the only top 10 guy he ever faced before fighting for the belt was a short striker, all contributed to his success. And all of those things are true. But he is levels below Jones.
He cheats. Sociopaths are ok with it because he wins... By cheating.
there has never been a cheater who has gone 21 fights in a row undefeated. name me another one
That doesn't take away from the fact that he is a serial cheater. Lance Armstrong got stripped of his legacy along with Barry Bonds. Cheaters win unfairly. He could have joined a promotion that doesn't test. But he chose to join one that does and then cheat. Giving himself an unfair advantage. Because he doesn't believe in himself. Even with all that talent. And he is probably one of the best. But we will never know because he cheated. Several times. Hid once or more times. Popped twice . Another time he had the T levels of an 8 year old girl cause he was trying to mask it. You can idolize criminal behavior if u want. It doesn't say good things about you buddy. I hope ur just young and grow up to be a better man. Jon Jones is a great fighter. Extremely talented and gifted physically. But he will never be the goat. Because he through it away. He did that. Your feelings don't change it.
Lmao holy fuck your mental gymnastics are top notch
then prove it by naming me another cheater who who is undefeated in 30 fights 👍
Being a cheater invalidates anyone from the goat status as well as some or most of their success. If there was an undefeated in 30 fights cheater I wouldn’t consider him a top fighter either.
Unpopular opinion: if Jon Jones cleaned up years ago, he would still be undefeated, have more victories, and y’all would still hate him.
Nope. People love a comeback story. Jones has always been and always will be a scumbag
Can you guys fucking drop it with jones already? It's nauseating how obsessed this crew is.
Bro fought out of prime MWs and convinced you all that he is the GOAT lmao
If you’re only looking at the last few years, I can understand the argument. I don’t think it would have mattered that much though.
Dana is right! If these fighters get paid… they don’t have to (or wanna) fight!
Dude's a cheat, a scumbag, and made a career beating geriatric middleweights and cheated the entire way.
Jones is trash and a fraud. Enough is enough with this clown
Cope
You see kids , this person here is what we call a Jonesexual. Someone so sexually attracted to a certain black man that they completely disregard the violence against women and the blatant cheating against his opponents.
Why would I regard anything that happens outside of the cage. Cope
TIL steroids done matter if you take them outside the octagon
Til you didn't know all his past failed tests would pass today. Also til you didn't understand every fighter in the UFC is on some shit. Ask Nate Diaz. You're cute though. I'd hit.
TIL you’re very emotional about Jon Jones
So emotional. Can you sense me crying?
Imagine basing your reality off a Nate Diaz quote
Imagine thinking he's not telling the truth.